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Written by David Richards
06/07/2012 | 02:47 |
Category: SECURITY & INTERCOMS
The widespread use of security technology and camera's built into mobile phones have become a huge embarrassment for NSW Police after several of their officers have been caught out "blatantly lying" and presenting false evidence in Court.
A NSW barrister who specialises in criminal matters told SmartHouse that the practise of "verballing" by NSW police officers has been going on for years. "The big difference now is that technology is catching officers out lying about arrests and blatantly presenting false evidence in Court" the barrister said.
"In the past it was the word of the police officer Vs the offender. Now technology is revealing the lengths police officers will go to in trying to get a conviction, even if it involves blatant lying. They like to be judge and jury even before a matter has come to court" he added.
Earlier this week Ballina Local Court Magistrate David Heilpern was shown CCVT footage that showed several NSW police officers assaulted an Aboriginal man in a northern NSW police station, then falsely claimed he had attacked them.
Senior Constable Ryan Eckersley was shown on the CCTV kicking the man in the head region while he was on the ground and another officer kneeing him in the side.
The officers then dragged Barker along the ground into a cell where he was left, handcuffed, for more than an hour.
Barker had significant facial and other injuries when he left the station.
"It was crystal clear that the defendant at no time punched Senior Constable Hill in the nose as described," Heilpern said.
In another case of false evidence being exposed by technology, Downing Centre Local Court heard last month how Manly Police Office Ryan Godfrey drew his taser and sent 50,000 volts into the back of a man who, he claimed, had been "loud and aggressive'' towards him and transit officers on a bus.
The man, who attracted the attention of police after he commented that four transit officers demanding he produce his bus pass was a waste of taxpayer money, got into trouble when a transit officer accused him of being a ''smart-arse''.
Three police officers boarded the bus and ordered Lindsay off. When he got off the bus and went to walk away from police - shocked at how a joke could go so wrong (his third mistake) - things got much worse and potentially fatal.
The Sydney Morning Herald covered the case and reported the officer in charge, Constable Ryan Godfrey, drew his Taser and sent 50,000 volts into Lindsay's lower back. An ambulance was called and police charged Lindsay with offensive language, resisting arrest and assaulting police.
Under cross examination at the Downing Centre Local Court on March 12, Constable Godfrey told the court that when Lindsay was asked to leave the bus, "he's replied with words similar to, 'This is f---ed, it takes f---ing four of you c---s to do this, this is f---ed.'"
Constable Godfrey then described a struggle on the footpath outside the bus when trying to handcuff Lindsay. ''That was proving rather difficult. As I said, he's of large stature. He was overpowering us.''
The problem for Godfrey and the NSW Police Force was that Godfrey's evidence was proven to be false because mobile phone footage clearly showed that Mr Lindsay's had not swore at police and had in fact been polite uttering the expressions ''please'' and ''excuse me''.
Backing up Godfrey's version of events was Constable Parkinson and Constable Christopher Gould, along with the four transit officers.
The false evidence came to light when the court was shown a passenger's mobile phone footage of what happened on the bus.
After the footage was shown to the court, the police prosecutor, Sergeant Grant Bucknell, immediately withdrew all the charges.
The magistrate, Lee Gilmour, said that Constable Godfrey lied under oath. She awarded $12,000 in costs to Mr Lindsay.
In another case reported by the Sydney Morning Herald, questions are being raised about a missing 25 minutes and 46 seconds of video captured at Rose Bay Police Station.
Earlier this year 29-year-old John Tanner went to the Police Station to report that three security guards him bundled him out of a club and attacked him at 11pm in the Sydney CBD.
His 41-year-old partner David Rook collected him and they drove to Rose Bay police station, 500 metres from their home, to report the alleged assault.
"At first police started to write down our details but then they started giving each other knowing glances and put their pads away," said Mr Rook, who believes that, because he has a stammer and is gay, he was not taken seriously.
When they left the police station and after showing police their injuries, he drove around the corner to their home.
As they drove up their drive way "police lights flashed behind us," they said.
Mr Rook was breath-tested and blew .12 more than twice the limit - and was arrested and charged at Waverley police station with mid-range PCA.
He told the SMH "I was shocked, I couldn't believe it. I had only driven to rescue my partner and police had followed us from the station to arrest me," he said.
Mr Tanner went back to Rose Bay police station to protest.
"By now it's 3am and police refused to take his statement, and they threw him out of the station," said Mr Rook.
It is what happened at the station that lies at the centre of the dispute and 25 minutes and 46 seconds of CCTV footage which appear to be missing.
The couple applied under freedom-of-information laws for the CCTV footage from Rose Bay police station.
On September 14, police declined their Government Information Public Access (GIPA) request, stating there was an "overriding public interest against disclosure".
The couple appealed and, while waiting for the GIPA result, Mr Rook was allowed to view the video at Rose Bay police station.
He said it clearly showed his partner being assaulted by police, who repeatedly threw him out of the station then allegedly kicked and punched him when he was trying to re-enter.
But on October 18, when police sent them the CCTV video, the alleged assault had been cut.
The NSW Office of the Information Commission, that oversees GIPA applications, agreed and reported on February 17: "Sections of footage appear to be missing from the copy of the CCTV footage.
A City Central commander Superintendent Mark Walton told the SMH a "thorough and independent investigation" found no evidence of tampering or inappropriate police behaviour.
The NSW Ombudsman is now reviewing that investigation, he said.
NSW Greens MP and justice spokesman David Shoebridge described police actions as "a whitewash."
Due to the circumstances surrounding Mr Rook's arrest the drink-driving charge was thrown out of Downing Centre Local Court.
He was however found guilty of failing to stop for police but the magistrate, applying a section 10 ruling, recorded no fine nor charge.
Mr Rook and Mr Tanner have said they will complain to the NSW Ombudsman, the Police Integrity Commission and also the Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission.
Both the Ballina case and the Constable Godfrey case have been referred to the Professional Standards Command for investigation and will be oversighted by the NSW Ombudsman,'' police said.
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Psalm 127
Children are a heritage from the Lord.
A Song of degrees for Solomon.
1 Except the Lord build the house, they
2 It is vain for you to rise up early, to sit up late, to eat the bread of sorrows: for so he giveth his beloved
3 Lo,
4 As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man; so are children of the youth.

subset: commoncrawl


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An authentic filling for tacos, pork tastefully combines with seasoning mix, green chiles and salsa.
For spicier tacos, chop 1 or 2 jalapeño chiles and add to the pork with the taco seasoning and green chiles.
Serve with Spanish rice and hot cheese-topped refried beans.
© 2015 ®/TM General Mills All Rights Reserved


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Basstrix Paddle Tail Swimbait
Tackle Warehouse Exclusive Color - Light Hitch
|Actual Length
|Recommended Hook Size
The Basstrix Paddle Tail Tube Swimbait is the original paddle tail swimbait. Several lure manufactures have tried but failed to perfectly replicate the Basstrix Paddle Tail Tube. The realistic finish, life like holographic eyes and natural swimming undulation is the reason why the Basstrix Paddle Tail Tube is the most sought after soft plastic swimbait!
Try Blade-Runner Swim Bait Insert Weighted Hook, Gamakatsu Weighted Superline Spring Lock Hook, Owner Weighted Beast Twistlock or use the Lunker City Belly Weight on your favorite EWG Hook. Any of these will work great with the Basstrix Baits.
33 Colors
More From Basstrix Swimbaits
Customer Reviews
Comments: Basstrix are great swimbaits, work really well, and hold up as well as most any other swimbait. They are highly effective. They do emit some sort of weird oily grease though, so keep 'em bagged up. Don't take them out of the packs and load a plano tray, or you will have a tray oozing goo all over your tackle box or bag. Still, wipe 'em down, add some good scent, put 'em on a half ounce jighead, and go to work. Will get bites when often nothing else does. And set the hook hard!
From: Big J: H-town 2/17/17
Comments: The only thing bad about them is the price! I use the size 6" which is actually 5", and it slays bass. My go to colors are yellow perch and ayu. I use a 5/0 weighted screw lock swimbait hook and add on my own trailer treble hook. If you are un a budget I highly suggest the keitech swing impact fat in the 4.3"
From: Emmett: Edina, Minnesota 12/19/16
From: Adam: Indiana 12/31/16
Comments: These are still the best hollow body swimbaits out there. I've been throwing Basstrix since they were still a secret and TW didn't carry them. A lot of questions about rigging so here's what I do. I only throw the 6" & 7" sizes. I use a 7/0 Trokar weighted swimbait hook for the 6" and a 9/0 for the 7". Remember that the 6" is actually only about 5.25" long. As with any hand poured swimbait you WILL occasionally get one with a bent tail or crooked body. To fix this simply heat up some water to a light boil and then dip the back half of the bait into the water for about 30 seconds. When you take it out put it in the fridge situated the way you want it for about 5 minutes. Works every time.
From: Hydrilla Gorilla: Lake Seminole, GA 3/5/16
Comments: A little tip with these, if the tail isn't paddling like you would like use a lighter to soften the plastic about & inch and a half from the tail or where ever the narrowest section falls (be careful not to scorch the lure and leave a black spot on it). Doing this will make it thump much more & has yielded great results for me.
From: Will: VA 2/10/16
Comments: I agree with the assessment that these aren't for the recreational fisherman. I am an avid fisherman, but not a tournament fisherman. They don't swim well at slow speeds. I bought these for some "trophy hunting" at a local lake. They are beautiful lures & they may yet work, but the action isn't what you get from Keitechs. Although Keitechs aren't as realistic, my confidence is much higher with those.
From: Rodney: Gainesville, GA 1/27/26
Comments: Not for the recreational fisherman. These cost a lot, not all swim right, etc. we know that and it's just part of the game. When money is on the line and the swimbait bite is on, these will get you paid.
From: Jay6: USA 12/26/15
Comments: I got the 6 inch Threadfin Shad for fall fishing Northern Ontario Smallmouth. The picture makes the bait look halographic, with very silver scales. What I received is an almost dull purple and not at all what I was looking for. I have not tried the bait yet, but am so far disappointed in the product for being advertised incorrectly.
From: Chris: Ontario, Canada 10/9/14
Comments: I bought the 3.5 inch bait, nice looking bait but it needs to be cranked very fast or trolled fast to perform. Maybe the longer bait would do better... but at their price I won't ever find out!
From: Mike: Dowling, MI 7/6/14
Comments: IF you are having problems with the action of these baits you can always drop them in boiling water for a little bit to soften them up. That usually makes the action better on most swimbaits. If the eyes fall off you can always just glue them back on. If that boiling them won't help, and they are rigged correctly, then you may have gotten a bad batch. If you continue to have problems with these the Keitech Fat swimbaits always swim true (without boiling) and have a really good action to them. They don't look quite as good as these because they don't have the eyes or the neat designs but I don't think that would matter much unless you are fishing ultra-clear water.
From: BGood419: Ohio
Comments: Disappointed in the latest 5 inch batch I purchased. The baits seemed larger than normal and did not have the normal action. The lure rolled through the water instead of the swim action needed to get bites.
From: Mike: Purcellville, Virginia, USA
Comments: Having trouble with 6" paddle tails. Most of them the tail section is too thick and has very little action. When I first bought these that was not the case. I have been using the j-will swimbait head and the blade runner weighted insert hook. They are rigged straight and centered properly. Customer service from basstrix is hard to come by. Dont waste anymore of your money. I have started using other brands. Now I am stuck with several baits that dont work.
From: James: TN
Comments: Bama rigs with these ,lol. why not just troll around with a giant net. I use these occasionally ' one at a time ' on a weighted hook. Fun to fish these. They have nice action. I guess if desperate we could cast about 20 or 30 on wires and run some electroshock to boot ROFL.
From: Pat: San Jose, CA
Comments: Great swimbaits,awesome kick on thein the tail,i use them for pike in England and they love the pearl colour.These baits are durable considdering the tooth prey i catch on them
From: Jason: London, UK
Comments: very disapointed.... no action on my bama rig unless burned.. netbait all the way
Comments: still the best hollow bodied swimbait on the market!! all i throw on my bama rigs
From: Nicholas: San Jose, CA
Comments: The 4 inch in blue back herring on the back of a dirty jigs finesse swim jig in light hitch color is THE BEST swim jig combination u can buy and you will catch tons of bass includeing the biggins
From: Trevor
Comments: Great swim bait! Got alot of large mouth on these baits. Colors are very nice, and the action too! Throw them on a scrounger jig head and reel slow on the bottom. Very soft though, after a couple of fish the swimbaits done. Got myself some mend-it to fix the rips. Other than that it's the best swimbait out.
From: Glasspar: Castro Valley, CA
Comments: The big smallmouth were slamming the the six inch basstrix in yellow perch on a recent trip to Lake Vermilion. Needed a stinger treble though.
From: Big J: Houston, TX
Comments:Better looking and softer than other paddle tail swimbaits, you get a harder thumping kick with these than others. Basstrix is the original tube swimbait, and still better than any of the imitations. Try skinning the clear plastic coating off the tail to make it kick even more wildly. Also try rigging sideways to give the impression of a wounding fish slapping on its side. I would love to see Basstrix add a line of wounding baitfish colors, with bleeding gills. Guarantee it would be a killer.
From:Big J: Houston, TX


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Skip to comments.Ithaca fires back with its support for gun laws
Posted on 03/09/2013 11:46:50 AM PST by Behind Liberal Lines
ITHACA -- Many areas in New York State are calling for a repeal of new gun control laws. With over thirty counties asking for this to be overturned, the city of Ithaca is standing alongside Governor Cuomo
The Ithaca Common Council knows that this is a step in the right direction as they passed a resolution unanimously Wednesday night. Being a liberal leaning city, some people are not surprised where their city stands with the new laws.
Judy Scarpella has been a taxpayer with Ithaca for many years and she is used to the way that her city does business. "You have to look at the history of Ithaca and I think we're more progressive in that sense. We don't always vote like everybody else," says Scarpella.
Steve Smith is on the Common Council and was one of the crafters for this resolution. "Right now we have a piece of legislation that does a good job of taking guns out of the hands of people who really have no business of having guns," says Smith.
Ithaca's Mayor Svante Myrick is using this as a way to make his voice and opinion heard. "Here in Ithaca we really appreciate a lot of the provisions in the SAFE act, like the Webster provisions where it increases penalties for anyone who fires on first responders," says Myrick. "We've got no special interest except keeping the people in our city safe and keeping our police officers safe."
Interesting bit of bias on the part of the reporter there. "Knows" implies that opinion of the city council is fact, not opinion.
Being a liberal leaning city...
No, most cities are "liberal leaning." Ithaca is much worse than that. Ithaca is the City of Evil.
May have to destroy my grand dads old double Ithica 20 gauge which I hunted with over 50 years ago.
Soundslike Ithaca would make a good target for a burglar.
That would be a grave disservice to an earlier generation of hard working craftsman that built them back them.
They had nothing to do with the morons running the place now.
That gun is a piece of true blue American history. Care for it well my FRiend.
Ithaca gun company moved out of Ithaca, N.Y., didn't they?
It's already the robbery capital of the Finger Lakes.
Yes. Over a quarter of a century ago.
My, how time flies. I was stationed at NROTC, Cornell University 1976-1980. I purchased a really great Buick Electra 225 from the Ithaca Gun Company. I remember Ithaca as a very snobby place but the concerts at Barton Hall were fabulous!!!!!
My daughter was accepted at Cornell as an undergrad but turned them down for Stanford. If she goes there for grad school I'll definitely buy her a t-shirt.
Would Ithaca be willing to practice what they preach and ensure that every home in their boundaries is a voluntarily gun-free home?
LMAO , they deserve it.
the biased reporter:
Alex Resila
Multimedia Producer
Alex joined the CNYCentral team as a multimedia journalist in December of 2012. After graduating from SUNY Oswego in May 2012 with a BA in Broadcasting, he worked as a teller for a few months.
Alex Resila's Resume Tape
No! Please don't! I'll give your grandfather's Ithaca a good home. I promise!
I regard the Model 37 Ithaca to be the 56 T-Bird of shotguns. The Remington 570 is of course the 57 Chevy, but hell, this thread's about....
Not much of an improvement — And I was born and raised there.
Not much of an improvement — And I was born and raised there.
But the colleges haven't -- Tompkins Cortland Community College, Ithaca College, and ... Cornell University (a Poison Ivy school). There's where your libtard problem is. From Wiki:
"These three colleges influence Ithaca's seasonal population. In 2010, the city's population was 30,014, and the metropolitan area had a population of 101,564."
A college song from the old days:
"Don't send my boy to Hahvahd," the dying mother said;
"Don't send my boy to Seer-Ah-Kyoose -- I'd rather see him dead! But send my boy to Princetahn, or bettah yet Kaw-nell! But as for Penn-syl-vane-eye-ay: I'd see him first in H___!" ... Ta H___ with the U. of P. -- P.U."
Should they have guns? Hmmmm. Not mixed with ale --
Ithaca is a Liberal college town. It's no wonder they are crazy. They would be more at home in Cambridge, Massachusetts, but there it is.
LIberals know the people that elect them cannot be trusted.
I thought this was about the Ithaca Shotgun Company supporting these laws! My mistake!
My Dad almost relocated us to Ithaca in the '60s so he could work at the gun factory - glad it didn't pan out even though it would have been his dream job due to his love of guns and shooting.
Just Joking!!!!!!!!!!
"Just Joking!!!!!!!!!!"
I know (grin)
Possibly of interest to an Ithaca double gun owner.
I saw a funny add on TV while attending the EIWA championships at Rutgers University. It claimed tha New York was open for business as it has lowered taxes. Too much!
Thanks for the ping.
24 square miles surrounded by reality.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.


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|Posted by Tom on January 01, 2004 at 17:02:57:
|In response to Re: Thanks Greg...a little more advice?
Towards the right or upstream to the initial - - The first item in the line is a toilet, then a separate shower, 2 vanity sink, a garden tub (why does everyone have one and no one uses it?)
The wye that is immediately following the leaky sanitary T comes from another double vanity.
I do not know how old some of the piping in this area is. 1987 house. I do know that the first owners of this house (I'm 3rd) had major issues in way of the garden tub...can tell because of bad ceiling patch directly underneath the tub area.
I have not yet started making my hole on the other side of the cabinets that you see in the first picture. Those cabinets are suspended from a hollow drywall box from the ceiling. The drain works along the back wall and crosses that hollow drywalled box at right angles. That is why I have to cut on the other side and have a slightly larger insert if that is the way I probably will have to.
To install a proper wye into that drain line, I am assuming that will involve coming straight down from the closet flange a short distance and then kicking off on a 45 and tieing in a little further downstream? That will be a rough trick perhaps with that existing wye...I might be misunderstanding you there.
I've updated with another pic looking right and have posted our exchange underneath it for easy reference and appreciate your help in ways I cannot explain.
: Tom,
: Good job getting some pix to your website; I can see where your one toilet drops into a sanitary T. I'm guessing some of this is newer than the original pvc, yes? I say that based on what looks like older pvc towards the back. Not real important, but it makes me wonder why the joint failed. I'm guessing whoever glued it didn't let it set and it pushed itself out before setting. Whenever I glue pvc joints, I now wait 30 real seconds (excessive, but...) before releasing because I've had joints start walking apart.
: The sanitary T related to your leaking joint is against code; it should have been a wye, although, that is not the reason for it failing, as your suspicion seems correct. If it were mine, I'd want that changed to a wye eventually.
: 1. Upstream from here is your other toilet?
: Without seeing your layout in person, cutting out your present T and installing a wye to the left of it would be ideal.
: Gotta run for now, but I'll check your post early tomorrow morning. I see a glimmer of hope, but dealing with plumbing always packs surprises. Talk to you soon...Greg
: : First attempt did not work, I posted them to a web page I just made at http://home.earthlink.net/~unlimitedoceans/id2.html
: : It's not fancy, but it conveys the problem I think.
: :
: : : Tom,
: : : : If I correctly envision what you describe, you need to seriously consider a licensed plumber in your area; that is your best, permanent solution. If you are unable to do that financially at this time, I would try a repair using something like plastaid (http://www.plast-aid.com/). I can't verify that it works, only that it's an option to try at least temporarily.
: : : : When I mentioned a picture, I meant uploading a picture to Terry's website, which can be done. Greg
: : : : : Greg, I have two bathrooms on second floor. 3" drain line starts at a toilet passes a shower tub and 2 sinks and into the other bathroom. Where the drain line picks up the 2nd bathroom closet flange is the leak. The leak is in the T where the closet flange drops into the drain line. It appears that not enough pipe was seated inside the T. The problem is there is a 45 into the drain line about 10" past the culprit for the sinks which is going to make for some fancy coupling on that side. I'd rather not tear out the 45 and it's run from the sinks because of the way the flooring and beams are...nightmare.
: : : : : I have to insert a few feet because of a beam and cabinets attached to the ceiling on the other side of the bad joint. My worry is how to make GOOD couplings on either side of the new insert without trying to force old piping to catch the overlap you need to seat a typical coupling. That is what attracted me to the flexible coupling idea.
: : : : : I hope that gives you a clearer picture...it's hard for me to put it into words and my art work is considerably worse.
: : : : : REALLY appreciate your patience and continued help.
: : : : : : Tom,
: : : : : : CPVC you can flex enough to gain some clearance, but 3" pipe, unlikely.
: : : : : : If this doesn't help or won't work, try posting a picture of your dilemma so we can get a better look. We'll be watching...
: : : : : : : Can you offer any other way to splice into an existing albeit old 3" line? Should I risk making existing piping bend for that moment that I need to make up that slack?
: : : : : : : Thanks so much for your help,
: : : : : : : Tom
: : : : : : : : Troubled Tom,
: : : : : : : : I've used the rubber couplings of which you speak, although my rule is only to use them where access is always available (although sometimes difficult) for servicing/inspection. Personally, I just don't trust them completely.
: : : : : : : : On the flip side of that, though, I'm currently witnessing large commercial buildings go up that use hords of these couplings (mission style - with the metal bands around the rubber inner). Some codes allow similar couplings to be buried. But, if you don't mind running the risk of redoing some drywall down the road, it could work well enough, they're just not as permanent or "comforting" as a glued joint, which is always preferred. Good Luck. Greg
: : : : : : : : : I posted a few days before Christmas about a leaking joint that wiped out some drywall in my kitchen before a party. You suggested (as I figured I needed to) that I replace. Here's my question:
: : : : : : : : : Thanks in advance!
: : : : : : : : : Tom Payne
|Replies to this post


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This stylish skort is ready for your next match. It features an elastic waistband, built-in short, front pleats, zig-zag stitching on skirt panels, and a heat transfer Swoosh on left hem.
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My interest in the Greek language and grammar stems from frustration with English as a tool for effective communication on one hand, and fascination with the power of NT Greek to express precise thoughts and ideas on the other hand. I am starting quite late, and under my circumstances I know I'll never become a scholar, but I want to understand as much of the language as I can. Joining this forum seemed to me to be a good move. I hope everyone will be patient with me as I learn the rules and the ropes and learn to fit in here.
I am intensely interested in theology, because to me a deeper understanding of Greek is not an end in itself - it is a means to understand more clearly what exactly we are being taught by the Scriptures. I want to know the Lord's mind, to the extent I can as a puny and imperfect human. But I will make every effort to confine my questions and posts here to the language, and keep my theology to myself, except where I need to posit some fundamental 'what-ifs' (elemental ideas) that would be at a very low level, directly linked to the Greek grammar itself in a particular verse.
I don't wear my feelings on my shirt cuff, as it were. You can be very direct and straightforward in correcting me if I err in any way. I want to learn. Without real learning and advancement, a person is biologically alive but dead by any real definition. I want to be alive!


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Santoni Leather Oxford Bootie
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Ralph Lauren Collection Ulah Velvet Logo Flat
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Skip to comments.More than 6 million self-described evangelicals voted for Obama.
Posted on 11/08/2012 3:41:20 PM PST by Anti-Hillary
Why & what else do the exit polls tell us about how Christians voted?
[CORRECTED VERSION: In the first version of this column, I incorrectly reported a figure of 25 million evangelicals voting for Obama in 2012. The actual number, as now noted below, is about 6.4 million. Please forgive my error.]
As the smoke clears from the wreckage of the Romney defeat on Tuesday, some intriguing yet disturbing facts are coming to light.
* Fewer people overall voted in 2012 (about 117 million) compared to 2008 (about 125 million).
* President Obama received some 6.6 million fewer votes in 2012 than he did in 2008 (60,217,329 in 2012 votes compared to 66,882,230 votes in 2008).
* One would think that such a dynamic would have helped Romney win clearly it did not.
* Incredibly, Governor Romney received nearly 1 million fewer votes in 2012 than Sen. John McCain received in 2008. (In 2008, McCain won 58,343,671 votes. In 2012, Romney won only 57,486,044 votes.)
Why? How was it possible for Romney to do worse than McCain? It will take some time to sift through all of the data. But here is some of what we know from the 2012 election day exit polls:
The President received a whopping 71% of the Hispanic vote (which was 10% of the total votes cast), compared to only 27% for Romney (McCain got 31% of the Hispanic vote in 2008). Obama also won 56% of the moderate vote, which was interesting given that Romney (who got 41%) was widely perceived by the GOP base as being a Massachusetts moderate. The President lost married women (getting only 46% of their vote to Romneys 53%). But won decisively among unmarried women (67% to Romneys 31%).
That said, what Im looking at most closely is the Christian vote, and here is where I see trouble: 42% of the Protestant Christian vote went for Obama in 2012. This was down from 45% in 2008. 57% of the Protestant Christian vote went for Romney in 2012. This was up from 54% that McCain won in 2008. When you zoom in a bit, you find that 21% of self-identified, white, born-again, evangelical Christians voted for President Obama in 2012. Youd think this decrease in evangelical votes for Obama would have helped win the race for Romney, but it didnt. 78% of evangelical Christians voted for Romney in 2012. Yes, this was up from the 74% that McCain received in 2008, but it wasnt nearly enough. To put it more precisely, about 5 million fewer evangelicals voted for Obama in 2012 than in 2008. Meanwhile, some 4.7 million more evangelicals voted for Romney than voted for McCain. Yet Romney still couldnt win. Meanwhile, 50% of the Catholic vote went for Obama in 2012. This was down from the 54% that Obama won in 2008. 48% of the Catholic vote went for Romney in 2012. This was up from the 45% that McCain won in 2008. Yet it still wasnt enough.
Now consider this additional data: In 2008, white, born-again, evangelical Christians represented 26% of the total vote for president, according to the exit polls. In 2012, white, born-again, evangelical Christians represented 26% of the total vote for president, according to the exit polls. In other words, we saw no change at all in the size of the evangelical vote, no net gain, certainly no surge, no record evangelical turnout, despite expectations of this. Of the 117 million people who voted on Tuesday, therefore, about 30 million (26%) were evangelicals. Of this, 21% or about 6.4 million evangelicals voted for Obama. By comparison, of the 125 million people who voted in 2008, 32.5 million (26%) were evangelicals. At the time, Obama won 24% of evangelicals, or about 7.8 million people. Whats more, in 2008, 27% of the total vote for president was Catholic, according to the exit polls. In 2012, only 25% of the total vote for president was Catholic. Remarkably, this means that Romney got a higher percentage of the Catholic vote than McCain, but millions of fewer Catholics actually voted in 2012, despite having Rep. Paul Ryan, a practicing Catholic, on the ticket.
What does all this mean? A few observations: 1.During the GOP primaries in 2012, it was reported that there was record turnout by evangelical voters they were fired up and mobilized then (though largely behind Sen. Rick Santorum.)
2.There were concerns by a number of Christian leaders going into the 2012 elections that Romneys Mormonism might suppress evangelical and conservative voter turnout. 3.The Romney campaign worked hard to not only to win the evangelical vote but to turn out more evangelicals to the polls but it did not work.
4.Despite Obamas pro-abortion, pro-gay marriage, anti-religious freedom record a record presumably abhorrent both to evangelicals and conservative Catholics Romney simply was not able to cut deeply enough into Obamas evangelical and Catholic vote.
5.If Romney had been able win over significantly more evangelicals and/or dramatically increased evangelical turnout in the right states he would have won the election handily.
6.It is stunning to think that more than 6 million self-described evangelical Christians would vote for a President who supports abortion on demand; supported the same-sex marriage ballot initiatives that successed in Maryland, Maine and Washington; and was on the cover of Newsweek as Americas first gay president. Did these self-professed believers surrender their Biblical convictions in the voting booth, or did they never really have deep Biblical convictions on the critical issues to begin with?
7.Whatever their reasons, these so-called evangelicals doomed Romney and a number of down-ballot candidates for the House and Senate.
8.This is what happens when the Church is weak and fails to disciple believers to turn Biblical faith into action.
9.Given the enormous number of evangelical Christians in the U.S., this bloc could still affect enormous positive change for their issues if they were to unify and vote for the pro-life, pro-marriage candidate as a bloc.
10.What will it take to educate, register and mobilize Christians to vote on the basis of Biblical principles, and what kind of candidates could best mobilize them? This is a critical question that Christian political leaders as well as pastors must serious consider. As we have seen, just a few million more evangelicals voting for pro-life, pro-marriage candidates could offset other demographics that are becoming more liberal.
11.That said, we need national candidates who take values issues as seriously as economic and fiscal issues, and have strong credentials on these values issues, and can talk about these issues in a winsome, compassionate, effective manner.
12.We need pastors registering voters in their churches and teaching the people in their congregations the importance of the civic duty of voting.
13.None of this should come, however, at the expense of pastors and other Christian leaders clearly, boldly and unequivocally teaching and preaching the Word, proclaiming the Gospel, and making disciples, and helping believers learn to live out their faith in a real and practical way in their communities, including being salt and light to preserve what is good in society. What we need most in America isnt a political revival but a sweeping series of spiritual revivals a Third Great Awakening. As men and womens hearts are transformed by the Gospel of Jesus Christ, they will, in time, vote for the values they are internalizing from the Bible. As I wrote about in Implosion, if we dont see a Third Great Awakening soon, Im not convinced we will be able to turn this dear nation around in time.
We are experiencing the Great Apostasy.
Polls are either wrong or we are facing Evangelists that no longer believe in God. Unfortunately, I think it is the latter.
Ping to read later
Must be that large right to life evangelicals. /sarc
There are rainbow flags on church marquees all over the valley I live in. There're a couple of lesbians one of whom calls herself a methodist minister, right down to the clerics collar, living right around the corner from me. I doubt they voted for Romney.
Actually I think we're experiencing a great deal of divisive democrat and "moderate" manipulation.
We have some of these idiots right here on FR. THANKS MORONS!
I ain't buying it. No Freakin' way am I believing Romney could have been beaten in a fair election. Call me delusional, say it's all sour grapes and I'll get my head around it in the next few days. Not happenin'. This race was stolen and I just can't prove it. Probably voting machines but most likely a series of cheating scams big and small is the culprit.
Romney loses to MMCCAIN?????
Christians that think they are so holy and could not vote for Romney - hatred which is not Christian. They have a religion but not a relationship with God. Hope a lot of the stay at home voters are some of those that are being laid off now.
And then there's that.
My uncle and his entire family go to some church that has a name like "The church of Jesus Christ, social redeemer" or some crazy crap like that. Its pure communism behind a cross.
...and another FReeper who thinks that you can attract flies with vinegar weighs in.
Another explanation, the most logical, is that the six million Evangelicals who voted for Obama look like Obama also.
"Romney loses to MMCCAIN?????"
He lost to him in 2008, so why are you acting so surprised?
Unlike you pathetic cowards who choose to blame everyone but your pathetic candidate. Just like a democrat, the only difference is that Romney isn't black so you can't use that.
Don't consider for a second that the church is full of people who have not a thing to do with christianity let alone conservatism.
Ignorance can be an ugly thing.
If that is true, we are not talking about Evangelicals are we? Sorry, there is a major difference in beliefs here...
Romney was not pathetic candidate. The pathetic part was in the Romney camp however. Their vaunted ORCA GOTV project was a total sham and failure. Poll watchers found out they didnt' have their permit. No one told them they needed them. The charade totally collapsed without any backup plan that entailed the old fashioned GOTV methods.
You have sealed the fate of a great nation! Be proud that you were there and helped, be sure to tell your kids that you killed thier future and thier childrens future. You have something to be proud of. You are not alone there are many like you who will have the brand. Nice to know you and your families will feel the wrath
We certainly do. And on another thread I have at least one of them claiming virtual ownership of FR, and calling me, a contributor to this site of 14 years standing, a troll.
I was warning before the election and during the GOP Primary, that getting Romney as the GOP Nominee - would suppress the Evangelical Vote.
It's known that the GOP cannot win without the full Evangelical Right on board and supporting the candidate. Romney just was NOT GOING TO FLY with many Evangelicals and that was known long before it ever came down to the convention.
But, many preferred to ignore it. The LOSS of the election is something I attribute DIRECTLY to this - a very significant portion of the Evangelicals refusing to vote for Romney!
Maybe next time, someone will take these things into consideration about the Evangelicals, instead of telling them that they "better come on board" - or else!
From the #s I crunched, yes, more than 6 million voters -- both in THIS election -- as well as the previous one...voted for Obama.
Keep in mind this still only represents 20% of all white Evangelicals.
(I mean even 22% of gays & lesbians voted for Bush in one of the elections...2004)
So, yes, this is terrible that 6 million Evangelicals voted for Obama.
Especially when you realize that 16 million Catholics voted for Obama...and probably around 20 million non-Evangelical Protestants voted for Obama...
Uh! So they voted for a Moslem, but not a Mormon. Sure thing.
Satan is alive and thriving. Sad
We're doomed! A radical like Obama getting that many evangelicals, any other democrat running for POTUS is bound to get even more!!!
Add up the amount of votes that 0bama won in the swing states of Ohio, Virginia, Florida, Colorado, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania and Iowa.
Throw in Wisonsin & Nevada as well.
It wasn't that hard to cheat a little in each of those states, enough to win them.
The GOP needs to investigate the votes in each of those states before they are ratified on Dec 17
Sorry, you can NOT be an Evangelical and vote for Obama! That means that either our definition of Evangelical is wrong or we have loosen the idea so that anyone can define themselves as an Evangelical with no idea what that actually means!
The short version is that we do not have Evangelicals that would vote for Obama - otherwise, they could NOT be Evangelicals - a major contraindication here for me!
In reality NO REAL EVANGELICALS would ever vote for Obama!
So, that's what's wrong with the polls (SEE PEW 91%).
Now, about asking people if they are Evangelicals, you'll find that term to be quite flexible. It includes every sort of Christian BUT the Catholics, and even then I've heard an MSM news gal refer to the Pope as an extreme Evangelical.
We live and learn eh!
I carefully differentiate between regular old fashioned Protestants and Holy Rollers by referring to the Holy Rollers. The only folks I've ever heard criticize me for that were Episcopals and they are almost not Christian in any meaningful sense anymore, so who are they to complain.
What we need is some data on the Holy Rollers. They are the fastest growing Christian component and we don't know how they vote ~ but they have 2 or 3 potential Presidential candidates already lined up and ready to go in the future.
Let's get the regular pollsters out there interrogating some of those self-described "Evangelicals" to tell us if they're really Holy Rollers or something else ~ denomination names might well be in order for this.
Then the Episcopals can scream and shout over that. Should be a regular circus.
Doesn't the RNC handle the GOTV for the candidate ?
Note, the article gets the number wrong on the 2008 election ~ Reps had 59 million and the Dems had 69 million votes. That's 128 million votes, not 122 million.
So, stop with the blamecasting upon Evangelicals please. Just look at a 2012 Presidential election results map, for goodness sake. See all those red states? Practically all Evangelical strongholds.
A worse case of barking up the wrong tree entirely, I've seldom seen.
Good point but that was before we had 4 years of Obama. I'm not sayin' Romney was then or is now a good choice. I'm just sayin' based on polls and just the mood of the nation and most especially The Republican Party the momentum and enthusiasm for Mitt was phenomenal. No I didn't just see the USA through rose colored glasses this election cycle. I speak as a person who did not and does not care for Mitt Romney. He is far too liberal for me. I still voted for him though. It was a vote against Obama more than a vote for Romney. I was far, far from alone there. But Republicans voting against Romney in a Primary vs not voting for the Republican Candidate in a General election, and one of this magnitude, makes no sense.
Do you really believe there were fewer Republicans voting this election than last? I don't. Even if the evidence is just circumstantial my gut tells me this election stinks of corruption.
"Even the elect will be deceived."
So, he got rid of the competitors by hook or crook.
Otherwise, he was the same old 20% guy, and in the end McCain's numbers beat Romney's numbers ~ except for some technical details.
I said Bachmann's hubby would have done better. I stand behind that.
I couldn't agree more. From your post to God's ears.
See this thread :
WTH are you talking about? I haven't sealed anything. I voted for the American!
A "church" doesn't have to have a name like that. The constituents of all the major denominations are attending assemblies where the major indoctrination is in the "social gospel" and in "social justice" which is exactly what you say. Their communicants are not believing in defeat of sin in their lives by conviction, deep godly sorrow, confession, repentance, and new birth in the realm of the Spirit; and separation from phony religion.
Declaring association with Christ without becoming dead to self, sin as a master, and the world characterizes the message of such denominations.
Bet you didn't know that did you.
All Mormons are not pure ~
But you cannot be a Christian and vote for Obama.
I have noted this on couple other threads. People keep posting this stuff based on the Tuesday totals. There are still votes being counted. Romney is going end up with more votes than McCain got and Obama will be short of 2008 by only a couple million not 6M.
Well, it's possible...but Evangelicals weren't alone on this...and more white non-Evangelical Protestants & Catholics stayed out of the election process this go-round...compared to even more Evangelicals turning out: See: How the Faithful Voted: 2012 Preliminary Analysis [Evang. up; other Prot. + white Catholics down]
Quite frankly, I do not believe any exit polls.
If all the pollsters and experts got this whole election this wrong by so much, there is no way the exit pollsters got it right.
This is all conjecture.
Any self identified Evangelical who voted for Obama in 2012 is not an Evangelical to begin with. Period. Whether they think so or not. Catholics are schizophrenic when it comes to the Bible and their core beliefs, but that is not so with true evangelicals.
What I want to see is WHERE the 2012 vote totals were less than the 2008 vote totals.
The lines, even with early voting, were much longer than 2008. There was less motivation for ANYONE to vote for Obama then in 2008. We know that there were many who voted for Zippy in 2008 that were not going to vote for Zippy this time.
S0, eleven million voters more voted last time than this time? When there were so many inclined to vote against Zippy?
Remember 2010? What happened to those voters? They decided to let Zippy win another four years?
The Hispanic difference between 2008 and 2012 is 10% of 3 percentage points. So no,pandering to them is not the answer. And the number of single women is not greater than the number of white males, white women who are married, etc. so they are not the cause either.
Frankly, if the pollsters ,Luntz, Rasmussen, Rove and Morris got it this wrong, they need to go away. I say they get no more chances to screw up. The folks here on FR probably could do a better analysis of the polls than they did. So now they are telling us how to solve the GOP problem base don exit polling that is not in any way exact, and we are supposed to believe them and go the way they tell us.
Screw that!
After four years of Zippy and his disastrous policies,a Vice President with dementia,and people all over single married, young older all out of work or making less than before, with a high unemployment rate and no plan to fix anything—that's the guy Americans voted for?
Baloney. This election was stolen in key precincts in key states and the fraud is so out there it is staring us in the face.
The Dems went for broke—remember their theme—By Any Means Necessary—to keep Zippy in the Oval Office.They are counting on the GOP to do NOTHING. They have been buggering election results since 1960 on the Presidential level. They fight every voter ID initiative or voter roll cleanup operation that starts.We saw how they almost stole 2000 right in our faces.
So why is 2012 any different? In four states there were multiple incidents of Romney votes changing to Obama votes before the voter even pressed the "VOTE" button. How do you think that happens? Magic?
Romney didn't get up to McCain's numbers, so we have a 2 million vote gap.
The difference is readily explained by demographic change, death, disease, disability ~ etc. Someone forgot to register more Republicans and then encourage them to go vote for the Republican candidate. I think that's behavior not really of much interest to the GOP-e ~ they leave it to the locals ~ even if Romney had kicked sand in their faces ~ does not work well!
Evangelicals voted. Black Evangelicals voted for Obama. They were at least 10% of his vote ~ to wit, 6 million people.
White Evangelicals voted for Romney ~ probably in greater percentages than other groups ~ even Mormons.
Well, yes & no.
I mean, you could say that no early Christian who was a true Christian would be sleeping with their mom-in-law; but the church @ Corinth had that...and the apostle Paul addressed it.
(You have even less church discipline these days...so there's ALL kinds of people on the rolls of church membership lists...and remember, Jesus said that the tares would be among the wheat...)
You never know if Virginia or Ohio gets put in the GOP column, less electoral votes for 0bama, less of a mandate
I think they are the Santorum avengers.
"Polls are either wrong or we are facing Evangelists that no longer believe in God. Unfortunately, I think it is the latter."
They don't believe in God but they consider themselves "spiritual," dontcha know...
I think Rosenberg is slightly over here...I think it could wind up @ 6.4 million (after all uncounted votes are counted)...
As Callahan has pointed out, they are still counting votes. In CA alone...1/2 million from 7 counties...+ provisional votes in ALL states...
Yet, if we only went with the count right now...the # of white Evangelicals who voted would be anywhere from 29.5 million to almost 31 million. 1/5th of that ranges from just less than 6 million to less than 6.2 million.
We have some of these idiots right here on FR. THANKS MORONS!""""""".... YEP, they are beginning to crawl out now, then there are these: Enough to put Romney over the top it seems, but by all means lets stick to Principles.
Thanks for reinforcing my point which was to solve the mystery of the 6 million Evangelicals. Everybody seemed to assume they were white.
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GlassFish V2 released with cost-efficient annual subscriptions
By John Clingan-Oracle on Sep 17, 2007
There is a good reason for the rather long pause at The Clingan Zone. As mentioned previously, I moved out of the field and into corporate as the GlassFish Group Product Manager. In that role, I have been working in the background doing my part to help move GlassFish V2 towards the goal line. As of today, we've crossed that line. GlassFish V2 is formally released!!
GlassFish V1, the first Java EE 5 application server available, focused on developers with Java EE 5 ease-of-development features, low resource consumption, dynamic resource configuration, etc. GlassFish V2 adds out-of-the-box enterprise features. In particular:
- Clustering - Cluster for scalability high-availability. New to GlassFish V2 is in-memory session replication for high availability; robust and easy to set up. For 5 9's of availability Sun continues to offer HADB.
- Advanced administration - From a centralized GUI console (or CLI) users can manage and monitor the clusters and applications. Clusters can be created and grown dynamically to meet user demand.
- Best-in-class performance - GlassFish V2 offers great performance and is the fastest open source application server available. In fact, GlassFish V2 is 10% faster than BEA WebLogic 9.x on the same hardware (compare here and here).
- Microsoft .NET 3.0 Web services Interoperability - At it's core, Project Metro offers industry-leading web services performance with JAX-WS. In addition, Sun (through Project Metro) and Microsoft have worked together to ensure secure, reliable, transactional and high performance web services interoperability between Java EE and Microsoft .NET 3.0.
Enterprise features do not compromise ease-of-use. To date the feedback we have received on ease-of-use has been overwhelmingly positive, especially for clustered deployments. Ease-of-use will be a top-level theme for GlassFish V3 (more on that in a later post).
Sun's commercially available counterpart to GlassFish V2, the Sun Java System Application Server 9.1, is offered with new annual subscriptions for support, including live transfer for issues impacting production availability. In fact, we have dropped prices by up to 75% to be in line with other open source offerings. Yep, you can buy online. Note, GlassFish V2 is at feature parity with the Sun Java System Application Server 9.1 - we're not penalizing the open source community for committing to open source bits. However, if production support is required to reduce the impact of production issues, we have your back. With great out-of-the-box enterprise features and cost-efficient pricing, the Sun Java System Application Server 9.1 offer a great value proposition whether you are an enterprise looking to drive down costs or a startup looking for a low barrier to entry.
Download GlassFish V2 or Sun's commercialized counterpart, the Sun Java System Application Server 9.1. Take it for a spin. Have questions? Check the documentation or the FAQ on how to get help.


text:
|5| Excellent
|4| Good
|3| Average
|2| Bad
|1| Terrible
Naruto Naruto Naruto,,,Why did he aim for the Mask and not for the Chest.
Kill Tobi you Baka...that is more important than seeing the face under the mask....dang! LOL!
I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !
i would say im surprised if we'll see tobi's face next chapter, but you're right paulbee, defeating him is way more important than seeing his face, but if you look at the lore of narutoverse then it would be more important to see his face than anything else atm, just imagine the rant there would be if tobi was defeated without ever showing us his face.
Tobi must be one Tough Old Bird.
He's taken a Rasengan to the Right Shoulder, and now he's taken a Black Minin BB Rasengan to the Face. I bet he'll still be moving a bit, if not a lot next chapter.
The larger question is what's next for Tobi. Is this the end of the road for him, or will Madara show up and save his sorry butt?
Last edited by paulbee; 08-22-2012 at 02:19 PM.
I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !
He could defeat him, and then remove his mask too
Sorry but I'm not interested in weaklings
Literally in his face. But seriously I think anyone who takes a Rasengan to the face, mask or not, his face must will be f***ed up for life.
Manga reading list: Bleach, Naruto, Katekyo Hitman Reborn, One Piece, Code Breaker, Gamaran, Kuroko No Basket, Fairy Tail, The World God Only Knows, Kimi No Iru Machi, Good Ending, Medaka Box, Nisekoi, D.Gray-Man, Ao No Exorcist, Freezing, Magi - Labyrinth of Magic, Soul Eater, Rosario Vampire Season II, Iris Zero, Ubell Blatt, Bloody Cross, Sun-Ken Rock, and Infinite Stratos,
fucking awesome chapter, real edge of the seat stuff. I hope Kishi doesn't troll us all to hell by saying that Tobi's face is damaged beyond recognition after taking a rasengan that smashed that mask into pieces. I really can't wait to see this chapter animated.
I love how they showed Tobi with the same mangekyo as Kakashi - the two of em side by side. That theory that Izuna is related to Obito is really growing on me. There's a visual similarity between Obito's mangekyo design and Izuna's. Each has a centre circle with 3 stalks coming out, except that Obito's have cool sickle shaped protrusions on the stalks.
So those stakes were still the power of the Rinnegan, fired with the Mangekyou, right? And why does Tobi still call his technique "Kamui", the name Kakashi gave it?
Anyway, Naruto finally getting some more time to shine in the Tobi fight was every bit as refreshing as I hoped! Based on the close-ups of the Rinnegan, it seems like Tobi is going to get out of this attack, one way or another, but here's to hoping he'll waste his Mangekyou using Izanagi or something to survive. With Kakashi seemingly out of the game, Tobi's got to lose the use of his warping, too.


text:
GDB 26: Danger in the Shark tank
December 06 2008 05:21PM
Step 1: Score three goals. Step 2: Gas three goal lead surrendering four straight. Step 3: Score stirring goal with 12 mins remaining to tie the game. Step 4: Have Schremp go in the shootout - get 56 alarm robbed by LaBarbera Step 5: Send in Hemsky to destroy everything.
Repeat as necessary
So what exactly is the plan for tonight? The Oil head into San Jose - who has collected an amazing 16 wins in only 12 games at home this year. The nice thing about tonight? The Oil really have no business winning in SJ so there is no pressure on them. The really nice thing about tonight? The Oil historically have this habit of winning games they have no business winning. Take gassing that 3 goal lead last night then still pulling it out.
And before we start planning the party for Schremp we will continue to reserve judgment. He looked all kinds of awesome again last night -- going so far as to ditch his lid on the one goal in tribute to Coach MacTavish. We can literally hear the "I told you sos" being screamed at the TVs all over the Nation every time Schremp collects a point. We are waiting a few more before we make our decision on how real his realness is.
It touches our heart
The Justice League meeting was a little sparse last night -- and that's perfectly fine. Cause you know that everyone who wasn't in attendance at the JL meeting was out on the town and watching the game somewhere and there in spirit. You just know that the JL is out there on the town all over Canada running beers through them. It's the holidays for heavens sake. We need to be able to bring the JL on the move with us somehow -- and we have a team of scientists thinking about how that would work. In the meantime let the good times roll.
Oh yeah
And there's this.
Holy crap Carbs looks like he was going to cry
Lidstrom looks like the terminator
LOL! Southleast division! I like it.
December 06 2008, 09:42PM
It's got to suck to play in florida...we should threaten to trade Cole there.....
IN all honesty I feel bad for Eric Cole, miss used early and hasn't found his stride again.
December 06 2008, 09:43PM
quick question gentlemen,
Is CBC sound all background for anyone else? I cannot hear the commentators at all, just some kid who keeps cheering go sharks go.
December 06 2008, 09:44PM
Man is PJ Stock strange. You get the feeling he brings Maclean his dry cleaning every monday morning as part of the deal.
The Coyotes are losing $30 million this year? Holy crap!
He keeps working like he has been, and pucks will start bouncing his way. I remain a Cole promoter.
December 06 2008, 09:45PM
Take a piss
Grab a handful of drinks
maybe a piece a beef jerky
and strap yourself in for a wild period of hockey!
December 06 2008, 09:45PM
Fiveandagame wrote:
IN all honesty I feel bad for Eric Cole, miss used early and hasn't found his stride again.
I truly think Cole is an unreal player and if the Oil can't get it out of him that's their fault more than it is his.
He is awesome.
Signed, Mrs Wanye Cole
December 06 2008, 09:47PM
Wanye Gretz wrote:
Signed, Mrs Wanye Cole
December 06 2008, 09:50PM
And everyone stops talking as they go to the can before the new period starts.
December 06 2008, 09:50PM
I think Cole will bust out of this, and when he does this team goes from hopeful to contender.
I hate to put the cart before the horse but i'd like to see a shootout and have Schremp get so redemption
December 06 2008, 09:53PM
Our first line is good now. I love you penner.
December 06 2008, 09:54PM
good shift 4th line. win draw, change it up.
December 06 2008, 09:54PM
Penner Horcoff and Hemsky are wicked first line!
How can Hemmer be so awesome but still cough up the puck so much
Watch Grebs play a bit. You'll be simply horrified.@ R-DAWG:
December 06 2008, 09:56PM
R-DAWG wrote:
How can Hemmer be so awesome but still cough up the puck so much
Gretzky gave the puck away more than any other player in history
December 06 2008, 09:56PM
Fiveandagame wrote:
hey jeanshorts is your mom reading over your shoulder, you're being very civil and stuff? Or do you need a Baggedmilk set up man for your comedy stylings?
I'm really off my game tonight and I have no idea why. I've been really distracted these last few JL meetings so I'm going to chalk it up to that.
I haven't talked to baggedmilk since yesterday afternoon and I'm afraid that he froze to death diving into his dad's fridge in a marijuana induced food pyschosis.
December 06 2008, 09:56PM
"Let's go SHARKS"
- the person yelling let's go sharks on TV
December 06 2008, 09:57PM
Good god
December 06 2008, 10:00PM
show me that offside again...
December 06 2008, 10:02PM
ALL I CAN HEAR IS LET'S GO SHARKS from like 1 desperate fan and his kid
December 06 2008, 10:04PM
Wanye Gretz wrote:
ALL I CAN HEAR IS LET'S GO SHARKS from like 1 desperate fan and his kid
The people of San Jose have far better things to do on a brisk 19 degree December night.
-Cleaning up gang graffiti
-Buying plasma TV's
-Drive by shootings
Thorton just opened the door to the fury of Roloson.
That's right, idiot ref! You have a goalie without a mask, you blow the whistle.
December 06 2008, 10:05PM
jeanshorts wrote:
That is hilarious. I was dancing on my toes yelling the same thing at everyone
December 06 2008, 10:06PM
That is a lot of work by Brule.
December 06 2008, 10:06PM
Look at that shot blocking!!! What is this the 2003 Oilers?????????????????????????
Shit, thesharks have more shots on the last flurry than we do all game
December 06 2008, 10:07PM
this is ugly
This game is giving me ulcers.
December 06 2008, 10:07PM
Lesson number one Kyle Broadziak, don't pass the puck to Joe Thronton.
You have to give your goalie a break, Oilers. Sacrifice your own overpriced bodies!
December 06 2008, 10:09PM
On a scale of One to Jonas Brothers, how bad does Cogs miss his BFFFFFF's??
December 06 2008, 10:09PM
This game is all kinds of too intense
December 06 2008, 10:10PM
Nilsson can stay away. I'm loving schremp!
December 06 2008, 10:10PM
@ jeanshorts: 3 Jonas brothers!
I love the over exageration by the Mark...HE HIT ROLOSON RIGHT IN THE FACE!!! SHREMP PASTED ON THE BOARDS
December 06 2008, 10:11PM
Good call actually Crawford. Roloson is bringing it
December 06 2008, 10:12PM
R-DAWG wrote:
I love the over exageration by the Mark…HE HIT ROLOSON RIGHT IN THE FACE!!! SHREMP PASTED ON THE BOARDS
I really, really liked Marc Crawford at the beginning of the season, but it's becoming clear that he is being groomed to be the next Harry Neal.
December 06 2008, 10:12PM
The first line is getting double shifted.
December 06 2008, 10:12PM
Oh and Mark Lee is terrible on his best nights.
only 40 shots on the oil...thats how many i'm up to tonite watching this
December 06 2008, 10:14PM
I bet San Jose scores here *employing JW's jedi mind reverse phycology trick and crosses fingers*
December 06 2008, 10:15PM
Gilbert, that goon!
December 06 2008, 10:15PM
fracking hell Gibby


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Virginia Sherwood/Bravo/NBCU Photo Bank via Getty Images
Wolfgang Puck learned to cook at his mother's side in Austria before training in Paris and hitting it big in the Hollywood food scene. Take our quiz to see how much you know about the restaurants of this culinary superstar.
Start Quiz »
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Question 1 of 30
Where did Wolfgang Puck take his first restaurant job in the U.S.?
New York
After arriving in the U.S. from Europe, Puck took a job at Indianapolis restaurant La Tour, where he worked from 1973 to 1975.
Question 2 of 30
What year did Puck finally take the leap and move to Los Angeles?
Puck moved to Los Angeles in 1975, where he became chef and part owner of Ma Maison in West Hollywood.
Question 3 of 30
What name did Wolfgang Puck choose for his famous first restaurant?
Puck rubbed elbows with celebrities at Spago, which he opened on the Sunset Strip in 1982.
Question 4 of 30
Which of these foods was Puck known for early in his career?
super-rare steaks
raw dishes
fancy pizzas
Puck impressed the crowds at Spago with his haute pizzas, which included toppings like caviar and foie gras.
Question 5 of 30
What did Wolfgang Puck name his second restaurant?
Puck opened Chinois, which offered Asian fusion cuisine in Santa Monica, California, in 1983.
Question 6 of 30
What city did Wolfgang Puck choose for his third restaurant in 1989?
New York
San Francisco
Puck opened Postrio, his third restaurant, at the Prescott Hotel in San Francisco's Union Square.
Question 7 of 30
Where did Puck move his original Spago restaurant in 1997?
San Diego
Malibu, California
Beverly Hills, California
After 15 years in West Hollywood, Puck moved Spago to Canon Drive in Beverly Hills in 1997.
Question 8 of 30
What name did Wolfgang Puck give to his first steakhouse?
Puck opened his first steakhouse, Cut, at the Beverly Wilshire Hotel in 2006.
Question 9 of 30
What does "Spago" mean?
"Spago" is an Italian slang term for "spaghetti."
Question 10 of 30
Where did Puck open his first Italian restaurant?
Las Vegas
Wolfgang Puck chose the Mandalay Bay hotel and casino in Las Vegas for Trattoria del Lupo, his first restaurant dedicated to fine Italian cuisine.
Question 11 of 30
What city is home to the first Wolfgang Puck restaurant ever opened on the East Coast?
New York
Atlantic City, New Jersey
Puck took on the East Coast with the Wolfgang Puck American Grille at the Borgata Hotel in Atlantic City, New Jersey.
Question 12 of 30
What city is home to Wolfgang Puck Steak, Puck's second foray into the classic steakhouse?
Memphis, Tennessee
Kansas City, Missouri
Wolfgang Puck Steak opened at the Detroit MGM Grand in 2012 and offered Puck's take on the classic slab of beef.
Question 13 of 30
What city is home to Red Seven?
Las Vegas
Los Angeles
Puck's seventh restaurant, Red Seven, features classic California cuisine at the Pacific Design Center in West Hollywood.
Question 14 of 30
What is the name of Puck's Dallas restaurant?
Wolfgang Puck Down South
Five Sixty
The elegant Five Sixty opened at the Reunion Tower in Dallas in 2009.
Question 15 of 30
What does the name "Five Sixty" represent?
Puck's birth month and year
types of wine available
distance from the ground
Five Sixty takes its name from the fact that it's located 560 feet above the ground, offering diners spectacular views of the Dallas skyline.
Question 16 of 30
True or false: Five Sixty is a revolving restaurant.
Five Sixty is high in the sky for sweeping views, and its views change constantly as the restaurant revolves.
Question 17 of 30
What year did Wolfgang Puck Express launch?
Puck's line of fast-casual cafes launched in 1991.
Question 18 of 30
What city is home to the Wolfgang Puck restaurant The Source?
Portland, Oregon
Nashville, Tennessee
Diners can eat Puck's cuisine at The Source, which is at the media-focused Newseum near the U.S. Capitol.
Question 19 of 30
Where is Puck's re Asian restaurant located?
The re Asian restaurant is on the 50th floor of the Four Seasons at Bahrain Bay.
Question 20 of 30
What floor of The Ritz-Carlton, Los Angeles is home to a Wolfgang Puck eatery?
Puck's WP24 is named after the floor it's on at the Ritz-Carlton in Los Angeles.
Question 21 of 30
What type of cuisine does WP24 serve?
WP24 offers a menu inspired by the flavors of China and the Far East, as well as an adjacent lounge called Nest.
Question 22 of 30
What city was home to the first location of The Kitchen?
Grand Rapids, Michigan
Puck chose Grand Rapids, Michigan, for his first casual dining spot, called The Kitchen.
Nashville, Tennessee
Question 23 of 30
What year did The Kitchen open?
The Kitchen opened at Grand Rapids' Amway Grand Plaza Hotel in 2015.
Question 24 of 30
Which of these cities is NOT home to a Wolfgang Puck Bar and Grill?
Las Vegas
Los Angeles
New York
The Wolfgang Puck Bar and Grill offers an upscale take on the American grill experience in Summerlin, Las Vegas as well as Los Angeles.
Question 25 of 30
How many Spago locations are operating as of 2016?
Puck has five Spago locations: in Beverly Hills; Las Vegas; Maui, Hawaii; Istanbul; and Singapore.
Question 26 of 30
Where can you find Wolfgang Puck's Cucina?
Las Vegas
Cucina is a rustic Italian restaurant located in The Shops at Crystals on the Vegas Strip.
Question 27 of 30
What is the name of the Wolfgang Puck eatery at the Griffith Observatory?
Star Cafe
Cafe at the End of the Universe
Dine at the Cafe at the End of the Universe while visiting the Griffith Observatory in Los Angeles.
Cafe du Monde
Question 28 of 30
What is the name of the bar at Wolfgang Puck's Cut steakhouse in London?
Blue Lagoon
London Calling
Bar 45
Cut London is home to Bar 45, which features a bar menu called "Rough Cuts."
Question 29 of 30
What city is home to Puck's Cloud Nine Cafe?
Orlando, Florida
Cloud Nine Cafe is on the observation deck of the Reunion Tower in Dallas, Texas.
Question 30 of 30
Which is NOT one of Puck's casual dining spots?
Wolfgang Puck at Hotel Bel-Air
The restaurant at Hotel Bel-Air in Los Angeles is a fine dining spot that serves modern California cuisine.
WP Kitchen and Bar
Wolfgang Puck Bistro


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I appreciate this opportunity to connect with readers of my book, Instead of Medicating and Punishing. It is my hope that readers will post their questions and comments about Attachment Parenting, unschooling, alternatives to traditional school, alternatives to psychiatric drugs and other topics raised in my book. For parents of children ages 9 to 18, I hope you will take the opportunity to dialogue with me about the attachment needs of older youth... I know there is much less info in the Attachment Parenting movement right now relating to Attachment Parenting and unschooling children ages 9 to 18, and healing broken bonds with these age groups; my book puts a focus on connecting to and healing youth at these critical ages. Thank you for your support and I look forward to hearing from you on the forum. Please also visit my website, www.LaurieACouture.com.
-Laurie A. Couture


text:
This week Duncan and Christian check in from the Banff Centre for the Arts.
They sit down with the Director of Visual Arts, Kitty Scott to discuss what the Banff Centre is and does.
Then they hijack a moment of performance art to "guerrilla" style interview Jan Verwoert, a contributing editor to Frieze magazine, a regular writer for Afterall and Metropolis M, and the leader of their summer residency. Read more


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George Washington
IntroductionWashington, George, 1732–99, 1st President of the United States (1789–97), commander in chief of the Continental army in the American Revolution, called the Father of His Country.
Sections in this article:
The Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia, 6th ed. Copyright © 2012, Columbia University Press. All rights reserved.
See more Encyclopedia articles on: U.S. History: Biographies


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The local San Rafael Soil Conservation District (SCD) and the U.S. Department of Agriculture (Natural Resources Conservation Service-NRCS) is seeking input from all citizens, organizations and government agencies about resource concern issues. The resource concerns of most interest to the SCD are soil, water, air, plant, animal and human issues. There may be other resource concern issues as well and public input is requested.
The San Rafael Soil Conservation District consists of five locally elected citizens charged with focusing attention on all resource concerns within its jurisdiction which is the land and water within the San Rafael River Watershed. The purpose of the SCD is to "focus attention on land, water, and related resource problems; develop programs to solve those problems; and, enlist the cooperation of various public and private resource groups who can contribute to the accomplishments of the districts goals and plans."
If you have concerns or would like to comment on local resources, please plan to attend a public meeting on June 23. The public meeting will begin at 7 p.m. in the new USDA Service Center located at 1120 North Des Bee Dove Road (road to the new county sheriff's office). If you have any questions please call (435) 381-2300 and visit with Roger Barton, extension 113; Hal Lemon, extension 109; Jim Greenan, extension 111; or Wayne Urie, extension 103.


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T-Shirts are printed on supersoft Sanmar Co., Gildan or Delta cotton tees.
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VELCRO Classic Super Size Roller- 2pk 2-1/2"(63.5mm)
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- Long-Lasting, Self-Gripping Rollers - No Pins needed
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VELCRO Classic Super Size Roller- 2pk 2-1/2"(63.5mm) straighten curl or frizzy hair for normal or thick hair.
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A Staple ItemPerfect for the right amount of volume and wave. If you're going for va va voluminous, I would recommend this for people with longer hair. I didn't take the time to look at the actual measurement of how big they were before purchasing, but they're the biggest I have. It's a great size for the crown of your head.
Was this review helpful?(Yes)(No)Oct 19, 2010Fran / KentuckyHAIR TYPEDark Brown / Curly Hair
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WELLINGTON-Ryan Roy Thayn was born Aug. 11, 1973, in Price, Utah to Randy and Loralie Thayn. He left us Nov. 4, 1998. Ryan graduated from Carbon High School in 1991, and he later attended the College of Eastern Utah.
Ryan was an all-star baseball player and loved to coach his younger brothers. Ryan loved to watch the Utah Jazz and the Oakland Raiders. Ryan's passion for fishing and hunting developed into taxidermy, which he enjoyed for several years. He stuffed many animals for himself, family, and friends.
Ryan's work included repair duties at Mine West and well operator for Seely Oil Company in Mounds. Ryan was a strong, reserved person with a dry, witty personality.
Ryan was extremely loved and will be missed dearly by all who knew him.
Ryan is survived by his parents, Randy and Loralie; brothers, Brett (Samantha) Thayn of Nibley and Tyler Thayn of Logan; grandmother, Marilyn Young of Wellington; great-grandmother, Elizabeth Olsen of Ferron; a nephew, Brendan Ryan; three nieces, Cydnie, Ashley, and Taylor; and all uncles, aunts, and cousins.
Ryan was followed in death by his grandparents, Harold and Ethel Thayn, and Merril Young, all of Wellington.
Funeral services were held Friday June 13, 2008 at 11 a.m. at the Wellington LDS Stake Center (935 East Main). Friends called Thursday June 12, from 6-8 p.m. at Fausett Mortuary in Price (680 East 100 South) and Friday one hour prior to the services at the Stake Center. Interment was in the Wellington Cemetery. Services were in the care of Fausett Mortuary.


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Nolan Ryan
Lynn Nolan Ryan (Ryan Express)
Position: Pitcher
Born: January 31, 1947 in Refugio, TX
High School: Alvin HS (Alvin, TX)
Drafted by the New York Mets in the 12th round of the 1965 amateur draft. (All Transactions)
Debut: September 11, 1966 (Age 19.223, 10,122nd in MLB history) vs. ATL 2.0 IP, 1 H, 3 SO, 1 BB, 1 ER
Rookie Status: Exceeded rookie limits during 1968 season [*]
Teams (by GP): Angels/Astros/Rangers/Mets 1966-1993
Agents: Dick Moss [*]
Last Game: September 22, 1993 (Age 46.234)
Inducted into the Hall of Fame by BBWAA as Player in 1999 (491/497 ballots).
View Nolan Ryan Page at the Baseball Hall of Fame (plaque, photos, videos).
View Player Bio from the SABR BioProject
About biographical information
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We'll respond shortly.
Tweet this has some peculiarities which took some Pivots a while to figure out. The URL you want is http://twitter.com/home?status=this+is+my+tweet – Using www causes a redirect, and leaving off home appears to work, but will lose the message if the user is not currently logged in to twitter and has to go through the log in dialog.
A pivot asks if anyone uses the "tweet/share/digg/blog/sharethis/email/overshare" links. Two pivots do, one thinks they're "rarely used but requisite" and one has added them to a project recently and promises to report back in a few weeks with some log data.
"Does anyone use Delayed Job with more than one worker process?"
One project is trying to use four workers, and can't find a way to monitor their individual status. The current solution is to spin them all down and then up, which not optimal. One suggestion is to wrap the entire thing in a rescue block, though this is probably not optimal.


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Watching round two has been like watching a baby fight Mike Tyson
May 01 2008 09:52AM
What in the sweet delicious maple-syrup-flavored carbonated beverage is going on in the second round? It's almost as though the Hockey Gods purposefully mismatched all of the series to give the teams a bye into the conference finals. The four teams currently losing their respective series' are imploding faster than the plans for Roger Clemens' new book "Marriage—how the Rocket makes it work."
As of this very instant, 9:11:02 AM MDT Today May 1, 2008 AD, the series stand as follows:
Flyers lead the Canadiens 3–1
The Canadiens have thrown their boy wonder Cary Price out with the morning trash and are now playing Halak. Carbo has never looked more tired at post-game press conferences in his life, and the Flyers don't even seem to have broken a sweat yet. Montrealers are getting ready to put down their happy rioting clubs and arson kits, and are looking through their closets for their angry rioting clubs and arson kits. Things are going so well for the Flyers that even Darien Hatcher is able to contribute, despite the notable handicaps that include the fact that a) his skating stride is best clocked with a calendar, and b) he's a caveman brought back to life à la Encino Man.
The Stars lead the Sharks 3–1
Ron Wilson went on record after the game last night lamenting that "You (the media) have us dead and buried already." No Ron, the fact you are down 3–1 to the Stars has you dead and buried. Dropping two overtime games has you dead and buried. The fact that your Sharks scored their first power play goal of the series last night has you dead and buried. The two members of the media that follow your team with a passing interest are merely reporting on the gong show that you are icing on a nightly basis. Blaming the media for the Sharks being screwed ain't it, son. No matter, when you're an analyst on TSN next season—you know, 'cause you're about to be fired—you can see what its like on the other side of the microphone.
The Wings lead the Avs 3–0
Oh man, the Avs aren't even putting up a fight. Our boy Smytty is out with an injured foot and leading scorer Paul Stastny is out for the rest of the series. In other words, neither will be on the ice when the Wings win tonight and the Avs are swept out of the building. The Wings meanwhile show no signs of slowing down. Chris Chelios has taken to bench pressing the entire training staff between periods, Franzen has eight goals—eight goals!—so far and Zetterberg and Datsyuk combined on a goal last night where they had passed the puck between them five times before they scored.
The Pens lead the Rangers 3–0
The Penguins are 7–0 to start these here 2008 playoffs. The Rangers sadly, are not. Sean Avery is out with a lacerated spleen, Lundqvist won't leave his crease to cut down an angle for love or money and the Pens are planning on making a day trip into Canada so the 80 per cent of the team who can't legally drink in the US can celebrate their win properly.
Does anyone on the Canadiens, Sharks, Avs or Rangers want to put a full 60 minutes of hockey in during the next game and make any of these series even the least bit interesting? Or does Mike Tyson get to beat a baby mercilessly within an inch of its little life? Is that what you people want? ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?
Its interesting that the Oilers were unwilling to offer Smyth a 5 year deal for fear of his injuries catching up with him. He has lost a lot of games to injury this year.
Or maybe he has decided to not play as injured as he was willing to in the past. Maybe now that he has seen the NHL for what it really is, he isn't willing to lay his very health on the line anymore.
Poor Smytty.
Now when you say a baby fights Tyson, do you mean Tyson today or years ago? I have seen a pic of him lately and he brings a new meaning to the term "heavyweight"


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At the start of the evening session at the World Championships, it looked like what you might call a quiet day for Great Britain. Jason Kenny was riding like a drain and there was this kid in the points race who was 20, making his senior debut and most notable for a shoulder injury last year. Somehow they came away with two golds.
Kenny won the keirin, rising to fill that large space on the podium Sir Chris Hoy left behind. But his rough-and-ready passage to victory followed a masterclass in timing and racing from Simon Yates, the 20-year-old from


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CL by Laundry Bianca Flat
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By Jerry Stotler Ferron
I watched Gov. Romeny's speech this morning on Oct. 8. It was a great speech, not a perfect speech, but a great speech, nevertheless. It was informative and inspiring. He started me thinking again. Yes, we need a leader that can and will encourage a vibrant economy. And No, President Obama has no clue how to do that. It appears his only domestic plan is to help the poor stay poor. There is some improvement in our economy, but as this President said, "You did not build that, someone else built that for you." No Mr. President, You did not do that, we did that. The American people are very resilient, knock us down, and we will bounce back up. The attack on Pearl Harbor is a great example of our bounce.
Governments produce nothing. You might make the case that roads are a product of government; at least when they are finished there is material good left over for the use by society. Government, by its nature, is a consumer. It takes resources, (the assets: material goods, money, energy, etc.) out of a society and uses it up. For example, it is typical that for every dollar received by our government, roughly 2/3 of it gets eaten up by government itself. Roughly 1/3 of the assets it confiscates from its people get back into the hands of non-government people. I saw a sign somewhere that said something like this, "If you put this government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in five years there would be a shortage of sand. Amen.
We have $84 Trillion in US assets, $121 T in unfunded liabilities + $16 T of national debt = $137 T in liabilities for a current ratio of .61; not a good number. Today, if we took all our assets, - i.e. all the money and property from all the people in the USA, ($84 Trillion) it would not be enough to cover our national financial obligations of $137,000,000,000,000. That's Trillions of Dollars. America is essentially broke, we own nothing, it is all mortgaged, to the tune of $137,000,000,000,000. You and all the people you know or have ever known, counting 24/7 as fast as you could, with $1,000 bills, could not count that high in all your lives put together.
We are in over our heads. In this case 8.4 feet tall standing in 13.7 feet of water wearing 20 lb. ankle boots on each foot. If you could walk to shallow enough water in 25 seconds, you might survive, but the prospects are not good.
God said, "Owe no man anything ..." (Rom 13:8) Debt is bad. But the interest on debt is a cancer eating away the society from the inside, eating away ever more as it *grows* and *grow*s and grows, eventually leaving not enough working parts to survive. The organism then dies, its people are devastated and even destroyed. If you support parasitic governance, if you have your hand out to get stuff, you will suffer a consequence as it little by little consumes you and those around you. Like cancer, for a while you feel OK, but as the internal parasites eat up your life sustaining resources - you will grow weaker and eventually have no life left in you, dead but not yet buried. That has always been the case when more and more people discover an easy way to sustain themselves at the expense of others. Sooner or later there are not enough others.
You could say that the nanny government cannibalizes the resources of the children in its care, us. The bigger the government, the bigger the appetite. It is really disgusting. In the case of our government, it takes not only the resources of today's children, but it takes the resources of generations to come through massive debt. And those in charge of our government think that it is OK to destroy the future of our grandchildren.
Mankind is basically lazy. The difference between one lazy person and another is what they do about our laziness. Some submit and become not much more than a dent in the couch. Others resist to some degree or other and some even become work-a-holics. Put yourself into that scale. Where do you fit between a dent-in-the-couch and a work-a-holic?
If you were the only person within a 2,000 mile radius, you would be absolutely responsible for the maintenance of your existence. No work, no eat. If someone should come into your sphere of influence, you would still have that responsibility to self maintain, but you would have the opportunity share the work for the "mutual benefit of each". If ten or fifty people show up, the responsible for the maintenance of your existence does not change, only the opportunity to spread the work load around changes for the mutual benefit of each. But, no one has the right to sit under a sycamore tree and sip an ice tea while everybody else works. The responsibility remains the same. That does not mean that we cannot help some get going, teaching them that which they need to self sustain. We can even shelter them while they are learning. But learn they must do as a condition of being helped. No able bodied / able minded person has a right to unlimited sustenance from others. The sustained must give something in return to those who sustain. Reciprocity is always appropriate, often required. It is clear, when we put together many of his comments, that Obama thinks that there is a large bowl of wealth for the world to share, and to the extent that some have more, others will have less, There are many in the liberal community who think that way. Well, "Bah, humbug". Every society/nation has its own bowl. Their bowl will have more or less according to how much wealth they create to put in it, by how much wealth they produce minus how much they consume. The only way to have more wealth in the bowl is to consume less than produced. That is just basic common sense. Government is always a consumer, a parasite that lives off the backs of its people. (Parasite - an organism that lives at the expense of its host.)
Since J.M. Keynes proposed the idea that governments could and should use debt based financing rather than asset based financing, adopted by virtually all the governments now in financial distress, their people have less opportunity for growth and productivity. Growth means there is more in the bowl than in the previous period. Their abundance is greater so to speak, the society is producing more for itself and is storing, selling or trading the surplus for a benefit to themselves and their progeny.
Every dollar taken by government from its people is a depletion of its resources and is a dollar that is not available to its people for their growth and productivity. Every dollar used by government is a dollar not available for use by its people for the improvement of a dynamic society. We are each either productive, consumptive, or counter-productive. We must be a productive people in order to maintain an abundant life for our people.