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(based on 22 reviews)
of respondents would recommend this to a friend.
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Feels too small
Feels true to size
90% (9 reviews)
(9 reviews)
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Reviewed by 22 customers
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pretty, but a bit long and heavy for me
By Betty
from Rockford, IL
About Me Casual Dresser
The delivery was very fast. I ordered two vests and put in a code for free delivery and yet I was charged. Customer service was very helpful --- they said that I will get the delivery charges refunded (haven't been billed yet). This vest is a bit long and heavy, but I will probably keep it to layer when it is really cold out.
Comment on this review(earn bonus points)
Pretty vest
By MagicPaula641234
from Orlando, FL
About Me Classic Dresser
This was a gift for my best friend. She loved it out of the package. Was wearing it by the end of the night. Nice cable stitching. She is a cotton lover which makes this perfect. Thank you Woolrich!
Love this vest
By Karen from Hodag Country
from Rhinelander, WI
Already have one of these in another color and this color is great! Ideal for layering when traveling or just a little bit more warmth when needed. Very soft and flattering fit.
Warn & Cozy
By Reyna
from McMinnville, Oregon
I loved this vest, I think what I liked the most is that what ever color you wore under it would show through the weave and that added color to the vest.This was a great buy, it's soft and very warm, I love it!
Very attractive vest!
By Deb, homemaker
from Illinois
Very pleased with vest, just concerned the length is somewhat short.
Versatile vest
By Seattle Slough
from Seattle
I wear the vest to work and other places. It fits well, looks good, adds a layer of warmth, and the color goes with lots of other earthy-colored clothes. I would have given it five stars but I have some doubts about its durability. After the first week of wearing it, I found two snags. I'm pretty active so I may be rougher on clothes that the average gal, so take this with a grain. I'd order this one again.
Nice Vest
By W.
from New hampshire
I really like this vest to wear over a turtleneck and with jeans. It is a nice gray with attractive cables and can also be paired with dressier slacks and blouse. I usually wear a medium size but found the medium a bit snug in the arm holes. Exchanged it for the large and it is better. Think it could fit a bit looser, and this is why I am not giving it five stars.
Casual elegance
from New Hampshire
Lovely green sweater that is casual but with a touch of elegance that can take it anywhere. Great layered and worn with jeans or dressed up with a nice blazer and slacks. Well made with a durabilty that makes it the one I want to wear most often. Love it.
just beautiful
By Cottage Lady
from Ashtabula County, Ohio
stylish, comfortable, not overly bulky, nice neutral color, looks hand knitted.
womens sweater vest
By patty
from Camanche, Iowa
See all my reviews
this is a very well made vest. worth every penny paid- warm and very comfortable-- a keeper......
I can wear with almost everything!
By School Secretary
from Solon, OH
I work in a school where it is always VERY WARM! This vest helps top off my pants/skirts without making me hot like a sweater does.The beige/tan color makes it useable in a variety of outfits!
great staple for winter
By beach girl
from Kalamazoo, MI
delivery was quick as usual- great job Woolrich
Definitely got my money's worth
By Meme
from Athens, GA
I love the rich quality of this vest. It dresses up any casual outfit and it keeps you very warm.
"OUTSTANDING" quality!
By BobbyBoy
from Gladwin, Michhigan
Very impressive at the speed of delivery. Took 3 days to receive - just before Christmas. Very commendable. Thank You
By Connie
from Clarksburg,Wv
This is a very nice and quite heavy meaning the fabricIt goes with all my wardrobe Will wear it for casual wearI am a size 10p and bought a small and fits well although i will only wear itshirts and cashmere tees
(0 of 1 customers found this review helpful)
Great Quality
By Calvin Needlemeir
from West Sand Lake, NY
Very fine quality.
Very nice sweater vest
By Kymber
from northern WY
Sweater vest is neutral so goes with large part of wardrobe. Bulky yarn so not quite as fitted as I would like. VERY well made.
(2 of 2 customers found this review helpful)
Looks really good on
By clotheshound
from Swan Valley, Condon
I normally do not like crochet looking articles of clothing but something said to try this on...so I did and loved it. It's heavier than you might think which makes it hang really nicely and is warm, but not too much and it is very classy looking on. It can be used to dress up or just for a casual occasion. I am normally a small but got it in medium which worked best for me.
Love it!
By Mama D
from Albany, NY
It is exactly what I was hoping...
(1 of 1 customers found this review helpful)
As nice in person as in the catalog
By toniatkinson
from Fort Collins, CO
I just received this item and have only tried it on; I have not worn it yet. I will use it in the colder weather over a crew neck shirt or a mock T. I like the simple lines.
Wish there were more colors
By jojo
from Lawrence KS
fast delivery
A gorgeous vest!
By Diane
from Jenison, Michigan
Love this comfortable vest, perfect for Michigan winters.


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Home : design your home : laundry room
(Courtesy of Whirlpool Corporation)
Today's laundry rooms have been elevated to much hipper status, with vibrantly-colored walls, spaces to accommodate hobbies and much more.
(Courtesy of Whirlpool Corporation)
Combination washer/dryers offer you the convenience of in-home laundry even when space is at a premium. Consider a single unit washer/dryer, or create space in your home with stackable or under counter front-loading washers and dryers.
(Courtesy of Toll Brothers)
Considering the amount of time we spend doing laundry every year, it's time to add some color and style to this frequently used room.

subset: commoncrawl


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Process NIR Analyzers
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 4:27 pm
Post subject: Steam and Brass
Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Posts: 148
Hey, I've been trying to find resources and materials for steam-punk themed DnD and stumbled across references to the Steam and Brass project by chance. I've since done some digging and decided that I'd really love to either buy someone's copy, or short of that, find someone willing to let me take a look at their copy.
I'm curious as to the feasibility of either of these possibilities. I've read the arguments about limiting availability of this project, and it seems like the proponents of it remaining largely unavailable would have no objections to me buying someone else's patronage rights. If anyone's willing to sell them.
If it's not possible to buy these rights, is there any way I could peruse the file/book without keeping it?
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 7:37 pm
Post subject:
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 141
Location: montreal
I don't know if anyone would sell their patronage to Steam & Brass, but I know that the upcoming Tales of Zobeck covers some of the crunchy highlights of that project.
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:36 am
Post subject: was this option ever discussed
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
I note that the reasoning that the project is "closed" is that it would be like buying now stable stock at the price when it was risky.
In a sense I agree...why should people now get the same price without the risk?
Here's what I propose: DOUBLE the cost of any purchases on the now collectable adventure. Then, have Wolfgang keep the original fee amount and spread the remainder among all of the original patrons (perhaps in quarterly/biannual/annual payments so that this doesn't have to be done every time someone buys a single copy.
Less risk=higher cost. Fine by me.
As far as exclusivity goes, there would be a direct correlation between payment and exclusivity. If one person buys the adventure, the exclusivity is only slightly diluted, the person has paid a substantial sum for the adventure (which in and of itself would be a way to promote exclusivity), and those who lose exclusivity gain money. If a number equal to the original patrons buy the adventure (effectively doubling the amount of patrons), then every patron essentially has a full refund, Wolfgang gets to make money, and the project is still fantastically exclusive---and in the hands of only people who have a real desire for it or have money to burn (lucky bastards).
I wonder if this model would be acceptable to those four patrons who balked at opening it up to additional "investors" in the project. If not, I think the stock market comparison really falls flat.
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:50 am
Post subject:
Kobold Overlord
Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 5010
Location: The Mines
Well, the patrons who balked would be the ones who decide. Steven Schend was one of them, Troy Luginbill was there too. I could dig up the names, but I'm really not willing to go chasing after these patrons every couople months when someone wants to make them an offer.
I'll leave it to other folks to convince them. I've sort of washed my hands of that issue. Repeatedly.
Wolfgang Baur
Publisher, Kobold Press
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:57 am
Post subject: Gotcha.
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
Thanks for the reply Wolfgang. I imagine this whole issue must be frustrating for you.
I think your stance is very reasonable. I'll see what I can do to track them down based on the names you've given.
EDIT: I just contacted the two blogs mentioned under the Steam and Brass section of the Free City by commenting on them and directing them here.
I also contacted Steve Schend at his site.
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:51 am
Post subject:
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 10
Got your message post to my (now mostly defunct) blog Aberzanzorax. Thanks for pointing me to this discussion.
A significant problem I see with your proposed solution, is that, regardless of the frequency of these payments, it's going to require record keeping that will eat up time that I would prefer Wolfgang spend on continuing to develop new content. Not to mention the logistical and tax implications of making these payments.
That being said - and I am no more interested in re-engaging in this discussion than Wolfgang is - as an original opponent of subsequent distribution of earlier patron projects, I'd just mention that I've softened that opposition somewhat. Steam & Brass has evolved into a significantly larger enterprise, and I'm proud to have helped support the project in its infant stage. The exclusivity I sought to protect will be maintained in that only those of us who made the original gamble will be listed as patrons. I'll leave it up to Wolfang's good judgment as to whether these older projects will be made available in the future.
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:09 am
Post subject: So then, are you stating that you've changed your mind?
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
I'm not trying to be obtuse, but the way I read your reply it sounded as though at this point you'd be fine if this project was opened up to new patrons (even without my compromise).
Is that the case?
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:31 am
Post subject: NO!
Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Posts: 148
Ok, so i knew that I might be opening a can of worms by bringing this issue up again, and honestly, that was not my intent. I fully understand the objections of the patrons who balked at making the project available again, although didn't agree with them, and was trying to work within the context of those objections.
I did not want to drag us down the road of "what's legit and what's not" again, I just wanted to put an offer out there to purchase someone's patronage of that project as I'm EXTREMELY interested in it. I wanted to post to the discussion board because 1) I have no idea how to go about conducting this purchase, and 2) I wanted to make sure that no one had any objections as I know this is a touchy issue.
However, if the patrons who previously objected have changed their minds on the issue I'd be very interested in negotiating terms for making the project more public. It just seems so backwards to keep these amazing gaming materials out of the hands of gamers, although I understand that the patrons feel protective of something that they contributed to and expected to benefit from exclusively.
Maybe someone could put me in contact with the people who objected previously and I could discuss this issue directly with them?
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 11:10 am
Post subject: Re: So then, are you stating that you've changed your mind?
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 10
Aberzanzorax wrote:
I'm not trying to be obtuse, but the way I read your reply it sounded as though at this point you'd be fine if this project was opened up to new patrons (even without my compromise).
Is that the case?
Well, in terms of the compromise, I am most definitely opposed as I believe it will eat up resources better used elsewhere.
As for opening the project up, I wouldn't say that I'm fine with it, as I still believe it runs contrary to what the patronage model is all about. However, that's mainly academic blather and in the end I just don't feel all that strongly about it. So I'm fine with Wolfgang making previous OD projects available to non-patrons.
I would be opposed to "new patrons" being added to the project, however, as later customers were in fact not patrons of the project at all. Perhaps a minor distinction, but it is the exclusivity of patronage for a given project that I am looking to maintain.
Of course, I am only one of the original detractors, and still support previous OD projects being walled off if any of those patrons object.
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 12:11 pm
Post subject: Thanks for the clarification!
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
Thanks for the clarification! I appreciate your candor.
I agree with new individuals not being listed as patrons. That has been the model used for people such as myself. I became a patron of Blood of the Gorgon and was allowed to buy 6 Arabian Nights and Empire of the Ghouls. My name was NOT added to the list of patrons, and that is as it should be, I believe.
I too believe that all four of the original detractors should be convinced of allowing the sale of the original model in order to do so. I am glad to hear that your position has softened, however, and hope to convince the remaining detractors.
I wonder if a compromise as simple as charging double the original cost with the full proceeds going to Wolfgang would be sufficient for the other detractors? It seems that this is more about academic fairness than anything else....and I can understand that on a personal and intellectual level. I, for one, would certainly consider that to be a reward for my original patronage (and it would help keep exclusivity up as few people other than "uberfans" of the Open Gaming Projects would want to pay that much).
One last thing, if you don't mind. May I have your name? I posted on three blogs all at once regarding this subject and want to follow up with the others in a few days time. If not, that's ok. (if you like, you can PM me the name, and I promise I'll only share it with Wolfgang--so that he knows of your changed position).
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jerrie luginbill
Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:41 pm
Post subject:
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Location: lynden washington
I too agree that the compromise would be top heavy and offer no payback to either wolfgang or the original patrons. But read below and you will see that for me the money is not the point.
I also agree that the stock analogy is a loose analogy, and does not represent the the greyer areas of the patronage model. It is an easy way to explain the basics motives for keeping it closed. The relationship to money and monetary value is the part that doesn't really ring true to the patronage model.
I am not willing to sell nor to open up the design. I am truly sorry that many missed out, but the unique aspect of this is that the module was commissioned with input by a small group of people. It is in my opinion not a publication but an actual work of art that I own partial copyright to. To allow wider duplication would be like having the mona lisa duplicated without the consent of Leonardo or the commissioning patron. That simply would not have happened back then. This is because of the collectors value. To many this mistakenly means the inherent monetary value, but to a collector this is not the case. It is not truly exclusivity but rarity and background that makes this module valuable. Very few of these exist in the world, yet I have one, because I was part of making it happen. I am proud of this work, I am proud to have taken part in steam and brass and to allow others to have a "piece" of that pride would devalue the contribution the patrons gave (not in money but in being part of the first of this sort of project.) I and others literally made history with this project. Patrons originally commissioned art for the rarity of the piece and pride associated with being the one that recognized talent and gave it a shot.
Imagine the real value of having someone of Wolfgang's talent and standing in the roleplaying realm write you your own adventure. Yes, you would have to drop a tremendous amount of money but it would be a one of a kind, singularly unique piece of work. How often would you show it off? How many times would you say no, you cannot xerox it? How would you feel if you saw someone standing at the store being either excited or disgusted with what you brought to life? Especially if the artist, you or the community regarded it as the artists master work.
I understand that sounds selfish, and that others would say "you would get more recognition for your efforts if it was widely distributed." I can only say to that that it is easy to make claims to generosity when you are the receiver of that generosity and that it is also easy to make claims to someone else pride and emotion when it is not yours you are selling.
So unfortunately no, I will not sell my patronage rights, nor will I acquiesce to opening it up. In the future if I decide to get rid of my rights I will give them away, just like a patron would have given a piece of art either back to the artist or to someone that could appreciate it for its historic and artistic value. If there is ever a museum of role playing then that is probably where it will end up.
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:25 am
Post subject: Thanks for the reply
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
First, I want to thank you for your reply. When you could have just as easily been silent, you chose to speak up, which speaks both to your investment in the project you love and to your belief that your position is worthy and worth defending.
Second, I want to say that I admire anyone who stands their ground when they believe they are right. It is hard to do when there is social pressure pushing you to act in a different way than what you believe should be done. (I love the play and movie 12 angry men.) I also want to say, though, that I admire someone who has an open mind broad enough to consider another's opinon, and who is willing to consider that they might not have been entirely correct. It is a noble thing to stand one's ground because one believes they are right. It is an unfortunate and misguided thing when one holds their ground simply for the sake of holding that ground because they have done so for so long or because they are unwilling to attempt to see another point of view. With that in mind, please read my responses to your points, not merely with the eye of countering them, but with an attempt to truly understand. When you get to the end, please, by all means counter them if you believe it is right to do so. I'd respect you for it.
I understand that money is not the point. I was using it as a means to reach compromise, fairness, and exclusivity. (Compromise and fairness as patrons risked more and invested in it in a way that cannot be duplicated, so there must be some additional penalty for new buyers. Money is the easiest. Exclusivity in the sense that the more expensive a product is, the more demand goes down. This carries with your art analogy. Merely by making something more expensive than its competitors, you drive down the number of people willing to pay for it). However, since you've conceded that money is not the point, I won't belabor that aspect any longer.
You state that this is not a publication, but a work of art. I can totally agree with that assessment. Wolfgang's other work in the Open Gaming Project (and Nick Logue's) are also art to me. I have read that you compare this to the Mona Lisa (or other paintings), and I find that problematic. This is not a one of a kind piece of art like a painting. It is a reproducable product. A more fair analogy would be a song or play that was written for you and several others or a print that had a limited print run (if you would like to maintain the visual medium as your comparison).
Merely by being reproducable, this analogy changes matters. You do not lose your copy of anything (as in a painting), though I concede that others having it makes it less exclusive.
You also mention that allowing it to be duplicated would be like "having the mona lisa duplicated without the consent of Leonardo or the commissioning patron". While nitpicking (but only to a small degree), this is not the case. In this case, Wolfgang (Leonardo) is willing to have his work duplicated. Again, this is not like copying the Mona Lisa, but for, say a playwright who wrote a specific work for a specific group of patrons to allow others to see the play. Ok, the creator of the art is on board....but that is not enough. The patron must also be on board, as the patron is the person who owns the art (if I understand the patronage model) even art like song lyrics. 70 of 74 have chosen to allow the reproduction. (Now 71 of 74, see earlier in this thread). Again, if you are right and they are wrong, this number should not be daunting. However, it does shake your analogy further. Imagine a highschool class that won a contest for working the hardest to get it to happen (making them more like investing patrons and less like lucky winners). A singer/songwriter famous at the time (take your favorite) comes to write a song for them as the prize. The kids LOVE it. It is their song. The songwriter says that he or she would like to sing it at other schools as it is inspirational and could spread joy (no money will be exchanged). 71 of the students say sure (some don't care, others maybe a bit grudgingly, but 71 allow it). 3 say no. This is a fairer comparison in my mind than the Leonardo/Mona Lisa comparison. Again, if those 3 kids are right, then fine. They are entitled to the song being theirs and no one elses. They worked hard. They won. Others did not.
You state that collectors value, to you, is: "is not truly exclusivity but rarity and background that makes this module valuable. "Again I will nitpick. I can understand rarity making it emotionally valuable. I can also understand background making it emotionally valuable. However, by opening up this project to new buyers, the background does not change. You still made this fledgling company viable. It was your risk, love, investment, and desire that helped Wolfgang launch a project (Open Gaming) we all can now enjoy. That wouldn't change. No new names would be added, no credit would be given to others nor taken away from you. Hence it seems we are left with rarity.
You state: "I am proud of this work, I am proud to have taken part in steam and brass and to allow others to have a "piece" of that pride would devalue the contribution the patrons gave (not in money but in being part of the first of this sort of project.) I and others literally made history with this project. Patrons originally commissioned art for the rarity of the piece and pride associated with being the one that recognized talent and gave it a shot." More nitpicking here, along the same lines. No one would have a "piece" of that pride. No one helped this to exist apart from you and 73 other patrons (and of course the artists). New buyers would not change that fact. New buyers would not be making history. They would see the 74 names emblazoned on the work and see those that did. Patrons did not only commision art for the rarity of the piece and pride associated, they commisioned it because they wanted something that fit their tastes...something that met their needs specifically. You got that as well. Again, the pride associated with the creation is something you cannot lose. The rarity, again seems to be the crux/sticking point.
I'd like to honestly answer the questions you have brought up/asked me. "Imagine the real value of having someone of Wolfgang's talent and standing in the roleplaying realm write you your own adventure." That would be, and is AWESOME.
"Yes, you would have to drop a tremendous amount of money but it would be a one of a kind, singularly unique piece of work. How often would you show it off?" I would show it off by running it, of course. I would run it as often as I could with any and all groups I played with because I'd want to use the product I loved dearly. I imagine this is true for you as well.
"How many times would you say no, you cannot xerox it?" That's a bit more complicated. I certainly have loyalty to Wolfgang and freelancers generally and do not support any duplication of their work for no reward. I don't use torrents to download music or movies either. So I would say that every time, but that would be the rationale. I suspect that's not what you are getting at, though, and I'm not trying to avoid your point, but to be thorough. If I were allowed as part of my patronage rights to copy it, I suppose I would copy it for some friends upon request...but not just any friends. I'd do this only for friends who shared parts of their lives with me (went to concerts with me whether or not they paid for my ticket, gamed with me, etc). I'd copy it for everyone who played it as a keepsake. I'd want to share, but not with just anybody...only with those I knew would find it as special as I did and who would not abuse it.
"How would you feel if you saw someone standing at the store being either excited or disgusted with what you brought to life?" Well, if excited, I'd be happy. If I were the artist, I'd feel proud. If I were the patron, I'd feel proud. If they were disgusted, I'd certainly feel defensive, and might wish that they did not have access to it to scorn it. That said, releasing this for purchase would not result in such things. Again, if it were kept only to those who really, really wanted it...you'd have option 1...where I'd be proud that others admired something I created. Again, we come to rarity.
You state: "I understand that sounds selfish, and that others would say "you would get more recognition for your efforts if it was widely distributed."" Well, it does sound selfish, so far. It seems you do not believe it to be. That may be because I do not fully understand you, particularly because metaphor rarely captures our true meanng and emotions, and as I think I have pointed out, the metaphors you have used are flawed in one or two ways. It may not sound selfish if I understood it better, or if it were said in a different way. To the second part of the above quote, I can respond in two ways: one would be "of course you would get more recognition for your efforts if it were more widely distributed" but I thought about it some and that is not entirely correct. Of course the product would be more admired and those who were patrons could point to their involvement. However, that brings me to the second point. I now know your name and one other. I know the names of the dissenters. Hence, you actually get more recognition by being in the minority group who refuses to allow the sale of the product. I doubt that this is the prideful sort of recognition you seek, but it is a form of recognition nonetheless. So hereI do question that if your pride is in the creation of this work and its historic nature rather than in keeping it rare, why you are working so hard to keep it from others eyes. Again, the sticking point is rarity.
You state "I can only say to that that it is easy to make claims to generosity when you are the receiver of that generosity and that it is also easy to make claims to someone else pride and emotion when it is not yours you are selling." This is a bit dismissive, but still correct. It doesn't really address your points beyond shaming those who want something that you exclusively have. Here again, we come to rarity.
You state: "If there is ever a museum of role playing then that is probably where it will end up." I disagree most strongly here. It sounds like it would certainly deserve a place there (along with Ptolus, the Demonomicon series, the original sets, and so on). However, you're comparing this to the Mona Lisa. That is a famous piece of art. This is not, and it is, in large part, you who are preventing it from becoming so. A fairer artwork comparison would be more like a lost artwork by a great painter. Not until it is unearthed and shared among others can it truly be appreciated.
I'm sorry to say this, but I believe your position is most similar to the following: Michael Jackson bought most of the rights to the Beatles music. What if if shut down all production? What if instead of being able to buy these hits on CD, the only available mediums would be the records, 8tracks, and tapes available before he bought them? They'd be rarer, to be sure. Parents could tell their kids about this historic and groundbreaking band that they used to listen to, but they'd only ever be able to tell them...they couldn't play the music unless they were lucky enough to have one of those increasingly rare items.
To use the patronage model, imagine you yourself commision a song to be written. It's composed for you by Mozart himself. It's beautiful. It makes you weep to listen to it. You play it over and over on your piano when no one else is around. And you refuse to let anyone else listen to it. It's mine, you say, if others heard it, it would be less special. This, I believe is the model you are working under. Rarity is the sole driving force, it seems, as I have outlined above. You make comments about pride, but it is a pride driven by rarity, not by joy in the product alone. If it was joy, the Mozart song would be shared with others. "Listen to this great song", you'd say. Without me it never would have been created. I still have the original, but you can have a copy too. Then we can both enjoy this work! I wouldn't give this to just anyone, but I see you are moved as deeply as I am by it.
In this analogy, you lose nothing. If I were able to buy it, you would lose nothing but rarity. You would have your historic contribution, would be named as a patron of the art, and would still have your copy of the work.
So if, as I think I've beaten to death, all it is is rarity, what does that really mean? What does keeping the number of something small so that there are fewer of them in the world and so that fewer people can enjoy them result in? What is the import? I can think of only one thing.
I'm sorry, but as I understand your argument, it basically comes down to "It's special because it is mine and not yours."
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:27 am
Post subject:
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 602
Thank you for the thoughtful response. Very interesting to get your perspective on it.
Imagine the real value of having someone of Wolfgang's talent and standing in the roleplaying realm write you your own adventure. Yes, you would have to drop a tremendous amount of money but it would be a one of a kind, singularly unique piece of work. How often would you show it off?
How many conventions would one have to get to and run it?
(Wolfgang actually once posted a price - at my suggestion - for a single patron-funded adventure. If I were him, I'd raise that price now given how successful this has all become.)
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:37 am
Post subject: Since rarity does seem to be the sticking point, how about:
Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 279
What about a model of purchase as follows:
Suppose Wolfgang opens up all prior products for sale. Each time one is purchased, the cost increases by $1. If 400 people bought Steam and Brass, the last person would be paying the patron price PLUS $400!
This model would enforce rarity through economic means, encourage people interested to buy early, or as soon as they could afford it, as the price was only going to go up, not down.
The additional money could go to Wolfgang or a gaming charity.
I know money is not the issue, but it is a means to an end...and if rarity is the end, then I think that this would be a way to accomplish that.
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:03 am
Post subject:
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 602
Well, Wolfgang has already said that the topic is closed as far as Steam & Brass goes. While I can understand the desire to get ahold of the book, the original patrons want it kept exclusive and we have to respect that. As to subsequent projects? That's up to Wolfgang. (I would think if they were opened up for purchase only, not patronage, that it would be reasonable to charge signficantly more, but as a fixed increase.)
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[Solved] Output value of nested arrays?
Is there a simple way to output a value that's nested inside multiple arrays?
Array ouput:
Array ( [auth] => Array ( [uid] => 50799167 [info] => Array ( [name] => Chris Burton [nickname] => chrisburton [urls] => Array ( [twitter] => http://twitter.com/chrisburton [website] => http://chrisburton.me ) [location] => New York [description] => Letterer & Typographer http://dribbble.com/chrisburton [image] => http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/3106804659/f100a994784f6e8059bb15125f286667_normal.png ) [credentials] => Array ( [token] => Token Removed [secret] => Secret Removed ) [raw] => Array ( [id] => 50799167 [profile_sidebar_fill_color] => DDEEF6 [created_at] => Thu Jun 25 22:48:35 +0000 2009 [contributors_enabled] => 0 )
Do you know which value you need?
@traq Well, let's say I need multiple values.
[id] [screen_name] [image]
I was able to get it by doing this
echo $auth['raw']['id'];
Just thought they're might be a better way. Maybe something like:
echo $raw->screen_name;
If this is something you'll be doing regularly (i.e., more than once, ever), I'd suggest writing a function to extract them into a more useful format. Something like
<?php // $array is your array from twitter function twitter_user_info( array $array ){ // check that each item exists in $array $id = isset( $array['auth']['uid'] )? $array['auth']['uid']: null; $nick = isset( $array['auth']['info']['nickname'] )? $array['auth']['info']['nickname']: null; $img = isset( $array['auth']['info']['image'] )? $array['auth']['info']['image']: null; // if any are missing, something went wrong if( $id === null || $nick === null || $img === null ){ return false; } // array is both numeric and assoc // so you can access it by key // or by index # - e.g., using // `list( $id,$name,$img ) = twitter_user_info()` $user_info = array( $id ,$nick ,$image ,'id' => $id ,'screen_name' => $nick ,'image' => $image ); return $user_info; }
If you want an object (as in your last comment), use the same function as above but replace
with this:$user_info = (object)array( 'id' => $id ,'screen_name' => $nick ,'image' => $image );
Then you can access it like so:
$chrisburton = twitter_user_info( $twitter_array ); echo $chrisburton->screen_name;
@traq Couldn't I just use a foreach to return the values as variables?
If you wanted all of them, sure.
If you only wanted a few, you'd be creating a lot of extra variables for no reason (which would then be floating around, wasting memory, waiting to collide with another var by the same name). I wouldn't recommend it, at least not outside of a function scope.
If that's really what you want, you can just use extract(), which does exactly the same thing (and offers a bit of control via flags).
Also, consider that you'd have to make extract()/your function/construct/whatever recursive, or you'd still have arrays:
<?php foreach( $array as $k=>$v ){ ${$key} = $v; } echo $nickname; // error - $nickname does not exist // $auth exists - but it's still an array, // and all those values are still nested inside it.
All things considered, maybe you'd like a user class, that could take the array and organize all the values for you. I'll write up a quick example.
I just want something that would be secure but also easy for me to understand at the same time.
I think this will do what you want. Try it out (see demo at the bottom).
@chrisburton I wanted to learn more about PHP arrays so I played with your example code.
Maybe you will find it useful.
@traq @hotpink Oh, wow. I really appreciate you both taking the time on this.
@traq I'm receiving this: http://cloud.chrisburton.me/image/420t0i2a3v1B
needs to be the variable that contains the array you receive from twitter. Are you calling it something else in your code?also, does the demo below the class work for you?
to explain further,
undefined variable
means that$twitter_array
doesn't exist in your code before you try to use it innew twitter_user( $twitter_array )
- which is also why twitter_user is throwing an exception.@traq Yes, I am.
Now I am getting
( ! ) Parse error: syntax error, unexpected '[' in C:\Users\Chris\Desktop\wamp\www\auth\example\callback.php on line 186
Line 186:
$response = [
Now I am getting
( ! ) Parse error: syntax error, unexpected '[' ...
Sorry. You're not using PHP 5.4, are you?
Get rid of my demo code below the class.
instead, use:
$cb = new twitter_user( $response );
is your response from twitter).@traq No, I'm using 5.3
Edit: I already changed that to $response.
I updated my demo to be compatible with PHP 5.3. Sorry about that. You can try it again.
In your own script, did you completely remove my demo code (everything below
) and replace it with$cb = new twitter_user( $response );
@traq I believe so?
/** * wraps info returned from twitter's "sign in with twitter" API. * add additional methods/properties as desired and use as a user class. * * @author Adrian Testa-Avila <email@example.com> * @copyright 2013 Adrian Testa-Avila * @license creative commons attribution-sharealike * http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/ */ class twitter_user{ ## NONPUBLIC PROPERTIES ## /** * object this will hold the info you got from the twitter API. * "protected" means it can't be accessed directly from outside the object * (e.g., like `echo $twitter_user->t`). * we do this so we can control how $t is accessed, using the __get() method below. */ protected $t; ## PUBLIC METHODS ## /** * this method creates a new twitter_user object - * e.g., like `$chrisburton = new twitter_user( $response );` * it simply converts $response to an object and stores it in $this->t. * see the __get() method to see how you retrieve values. * * @param array $twitter_info the info you got from twitter. */ public function __construct( array $response ){ if( !empty( $response['auth'] ) && is_array( $response['auth'] ) ){ // you might want to verify other|all values exist, // beyond just ['auth'], but that's up to you. // converting the array into an object // makes it easier to access the values via our __get() method. // (using the json_* functions is an ugly hack, but works well.) $t = json_decode( json_encode( $response['auth'] ,JSON_BIGINT_AS_STRING|JSON_UNESCAPED_UNICODE ) ); // make sure there were no errors if( json_last_error() === JSON_ERROR_NONE ){ // all good. $this->t = $t; }else{ // throw an exception so you know something went wrong throw new Exception( 'conversion to object failed' ); } }else{ // throw an exception so you know something went wrong throw new Exception( '$twitter_info is malformed' ); } } /** * __get() is a "magic method" that runs * whenever you try to access a nonpublic (or nonexistant) property. * we're going to use it to access the twitter array. * * @param string $name the name of the value asked for * @return mixed the value that $name is mapped to, if it exists; * FALSE otherwise */ public function __get( $name ){ // first check if $name maps directly to a value in the twitter array: if( isset( $this->t->$name ) ){ // this handles usage like `echo $chrisburton->uid;` return $this->t->$name; } // next, check if $name maps to a nested value: foreach( $this->t as $t ){ if( isset( $t->$name ) ){ // this handles usage like `echo $chrisburton->nickname;` // or even `echo $chrisburton->urls->twitter;` // (but *not* `echo $chrisburton->twitter;` - that won't work). return $t->$name; } } // finally, if nothing was found: return false; } } $cb = new twitter_user( $response );
contains the array from twitter (the array you posted at the beginning of this thread)?are you still getting the "unexpected [" error?
@traq Yes, $response is the main array or whatever you call it.
I'm getting two errors on line 189 which is
$cb = new twitter_user( $twitter_array );
Notice: Undefined variable: twitter_array in C:\Users\Chris\Desktop\wamp\www\auth\example\callback.php on line 189 Catchable fatal error: Argument 1 passed to twitter_user::__construct() must be an array, null given, called in C:\Users\Chris\Desktop\wamp\www\auth\example\callback.php on line 189 and defined in C:\Users\Chris\Desktop\wamp\www\auth\example\callback.php on line 131
Line 131 is:
public function __construct( array $response ){
I'm getting two errors on line 189 which is $cb = new twitter_user( $twitter_array );
Change that to
$cb = new twitter_user( $response );
If you still get an error, use
var_dump( $response )
to make sure $response really is the array we're looking for :)@traq Oops, my fault. Now I'm getting a ton of json errors. Will try the
is correct. It outputs the following:array (size=3) 'auth' => array (size=5) 'uid' => int 50799167 'info' => array (size=6) 'name' => string 'Chris Burton' (length=12) 'nickname' => string 'chrisburton' (length=11) 'urls' => array (size=2)...
can you zip it all to me?
@traq Sent. Thanks again.
Try putting this
// create new twitter_user $cb = new twitter_user( $response ); print "Hi, my name is {$cb->name}.<br>Visit me at {$cb->urls->website}";
inside the
block where it says/** * It's all good. Go ahead with your application-specific authentication logic */
I'll look more in-depth this afternoon.
@traq Hey, no rush. Unless I'm doing something wrong, I'm still getting an error.
no bother; I'm interested in this too (the whole Opauth/twitter thing).
Are your errors still the "undefined variable" and "catchable fatal error" on 189? Nothing else?
And have you tried the twitter_user class again (get a fresh copy, since I fixed the demo), by itself? (Just trying to narrow it down; the class demo works for me, without a hitch.)
Okay, I've discovered the problem with my twitter_user class, and provided a solution.
(1) The flags I use for json_encode() aren't supported in PHP versions less-than 5.4.
... The solution is to remove the flags.
(2) The function json_last_error() did not exist in PHP versions less-than 5.3.
... The "solution" (and I use the term loosely) is to remove the error-check and "hope for the best." A better solution is to upgrade your PHP version.
You say you're using 5.3, correct? Simply commenting out this line
should solve your problem. If not, you can also replace this line
if( json_last_error() === JSON_ERROR_NONE ){
with this instead
if( true ){
I have a working example here, if you'd like to see the result.
@traq Wow. I checked my host's PHP version and I'm using
PHP Version 5.2.17
. I upgraded my localhost version to 5.3 due to a certain feature that gave me an error.Really appreciate all of this. After reading some articles, I keep seeing
being used for authenticating a twitter user. I'm concerned that I should have stuck with that or is this completely separate?Everywhere I see it in that article,
) is being used during the oauth process - e.g., to check what the response returned. The Opauth example does this as well (are you still using the opauth class?).Yes, those checks should remain.
However, don't use them when(if) you're accessing the results via the
class:#no if( isset( $twitter_user->name ) ){ print $twitter_user->name; } #yes print $twitter_user->name;
Also, the code in that article uses the mysql_...() functions.
ext/mysql is long outdated and will be deprecated in PHP 5.5. It should not be used in new work (try ext/mysqli or PDO instead).
@traq I mean, as long as it's secure, I'm not worried about it. I just want to make sure the users info is not vulnerable. It looks like I have a lot to learn. By the way, when you get Kirby up and running, I'd love to see you create a plugin that does this.
Regarding Opauth class, I'm not sure. What I sent you is what I am still using. I just pasted your code below the code that Opauth comes with.
Keeping the checks will prevent errors. It may not lead directly to security vulnerabilities, but it definitely makes for better UX and also best coding practice.
It looks like I have a lot to learn.
Everyone does. That's the fun part.
By the way, when you get Kirby up and running, I'd love to see you create a plugin that does this.
Maybe. I'll have to see how easy it is to integrate.
I just pasted your code below the code that Opauth comes with.
which is exactly what I did; works great (that example is on one of my old domains that is still running PHP 5.2). Taking the code you gave me, those minor changes to my class are all it took.
@traq - super forum props for helping Chris out with this. I've been following this thread and have admired your dedication to the problem!
@TheDoc - thanks very much. I've enjoyed it ...and my own projects may benefit from this as well :)
You're quite welcome, thank you.
Just to clarify, is this working for you now?
@traq Working 100%. Much easier to write also so that's a definite plus. Thanks again, I owe you one.


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Pulling Nails
By: Amanda Campbell
Updated: September 1, 2011
You can try the fulcrum method -- place a wood block under the hammerhead for leverage -- but even that won't work on a stubborn nail, and it's easy to lose your balance and break the handle doing it.
Instead, try this:
First, slip the nailhead as far as it will go into the hammer claw. But, now, instead of pulling the handle straight back, roll it over to the side.
The hammerhead will act as a leverage block to help extract the nail. If the nail doesn't come all the way out at first, reposition the claw on the nail shaft close to the board and roll the handle over to the opposite side.
The windows in your home may be responsible for up to 25 percent of your heating and cooling bills. When it comes to energy conservation, most windows don't do a very good job. So, if you want to make your windows more efficient when it comes to saving energy and maintaining the temperature in your home, you might want to take a careful look at your choice of window coverings. Here are a few tips to help you shop smart as you try to save energy with your new window coverings.
- Consider Cellular Blinds- Cellular blinds are an excellent choice for energy saving window coverings. The honeycomb (or cell) that forms when the blinds are lowered traps air within it, providing an extra layer of insulation for your window. Of course the more layers in the blinds and the deeper they are, the better they insulate.
- Keep your colors light - Light colored window coverings help reflect the intense summer sun, keeping the hot air out and your cooler air in. When the weather gets cooler you can open them to let in the light and warmth of the winter sun.
- Keep window direction in mind - Do your windows face south or do you have a harsher western exposure? Consider the direction of your windows as you are looking for the best energy saving window coverings. Windows facing west receive the most intense sun, so as a result they would need greater insulation. Southern facing windows receive a gentler light and therefore need less protection.
- Leave less space when hanging drapes - If you chose to go with energy saving drapes or curtains, be sure to hang them as close to the window as possible. This prevents the air in your room from being affected by the heat or cold outside.


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Although Keith Thomas has a slight tendency to list this was an extremely interesting book, with much detailed research. Read full review
Astrology, witchcraft, magical healing, divination, ancient prophecies, ghosts, and fairies were taken very seriously by people at all social and economic levels in sixteenth- and seventeenth-century ... Read full review


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Welcome to Link4Life
- Details
- Category: General
Link4Life have some fantastic events taking place at Heywood Civic Centre, Middleton Arena & Touchstones Rochdale in the forthcoming weeks including Julian Clary live on stage at the Middleton Arena in May.
Also appearing at the Arena are The Peter Cowap Music Festival, An Evening of Mediumship with TV Psychic Tony Stockwell, the Amazing Muay Thai Boxing and Oldham Choral Society Show.
Heywood Civic Centre will be hosting a 50s & 60s Night, Live Comedy, 1940s Night, Big Dance week 2013, Soul & Motown Nites, The Bradshaws and much more...
The award winning Arts & Heritage Centre at Touchstones Rochdale has something for everyone including the following current exhibitions Compulsive: ATIC Studios, Sea, Bloom and Natasha Daintry: Fluid Colour.
May Half Term Activities
- Details
- Category: General
Link4Life has some fantastic activities for children during the May half-term holidays, right across Rochdale borough. Allow your children to make the most of the holidays; taking part in various sports based games, and arts activities in a fun, safe and supervised environment.
Activities will be taking place across a number of Link4Life venues from Tuesday 28 - Friday 31 May 2013 as well as out in the community.
Activities include: Shokk Gym/Dance, Mats/X Box Games, Tri-Golf Indoor, Art Classes, Trampolining, Village Glee, Sport Zone, Football Fridays, Mini Tennis, Fit N Fun, Sports Camp and Active Kids.
Follow this link to the School Holiday Programme.
Julian Clary - Position Vacant: Apply Within
- Details
- Category: Middleton Arena
Wednesday 29 May 2013
Master of camp and Celebrity Big Brother Winner, Julian Clary is scouring the land in search of love. He's promised to leave no straight unturned.
"Hilarious ... vintage Clary." What's Onstage
Time: 8pm (Doors open 7:30pm)
Ticket price: £20
Visit www.seetickets.com to buy online or 0871 230 0010, or in person at the Arena box office. (booking fee applies to online bookings).


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Sip your way to pure banana bliss with our Banana Puddin' MilkQuake. It's a sweet combination of nanner pudding and real Nilla Wafers. Only available for a limited time at participating restaurants.
Krystal has a whole new take on Philly's most famous sandwich. Watch the video.
Got a question or comment? We want your input. Tell us how we're doing!
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Revered by the Aztecs, chia seeds are nutritional powerhouses that keep thousands of customers coming back to this top seller. My mom puts chia seeds in her cereal every morning. Ch-ch-ch-chia!
Organic Maca Powder (raw) comes from maca, an adaptogenic root known for its dynamic natural effects--users tend to experience a big boost in energy, relief from stress and even an increase in libido. While it is sometimes prepared and eaten as a root vegetable in the few areas where it is available fresh, its nutritional and medicinal assets are concentrated in our raw organic maca powder.
Seeds from the hemp plant are naturally loaded with nutritional value, boasting all of the essential amino acids and fatty acids the body needs. These whole hemp seeds arrive with their hulls and shells intact, but once you crack into them, you'll discover a huge variety of nutritional and medicinal applications.
Organic Red Maca Powder (raw) is an adaptogenic root that enhances your ability to deal with stress while boosting energy, endurance and performance. Red Maca is packed with more vitamins and nutrients than regular maca. In traditional Peruvian culture, Maca is believed to be an aphrodisiac. Find out for yourself, and blend a spoonful of this sweet powder into your smoothies, or mix with our Organic Cacao Powder for a delightfully energizing effect!
These blue, beautiful poppy seeds are bursting with bold, nutty flavor and have dozens of popular applications. Poppy seeds add both flavor and texture to breads, cookies, muffins, cakes and other baked goods, and are often added to hamburger and hot dog buns to give them a little crunch. Try adding a few pinches to all your favorites from pancake batter to salad dressing.
Pepitas are great in salads or just for snacking. No need to worry about what to do with the shells because there aren't any!
The favored grain of the Aztec empire, Organic Amaranth is a sweet, nutty grain, high in protein and gluten-free. It contains high amounts of the important amino acid lysine.
These raw snow white pumpkin seeds are ideal for those looking to roast their own at home. These also make a great snack for birds.
Wanting to add something extremely healthy to your diet regimen? Then brown flax seeds in the shell are the way to go! To get the most health benefits out of the flax seed we recommend grinding them.
All natural and very hard to find, these white chia seeds are a nutritious powerhouse.
These are similar to the brand name Salba and contain the same high nutritional value as the black Chia seeds.
Dried adzuki beans are a small dark red oval bean approximately 5mm in diameter. They have a very distinctive white ridge along one side. Adzuki beans have a strong, nutty, sweet flavor. They are popular in Asia.
Natural imported unhulled sesame seeds used in many meals and candies.
These hulled sesame seeds are lighter in color than the natural variety. Often found on top of rolls, these seeds are ideal for baking and cooking.
Black sesame seeds are more rich in flavor than white sesame seeds. Used on fish, salads, breads, and sauces. It is a prominent ingredient in Asian dishes as well.
Organic Kamut is absolutely delicious and very nutritious for you. A member of the wheat family, Kamut is considered the "high energy grain" because it contains 40% more protein than the national average for wheat. As this grain hasn't been altered by modern plant breeders, it retains its ancient nutrition, flavor and goodness. It contains elevated levels of vitamin E, Thiamin, Riboflavin, phosphorus, magnesium, zinc, pantothentic acid, copper and complex carbohydrates. Kamut is excellent in cereals, baked goods, and eaten as a side dish.
This long grain is best cooked in a slow cooker similar to rice and must be simmered for up to one hour.
Mung beans are a small cylindrical bean with a sharp green color. Mung beans are used primarily for sprouting and produce the sprouts most commonly found in Chinese cuisine. They also can be soaked overnight, cooked, and eaten just like other beans.
Fennel seeds emit an agreeable, warm, sweet odor, somewhat similar to that of anise. They even have a licorice taste! Great for pizza sauces and toppings, Italian sausages, and specialty breads.
Bulgur wheat is an easy-to-use, low-calorie, whole grain. Bulgur wheat has been used in Middle Eastern dishes for three thousand years, and is very nutritious. Our bulgur wheat is perfect for making tabouli salad!
These golden flax seeds are packed with vitamins and minerals and are particularly high in omega-3 fatty acids. To get the most health benefits out of the flax seeds we recommend grinding them.
Hulled millet is a wonderfully tasty grain. Millet is rich in B vitamins, especially niacin, B6 and folic acid, calcium, iron, potassium, magnesium, and zinc.
Organic spelt berries are wonderful grains that are high in protein. Spelt contains 15 - 21% protein which is much higher than wheat. It's also higher than wheat in complex carbohydrates, iron, potassium and the B Vitamins. Spelt is easier to digest than wheat products because of it's higher solubility in water. Spelt also contains nutrients that aid in blood clotting and also stimulate the immune system.
An imported seasoning from Jamaica, used in many dishes for that exciting curry flavor!
Ground Red Pepper is perfect to spice up any dish like chili. Also known as cayenne pepper.
Strong fresh black pepper ready for your grinder. The freshest you will find anywhere!
An extremely fresh and strong flavor. Crushed Red Pepper will excite any dish, from tomato sauces to stir fries to hamburger patties! Be prepared!
Couscous is a coarsely ground semolina pasta made from the hard part of the wheat. It makes an excellent side dish instead of rice. It tasts great when mixed with other herbs, meats, or fish.
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Tuesday, November 06, 2012 at 1:02 PM
Natural place to shop: Vine.com
When shopping for your family, the farmer's market is fantastic, but outside that, I get nervous. When we go to the supermarket, I suddenly get suspicious of all the packaged goods. After watching Food, Inc., and hearing reports about unsafe beauty and baby products, I walk down the aisles and wonder: Is this dish soap safe for my baby? Is this body lotion full of chemicals? Do these crackers have unnatural ingredients?
So, I literally cheered when I discovered Vine.com, a new site that carries ALL natural products. They refuse to carry anything with questionable ingredients, so you can trust that everything you buy will be top-notch. They carry household cleaning, beauty, shower and baby products, as well as organic snacks and groceries. And they deliver in two days. What a godsend!
We try to live a healthy, natural lifestyle, as I'm sure everyone does, and Vine.com is going make that so much easier. I'm so excited to introduce them to you guys, if you haven't heard of them already. xoxo
Above are a few of my favorite Vine products so far, including dried strawberries (Toby's new favorite snack), natural household cleaning products, and shampoo for washing your favorite wool sweaters in the sink.
Bonus for all readers: Get 20% off your first Vine.com order with the code 20CUPJO. Good for the next seven days. Find everything here.
(Photos by Sarina Cass for Cup of Jo. This post is sponsored by Vine.com, whose mission I adore. Thank you so much for supporting the sponsors that make Cup of Jo possible.)
56 comments:
Tom's has the BEST deodorant! If you have sensitive skin, especially after shaving, Tom's is amazing. Thanks for sharing!
ReplyDeleteRepliesWow excited about this! I use the EWG Skin Deep site too. It's a great resource because it goes into detail about all of the ingredients so if you want to be sure and avoid greenwashing, you can dig right into the details of a product.
DeleteOh God, I hope you don't stand near me! It may not irritate your skin but it definitely doesn't work.
Burt's Bees is now owned by Clorox, which makes the brand questionable in my opinion. We should always do research about these seemingly smaller all-natural brands because sometimes their parent companies represent just what we're trying to avoid. But this looks like a great idea and thanks for sharing the discount!
ReplyDeleteI can understand wanting organic and safe products in your home, but why give your child processed foods from a bag when you could just give him fresh strawberries, peas, pears and broccoli? The dried stuff is probably more convenient to transport, but the fresh stuff is ever so much better.
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing and for the coupon code! Ever since I got preggy with my son (4 years ago), I started reading about household cleaners, shampoos etc. EWG database is great and now we use Seventh Generation for all cleaning and laundering, Tom's for dental care and deodorant, Avalon Organics for face wash, hand cream, shampoo and shower gel and Burt's Bees for bean's shampoo and shower gel. I hope these industries get regulated and more chemical giants see the light and that a green sustainable product is good for everyone and the plant.
ReplyDeleteI hate to be *that guy,* but I have to point out that of course all products are full of chemicals. So is your body. So is coffee. A chemical is any prepared compound, so using "chemicals" as a shorthand for "stuff that's bad for me" is misleading, in the same way that using "all natural" to mean "stuff that's good for me" is misleading (as someone pointed out above, arsenic is 100% all-natural, as is lanolin - a common ingredient in Burt's Bees products that makes many people break out).
I totally support what you're getting at, but as an environmental and language geek, that kind of confusing labelling drives me up the wall! It's also how companies are able to "greenwash," ie stick unsubstantiated claims on products that are no different than everything else on the shelves.Repliesagreed. tom's of maine, for instance, uses propylene glycol in their deodorant.
legally, the terms "natural" and "organic" on products can include a variety of things you'd never want near your body or your loved ones.Always happy to not be the first person to go here! I think being 100% organic is lovely in theory but for most people it is completely unrealistic. I had several children and they all turned out fine having their hair washed with LOreal Kids shampoo and eating Oreos in their lunch. None of them are overweight. I look at the prices of organic products and can't believe that it could possibly be worth it. I went to Whole Foods when it first came to my town and did my family's grocery shop for the week and it cost me 5 times as much as it normally does at a normal grocery store. I just don't think it is worth it. I definitely couldn't have afforded it when I had my first two.
I'm with ^ meaghantothemax...I would still end up researching each product (and likely be disappointed with most) because of greenwashing. Labels like 'chemical', 'natural', and 'green' mean absolutely nothing in terms of what's good for you or not. For the most part I'm better off making my own cleaning and body products and drying my own strawberries, although I totally understand the convenience angle (and the yummy scents - those are hard to replicate).
ReplyDeleteI just lost a ton of respect for you. Food, Inc? Seriously?? I thought you would be more educated and listen to more than incredibly biased information paid for and produced by an organic producer. Also, organic does not mean no pesticides or herbicides- it means you can still use them as long as they are made organically.
ReplyDeletei love your blog and understand the need for sponsored posts so I make these comments with respect. however, none of the brands shown there are what i consider to be 100% natural or organic brands. nearly all are owned by big business - toms and burt's bees included, which resulted in reformulations and the introductions of ingredients that are not safe enough for my family. it's important to recognize that just because an ingredient originated in nature, (and many of these brands have ingredients that don't) the degree to which it's been processed (including the use of toxic solvents) turns it into franken-cosmetics. for truly natural, organic cosmetics we're all going to have to dig a little deeper. there are many companies really going the extra mile such as nahla beauty and suki naturals, both of which are made right here in the us and rahua for haircare. this post disappoints me because those products shown and sold through vine are absolutely not perfect choices. not even close.
i know every family needs to make their own choices about how natural to go but i think it's extremely important to not gloss over questionable ingredients or promote something as the perfect natural choice.Thank you so much for your sweet comments, and apologies for my slow reply!! My boots are from Loeffler Randall (they are a major splurge, but the kind of boots you can wear all your life, and Loeffler Randall has some GREAT sales if you watch out for them); http://www.loefflerrandall.com/LRProduct.aspx?ProductID=30&CategoryID=60
Thank you again for your sweet notes!! xoxoxoThese look good! Thanks for the suggestions.
For those of you who think organic is too expensive: farmer's market. It's great. I don't have much money, either, but we can get hormone-free, grass fed meat LOWER than supermarket prices at ours.
Finally, if you're totally into orgnanic stuff, I hope you're not pumping hormones into your body to get rid of your fertility (yuck!). If you are, and want to try something different to postpone pregnancy, I'd suggest Creighton Model Fertility Care. It helps you determine when you are and when you're not fertile (and would help a lot if you have any trouble with your fertility).Natural is good sometimes. As I've posted before, people need to be informed about what they're buying/using. You may think preservatives sound evil, but they're a lot better for you than putting on a lotion than has no preservatives and is contaminated with microbes and other nasties. THAT can make you sick.
I think it's important to strike a balance... you just have to be smart about it. Natural doesn't automatically mean it's good for you.
I'm all about moderation in diet and what products I put on my skin.WOw!! I love those pictures and I hope what I read really gonna do it's work. I like the content and its really nice to know.
Organic Baby ProductsThis post is sponsored by Vine.com. I'm proud to be working with them, and we love and use their site for our family. Their all-natural products are a huge step in the right direction!swtor gold
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Rules are cool. :D
You already know I will be there Taga, since I am going with you to Arisia as your Tenth Doctor ><
Or I may do Sarah Jane, or both! Not sure yet.
I am part of a group that plans to attend one day as Doctor Who Characters. So far we have a number 10 Lady Doctor, Donna Noble and Captain Jack Harkness.