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|Topic Review (Newest First)
cruiser vs live-a-board
I think you make a good point and, fundamentally, ask a question which applies to many folks who picture themselves cruising a lot, but who either plan to or end up cruising in more challenging circumstances only occasionally or even rarely. One reason boats of immensely different capabilities are seen in the Caribbean, or down on Mexico''s west coast, is that cruising conditions IN those regions can be fairly benign, transiting between islands and ports can be relatively easy and quick, and weather patterns are seasonal (meaning one can choose to be there when it''s safest and the wx most stable). In such circumstances, one can cruise with a cautious agenda in truly marginal boats, not that most of us would aspire to do so.
I would put an ocean crossing - even a relatively short run such as visiting Bermuda from the U.S. mainland - in a different category, however. If an ''occasional'' or even ''single'' ocean crossing is in the plans, I don''t know how to be concerned about the safety of the crew - let''s set aside the goal of the passage being a relatively enjoyable one - without placing significantly higher weight on the vessel''s offshore capabilities. The reason is that even major stable, seasonal wx patterns don''t exist uniformly, unwaveringly, across large areas of an ocean, and some level of disturbance (convective, subtropical, frontal) has to be anticipated. They''ve run the Caribbean 1500 for many years now, and the vast majority of the boats doing it have had mostly good conditions altho'' usually with a rambunctious period given the autumnal wx patterns...but the occasional boat has been abandoned and crew members have been seriously injured. The occasional loss of boat and life has also occurred in the ARC runs (and also individual passages) from the Canaries to the Caribbean, considered by most folks to be a rolly, convective-laden but warm and relatively safe run. When you start with a relatively inexperienced (re: offshore sailing) crew and an untried (re: offshore conditions) boat, and add in wx variability, you already are operating with a mix of unknowns that represent a significant level of challenge. To add to the mix a boat which brings inherent design and build weaknesses (re: offshore use) is to roll the dice much further, IMO.
I don''t know what you mean by ''coastal cruising both sides of the Pacific'', as that would imply a Pacific circle, in which case a truly capable cruising boat would be essential for numerous reasons. I''m wondering if you mean ''both sides of Central America'', instead. I recently corresponded with a fellow who did that in a Catalina 34 (Glen Herman; email address can be found on C34 owner''s website; he essentially cruised from California to Florida via the Canal) because I was interested in his impressions of how his C34 held up. His remarks related far more to systems (DC power generation, watermaker, canvas and cockpit protection, anchor gear, etc.) than long sailing runs or sustained heavy weather (altho'' he did see windy conditions on occasion) and I think that''s typical of what ends up being the important issue when doing extended cruising...but in relatively small areas with many coastal or island stopovers.
I''m also not sure what you mean about design features which offset long periods in cold waters. Perhaps you could elaborate.
cruiser vs live-a-board
With all the good stuff on this thread, I''m still not sure where I would fit on the cruiser/liveaboard lifestyle continuum. My wife and I have decided we don''t care too much about earning the circumnavigation merit badge, and might find coastal cruising both sides of the Pacific more enjoyable and interesting. In that scenario we might have only one crossing in the ten years we hope to spend on the boat.
How does one weight the importance of that one passage in choosing the boat? And are there design features to minimize the risks of long periods of time spent in cold waters?
I''ve had so much good, helpful, and encouraging advice on sailnet. Thanks in advance. Dick
cruiser vs live-a-board
Unless something changed in the past few months I don''t believe that PC builds the Dana or any of the full length keel designs any longer.
cruiser vs live-a-board
You are correct, this picture is of Dana 24, with full keel. http://www.pacificseacraft.com/cgi-bin/printview.php?2414
There is nothing on their website about 31 & 34 but 37'' & up they spec a fin keel. I don''t know what made me think they were all full keel.
cruiser vs live-a-board
Actually, the Pacific Seacrafts currently in production are fin keel with a skeg hung rudders.
cruiser vs live-a-board
As far as the brokers & builders are concerned the only consistency I can find is the "horizontal surface suitable for sleeping" mentioned earlier. Catalina puts my 27 in their "Bay" category while a 31 is a "Cruiser". This seems based solely on size as the boats are about equally seaworthy. I always associated "liveaboard" as an attempt to describe a boat big enough to live on in some measure of comfort. The big difference is between boats built for speed (racing) and those built for comfort & safety (or something approaching them) while at sea. All sailboats are a compromise between the two, a "bluewater Cruiser" IMHO is probably a full keel design (like Pacific Seacraft) as opposed to fin keel, (I know there are plenty of circumnavigations with fin keels). I''m really reinforcing others in the post that the terms are a lot like Real Estate ads in that the seller will describe what he thinks potential buyers want, and the things that make a boat more pleasant at the dock are not necessarily the things you want in a boat that will be offshore a lot.
cruiser vs live-a-board
To me, cruising is about going places. Doesn''t matter if it''s offshore or coastal as long as you don''t have permanent docklines. An unending journey, so to speak. (Not that one can''t cruise for a specific time frame, but in a general sense, it''s the cruise, not the destination.) And living aboard is part of that.
IMHO, it''s the person that needs definition more than the boat. You can''t choose an appropriate boat, until you honestly define how you''ll use it. Not wishfully define, nor romantically define, but honestly. Once you do that, then put your finances in perspective, you have some useful parameters for searching.
The key, I think, is that "you" have to define yourself, not let someone else do it. And to remember, there''s nothing wrong with whatever definition you come to. You don''t have to sail to Tahiti to be a cruiser, nor do you have to be tied to the big fat yellow cord to be a live aboard. What you "have" to do, is enjoy whatever you''re doing, or why bother.
There is no perfect boat, only the boat that is right for how you''ll use it. Once you know that, you can buy the best one you can find.
Fair winds, and best of luck in your search,
cruiser vs live-a-board
Jeff and the group:
A while back I offered an informal hierarchy of cruising categories; damn if I can remember the detail of it now. But IMO that''s what''s lacking in any discussion about cruising boats...and I only reintroduce the notion because of the original post, asking about ''cruiser'' vs. ''liveaboard''.
As memory serves, I was trying to slice the cruising pie into the following categories:
A: Daysailing
B: Inshore, protected waters sailing with occasional coastal leg and/or occasional overnight, but close to shore and within a 24-36 hr wx f''cast window
C: Coastal to 1-2 day passages offshore, still within 48 hr wx f''cast window; Bahamas cruising, skirting the Gulf Coast Panhandle, jumping outside to skirt ICW sections, or SoCal Channel transit are examples
D: Offshore for a period in excess of solid wx f''cast period; examples might be returning to a SE or Mid-Atlantic U.S. port from Bahamas, a big leg enroute the Eastern Caribbean (e.g. Georgetown to Provo, T&C), or the first (longest) leg of the Baja Ha-Ha to Bahia Tortugas from San Diego.
E: Offshore for extended period (measured in weeks) with whatever seasonal wx patterns and convective nonsense that are typical
IMO Jeff''s definition of a ''cruiser'' best fits D and E passages. I (and probably everyone else here) would prefer making C passages on the ''cruiser'' type boat, but in reality would mostly (8 times out of 10) be fine doing them in the archetypical Morgan 41 liveaboard-type boat and not suffer the difference. Just about anything would suffice for A and B, not that we would object to a fine sail in a nice sailing sailboat.
The CE ''A'' rated boats we''ve had those tiring discussions about here in another thread are great for A, B and C runs, IMO. D is when one begins to seriously regret the absence of a truly functional galley, or decent seaberths, or when a head up in the bow of the boat causes one to haul the bucket out of the sail locker, or when shortening down sail requires more than just roller reefing a big genoa.
cruiser vs live-a-board
Jack, once again you inject a very thought provoking nuance to this discussion. To some extent you are exactly right about the definition of a ''cruiser''. This was was nudging at the back of my mind while I wrote my post. I found myself using terms like ''distance cruiser'', ''purpose built cruiser'' or ''serious cruiser'' to try to distinguish between boats that are intended to spend time offshore or cruise long distances vs boats that are more suitable as a liveaboard or a purpose built coastal cruiser. But really in the end I only danced around the issue that you so squarely raised, which of course is the on-going blurring of terms.
All to often I see terms like ''bluewater cruiser'' thrown casually about. All too often I see boats that are optimized for a comfortable trip down the ICW or over to the Bahamas called ''Bluewater'' or ''Offshore capable'' when many of the features that make a good offshore boat are absent. Very often I meet people who have years of coastal cruising under their belts who are disparaged for a lack of offshore experience as if that is the only mark of an experienced sailor. They are often disparaged by the so-called experienced cruisers who would no more jump offshore for three or four days rather than suffer a week or two of screwing around in the ICW. There is no right or wrong here and I am not sure that the offshore voyager is any more of a cruiser than the ICW passage maker but it does make it harder to define terms doesn''t it?
Good point Jack,
Best wishes,
cruiser vs live-a-board
A big missing piece in this fictional but functional ''cruiser vs. livaboard'' characterization is clarifying just what is meant by ''cruising''. While there are large regional differences in weather, living aboard nevertheless remains a fairly clear, constant picture in all our minds: one is aboard and afloat, suffers small spaces but hopefully offsetting positives in lifestyle, environs and perhaps that ''interim'' stage (if only a dream) between the 8-5 Rut and shoving off for good.
OTOH ''Cruising'', it seems to me, has been watered down to such an extent now that it''s meaningless when used as a modifier when discussing boats. (Did anyone else wince at the types of boats CW was featuring in their cover article on small cruising sailboats a few months ago? Apparently, a horizontal surface on which one can lie or place a camping stove makes a boat into a coastal cruiser).
If we use Jeff''s description as a template, it seems to me it fits more or less accurately depending on what definition of cruising we choose to use. E.g. one is truly labeled a seasoned cruiser who wanders up and down the ICW several times, perhaps at some point carefully loping 90 NM across to the Abacos (altho'' this may be trumpeted as "We were in the Caribbean this last winter..."). There are not many folks around my hometown who would hesitate to label that boat''s crew as cruising sailors, but in truth much of the Liveaboard side of Jeff''s template could be quite suitable for that kind of cruising (nor am I suggesting there is anythng wrong with it). In fact, 35-45'' trawlers - hardly seagoing vessels by and large and very much fitting within the Liveaboard category as Jeff describes it - manage in small numbers to occasionally find their way as far south as Trinidad or up the Rio Dulce. They do this mostly by moving in the weak seasons (late Spring and early Fall), smelling few roses, and tolerating lots of rolling.
So as much as Jeff''s template does an excellent job of laying out the continuum and differentiating between two conceptually different types of boats, much (I would claim ''most'') cruising falls into a more modest, compromise category...which, I believe, explains why there is such a huge market for compromise boats that offer liveable quarters and get away with claiming to be cruising capable.
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subset: commoncrawl


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Before Suspect's Capture, a Day on Lockdown
Transit Grinds to Near-Halt as Normally Bustling Streets Go Quiet and Workers Check In Remotely; 'It's Very Weird'
BOSTON—A week in which residents in and around this city were whipsawed by grief, fear, anger and uncertainty took a somewhat surreal turn as a dragnet for the surviving Boston Marathon bombing suspect effectively paralyzed the region until his capture late Friday.
After a bloody Thursday night punctuated by a shootout and police chase, area residents awoke Friday to a region on lockdown, with many ordered to stay indoors and not answer their doors for anyone but the police.
- Manhunt Ends With Capture
- WHAT WE KNOW: The Suspects, Miranda Rights, Watertown
- Miranda Laws Have Flexibility
- Life Unravels for Brothers
- A Young Officer Shot Dead, And Another Critically Hurt
- Call for More Video Cameras Spotlights Debate on Use
- Renewed Fears About Homegrown Terror Threat
- Chechen Terror Usually Aimed at Russia
- A Father Keeps Faith In His Sons
- Uncle 'Ashamed' of Alleged Bombers
- Attacks Enter Immigration Discussion
- Remembering MIT's Officer Collier
The Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority shut down the greater-Boston subway system, and Amtrak suspended rail service in and out of the city. The Federal Aviation Administration ordered a no-fly zone over parts of the area including Watertown, where the manhunt was centered, and police stopped cars at roadblocks as they entered Logan International Airport. Businesses were closed and taxi service suspended.
As helicopters buzzed overhead and thousands of law-enforcement officials scoured huge swaths of the region, residents hunkered down. Reports that police were looking for hidden pipe bombs and that they feared a violent confrontation with the suspect only added to the tension.
Residents who had spent most of the day behind bolted doors came out of their homes and burst into applause upon hearing the news that the 19-year-old suspect, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, was taken into custody Friday night. His older brother, 26-year-old Tamerlan Tsarnaev, was killed earlier in a confrontation with police in Watertown, Mass., according to a U.S. law-enforcement official.
Before the capture, the streets were quiet, with most shops and restaurants shuttered and dark. Police stood on every corner, holding long rifles and quizzing every driver and pedestrian about their intentions.
Map: Boston Area
See the locations of key incidents in the search for the suspects in the Boston Marathon bombings.
Terror in the U.S.
Review other major plots of terrorism on American soil.
In Boston's Kenmore Square, usually a hub of activity and noise, it was so quiet that leaves shaking in a gentle breeze could be heard. Only a handful of people ventured outside.
"I haven't seen it like this since the blizzard in February," said Lisa Horvath, a 32-year-old yoga instructor out for a brief walk with her German shepherd, Eli. "I don't want to be caught up in something stupid because I was dumb and went outside," she said.
Many financial firms operated with few people in the office or shut down altogether. Eaton Vance Corp. remained open, with employees working from home if they couldn't get in, a spokeswoman said. "We're leaving it up to people to decide what's best for them," she said.
More Video
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- Obama Hails Efforts Leading to Suspect's Capture
- Tip Led to Capture of Second Bombing Suspect
- Gov. Patrick Commends Efforts to Capture Suspect
- Mass. Police: 'We Have a Suspect in Custody '
- Ambulance Leaves Site of Captured Bombing Suspect
- Giuliani on the Boston Manhunt
- Suspects' Uncle Speaks Out
- State Officials Hold Press Conference
- FBI: Suspects From Chechnya, Russia
- Boston Suspect Is Killed in Shootout
- Shop Owner Recalls Bombing Suspects
- Witness Accounts From Shootout
- Video Footage From Watertown Shootout
- Boston Bombings Surveillance Video
Hospitals in the area, many of them still treating victims of the bombings, cautioned staffers and patients against leaving and delayed discharging patients. At Boston Children's Hospital, the disaster-control team secured the building's perimeter, according to Patricia Branowicki, vice president for medicine and patient services. Security guards from the night staff and Boston police manned every door, allowing no one in without ID.
Because many sick children would be without visitors, staffers called family members to reassure them their children were being well cared for. The hospital's entertainment team kept kids occupied with activities like air hockey.
In Newton, Mass., 53-year-old Ted Liberatos, who drives a truck for Anything Goes Removal Service, said a series of police officers pulled him over three times within a few miles to inspect the back of his truck.
"They're not taking any chances," Mr. Liberatos said. "It's very weird and a little scary."
Tom Kilduff, a U.S. Postal Service worker, arrived at work Friday morning only to find out the routes in the lockdown areas were canceled. Only about half of his fellow employees made it in. "It feels like the day after 9/11. Remember that? No one was out—it was like a ghost town," he said.
His co-worker, Mike Terrio, said he felt haunted by the look on the face of one of the suspects who allegedly dropped a bomb-filled backpack in the crowd during the marathon and walked away. The footage was played repeatedly on television news.
"The thing that's imprinted on my mind is his expression. There's just nothing there, nothing," he said. "How can you just drop a bomb in the middle of a crowd of young kids and walk away?"
Despite the lockdown orders, a crowd gathered at the police blockade set up near the suspects' home in Cambridge. One group took a photo, smiling in front of the police tape.
On nearby Cambridge Street, one of the few open stores, S&S Delicatessen, was serving emergency workers, residents and journalists. "In good times and difficult times people rely on us," said co-owner Gary Mitchell, 55. "We're a fabric of the community."
A scene that unfolded in Watertown on Friday morning illustrated the tense atmosphere. Police pulled over a car with four men in it, and within minutes, three dozen emergency vehicles had converged on the area along with a television news crew. It wasn't the suspect.
In his house a few hundred yards away, Joe O'Connell, a 29-year-old personal trainer, watched the television coverage and realized it was near his house. He and a few friends went to look.
Mr. O'Connell said he was standing about 100 feet away from the site of the second bomb blast at the marathon. Early Friday morning, the sounds of police chasing suspects into Watertown woke him up. Now, loud noises were making him flinch.
"I'm sick and tired of this," he said. "I've never been this jumpy. I just want it to end."
—Jennifer Smith,
Melinda Beck, Alison Fox
and Kirsten Grind
contributed to this article.
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text:
Click for "Microbes After Hours" videos
Don writes:
thank you all for sharing your knowledge in such a comprehensible manner. Thank you also for your stand against bureaucratic censorship in the H5N1 research, and your win. I have two questions. Is H5N1 a highly specific test for a human genotype/?phenotype, and if those who died of the disease were sequenced would that give a good estimate of the true risk for the rest of us? Question two concerns the genetic code, AGCT &U Are there reasons of physics or chemistry that make this the only way to archive information, or is it just Mr darwin"s best shot to date?. And why uracil is it a chip of an old rosetta stone? Again, thanks so much for your hard work and excellent podcast.
Gerald writes:
Hey TWIV-ites,
I'm a 32 year old, low-waged data-entry clerk without a college education and I've been unsure of what to do with my life over the past decade. It's not until I listened to science podcasts like TWIS and TWIV that I began to reevaluate what I want in life. Your podcasts jump started me into going back to college to get an Associate in Arts for Teaching Secondary (Biology) for High School or Middle School. Your engaging and insightful conversations gave me something worthwhile to strive for where otherwise I was a little lost. I thank all of you for the interesting conversations and for keeping it on a level that the general public can follow (for the most part). I'm particularly happy when Alan joins the group. I have always enjoyed his stark, careful logic when approaching a perspective or problem brought up in the program. Anyways, keep up the good work for us fans and I'll be listening down in Miami.
William writes:
Good day again TWiV Doctors,
The ethics statement in the Sim et al paper is geared more towards 1) the use of animals to maintain the colony outside of experimental infections, and 2) using the mice in the host seeking assay. The mosquitoes used in this study are a long colonized lab strain, and are typically maintained generation to generation by feeding on an animal, often a mouse, although chickens are also used.
Hope that this provides a little clarification,
Graduate Research Assistant
Department of Biology
New Mexico State University
Kevin writes:
Dr. Racaniello and compatriots,
Something that has come up again and again in discussion over things like chronic fatigue syndrome and influenza is *sampling* and the different medical measures considered.
I just saw a paper published by some computer security researchers at Microsoft who discuss some fundamental sampling problems. Their focus is computer crime statistics, but the problems described apply widely to other fields and make an interesting read:
(1) "a representative sample of the population doesn't give a representative picture of the surveyed quality"
(2) "outliers can cause catastrophic errors"
(3) "for rare phenomenon we are measuring a signal weaker than the noise in which it is embedded"
And it has a great title: "Sex, Lies and Cybercrime Surveys"
For what it's worth, I'd love it if you had an episode with some computer security folks, to chat about statistics, responsible vulnerability disclosure, and possibly also viruses.
Geoffrey writes:
How Many more Pieces of Biological Machinery Are Byproducts of Viral Infections?
To quote the narrator in the old Tootsie Pop commercials, "The world may never know.", but I would like to suggest that the venom genes in reptiles and platypuses are just such a mechanism. I admit that I know little about the evolution of the venom systems but a gene sequence search might just show some close matches with either viral or bacterial sequences. It would certainly be fun to find out, one way or the other.
Robin writes:
Dear TWIV team:
Podcast #179 was amazing. The wasp using integrated viral capsidization genes for a vehicle to deliver its own immunomodulatory genes to target caterpillar cells is Nature more imaginative than the best of science fiction. It compels a further rethinking of basic concepts as to what organisms really are. Cladograms of the tree of life overlook the fusion of mitochondrial lineage with an anaerobic lineage to produce eukaryotes. Viruses are para-organisms that alter properties of cells; their integration into cell lineages is a reminder that nucleic acids are the players and we are epi-epi-phenomena after several layers of emergence overlying them. That includes all of biology and all of what we call "civilisation"!
Tom writes:
Dear Dr. Racaniello and colleagues (sorry, couldn't think of a more clever TWiV appellation that hasn't already been used),
As always, I'm very grateful for the show. I have a small suggestion that might help spread TWiV to more people. Many sites and online articles use "buttons" to automatically create links that can be shared on social networking sites like facebook or social news sites like reddit. Reddit especially has a large community of science-appreciative lay folks just waiting to get infected by TWiV. These sharing buttons could appear at the header for each week's episode, along with the retweet button you already use. I would also suggest these for Alan Dove's blogs. His recent entry on bee colony collapse disorder was great, and it's the kind of thing that should be spread online to as many readers as possible.
Also, while I'm writing, I have to throw in my thoughts on the Fahrenheit/Celsius issue. I completely agree that we would all be better off using more of the metric system for weight, distance, etc. But, I'm very partial to the Fahrenheit scale for describing the weather. While zero to one hundred in Celsius perfectly describes the the range of temperatures we use in liquid water-based chemistry and biology, zero to one hundred in Fahrenheit neatly caps the extremes of temperature we experience in most weather. Hundred point scales make sense to me. It just depends on what you're describing.
Anyway, looking forward to your upcoming two hundredth episode benchmark. TWiV is a great show, and it's really influencing how science can be communicated.
Best regards,
Nina writes:
This question is not entirely to do with viruses, but I really enjoy your podcasts and couldn't think of anyone else who would have scientific theories.
I have been reading alot lately about two different topics. 1) how diet and stress impact epigenetic regulation and how, for example, a bad diet may impact gene regulation and lead to disease states. 2) The paleo diet (and other plans) that insist grains are bad for your health--mostly stating that since the eating of grain evolved only, say, 10,000 years ago, humans are not well equipped to digest and this can lead to poor disease states. I can't find any scientific evidence towards these last claims. It doesn't seem really logical. This would mean that any agricultural progress is not healthy for us? It does seem healthy to cut down sugar intake, especially all of these high carb beverages out there today, and to limit grains...but to cut these things out all together?
What is your scientific opinion on how what you eat impacts health. Can a bad diet lead to a higher susceptibility to a cold or maybe even cancer? What makes up a good diet? There seems to be so many opinions and non-scientific claims out there it's hard to discern fact from fiction.
Thanks for any thoughts on this!
David writes:
Since the topic of personal genomics has come up a few times lately, I thought this might be a good pick of the week. It is a Nova program on ethical and other questions raised by personal genomics. How ready are people to know their own genetic code? What would you do if you find out you are susceptible to heart disease? Or what would you do if your genes suggest you are not?
Josh writes:
Dear TWiV Doctors,
Here is my selection for a Listener Pick of the Week.
It's a 2009 editorial in Bioterror and Biosecurity, entitled the "Nuclearization of Biology is a Threat to Health and Security" by David R. Franz, Susan A. Ehrlich, Arturo Casadevall, Michael J. Imperiale, and Paul S. Keim.
Since Dr. Imperiale was on the show discussing these issues a few weeks ago, I thought it would be relevant.


text:
Dugu wrote:When I read the Sutras, I get the impression Buddha's Enlightenment is somehow higher in the sense he can see everything in completion as compare to Arahans. Why is that?
pilgrim wrote:My understanding is that the Buddha is a Samma-sambudha, a thoroughly perfected being whose achievement cannot be surpassed. In the process of becoming a Buddha , he destroys the 10 fetters that bind one to samsara.
An arahant has destroyed the 10 fetters only. That achievement is enough to stop rebirth in samsara, but an arahant does not have the other qualities of a samma-sambuddha.
CAVEAT LECTOR, reader beware. If you do not like 'high and mighty "greater than thou" undertone of the hairsplitting, jargon and transparent veneer of intellectual superiority [ego dressed up for night on the town]' do not read any further. If you do read further and get annoyed, that is your fault, so please do not share that with us. It is your fault, you were warned, so deal it.
-- Also, just a note, what is being present here concerns only the Pali suttas/Theravadin notion of the arahant. The idea of a arhathood as being sort of rest stop, of lesser attainment, on the way to being a bodhisattva/Buddhahood is not a Pali sutta/ Theravadin doctrine. It is a Mahayana doctrine, which I am not talking about.
Savant: 1) As I have stated in my earlier posts, traditional Theravada do teach that the Arhat, except for release from samsara, is lesser than the Buddha in many aspects.
And the Pali suttas make it quite clear that "release from samsara" is sambodhi, full awakening, a term used by the Buddha for himself and for arahants. And as the Buddha states:
'Through heedfulness have I won sambodhi, … 'If you, O monks, will struggle unremittingly and resolve … -- then you, too, O monks, will soon realize here and now, through your own direct knowledge, that unequaled goal of the holy life."' -- AN II ii 5.
In terms of awakening in the Pali suttas, the Buddha did not make a distinction.
Savant lectures:
When we talk about Theravada, it necessitates talking about the teachings of the tradition as a whole, including the commentaries written by great Theravadin elders of long past. Separating the teachings of the Theravadin Sangha from the Pali Canon, one would be branching off from the mainstream teachings of Theravada. Of course, everyone has the freedom to their own views, but one should not present the teachings of Theravada as such, since it is different. One is still Theravadin, but are such views coherent with the Pali Canon?
Interesting question. Some (rhetorical) interesting questions:
Is Ajahn Mun a Theravadin (assuming that the accounting of his awakening is how he actually experienced it), given that his awakening as described in the biography (hagiography) of him runs counter to the great Theravadin commentators of the past?
Is the late Bhikkhu Buddhadasa no longer to be considered Theravadin, given that he has questioned some significant Theravadin commentarial doctrines, including rebirth?
The Mahasi Sayadaw tradition of Burma differs in important ways from the Thai forest tradition, so which one is Theravadin and which is not?
Are the early Theravadin commentators to be rejected in favor of the later Theravadin commentators, given that they do not always see eye-to-eye on things, or do we favor the early commentators or the later ones?
Must the Pali suttas be read solely in light of the commentators to be Theravadin, and if so which commentators?
Must the commentarial tradition be adhered without question to be Theravadin?
Since when has the Theravada become a creedal religion?
Did the commentators always get it right?
Tilt has ignored a great deal of suttas that factually state the over-all attainment of an Arhat is lesser than the Buddha, except for liberation from Samsara.
Tilt certainly has not ignored anything. Again, "liberation from samsara" is sambodhi, full awakening, as the texts very clearly state. Let us not assume, however, later definitions of (sam)bodhi, awakening, are what the early texts are talking about.
Let me requote Bhikkhu Bodhi:
Later forms of Buddhism draw extreme distinctions between the Buddhas and the arahants, but in the Nikayas this distinction is not as sharp as one might expect if one takes the later texts as the benchmark of interpretation.
On the one hand, the Buddha is an arahant, as is evident from the standard verse of homage to the Blessed One; on the other, arahants are buddhas, in the sense that they have attainted full enlightenment, sambodhi, by awakening to the same truths that the Buddha himself realized. …
A Buddha has the function of discovering and expounding the path, and he also possesses a unique familiarity with the intricacies of the path not shared by his disciples. His disciples follow the path he reveals and attain enlightenment afterward, under his guidance. IN THE BUDDHA'S WORDS, trans by Bhikkhu Bodhi. Page 382.
I agree with this picture and what I have quoted supports it.
Savant: In the words of the Buddha, in terms of vision, insight, knowledge, virtue and wisdom, none of the Arhats are his equal.
Except in terms of sambodhi, full awakening. Now, there is an interesting text in this light:
I [the Buddha], monks dwell, having actualized here and now the higher knowledges [abinna], freed through the heart/mind [cetovimutti] and freed through wisdom [pa~n~navimutti]. Kassapa, too, monks, dwells having actualized here and now the higher knowledges, freed through the heart/mind and freed through wisdom. - SN II, 214
Now, the Buddha does not say his attainments are greater or that Kassapa's are lesser. The exact same language is being used, and this is not unique in the Pali suttas. If anything, it indicates equality in terms of what is listed.
What is of interest in this text is what precedes this passage. There are 15 items listed, with the above quoted item being the very last one listed, and it is the only one that is indicative of awakening. The first 9 have to do with the attainment of jhana meditation, the remaining six are the abhiññás (which are not exclusive to the Buddha). See:
http://www.palikanon.com/english/wtb/a/abhinna.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
• (1) magical powers (iddhi-vidha),
• (2) divine ear (dibba-sota),
• (3) penetration of the minds of others (ceto-pariya-ñána),
• (4) remembrance of former existences (pubbe-nivásánussati),
• (5) divine eye (dibba-cakkhu),
• (6) extinction of all cankers (ásavakkhaya).
Number six (#15 in the Kassapa list); however, is not worded in terms of the extinction of the cankers (asavas), in this list, but in terms of attainment of knowledge, liberation and wisdom. What the Buddha knows, Kassapa, too, knows (in terms of the destruction of the asavas and the Four Noble Truths).
The preceding 14 items are worded in this way:
"Bhikkhus, to whatever extent I [the Buddha] wish" to attain this jhana or know "with divine eye which is purified and surpasses human" the death and rebirth of being born into this or that state, I can. "Kassapa, too, to whatever extent he wishes" to attain this jhana or know "with divine eye which is purified and surpasses human" the death and rebirth of beings born into this or that state, he can. Sn II 210-14.
Again, a statement of equality.
Now, savant quotes the Gopakamoggallaana Sutta MN 108:
'Did we not tell you, brahmin, "there is no single bhikkhu, brahmin, who possesses in each & every way all those qualities that were possesses by Blessed One, accomplished and fully enlightened."'
What savant does not quote is the very next two sentences:
For the Blessed One was the arouser of the unarisen path, the begetter of the unbegotten path, the expounder of the unexpounded path, the knower of the path, the expert with regard to the path, adept at the path. And now his disciples follow the path and become endowed with it after him."
I have absolutely no problem with this; it mirrors very nicely the SammsambuddhaSutta:
At Saavatthi. "Bhikkhus, the Tathagata, the Arahant, the Perfectly Enlightened One, liberated by nonclinging through revulsion towards form (feeling, perception, volitional formations, and consciousness), through its fading away and cessation is called a perfectly Enlightened One. A bhikkhu liberated by wisdom, liberated by nonclinging through revulsion towards form (feeling, perception, volitional formations, and consciousness), through its fading away and cessation is called one liberated by wisdom.
Here we have an equivalency between the Buddha and the arahants in terms of attainment, and acknowledging this equivalency, the Buddha then asks:
Therein, bhikkhus, what is the distinction, what is the disparity, what is the difference between the Tathaagata, the Arahant, the Perfectly Enlightened One and a bhikkhu liberated by wisdom? ...
The Tathagata, monks, who, being Arahant, is fully awakened, it is he who causes a way to arise which has not arisen before; who proclaims a way not proclaimed before; who is a knower of a way, who understands a way, who is skilled in a way. And now, monks, his disciples are wayfarers who follow after him. That, monks, is the distinction, the specific feature which distinguished the Tathagata who, being arahant, is fully awakened, from the monk who is freed by insight. -- SN III 66.
Again as Bhikkhu Bodhi states:
On the one hand, the Buddha is an arahant, as is evident from the standard verse of homage to the Blessed One; on the other, arahants are buddhas, in the sense that they have attainted full enlightenment, sambodhi, by awakening to the same truths that the Buddha himself realized. …
A Buddha has the function of discovering and expounding the path, and he also possesses a unique familiarity with the intricacies of the path not shared by his disciples. His disciples follow the path he reveals and attain enlightenment afterward, under his guidance.
As I said, I agree with this.
Savant quotes the Sampasadaniya Sutta Digha Nikaya 28, but let us look at it in more detail the little snippet savant gives us:
Sariputta states: All those Arahant Buddhas [arahanto sammasambuddha] of the past attainted to sambodhi by abandoning the five hinderances, defilements of the mind which weaken understanding, having firmly established the four foundations of mindfulness, and realized the seven factors of awakening as they really are. All the Arahant Buddhas of the future will do likewise, and you, Lord, who are now the Arahant, fully-awakened Buddha, have done the same.
First thing worth noting is that the way of attainment of awakening/sambodhi, by Buddhas past present and future, described here is exactly what the Buddha taught as the path of practice to his followers – by abandoning the five hinderances, defilements of the mind which weaken understanding, having firmly established the four foundations of mindfulness, and realized the seven factors of awakening as they really are – none of which are unique to the Buddha, but describes the arahant path.
Secondly, sammasambuddha is used in this quote. The process of abandoning the five hindrances and the establishing the four foundations of mindfulness are the basic practices that the Buddha taught for the attainment of (sam)bodhi. It is obvious it is not the process of abandoning the five hindrances or the establishing the four foundations of mindfulness that distinguishes the Buddha, making him a Sammasambuddha. What makes a Sammasambuddha is, as outlined above, being the one who through his own efforts makes the way known.
And this brings us to:
"If, lord, anyone were to ask me: 'What then, friend Sariputta have there ever been in times gone by other recluses or brahmins greater or wiser as to Enlightenment than the Exalted One?'
I would say 'No.'
'What then, friend Sariputta, will there come in future times any other recluses or brahmins greater or wiser as to Enlightenment than the Exalted One?'
Thus asked, I would say 'No.'
'What then, friend Sariputta, is there Now any other recluse or brahmin greater or wiser as to Enlightenment than the Exalted One?' Thus asked, I would say 'No.'
Again, lord, if I were asked: 'What then, friend Sariputta have there been in times gone by ... will there be in future times other recluses or brahmins exactly the same as the Exalted One, in the matter of Enlightenment?' I would say 'Yes' ... But if I were asked: 'Is there now any recluse or brahmin exactly the same as the Exalted One, in the matter of Enlightenment?' I would say 'No.'
Again, lord, If I were asked: 'Why does the venerable Sariputta thus acknowledge the superiority of one teacher and not that of another?'
Thus asked, I would say: 'In the presence of the Exalted One have I heard him say and from him have received, that whereas in times gone by and in future times, there have been and will be other Supreme Buddhas exactly the same as himself in the matter of Enlightenment, yet that in one and same world system there should arise two Arahant Buddhas Supreme, the one neither before nor after the other: - that is impossible and unprecedented. That cannot be...'
(The underlined is what was quoted savant.)
Again, the issue here is the question of sammasambuddha, and what makes one a sammasambuddha. Since there can only be one sammasambuddha at a time, and since the process of abandoning the five hindrances and the establishing the four foundations of mindfulness are the basic practices that give rise to sambodhi for both the Buddha and the arahants, it is, as the Sammasambuddha Sutta clearly points out, it is in the attainment, discovery, of awakening first, everyone else follows after, so in that context the Buddha is unequaled.
If the Arhat and Buddha are the same, then there will be no need for Sumedha to take on Bodhisattva path.
But I never said that. What I have said, very clearly and repeatedly, is that, as the Buddha makes clear, there is no distinction in the sambodhi.
There is a very clear distinction, as the texts quoted above illustrate, in the one who first attains sambodhi and the ones who follow after. That has never been an issue for me. It is in the awakening that they stand as equals.
Let me quote Astroboy here:
The fully enlightened Buddha, the Pacceka Buddha and the savakas are all different kinds of arahants. Whether in Theravada or Mahayana a bodhisatta is training to be an arahant, an arahant who discovers the noble path by himself and not a disciple arahant. But before reaching this arahanthship even for the disciple arahants, they have to go through many lives accumulating merits through the practice of generosity etc., thus benefiting others.
According to Theravada only an arahant (whether fully enlightened/silent Buddha or disciple arahant) can truly show the path to liberation. Bodhisattas cannot as they have not reached it themselves yet. So only one who has reached enlightenemnt can really benefit other sentient beings in terms of showing them the way to enlightnement. However a bodhisatta has the greatest potential in benefiting living beings because he will achieve arahantship and teach the dhamma in a time when the Buddhadhamma is non existent and is most in need.
Now, whether or not this is accurate for the Mahayana is irrelevant. The point is that it is accurate for the Theravada.
Also, of interest, savant quotes the Buddhavamsa to support his contention, but if he is going to take that text seriously, it is really only those who are on the very verge of becoming an arahant, as was Sumedha, that can truly become bodhisattas, who have the true wisdom and motivation to do so, but it is not a necessity for all to do so, nor is it reasonably to be expected for all to do so, from the Theravadin point of view.
The bottom line here is that an arhat who has not really attained sambodhi equivalent to the Buddha's, but is on a lesser level, needing more work to be done, is not what the Pali suttas/Theravada mean when they talk about the arahant. The issue here is that the Theravadin/Pali suttas point of view is correct for the Theravada/Pali suttas, and the later Mahayana notions of the arhat are not a correct way of understanding the Pali suttas' descriptions of the arahant or Theravadin doctrine.
Bhikkhu Bodhi wrote:Thus the Buddha is distinguished from the arahant disciples, not
by some categorical difference in their respective attainments, but by his role: he is the first one in this historical epoch to attain liberation, and he serves as the incomparable guide in making known the way to liberation. He has skills in teaching that even the most capable of his disciples cannot match, but with regard to their world-transcending attainments, both the Buddha and the arahants are 'buddho', "enlightened," in that they have comprehended the truths that should be comprehended. They are both 'nibbuto', in that they have extinguished the defilements and thereby attained the peace of nirvâna. They are both 'suvimutto', fully liberated. They have fully understood the truth of suffering; they have abandoned craving, the origin of suffering; they have realized nirvâna, the cessation of suffering; and they have completed the practice of the noble eightfold path, the way leading to the cessation of suffering.
http://www.bodhimonastery.net/dhamma/bh ... dhasV2.pdf
pilgrim wrote:My understanding is that the Buddha is a Samma-sambudha, a thoroughly perfected being ...
Then Ven. Radha went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, having bowed down to him sat to one side. As he was sitting there he said to the Blessed One: "'A being,' lord. 'A being,' it's said. To what extent is one said to be 'a being'?"
"Any desire, passion, delight, or craving for form, Radha: when one is caught up (satta) there, tied up (visatta) there, one is said to be 'a being (satta).'
"Any desire, passion, delight, or craving for feeling... perception... fabrications... consciousness, Radha: when one is caught up there, tied up there, one is said to be 'a being.'"
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please fill in this short survey its only 3 questions long. thank you. x
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Done - interesting question!
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Took it, not sure why LOL.
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Be there as Arsenal take on Shakhtar Donetsk at the Donbas Arena
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Gas explosion levels building, injures 8 in Springfield, Mass.
Springfield Police Captain William Collins said the building, a gentleman's club, exploded about 5:25 p.m. as the gas company was looking for a leak under the road.
"The whole building is completely gone," Collins told Reuters by telephone. "The building was leveled ... there was extensive damage to a building across the street."
Eight people injured in the explosion were taken to Baystate Medical Center in Springfield, but none was in critical condition, said hospital spokesman Jane Albert.
The medical center did not expect to receive any more people injured in the explosion, Albert said.
Images on a local CBS affiliate showed buildings with shattered windows, debris scattered in the street, and emergency services entering the area.
A representative of the Columbia Gas company told television station 22News that two employees had been injured in the explosion, but were both expected to survive. Columbia Gas could not be reached for comment.
Witnesses described to local media a massive explosion that shook the ground and sent up a huge cloud of smoke.


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text: In honor of Valentine's Day, this one hour syndicated program has been making the rounds of local TV stations across the country for the last couple of weeks. Dorothy Hamill, Toller Cranston, and Brian Pockar star in this 1982 "ballet on ice". In all my years of recording skating, I don't think I have ever watched this one. Does anyone know any of the other skaters who were in it? Did anyone watch it?


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Durham's dazzling light display 'Lumiere' returned to the city last night for a weekend of lasers, colourful projections and neon artworks.
Click here to view the gallery
The third festival transformed the northern city into a magical wonderland with more than 25 conceptual light installations from around the world dotted around the market place, river and streets.
Artistic director Helen Marriage has promised "high octane excitement with moments of quiet contemplation, sprinkled with pure joyous fun".
Festival highlights include the larger-than-life 3D "Elephantastic" by French design studio Top'là and "Keyframes", a playful sculpture-animation in which LED stickmen miners take over what used to be the Durham Miners' Hall to the beat of a Durham Brass Band.
Ross Ashton's famous "Crown of Light" is back to illuminate the impressive façade of Durham Cathedral, while the interactive "Solar Equation" is a giant animated replica of the sun, exactly 100 million times smaller than the real thing. Using an accompanying iTunes app, viewers can disturb the animation in real time.
Other notable exhibits include Gina Czarnecki's projected artwork "I", Nathan Coley's futuristic sculpture "A Place Beyond Belief" and Beth J Ross' neon proverbs.
Lumiere drew an estimated 150,000 visitors in 2011, bringing economic benefits to the city worth £4.3 million. Even bigger crowds are expected this year, as the festival has extended opening times and introduced a free ticketed system during peak hours.Reuse content


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OMC I got diary pick and didn't even write a diary since I was Diary of the Day a few days ago! Thank you everyone for the congratulations and gifts but please save your zeelies for a more worthy occasion. Thank you again, I love you all!
Wow I got Diary of the Day, thanks diary lady!
I want to thank all my friends for all the gifts, pictures, Pmails and comments! I will thank each of you personally very soon.
I've been tagged by my friend Tony, so here goes. MOL
"Who are you really?"
I'm really a dog trapped in a cats body. MOL
1) Tell me your funny Christmas story.
Mom used to always put up a christmas tree but after a few years living with me she finally gave up.
This is the tree when she was done decorating it.
this is what it looked like after the first night.
2) Where's your favorite hiding place when playing hide and go seek?
That's my secret. ;)
3) What did you dream of being as a young kit?
I wanted to be a puppy!
4) What's your favorite hobby? Anything goes.
I LOVE shredding paper and boxes.
5) Whats your one "bad habit" that you love and your Mom hates?
Getting on the table and counter.
6) If you could go anywhere in the world where would you go?
I'd go outside. I'm not allowed to go out now.
7) What is your guilty pleasure? Food, skirts and suits or cars? What?
I love Gooberlicious dog treats.
8) What is your favorite make believe monster? And yes girls, unicorns and fairies are included. Post a pic of this mysterious beast.
Monster's are make believe? Who Knew! :-O
9) What is the one dreaded thing you have to do at home? Babysitting, taking baths, entertaining guests....what is your dread?
I have to share with my sister.
10) I'm not so sure if Zach and Zoe are going to have coed ships this year or not, but in any case, which ship would you want to be on: Zach's, or Zoe's?
I'd like to be on Zach's ship.
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R&R: Shabbat at the JCC
JCC in Manhattan
Until Sat Mar 15 2014
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Time Out says
Tue Jan 3 2012
Celebrate Purim with an afternoon of free fun at the JCC in Manhattan! While grownups enjoy activities like meditation sessions, film screenings and an cappella concerts, kids can join in on holiday–themed art projects, face painting, a Purim concert from Shira & Friends, an interactive Shpiel with Clown Professor Doink and other activities. All ages.
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Alright, mid April feels like as good a time as any to share a couple screenshots from my desktops. Both of them belong to Ubuntu 9.10 Karmic Koala installations:
A nice modern sleek look with shiny black panel and menus
I usually like to set up my desktops as clean as possible. In order to do so, I try to keep a balance between the desktop wallpaper and the icons on top. If the background is a busy picture, I try to keep it simple with icons, keeping their number to a handful. I also try to choose icons which stand out, mostly trying to find nice contrasts in colors. The screenshot above is a nice example of such balance.
A nice look at nature that feels fresh and relaxing
Once again, the screenshot above shows that balance I was talking about before. The background is busy already, so I kept it clean and grouped icons at the bottom, where they can stand out a bit more. The Magog White icon theme fits perfectly on the top panel.


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CHAPEL HILL, N.C. -- No. 1 North Carolina will conclude a seven-game homestand when the Tar Heels host UNC Wilmington Tuesday and Charlotte Wednesday at 6 p.m.
The Tar Heels are coming off a home sweep of Duke over the weekend and have won 14 straight games entering the midweek contests. A win will give Carolina 40 wins on the year for the 20th time in school history and the 11th time in the last 12 years.
Junior outfielder Parks Jordan paced the Tar Heels at the plate last week with a .615 batting average as he tallied a RBI in all five games and finished with five for the week. Jordan also reached base at a .700 clip on the week.
Senior right-hander Chris Munnelly will take the bump on Tuesday for the Tar Heels as he faced UNC Wilmington for the second time this season. Munnelly dazzled in his previous start against the Seahawks on April 3 in Wilmington. Munnelly surrendered just two hits in seven scoreless innings as he struck out eight.
The Seahawks enter with a 30-11 overall mark and have won nine of their last 10 coming into Tuesday's game. UNCW moved up to 23 in the lastest Baseball America rankings.
Left-hander Christian MacDonald will take the mound on Tuesday for the Seahawks and is 4-1 on the year with a 3.08 ERA.
Wednesday will see the Tar Heels welcome in Charlotte for the lone contest between the two clubs this season. The 49ers are 23-16 in 2013 after taking two fo three games from Xavier over the weekend.
Neither team has announced a starter.


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The Lakeland Fire Department (LFD) is proud to be able to honor veterans and recognize the many service men and women who have sacrificed very much in name of country and duty. The LFD employs many military veterans from all five branches of service and is excited to be able to participate in the upcoming Lakeland Veterans Day Parade, scheduled for Saturday, November 9, 2013 from 10:00 AM to 12:00 PM. Tower Truck 15 flanked by Fire Administration and Fire Fighting Personnel will lead the parade procession.
In addition to the departments participation in the parade, which has become an annual tradition, the LFD will also be participating in the Lakeland area Honor Flight reception scheduled for Tuesday, November 12, 2013 at 8:00 PM. The event is organized by the Polk County Veterans Council. The reception will be attended by community members, Polk County School's JROTC groups, former military personnel, community organizations like the fire department, and many others to welcome back area WWII veterans who will be returning from visiting the National World War II Memorial in Washington D.C. .
Particularly exciting is that two of LFD's very own, Lieutenant Harley Wilson and Driver-Engineer Kelvin Jones will be serving as a Guardians on this honor flight and have served as guardians on other flights before. Both are very involved with veteran related events and organizations as a way of giving back. Lt. Wilson served in the United States Navy. D/E Jones served in the United Stated Air Force and served multiple tours in the Gulf War.
Upon arrival the plane load of veterans will not only be greeted by the throngs of excited and thankful well-wishers but also by the LFD's Aircraft Rescue and Firefighting (ARFF) truck which will hose down the plane in an honorary gesture. The entire department is looking forward to participating in both the parade and Honor Flight reception. The public is welcome to attend and all LFD personnel are encouraged to participate.
For more information about the parade from the event organizer, please click here.
For more information about the Honor Flight reception from the event organizer, please click here.
For more information about the Honor Flight Network, please click here.


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Posted by James Staten on December 13, 2011
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If you are left handed, and shoot with the tank normally in your left shoulder, then reverse all the left/rights.
Onward then. Firstly – Non-modular, semi modular, and modular.
A non-modular vest is one that each pouch is permanently sown in place, and cannot be removed or altered. An example of this is the armotech vest below, or the BT battle vest . The advantages of a vest using this type of attachment are that it is simple, and very easy to use. No assembly required, bang it on and go play. However, if there's something you don't like about the vest – for example, if the radio pouch is too small, then there's little you can do it about, short of taking a pair of scissors, needle and thread to it.
Armotech vest, once owned by me. Pods in front (discussed lower down), and non-modular.
A semi modular vest is one that some pouches can be removed and interchanged, though the scope for this is limited. Such as the rap4 tactical ten vest, the pouches can be removed and reconfigured, using a Velcro attachment system. However, there are a limited number of these Velcro-backed pouches in production – it's by no means a standardised system. Another example is the flurry vest, on which some pouches are removable (again, Velcro attachment), and others are permanently sown on. Hence, semi-modular.
RAP4 TacTen - each panel is attached with velcro to the platfrom.
A truly modular vest, more commonly referred to as a MOLLE vest (which stands for Modular Lightweight Load-bearing Equipment), is one that uses a PALS webbing system to attach pouches to the vest. The finer points of this would take an entire thread in itself, so forgive me for taking the easy way out, and referring you to Wikipedia. The advantage of this system is that there is a limitless amount of configurations available. You can choose any MOLLE platform, from any manufacturer, and combine it with a huge range of pouches (literally, tens of thousands of options), and have a rig entirely assembled to your taste and preference. On the downside though, it rapidly gets expensive.
The horizontal lines are strips of fabric, which are sown to the vest via vertical stitching every 1.5 inches. There are vertical corresponding strips of fabric on the back of a MOLLE pouch, which are threaded behind the horizontal strips on the vest. See Tyger's video below for a visual demonstration.
So you've decided what type of vest you want to use. Now, what goes in all those exciting pouches and pockets? I'm talking as if you were playing a full-blown, two to seven day scenario, not 5v5 at a walkon or the like.
So joint first, comes paint and water. Some people will say water is all-important, but I disagree, plenty of people play big games here with just pod packs, and are fine. It does depend on your climate though; obviously water will be more important if you live in Oklahoma, than in wind-swept East Anglia. Paint, I can't really advise you on how much you need, it really depends on your style of play.
I personally carry my water in a camelback in a pouch on my vest, but you can use water bottles, waterpods, whatever, it's down to the individual.
After those two, prioritising becomes difficult. A radio, provided other people on your side are using them, is always a valuable asset. You can, in effect, become a team leader - if you can communicate with your chain of command, then everyone around you is in your hands. In your General wants an objective 500m south of your position taken, and you're the only one with a radio in the area, then it's up to you to get some guys together and have a crack at it.
I always carry a map of the game area with me, along with a compass if it's a big field. Obvious really, it's easy to get totally lost, and it makes it far easier to understand the strategic situation if you have an image in front of you to which you can refer.
I, personally find that smoke grenades are useful on the field, mainly if some entrenched target is putting up stiff resistance, and the attacking force (us) is getting bogged down. They're also good fun, and do make games more interesting. Not essential though.
Carry a swab with you, it's embarrassing to have to borrow one, and a barrel full of paint makes you useless as an offensive player.
ID tags/cards, if you're using them, put them somewhere easy to reach, but where they won't fall out.
Also on my vest I have a pouch for pistol magazines, I may do a thread about pistol use in the future, but this isn't the place. Anyway, if I'm using it, the mags will be in my vest. As will some 12gs. The pistol itself goes in a right-hand drop leg holster. My left leg is always clear, so if I'm sliding I don't crush anything.
Finally, I have a utility pouch that is normally empty, it's good for putting small objectives in, such as if you have to collect 'artefacts'/objectives from the field. Which once lead to my carrying around 6 bottles of 'diesel' in my vest, weighed me down a bit. However, that's a story for another day.
Some people take snacks onto the field, I personally don't. Unless there are in-field safe zones then don't bother, because you'll have to lift your mask to eat anything.
Where does it go?
You dirty minded bugger.
Paint – I always have my paint in pouches on my back. 5 pods, all with the lids downward, similar to a pod pack. I did once have a vest with the pods on the front, though I disliked it for two reasons. Firstly, it preventing me from bending easily at the waist – the rigid pods just in front of my midriff were getting in the way. Not ideal when trying to play bunkers tightly.
Secondly, it prevented me from crawling. If I didn't use completely solid pods (no flex in them), then all my paint would break, and it generally didn't feel too clever. The advantages were that you can easily see the pods, and get them back in their pouches. Personally, I can do that just as easily with the pods behind me. See the picture of my old Armotech vest at the very top.
Broadly speaking, with my MOLLE rig I always keep the space in front of me clear, so I can crawl. Everything is on the sides or back.
Myself at the tippmann challenge. You can just see some of my pouches on my RH side, deliberately set to the side that they are not in the way when my belt buckle is on the ground.
Water – Personally, in a camelbak. Waterpods and bottles are well and good, but you will either need to use a straw (which I would easily lose), or pour it through your mask grill. I've never tried the latter, but I can imagine it's less than ideal. If you do use a camelbak, put the hose over your left shoulder, so that you do not open the valve with your tank/stock when shooting.
In this picture of me, you can see the placement of my paint, with the camelbak beneath it (hence the bulge).
Radio – If you're right handed, put it on the left upper chest area (as close to the edge of the vest as possible). This is so it will not get in the way of your tank/stock, and will not be underneath you when crawling. If it's got a screen, it faces you (presuming it's in a pouch); this protects it from incoming paint, and means you only have to marginally slide it out of the pouch to see the display. Otherwise you will need to completely extract it and turn it through 180 degrees before you can see what's happening.
Grenades – If you're using them, and you're right handed, they go on the right hand side of the vest. You reload with your left hand, and throw with your right.
Swab – I fold mine in half, and stick it through the MOLLE loops on the top of my left hand shoulder, so I can quickly grab it with my right hand and get it into the gun. You could also carry it in a pocket or pouch, I've just found on top of the shoulder to be the best option for me. See the above picture of me, the swab is visible on my left shoulder.
Air tank – When running remote, I have a pouch on the back of my vest, above my paint, for my 68/45. It is horizontal, with the reg on the RH side, and the line run under my arm. Obvious really.
Pistol mags – In a pouch on the lower LH side. As said above, you load with your left hand. 12g's go in a pouch next to it, so that i can hold the pistol in my right hand, and (guess what) load the 12gs with my left.
If you have questions, then post them up. I shall extend this as i see fit, and when there is enough interest to warrant more information. This is very much a work in progress, hence the current erratic placement of pictures etc.
Edited by JJ GBR, 19 January 2011 - 03:24 PM.


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|Topic Review (Newest First)
|Be careful Gatordog---I don't think Hans is full grown yet.
Originally Posted by Chip18 View Post
Oh since prey birds are already in here.
Winter time maybe 5 years ago, it was so cold that the Bald Eagles came down one was setting on my back fence.
Gunther my BullMastiff/Pit (Tri colour 85 lbs)mix goes running out to charge the Eagle, go whatever, head back in the house.
Struddell the White Boxer 65 lbs and Boxer Slim starts to charge also! I spin around and scoop her!
I figured the Eagle was going to take off with with Gunther going after him, with Gunther charging him but Struddel ? I thought he might be a near sighted Eagle and mistake Stru for a skinny Sheep!
True in a good number of cases..but you ask for the health docs and certs on the parents.
Health testing provides the mere tip of the iceberg. Is the extended family healthy, sound & long lived? Do people return for a 2nd & 3rd pup from the breeder? If you contact previous owners, do they have mature adults rather than simply a cute pup purchased a few months back? Does the breeder instill confidence?
Friends laugh b/c one of the things I liked about Djibouti's breeder is that when I visited she showed me a 12 yo bitch with DM who had about 3 mo remaining before she needed to be pts. There are breeders who would have had her pts & then conveniently 'forgotten' she'd had DM.
Nor should people passively accept recommendations extolling popular breeders & kennels. Scratch the surface of these widely touted breeders. Beneath a beguiling surface & a ton of hype some are indeed golden. Others are dross.
Ultimately, there is no substitute to doing the research, thinking for yourself & choosing the dog that will make you & your family happy.
[QUOTE=Chip18;4893202]Welcome to the club![/QUOTE
Okay....that's just a great doggy pic....love it...what expression !!!
Originally Posted by alexg View Post
I haven't yet met a breeder who did not claim just that.
Originally Posted by shepherdmom View Post
It gets confusing actually there is a whole thread on it but whites and standards used to be the same but white is a fault and the SV in Germany refuses to register or even acknowledge that whites exist. They are allowed to be registered here with the AKC but then another group has gone a different direction and is breeding the Berger Blanc Suisse, or sometimes called the Swiss Shepherd and got it registered with the FCI.
Originally Posted by shepherdmom View Post
No what my 90# GSD is going to do is to deter the owl from swooping down to get my smaller dogs. Just as he deters the coyotes from coming into my yard. Because he is big and scary and no one wants to mess with him. Unless you are a kid or a puppy then he is a big teddy bear.
Winter time maybe 5 years ago, it was so cold that the Bald Eagles came down one was setting on my back fence.
Gunther my BullMastiff/Pit (Tri colour 85 lbs)mix goes running out to charge the Eagle, go whatever, head back in the house.
Struddell the White Boxer 65 lbs and Boxer Slim starts to charge also! I spin around and scoop her!
I figured the Eagle was going to take off with with Gunther going after him, with Gunther charging him but Struddel ? I thought he might be a near sighted Eagle and mistake Stru for a skinny Sheep!
|I do enjoy my big guys but it's health, longevity & temperament that I obsess about. IF I couldn't have had what I wanted in a bigger package then I would have gone with a smaller GSD.
|I love my bitches size. About 22-24 inches and 68-70 lbs. She does produce puppies that turn out larger than her though. Hoping to get a pup on the smaller size out of this litter (bred two days ago) to keep. The breed standard says its a medium size dog, not SUPER SIZED. I think Americans in general are obsessed with bigger things.
Originally Posted by RubyTuesday View Post
SuperG, I prefer bigger dogs. I just do & I always have, but no, I don't think they're better.
Do I prefer them? Yes.
Are they better for some tasks? Yes.
Are smaller GSDs a better choice for some jobs? Yes.
Do others have preferences different than my own? Yes.
Does that bother me? *raising eyebrows yet again*Ummm, no.
Is size the most important issue facing the breed? Hardly.
Is size a terribly important issue? IMO, no.
I originally was making an observation which is all too prevalent with many larger breed dog owners. This mentality I see expressed too often, revolves around this idea that the larger a certain breed is ( such as GSDs ) the more "superior" or a better specimen of the breed it is. I have no problems with small dogs or big dogs however I desire a larger breed dog for my own tastes....that is simply my "taste buds". To each their own is my mantra with many things in life. But this attitude of which I speak is evident at either end of the spectrum, witnessed by so many who almost seem letdown by the fact that their GSD is too small. I am sure you have read countless posts in this forum of GSD owners who are worried sick that their GSD isn't big enough as a puppy....this fretfulness has captured my quizzical attention equally. Prime example....post just popped up... Miniature German Shepherd I recently adopted a German Shepherd who was abandoned at my work. She was only 44lbs at the time. She has a small frame and is well proportioned. She is definitely full grown, aged between 3-6. The vet says she's in very good health and that she is just a really small gsd... She weighs over 48 lbs now but is still tiny for a German Shepherd but is definitely pure bred.
Does anyone have an idea on why she is so small?
I was just curious in nature as to why this emphasis is placed so heavily by some folks. This "curiosity" has led me to then wonder why the GSD has so many permutations as compared to most other breeds. One poster suggested this is what happens when a breed is super popular and a plethora of breeders is the result. I agree with the poster's assertion.
I am not suggesting that the desire to own a larger dog is somehow incorrect at any level. I do however believe that the allure of "BIG" by too many GSD owners is an interesting quandry when most every GSD owner is so concerned that their GSD is purebred.....purebred to what standards however?
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