text:
Pa. Voter ID Law On Hold Until After Presidential Election
Judge Robert Simpson ruled Tuesday that implementation of Pennsylvania's new Voter ID law be put on hold until after the Nov. 6 general election.
A judge ruled today that Pennsylvania's tough new Voter ID Law should be put on hold until after the Nov. 6 general election, according to an Associated Press report.
The ruling can be appealed to the state Supreme Court, which said it would expedite any further action in the case since Election Day is just five weeks away.
Do you agree with the ruling? Tell us in the comments section below.
Commonwealth Court Judge Robert Simpson heard two days of testimony last week, as directed by the Supreme Court, to determine whether the state has made it easy enough to get a photo ID in order to vote.
Opponents say the law, and the process to get an ID, disenfranchises voters. Supporters say the law will prevent voter fraud - but that justification sparked controversy when GOP state Rep. Mike Turzai said the law will allow Gov. Mitt Romney to win Pennsylvania.
Some political analysts called the voter fraud prevention argument "a sham."
Simpson based his decision on guidelines given to him days ago by the high court justices. He ordered the state not to enforce the photo ID requirement in this year's presidential election but will allow it to go into full effect next year.
One lawyer for the plaintiffs said it appeared to be a "win." Election workers will still be allowed to ask voters for a valid photo ID, but people without it can vote on a regular voting machine in the polling place and would not have to cast a provisional ballot or prove their identity to election officials after the election, according to this Huffington Post report.
A wave of new voter identification requirements has been approved in the past couple years, primarily by Republican-controlled Legislatures.
- The U.S. Supreme Court upheld Indiana's voter ID law in 2008
- Georgia's top court upheld that state's voter ID law
- A federal court panel struck down Texas' voter ID law
- The state court in Wisconsin has blocked its voter ID laws for now.
- The Justice Department cleared New Hampshire's voter ID law earlier this year
- A federal court is reviewing South Carolina's law
In Pennsylvania, the plaintiffs – a group of registered voters including a 90-year-old Doylestown woman, plus the Homeless Advocacy Project, the League of Women Voters of Pennsylvania and the Pennsylvania chapter of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) – sought to block the law from taking effect in this year's election as part of a wider challenge to its constitutionality.
The constitutionality of the law was not a question before Simpson.
Rather, the state Supreme Court ordered Simpson to stop the law if he thought anyone eligible would be unable to cast a ballot because of it or if he found the state had not complied with law's promise of providing liberal access to a photo ID that voters were required to show on Election Day.
Tuesday, Oct. 9, is the last day for Pennsylvanians to register to vote in the general election.
Simpson, of Nazareth, is a former Northampton County judge.
Obama Remorse
10:16 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Dictatorship of the Judiciary. Why bother having a democratically elected legislature?
ed r.
10:29 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Sorry that whole "checks and balances" thing gets in the way of your democracy. Oh...wait...
ed r.
10:34 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
10:54 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Because this democratically elected legislature is trying to make sure the next election isn't democratic. Its called checks and balances. The right continues to pretend to defend the Constitution while trying to undermine it.
Hal Dudash
1:13 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
forget democracy - what we have is a oligarchy - rule by the upper classes - thanks to Citizens United. Actually, I am all for voter registration - one can't actually have a democracy without a good census. On the other hand, voter ID should be something everyone (remember them?) has access to. State driver's licencing is not easily found in urban centers. Once we determine this, we need to have people vote anywhere and it being electronically counted in their local district.
Jack Minster
3:41 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Activist judge legislating from the bench and passing the buck. Why have lawmaking bodies representing the majority, but then give final authority to single individuals with their own personal biases? Smart people break issues down into their simplest facts: We must show photo ID to TSA in airports; we show photo ID to get into government buildings and courts. What is the difference with showing photo ID to perform this, most basic interaction with our government? If you are qualified to vote, prove it. If you aren't, go get qualified. The arguments about immobile elderly who cannot obtain a photo ID are false. If a person is elderly and previously registered to vote, she can submit an absentee ballot application with the last four digits of her SS#, and still vote. If someone reached advanced age and now decides to start voting, never before registered, he can do so now, or after, this Election. Meanwhile thanks to Judge Simpson, we can count on another round of students voting both in their college towns and back here in Perk Valley, and other voter fraud I see here every Election. Some here suggest that this law is political. I disagree. This law is practical and overdue. This law passed months ago and provided plenty of time to take effect. Today's decision, to use the words of the law's sponsor, is "skewed in favor of the lazy who refuse to exercise the necessary work ethic to meet the commonsense requirements to obtain an acceptable photo ID." Amen.
K. McDonald
9:02 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
What dictatorship? And our democracy isn't that the majority takes all, our democracy is that we protect the rights of minorities as well -- otherwise, CA would have a lot more Senators than WY.
And keep in mind -- there was no voter fraud that was presented to the Court -- no prosecution of voter fraud presented to the Court.
And I don't recall Corbett running on changing the voter registration laws.
Jack Minster
9:32 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
The USSR had a democratically elected system of government - you learned this where, Moscow U? That statement wins 2012's "Most Ridiculous Comment" award. I don't mean to be rude but seriously. It's not even worth trying to enlighten you. Best of luck, God bless you.
Marc L.
10:18 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I think this is the best solution. I agree that a Voter ID law SHOULD be in effect, but I think that the plan that was pushed through by the GOP was short-sighted (see the way that the IDs issues by the nursing home in PA are valid because of a potential loophole) and was obviously rushed through in order to cause a problem for certain voters in November. By taking the time to make sure that a reliable system is in place, the sort of fraud that they were looking to prevent can be prevented. I'm glad that a law will be put into place and I'm equally glad that a thrown-together law will not prevent legal voters from casting their ballots next month.
ed r.
10:31 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
"Republican House Majority Leader Mike Turzai made waves in June when he said at the Republican State Committee meeting that the voter ID law "is going to allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania."
That right there alone is enough reason to be suspicious of the law. Regardless of which side may say it, something like that is a HUGE red flag
SWT Resident
10:56 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Marc.....well said. I am all for voter photo ID. BUT....lets put it in place correctly. I am really surprised that the Republican caucus didn't offer to pay $4M dollars out of the $100M their private bank is sitting on in taxpayer money to cover the costs of implementing this thrown together plan. THAT would have been worse than the obvious Mike Turzai comment that blew this thing up in the Republicans face.
Frances Stein
10:57 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yes, thank you for leaving a common sense response.
Tina Fitzpatrick
11:43 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Exactly. I'm not against voter ID, I am against any law that is put in place for political gain. Putting off this decision until after the November election allows for a rational discussion of the issue including whether or not voter fraud is even an issue in Pennsylvania.
Mary Beth O.
12:50 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I agree with you all of you and is how I have felt all along ... just seemed to be such a rush to push this through. It will take more than a few months to get all of this together.
Publius 2.0
1:55 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Excellent, well thought out comments here under Marc's post.
12:11 pm on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
I couldn't agree more. A voter ID law in principle has some merit, but this iteration was a rush job voted in strictly based on party for a stated goal of potentially "engineering" the upcoming presidential election. It essence it was designed to do exactly what it was supposed to prevent in "qualifying" voters.
I am no authority on the law, but it seems to me just the expiration date requirement is a problem for some voters such as the elderly that may have had a PA photo driver's license, but it's expired because they no longer drive. There also are other photo ID's like Bucks' new Veteran ID card. Has a photo but no expiration date. Why can't it be accepted? Sorry, this law was too narrow and not well-thought-out from the get-go, and was right to be enjoined by the Judge. Take the time, get it right and then there will be no problem with it.
10:18 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
What a disaster. Guess we'll have the New Black Panthers armed with billy clubs patrolling the streets of Philadelphia and polling places again, too.
Hey Dems -- vote early and vote often!
Illegals -- step right up!
Meanwhile, Obama is making it very difficult for those who are serving our country to vote! Shameless.
ed r.
10:37 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
"Oh yea! I remember hearing about the black panthers patrolling streets with billy clubs on all the legitimate news services" said no rational person ever.
I think I know your agenda. Perhaps you can write about about "your struggle", and work to find some sort of "final solution" to deal with the voting issues. Hmmm?
10:44 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
BOTH of those Panthers really scared off the white vote .... in a DEMOCRATIC DISTRICT...where they were voting for OBAMA !!
Frances Stein
10:54 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
What are you talking about? This is not President Obama's doing. Get your facts straight. This is from the Republican side.
Either way, this law can be implemented later. Tough luck, Righties! Guess your voter suppression tactic won't work in PA.
OBAMA/BIDEN all.the.way.
Robert Fiorentino
11:17 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Are you saying it's a disaster because more black people will be allowed to vote? The fact that you acknowledge the racism in this law and still support it is a little shameful.
12:21 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mary, Your right I saw the actual pictures and followed the story right up until the AG, Obama's AG refused to press charges...seems to me that we have one set of rules where certain folks pick which will be enforced !!
WILFREDO G. SALCEDO, Sr.
12:43 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I told you so...Sorry to gloat but it's the right thing to do...This is all concocted by Republicans to try to win elections in a sleazy way...Five swing States, NV, CO, VA, NC, FL cancelled their registration process when it was discovered that it was another GOP shenanigans to disenfranchise Democratic voters...This ugly tactic was supposed to disallow all registrants who say they are for Obama...These guys don't play nice...Good thing they were exposed and told to pack up...Lordy, what will they think of next.
Morgan King
3:30 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mary, did those guys not have a valid Photo ID? Or is that a completely different issue?
Dave Hoag
4:00 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mary, as usual, you're repeating propaganda gibberish from John Birch blogs that has absolutely no basis in fact.
Obama has been working to make it easier for the armed forces to vote. The Romney campaign and the GOP has tried to make it more difficult by filing suit to block new laws expanding voting access for troops serving our country. Fortunately, the Romney/GOP attempt was defeated in Ohio.
Coach Clark
10:20 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Why be sure voters are legit until after the the election?
Another insane ruling by the liberal-biased judiciary.
Morgan King
10:55 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Because cross-referencing their stated name and address with the local registration lists has worked for decades, with virtually no indication that in-person voter fraud was happening, and that this law's rush to implementation was going to lose more legitimate votes than it was going to prevent fraudulent ones? I'm fine with Voter ID being required down the road, but let's make sure everybody's got one first.
12:51 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
While we're at it, we should pass a law that disallows Martians from voting. Sure, it's not a problem, but what if, some day, it might possibly become one. We should definitely pass a law right now. Even if it DOES harm the abilities of some actual Americans to vote.
Tony Campisi
6:49 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Liberal-biased judiciary! There you go again Coach! Judge Robert Simpson is a Republican.
Stan Sarnocinski
10:20 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
We need ID for everything we do. But lets get it right so everyone can vote thats eligible to.
SWT Resident
11:06 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Stan...I hear that all the time: we need ID for everything. BUT...how many of those that ask for photo ID have the LEGAL authority to do so? Very few. Most times it is procedure or policy...not a legal requirement. I always challenge those that ask me for a photo ID and less than 10% have held their ground where I absolutely had to produce it (hunting and fishing license, alcohol, as examples. Most times my simple verbal address confirmation suits their needs. Handing over your photo ID is one step below giving out your SS number in todays world. By allowing someone to copy your photo ID you are handing over your birth date, your physical address, your middle name, your organ donor status, etc. What if that info got into the wrong hands from someone at a bank, for example, that also had access to know that you had a large amount of money? Hope you have an alarm system installed in your home. And a gun. Don't be giving in to those that ask...do you have identification?....your response should be why do you need it? and...can I give you my home address as ID? You would be surprised how many times not handing over your photo ID will NOT be required when the requester is challenged.
Robert Fiorentino
11:20 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Not only that, but you have to have a perfect, unexpired, current address the same, same last name (even if you changed it for marriage) ID. That rules out a lot of students whose IDs expire, women who get their name changed after marriage, and seniors whose licenses expired. What a coincidence, the democratic base!
Dave Hoag
4:04 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Did you show a photo ID before you wrote that comment here? Of course not. Free speech is a constitutional right. Do you show a photo ID before you pray or go to church? Of course not. Freedom of religion is a constitutional right.
We do not need a photo ID to exercise any of our constitutional rights, including voting.
8:53 am on Sunday, October 7, 2012
Yes we need ID for all most everything, but He did the right thing by makiing them wait. It is so much Identity Theft out there, because half of the time people do not even look at the ID. How many people in the Gov. show ID for anything, so the law would not have been for the Gov., are anyone that can sign to make a change in the law.
11:57 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
So God would help those vote for a President who believe that killing the unborn is birth control? I heard him say with my own ears at a Planned Parenthood fundraiser that he would not want his daughter punished by having a child. He is not Godly. If you cannot protect the unborn who are innocent, then you have no right trying to protect the rest of us. Yes, the wars under Bush ....well guess what, every single one of those men and women signed up for the paycheck to serve and defend. They chose it. Ask them who they would prefer to serve under. I would bet it would be overwhelminingly (though not 100%) Republicans. I would NEVER vote for a Republican who was not against abortion either. So, Divine....I doubt it....more like MONEY came through from the right person.
Morgan King
1:23 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Did the killed Iraqi and Afghani civilians 'sign up for it' any more than the people in the World Trade Center? When does innocence begin and end?
Anthony Wayne
3:36 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
@ anonymous, Active duty military has spoken loud and clear and already voted with their pocketbooks. The candidate who has raised the most money from active duty military personal, more than double the amount raised by all other candidates combined, was and is Dr Ron Paul, the Peace candidate. Speaks volumes.
Bruce Haines
10:23 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Good outcome for the Commonwealth. There was absolutely no evidence that in-person voter fraud was even close to an issue, so it is sad in the face of stringent budget cuts even a dollar of the state budget was wasted on this law and trying get people IDs. Still, if we are to have it, there is clearly no urgency to put it into effect within the next month given all the hurdles and changes the state has made in trying to get ID to disenfranchised voters. Waiting a year has no downside and huge upside in terms of not denying older, poorer and sicker citizens the right to vote.
Phil Goldstein
10:23 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
As it should be. This is a victory for the voters of PA and a slap in the face to our Governor whose attempt to suppress voter turnout was a joke. There is NO voter fraud. If you're looking for that, see what the Republicans did in Florida and other states. And were caught red-handed doing it.
Daniel Pipes
10:51 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No voter fraud? How do you think Obama was elected. Does anyone remember ACORN?
10:57 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Daniel, please please tell me what ACORN did and how they committed voter fraud?
ed r.
11:02 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No Daniel, I don't remember. How about refresh our collective memory and cite some verifiable news sources? I'll be waiting patiently.
Robert Fiorentino
11:21 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I like how this guys talks about Obama stealing the election. Does he not remember the two Bush stolen elections? Hanging chads and all that?
12:08 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Only an attempt to weed out Illegals and folks with 10 Welfare ID's
3:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Amy, the story you cite has to do with voter REGISTRATION fraud; not VOTER fraud. There is a huge difference. No one is elected to office by having a lot of people registered to vote.
Daniel Pipes
4:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
ED ROPER this cup of kool aid is for you. http://www.rottenacorn.com/activityMap.html
Kaari Burrows Davies
10:24 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This ruling will please a lot of dead democrat voters!
10:55 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Really? Like who? Can you substantiate your comment with a fact? Would love to know who is on that list. Peace.
10:58 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Kaarl the attorney generals office of PA stipulated in a court filing they had no evidence of voter fraud in PA or anywhere nationally that this law would address. You need facts to make claims, not old right wing wives tales.
Robert Fiorentino
11:23 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I know it's a real shame. Those 2 or 3 dead people who vote in the election. How many people do you really think go through all that extra effort to cast a measly one extra vote? People have better things to do with their time, as evidenced by the low voter turnout rate.
11:10 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Wallst pay attention and maybe you will learn something! 1. "A judge ruled" keep passing it around till someone rules on it? 2. Yea that's democracy alright. 3. Another empty chair. 4. As always, you libs ignore reality, facts, and truth, and you constantly lie to yourself and others. No rational person would vote in this election for the liberal, leftist, socialist, communist man child. 5. No worries I see a red state in November. 6. Sad to say I'm a 60's registered democrat? Go figure.
Publius 2.0
3:58 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
RW62, I'm a liberal/progressive and I'm very proud to be one. All the great men in history were liberals: Madison, Jefferson, Hamilton, Jay, Lincoln, Washington, Franklin, Roosevelt, Teddy R (Progressive), Kennedy, Johnson, Clinton, Obama, Clinton (2016). We are voting and the Dems will carry PA by 12 points. As a result, when you get sick due to your age, you will have healthcare and social security. So, please remember to thank us for saving you from your own stupidity.
Liz Doyle
10:28 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I am glad that some sanity has been demonstrated about a spurious attempt to prevent voters from exercising their right to vote in a critical presidential election. There has been no evidence of any previous voter fraud to have warranted this ridiculous policy other than to make it extremely difficult to allow a fair and open election.
Bill N.
10:30 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mary: Your comment seeps of ignorance and bigotry, as not one single case of 'voter-fraud' was ever cited by the GOP as justification for pushing the law through the system. However, just last week the GOP in the contentious state of Florida was caught adding tens of thousands of obviously fraudulent voter registrations into the system.
Ronnie DelBacco
11:15 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
It was an outside firm hired by the GOP and just as quickly fired by them when they learned of the crime.
Dave Hoag
4:07 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
That's not the case Ronnie. The firm in question had a long history of dubious practices. It was well documented.
careless fills
1:10 pm on Friday, October 5, 2012
sounds like the type of fraud that could be countered bt a voter id law when these voters show up
10:33 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Another victory for voter fraud.It's too hard to get an ID,please cut the CRAP.You know what, you had close to a year to get your ID, and if your to damn dumb to be able to get an ID then GOOD, I don't want you voting anyway. Well, now the Dems can have more dead people vote.Go get booze without ID, get a library card without ID. Voting is the most important thing you can do as a citizen, and to not have to show who you are is insane.
Impeach Judge Simpson for disregarding what has been voted into law. And please, spare me your remarks about disenfranchisement , thats crap and you know it.And again please don't bring up,oh, there have been no cases of voter fraud, WHO HAS BEEN in charge of the big cities where it all happens? THINK .Democrat or Republican why would you not want people to prove who they are before they vote?
Morgan King
10:59 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
PennDot didn't have free IDs for voting available until August 31, 2012 - they've only been available for 62 days. Voting is the most important thing you can do as a citizen, and we've successfully done it, give or take, for centuries without requiring an ID. If we're going to make that change, let's take the time to roll it out properly.
SWT Resident
12:33 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Morgan...well said. I would think this time next year when we've had a year to outfit every eligible and legal voter with the proper ID...half these comments would not be here. Mine wouldn't.
Glenn Smith
10:33 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
People have had 9 MONTHS to get ID. Should we also stop people from producing ID when cashing checks, when checking in at the airport, when buying alcohol at the state store and so on? It seems they have ID's for these more common situations. I'm going to Washington DC on a trip this weekend. I need ID to get into parts of the tour. Obama is and will continue to ruin this country.
10:34 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I do not agree with the ruling. We need I.D. for everything we do these days. Why not our vting rights?
Those who say there is no voting fraud--- wake up. Ask your College students if they sent in an absentee vote, and then vote again @ school. Ask the unfortunate homeless how much $$ they werer given to vote for a certain party? Ask the nursing home resident etc.etc.
We need to pray for Divine Intervention!
10:59 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You state that "we need I.D. for everything we do these days."
Everything? Really? I think that is a bit of a stretch.
Where is your *proof* of your comment? Where is the lists showing those people who committed fraud? Where is it?
Nowhere - that's where.
SWT Resident
11:16 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Margaret....you only need to provide a photo ID as is required by law. Purchase of alcohol when requested, purchase of PA hunting or fishing license to prove residency, when stopped by a police officer upon command, etc. are such examples. I don't ever remember seeing a law written that says I have to show my photo ID to my doctor as a requirement for being seen. That is for their convenience. There is a difference between law and policy. People are so use to handing over ANY ID upon request and because of this it will be the next scam downfall in this country. Crooks love to know where you live and your age. It makes it much easier to rob your home when you are away. Stop being a sheeple and stand up for yourself. NO ONE has the right to see your photo ID UNLESS required by law. Not by THEIR policy. LAW. Period.
Robert Fiorentino
11:25 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I think it's safe to say if you ask any college student if they did that, 99.9% would say "NO" and be telling the truth. Divine intervention's already here. Your scammy Republicans are going to have to try to win the election the old fashioned way, based on issues and personality. So basically, you're screwed.
Dave Hoag
4:08 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Did you show a photo ID before you wrote that comment here? Of course not. Free speech is a constitutional right. Do you show a photo ID before you pray or go to church? Of course not. Freedom of religion is a constitutional right.
We do not need a photo ID to exercise any of our constitutional rights, including voting.
Trish Dudas
7:49 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
If you have to provide ID to prove residency for hunting and fishing, why not to vote?
SWT Resident
12:40 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Trish...hunting and fishing is not a Constitutional right by law. It can be taken away for infractions...as can voting in PA (which is a bunch of crap as far as I am concerned but that is another subject). Still...voting is a right that can not be denied to the law abiding legal citizen in PA. And to have to pay to to garner an ID required to vote (and this is still up in the air yet as people have paid to get a copy of their legal birth cert in order to get their voter ID) is akin to a voter tax which was outlawed many years ago. This whole law is a grey area which needs time to settle. THAT is what we are fighting for: time. Do it right or don't so it at all. WHICH is the way that Judge Simpson called his decision. Any doubt...it is wrong. Voting is way to sensitive of an act to be handled like a auto inspection.
Trish Dudas
7:39 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@SWT Resident: you do have to be a legal resident and registered to vote in order to exercise your right to vote, true. We should be required to prove our identiy and current address to prove we are still a resident. There is a long list of acceptable ID's available to use as proof, not just a valid driver liscense. The public only heard that it had to be a valid driver's liscense because that was the most difficult to obtain. I am chuckling at all the arguments here. The Dems are accusing us of trying to run this thru before the election in order to change the outcome and the expense that the Republicans went to to fight it. The Dems trying equally as hard to stop it for the same exact reasons and spent money to fight this too. While it is our Constituanal right to vote, that right is for legal residents who are registered. In this day and age, unfortunately, we should be required to prove it.
Amend Wun
10:37 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Finally, an example where logic prevails in this over heated, and increasingly hostile political climate. Hopefully, rulings like this will reduce the political shenanigans occurring during this election cycle.
10:38 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This is very welcomed news and a right decision. We do need some voter Id requiremnets, but not jamed in for a Presidential election.
10:39 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You have to prove who you are to perform our most sacred duty, voting. What a concept to be a citizen. There is no politics with this thought, just reason and logic, which we have somehow lost!
SWT Resident
12:46 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Charlie...why are the Republicans pushing so hard for this voter ID 3 months before a major election? I don't mind showing my ID to vote by any means. But having it jammed down the throats of what is estimated to be 1M PA voters who have little time to prepare...and with a State Dept. that can't move fast enough and is totally unprepared as many PENNDOT licensing center employees have commented...I don't see the harm in waiting until next year until the entire law is reviewed and vetted into law. No matter who wins the next Presidential election...the 99% taxpayers lose anyway. Its a time issue Charlie. Give people the time to ramp up. Give the state time to do it right. After that...when all eligible legal voters have had their fair chance...ID the he11 out of us. No problem.
Debbie MacAdams
10:39 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Sadly, we've seen how the number of "our votes" means nothing in these elections. The ultimate vote is that of the Electoral College. It won't make a difference either way.
Marc L.
10:41 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
My guess is that the reaction here from the political right is just a taste of what their reaction is going to sound like on the morning of November 7th.
10:49 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Got that right, Marc. Romney is certainly going to lose anyway, and the republicans are going to go into a firestorm of rage as they always do. Republicans are such SORE losers.
Ryan F.
11:26 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Anybody remember the liberal firestorm after the 2000 election? You want to talk about sore losers??? Of course not, the Democrats conveniently overlook that.
Publius 2.0
3:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ryan, what should Democrats overlook? The fact that their candidate received more votes than the fellow who was coronated by the Supreme Court? Or, perhaps the fact that the coronated failure of a president so botched national security and was so blinded by ideology that he allowed our money-center, our defense center and our courageous citizens to be attacked and killed by terrorists despite express warnings of that attack one month earlier? Or, perhaps that he then proceeded to lie to the nation and waste precious talent and tressure on a stupid misadventure into a war with a nation that had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11. Or, perhaps that his administration and party then embarked on a "go to the mall" spending spree and ownership society that encouraged debt and turned a suplus into an $11 trillion debt and the worst financial crisis since 1929? Or, perhaps that this same discredited philosophy and thinking is precisely what the GOP's current nominee believes. Yes, if we overlook all those facts, then we too could be real deserving idiots and repeat the same mistakes we just lived through.
Ryan F.
3:42 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ever hear about the Electoral College, idiot? Maybe you should do some research on it first. The candidate receiving the most popular votes doesn't always win, that's how our system is set up. I wasn't referring to Bush's presidency...just the way he was elected. But while we're at it, here are the problems with Obama's presidency so far. How about the fact that he wanted to try terrorists in downtown NYC rather than in military tribunals? How about his Attorney General withholding documents relating to Fast and Furious? How about the massive increase in federal debt under his watch? What about the huge increase in dependency and food stamp enrollment? What does it say about a president when he won't meet with world leaders at the UN, but rather will instead appear on talk shows? What does it say about a president who does not respect the First Amendment and wants to ban a video from being displayed on Youtube? How about a president who lies to the American public about a clear terrorist attack on our embassy? What does it say about a president who wants to appease the Muslim world and not show any strength through power? What does it say about a president who wants to work around Congress to get things done when this is clearly unconstitutional? What does it say about a president when he wants to jam burdensome regulations through Congress without requiring Congress to read and approve of it first? Does that sound like a president you would vote for?
Publius 2.0
4:11 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yes, I truly believe the terrorists should be tried by courts here. I also believe Congress has no right to executive documents in an ongoing criminal investigation. And, I believe the debt needs to be increased NOW by a lot more so we can prime the pump for growth and get people back to work. Because interest rates are at an all time low and we can grow our way out of the debt, we will reduce the deficit in the long run by paying it back with inflated dollars by encouraging needed inflation NOW. Also, I find it truly funny that conservatives want the President to meet with leaders at the UN when they were calling for the destruction and defunding of the UN a little more than a year ago. I'm 100% certain that the President did not "lie" about the tragedy at the consulate in Libya, nor would he want to. As for "foodstamps," the largest benefactor of that program is, of course, American farmers, who receive a 10 for 1 subsidy based directly on the size of that program. So, may I suggest you do some reading of your own. Also, there are some fine Community Colleges you could attend to broaden your self-evidently limited education.
Trish Dudas
7:55 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
@Publius 2.0: all the planning for 9/11 was done during the Clinton Administration. President Bush was left to clean up the mess.
10:48 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
ANYONE who does not see this timetable as a cheap political dirty trick is being played. SURE, ID is fine... require it in 2012. These people affected are not flying or renting cars. They are the old, sick, poor and disabled who were being disenfranchised. Not everyone can afford to take off a day of work to drive their 90 year old mom the PennDot and cool her heels for four hours. Not everyone can put their hands on a birth certificate. Not everyone has utility bills sent in their names. This was SO outrageous, it made me ashamed to be a Pennsylvanian.
Ronnie DelBacco
10:53 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
There are 49 other states (or as Obama believes, 56 other states).
Pick one and move.
Those of us who are proud Pennsylvanians will gladly stay through the ups and downs.
Ronnie DelBacco
10:48 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This WILL NOT stop the complaining from the left about the law. After the election the same democrats who complained about it's "timing" will continue to complain. This delay only drags out the debate. Even those who say they agree with the law, but want more time will complain no matter how much more time is given after this election.
10:56 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I've got a better idea... Why don't YOU move ?? Maybe to Iran, where you'll be among like minded people ?
11:01 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
So you believe that only the *left* is complaining about the "law"? Pretty short-sighted if you ask me.
SWT Resident
12:00 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I think you are wrong there Ronnie. I have been one of the biggest opponents to this law because the Republicans planned it short-sighted on purpose. They saw an opportunity in a predominately Democratic state to disenfranchise predominately Democratic voters...and they jumped on it. To cap matters...a top chief Republican blew the lid off it all with a stupid comment (Mike Turzai) and let the cat out of the bag. THAT is what has people angered. Next year when the law is passed properly and people have time to get their ID's etc...things will quiet down. Romney won't be in office...but things will quiet down.
11:03 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Merri I encourage you to take your dog and cat to vote on election day. Since they don't need ID surely dogs and cats can vote now, like they have in the past?
Are you a complete idiot?
Robert Fiorentino
11:29 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Haha @Nick. These Republicans really are idiots. Hey Merri, dogs and cats can vote and evolution & global warming are total myths! A woman's body has a way to shut down "legitimate rape". I can't believe we have a major party in this country that has such a low value for intelligence.
SWT Resident
12:02 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No Nick...not a complete idiot. She owns a cat and a dog. That says something for her at least. A complete idiot would let their cat or dog drive them to the polls and tell them to keep the car running for her.
Adam Fifth
3:48 am on Friday, October 5, 2012
So can my dead Uncle Harry, who seems to always vote Democratic!
Amy Callagy
10:49 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
How many years have we voted without that requirement???? And its urgent now, why???
John Albertson
11:12 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
It is urgent now because without it, Williard goes from having little chance of winning Pa to not a snowballs chance in h.ell. The republicans forced this law through with the knowledge that if the blacks, latinos, poor, elderly, etc... were allowed to vote, then they would lose.
Robert Fiorentino
11:32 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Because it's the last chance Republicans have before the country's demographics shift to primarily Democratic! The extreme right views of Fox News and leading Republicans do not represent the views of most of this country. The party needs to come closer to the middle if they want any chance of surviving.
SWT Resident
12:54 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Robert...well said. I have been a Republican voter for many years. And Romney, Ryan, the entire party...turns me off. They need to readjust and get a real grasp on reality. We've got a real problem in this country...a real problem. These guys are living in fantasy land behind their taxpayer salaries and pensions. ALL of them. Both parties. I see a major revolution on our future in the next decade or two. Kids coming out of college...no jobs. And kids behind them...not a chance. Greed bred this problem. Our elected officials have so insulated themselves from the real world they have no idea of the pain that is coming. Its all but guaranteed to blow up in their faces. The Justice dept. did the right thing in purchasing 700,00 rounds of ammo 3 months ago. I think they will need it.
K Burns
10:50 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I agree with the ruling. Too much paperwork to collect and a poor person working two jobs it's not easy. Had to get birth cert. from New Castle, then figure out when to go to get the id where I wouldn't lose too many hours. It has been proven that there is not an issue of voter fraud in Pennsylvania and the only reason this was made a law is because the Republicans want to silence the poor. Well, I will be voting come hell or high water. Obama/Biden 2012~
John C. Nagle
10:50 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The article is not accurate. Voter ID is not on hold till after the Election, Only the part about Provisional Ballots is postponed. And these are paper ballots which are not counted on election day and are subject to tampering.
Kyle Bagenstose
11:07 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I believe this is just a question of semantics. From my understanding, you are correct that the judge found voters would be disenfranchised through the provisional ballot process, not because of the entirety of the law. However, because of that determination, Judge Simpson filed an injunction that will effectively allow voters without proper ID to vote, thus putting the "voter ID requirement" on hold through the fall election.
John C. Nagle
11:50 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I just read through the decision and found the detail. Basically we are going back to the "transition period" that we had during the primary and allowing folks to vote without an ID
Bill Star
10:51 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Well, it looks like we were able to shoo away the little Jim Crow for another year.
10:51 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I really don't understand the problem with the voter ID. People have known about this for a long time and had plenty of time to get FREE ID cards if they did not have a drivers license, passport, school id etc...you have to have ID to buy your beer or alcohol or even cigarettes and they seem to have it when it comes to that but apparently it is WRONG to have it to vote...seems like a double standard to me...it has nothing to do with democrats or republicans it is about who is eligible to vote and who is not and keeping things honest...I know a stretch for anything political!
11:07 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I purchase beer and alcohol and never asked for ID. I purchase cigarettes and never asked for ID.
Besides, to whom are you referring when you state "they seem to have it when it comes to that"?
Who is *they"? Peace
Morgan King
11:19 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Free IDs have only been available from PennDot since the end of August:
12:58 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Hey AntKaren, the reason you "don't understand the problem" is clearly because you seem to think all anyone has to do is produce a photo of themselves. There are specific mandates that are required to be on those ID's. - Obviously, you have computer access, it would do you well to educate yourself on the details of the law.
Dave Staiger
10:52 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Unbelievable ! We are asked for ID for far more less important things and not to ask for ID for the Presidential election ??????? I wonder what this Judge's political affiliation is, HUM, let me guess.........................
Frances Stein
10:56 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I've been voting for 40 years now and my voter card and signature were sufficient.
No reason to change a good system unless you're in the business of voter suppression.
Guess the Right will have to come up with another plan to block President Obama's reelection.
Marc L.
10:57 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
He's the same judge who upheld the law before the State Supreme Court looked at it and sent it back to him. It's like the replacement refs making a bad call and the folks from the NFL's officiating committee up in the booth calls down and tells them to take a look at the play again under the hood. His political affiliation has nothing to do with it. He didn't throw out the law. He merely declared that it needs to be re-evaluated after the election because there isn't enough time to make sure everyone who needs a valid ID has one. The State Supreme Court will have to look at this ruling once more (which I would guess they will uphold).
11:26 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The same judge was for it before he was against it.
It went back to him after the Pa Supreme Court threw it back at him.
Precedents in many other states about the unconstitutionality and thinly-veiled Jim Crow ramifications showed him the error of his ways. Why don't people read?
George Hall
10:54 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I agree with Bruce. Voter fraud was never an issue here. This was a complete waste of time and money and it was designed to take people minds off of more important issues.
10:54 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Good decision. While voter fraud is not acceptable no matter which side it helps, this law was an obvious last-minute ploy to give the state of Pennsylvania's electoral college votes to the party representing the "haves."
It was a cynical bet that the "have nots" could not get picture id in time for the election as many would probably not have known how to get one. As also, many would find out the day of the election when they got to their usual polling location.
Thank God there is still some sanity and fairness in our judicial system. Today, having lived here nearly 10 years and as a former lifelong New Jerseyan I am proud to be a Pennsylvanian.
Ryan F.
11:35 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
With thinking like this, there's no wonder why our country is headed down the toilet under Obama. I guess someone buys right into the 99% v. 1% argument advocated by OWS and the President.
10:54 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
While I have an ID and no real issue with the law passing, the timing of it was just blatant attempt to bully voters and impact THIS election. With no ACTUAL proof of voter fraud in the past, its attempt to remove a certain population. You do need an ID for just about everything, but not everyone does just about everything. Plenty of people choose
- not to drive
- not to write checks
- not to travel
- don't have utilities in their name
- not to drink
So these people now have to deal with these new changes? Did the state send out a letter to every registered voter to let them know? Just cause you can spend hours at the DMV waiting for a new ID, doesn't mean everyone can. This country isn't McDonalds or Burger King. Its not about getting it your way. Its getting it so its fair and it works for the entire population.
They want this law so bad, lets see how much it gets pushed for in 2013.
Mohandus Frieri
11:04 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Don't forget buying and watching pornography, smoking cigarettes, borrowing library books, picking up a prescription and all of those other constitutionally guaranteed rights.
SWT Resident
12:16 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Woah woah woah Mohandus....where exactly does it say in the law that I MUST show ID to watch porn? Or borrow a library book? Or even pick up a script of antibiotics? This is where the misconception in the requirement of photo ID begins; people not understanding the difference between law and policy. There are few times a photo ID is required and those times are set by law...law passed by the Commonwealth after debate and examination. Not policy. Policy can only be enforced by denial of service by the vendor. A Vendor can deny me service because I am wearing a blue shirt if he wants to. He can't legally if I am black, He can throw me out of his store for not wearing shoes and socks and legally if he does not he is breaking the law. The biggest misconception in the understanding between law and policy when it comes to providing photo ID. That is where the problem is with all this. People just simply accept it when someone says...let me see your photo ID. My response if I feel it is not a legal request is always: for what reason??
Mohandus Frieri
6:09 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
More right-wing madness. If you want to watch porn, you have to produce ID.
Frances Stein
10:55 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Most excellent decision. This allows for time for people who have difficulties acquiring photo ID to get it without causing voter suppression. People have died for our right to vote! Bless them, and get out the vote!
10:58 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Even if 1000X more people did not get caught, it would not have a statistical effect.
"...A major probe by the Justice Department between 2002 and 2007 failed to prosecute a single person for going to the polls and impersonating an eligible voter, which the anti-fraud laws are supposedly designed to stop. Out of the 300 million votes cast in that period, federal prosecutors convicted only 86 people for voter fraud – and many of the cases involved immigrants and former felons who were simply unaware of their ineligibility. A much-hyped investigation in Wisconsin, meanwhile, led to the prosecution of only .0007 percent of the local electorate for alleged voter fraud..."
10:59 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
for those of us that want voter id....Put a the voting booths in Doctors offices....because its FEDERAL LAW (thanks to obamacare) that you MUST SHOW A PHOTO I D WHEN SEEING A DOCTOR OR HOSPITAL.
Mohandus Frieri
11:02 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Now we can fire up armadas of buses filled with negros, latinos, asians, mental patients, poor and homeless people, as well as elderly and raid the election polling places to push the big D button.
But before we do that we have to rig all the pre-election polls so that we can mask the fact most Americans feel Mitt Romney is a brilliant candidate for president who possesses all the qualities and characteristics of the leader of the Western world.
Yikes!!! Look out for all the bobo's coming out of their closets.
11:41 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Good ideas! Thanks. I forgot all about picking up those mental patients. You got your pass?
Mariska van Aalst
11:10 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
If you do not have a driver's license, in order to get a PennDOT photo ID, you have to collect your original birth certificate (with certified stamp), social security card, and two documents (lease, mortgage, utility bill--that's IF your name is on those bills), then take the bus or get a ride to the DMV, all while spending several days off from work collecting all of these documents. How many people can afford to do this? This measure pretends to "protect" a fundamental American right that has *never* been threatened by voter fraud (but certainly has been threatened by voter intimidation!). The incidence of voter fraud has been proven in one 1 in 15 MILLION voters, which is significantly less likely than the odds of any one of us becoming president of the US (1 in 10 million). What could PA have done with the millions of dollars spent on this campaign alone....? Voter suppression by any other name.
May the best man win!
David Curran
11:11 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Excellent decision by the judge, but the issue is still not dead. I think the taxpayers should demand to know how much money the foolish spendthrift R's have wasted on this clearly poorly thought out piece of legislation. What a bunch of hypocrites. I won't forget who voted for this on Election Day, even if I do forget my voter ID. :)
mary kushner
11:13 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Having a voter id to prove who you say you are and something I have to pull out of my wallet everyday to do just about everything will disenfrsnchise voters. Give me a break. Not to mention needing photo id to get into the democratic convention. For the small amount of people it would actually affect , they could have gotten id's at this point. Cheating is what the democratic party is about.
Morgan King
11:46 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The usefulness of a photo ID to prove identity was never the premise of this debate. It's about ensuring everyone with the right to vote could do so without obstruction.
SWT Resident
12:24 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Morgan...you opened up what is called a double headed coin debate. We discussed this many times within focus groups and some said...the law was designed to preserve and protect the legal right to vote for those that were qualified to do so. Others said the law was designed to keep those who do not have the legal right to vote from voting. This goes back in history as the glass half empty - glass half full debate which to this day has never been settled. In fact it has been explained better from a psychological view as dependent on the person's view point as to the condition of the glass and many doctors will ask this question as a base line for their patients.
To add to the dilemma...those that are suspicious of government (like myself) offered a third option: to disenfranchise, or make it extremely difficult to follow through and vote, as many voters as possible from one party or another. It so happens PA is 1M people leaning Democratic and JUST so happens the author of the Voter ID Law were the Republicans. What a quandary. Its called: a perfect storm.
Morgan King
1:02 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
That's an interesting way of framing it - I'm going to have to think about that. Thanks for posting it. On first blush, it seems like this law can only actually address the latter of those. Isn't the former interpretation only protecting the right to vote for those were qualified AND could meet the conditions of the law?
I was just countering the argument that 'but you need an ID for cigarettes and even to get into the democratic convention' by pointing out that we aren't actually discussing whether or not a photo ID is an effective way to prove your identity. This issue is, on both sides, at least in theory, about what is actually promoting the most accurate vote, right?
What focus groups were discussing this? That sounds fun.
SWT Resident
1:15 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Morgan....as you can see from the debate raging on this post header...you have dead-fast what I assume is Republicans fighting for the voter ID law. Yet...why do they fight for it? Because they want to replace Pres Obama with a Republican candidate who they HOPE will do a better job at running this nation? But many are what I consider ninnys and have no idea what government is about and don't understand....government has NO idea how to run a nation. Government is a 'cost' to the taxpayers. Government produces noting towards our GNP. Government takes away from our GNP and to add insult to injury...they pizz our money away with little to no return. That is the bones truth. No matter who wins...the taxpayer pays. Its either pay now...or pay later. This nation is done. We are over the hump and heading down the other side. Greed in this nation by those that can buy an elected official has done us in. Bethlehem Steel...the greatest steel manuf in the world...gone. So are 100,000+ good paying jobs. China owns that now. The list is hundreds of companies deep. We've got a bigger problem now then we ever had. The voters have totally lost control of this nation. With the Supreme Court decision that ANY entity can bank roll an election....we lost man. We voters are done. We taxpayers are done. The ONLY hope we have is coming together as a nation and taking it back...with force if necessary. And here we sit and fight about voter ID's. Pfffttt. Its exactly what the parties want.
SWT Resident
1:27 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
And Morgan..on the flip side you have dead-fast Democrats fighting for what they believe is disenfranchising Democratic voters. Those that are low income, legal aliens, etc. Those that by definition are considered the 47%...beholding to the government for help. He11...the government and our elected officials are the ones that created beholding voters to begin with with their policies, give aways, special tax programs, etc. Our government decided who was going to be rich and who was going to be poor by policies enacted and bank rolled by special interest groups. Yes...any man can be a millionaire in this nation many will say. If you don't inherit it you need 'help' with it. What better way than to buy a government? This nation has bigger problems than showing a flippin ID to vote. This nation needs its people to come together on policy and force the issue with government. Romney can stand up and say...I will create jobs! He is so full or crap his suit is brown. Obama can promise everyone health care until the end of the earth. HIS suit is brown too. While we are listening to the BS these guys are shoveling, they are getting 4% COLA's every year, next to free health care, GUARANTEED PENSIONS, car allowances, car insurance, $160 a day per diems, and the list of 'politician created benefits" goes on. I ask you: who is really robbing this nation blind? The black man in center city Allentown collecting welfare when he can work? The bank CEO sending his millions to Aruba? No. Guess?
truth seeker
11:18 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Judge Simpson is a Republican: http://articles.mcall.com/2012-07-28/news/mc-pa-voter-id-supreme-court-20120727_1_voter-id-law-voter-identification-ellen-mattleman-kaplan
The majoriy of the PA Supreme Court is Republican. This still got overtunred.
Same thing with their attempts to delay the special elections last April and the reapportionment map they put together
Mike Turzai - voter ID passed which will allow Romney to win PA: Done. Now it's undone Mike.
How about we put the nasty politics aside and govern. Maybe it's time to slam the PA state GOP.
careless fills
11:57 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Your data seems like it is good proof that PA's Republican judges are open-minded, as are the Republican appointed SCOTUS justices Kennedy, Roberts, as well as O'Connor (ex) and Souter (ex), to name a few!
Chuck Rohrbach
11:19 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
They have to make sure Obama gets elected first, After all, we need four more years of "transparency". Ya wanna drive a car, get a license, ya wanna vote, get an ID.
Chuck Rohrbach
1:20 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No driving a car is not a "Constitutional right" , but, I have defended the right to vote by serving my country in the military and law enforcement. The ID is to be certain that those who do have the right vote are not impeded by those who do not have the right to vote, by those being in this country illegally. An illegal vote cancels out a legal vote and to many people have died fighting for that right to allow this to happen. This is nothing more than a ploy by the left to get Obama re-elected...call it what is...election fixing
Morgan King
2:27 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You, and those that have died fighting, defended the right to vote for legal voters who don't have state-issued photo IDs with current expiration dates, too. If non-citizens are voting (are they?) that's a problem with voter registration lists - if those are being ignored by poll workers, why would they not also ignore an ID?
Mike Shortall
11:21 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Thank God ... I mean WHO could possibly get a valid ID in ONLY 7 months?!? Simply unheard of!!
So now you need an ID to buy beer, buy cigarettes (assuming you don't "look" qualified), buy a gun ... But at least we'll still allow ANYONE to vote, whether here legally or not, whether dead or alive, etc.
FLASH ... The same people who claimed it was "impossible" to comply with such an "unreasonable requirement" will still be complaining about it next year, in 2016, in 2044 ... Anyone who really wanted an ID could have gotten one of the numerous ones authorized, but it's just a little too much WORK for some. (And no, I'm not speaking of the elderly or the disabled, so save the drama for your momma.)
Some things just never change.
I sure hope they don't make an ID part of the requirement to benefit from the Affordable Care Act, 'cause they'll be a lot of people dying in the streets ... either that or we'll have an 18-month delay getting driver IDs renewed because suddenly all the slackers will realize how EASY it is to get an ID!
SWT Resident
11:37 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mike....registering to vote today based on current laws to do so still has plenty of safeguards in place. You make it sound as if a boat load of Africans can dock in at NJ and be bussed to Philly to vote...get back on their board and leave for Africa. That is the furthest from the truth. And too many people are blowing this whole thing way out of proportion for a myriad of reasons. I have voted continuously for the past 30+ years and at least 6 or 7 times have seen people from my community that could not vote because they moved in and did not bother to register in that voting district. It was their simple oversight. There are safe guards in place and they are actively used as required.
Marc L.
11:49 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mike: The government seemed to be much more involved and the warning to the public as well as the assistance offered was significantly greater when all we were talking about was Network TV moving from analog to digital. All those who are opposed to the ID law are asking for is time to get it done and get it done right. No one is saying that this law should not EVER come to pass. Just that it should be done correctly to avoid leaving anyone out who deserves to cast a vote.
SWT Resident
12:34 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Thank you, Marc. I agree whole-heartedly. I will support the law WHEN it is allowed to go through the entire vetting process, allows time to be implemented, is paid for, and double checks to make sure...make absolutely sure...those that can legally vote and are entitled to vote...can vote. Until then...this law will not get my support.
Mike Shortall
1:43 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Marc: There wasn't a day I could pick up a newspaper or go on-line and not see a story on the voter ID law or a change implemented by the Commonwealth to make the law easier to comply with. Seriously ... To say there wasn't enough information out there is mind-boggling.
SWT: It would be so simple to do EXACTLY what you just dreamed up without having to resort to the "boatload of Africans" scenario. All you need is one or two insiders at the polling place ... Not a very far-fetched scenario at all in places like Philly. You could pull up a busload of people, have a list of names (recent deaths, known shut-ins, people in prison, in nursing homes, in the military). Give each person off the bus a name to vote under. The insiders at the poll wink and nod as the imposter signs the book, and viola' ... Four more years! It's simply naive to believe this wasn't possible or hasn't happened in some form in the past already.
Marc L.
1:53 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Mike: And that's why every polling place has a minority clerk as well as a majority clerk along with the Judge. Both political parties are to be represented at every polling place. So if you're saying a payoff is all that it takes then -- sure, hypothetically it could happen. But that could ALSO happen with an ID law in place, so your point is moot.
Mike Shortall
3:06 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Wrong, Marc ... All I had to do was demonstrate that it COULD happen. And, do you really think a Republican poll watcher in some parts of Philly would have a chance of standing their ground?
SWT Resident
1:44 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Mike...you spell out a very good point. IF things happen the way you illustrate...then we are no better than a third world county. IF that is what voting for an elected official in this nation has come to...I want no part of the process. I realize politics in this nation has fallen to its knees. Anyone who can't see that is living in a hut. Pregnant chads in FL. Republicans jamming through a 'law' on very short notice that the 6th most populice state out of 50 in the nation can not handle...we've got problems in this Commonwealth. Three simple words solve it: Commonwealth Constitutional Convention. Put the people back in charge of their money, their elected officials, their livelihood. Its beyond what everyone on here is fighting about. We're being robbed blind...of out futures...our childrens futures...by people who have crated their OWN idea of government serving the people. When is the last time WE, the PEOPLE, were asked by government what we thought? What laws should be passed? Referendum no longer exists. Why? THEY made it that way. Look how many elected officials are sitting in a taxpayer funded jail because they were caught. Little do people know...the taxpayer funded both to prosecute AND defend those elected officials. And we want to re-elect or elect these people? AND many will get out with a taxpayer funded pension! This nation...this Commonwealth need a serious enema. And many worry about what...possibly 8 or 10 illegal votes?
Dana Grubb
11:25 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Good for the ruling, and very sad for America that much of the rhetoric is hateful; and that personal photo IDs and security cameras are everywhere. Didn't an entire generation of free people fight the Second World War against this kind of world. The so-called defenders of the US Constitution who call for voter ID due to rampant fraud, which is negligible at best, at the same time feel it's okay to erode the personal freedom and liberty of the American people. What the heck is happening to our country? What's next; checkpoints where you must produce your papers?
Ryan F.
11:43 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I suppose your next thought would have been to assume that those of us who dare to oppose Obama are all racists too. Exactly, how does requiring someone to show ID to vote eroding their personal freedom and liberty? I'd really like to know.
Dana Grubb
9:59 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Ryan, I don't know if you know me or not, but I didn't mention the President and certainly did not infer anything about racism. Your blind accusation is part of the problem in this country. You do not know my thought process on this at all, yet want to tell me and others what it is anyway. Why do you feel that you must you go on the attack?
If I took the same approach as you just did, I might say that you've got some sort of a chip on your shoulder; that you appear hateful; or that you believe the current form of government in America should be overthrown and turned into something that's acceptable to you. But, I won't do that because I respect your and everyone else's opinions even if we disagree. I won't put words in your mouth, so please don't attempt to put words in mine.
As for the need to verify who I am at the polls or anywhere else, my word that I am who I say I am should be sufficient in America or any free society. Sadly, since 9-11, more and more people have become mistrustful and more demanding of individual verification. I didn't say I don't understand the call for photo IDs, I said it's a very sad commentary on the America of today.
Dana Grubb
10:00 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Finally, when I registered to vote, and each time since then that I've moved and had to change my polling location, I received an updated Voters Certificate of Registration card from the county of my residence. Why isn't that sufficient? And, certainly after voting for twelve years at the same polling place, by now those poll workers should certainly know who I am, especially since I've never missed voting in my life and they are residents in my voting district whom I know.
Mohandus Frieri
11:30 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Gee Matt, how did we get by the first 233 years of our country without voter ID?????
Who's the "useful idiot"?
SWT Resident
11:30 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I really don't think a single person here has an issue with the anticipated outcome of this law....IF it is implemented in a lawfully, correct, and timely manner. Right now it has been so watered down to try and get as many people voter ID's as possible within the alloted time before the election that is has become dangerously weak. Big mistake. It got to the point that I could have just about used my dogs urine sample for a picture ID. Do the law right...allow enough time for ALL voters to comply...and we'll be happy. It is as simple as that.
Next up: illegal immigration enforcement - hand it over to the individual states to help better enforce this new voter ID law. Will it happen? Probably not. The Republicans will then lose all their $1.50 an hour illegal laborers.
Ryan F.
11:47 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Do you really feel that Republicans only have or use illegal laborers? Give me a break.
SWT Resident
11:51 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No Ryan...but you were the first one to jump on that hook so that tells me what I need to know about you.
Ryan F.
11:55 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You can assume whatever you want, but you know what happens when you assume? I didn't jump on any hook, but I was merely thinking of the typical liberal talking points.
Ryan F.
12:05 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Sorry SWT, you lost all of your credibility when you said that Republicans only use illegal laborers.
11:31 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
We need to get VoterID done right to avoid ANY fraud by anyone or any "side" in our divided country which takes time (fair and equal for ALL) - not what WAS done trying to get it done for political governing reasons to win an election which is a crime of representation ... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuOT1bRYdK8). I heard in town meetings from our local reps this NEED being spun and pushed and the NEED, but Turzai spoke the truth - shame his truth revealed a crime on democracy in their attempt to suppress the voice of some for their "side".
11:34 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I guess the Democrats got to the judge. An I.D. was necessary to get into the conventions. I do not see why it is so difficult to have an ID. Practically everything we do today needs some sort of identification. Shame Shame Shame on our elected officials.
SWT Resident
11:41 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I think there is a LOT of abuse out there on people saying....let me see your ID. My response is always simple: for what purpose? Do you have the legal authority to ask for my ID? Your photo ID has a lot of information on it that can be dangerous if in the wrong hands. Until they start writing more laws that say you need to provide a photo ID for this, that, and the other thing beyond what the law says today...I challenge everyone that asks me. 90% back down.
11:38 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
So much anger over what each one of us, through our comments thinks they are the better than those that disagree. Is it any wonder then that kids become bullies? Peace.
Joe Mama
11:45 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Funny how nobody's disenfranchised showing ID for getting government benefits....
Mike Shortall
11:57 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Wait to you see the lines at PENNDOT when they decide to require an ID for Obama-care benefits. Suddenly, no one will have a problem dragging themselves to a PENNDOT office and getting an ID.
Tobie S
11:46 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Voter fraud is more likely to happen by tampering with the vote count - people sign in and signatures must match reasonably well, plus they call out your name and others may be there who know you. Here is an example of potential fraud (or carelessness on the part of the officials): one of my children is a staunch Democrat and voted in an election by absentee ballot. The absentee ballots are delivered to the polling place and opened by the precinct judges when the polls close. In our precinct that year, there were 7 absentee ballots - all straight Republican. My other son was working the polls and witnessed the count, and knew immediately that his brother's vote was missing. I am not totally against voter ID, but it starts to feel like an old movie set in Europe..."show me your papers." It was too partisan a law, and too rushed to be done well.
Nanine d'Onofrio
11:48 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Elderly Republican voters are also disenfranchised by this law. My 92 year old mother is a life long Republican. Proud of it too; however, she doesn't have a photo i.d. She's so outraged by the law, she refuses to get one even though I, a life long Democrat, am willing to waste my time to take her for a photo. She's been voting all these years with the same people checking her in at the same polling center. In her mind it's an insult. Mom won't be voting for Romney now even with the I.D. law on hold. Neither am I. Be careful what you wish for.
K. Thom.
11:51 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Lets see how many districts get OVER 100% voter turn out this year. They want to tell us this law disenfranchises some people, I say every time a vote is cast by a dead person, a pet, etc we are all disenfranchised. ID is needed for social security, medicaid, unemployment filing, cashing a check, opening a bank account, getting certain prescriptions with insurance, getting a library card, to drive a vehicle, to buy firearms, to buy cigarettes and alcohol, to buy spray paint and some cleaning products(brake clean etc), and on..............
truth seeker
12:11 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yeah but not an ID with an expiration date. And much of that stuff you have listed will take other forms of ID as opposed to only a phote ID.
Maynard G Krebs
12:14 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I'd like to see that, too, because in my 65 yrs in PA, I've NEVER seen this problem. Oh, of course, the liberal media conspire to keep it a secret.
K. McDonald
12:19 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Voter obstruction speaks volumes about today's GOP.
They're standing on the shoulders of giants.
Ryan F.
12:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You've never seen the problem? Well, neither have I firsthand, but I know that it exists in this state, particularly in Philadelphia. Does anyone remember the '08 election with the Black Panthers intimidating voters? Nah, people like Peety will just ignore the problem and put their heads in the sand.
Mohandus Frieri
11:52 am on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
We'll be storming the polling places. We're going to purposefully bring in hoardes of illegal immigrants to vote, hand write their names on the voter registration list when we arrive. We'll promise them alcohol if they vote the big D but they'll have to show ID to get the booze.
Where's Mike Turzai, I have a question for him?
Morgan King
12:01 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Crazy how we've managed to vote in this country without valid Voter IDs for 225 years, right?
SWT Resident
12:30 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
LOL...I have been thinking the very same thing since this law was being promulgated months ago. How many elections were held and the winner won via ineligible votes? How many retired politicians are collecting their tax payer funded pensions and should have never won their election to begin with? Boy...that photo ID law and the millions of dollars spent putting it in place is sure going to make 100% sure...like DNA testing...that every elected official elected after full, legal, timely, and accurate implementation is really the winner. Now I can rest easier at night. Especially knowing my taxes are going up year after year to cover the cost of this new law. Yeah.
Chuck Rohrbach
1:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Crazy how we lived without electricity for thousands of years....times change
Morgan King
2:12 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
What's changed about the election process since 2008?
12:01 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I think the whole idea of the voter ID law is about suppressing the vote and is backed mainly by conservatives who are afraid Obama might win and this might be a hindrance for certain target groups. Where were voter ID concerns in the last election, or the ones before that?
Ryan F.
12:24 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Umm, Black Panthers at the polls intimidating voters in Philadelphia in 2008, anyone??? Of course, the US Attorney General will sweep this clear case of intimidation right under the rug.
Chuck Rohrbach
1:24 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
So what you are saying Obama is counting on the illegal voters to win.
1:33 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
No Chuck...what I am trying to say is that Romney is depending on phony voter fraud claims and roadblocking elderly, young people, the infirmed, rural voters and others who might vote for Obama from doing so...don't you get it?
Ryan F.
3:17 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
That's funny, Cher. When I think of voter fraud, I tend to believe it's more of a problem on the Democratic side. By the way, young people, the elderly and rural voters won't be voting for Obama this time like 2008.
3:55 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ryan, not sure what you mean about the Dems and voter fraud. BTW, the PA judge is a Republican. I am interested in who gets the women's vote...pretty sure it ain't Romney/Ryan. At least not any women I know, INCLUDING Republican friends are voting for them. I'm sure some Obama haters (including some bigots) might vote R/R, or Mickey Mouse if they could. Can't wait for the debate tomorrow...how about you? And others posting?
Greg Miscavage
12:12 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
It seems like nobody wants to stand up against Obama. The news covered inner city city voters in the last election who blatantly stated they voted several times already that day and were going out and voting some more after lunch! And talk about you hanging chads, I guess that's worse than dead people voting! Bet their Dem's!
12:16 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The only "fraud" in this election cycle was perpetrated by the firm hired by the republican party..Kind of ironic, no? All their planning to steal the election going down the tubes..Poor Mitt..he might have to return to the French beaches where he spent the 60s as a Mormon Missionary while other poorer boys his age were dying in Vietnam..Go back to France you loser..
Greg Miscavage
12:20 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I would like to say the same about Osama, I mean Obama but we don't know where the he** he's from!
K. McDonald
12:34 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You know Greg -- it's disgusting comments like yours that epitomize today's GOP.
Pathetic, not patriotic.
Mohandus Frieri
6:13 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Greg Miscavage doesn't know where the hell Obama's from.
Where are you from Greg?
K. McDonald
12:17 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Fantastic! Voter obstruction particularly for political gain is down right un-American! And when you have PA Republican politicians saying that's what they were doing -- it was righteous that it was struck down -- by a Republican judge!
Perhaps there still TRUE Republicans around. Putting country first!
And I say to all Americans -- let's double down after this election -- we should make sure that there is some universal Voter Registration so that EVERY American has it --- and NO ONE will be denied the fraud of Corbett's voter obstruction bill that was shut down today by a true American!
Greg Miscavage
3:29 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
K, why is it that the liberals can say what they want about Bush, Reagan, Romney etc. but as soon as someone says anything about Obama, they're not patriotic? Free speech applies to all parties. Pretend just for a moment that the president worked for us and it's time for a performance review like most of us who work have to answer to. How would you rate him, would he get a raise, should he keep his job? NO. You guys really have nerve. The Dem's campain is nothing but mud slinging because they can't flaunt their record because they don't have one! And besides, I am more patriotic than him. I was born here ( can produce my original birth certificate ) served my country, worked hard and paid my taxes for 46 years!.
Publius 2.0
4:27 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I would rate the President a strong B+. But for the obstructionism and economic sabotage of the radical tea baggers and rightwing guano eaters, the President would have achieved an A. In my opinion, the debt-ceiling shenanigans together with the outlandish birtherism and the war or women so demeaned the GOP brand that it will likely be a party of John Birchers for years to come. The GOP is going to lose big this year. I think it is very probable that the GOP will lose the House. I cannot wait to see Nancy Pelosi as Speaker again, so she can shove the 33 stupid attempts to interfere with women's rights up the poop shoot of the GOP maggots.
K. McDonald
9:07 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Who said anything about Obama. This is about a PA voter law that was jammed down our throats.
Corbett didn't run on 'fixing voter fraud' -- and when a GOP politician -- Turzai stated that "...this law will allow Romney to win..." and Corbett said NOTHING in response -- what more do you need to know?
And no -- I do not think that voter obstruction is patriotic. If you do, own it.
12:20 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
awesome. it prevents the no proof voter fraud and bigfoot from voting. also stop the PA repubs from their big government tactics and wastefull $11 million in tax payer dollars
12:25 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
As Judge of Elections, I needed this to past. It is NOT about what political party - or what color of your skin is - or - if you are elderly - or if you are disabled - or if you are poor. Do you all know, that you HAD to show ID in the past - to prove that you are allowed to vote in YOUR district? that your address matched the voting book? that your signature matched the recorded signature on the sign in sheet? This is just great - just great - THANK YOU Democrats and Republicans! When are we going to unite as "citizens", start voting on the issues - rather than voting political parties? I will now be forced to do Provisional Ballots. We, (Judges of Elections) do not get PAID enough to go thru this hassle again, like we did at the last Presidential Election.
1) The IDs are available for free (so much for the "disenfranchised poor" argument)
2) The law was introduced 7 months prior to the election to provide enough time for everyone to get one
3) Personal Care Home IDs for the elderly could be used in their place (to save the elderly from having to make a trip out to get the ID)
THIS will be my last election, I am never going to vote again.
K. McDonald
12:38 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
So you're saying that the Republican judge who shut this voter obstruction down didn't get enough evidence to make a decision?
As has been stated, the ID that was shown in the past -- didn't have to have a current expiration date. Do you know what I had to go through to get my son -- who was born out of state -- a birth certificate to get his passport?
This Corbett Bill was about voter obstruction -- as I said in an earlier post -- we should ALL double down this and make sure that any possible voter has a voter registration -- so everyone can vote! Democracy is about voter rights not voter obstruction.
Marc L.
12:53 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Let me get this straight: You're a judge of election and you think this means that NOW you're going to need to handle provisional ballots? Please make sure that you read the ruling correctly and stated what you said correctly. Because what I read expressly stipulates "Election workers will still be allowed to ask voters for a valid photo ID, but people without it can vote on a regular voting machine in the polling place and WOULD NOT have to cast a provisional ballot or prove their identity to election officials after the election," Seems pretty cut and dry to me that your workload will not increase. If anything, it should speed up the line without the hassle of people having to check names, addresses, faces, etc. if the ID law stayed in place.
Additionally, if this is all it takes for you to swear off voting I say "Good riddance." Please be sure to pass your judge of elections role on to someone who cares.
Morgan King
1:06 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The free IDs have only been available from PennDot since the end of August. The law was passed 7 months ago without the infrastructure in place to get the IDs out in time, which is the core reason the enforcement of it has been delayed.
Marc L.
1:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The more I think about this...Thank you for your post, Sara. This is as solid proof as any to state that there is not enough time to properly train the Judges of Election in PA on the new voter iD laws. If Sara is so confused I bet there are countless others out there in PA who are still scratching their heads. Best that they get trained through NEXT November and start requiring IDs at that time.
David Curran
11:51 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I agree Marc, this is probably the most poorly thought out and administered piece of legislation I ever saw, Sara is proof of the that. Both the gov and sec of state have said factually wrong and uninformed info . Just a real amateur hour in general.
12:46 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Only the timing of this law should be an issue! Voter ID should not a big deal for all legal citizens to present to vote...but not this soon...it's the timing of this law that is suspicious!
My usual voting place was under construction in the spring primary. I had to go to another location...guess what? They did NOT ask me for ID!! I presented my driver's license, and was told it wasn't necessary! When I went to my local township building for business that same day ( also an election polling place), I over-heard people being asked for ID! There was no consistency ...I asked family members, and friends about being asked for ID...some were asked, some not asked!
More time is needed for this law to be put into action.
12:58 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The Abrams Center on Horsham Rd in Horsham always submits a stack of absentee ballots. Many of the signatures are scribbles or xs. They usually are straight Democratic tickets.
Pink Pussycat
1:09 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I have to laugh at the don't tread on me crowd, who want no government interference or regulation and then are cheering for restrictions on our fundamental right to vote. Guess what? Today is a small victory for voter rights. Bigger victories are ahead.
Ryan F.
1:17 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Well, the "Don't Tread On Me" crowd you refer to will be laughing all the way to the polls when we vote Obama out of office. By the way, we want less government interference and regulations, NOT no regulations or government at all. Guess what? Today's ruling will only embolden our resolve to vote Obama out!
Ryan F.
1:20 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The "Tea Party" crowd that you so disdain will be heard loud and clear on election day.
Morgan King
2:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yes, as the 'loud and clear' albatross around the Republican party's neck for yet another election.
Publius 2.0
2:14 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The Tea Baggers will have a mouth full of crow in a few weeks. Then we'll finally have a return to sanity. The Tea Baggers are know-nothing malcontents who would rather destroy the Constitution than attempt to understand its fundamental principles. By the way, have any idea who Publius was?
Ryan F.
3:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Publius, you lose all credibility when you can't even refer to the Tea Party by its proper name. You call this current administration as sane? Spending almost 6 trillion and piling up the debt to unseen levels? Covering up a terrorist attack on a US embassy? The Tea Party doesn't want to destroy the Constitution, but don't tell that to a moron like yourself. The Tea Party wants a return to fiscal discipline which is a foreign concept to most close-minded liberals like yourself.
Morgan King
3:54 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ok, if this is going to be the Tea-Party-talking-point-of-the-Week, let's just dispel this nonsense right now. Not immediately linking the attack in Benghazi specifically to the al-Qaeda is not 'covering up.' At Obama's press conference the next day he clearly included the incident when he said "No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation". Whether the attack's leaders leveraged the anniversary of the 9/11 attacks or a moronic video on YouTube to rally support is irrelevant. The hindsight criticism of what security should or should not have been deployed there, and to what extent the threat was reported as credible, is ineffectual, uninformed speculation.
Bill Sams
1:16 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This again is what The United states is all about , Stupidity runs Deep. There plenty of time for this law to go into place. It looks like we are in Deep s--- for another 4 years
God Help us all, The Dumacrats in their Convention Blasted God!!!!!!!!
Bill Star
1:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Remember with the "Don't tread on Me" crowd, the snake on their flag stands for "snake oil".
Elyssia Mathias
2:27 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
It most certainly does not. You seem to lack any clear understanding of the founding of this country, or the influences of the founders. (see: John Locke and Montesquieu).
Bill Smith
1:29 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The purist definition of idiocy is to support something just because someone tells you to. Voter fraud? States have dumped thousands of ballots for no reason at all and the complaint is about ID. People should be raging about how the government has restricted the voting rights of people from both dopey sides but instead they rage about...ID? Yeah, we as a country certainly have our priorities right. Thank goodness there wasn't blogs and threads when the forefathers were fighting and dying for our freedom or they may have chosen to be keyboard warriors like we currently have. We are all doomed because sheep are still flocking to their respective shepherds and this thread is undeniable proof.
1:31 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
GOPers believe allowing people to vote against the GOP is simply not democratic.
Bill Sams
2:04 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This Law was enacted because of The very thing that happened with Acorn, Have we all forgotten that Obummer was in that Acorn Group?
3:52 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yes, it's exactly the same situation. You know, when ACORN saw the suspicious names on the voter registration forms, and REPORTED IT ON THEIR OWN? And then FIRED the employees who did it? Yeah, I remember.
K. McDonald
9:09 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Enough -- you're bring up Acorn when the GOP hired a firm that they had to fire because of voter fraud?
When Turzai stated "...this will allow Romney to win..." and not a single Republican in PA said anything -- including Corbett -- then you know that this was about voter obstruction.
2:12 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Disappointing ruling. We can only hope Romney will win!
Publius 2.0
2:21 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Romney is toast, as he should be. He's a terrible candidate, nominated by a party that has terrible policies, supported by Plutocrats who have terrible ethics, and followed by crackers who were and are terrible students of history, economics and patriotism.
Ryan F.
3:30 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Publius sounds exactly like my liberal college professors. Same BS thinking, different day.
Publius 2.0
4:40 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ryan F. There is absolutely no way you went to college. Strike that, University of Phoenix, Strayer or Capella really don't count as colleges, so I suppose you could have taken some courses there.
K. McDonald
9:10 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
If you have to obstruct voters to get a win for your candidate, you know you have a problem.
Elyssia Mathias
2:21 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Right! Those evil Republicans are out to suppress voter turnout – or maintain the legitimacy and integrity of our elections. I mean, why should you have to prove that you are who you say you are to vote for our representatives? It's not like you're going to vote more than once! (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/maryland-politics/post/maryland-democrat-quits-congressional-race-amid-vote-fraud-allegations/2012/09/10/d0ff9b1e-fb73-11e1-b2af-1f7d12fe907a_blog.html) Or vote with a deceased persons ID? (http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/09/9000-dead-voters-still-on-the-rolls-in-dally-county/) Right???
Marc L.
3:06 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Or hire a 3rd party corporation to fill out false voter registration forms for Republicans and trash those filled out by democrats. (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/voter-registration-fraud-gop-backed-firm-spreads/story?id=17370445) Right? Or try to sign up ONLY Republicans while pretending to work for the County Clerk's office (http://kdvr.com/2012/09/28/colorado-gop-dumps-firm-with-ties-to-voter-fraud/) Right?
Mohandus Frieri
6:17 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
The emergent crisis of voter fraud. Frantic and frenzied efforts by Republicans to make sure negros, latinos, asians, elderly and poor don't vote.
Hurry up! Shove the law down our throats. We have to get it done now.
Why? Oh, snap. Because Mike Turzai might not get re-elected.
2:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
If you want to enforce this in 2012, that's ample time. The reason this was struck down, is because HARD EVIDENCE shows that 5 weeks is insufficient, given the hurdles present, for a large number of Pennsylvanians to obtain photo ID. THAT IS THE POINT !! Few people argue that ID is a bad idea. Ramrodding a law shortly before a Presidential election that unfairly targets a particular party should not be legal. There is no legitimate argument to that fact. If there had, been, this partisan judge would never have reversed his decision. Even political puppets need to come to terms with the truth when it is inarguable.
2:26 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
BTW, Obama is not a Muslim either... Consider the following:
Islamic law strictly outlaws homosexuality and gay marriage. President Obama, however, supports gay marriage.
Muslims tend to oppose abortion. Obama supports a woman's right an abortion.
Islamic law calls for government based on religious doctrine. Obama believes religion and government should both be protected by keeping them separate.
Many Muslims believe women are inferior to men and should obey their husbands. Obama believes women should be equal to men in every way and has signed legislation to help ensure women are paid the same as men.
Muslims are forbidden from eating pork. President Obama does like a good Bar-B-Q pork sandwich.
Muslims are forbidden to drink alcohol. Obama enjoys a beer now and then.
Muslims fast during the holy month of Ramadan. Obama has never done this and has frequently been observed eating during Ramadan.
Muslims are required to face Mecca and pray 5 times a day. President Obama has never done this.
President Obama is a baptized Christian, has attended Christian Church throughout his adult life, was married in a Christian Church, and his children were baptized in a Christian Church.
He has never been observed worshiping at a Mosque or observing any Islamic religious traditions.
Marc L.
3:00 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Next you'll tell me he was born in America and has a U.S. Birth Certificate to prove it.
Carl W
2:31 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
" So God would help those vote for a President who believe that killing the unborn is birth control?"
To all who feel this way, this is not to cavalieringly condone abortion. Some people are going to commit abortion, legal or not. I'm sure The President feels as I do. If they're going to do it, I'd rather have it done by a doctor, in a hospital, than with a drty hanger wire in a bathtub, of a knife in a kitchen or baclk alley, where both mother AND child may die.
Don't like it being legalized? Spend your time & money on helping people NOT get pregnant, or some form of deterrent to abortion. However, if a teenager or working woman wants to have an abortion - no if, ands, or buts, -let them have it done in a hospital.
2:52 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
How does this effect the absentee voting forms that require an ID number?
Bill Sams
2:59 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
This law was enacted long before the General Election. Now Montgomery County is Giving out Voter I.D. Cards This was stopped to allow Even the Dead to Vote. It has happened. I even heard from a Lady that her Father was sent an Ballot for voting and He is Dead. By The Way, Obummer is a Muslin Just like his Father From Kenya
Publius 2.0
3:14 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
You sir are a racist. You are precisely why no reasonable person will remain in the Republican party and why that party is doomed to longterm failure. If you like the company of losers, then you are in the right party and should vote with the losers.
ed r.
3:16 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Are you late for your klan meeting? Why don't you just call him a nigger and get it over with. Can't believe you backwoods racists f'ers are still holding on to the whole "muslim" thing.
BTW, you just called him a piece of cloth, I believe you meant to say MUSLIM and not MUSLIN.
Ryan F.
3:28 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Yeah, the Democratic Party is in great hands with Obummer and Burden in charge LOL.
Publius 2.0
3:51 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ryan F. I very much agree that the Democratic Party is in great shape having both President Obama and Vice President Biden in charge. Frankly, they are the best co-executives we have had since Clinton/Gore. Bin Laden in dead, General Motors is alive. With Romney, the cars get the elevator and the workers get the shaft. It is really time for the Republican party to find some quality candidates. For example, Jon Huntsman is an excellent choice. Too bad the baggers, evangelicals and klan have destroyed the real GOP.
Ryan F.
4:00 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
It's no wonder that Publius is an Obama supporter. Is that the best you have to offer? GM is alive and Bin Laden is dead? Thanks for repeating the party's talking points.I think those words are verbatim what Biden and Granholme said at the Democratic convention. Do you have any original thoughts in your head or do you mere repeat the same liberal refrain anytime someone questions this President? How has the Tea Party destroyed the GOP, genius? The movement helped the GOP regain Congressional seats in 2010 and will be Obama's undoing in November. Finally, the Klan was more likely to support Democrats throughout our history, and Robert Byrd, a Democrat was a member of the Klan. The Republicans, since the creation of the party in 1860, have destroyed the institution of slavery and favored minority voting. But, I'm sure you knew that, right? You sound like a student of history though.
Morgan King
4:12 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The KKK has always been a racist conservative group, the Republicans haven't.
Elsa Stutman
3:07 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
ACONn was registration fraud and was repported by ACORN as soon as they discovered it. This has nothing whatever to do with this ID law. As a former Judge of Elections and currently a Majority inspector. for at least 40 years, there has never been a case of voter fraud in our polling plavce. This law is useless, expensive and restrictive and should be rescinded in toto. Just postponing it for another year is ok but is is not constitutional in the first place. There is no voter fraud which can be done away with by this type of law. To all those people who think that asking for ID is done everywhere-the expiration date and other things needed to get this ID , the long time it takes to acquire the many items required by this law are much more than any other ID ever asked for. My father, who was born in NYC in 1893, if he were still alive, could not vote because his driver's license expireed before they were in the computer, his birth was never registered by the midwife who delivered him. BUT he got Social Security at 65 by them checking the US census from 1900 where his address and age were recorded. If that was good enough for the US Gov't, why should PA have more stringenet requirements? It's a Republican effort to prevent voters who mght be for the other side! NO FRAUD EXISTS except by the legislature.'s R majority.
Elsa Stutman
3:10 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
To Sara-as a Judge of Elections- you are a disgrace! Read t he new instructions before you go off to never vote again.
3:38 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ok .. Look like the teabaggers are showing the true colors .. Why not just admit you hate N---ers?? Oh .. Looks like some of you already have !! I had hoped America can grown past this. I guess there is no shortage of uneducated, gullible jagoffs who will vote for a man who will take their last dime and give it to his rich buddies, but at least he's a WHITE guy ..... even a MORMON over a traditional Christian ...
Dolores Umbridge
3:47 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Wow. Finally someone wrote what every moderate is really thinking.
Ryan F.
4:01 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Your thinking here really illustrates your own racism on this issue. Chris Matthews and you would get along swimmingly.
Ryan F.
4:06 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
But, Obama and his buddies aren't rich, are they? You have no credibility on this issue since you derisively refer to the Tea Party as "teabaggers." Obama is a traditional Christian??? You've got to be kidding me. What about the uneducated liberals who will vote for a candidate merely because he's black and not because they are in favor of his policies?
James L. Holland Jr.
3:47 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Jim Holland Jr. The World's Greatest Psychic
I am so Happy the Judge put the Pa. Voter ID law on hold until after the Presidential Election. It will be a fair run now!
The next President will be President Barack Obama.
Anthony Wayne
3:57 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
My research indicates that the largest voter fraud opportunity today exists with the tampering of the computerized systems. While widely reported, in particular after the 2000 election, voters seem to shrug it off as folly or inconsequential. Yet the polarization caused by asking for ID seems limitless. I will never understand the thought process of Americans when it comes to voting.
K. McDonald
9:13 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Exactly. The was a Frontline on voter machine fraud years ago. We should be insisting that the paper back-up on the voting machines is protected. Having said that, the Frontline report said that the machines were corrupted so deep that it was hard to see the fraud.
Dave Hoag
4:02 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
A huge laugh at the comments about the "liberal activist judge."
He's a Republican.
Dolores Umbridge
4:16 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Ok - lets go over this again. You realize that's a fake picture too, right? Ugh..never mind. Just go back to your nonsensical McGrath hating posts....
the VOICE
4:32 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The man has made a Bad deal and we have to suffer with his childish Rants !
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
4:20 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Stupid Question # 26,590
- Take out your driver's license.
- Take a picture of yourself with a web cam.
Do you look like you?
Stupid Question # 26,591
Now grab a piece of paper and sign it.
Does your signature look like the one on your license?
the VOICE
4:29 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I can't believe You FOOLS ! It is not hard to get a picture ID ! U morons who grew up in the suburbs have never seen Big City Voting places in person. Voter fraud is alive and well in this country ! This Ruling will only help Obama. Voter registration sholud be a required only with a picture ID, a thought for the future ?
The dead have voted in the past and are getting ready to vote again in PA !
Jason Dempsey
4:45 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
looks like everyone has it covered. Have a great day.
Publius 2.0
4:58 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Really, I've spent hours at polls in Philadelphia, Pottstown, Harrisburg, Scranton, Allentown and Coatesville, and I never once saw a dead person walk in and vote. Also, I never once saw a case where the number of ballots cast exceeded those in which real people came in to vote. Nor did I ever see the same person vote twice. So, if this fiction of dead people voting really happened in any place other than the sore-loser's rationalized delusion, one would think there would be some sort of real evidence. Besides, it would really take a lot of co-conspirators willing to risk a lot jail time for absolutely no reward to pull off the fool-hardy and completely implausible effort to alter an election through dead people voting. Get real people, it does not happen. It only happens in the delusional fantasies of addled small-minded losers who can't accept that their candidate was a dud and lost.
Tim Again.
4:59 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The GOP is trying to steal the election. Surprised.
5:00 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
What do some of you people do for a living that you can post all day long...just curious. I am retired and work part time. How about the rest of you busy bees?
1:17 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Cher, They work for some branch of our government or are on the payroll of Obama or Romney campaigns, paid to be on here day and night making comments just so it appears that anyone cares who wins this sham of an election. The country is in shambles, and it is obvious that those in leadership positions aren't choosing lives worth living whether they are Democrats or Republicans. Maybe they will wake up soon, and chose to care about themselves, their people, and their planet, but time is rushing out now.
5:15 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Basically im for voter id. It will help preserve and protect the legal right to vote. The constitution gives only US citizens the right to vote so showing id is very resonable request. The problem was trying to rush in this law. It should be done carefully and done right so all legal citizens can obtain an id.
Mohandus Frieri
5:19 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
We've been voting since 1789 and never required Voter ID. 233 years!
All of a sudden we have become frantic about Voter ID. We need to drop everything and focus squarely requiring ID from everyone who attempts to vote. This has become a national emergency, which undoubtedly will require Marshall Law.
Voter ID has taken on the frenzied epidemic of the Ebola virus.
Yet there has never been a case of voter ID fraud investigated or prosecuted in the history of the Commonwealth. Whence comes this frenzied, frantic need to ID prospective voters? What is the emergency.
Time for the R's to get real. What we need to do is vote out the bums who cast a Yea vote for the Voter ID. No emergency. No ID.
paul grauber
5:32 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
I would really love to see a law in place that curbs the fraud committed by politicians, both Republican and Democrat. Fraud, its an interesting word, those screaming the loudest, are most likely the ones indulging in such activity.
5:39 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
267 comments? Let me guess, you're all out of work hammering away on Pottstown Patch comments all day because of Obama, right?
5:47 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Hopefully now we can stop worrying about voter id and birth certificates and tax returns and whether or not someone is too rich and actually get on to the debates and start talking about real issues. Remember to get your familly and friends involved. even if my candidates lose id be happy just to see huge turnouts in all elections we need to tack back our country and stop taking for granted what other people on earth would kill for FREEDOM.
6:14 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
We should all have ID to vote,buy alcohol,etc. Perhaps we should have ID for everything, maybe a National ID card or something! Listen to yourselves people. Does any of this sound familiar? Big Brother is watching.
K. McDonald
9:15 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Corbett is a Republican -- this is his law -- a law that he rammed down our throats. He never campaigned on "fixing (non-existent) voter fraud" with a new voter registration law. NEVER. If you're worried about "Big Brother" -- put your finger in the "right" direction.
7:02 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
When it comes to voter FRAUD, the GOP takes the cake.
Dorothy Sinkler
8:34 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Good for the judge for putting the POLL TAX in the toilet where it belongs.
9:06 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
@Dorothy _ there never was a poll tax. And there never was a ironclad ID requirement.
Most people, even proponents of the law, don't (didn't) realize that the voter ID law didn't even require an ID to validate a provisional vote. All you had to do is sign an affadavit that you don't have anacceptable ID to validate your provisional ballot. Read the original law and the affadavit and you will find that this is true. I wonder if the judges understood this, since many people claim you had to be indigent for this to apply, but even that is not true!
The law states:
The operative word is "OR" and "ANY OTHER GROUNDS" means anything, including you couldn't or didn't take the time to get the ID. You didn't even have top be indigent to get this waiver of the voter ID requirement to apply. Anyone without ID could get the waiver for their provisional vote to count simply by showing up and saying so!
Mohandus Frieri
3:20 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Clearly there was a crisis of epic proportion, that even though we voted for the past 233 years without Voter ID, we had to frantically push this through right before this election.
Anyone can see this crisis unfolding that we required emergency measures to force persons to show ID at the voting place. Imminent death, pestilence and suffering would occur unless people showed ID at the voting booth.
It's hard to believe everyone cannot see this crisis at the voting booth. Maybe the state supreme court can step in and recognize the depth of this crisis.
The Voter ID supporters are pathetic.
10:19 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
Where does WAM go? Walking Around Money for the ignorant people here. There will be money to be made on election day. All you need is a car and you get paid for each person who you drag into vote.
10:22 pm on Tuesday, October 2, 2012
The government should implant RFID chips in everybody. Problem solved
Anonymous Andy
2:15 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
If you're dumb enough to vote, you're dumb enough to believe them.
6:55 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
As has been done for now, postpone. Erring on the side of caution in the potential exclusion of some who would vote is the prudent thing to do. However, to all of you with your tilted to the right, left, or even smack dab in the middle posts, don't you find it the least bit odd that we can list a host of other actions in our lives, many of them far less critical than voting, that require a photo ID, but voting...does not? Reconcile that, please.
This is a critical issue that should have been addressed a long time ago, and by both sides of the spectrum. There was plenty of time to do this and outside of the glaring heat of an upcoming national election.
Behold, yours and my public servants. May they continue to serve themselves with more sloth, inaction, procrastination, and downright laziness. So what does that make us? We hire them, then keep them as incumbents.
7:16 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
The only upside-- when Romney soundly defeats the socialist, the Dems can't cry "fraud" and "poll tax" and other nonsense.
R Mexico
8:34 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
you can dream, can't you... luckily it doesn't seem likely that such a nightmare will come to pass.. so sorry!
K. McDonald
9:16 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
If you're worried about socialism -- then you
- hate Palin -- as a socialist, she got every AL citizen a check from big oil
- hate our existing health care system -- because we're ALL paying for those without healthcare insurance.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
9:23 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
your logic is upside down.
if Romney wins in PA - it becomes more fuel for the fire for those claiming fraud.
if Romney were to win the White House no one respect him because of stolen election.
Michele Ippoliti
7:34 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Another issue being blown out of proportion. There is nothing wrong with requiring ID to vote. Period
8:03 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
For the LAST time, there IS something wrong with requiring it five weeks before an election when tens of thousands of potential voters do not have the capacity to meet the strict and arbitrary requirements designed by a single party SPECIFICALLY to make it difficult. The judge did NOT strike out the need (actually desire ) for voter ID. It will just not have to happen before the next Presidential election. There was sufficient evidence given that many poor, elderly and disabled voters would not be able to obtain photo ID IN THIS TIME FRAME !! Period. Exclamation Point.
8:03 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Photo ID for voting should have been required years ago!
The argument has gotten caught up in plausibility of incompletion and lack of complete access by narrowly defining the forms of ID necessary and it was done on purpose. It was the sole purpose of the foot dragging. The left has gotten it way..for this election. That is what concerns me after seeing the ends that this regime will go to in lying, obfuscating, and lying some more. Useful idiots do not see it. A pass is given for the very same behaviors that would have gotten other POTUS impeached or thrown out. It is quite uncanny the fireproof nature of this propped up puppetized poser. The soothing of the masses by spreading largesse in exchange for unconditional support and the vote. Few see it.
Rosemary B
8:17 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Philly Jazz, the citizens of Pa were not just given 5 weeks notice! I've known about this law since the spring. That should have given people plenty of time to get what they need to vote. If they WANT to vote.
Mike Shortall
8:46 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Phillyjazz obviously hasn't been paying attention the last 6 months, because the ID requirements went into effect in MARCH, not "five weeks before an election".
You can't possibly be that out of touch, can you?
9:12 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
This issue has been discussed since 2005 and recently, nonstop, since MARCH! There has been plenty of tie to get proper ID. Why are only the Dems whining?
Republicans need ID, too, and we want a true fair vote.
This stinks.
SWT Resident
9:20 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
No Stabby....those that know what to look for....see it quite clearly. Our biggest mountain to climb is to try and organize our fellow man...both sides...and pull the rose colored glasses that politicians have so conveniently installed on their faces with BS promises they KNOW they can not keep in an effort to control and add discontent to our organizational efforts....off their faces so they can see the truth. I've never worked harder at any other job than this. The left and right are so far apart we might as well BE two different nations. But, you are correct...this voter ID law should have been passed and passed on a federal basis years ago. The patch work of states who have done so with a myriad of different ID types and such...and this is America? Quite depressing to say the least. One simply can not help the town idiot when the town idiot can not be silenced long enough to listen to reason. That is our largest problem to deal with today.
Its good to see you on this post, Stabby. Your comments are always a learning experience.
Bar Keep
Mohandus Frieri
6:22 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Yes, but despite going 233 years of not requiring Voter ID, we must make frantic and frenzied efforts to require it just before THIS election.
You sound cute though, Michele. What are you doing Election Night?
Mohandus Frieri
6:25 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
I hear we don't have to show Voter ID after all. I myself am driving busloads of negros, latinos, asians, elderly, poor, and illegals to polling places and have them vote illegally, especially in heavily Republican areas so we can fix the election.
What do you think of that, Shorty?
8:52 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
I know precisely when the law was enacted. The point is that there are five weeks LEFT and still tens of thousands of potential voters do not have ID, and the courts agreed that the level of difficulty is still too high for those to be easily obtainable. I went through this process with my 87-year-old mom. It required taking TWO days off work (one because the PennDot office was closed on a day the website said it was open) and another to actually go there and sit four hours waiting for her number to be called. My mom is profoundly deaf and would not have HEARD her number called had we not sat there with her for the entire process. So please don;t refer to ME as "out of touch." I think it is obvious who the ignorant party is in this discussion,
Rosemary B
9:23 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
I think it is great that you made sure your mom has ID so she can vote. Part of my point is that people have had almost 7 months to get their ID ect. Maybe if they don't have the ID maybe it is because it is not important enough to them to vote. It was important to my 19 yr old son who does not drive and he made sure he got one cause he is dying to cast his vote. It was important to him and he got it done.
10:13 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
LOL wow i can almost hear the violins playing. Geez two days and one of those days you had to sit and wait for four whole hours and you actually lived to tell the story. Man you should have been a pioneer or lived in the wild west or something or maybe you should have been a soldier and risked your life defending our freedoms. Tell you what, i got your crying towel right hear just tell me where to send it lol
10:29 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Oh phillyjazz just want to say my comments were directed at you for complaining not at your mother. I wish her well and tip my hat to her for being a concerned citizen willing to do whatever it takes to vote. Iknow its hard for some people but im growing tired of the lack of self responsability i see and excuses i hear.
Mike Shortall
11:23 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Of course we're the "ignorant ones", Jazzy, as if you were the only one who ever had to help an elderly family member get official documents.
I went though the same process for my mother several years ago, when air travel began to require PHOTO ID - like so many other things we do these days in a civilized world. Only it took me just a few hours to get my mother's situation addressed, but then again I was smart enough to do my homework before dragging grandmom out to PENNDOT!.
The facts are these ... This law has been the non-stop subject of newspaper columns, media reports, blog posts, on-line political discussions, etc., etc., etc. since MARCH! SInce MARCH only 12,000 people (out of the purportedly 750,000 - 1 million so-called "potentially disenfranchised") bothered to see the process out to its successful conclusion.
This indicates one of two things, neither of which are problems with the system:
a) Voters have not been listening or caring about what was needed under the law, or b) These eligible voters couldn't be bothered with meeting a very reasonable documentation requirement that's used every day by MILLIONS of people to complete a myriad of daily life activities.
People opposed to this law made it sound like they were being asked to fly to Jupiter!
12,000 out of a potential 750,000 = voter disinterest and laziness, plain and simple.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
9:25 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
If this law was not struck down and Romney were to win the White House because of it
then no one would respect him because of the perception of a stolen election.
9:42 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Why anyone other than rich old white men would respect him anyway is beyond me. I find literally nothing respectable about him (aside from the excellent health care plan he provided the people of Massachusetts.)
Rosemary B
10:37 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
You need to do more research about Romney. He is worthy of more respect then Obama who is a terrible leader, ect.
10:38 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Why would anyone other than someone whom thinks they are entitled to whatever they want without having to work for it or someone whom doesnt believe in the principles our country was founded on vote for Obama.
Mike Shortall
1:39 pm on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
That makes a lot of sense. </sarcasm>
What if Romney LOST Pennsylvania and still won? Are you saying if he won even ONE of the THIRTY states with voter ID laws, the elction would be tainted?!?
Please ...
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
11:49 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Rosemary - I would like to do some research of Romney's 2009 Tax returns - can you help me with that.
(I am looking to see if he took part in a tax amnesty program for tax cheats.)
9:46 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@Rosemary : It is easier for a healthy 19-year-old to get an ID than a disabled 87-year-old without support from caring family or friends. This is not about laziness, or not caring. Many old, poor, and disabled people live miles from their nearest PennDot office, and many working people cannot take a day off work to face the arduous task of obtaining ID from the PennDot monopoly. If the government of PA were truly interested in Democracy, they would set up ID centers in Post Offices, libraries and other more easily accessible venues. PennDot is there for TRANSPORTATION, not IDENTIFICATION. There is no reason for them to be in this business, especially as the sole provider of official government ID of non-military or government citizens.
John Q. Public
9:57 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
My totally, disabled daughter has been getting non-driver ID for at least 15 years. Not a big problem; no worse than her going shopping or church. Me, or her husband, or her sibling take her every 5 years to renew. She, and everyone who knows her, consider this issue to be ridiculous.
Rosemary B
10:32 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
also got one for my nearly deaf and blind 87 yr old mother. We went when they opened and had maybe a twenty minute wait. Still, not a big deal if you are really interested in voting. agree that special voter ID places should be opened at additional places and additional times. Not doing that was a big fail with the proponents of voter ID laws.
Jack Minster
9:48 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
You must have something against rich old white men, Phillyjazz. Fortunately we all belong to the same ROWM club, worship Jesus at the same ROWM church, and so now I can tell them never to hire you, give you an opportunity to advance, and keep you right where you are. Thanks for the heads up!
Jack Minster
9:51 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Why did the 87 year old indigent lady decide after 87 years that suddenly now, in 2012, she wants to vote for the first time? I find that scenario hard to believe. The fact is, under the VoterID law, if she EVER voted, she can still just complete and mail the Absentee Ballot Application along with the last four digits of her SS# to the Election Board where she last voted, and can still vote from her bed, for the cost of two stamps. Which you as a good loyal Democrat, Phillyjazz, should offer to donate to her.
9:55 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@Jack - Do you really think that supporting the 1% will one day gain you entrance to "the club?" You don't even stand a chance of parking their cars. BTW, I am an old white man (far from rich) but at least I am not so played by these people that I will pay another $500 a year out of my taxes to give THEM breaks in the misguided hope that they will "give me a job and an opportunity to advance." I am situated quite well, as it is, and have a good job , so "right where I am" is not a bad place. And I got here on my own... not by the largesse of my parents and the stock portfolio they gave me.
Jack Minster
10:01 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Support the entrepreneurs and small business owners and people making over $200K (Obama's definition of "middle-class" keeps dropping - used to be $250K) through tax cuts and incentives, enabling those who are tightly holding onto their cash to risk buying a new printer or truck or adding on to their operation, and watch millions of jobs for bench-warmers like yourself, perhaps, open up. This has happened like clockwork after every recession up till now. Democrat Bill Clinton had the sense to implement these economic policies. Economics 101. It's not even a political issue. And no, I will not give you a dollar to come park my Benz S-500 4-Matic unless you promise to vote straight Republican.
10:02 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@Jack - It happens that in June she received a letter from PennDot demanding that she send in ANY AND ALL Identification supplied by PennDot because they received a report from a "Medical Authority" stating that she suffered from "seizures." As it happens, the only photo ID she possessed was NON-DRIVER ID and they threatened to send the State Police to confiscate it if she did not mail it in. When we inquired at PennDot who the "medical authority" was, we were told we would need a court order to obtain that information. Her State Representative called PennDot on her behalf and was told the medical report was "in error." Still, they required us to physically obtain the ID. Whether or not she voted in the past is immaterial. Your argument is specious. She is voting in THIS election.
10:09 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@Jack. I have an MBA. I do not need an "Economics 101" lesson from you.
Mohandus Frieri
6:28 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
I hear Phillyjazz has an MBA.
No economic lessons here folks! PHILLY JAZZ HAS AN MBA!
Phillyjazz is economically sufficient. He has an MBA(douchebag).
John Q. Public
10:10 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Phillyjazz, envy is a human failing, manipulated by the DNC with expert precision. They know how to appeal to their base, and stress 'coveting thy neighbor's goods' to get out the vote. Typical comments I see here show resentment that some might have more than them, and a desire for it be taken away, typically by raising taxes. Fight the urge, and you will be happier.
Jack Minster
10:15 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Aging is a crime to which we are all sentenced. Medical personnel are required to report certain seizure activity to the state, which ostensibly protects the greater public safety. I know a 24 year old female who hides her seizures even from her doctors for this reason. I get it. You are subverting the point. Not everyone can drive and that's a good thing, I think we can all agree. But everyone can get their picture taken. If you can get to the Polls to vote, you can get to PennDot and get a non-driver's state photo ID, which also allows you to access government buildings, courts when you get called for Jury Duty, pass airport TSA, and other useful interactions with government. If you ever voted in the past and are now incapable due to infirmities, you can send the Election Board an Absentee Ballot Application with the last 4 digits of your SS# and vote from home. If you break this situation down to its basic facts, subtract emotions and political conspiracy theories and bizarre exceptions - it is a practical law that protects both Democrats and Republicans and everyone left of Lenin and right of Santorum from voter fraud.
10:18 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
There is such a division in this country. Worse than that, is the all about me attitude.
It is no wonder why we are in the shape we are in.
Everyone should have a valid ID. It helps prevent deception. It helps prevent mistakes. It helps ensure accuracy. Common Sense.
What I don't understand is how the decisions regarding this issue affect any party more than the other. If lack of ID prevents a vote, it could be for any party. If fraud allows multiple votes, they could be for any party.
Step out of line for just a moment, Lemmings. Think.
10:21 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@John: Anyone who is happy with the political situation in this country (who is not already "privileged") is not paying attention. I think an "even playing field" is appropriate, and our country functions best when one exists. I do not wish to see us revert to the days of "Robber Barons" who manipulate a government (supposedly of ALL the people) for personal gain, I bear no grudge against the entrepreneurs and hard workers who have achieved success. I DO, however, wish to see a society where everyone has an equal chance. Yes, envy is an inevitable human emotion, This is not about envy, but fairness, and a Democracy that is not manipulated by special interests to the detriment of the citizenry as a whole.
10:27 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
@Jack - I don't think it is I who am "subverting the point." The fact is that my mother does NOT suffer from seizures, but the standards for medical reporting are so low in PA that ANYONE can fax a DL-14 to PennDot with an easily obtainable name of a doctor and his state ID# and PennDot will revoke that person's ID. EVEN A NON-DRIVER ID !! Maybe you think this is OK. I really don't care at this point what you think. And BTW, Walter, in case you have not read previous posts, there is little argument about the need for ID. The argument is that a single political party, after HUNDREDS OF YEARS decided that they are SUDDENLY NECESSARY to fix a problem which statistics INDISPUTABLY prove does not exist. OK ?? Before you resort to calling other "lemmings" perhaps some introspection is in order with regard to regurgitating Fox News sound bites without understanding the argument in which you are trying to make a point.
11:22 am on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
AGAIN (and for the last time !!!) This is NOT about ID.. This about the RUSH to force ID in a timeframe which will benefit NO ONE but the Republican party !!! This is about basic DEMOCRATIC PRINCIPLES and the RIGHT OF EACH CITIZEN TO VOTE. There is INSUFFICIENT EVIDENCE to prove that IN PERSON voter fraud is a problem. The PA COURT has decided that there is insufficient time and inadequate infrastructure to support a SIZEABLE and STATISTICALLY VALID number of Pennsylvanians in time to vote on November 6th.
I am now done with this thread. If you cannot read the above sentences and understand them, I do not wish to waste my time teaching simple English. Have a nice day !
1:02 pm on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Glad to see you go Phillyjazz. No big loss!!!
1:13 pm on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
Most of you are ridiculous. It's not even a debate on these pages anymore. It's nothing more than a bunch of name calling mud slingers. Most of you are doing exactly what you complain about our government doing. It's quite pathetic.
Welcome to Kenya, the 51st State
1:55 pm on Wednesday, October 3, 2012
All I know is that if you give enough free stuff to enough lazy losers, you become President
Mohandus Frieri
6:30 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
The 55 gallon drum of Preparation H is available to you. Paid for by the Kenyan government.
Welcome to Kenya, the 51st State
8:46 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
We're going to need it if the Muslim gets re-elected. After he gets done with everyone who works for a living, that;s all we're gonna have left. god bless america, land of the free beer, cars and smokes!
K. McDonald
9:15 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Isn't it funny that the GOP pit bulls who said such lies don't put their names on their posts.
K. McDonald
9:17 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Let us all know who you are. Put it on a bumper sticker, your front door --
"I don't know anything about Romney, I just hate Obama."
"I love to hate."
Rosemary B
5:39 pm on Thursday, October 4, 2012
No one hates Obama. But his policies are another story....We are certainly not better off now then we were 4 yrs ago. And he has broken so many promises! Where is the transparency in government that he promised? Did he cut the deficit in half? Are Helthcare insurance premiums lower because of his policies? NO! They are higher. He has not done the job and now must go.
Rosemary B
9:54 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
To read this page one would think that it is only Democrats who are required to show ID at the polls!
10:06 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
And they are all old, sick, disabled and live in the boonies.
12:09 pm on Thursday, October 4, 2012
My good ole' Grandfather was a hard working man who came up through the ranks in his industry and was for the common man, he always voted Republican in those day and until h passed away. Now he votes Democratic!
K. McDonald
12:07 pm on Friday, October 5, 2012
Are you referring to the GOP voter fraud activities that are occurring in FL and other states?
7:30 pm on Sunday, October 7, 2012
Rosemary, the point is that yes, of course Dems and Reps alike go to the polls, but the voter ID law is more likely to prevent Dems from getting there, as many of Obama's supporters are older, poorer, minorities, college kids, and urban and would find it more difficult to get to the polls or get to wherever you need to go to get ID. But I'll bet you knew that, as it has been in the news, on message boards, blogs, etc.
Bob Tigue
8:52 pm on Tuesday, October 16, 2012
If our military personnel can lose their life,limbs and blood for our freedom, then every person who votes can prove who they say they are with a valid I.D. If one values freedom they will not object. Voting is a right . Proving who you are is a obligation.
Feodor Tiorlenko
9:21 pm on Sunday, October 7, 2012
All aboard the minority express. We're getting ready to jam the voting polls with voters whose names we'll scribble on the voting registration lists when we arrive there.
The "D" button has never looked so big. We've got negroes, mulattos, quadroons, Hispanics, Asians, elderly, poor and mentally ill all ready to make Barack Hussein Obama a two-term president.
We'll make people who already had baby have abortions or alternatively make them socialist Islamists.We'll start a web dating site for extreme right-wing women. They'll make racially charged right-wing statements about big-eared light-skinned black presidential candidates which will cause us to be immediately attracted to them.
Yes, we want you!