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Originally posted by Jaedor
I'm playing differently than I used to. I'm engaged with 4 AAA mmos at once instead of being loyal to one. From my perspective, it's quite strange. As a result, I'm also spending more money. My gaming entertainment budget is a lot higher today than the $13/mo I used to spend. For the industry, this is a good thing. It does feel strange, though, and I find myself continuing to search for something that may be lost to time.
I'm just playing DAYZ until someting not crappy comes along. The freedom to kill players I don't like has been long missed.
People keep saying that WoW is an anomaly, but is it? It is one of the best developed games out on the market, and they tend to develope expansively, that is, to please many and on several levels. There is stuff for the content locusts, and there is stuff for those who like to stop and smell the flowers, like me. As such, it provides in general the longest term enjoyment for both kinds of players.
Outside of the grinds, of which there are many, there are things like arena, now the pet battle system, economic activities with the AH, exploration outside of flagging the achievements. There is still so much to see and do, resee and redo.
The only game I find that is equivalent in that sense is EQ2.
Both of these games are nigh-on impossible to entirely complete. What I mean by that is getting all of the endgame PvE gear, get the best PvP gear and titles, get the best slot in arena, be the best crafter with all of the recipes in the game, etc. I mean, after 8 years of playing these games off and on, I certainly haven't seen all of the content, and I think even the min maxers are a lot like me. There will still be stuff they haven't done or seen.
The issue more is that recent releases are too slimmed down and streamlined that they don't offer as many elements of play.
Originally posted by MurlockDance
People keep saying that WoW is an anomaly, but is it? It is one of the best developed games out on the market, and they tend to develope expansively, that is, to please many and on several levels. There is stuff for the content locusts, and there is stuff for those who like to stop and smell the flowers, like me. As such, it provides in general the longest term enjoyment for both kinds of players. Outside of the grinds, of which there are many, there are things like arena, now the pet battle system, economic activities with the AH, exploration outside of flagging the achievements. There is still so much to see and do, resee and redo. The only game I find that is equivalent in that sense is EQ2. Both of these games are nigh-on impossible to entirely complete. What I mean by that is getting all of the endgame PvE gear, get the best PvP gear and titles, get the best slot in arena, be the best crafter with all of the recipes in the game, etc. I mean, after 8 years of playing these games off and on, I certainly haven't seen all of the content, and I think even the min maxers are a lot like me. There will still be stuff they haven't done or seen. The issue more is that recent releases are too slimmed down and streamlined that they don't offer as many elements of play.
I blame the fact that so many games try to copy off WoW yet fail to even do that well leaving out large things that should be in any modern MMO release such as multiple things to do at 'end game' from dungeons, raids, to 'casual' content or other quality of life improvements like LFG systems. One of the larger mistakes I see occur all the time is so much effort being put into the leveling portion of the game and the max level content being nonexistent.
Originally posted by Leviathonlx
I blame the fact that so many games try to copy off WoW yet fail to even do that well leaving out large things that should be in any modern MMO release such as multiple things to do at 'end game' from dungeons, raids, to 'casual' content or other quality of life improvements like LFG systems. One of the larger mistakes I see occur all the time is so much effort being put into the leveling portion of the game and the max level content being nonexistent.
Yes, that and too many bucks spent on fancy pants VO and cutscenes. ToR is the worst offender.
I really do not think that that gives us bang for the buck. A cutscene here and there to tell a story is good, and VO can be very nice if used properly, but I find that overusing both is an irritation and a waste of money that could be spent developing the world content in such a way that is even more immersive. Too many cutscenes can break immersion because they force on the player how the developer wants him/her to see the world.
Content locusts aren't bad per se. Content locusts who play MMOs like they're a second job (or the only job in some cases) and then complain "there's nothing to do after 700 hours of gameplay in 2 months" are the problem. They seem to be the loudest, most negative types out there.
I'd also say that content locusts are the reason there are so many games out there that are superficial gear grinds. If that many people are going to run through so much content in so little time, in many cases companies may feel they have no choice but to implement grinds in order to keep the locusts playing.
Tell you what, stop playing a single game for 30+ hours/week and you probably won't get bored. Companies may also feel they can take more risks with more in depth play rather than just having to through content out there to keep the locusts happy.
Originally posted by MurlockDance
People keep saying that WoW is an anomaly, but is it? It is one of the best developed games out on the market, and they tend to develope expansively, that is, to please many and on several levels. There is stuff for the content locusts, and there is stuff for those who like to stop and smell the flowers, like me. As such, it provides in general the longest term enjoyment for both kinds of players. Outside of the grinds, of which there are many, there are things like arena, now the pet battle system, economic activities with the AH, exploration outside of flagging the achievements. There is still so much to see and do, resee and redo. The only game I find that is equivalent in that sense is EQ2. Both of these games are nigh-on impossible to entirely complete. What I mean by that is getting all of the endgame PvE gear, get the best PvP gear and titles, get the best slot in arena, be the best crafter with all of the recipes in the game, etc. I mean, after 8 years of playing these games off and on, I certainly haven't seen all of the content, and I think even the min maxers are a lot like me. There will still be stuff they haven't done or seen. The issue more is that recent releases are too slimmed down and streamlined that they don't offer as many elements of play.
Both of the games you mentioned have been out for a long time and have had several expansions. That's why there is so much to do and see, and so much for so many different playstyles. But was it like that originally, in their vanilla releases? I don't think so. Yet, people seem to expect that a game being released now should have as much content and expansiveness upon release that those two games took nearly a decade to produce.
That's the main problem I see with gaming in the present.
I played SWG from the beginning, suffered through CU, and terminated my participation with NGE.
I played SWG for years, would still be playing it today if not for horrifically inept project leadership.
Hate the use of Sandbox and Themepark terms as stereotypes of MMOs. To me, an MMO is about virtual worlds, and being a world, your avatar is able to live and breathe "so-to-speak" or "experience life" in an alternate reality. It therefore must have depth, must have multiple dimensions of activities and progress/achievement ... a building process of accomplishment, for avatars, for activities, for guilds, for communities. The world around you should be "built by activity" and "sustained by activity" allowing players to choose and find their individual niches from a selection of game and player-based systems and cohesively around shared or common core activities.
SWG gave us that, until inept leadership unwound and destroyed it. They launched it prematurely - missing crucial content - due to a bad corporate decision. Lacking core theme-based content, and with weak leadership and weak sustained vision, weak project leadership and management fundamentals (including integrating and managing community feedback), the development team then was caught in catch-up mode, trying to catch up for a false start, and tripped over themselves week after week, month after month, lacking vision and reacting in an ad hoc manner, zigging and zagging in response to ad hoc criticism from players.
Lacking vision, they could not maintain cohesion with high level design tenets and quickly lost their way, tripped themselves and their development infrastructure, and essentially crashed and burned to the point that critical staff were gone, design was confused and breaking, they couldn't sustain the bloat of confused design elements, and they didn't know which way was up. Complete project Leadership failure that was quickly evident and was allowed to continue for years. Smedley owns that.
Instead of owning that leadership failure, they deflected and blamed the design that they broke, and sold shareholders on the need to revamp the game (and again). CYA instead of dealing with ineffective Leaders. Leaders were spared the embarrasment and accountability for leadership failure (not design failure, the design started out sublime), deflecting blame onto original game design inappropriately, and so we lost the greatest MMO ever built due to corporate shennanigans... Smedley at the top of the blame pyramid who somehow survived the greatest failure and injustice of the MMO genre that laid waste the creativity of the MMO's for a decade and a half so far, and let inept SWG leaders like Daniel Erickson of the NGE fame to go on and pass his sacred cows to the same effect with SWTOR with its shallow NGE-like design fundamentals.
A premature start and lack of effective leadership sank SWG, but there is no doubt that had they just held course to high level design tenets and caught up with missing content, I would still be playing and paying pre-CU today, and loving every minute of it.
So I've been a locust, and every MMO since SWG has been something to kill time with until the next one came along, also to disappoint, and ever waiting for someone to deliver again on the promise of the MMO experience.
Great post Bill. Mirrors a lot of what I (and others here) have been saying for awhile now. BadSpock also made some great points that this is what gamers (today) want to play. I just starated WoW a few weeks ago, and I must admit, albeit its shortcomings (level too fast, linear questing, etc) its a fun experience and there is a TON to do.
So it makes sense that developers try to 'copy' or 'mimic' that. The next one to become the leader of the pack will no doubt have to introduce sandbox like systems that allows players to create the content. I want something to DO outside of questing/pvp/raid/dungeon. Let me fish. Let me build a boat or a flying contraption. Let me explore. Give me something (pretty) to look at. GW2 almost made it but the lack of progression killed it for me (along with the fact I couldnt get into action combat - just not what I prefer in my RPG).
Im also playing multiple MMOs until one comes out that can monopolies all of my interests. Eyes on ArcheAge at the moment.
Well writen article with some good points. But I think the true challenge for MMO's nowadays is and the way corporations are handling a new player base and it is completely and uterly ignored in these forums.
I'm guessing the majority of people on MMO post sites are similar to me, age 30's-40's. People who used to play D&D and were the pioneer role play gamers on Genesis and the PC etc. Now have jobs, kids, and are driven dedicated people.
The MMO landscape has evolved along with those of us. The 1 to 2 million of us, who are still here looking for "the"game in a genre that has drastrically changed.
How did it change? WoW. Blizz did the most amazing gaming marketing campaign to draw in a new type of MMO player by the tenfold. Straight up brilliant, but changed our landscape forever. But they are only one part of the change. As us original MMO gamers evolved so did the next generation that didnt grow up on MOGS, and table top games, but rather XBOX and PS2's etc in a digital world.
IMO WoW is only popular because people went to it. You look for an MMO that has population, friends bring in friends and have a good time. WoW was good in many ways, shallow in most others, but they had people, which draws people and the marketing behind it to boasted that at every chance. Honestly WoW has only been successful because of their marketing, which was completely ignored from SOE and majority of titles that hosted games like UO or DOAC at that era. Blizz really didn't have anything revolutionary or drastically different beyond easy leveling and lots of instant gratification which takes us to the other point.
As we aged and changed so did the genre. Don't forget this is a commercial and capitalistic Genre, as is well pretty much everything. Point in case would be the music industry, look back 60-70 years then move forward, you have the Beach Boys, you have the Beatles, you have Manudo, New Kid's on the block, Nsync?, Justin Beeber and so on. An ever changing cycle with the majority of popular sales world wide targeted towards a certain demographic. Is the MMO market much different?
Well first we used to be more of a "cult" market really. Some might call us nerdy techy types, on the leading edge of hype trendy technology that was actually pretty expensive and complicated. Now those are given out pretty easily. New box's are pretty cheap, technology and interfaces easily understood by most. One of my coworkers was setting up a computer for his youngest daughter last week like he did with all of his other kids, and she couldn't get past the keyboard because of her previous interactions with the iPad. Again another change.
I think what we're seeing is the continued surge of those evolving from the Xbox360/PS3 environments where they were continually conditioned people to beat the game on a linear track and move onto another title, hence the "locusts" people mention. Honestly the market and development reflects this in every way. Unfortunately most game developers also seem to be trying to keep up with these trends only to a negative affect to their product in the MMO world scape. And lets not even mention the foriegn asian market because I know very little about those games but has quadroupled the player base.
Why wouldn't they? Let's look at a few facts. Most major console title's like Halo, or MWF, are dishing out more than major motion pictures for production, and bringing in way more revenue than them. Selling hundreds of millions of boxes at around 60 bucks a pop, at least tripling the sales of the most popular movies on the market.
From a story line, these games are very linear, from a pvp aspect they are dead as soon as the next release comes out. They don't even stack like MMO's. But these are the clients who have been merging into the MMO world over the last decade, our "locuts"; Beat it, on to the next; follow the popular herd to a new game and or release that doesn't allow for you to carry your character or continue to build your hero any more. It's a very different world. The different MMO companies seem to be trying to catch up to this and continually try to suck in the billions of dollars being used for gaming entertainment.
Probably no different than why I can't understand my X-wife, or why my kid wants/NEEDS a new $60 game every month :-P
How have we seen this affect our games?
Well most of my complaints would revolve around poor marketing for most major titles, and the success of marketing for other titles that have kind of ruined the genre. But beside that there are crucial differentiators that are obvious.
IMO there are a few titles over the last couple decades that had stood out as true MMOs. UO, EQ2, SWG, VG. Each of these had had their good stuff and eventually major short fallings.
UO absolutely revotionary, simply couldn't compete with upcoming major devolepment titles and progressive systems, poor management and dissruptive ownerships.
SWG could have been would have been the next evolution of this. This is literally the biggest proprietary title on the planet, and should have gone so far. NGE did kill this game, but why? Battlefronts had come out and did amazing on the consols selling millions, they twitch played production to try to replicate that, not realizing those people were'nt MMO'rs yet (check the timeline). That was really what that was about. NGE failed and almost no production money was put into the title after that, and the few remaining developers did their best to make the best game they could, but unfortunately it wasn't enough, and was then killed because of the next fail of the new SW MMO SWTOR.
VG, which I really think "physically should be" what an MMO is, was again just sabotaged by many poor desicions and never received much love after it's poor launch.
EQ2 was MY game forever. I loved it and was dedicated to it since beta. I just think they swung way to far to left over the last couple years and now the game being "ftp" has only added a dozen ways to make you pay for it. Management dummied it down so much that you either are playing it as a newbie locust, are a Sim City crafter/decorator or are left with raid grinding. The game had so much to offer, but they completely yanked out the core game play aspect. No matter how much candy you throw in, once you lose the real game play, the core, there is no back bone to hold it up. If SOE had half the smarts that Blizz did this game would have rivaled WoW. But now SOE has chosen to completely disregarded their original player base and proves to only play "twitch" development to find everyway they can to cash grab from customers instead of continue to make them loyal.
What I am currently playing is GW2. It has honestly been refreshing over the last three months. I don't feel any level grinds, and when I am over powered for a zone I am quickly put back in my place even in zones way below my level. The PVP is amazing and I spend most of my limited time there. I paid to buy the game (as almost all FTP games do, but have actually saved hundreds of dollars over the last few month from my last game that was "FTP"). There is no monthly sub, no constant barrage of market items. Simple and fun.
FTP is an illusion to suck in new people, simply an illusion.
To any publishers out there. Just make the game fun please, make it easy. If you want a serious and dedicated player base, don't keep changing subscription rules, just stand up for what you believe in continue to develop the story. That will keep your players active and loyal. I don't honestly see how the "fly by night" players bring in real non-spurt revenue, aka most of the "locusts" people are complaining about should become the complete focus.
Developers have created the "content locusts". They insist on making games "on rails" with specific time limits, developer control on what the end stats are, and then cry when people hit their so called "end game" and find there is no reason to continue playing. So, they try and create "harder" content, make grinds to surfice for some part of longevity, and then even try the Cryptic way of placing "some" developer tools into the game itself so players can create their own quests. The "foundry" did not work in STO (where is was introduced) as players were still complaining for dev released content, and developers still wanting that "control" so they did not allow for players to put in "rewards" for their quests that would make the playerbase want to actualy do them. "Story" may have been TOR's "4th pillar" but I believe the industry now knows exactly just how far that will get you.
The problem here with player made content is the same as with developer made content (quests). At 1 point in time, they're done and people who rely on content for something to do in an MMO will be at an end. There is no longevity in that context.
I'm almost overjoyed to see the industry looking again at "sandbox" gameplay rather than strict on rails themepark. Maybe we will actualy get a game that is worth playing for years instead of months. ESO, if they include most of what Skyrim has in it, might be the game that I'm looking for but, to be honest, with so little info on ESO, I'm waiting for more to make that decision. I was bit for 2 CEs (mine and the wifes) for TOR and will not make that mistake again.
TOR was a train-wreck looking for a place to happen the minute that BioWare hired the NGE devs back on 06. Dallas Dickerson et al. These guys had the idea to make vanilla "WoW" (that's what was out when they made their design criteria) with a Star Wars skin and that is exactly what they set out to do and they suceeded in design, however their game did not with the masses. It did the exact same thing as their previous design did with SWG's NGE. The problem was, the game they set out to create already existed, there was nothing new to it, and WoW (the direct competition) had almost 8 years of post launch "content" (for the locusts) to compare it with. Pretty much the same problem with all the WoW clones. No sence in playing a copy if the original works, has more to it, and Bliz keeps adding more and more.
Originally posted by Esquire1980
TOR was a train-wreck looking for a place to happen the minute that BioWare hired the NGE devs back on 06.
Spot on truth. I said the same thing the moment their names were associated with TOR, and we saw in their video diaries leading up to launch the arrogance and sacred cows that they were foisting on their future customers rather than fundamentals of MMO universes. So, its clear these fools intended and gave us an NGE in TOR, which they probably thought "we were right with NGE in SWG, but the reason we failed was because of the baggage. In this case, we don't have that baggage and we can now be successful with an NGE-like MMO that we always knew was the right model."
I have no doubt that's what these fools from SWG thought as they foisted their NGE sacred cows on TOR design. That's exactly what we have today, and why they're now out the door and unemployed. Unfortunately, we players continue to suffer another anemic pseudo-MMO experience in TOR.
You have to wonder, how so many people can continue to be so arrogant and wrong, and blow a franchise opportunity represented by Star Wars and MMO players.
As I said before, Smedley (NGE) is directly responsible, Julio Torres (NGE, went on to KOTOR), Daniel Erickson (NGE, TOR) ... all of those fools who trashed a legendary MMO universe, and instead of taking responsibility for their inept leadership of the project, deflected blame on the game design complexity (lacking the original vision, the ability to manage a complex project, or having any vision as leaders otherwise) and lobotomized it. And because those fools weren't held accountable in SWG, deflecting blame on complexity of design rather than their inability to manage the premature launch and the project itself, and were able to move on and get hired for TOR only to arrogantly apply the exact same mistakes in MMO design principles.
Let's hope with two strikes on two phenominal Star Wars MMO franchise opportunities and blunders, these fools are flipping burgers for a career from now on and no longer doing harm to gamers. Yet, somehow, people like Smedley were able to deflect the blame and still hold their jobs... amazing. To this day, I have never bought a Sony product of any kind.
PS- I'd sure like to know who hired Erickson as a Bioware leader, and bought his nonsense. The whole 4th Pillar Story idea was a no-show. All we got was shallow quests as the avatar moved from one NPC stranger to another NPC stranger to get a task. No ensemble cast, no recurring characters (and if we did have recurring characters, no stand-outs), nothing we'd expect from the charm and depth of Star Wars or any story at all. Just one stranger to another for a task. Really? Pillar?
The only innovation provided by TOR is Voice, and absent story - of which LOTRO by comparison has 20x more story per quest save in text - the Voice innovation is little more than an underutilized novelty that gets what it deserves - which is alot of space-baring to get past the "yada yada go do this or kill that". What a sham, what a shame... what hacks. Where do they find these people to run MMO projects?
It's almost inconceivable that when I learned years ago that I would get another chance to play a Star Wars-based MMO and about fell out of my chair, that I would be stuck with another NGE MMO (literally made by the same fools.)
Here's an example of what I want from a real living, breathing MMO experience with my avatar able to play out life in an alternate universe. I'll use SWG as an example with some twists, since I haven't seen anything else come close to creating an MMO universe (some might call it sandbox, I do not).
Using crafting as an example. Multiple trades, multiple roles, suiting those who would approach crafting as a casual endeavor, or a dedicated activity:
* Multiple roles; resource gathering, reseller, casual goods crafter, niche crafter/specialization, factory production, merchant focus, shopkeeper and decorator.
* Multiple goods; casual crafters can craft low-quality, low maintanance-cost, low frills goods... an example of which would be housing structures where some players may be interested in comparatively inexpensive, low maintenance cost structures, and have little frills, to serve purposefully as workshops or storage facilities shared by crafters or a storefront that requires a distinct look - they're more disposable and replaceable - or factories that make low-level goods at lower production costs (more efficient for low level goods) or in fewer volumes. Contrast with crafted high-quality structures or factories (from same or similar schematics) crafted with high customizability and textures (for player houses to be decorated) or factories that produce high quality goods but both require higher maintanence to support. Demand for both levels of goods, with segmented production by casual or dedicated crafters; each with their own market. As a dedicated crafter, I can make low quality, low maintenance, low frill goods, but there's no economic payoff by doing so... "I'll do it if I have to or if asked to, but its not efficient for me."
* Multiple production levels; ability to produce high volumes of low-quality goods at casual levels, low volumes of high-quality goods at median engagement levels, and high volumes of high quality goods at dedicated engagement levels, lesser ability to produce high quality goods at high volumes across various niches requiring specialization - ... all suiting different roles desired by individual players to be mass producers, niche producers, merchants with stocked vendors, etc.
SWG did most of the above, and the amount of player-directed activity across various dimensions of above gameplay was almost unlimited. And that's just for crafting. Find something you enjoy, and spend untold weeks or months doing it, tweaking it, sustaining it, building reknown and reputation for your niche, and at anytime delve off into another area of gameplay. A place where in many cases, your participation matters, what you do effects others, such as providing them goods that they need in the crafting example and where you can build a reputation and reliability for your place in the universe. You matter.
The following was just prior to the NGE bombshell to change SWG as we knew it, which itself just followed the launch of the Trials expansion that players had just "paid" for.
MMORPG.com: What is your personal favorite part of Galaxies? What makes it a good game?
Julio Torres:
My favorite part of Galaxies is that it allows me to immerse myself in the Star Wars universe like nothing else can at any time, all the time. In addition to that aspect, I would say the amount of depth Galaxies offers in terms of the game itself is simply amazing and provides near-endless gameplay and fun experiences.
MMORPG.com: With a couple of expansions now under your belts, how does Galaxies appeal to the "new player" without having them feel lost or somehow behind other players?
Julio Torres:
This has definitely been a challenge for our game in the past, but has come a long way, especially in terms of directing the player to what they need to be doing early-on. The first experience a player has with a game is incredibly important in terms of design because it is within this initial time frame that a player decides whether they will continue playing the game or move-on to something else. Knowing how important it is to put your best foot forward as early as possible, we are constantly looking for ways to make the game more accessible to more players and improve the overall experience.
That being said, we actually have some very exciting things in the works right now to help accomplish this. Stay tuned.
MMORPG.com: With Trials of Obi-Wan now nearly on the shelves, what is next for Galaxies?
Julio Torres:
Though I can't go into any detail regarding future products, I can tell you that Trials of Obi-Wan will not be the last expansion to Star Wars Galaxies. We are constantly conceptualizing, designing, and thinking about the future for this great game that despite being out for over two years, continues to be enjoyed by hundreds of thousands of players. [about to cry out in the Force]
Smedley, Torres, Erickson ... nice.
Companies also need to just skip to Free2Play.
Seriously, how many of you see a new MMO title come out that looks interesting and think, at least somewhere, " I'll wait till it goes Free2Play "?
"Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius
I'm the type of gamer (like many) who works all day, comes home, takes care of family, cooks, etc. Then I want an hour, maybe two if I'm lucky to immerse myself in a beautiful world where I can be creative and social and not have to murder everything in sight nonstop. (Granted, on the really bad days where I need to release some stress, sometimes that's not such a bad thing - lol). But anyway, I want an immersive world with people running around talking, an alive and bustling world. I want to be able to explore nooks and crannies without having to worry about getting attacked by something every 10 feet. I want to craft stuff that is interesting and useful for myself and for others. I want "busy" activities, whether it be fishing, cooking, building, creating something. I want a house or a shop. I want pets or animals.
Now, most of the time, I hear people say to go play Hello Kitty or whatever it is. Yeah, well, I'm an adult. I want an adult game. I want to be surrounded by adults (well, not that everyone is an adult in MMOs, but you know). I want the atmosphere/open world that exists in many MMOs these days, but I want all those things I mentioned (or at least enough to keep me interested) without having to "progress" by doing mindless quests and killing nonstop. Every MMO I've tried since WoW, I've labored through that part of it while focusing on doing the stuff I enjoyed such as crafting, fishing, etc., but too often in MMOs, in order to progress those aspects, you need to level your character by...yep...doing those boring quests and killing nonstop. Sigh. I don't mind killing stuff, but that being the whole basis of a game just doesn't work for me.
I do have my eye on The Repopulation, which is in its early stages of development. So far, it sounds like the closest thing I will find to what I'm looking for. It's still quite a ways out, though, so in the meantime, I'm slogging along looking at all new MMOs that come out and being disappointed over and over. The only upside is that I'm starting to see more and more blogs/articles/discussions like this one where I'm finding more and more people who, while they may not think exactly like I do or want exactly what I want, they're voicing many of the same things that I've been feeling. I make sure to jump into any of these conversations to add my voice to what I hope is a large enough base of players with these wants to maybe make some developer out there somewhere think it's worth it to come up with something different.
With my prior rants (feedback) done... Thanks, Bill, for bringing up such an important topic. We spend so many hours and so many dollars, and so many hours invested with guildmates and friends made, that it is 'never' my intent to be a locust. If SWG hadn't done what it had with the revamps, there is no question I would have stayed with it. Even with TOR performing at a 3 out of 10, I'm still sticking with it despite my long list of fundamental issues (search Definitive Issues in TOR forums), until such time as they seriously tick me off (actually find its gotten better, maybe a 4 now, and a slight eagerness to log in again).
So why do we leave hoping the next will entertain us better, or meet our MMO needs better? And how can MMO's based on a franchise like Star Wars or Star Trek go so wrong?
Face it, SWG was mismanaged, but enough of that.
MMO Leveling - what is leveling and what is end game? Well... two premises... 1) Leveling is an exercise in skill building and learning curve - if not, then give us all our skills at Level 1 and turn us loose on content and content areas, balanced accordiingly, and 2) we need endgame that isn't just a gear grind. If you flatten this conceptually, quest lines and quest areas currently attributed to leveling are just another element of end game activity. They give you things to explore, areas to explore, skills and competencies to learn.
Endgame - once you get to end game, whether after leveling up, or as above theorized with a player dropped with end game activities from the onset with a flattened and complete set of skills at Level 1 - what do you expect?
Here's a list:
1) Questing - this is exploration, achievement, and loot-based activity to enjoy game time. Tell a story, not just strangers represented in NPC's like in TOR, where they assign a task, then the next NPC stranger to assign another task. Have recurring characters, ensemble characters, that help tell a progressive story and recognize the progression your avatar has achieved. Have interesting areas of exploration with stories and achievements (not just gear - see motivating items below). Questing and story lines don't have to be associated with leveling, but can be one of story telling and exploration, with non-gear oriented rewards. Don't even need to level or have levels if approached with quests as just another activity for players. "It's all endgame!" "I'm going back to the Darklands quest area, because... never finished it... to get avatar skill stats... to finish achievement and unlocks... to do hardmode... to get awards..."
2) Crafting - allows players the opportunity to enjoy aspects of the game, self-created activity, such as resource gathering, reselling, merchant, specialization, building a reputation as a niche provider where players seek you out or know of you, storefront shopkeeper and decorator
3) Guilds - activity that supports and reinforces guild communities and progression. These can include accomplishments that award vehicles, pets, structures, crafting halls/malls, taverns, or ships for the guild, guild-feature modules and capabilities, combat or merchant skill sets, cosmetic items (banners, logos, fireworks), gear (militia armor, heavy weapons, platform weapons, ship weapons) ... stars the limit, only we typically have dark skies in MMO's. With so often that player enjoyment is based on guild community enjoyment, provide guild charter tools for "would-be" guild leaders to flesh out succesful expectations, and search tools that allow players to find good guild fits beyond today's dismal "have to jump into a guild with both feet to really find out what they're about" beyond their usual poor "no drama" shingles.
4) Raids - Activities that are not so gear-gated ("let me load my tank, and we're good to go") that provide for flexibility and opportunity based on challenges to class skills and teamwork primarily - things that guilds and teamwork, even PUGs with embedded voice chat, can overcome with repeated effort. Things that provide rewards other than gear, such as the many items listed in Item #3 above. A place to enjoy content together, build skills, build teamwork, and demonstrate achievement as groups. If nothing else for PUGs, indivdual motivation such as Credits, cosmetic items, badges, twinking loot, and crafting materials...
5) PvP - a place for multiplayer combat that links activity and accomplishments to persistent MMO world progression, such as the items listed in Item #3 above, for guild awards, and Item #4 above for individual awards. Ideally, a place where teams (of balanced numbers) can come together in a variety of environments, victory conditions, and configurations to apply teamwork and class skills against other players. A place where skill and teamwork is more important than gear (more gear gating), where the rewards benefit the guild, the guild community, its players, and also indivdual players. See above for examples of awards. Fortress maps, battlefield maps, capture the flag, most kills, hold territories...
Make access to the above simple, not gear gated, so that there's more opportunity to form a team, and exercise teamwork, class skill building, team role building, without being gated by gear requirements. Again, "I'll get on my tank and we're good to go" rather than, "we don't have a tank that's raid ready." In so many MMO's we always find the latter. Then, once in and building skills, "ok we got owned there, here's where we need to do better, here's what we learned from that - the good news is, after three months now we got the crafting module for our guild capital ship and had alot of fun, but I really want those guild logos for our armor pieces."
6) Entertainment - not alot personally to say here, I know alot of players ask for this in MMOs (harkening again to SWG), the musicianship, the cantinas as a social hotspot... but I've had a hard time articulating what this might mean from a design standard. I would say that in LOTRO, I had 5 accounts, and 5 boxes, and for a hoot would load them up in a public spot, dressed them the same, and equipped each with a different instrument, and played a song as a band like the Rohan Theme. That was fun and funny and always drew a crowd and cheers.
7) Player Housing - we all know about the SWG ghost towns... we also know there's a solution for everything and that SWG leaders applied neither leadership nor policy. There's a hundred ways to solve it, whether instanced neighborhoods (LOTRO) or instanced worlds (TOR, "Tatooine 1"), but simple policies like LOTRO's "can't pay too far in advance" and introducing policies like if you don't log in to your structure and pay upkeep for 4 weeks, it disappears, or is available for purchase, and your belongings are in escrow to collect. Set policies and let people have some fun. Provide cheap structures for shared storage, crafting, and manufacture of low-quality goods, that require little monthly maintenance costs, and provide high quality structures and textures, highly customizable and decoratable, that cost more per month to maintain, all player crafted. Provide the lots, and let players place the structures they want, in the configuration they want (guilds). Provide Guild structures, awarded by achievements (combat, raid, PvP) such as capital ships, guild halls, flag poles in neighborhoods, neighborhood signs, turrets, walls, decorative items, merchant structures and vendors, custom guild flags, blacksmith shops, travel stops, taverns... provide player ship berths in Guild Capital ships as hubs, or merchant hubs, or player housing within Guild Halls/Keeps... so many opportunities or approaches. Where's the leadership?
8) MMO Flexibility - games that rigidly lock down player names, player surnames such that Kash Thurston prevents another player from naming theirs Kash Forbit, or in turn prevents another player from naming theirs Triton Forbit... all too restricitve. We all seem to get along just fine in our RL without being confused by three Ted Smiths in the phone book. Let people be. Then we get server merges where one Kash has to give up their name when merged and players have to give up a name they've had for years before the game even launched, in planning, and ticks people off. For what? Let people be. Similarly, provide ample storage for guild crafters and banks, for crafting materials, shared storage, workshops, and crafting huts, with large stack sizes, without rediculous and unnecessary stack size or other types of gates to limit people's ability to enjoy, to craft, to produce (factories), to cooperate.
#1. Just so long as it's not done with Group Quests. I never got to listen to any of TOR's Group Quest dialogue because people wanted to get it done...and I can't blame them, it was like the 7th time they ran the damn thing THAT DAY. Instead, make 'Journal Entries' that allow you to replay the dialogue, saving the coversation choices you and the group made. That way you can "experience the story" at your leisure without having people who maybe need to log in a few telling you to "Spacebar through".
#2. Harkening to Lineage II's crafting system (in terms of you could set yourself up as a crafting station) and private shops?
#3. agree
#4. Has to be gear-gated...or else there's no carrot.
#5. Gear will always be important, second only to level...true even in Guild Wars 2 (Trait and Skill Points)
#6. I love player-driven content
#7. Yes to housing, no to instancing...unless it's dynamic instancing used in like AoC to reduce lag. I don't want to have my house in Instance #33.....which has two other people's houses
#8. Sorry, but #8 is ridiculous. Unless the account name is displayed after it, like in STO (or was it before?). Or are you seriously saying you'd be fine if I used your character name and made you look like a douchebag; I can skirt the EULA/ToS in just about any game and still make the game population hate me (which would be you, since I'm using your name). [just an example, I don't do that, because I have to much self-respect].
That's the #1 reason it's not done. Has nothing to with DB entries, that can all be done like Blizzard's Battletag (playername.###).
As for server merges, that's why they do first-come-first-served.
-Most of that is solid, but some need tweaks.
"Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius
Originally posted by Dyner
#4. Has to be gear-gated...or else there's no carrot.
This is an MMO. Players aren't involved for MMO's to grind gear, they're there to play a multi-dimensional game where they can engage, explore, develop, and enjoy.
Relative to Raids and multiplayer combat... my clan played CounterStrike for more than two years just as enthusiastically as I raided with a LOTRO or TOR guild, not because of gear, but because of class and role challenge, teamwork, fun, and community. How many games do we play endlessly and gear is not even a game feature? It's just "he11a fun." MMO's can deliver on all those dimensions, and gear need not be the carrot or at least the gate that it is to the extreme that it is.
You can gate challenge levels by 2 elements: class competency, and role (teamwork) competency. These guys constantly add a 3rd element - gear readiness. The gear uberness is just a 3rd wheel that only serves to restrict opportunity to enjoy raiding. I'm not saying that gear shouldn't matter, that I can just go in without any armor. But the extreme they take it, such that I can't be reasonably geared, and very good in my class, and very good at executing in a team in a combat environment... so very often groups can't go because they don't have the requisite "raid ready" (gear-wise) class availability.
I killed myself to get raid ready in LOTRO on 4 classes, and I could go into the toughest content and play it well. That provided my guild alot of flexibility to enjoy the content and provide access to the content for alot of players in the guild, because of me and some select others, they could say, "Celebereg's on, he can fill the missing DPS role," or "Celebereg's on, he can fill the missing Tank role." But that's a killer pace, a marriage-ending pace, because as soon as you kill yourself to "gear up" multiple toons, they raise the level cap, and you're on the mousewheel again to level and twink their stats and gear again.
When do we get off the mousewheel and really get to enjoy the content they give us, before that level cap goes up again. The gear gating to the extent it is used, is way over the top. As a result, because there can't be more people multi-role and raid ready, it gates players accessibility to enjoy the content. As such, only a small percent gets to enjoy the tougher endgame content when it's not the players' competency in class or teamwork, its the enormous time to grind gear. That's completely counter-intuitive to providing a game for players to enjoy, developing all that content, and then putting up roadblocks to prevent most players from enjoying it to their capabilities. Pretty rediculous.
Originally posted by Dyner
Sorry, but #8 is ridiculous
We learned in business decades ago that you don't design a game around the bad behavior of a few abusers. There is so much distinction between one avatar to another; from species, appearance, male/female, class, guildname, title, profession... that I have no problem if another player happened to have the same first name, or the same last name.
Having both first and surname the same as another player would be pretty rare, unless you took a really common name for both, and even then, if you don't like it, you "should have" (emphasis Bioware) the ability to choose to change your name. In the rare example that someone was trying to grief you or impersonate you, they can be dealt with. Frankly, they can do that today, too, with a slight alpha variation - instead of Kandus Ordo, Guildname of True Blud, name yourself Kandos Ordo, and start a guild called Tru Blud. If someone's going to grief, they're going to grief.
Can't build something around griefers, or you'll be left with an NGE passing for an MMO.
I agree for the most past, scripted content is only going to last for so long, and companies just keep giving us the same ole content over and over and call it new, adding another ferris wheel to the park is just another ferris wheel, it's not new when you have 10 other ferris wheels..
Games need some kind of hybrid so our toons feel like they live in the world,and not just playing through it, more activites that are indeed new and not just rehashed.
I wonder with so many f2p games these days, if it is not putting the breaks on companies creativity, they just keep pumping put stuff for a store a little content here and there,but not addressing the real issue of the transient player.
But all games are not what the used to be even stand alone games do not offer the hours of play they did a few years age, everything seems to be designed for the wham bam thank you mam crowd, and on to the next.. depth and creativity are becoming a lost art in video games, might explain why sales were down across all platforms last month by 25%.. /sigh
Originally posted by wgc01
.. depth and creativity are becoming a lost art in video games, might explain why sales were down across all platforms last month by 25%.. /sigh
As far as MMO's go, there is a dearth of leadership. I have to call on SWG again, as it is the landmark MMO having the depth of a virtual universe. Two quick facts:
> The design was sublime across all gameplay dimensions.
> It was launched prematurely due to corporate leadership failure, missing much of its activity-oriented content
With those two things in mind, without strong leadership, it was doomed. There were two things that drove a failure of leadership:
1) The so-called leadership ilk represented by Torres and Erickson were too young and too inexperienced, they didn't know what they didn't know.
2) They lacked effective project leadership skills; everything from effective community feedback and communication loops, to an absence of project vision (design tenets) to hold to, and to apply feedback to within the contraints of a cohesive vision.
Absent that leadership, what we saw was one ad hoc design redirection after another, based on community shouting, without a cohesive vision to apply it to. They couldn't do anything right, because they didn't have the core vision, didn't have the leadership skills to integrate the feedback to the vision, and demonstrated their twists, turns, and meandering right off the cliff. As a result, too, they lost the talent, they lost any cohesion of the design tenets from one expansion to the next, and the game was breaking almost from the start.
Complete leadership and project management fundamentals failure. It would be bad enough if these young leaders were trying to cut their teeth on a simple project, but they were thrown into a guidance position over the pinnacle of MMO depth and design, a complex series of interconnected systems that made it the pinnacle that it was. That was a failure by Smedley and other higher ups at both SOE and LucasArts, that put these green leaders into the positions they were.
So, instead of putting experienced leaders on the team, they blamed the complexity of the game as "unmanageable". We knew by watching them over time that they had no leadership skills, so the issue was the leadership, rather than the game (we'll never know about its manageability, because the leadership was so bad so as to smother any chance of success). By blaming the game, and by that story being bought by SOE and LucasArts corporate leaders, they were able to deflect blame from themselves and sell the lobotomization of the MMO.
Two things followed that matter to TOR.
A) The failure of SWG as a poster child for sandbox (don't like the term, rather "a game of depth, dimension... a true virtual universe"), such that nobody touched sandbox for a decade and still counting, and the alternative, themepark MMOs, continued to disappoint players since.
The leaders of SWG who deflected blame, who blamed the game, who sold corporate leaders on lobotomizing SWG, and subsequently failed with NGE, went on to be leaders at TOR development. We players got The Old NGE as a result. Call it TOR or call it TON, doesn't matter, we got Erickson. Erickson apparently believed in his youthful hubris that he was right all along with what would make a great MMO, and probably thought that the reason NGE failed was not because it was bad design, but because players had baggage from the revamp.
We could see all through the development of TOR in Erickson's videos his arrogance, his sacred cows he was placing in design tenets, and thereby and more, his leadership failings. In the end, we launched with TOR/TON. What happened?
Let me ask you this? How is it possible that you can mix an MMO and Star Wars, and fail? ... Twice?
ANSWER: When the same failed leaders were at work on both projects.
Ultimately, we will never have a sustaining MMO success in a themepark, as it is counterintuative to "depth and dimension, in a virtual universe." We will never thrive without that depth, without experience through our avatars the life (story, combat, crafting, social interaction and dependencies, roles such as merchants and gatherers or raid coordinators, decorators, manufacturers, niche specialists, etc. etc. etc.) in a virtual universe.
The issue of project failure is not sandbox or themepark. The issue is three-fold to have MMO success:
1. Great design across many gameplay dimensions (no easy task)
2. Great leadership (no easy task)
3. IP (eg. Star Wars, Star Trek, BSG, Potter , whichever)
We've rarely had #1, and never had #2. So without those, we will never have a great, thriving MMO. The question for Bioware today, is do we have #2 now that Erickson has been shown the door.
This article should get some more face time. After seeing many people try to blame the players for playing a game the way they want, be it having more time, accusing people of rushing to max, not stopping to smell the roses, some of it even sounds like jealousy because they can't play more.
Content locusts are a symptom of current MMO design.
If someone can eat a four course meal in 5 minutes and someone else takes an hour that doesn't change the fact that you both have a four course meal and are not at a buffet.
If someone can beat the game in a month because it has 100 hours of content and someone else takes 6 months to beat the 100 hours of content that doesn't change the fact that there is only 100 hours worth of content.
Pretty tired of people who have not done all the content telling people who have how they should play. Maybe they should design MMOs so that they are not linear, shallow, easy, and able to be beaten in whatever number of hours. This is why I'm such an advocate for Minecraft, you can never beat it you just build more stuff.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer


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Celebrate autumn in the north with this vibrant category from our online puzzle store! Browse gorgeous landscape scenes chock full of carved pumpkins, trick-or-treaters and wild turkeys. Explore the bright leaves of orange, yellow and red on trees setting the stage for winter. With our great selection of harvest-themed fall puzzles, you'll be sure to get in the cold-weather spirit.
We offer jigsaw puzzle brands that make quality products; brands like Tomax, Springbok, Buffalo Games, Dowdle, Cobble Hill, Springbok, and Sunsout that use great materials and sharp, colorful images worthy of a season so colorful.

subset: commoncrawl


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|Posted by Terry Love on April 30, 19101 at 12:27:09:
|In response to Re: Toilet with drain in front
: I have a problem that can't be unique. Apparently, sometime in the last century, toilets were redesigned, with the waste discharge moved from the front to the middle, apparently so that only two mounting bolts are now required. However, replacing the older models with the new design moves the whole toilet forward eight inches or so, and in a small bathroom, leg room suffers! It is really not practical to relocate drain (mud floor). Does anyone still make a four-bolt toilet that will sit closer to the wall, or is there another solution I haven't thought of?
|Replies to this post
|There are none.


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Parks Canada
Home > National Parks of Canada > Pukaskwa National Park > Natural Wonders & Cultural Treasures > Monitoring moose from the air
During the winter, park staff at Pukaskwa National Park hop aboard a helicopter to count moose (Alces alces) from the air. The monitoring survey allows the park to obtain an estimate of the park's moose population, which gives an indication of the health of the park's forest ecosystems.
The 2011 survey estimated the moose population at 222 animals, or 0.2 moose/km2. This was up slightly from a 2008 survey that estimated the park's population at 144 animals. Outside of the park, the moose population is almost twice as high. This is likely because there are a lot more young forests in areas that have been logged and are now regenerating. Young trees and shrubs are ideal for moose to forage. Despite the small increase in Pukaskwa's moose population, the numbers are right where we want them to be. Having too many moose may have a negative impact on a small remnant population of Woodland Caribou (Rangifer tarandus caribou) in the park, as elevated numbers of moose will attract elevated numbers of wolves, a top predator that will also prey on caribou given the opportunity. Although predation is a natural process, Pukaskwa's caribou numbers have experienced significant declines over the last three decades and are now so few that even a slight increase in predation may cause them to disappear altogether. Also of concern to both moose and caribou, are the increased observations of white-tailed deer (Odocoileus virginianus) in the park. Warmer winters and the widespread conversion of forests into agricultural land in North America have been favourable for this species to expand its range north. White-tailed deer are carriers of brain worm (Parelaphostrongylus tenuis), a small parasitic nematode that infects the brain. Although white-tailed deer themselves are unaffected by its presence, other species suffer severe neurologic damage that eventually leads to death. Pukaskwa aims to ensure the balance of moose, wolves, and caribou is maintained so that the full complement of natural biodiversity can be maintained on the landscape. Want to know how YOU can help? Report your observations of any of these animals to park staff during your visit to Pukaskwa and learn more about any of these topics by speaking with one of our staff at the Visitor Centre.


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Kesler Tanner and Jacob Begay, seniors at Emery High school each earned a scholarship from Novell. This scholarship program is sponsored through Novell by the Utah State Office of Education and each scholarship is worth $2,000. Only eight seniors in the State of Utah are given scholarships by Novell.
To be eligible to apply for this scholarship, a senior student must take and pass a Novell networking class. Upon completion of the class, the student is a certified NetWare administrator. This means the student is certified through Novell to run their network operating system. Tanner and Begay are pictured here with their instructor Wayne Roberts.


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ISU students targets of tax prep scam
Here's a news item from the Associated Press: POCATELLO, Idaho (AP) ― A 38-year-old Dallas man has pleaded guilty to federal charges that he conspired to falsify income tax returns for Idaho State University students. The U.S. Attorney's Office says Moses Mukuka pleaded guilty Wednesday in Pocatello to conspiracy to file false claims for a refund and making a false claim against the United States. Sentencing is set for Feb. 13. Prosecutors alleged Mukuka entered into an agreement with another person to place flyers around the ISU campus advertising himself as an accounting student who would do income tax returns for $10. Mukuka sent the students' paperwork to another individual who submitted returns to the IRS with false information designed to increase the refund. Mukuka distributed a small portion of the refund to the taxpayers and wouldn't provide them with copies of their returns.
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It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
If you believe Funcom is owned by EA... wrong
EA is only distributing physical discs for FC in case of TSW.
FC is a much more experienced MMO developer than Bioware, and they stick to their update plans.
Looking at TOR the number of bad decisions and empty promises is unbeatable by any other dev.
Secrets of Dragon?s Spine Trailer.. !
Best MMOs ever played: Ultima, EvE, SW Galaxies, Age of Conan, The Secret World
BioWare was sold to EA in 2007. Funcom might eventually be sold to EA, but thus far is still independent.
So kind of an odd question... BioWare was an awesome company prior to 2007 (before being sold), while currently it's an inferior subdivision of EA .... so .. was Funcom an awesome company prior to being sold (possibly 2013)? An OK / good company, sure. A great / awesome company? naw
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
i used to like bioware :<
i still like fc heh
There are people who play games and then there are gamers.
Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security. I don't Forum PVP. If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident. When I don't understand, I ask. Such is not intended as criticism.
only EVE is real MMO...but I am impressive with TSW
I don't get the Funcom hatred. I have only played two Funcom games, TSW and AoC, and I liked one and love the other. Don't blame Funcom if you bought a lifetime sub and feel you are getting screwed, no one put a gun to anyone's head and made them get a lifetime sub. TSW is one of the better themepary MMORPGs out there right now (the best, in my opinion), despite what the naysayers say about it.
Funcom realized the game was struggling and decided to go B2P. In fact if you read the TSW forums, Joel has been very candid and honest about the whole affair which is very refreshing. None of this "we just wanted to give more people a chance to play this awesome game!" He admits that GW2 hurt their sales, he admits that they were losing money and he was afraid they'd have to fire more devs, so a decision was made. That his how you handle a price model conversion, players appreciate honesty.
Bioware on the other hand... when their game was struggling they charged people for action bars.
Please visit my youtube channel for some H1Z1/DayZ casual roleplay videos!
Originally posted by Phry
The OP might be on to something, after all you never actually see them in the same room together AT THE SAME TIME!! can't believe nobody noticed this earlier!!!
It's a conspiracy I tell ya!
OP: This is a forum for discussion of the game, The Secret World.
You appear to be a character who has escaped from that game.
Free to play = content updates for the cash shop. Buy to play = content updates for the cash shop.
Subscription = Actual content updates!
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
OR PM ME FOR A BUDDY KEY (need your email address).
Originally posted by DarkOmega
Funcom is so far below Bioware's league it's not even funny. If you were to compare them to TV shows it would be like comparing Jersey Shore or "insert lolreality show here" (Funcom) to Firefly or Breaking Bad (Bioware).
Partially true, if we're talking old Bioware then yes, if we're talking new Bioware... then you're comparing Jersey Shore to The Honey Boo Boo show... no real winners here but at least Jersey Shore has the retarded humor/feel about it.
What if we could have both?
Funware sounds the most entertaining. But 'Biofun' makes me laugh out loud.
There are many BioWares. There is only one Funcom.
But I assume you're comparing to the BioWare studio that made SW:ToR (and only SW:ToR so far) and in that regard Funcom smashes them with a critical hit.
The Longest Journey is one of my favorite games of all time, and even ignoring that for just AoC and TSW I still find Funcom's MMOs better. Looking at how BioWare handled cutscenes and how Funcom handled them with TSW, that alone is enough to put TSW years ahead. Then there's these points:
-SW:ToR's environment detail and "lifelikeness" is probably the worst of any MMO I can remember, while both Age of Conan and TSW are well in the top five if not alone on the throne.
-Funcom's games reward exploration, BioWare actively hinder it.
-BioWare has a serious copy/paste issue in mission design, Funcom doesn't.
-BioWare's writers more often shoot for epic drama, stretch-of-the-imagination twists and clichés, where Funcom actively avoids them, favoring the understated and quirky instead. (To my personal taste Funcom wins again)
-Graphics. Sure, we don't all care about graphics, but there's no denying Funcom wins here too.
When throwing the "old" BioWare into the mix it's a different story, as you have to compare a mountain of AAA Bioware game classics to just one Funcom classic. (TLJ) But since this is an MMORPG site...


text:
|Project Title
|Principal Investigator
|Toxicant-induced autism and mitochondrial modulation of nuclear gene expression
|Wlodarczyk, Bogdan
|Texas A&M University
|Epigenetics, hormones and sex differences in autism incidence
|Rissman, Emile
|University of Virginia
|Assisted reproductive treatments and risk of autism
|Reichenberg, Avi
|Institute of Psychiatry, King's College London
|Investigating gene-environment interaction in autism: Air pollution X Genetics
|McConnell, Rob
|University of Southern California
|Molecular and environmental influences on autism pathophysiology
|Kornblum, Harley
|University of California, Los Angeles
|The CHARGE Study: Childhood Autism Risks from Genetics and the Environment (supplement)
|Hertz-Picciotto, Irva
|University of California, Davis
|The CHARGE Study: Childhood Autism Risks from Genetics and the Environment (supplement)
|Hertz-Picciotto, Irva
|University of California, Davis
|Vitamin D status and autism spectrum disorder: Is there an association?
|Hammock, Bruce
|University of California, Davis
|Effect of oxytocin receptor inhibitor (atosiban) during the perinatal period and prevalence of autism spectrum disorders
|Ebstein, Richard
|Hebrew University
|Immunopathogenesis in autism: Regulatory T cells and autoimmunity in neurodevelopment
|DeWitt, Jamie
|East Carolina University
|Vaccine safety datalink thimerosol and autism study
|DeStefano, Frank
|Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)
|Autism in a fish eating population
|Davidson, Philip
|University of Rochester
|Prenatal exposure to polyfluoroalkyl compounds in the EMA study
|Croen, Lisa
|Kaiser Foundation Research Institute
|Genetic and epigenetic interactions in a mouse model for autism
|Carpenter, Ellen
|David Geffen School of Medicine at University of California, Los Angeles
|IACC Strategic Plan Objective
|Initiate studies on at least 10 environmental factors identified in the recommendations from the 2007 IOM report "Autism and the Environment: Challenges and Opportunities for Research" as potential causes of ASD by 2012.
IACC Recommended Budget: $56,000,000 over 2 years (revised in 2010)
19 projects
14 projects
5 projects
3 projects
1 project
|3.S.F. Funding: The recommended budget was partially met.
Progress: There has been a significant decrease in the number of studies related to this objective.
Remaining Gaps, Needs, and Opportunities: Further work in this area is needed, and work should focus on identifying the directionality of associations between environmental factors and ASD (causal, reactive, or independent) in order to be applied to prevention and the development of therapeutics. Sophisticated methods that are being applied in other fields need to be brought into autism research.


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GENEVA (AP) — A growing body of evidence collected by U.N. investigators points to the involvement of senior Syrian officials, including President Bashar Assad, in crimes against humanity and war crimes, the U.N.'s top human rights official said Monday.
Navi Pillay, who heads the U.N. Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights, said the scale and viciousness of the abuses being perpetrated by both sides almost defies belief, and is being well documented by an expert U.N. panel of investigators.
"They've produced massive evidence," she told a news conference. "They point to the fact that the evidence indicates responsibility at the highest level of government, including the head of state."
But Pillay said the lists of suspected criminals are handed to her on a confidential basis and will remain sealed until requested by international or national authorities for a "credible investigation," and then possibly used for prosecution.
Pillay said she worries about striking the right balance in determining how long to keep the information secret. The lists "rightly belongs to the people who suffered violations," she said, but they also must be kept sealed "to preserve the presumption of innocence" until proper judicial probes can be done that could lead to trial.
Pillay said Syria and North Korea — the two countries being probed by a U.N. investigative panel — represent two of the world's worst human rights violations, but she also cited concerns with Central African Republic, Bangladesh and other regions.
Other places that require the world's attention, she said, are the large-scale expulsions of migrants from Saudi Arabia, the high number of migrant laborer deaths building World Cup stadiums in Qatar, and continuing political exploitation of xenophobia and racism in Europe and other developed regions.
Copyright 2013 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


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Kelly & Katie Iris Flat Sandal
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May 31, 2013
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Shoe Broke
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looks cheap
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By ANDREA COXSalt Lake City
Perhaps I am a little late in response to a letter to the editor I read a couple of weeks ago. This particular letter accused the democrats within our country as being the enemy and compared them to the terrorists we are currently trying to subdue in the Middle-East. The letter claimed that democrats hate America and love our enemies. This claim and these comparisons are not only far-fetched, but untrue.
There are many things happening within the government right now, both from a democratic aspect and a republican aspect, that many Americans don't support. There are certain policies not only concerning the war in Iraq but "No Child Left Behind" and other various acts President Bush has presented to Congress that cause many Americans to question the values of the Republican party, and clearly many Republican citizens may question the values of the Democratic Party.
Regardless of the differences in these two parties and the debates that take place amongst Americans everyday who belong to these two parties, it is this two party system that makes America great. It is the ability to express opinions, the ability to change and make laws, that makes America a land of choice-a land of freedom. It's the right to burn a flag, to attend a worship services, and to rally against abortion or for animal rights that make up what the America dream is. It is true, there is disagreement.
It is true that we may not agree with a specific aspect or opinion of a certain party, but the very same ideals that allow these two parties to coexist is the same ideals each American uses everyday to express their ideas. The democrats are not evil, the republicans are not evil, they are groups that represent ideals and essentially set an example of what an American system, a democratic system, looks like.


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eye lift in a tube
Verified Purchase
eye lift in a tube
great refreshing , only use a small dab! I only use in the morning for I need more moisture in the evening...
eye lift in a tube
great refreshing , only use a small dab! I only use in the morning for I need more moisture in the evening...
great absorption
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just a few drops. it absorbs quickly. kinda nice smell and color.
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Seem some results already!
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un serum hyper frais que j'adore utilisé (il dure longtemps vu la contenance du flacon!). il hydrate bien le contour de l'oeil. en revanche j'ai été qq peu surprise que al composition sur la boite et sur le tube en lui même ne soit pas la même... après contact auprès de iherb puis de desert essence, il semblerait que les compositions du produit aient changé et que iherb écoule encore des anciens packaging mais la formulation est bhien la nouvelle! celle qui prime est celle sur le tube! (ouf!)
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this is very refreshing. The only problem I have is that it takes some time to dry.
Great Product
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I like this light gel as it sinks in and is completely none greasy. I'm not sure if it has made my fines lines any better yet but only time will tell
is not that good
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it burns!not only me but my boyfriend had the same problem,is to strong that burns!
Desert Essence Eye Serum
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The eye serum soaks right in and is not greasy at all.Love it!
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Celebrate the marvels of man's engineering and architectural feats with our wide selection of architecture jigsaw puzzles for sale. You'll find everything from tiny, quaint cottage and coastal lighthouse puzzles to the iconic Eiffel Tower and ancient Colosseum puzzles. We offer jigsaw puzzles of sweeping bridges, tall skyscrapers, precious churches and historical castles. These images spanning thousands of years of man-made architectural achievements may inspire you to tackle the most intricate puzzle you can find! Try an architectural 3d jigsaw puzzle or shape puzzle for a fun challenge!
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Description: DMC Color Variations is a 6 strand multi-colored embroidery floss that gives life to your cross stitched designs. Each skein has a blend of soft multi-colors that flow seamlessly into one another every 5 to 7 stitches. 100% colorfast, fade resistant. 100% long staple Egyptian cotton. 8.7 yard. #4129 Peanut Brittle - Shades of Tan and Gold.
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New Balance 870 Performance Running Shoe - Mens
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Item # 247400
Long distance runners, feel the ground beneath your feet in the New Balance® 870 running shoe. Perfect for the neutral to moderate over-pronater who goes the distance and needs a comfortable, stable running shoe to accompany them and aid in keeping your feet from fatigue.
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- Imported
- View More New Balance
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By: TheAnachronist
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
July 01, 2013
New Balance 870 Performance Running Shoe
"I like the shoes themselves just fine, but I was disappointed in the price. Everywhere I looked online, I could have matched the deal I got only by using my coupons here on DSW. I was also disappointed to find that these shoes were not made in the USA, as I thought all New Balance shoes were. That last one is my fault for not checking, but be aware."
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Browse other items in the Dazzle collection from Wayside Furniture in the Akron, Cleveland, Canton, Medina, Youngstown, Ohio area.
These plush hand tufted rugs, of the Dazzle Collection, will add vibrancy, color and make a dramatic statement about your decor. Hand tufted with 100% New Zealand wool, each rug is produced by talented artisans using the finest wool that will liven up any decor.
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This item has been tagged as: Rugs, Area Rugs, Home Decorations, Accessories, Home Design Accessories, Throw Rugs, Bathroom Rugs, Large Rugs, Small Rugs, Floor Rugs, Unique Area Rugs, Rug, Indoor Rugs, Bed Rug, Living Room Rug, Family Room Rug, Kitchen Rugs, Hallway Rug, Accent Rug, Nursery Rug, Room Rugs, Carpet, Decorative Rugs, Floor Mat, Floor Covering, Coverlet, Mat, Matting, Runner, Carpet Runners, Tapestry, Tapestries, Table Rug
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Daniel is a good guy, collected and dropped car off when convenient for me. No fuss, easy and the car is sorted. Couple of new tyres needed so price higher than estimated. Very happy and would use again.
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An Open Letter to Governor Herbert
Governor Herbert,
I recently read your "first shots" in the battle over gun control and Utah's gun legislation. To say I was disappointed in its compromising tone is an understatement. There cannot be any compromise on the Constitution, something is either Constitutional or it isn't. If it isn't then it is not lawful and should be nullified by both the people and the states. These are your five key points void of your expansions on each point, the comments are mine.
1. "Respect the Second Amendment" - Respect for not just the Second Amendment but all of the Constitution is the obligation of all Americans. All current firearm control statutes diminish our fundamental right to bear arms and disrespect the Second since they have been instituted outside of the Constitution. The Second Amendment guarantees us the right to keep and bear arms and places no restrictions or conditions on that right and specifically and clearly states that the right "shall not be infringed". All current and proposed firearms control statutes infringe on this right. The Constitution allows for only one way to change anything in it and that is through Article V, the amendment process. If, with the passage of time, limitations or conditions need to be placed on this most basic right they cannot be legitimately introduced through legislation, from the bench, nor through "executive order" since the authorities for modification of the Constitution are not enumerated to the legislative, judicial, or executive branches by Articles I, II, or III which enumerate the powers of these branches.
2. "Find rational solutions" - Finding rational solutions is an important consideration Mr. Governor, but it is the Federal Administration and its left-wing, liberal anti-gun attack squads that are acting without careful consideration and in a reactionary manner marked by a hatred and contempt for the Constitution in proposing extreme measures designed to not only politicize and polarize the debate but also to inflame those who support the Second Amendment. Additionally, we do not need to find solutions that protect Second Amendment rights, they are built into the Constitution in Article V which provides the only lawful means to change or add any amendment.
3. "Enforce existing laws" - As you know, Mr. Governor, laws do not stop any anti-social behaviors, they only provide penalties for violating acceptable social standards which when violated are deemed criminal. It is an indisputable fact that it is only the law abiding that obey laws, those with malevolent criminal intentions do not. The view that new, more restrictive gun laws will somehow cause criminals to be deflected from committing criminal acts is not just naïve but verges on criminal malfeasance when that view is held by elected officials.
If stringent gun laws actually reduced violence then Chicago and New York City with among the, if not the most, stringent gun laws would be the safest cities in America and they are not.
As you've said, preventing firearms access for violent criminals and the violent, or potentially violent, mentally ill is necessary to protect society. I would pose that there must be some rational relationship between public safety and such restrictions. There is absolutely no rational relationship between someone who is convicted of a non-violent felony, for example tax evasion, and the probability that such a felon will commit a violent act in the future nor is there any rational relationship between someone who suffers from a benign mental disorder such as obsessive compulsive disorder, for example, and the probability that the sufferer, due to this relatively benign mental condition, will commit a violent act with a firearm in the future. When establishing restrictions specificity must be used to protect the rights of individuals rather than painting members of a class with a broad brush for the purpose of political expediency.
4. "Protect the vulnerable" - As you've stated, protection of the vulnerable is an imperative but to quote Cesare Beccaria "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms, disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed one." The events that have spurred these most recent attacks on the Second Amendment played out in "gun free" zones, areas where the attackers could be relatively assured that their targets would be unarmed and unable to defend themselves. These events are proofs of Beccaria's admonition. Increased gun control will serve to make the vulnerable more vulnerable not less.
5. "Address a growing culture of violence" - As much as the liberal-left, anti-gun/anti-Second Amendment movement would like to convince Americans differently, the truth is that violence in American Society has actually declined, not increased over the past quarter century. Between 1991 and 2011, the latest years I could find data for, the violent crime rate decreased 51 percent to a 41-year low (including a 51 percent decrease in the murder rate, to a 48-year low). The original "Assault Rifle" Ban was signed into law in 1994 and expired in 2004, in other words the decline in violence began three years before the ban was enacted and has continue for the seven years (now nine years) after the ban expired.
Mr. Governor, there is a growing divide in this nation based not on race, religion, or even class but between those that support the Constitution and those that would have us abandon it with the Second Amendment being the current skirmish. In Utah the Utah Sheriffs Association as well as a majority of law enforcement, the Utah Legislature as well as our Federal Representatives and, I believe, the majority of Utahns are standing on the side of the Constitution. I ask you most respectfully to stand with the Constitution and the people you serve and sign HB114, the Protection of The Second Amendment Act, and any other legislation supporting the Constitution when they appear on your desk even if they inflame those that favor abandonment of the Constitution.
Lou Sansevero


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The UDM community acknowledged the many donors who supported the Riverfront Campus Campaign at a rededication ceremony in November.
Many ribbons were cut by benefactors of classrooms, offices, and projects throughout Dowling Hall. University President Antoine M. Garibaldi, Ph.D. and Dean Lloyd A. Semple expressed their gratitude to the Campaign supporters and to the Campaign chairman, Eugene A. Gargaro, Jr. ('67), the chairman of the UDM Board of Trustees, John D. Lewis, and to the former Dean of the School of Law, Mark C. Gordon, among many others. The ceremony included a blessing of Dowling Hall by Reverend Simon Hendry, S.J., in which a representative of each key constituency participated.


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By GARY ARRINGTONSports Reporter
The Lady Spartans of Emery High School hosted the Carbon Dinos last Thursday night and for a half, this young squad had their way with the visiting Dinos. The Spartans led 25-17 at halftime and they had held Morgan Warburton, Carbon's talented senior shooter, scoreless. Unfortunately, the Spartans had to play the second half of the basketball game and the Dinos were motivated. They held the Spartans to only 10 second half points while they were kicking in 35 points of their own and won this game going away, 52-35.
Emery and Carbon were tied at the end of the first quarter 8-8 with Callie Seeley's four points leading the way. Jodie Lundell's two 3-pointers helped the Spartans outscore Carbon 17-9 in the second quarter. Natalee Hanson led the Spartans with 11 points while Seeley and Lundell finished the game with six points each.
Coach Merrell had this to say, "I'm pleased with how our players are developing as basketball players. Since the beginning of this season, our team and our players have improved. We knew (going into the season) the kind of year that we would probably have." Not only were the Spartans very young and inexperienced, they were also playing in the toughest region in the State this season. Region 8 has four very good teams, with two of them ranked in the top five.
The Lady Spartans are on the road this week as they travel to Mt Pleasant on Tuesday and to Delta on Friday. Game time each night should be 5:15, as they play just before the men.


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By Parrish Alford/NEMS Daily Journal
NASHVILLE – Ole Miss placed three players on the SEC's all-tournament team, including Marshall Henderson as the tournament MVP.
Senior forwards Murphy Holloway and Reggie Buckner joined Henderson on the team, along with Florida forward Erik Murphy and Gators guard Kenny Boynton.
Henderson went into the tournament as the SEC's scoring leader at 19.7 points a game.
He averaged 23.6 points in three tournament games including 21 points against Florida when he was 3-for-8 from 3-point range and 6-for-6 from the free throw line.
Holloway averaged a double-double in three tournament games and closed with 23 points and 10 rebounds against the Gators.
Buckner averaged 11 points in the tournament and had six blocked shots, half of them against Florida.
Missing Summers
The Rebels played without starting point guard Jarvis Summers for the second-straight game.
Summers sustained a concussion late in the Rebels' quarterfinal win over Missouri. He spent the next two games on the bench in sweats.
"Can you imagine losing your starting quarterback at this stage of the season and going to a guy who had not gotten many snaps?" Ole Miss coach Andy Kennedy asked. "That's a testament to these guys continue to stay in the moment, continuing to persevere."
Summers remains listed day to day and will be reevaluated for the Rebels' NCAA tournament game Friday against Wisconsin in Kansas City.
Player of the Game
Holloway was 11-for-14 from the floor and his critical free throw with 8.3 seconds left limited Florida's comeback options.
"We're fighters. We didn't panic in the second half. We performed and played ball." – Sophomore guard LaDarius White
Parrish Alford


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Impact sensor monitors equipment performance
PHD Inc. has introduced the PHD series KG impact sensor for monitoring equipment performance. It attaches to any piece of equipment that has motion.
Featuring single-axis/bidirectional sensitivity, the sensor attaches to the moving part of a machine or device and monitors impact. A PLC can interpret the signal to warn of erratic operation or shut down a system to prevent catastrophic failure.
Using the KG Programmer, the sensor can measure an impact and relay that value to the user. A single programmer can service an unlimited number of impact sensors throughout an entire plant.


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War Eagle Extreme Trokar Double Willow Spinnerbaits
Featuring Lazer Trokar hooks - the sharpest hooks in the world - along with custom-painted heads, the War Eagle Trokar Double Willow Spinnerbaits are made by avid bass anglers for avid bass anglers. Designed and built in America, they deliver perfectly balanced performance right out of the package, and also come equipped with premium Sampo swivels, piano wire for better vibration, and custom tied skirts. One of War Eagle's most productive spinnerbaits just got better - the War Eagle Trokar Colorado/Willow Spinnerbaits are here and ready to deliver.
13 Colors
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Customer Reviews
Comments: I decided to try a couple of different War Eagle spinnerbaits after losing several of my others. All I can say is wow! The Trokar hook is, well, a Trokar, second to none. As for the color...I had a 19"+ rainbow trout hit the spot remover color like a freight train while fishing for bass. Even trout like 'em!
From: Sean: Centennial, CO 10/27/14
Comments: great concept but the trokar hook looses it's sharpness too quick and easy
From: Boo Bo
Comments: Not a fan of the closed eye tie because the line seems to get stuck every now and then causing it to fray. Also, cant explain it but with the Trokar hook i've lost at least 75 percent of the fish i hook with it.
From: Justin: Indiana
Comments: War Eagles are the ONLY spinnerbaits in my boat; huge fan. Love the Trokar hook, but the skirts (at least on the colors I bought) are a big step below what I expect from War Eagle. NOT hand tied - you are paying for the hook here. If War Eagle goes away from hand ties they are losing at least 1 customer...
From: Dan: MA


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This Smart case in pink covers your iPad both front and back yet still retains the slim, light design of the iPad. It folds easily into a stand for reading, typing and watching video. The slim yet sturdy iPad Smart case protects your iscreen. Open the Smart case and the iPad magically wakes up.; close it and the iPad automatically goes to sleep. This is a must-have accessory for keeping your iPad in top condition.
Catalogue Number: 491-9857
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- Polyurethane design, FaceTime and movie stand.
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Cloud-chaser: Derogatory term or innocent classification?
Discussion in 'Vaporization Discussion' started by t-dub, Jan 22, 2013.
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Top Definition
adj. Wretched
n. Wretched thing
n. Wretched thing
Chelly is a rat chew.
Chelly has rat chew ankles.
Chelly has rat chew ankles.
by truth teller January 01, 2004
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