text:
This is the best way to handle the situation, your giving all the information to the player, and its up to them to use the rules, they are supposed to know, how to get around it.
This is the best way to handle the situation, your giving all the information to the player, and its up to them to use the rules, they are supposed to know, how to get around it.
Ba Weep Gra Na Weep Ninny Bon
Yar I have press ganged-- Legion Strider, Farrow Brigand, Blood Trackers, Tharn White mane
West: You're right. The end of my post was judgmental and uncalled for. I'm sorry for posting it.
Pete: There is obviously a point after which further information/explanation will not assist someone in making a better choice due to limits in experience, tactical intelligence, or whatever. I want my opponent to have that level of information. If you do that with your opponents, we are attempting to handle this question in the same way.
That said, you cannot know someone's knowledge of the game by looking at them. I try to gauge it by giving an overview of the general mechanics of my list and give important specifics. After that you have to see what questions come up.
Example of initial disclosure: "My pVayl list softens you up and tries to force you to advance with long range shooting. When you get close, I increase the firepower with Vayl's buffs (explain Incite and Chiller) and often buy an additional round of shooting with Vayl's feat (explain Cat and Mouse) or move in for melee then fade back for a second alpha strike next round. Typhon tends to do a lot of the damage with its three sprays."
EDIT: I want to emphasize that I don't think anyone is breaking the rules or the spirit of sporting conduct by being tight-lipped. That is the game and your preparation for it is part of the intended competition. It is my personal choice to disclose more because I enjoy the game more that way and feel better about the win after (assuming I win).
Last edited by Ordrek; 06-26-2012 at 01:14 PM.
The thing is none of my opponents that I have ever played ever, have gone beyond asking me to see the card or when I said I was casting/using X ability what exactly does that do? To which I answer by reading the card for them.
The common response we have for each other is Wow! That ability is great or really nasty. Its said and felt with enthusiasm and enjoyment, even if we are blindsided by it. We will also tend to remember it and learn by experience.
The fact that you are unwilling to do the same and then WHINE like a ninny when you lose because I out manuevered you tells me you are not the type of player I would ever want to play.
That isn't the issue. I don't expect you to have perfect knowledge of all the casters. That's kind of why we have the rules for each model sitting in front of us.
You are crying foul and cheat because I hand you my cards with the rules on them and expect you to figure out what synergies I might have instead of just explaining what synergies I will use in the game so you can intentionally AVOID them.
It is LAZINESS on your part not to have to think about it and have me spoon feed you my strategy/synergies throughout the game.
Sorry if it makes me a **** for not explaining to you how to beat my army during a tournament game.
That's pretty much it, Infamousd. I feel that no matter what happens, at least I gave my opponent every opportunity to see what I was/am doing and how it was done.
He can't yell at me for getting math wrong. I don't have to hide behind silly evasive language, I just hand over cards, explain any rules, and treat him with enough respect to assume he is both literate and knows the basic rules.
If this makes me a monster, at the very worst it makes me an giant, secretly nice on the inside Pixar style monster
Rasheth 2012: Chains we can believe in!
Oh, Set Defense... I know Ivan's run afoul of that particular ability too. I've started to actually mention it when people ask me for the DEF of things like my Temple Flameguard with Defender's Ward on them -- "they're base DEF 13, DEF 15 with Defender's Ward, and DEF 17 against charges due to Set Defense" -- but that may be in part due to the fact that I like gloating about how they can get up to DEF 17. :P
And someday maybe I'll get to use Hyperion against your silly Sea Dogs, just so I can try to vaporize them!
My Cleansers have killed: 2 Combine members, Finn, pNemo, Sentinel, Lord of the Feast, eMadrak, Mordikaar, pKreuger, Molik Karn, Calaban
Lord Carver has successfully raided: Xerxis, Shae, Nemo
2012 Cygnar Challenge! The sturdy grunts of the Irregular 11th versus the gleaming mechanika of the Flashing 1st!
You did prove a point, it just wasn't yours
The point is, giving a hard number often doesn't give your opponent the full story or all the info they need.
Even if I had said 16.5 inches, leaving out beatback means he would have no idea that some of those inches didn't have to be in the same line, and that after charging I can move in completely different directions.
Rasheth 2012: Chains we can believe in!
Wow I hope I don't play against you.... picking arbitrary numbers.... Nah just joshing you (and doing some journalistic like quoting). While I prefer your argument about giving them Raw data, I think its good pratice to offer your cards, book, what have you, so they can check your data for themselves.
And Mischa... Haven't played a lot of pirates since Gators... but once I get Gaellon, Challenge accepted.
Last edited by infamousd; 06-26-2012 at 01:20 PM.
Ba Weep Gra Na Weep Ninny Bon
Yar I have press ganged-- Legion Strider, Farrow Brigand, Blood Trackers, Tharn White mane
*laughs* Wow, have you ever actually played against me? I can't tell what your location is, so I'm not sure if you're in my area or not... XD
Judging from your response, though, I'm guessing you didn't bother to actually read the much longer post I wrote in response to petegrrrr's reply to my own and other posts, elaborating on my point of view and the perspective I made my comment from. Instead, you unfortunately appear to have made the kind of extreme and knee-jerk reaction I mentioned in my post as being disappointed and characterized by the sort of hyperbole that even petegrrrr mentioned was appearing in various posts in this thread.
Do I expect someone to spoon-feed me a victory, or hold my hand through the game? Not at all. On the other hand, given my relative lack of experience, I see no real harm in asking an opponent how a particular combo I've heard of but never seen works, or for information that might actually help give them a more interesting/challenging game rather than a one-sided roflstomp on the way to the top.
On the other hand, judging from the tenor of your post, you appear to have very strong feelings about even an inexperienced player who may ask questions about the capabilities of your models during the game. At the very least, you seem to be quite willing to make assumptions about people given a relative lack of context. I'll admit, reading petegrrrr's post I may well have misjudged him, but at least I did go back and attempt to explain my point of view at length and present a more moderate position.
My Cleansers have killed: 2 Combine members, Finn, pNemo, Sentinel, Lord of the Feast, eMadrak, Mordikaar, pKreuger, Molik Karn, Calaban
Lord Carver has successfully raided: Xerxis, Shae, Nemo
2012 Cygnar Challenge! The sturdy grunts of the Irregular 11th versus the gleaming mechanika of the Flashing 1st!
I'd be happy to play against you.
I'd answer any of your questions to the best of my knowledge and you would be provided with my cards should your questions get to vague.
But you have to admit, your coming a competitive environment with limited experience and practice. If you went to a martial arts tournament with the same frequency of practice I think it would be less forgiving.
I'd be happy to teach you everything I know in a casual environment. I just think it is a little unfair of you to expect me to anticipate all your questions.
The posters on this thread are saying that I should not only answer your direct questions I should offer up any information I think you MIGHT need including basic rules like the 'push' ability on a WarJack.
If I am to assume you don't even know the basics, (which I don't for you personally I am speaking generally now.), am I to walk you through every step of the game? Where is the line? I'm all for a friendly hobby, but this is a tournament here.
As I said, I will be a helpful and gracious opponent. But I'm not there to teach you how to play..
Common Sense is a Myth.
I could be wrong, I've only skimmed through the two pages between my previous two posts, but I don't think anyone is saying that.
I think the pro- "open discourse" side of the thread are saying that just brushing off answers by handing cards is a bit evasive, and that if the information is freely available it doesn't hurt the game for you to just say it. i.e. while you don't need to go into super detail, there's little reason not to be specific in your answer and open to such questions.
Whereas the anti- "open discourse" side makes the assumption that that then requires you to detail everything for your opponent. And (in some cases) that informing their opponent of what their army is capable of is giving their opponent an unfair advantage.
eStryker is my copilot.
I am going to lean towards Petergrr on this.
Generally when I play a game, casual, tourney and everything in between. I ask my opponent if he needs to know anything about my army, and if he wants to see my cards, as well as I will ask to see his cards and maybe ask questions of his units/caster/jacks etc..
If during the game he asks what is that models Stat, I will tell them what is the CURRENT stat, as well as any buffs/modifiers that they currently have. If they ask is there any way I can increase/decrease that I will also let them know as well.
But I probably will not go and:
Well after Mortenembrah and her Skarlock cast Terminal Velocity as well as Overrun allowing my one Warjack to move another Warjack around your defenders, who will then have a bonus of charging your flank at a extended Range because you are a living model and eat you for breakfast.
Actually I may have told people that in the past, I just say my Deathjack can touch you from 17.5" away (or some number that escapes me atm).
I do not ask my opponent what his end game strategy is, and I do not expect them to ask me, I find the best way of learning is by having it happen to you and to remember not to do it again.
The Original Calibretto....
That is not Cheese you smell, thats Tartarus Sauce Baby...
Loki77515: This one guy at my LGS that I play the most LOVES to play infantry heavy Cryx lists.
Darknesse: Is there any other kind of good Cryx list?
Loki77515: ... No. No there are not.
You know, it seems like a secondary moral of this thread is trying to skirt threat ranges is going to run you into trouble.
Fenbek, 2/3 FP
"The post above does not really help anyone, nor is it really intended to."
Again though, is the burden on the Skorne player to explain the very critical nuances of how Beat Back can be used? What if Hyper Aggressive comes into play? Counter-charge? There's a whole lot of non-linear moving and Push effects going on, and those are just the rules on the card, let alone things like Leash or Admonition. Just stating a 16.5" number (or whatever) is likely to make the other player feel cheated when you counter-charge an enemy trooper, then beat back through several models to eat something important. But the flip side is that explaining all the various ways the Bronzeback might move will be both time consuming and (I personally think) be beyond the scope of a tournament game. That's why I'd rather see the card, because then it's on me to understand the interactions, and I have all the information to do it. Now, if after handing an opponent the card and saying something like "Well he's SPD 4, and I have access to Rush and he can cast Beat Back on himself to get some extra range, plus his passive rules, as you can see," my opponent wants an explanation of exactly how some of them might interact so that he/she feels comfortable in their understanding of the cards? Sure, no problem. There's no "hiding the ball" or devious dry-washing of the hands going on, or any cackling*. It's just that the fairest way to exchange the information is to allow the opponent access to the precise wording of the card, not a hand-waving number, where I may forget certain interactions like Counter Charge. That seems to be Pete's attitude, from what I've read of his posts, and I think it's a good one.
*Well, ok, maybe some cackling, unrelated to rules "gotchas", since I'm fielding a Bronzeback. They're cackle-worthy in their own right =).
I'm a free-born man of the USA
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Actually - I think petegrrr made a great point. I know people have asked me before what my models threat range is and I just rail off 7.5 inches (Khador player who loves to use a Juggernaut). Then come around to my turn I remember - hey I'm using a caster with Boundless Charge. Ooops (then I end up purposely not using the ability on that turn - which is EXTREMELY frustrating. Handicapping yourself just because an ability slipped your mind is very cumbersome but you do it so that you don't punish the other person because you gave them wrong information)
Its not your job as a player to go through all of your tactics and spells and abilities for your opponent and then spoon field your opponent the information. I've done that in games before and never ask my opponent a question - and what usually ends up happening is that I end up beating myself. I end up revealing all of the counters to my own army and my opponent ends up playing essentially a perfect game. When I just give them stat information and let them look at my cards the games are generally much closer - this is an example of player skill. Its not your job as a player to make it where your playing against your opponent AND yourself.
Now I don't hide information from my opponent - I give them my cards, i'll rattle off stats for them. If they ask me do I have any abilities that increase my threat range - i'll say yes and list off Boundless charge (and any other that I might have), but its not my job to add up the abilities effects for my opponent. (Speed) +3 + (melee range) + (speed buff) = threat range; is not a complicated equation and it is in; no way shape, form, or fashion, mean to have your opponent do the math in his or her head.
I think you're right. If the major concern here is over threat ranges they say so instead of trying to make it into a general argument. Otherwise you get people using examples like
"As I was about to place my caster my opponent reminded me I could get an extra inch by pushing my beast."
To me that is on a whole other level then trying to be precise over threat ranges.
If some one asks me how far a certain model can charge, I'm not just going to hand them my cards. I will do my best to explain to them how far he can charge and any models that can effect that.
There is just still always a gray area I think. I mean how do you prepare a player for a bulldoze charge? How often do I remind him my Jack has pathfinder? How often do I remind a player Terminus can fly? How do I prepare a player for the excarnate bloat thrall launcher?
Do I only answer pointed questions? Do I try and prevent a player from making a mistake? How do I do that with out crossing the line of telling him how to play or being annoying.
What if it looks like he is forgetting about one of my abilities but he is baiting me into using and planning on taking the hit?
You see it gets pretty complicated when you are trying to be that helpful instead of just handing over your cards, explaining the questions you are asked and trusting you know what you're doing.
Common Sense is a Myth.
Right, that may have gotten lost in my rambling about the Bronzeback. In simple cases, like "How far can that Savage charge?" when I don't have any strange movement issues going on (playing Skorne, I frequently do have strange movement issues going on), I have no problem saying "15 inch threat range with Rush and Abuse".
It's when things get more complex, and in WM/H they frequently do, that I think it's fairer for both players to give the precise wording and abilities on the card.
I'm a free-born man of the USA
The Pogues - Body of an American
If you're intrigued by doctors who are also ninjas, then this is the Web comic for you!
If asked about my threat ranges, if it is a new player in a casual game, I go through the full gamut of what I can do.
If it is not a new player, I simply respond with "That model has speed x printed on the card."
But then again I play Circle - so shenanigans is what we do. After all, when an opponent asked about what the charge range of my feral warpwolf was, I simply responded "The printed speed on the card in the statline is 6." He wisely asked to see the card.
Fenbek, 2/3 FP
"The post above does not really help anyone, nor is it really intended to."
Personally, I think that showing up to a tournament with minimal familiarity with some of the more popular options from other factions, and expecting my opponent to give me an explanation of how he or she plans to employ their army is asking a bit much. This is just my opinion, of course, but I think that in a competitive environment the obligation is on you to be at least somewhat prepared. It's not like this info is too hard to come by, either in forums or the books/cards themselves.
On the other hand, if you are at least fairly familiar with what the bronzeback (for instance) does, then reading the card should be enough to stir your memory.
I'm a free-born man of the USA
The Pogues - Body of an American
If you're intrigued by doctors who are also ninjas, then this is the Web comic for you!
This thread is basically all about what you should answer when someone asks you a question about what your models can do. Personally, what I am getting from this though is perspective from the other side of the table.
That perspective being: Don't ask questions about what your opponent's stuff can do!
The thing is, I agree with Pete and West entirely, in that the only information each player should have access to is what is on the cards. Essentially, the cards for an army create a big tapestry of rules describing what stuff can do. Each player should have full access to view their opponent's tapestry at all times. However, asking "what is this model's threat range?" is the same as asking "please highlight for me what areas of your tapestry are of interest to me when it comes to working out where it is safe for me to stand". And this "highlighting" is really something you are supposed to work out yourself, since what parts of the tapestry are relevant and which aren't at any given time will vary and be relative.
However, I am a friendly person and I like chatting to the friends I play with, so if they were to ask me, I would of course answer as fully as I could, including anything I thought might be useful for them to know. However, I would feel awkward about it, because in the back of my head I would be going "did I explain enough? or did I explain too much?"
I feel that the game is written and developed based on an assumption that everyone has access to all the rules for everything in their head at all times. With this in mind, you should never ask your opponent what their stats are or what their threat range is - just ask to see the cards or the rulebook. This is how the game is meant to be played. Part of the challenge and fun of the game is putting the pieces of the puzzle of special abilities together in your head yourself. Only ask your opponent to summarise and run things through for you if you are specifically playing a tutorial game, where the purpose is learning and not competition.
If people just stop asking for summaries of what their opponent's models can do, then we avoid the unpleasant problem of what the opponent should answer entirely.
After reading this, an odd thought occurred to me. Many of the people posting in this thread have commented that they would freely discuss what their army could do and is capable of in a casual setting, but refrain from doing so in a competitive one, and I couldn't help but wonder "Why would I even want to participate in a competitive event, then?" I would appear to lose out on a certain amount of social interaction and friendliness, and the only benefit is a chance at a hunk of metal that'll sit on my shelf and/or bragging rights I couldn't really care less about. X3
That may be why the prospect of travelling to any of the big gaming conventions never really appealed to me...
My Cleansers have killed: 2 Combine members, Finn, pNemo, Sentinel, Lord of the Feast, eMadrak, Mordikaar, pKreuger, Molik Karn, Calaban
Lord Carver has successfully raided: Xerxis, Shae, Nemo
2012 Cygnar Challenge! The sturdy grunts of the Irregular 11th versus the gleaming mechanika of the Flashing 1st!
This thread reminds me of why I'll likely never do tournaments. I'm WAY too dumb for this game - I can't even remember my OWN models' abilities; remembering what every model in the game can do (like some people can) would be an exercise in futility.
This is a pretty asinine statement. Maybe - just maybe i'm busy paying attention to what my opponent is doing and thinking of ways to counter all of the moves that he's made - and thinking ahead of what I want to do on my turn. Do not assume that I am ignorant about any of my models at all. I can essentially quote you the entire Khador book - which should give you an idea about how much I play this game and about what kind of a passion I have for this game. Guess what i'm human and I do forget things from time to time - like if a particular caster has boundless charge or not at a particular moment in time. Guess what its not my responsibility to spoon feed them the information either - i'm sorry that you feel insulted that your opponent isn't telling you every spell and ability he has access to. Your there to play a game - not have a sit down and discuss every ability on every model. Your a grown-up - I hope that you have a capability to read your opponents cards. Its not like no one is keeping them from you.
Now if you want to have a conversation instead of trying to insult my mental prowess then by all means lets have a conversation. Assuming that I am ignorant is not the way to go about it
Actual situation that occurred in a game I played:
Opponent playing Cryx activates a bone jack and is studying the space around Typhon which is also near my caster and declares the bone jack is running. Typhon's model is facing at a right angle and the bone jack has enough movement to end up on either side of Typhon if he moves around some obstacles nearby. The bone jack has an active arc node. The opponent asks/states "Typhon doesn't have Reach, does he?"
Now here's the thing- Typhon does NOT have reach, but he DOES have circular vision, which means if he moves into what appears to be Typhon's back arc (which doesn't exist for Typhon), he cannot channel spells. My opponent probably asked the reach question to avoid a free strike, but didn't seem aware of the circular vision.
I told him that Typhon does not have Reach. He began measuring a path to right behind Typhon within melee range, at which point I warned him about Circular Vision and no channeling in melee and let him adjust his movement.
What would you have done in this situation, assuming a competitive environment?
I think this is a tricky topic to discuss, but to me there is nothing whatsoever unfriendly about playing competitively. The reason for playing competitively is that it makes the game more exciting, to feel a rush because you are planning to go in and do your very best. More excitement should result in more fun, and this fun is meant to be shared between the two players, creating a great social feel of camraderie with your opponent. But part of the "do your very best" attitude is, to me at least, taking responsibility for your actions to the extent that you check yourself on the cards what your opponent's cards can do, rather than asking your opponent to feed you the information.
Me personally, I frequently forget all the various interactions of my own stuff. I don't want to handicap myself later if I forget something, and I don't want to convey inaccurate information my opponent relies on. So if my opponent asks "What's that models speed" I'll tell them. If they ask a question like "what's your maximum threat range" I'll hand over my cards. There are too many rules interactions in this game to exhaustively list every possible interaction.
I agree with this course of action. Once he has declared his intent to move and channel a spell, I would also inform him when he is about to move into a space where he cannot do this. The game assumes that he knows this and therefore doesn't move his model into a totally illogical place. The game is more enjoyable that way to me.
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It is a good example because the circular vision certainly may not be a well known thing. To be honest though I am not sure I would have been intuitive to know what he planned. I would have thought by the question he was trying to avoid a free strike or something. When it came down to him trying to channel in my melee range I would have mentioned the rule and then allowed him to take back or adjust his movement.
Not as smooth I will admit, but what do you think is more memorable. Being told prior to movement, or being told when you are about to channel and told you can't. Then being given the opportunity to correct it.
In this example though you are giving the player information so that he can carry out an action you have deduced he is trying to do, so you're helping him with his movement so he doesn't screw himself over by a rule he might not have known to ask about.
This is different then a player asking you how not to be threatened by his models. Or especially even how to warn a player against potential threats they might have next turn with out them asking. (eg. Excarnate Bile Thrall)
I'm going out now but I'll try to think of some specific examples to ask how you would handle them.
Common Sense is a Myth.
When he asked if he had reach I would have given him Typhoon's card and said this is what he does as he clearly isn't familiar with the model that he is trying to skirt around. What he chooses to do after that is his own accord.
I ask for cards all the time though as mistakes happen either in recollection or understanding of the card , I'm of the personality though that I like knowledge and understanding of things and it baffles me on some level how people will go in to things blind and hope that others will guide them in competitive play.
Answered that he doesn't have reach and left it at that.
If it were me making the mistake I'd only blame myself for not knowing Typhon's rules in the end, nor would I take back the move after or even want you to warn me in the first place. It's my game, my strategy and therefore my mistakes to make and then adapt and correct for elsewhere. Page 5, no whining.
Last edited by Triumph Of Man; 06-26-2012 at 08:14 PM.
So intentionally leaving out information is an acceptable way to win since your opponent "should know how to ask a question correctly"?
Seems more like you aren't a very good player and you should probably play more openly and stop trying to get got-cha wins.
Agreed. Some of the best competitive players in this game also happen to be some of the most open and relaxed players. Being a jerk may win you a couple games but its going to be hard to have anyone to play against after a while. It isn't about holding someone's hand through the game by telling them your threat ranges.
Some people need to get over themselves...
Shred the Gnar(ls)!
Saddest thing about this thread is that talking about this issue wont change the way people play. You think people are playing for actual money and not a little coin. I guess 90% to 99% of the players I know and have played against don't play this way. So there is hope that last 10% will figure it out.


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pstrwife wrote:Oh my gosh that is so good to hear....because....to be honest I am SUCH a beginner. I've been crocheting for almost two years, and trying anything above EASY frightens and frustrates me. I have to SEE things or be right there with someone in order to understand sometimes. I'm going to try this though....I feel the love.
I was a beginning crocheter when the last Bernat CAL took place. I used the CAL as a way to learn how to crochet! I didn't make as many squares as everyone else did, and made a baby blanket, using Bernat Baby Coordinates instead of Softee Chunky. Each new clue was an exciting challenge to me. The instructions were very clear, and the illustrations and charts helped a LOT! Also, there were videos available, to help show how the blanket should be crocheted. I was so pleased with my finished blanket!
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Darmanitan is quite the beast, with 140 base attack and good speed. Sheer Force is a great ability that boost several moves by 30%. So yes, definitely worth having.
I would go against DarthDestiny and suggest catching a normal one, not Zen Mode. With Zen Mode you need to carry a mixed attack set and probably Substitute to get yourself down to 50% HP to activate Zen Mode.
I would go with Pokemaster because Darmanitan can learn a variety of good moves, including both special moves and physical moves.
Darmanitan is definitely one of the best pokemon in the game because his attack is through the roof. I would also suggests to not make him learn any special attacking moves like overheat because his regular attack will be triple his special attack. Also his other moves are good to. Like super power, hammer arm, and fire punch. Plus thrash. Having all 4 would be a good move-set.
I have one and its worth it and I can provide you with a moveset : Item (Persim Berry) Fire Punch : Decent PP and with sheer force the power is 97.5 Rock Slide : Same reason Power 97.5 Hammer arm/Brick Break(To beat those annoying Rock pokemon) : I'd go with Hammer arm but it has a speed setback. Thrash : A really Amazing move . Power 90 .Decent PP .
A really worth Pokemon .
Catch Darmanitan in front of Relic Castle instead! They have Zen Mode Ability and you can breed Darumaka later!
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Brandon Weeden making a name for himself
BEREA — Brandon Weeden is making a case for dismantling the revolving quarterback door that has never really stopped spinning since the Browns were reborn in 1999.
Brady Quinn, now the quarterback of the Chiefs and the Browns' opponent Sunday, started the 2009 season for the Browns.
Jake Delhomme followed Quinn in 2010 and Colt McCoy followed Delhomme a year later. The 2012 opener meant another opening day starter; Weeden was handed the job the moment he was taken with the 22nd pick of the draft in April, though the Browns went through the charade of a quarterback competition with Colt McCoy.
In all, 17 quarterbacks have started games for the Browns since 1999.
Weeden will start his 13th game of the season Sunday afternoon when the Browns host Quinn and the Chiefs at 1 p.m. He is trying to become the first Browns quarterback to start all 16 games in one season since Tim Couch in 2001.
If new CEO Joe Banner sees fit, Weeden will be the starting quarterback in the season opener in 2013. And if that happens, he will be the first quarterback to start back to back openers for the Browns since Charlie Frye in 2006 and 2007. Prior to that Kelly Holcomb got the ball in 2002 and 2003.
"I knew the names of the guys that came through (before being drafted) but I didn't know the history and what happened," Weeden said Wednesday. "I knew they took Brady in the first round and I knew they took Colt and Delhomme was here and all those guys. I knew what was going on but I didn't get wrapped up in it until I got here.
"I want to be the guy for long term. If I can take care of what I can control — that means playing well, winning games, taking care of this locker room and being the guy everybody looks to to lead this team — then hopefully I'll be around for a while and help this organization win some games."
The Browns and Weeden are 4-8. One more victory would give him the record for wins by a Browns rookie. He has three 300-plus yards passing games. One more would put him on a plane with Brian Sipe as the only Browns quarterbacks with at least four 300-yard games in a season. Continued...
Fans might be surprised to learn how similar Weeden and Andrew Luck, the first pick in the 2012 draft, are statistically. Luck ranks 29th with a 76.1 rating. Weeden is 30th at 72.3. Luck has thrown 17 touchdown passes, Weeden 13. Luck has thrown 16 interceptions and Weeden 15.
The glaring difference is in the record of their two teams; the Colts are 8-4 and the Browns just the opposite. The Colts have outscored the Browns, 265-229.
Offensive coordinator Brad Childress did not hesitate Thursday when asked what Weeden has improved most since the start of the season. It might sound strange, but Childress said communicating the play in the huddle tops the list.
"Just being able to articulate with ease our rather wordy plays," Childress said. "He's the guy that disseminates information. When everybody is in the huddle looking at him, they don't hear him stuttering or having to repeat.
"I think those things are taken for granted, but for him to not have to think about it and be able to articulate exactly the paragraph he has to say has helped everybody."
Childress said Weeden knows his receivers better than even a month ago. That is a byproduct of Josh Gordon and Greg Little establishing themselves as the No. 1 and No. 2 receivers, and that is a byproduct of both staying healthy.
Mohamed Massaquoi began the season as the No. 1 receiver, but lost that gig when he missed five games with a hamstring injury. A hamstring injury also sidelined Travis Benjamin.
"He's had steady improvement with his receivers because he understands conceptually where everybody will be," Childress said. "You have to know what everybody's skill set is, how they're going to go about getting to a spot. They're all kind of different. You have to take that and transfer that into your scheme to know how it's going come out."
Weeden's completion percentage increased dramatically in the back-to-back victories over the Steelers and Raiders. He completed 54.1 percent (20 of 37) of his passes vs. Baltimore and 57.1 percent (20 of 35) vs. Dallas. The Browns lost both games. He completed 17 of 26 passes (65.4 percent) in the 20-14 victory over the Steelers and 25 of 36 (69.4 percent) in the 20-17 victory over Oakland.
Quarterback chart Continued...
Browns starting quarterbacks since returning to the NFL 14 years ago:
Ty Detmer
Tim Couch
Tim Couch
Doug Pederson
Spergon Wynn
Tim Couch Continued...
Tim Couch
Kelly Holcomb
Kelly Holcomb
Tim Couch
Jeff Garcia
Luke McCown
Trent Dilfer
Charlie Frye
Charlie Frye
Derek Anderson
Charlie Frye
Derek Anderson
Derek Anderson
Brady Quinn
Ken Dorsey
Bruce Gradkowski
Brady Quinn
Derek Anderson
Jake Delhomme
Seneca Wallace
Colt McCoy
Colt McCoy
Seneca Wallace
Brandon Weeden
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His portrayal of a brutal, emotionally delicate mob boss in HBO's "The Sopranos" was the brilliant core of one of TV's greatest dramas. Read story
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The superstar rapper drafted producer Rick Rubin and rising stars like Chief Keef, to air his dark, twisted fantasies. Read story
Chef Tim Byres builds a fire and grills up some steaks on the balcony of the Fort Worth Central Market, and our Weekend Chef has pictures! Read more
Dinners such as shrimp-and-grits or grilled salmon cost $13-$16 at the new diner-bar-and-grill in Montgomery Plaza. Read more
Want to experience the best of Dallas-Fort Worth? Our entertainment experts offer advice on the best places to stay, eat and party. Read more
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On Thursday, Martin House Brewery will begin selling its first canned beers at Central Market in Fort Worth.
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Fresh sounds from area acts, including a terrific new band out of Denton.
Shakespeare's battle of the sexes brings to mind modern-day fights for equality
His portrayal of a brutal, emotionally delicate mob boss in HBO's "The Sopranos" was the brilliant core of one of TV's greatest dramas.
"Miss Saigon," the musical that brought a real helicopter onto the West End stage, is descending on London again.


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Transworld to operate Bombardier Dubai depotUAE-based Transworld Aviation said it has signed a parts distribution centre agreement with Canadian aircraft manufacturer, Bombardier Aerospace, to operate the Dubai depot for Bombardier aircraft parts. Transworld Aviation is a m More… |
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Mena Aerospace boosts Bombardier fleetBahrain-based Mena Aerospace Enterprises said its subsidiary, MAE Aircraft Management, has added a new Bombardier Challenger aircraft CL605 to its fleet. The Challenger is in addition to an Embraer Legacy 600 and two Boeing 737s the compan More… |
Bombardier opens new academy in SaudiBerlin-based Bombardier Transportation, a rail technology leader, has launched a project management academy in Saudi Arabia featuring a modular education programme. The academy will train a new generation of project managers who will go on More… |
Bombardier wins $309m PrivatAir jet ordersBombardier Aerospace said Geneva-based PrivatAir has placed a firm order for five CS100 airliners at the ongoing Bahrain International Airshow and has taken options on an additional five CS100 aircraft. Based on the list price for the CS10 More… |
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I like the concept a lot. I like how you've written out all the steps in your creative process, too. I love Hard Boiled Cultures - it's a great supplement. One Bad Egg had some of the best 4e products available, I was very sad to see that they had folded. Cartigan wrote: I thought that's what the Duergar were already? 4e's taken the Duergar in a bit of a different direction, they're all about summoning demons (or devils, I can't remember) and making infernal pacts. I like them, although I'm not fond of the spiky hair they've given them. Raevhen wrote: I'd want to know what happened to the Aboleths. What is the 'gotcha' for their long term plans... Me too! I wanna write this campaign.
That doesn't really diminish my point. Duergar were the psionic, nazi slavers. If that changed in "100 something years," well oh well, but there is no need to create an entire race to do something that not only previously existed but previously existed perfectly - the Duergar, evil Dwarf psionic slavers. If you are going to be changing up the mythos anyway (like saying Dwarves wern't enslaved by giants), why not just change the Duergar back to what they were and replace Giants with Duergar?
Yeah - I get the sense the goal of this isn't, "I want to use some psionic nazi slaver dwarves," but rather, "what interesting changes can I make to dwarven culture?" Moving away from the dwarves entirely would be missing the original goal entirely.
Matthew Koelbl wrote: Yeah - I get the sense the goal of this isn't, "I want to use some psionic nazi slaver dwarves," but rather, "what interesting changes can I make to dwarven culture?" Moving away from the dwarves entirely would be missing the original goal entirely. I thought Duergar were Dwarves?
Cartigan wrote: They are. (Well, the workaholic gray cousins of dwarves.) Still, he didn't just call them duergar because he set out to make a different version of dwarven culture and just accidentally ended up with something a lot like 3.5 duergar.
Paul Worthen wrote: That could be. But I would say that he has already fallen into a sort of 'canonical' idea by having psionic dwarves that enslave a large group of servants. I would suggest that one either one either just make them into the Duergar or try to make them more different just so one doesn't confuse an Iron Dwarf with a 3.5 Duergar. I would prefer the making them the same because, as daysoftheking wrote in his blog, "Names have a lot of power, especially when they are used right." I believe that Duergar has a lot of power behind it, and it is especially meaningful when one applies it to an psionic dwarven slavers. (Also, while Iron Dwarf is a reasonable name, I am much more found of new names rather than [noun/adjective] [race].) Although this direction goes against what the Duergar (with poisoned spiky hair that they can shoot out of their body as a projectile weapon) stat blocks in the Monster Manual 2, I wouldn't really care about forgetting them.
Blazej wrote: I believe that Duergar has a lot of power behind it... And I think that's exactly what he's trying to avoid. You say to your players, "That's the Duergar kingdom", and they have a pre-formed idea of what that place should look like. Bur if you say, "that's the realm of the Iron Dwarves", then I think you spark some curiosity, and also get the players to come into the situation with fresh minds.
Paul Worthen wrote: Except when the realm he is imagining is the Duergar... Quote: I suddenly hear Christopher Lee in my head: "They delved too greedily, and too deep." While this is a Tolkien-ism, I'm going to use it for my own ends. What if they delved way, WAY too deep? As in, into the Underdark type deep? Yeah, these are totally not Grey Dwarves (Duergar) Oh wait, he refers to them being converted by Aboleths instead of Illithids. Fish people instead of Cthulhu monstrosities TOTALLY changes everything. Though how they broke into a aboleth enclave when aboleths can ONLY exist underwater escapes me. Honestly, just reading the entire thing makes me think this guy has never heard of Duergar before and thinks he is making up something cool and new. But the fact that this is pretty much EXACTLY the story of the Duergar makes me think he just wants other people to think he is being unique when he is ripping them straight out of the mythos and renaming them with only MINOR details changed.
There are no new ideas. Pretty much any concept, any plot, any setting ideas someone comes up with have cropped up before - but that doesn't mean they can't be done, and done well. This guy has come up with an idea for his game that he is excited about and putting a good deal of work into crafting as something unique and interesting. I suspect it will go over well. I doubt his gamers will think he is either ripping off the standard Duergar concept, or just trying to take them and paint them as regular dwarves, or anything along those lines. For myself, I've never been excited about Duergar. They've always just been "those evil underground dwarves who turn invisible." I never heard of the psionic connection, or that they were changed by Ilithids, or anything along those lines. I found the 4E lore for them a bit more useful - feeling like it cemented their place more in their mind - but still had no real interest in them. I found his write-up of the Iron Dwarves, and the concepts behind it and the direction he was going with it, to be far more fascinating. I guess you have some sort of huge attachment to the Duergar and feel he is infringing on it. I suppose I can understand that. But I myself have never had any interest in the Duergar, but find what he is doing here to be really cool. That's a sign to me that, despite whatever disparagements you want to toss his way, he is clearly doing something right.
Since he went through the process of how he came up with the idea, I'd say he was subconsciously inspired by the 3.5 druegar at worst. (Also, the druegar were originally altered by illithids? I thought they left regular dwarven society because of religious differences then eventually developed random psychic powers because the Underdark is weird and mutations just occasionally happen. Learn something new every day.) As for the aboleths, there's bound to be underground lakes and rivers somewhere down there. If there wasn't, all the other stuff would probably die from dehydration and the water table has to be somewhere in this bizarre land called D&D.
They were enslaved by the illithid which was what gave them their psionic powers. He just replaced "illithid" with "aboleth" and used a plot-hook to explain it which made zero sense. They broke into an aboleth enclave? You realize this would have to be underwater right? So the Dwarves just drilled straight through a wall into a lake? They decided to go for a swim? What?
Cartigan wrote: They were enslaved by the illithid which was what gave them their psionic powers. Much like githzerae. Cartigan wrote: They broke into an aboleth enclave? You realize this would have to be underwater right? So the Dwarves just drilled straight through a wall into a lake? They decided to go for a swim? What? Sounds like a mistake. I can visualize that, and the scenes of panic as a hundred thousands gallons of water come pouring into the cave that was dry only minutes before. And, as the dwarves are about to lose consciousness, an immense, dark figure looms in the waters above them, curious. Or, and I apologize for not knowing how 4th Edition handles psychic domination, it's possible that the dwarves ran afoul of an aboleth while they were still in dry tunnels, and compelled to open a passage to the aboleth's pool. There are all sorts of ways this could happen, many of which make great stories.
Davi The Eccentric wrote: Since he went through the process of how he came up with the idea, I'd say he was subconsciously inspired by the 3.5 druegar at worst. (Also, the druegar were originally altered by illithids? I thought they left regular dwarven society because of religious differences then eventually developed random psychic powers because the Underdark is weird and mutations just occasionally happen. Learn something new every day.) Well religious differences crop up in Dragon Lance version of the Dark Dwarves but I honestly can't remember what the story was with the Duergar. Hmm...OK I pulled out 1E's Dungeoneer's Survival Guide because its the earliest book I can think of that has a kind of race overview. Still nothing really about their history there just that they are evil - like to mine and are slavers. They'd have first appeared in Monster Manual II (1E) and I don't know where my copy is. Anyone want to look that source up and see if it sheds some light on the topic? Anyone know what module they first appeared in? I don't think they had an appearance in the Spider Queen series.
Paul Worthen wrote: I would suggest that players are just as likely to see "Iron Dwarves" and immediately have a pre-formed idea of what the place would look like just because of the word "dwarves." If one was trying to go into the situation with fresh minds, I would say just create a completely new name for them. That way players can't go in having an idea what they look like, where they live, what their personalities are like, what their goals are, etc. If one is going to use a preexisting name, to me, going with Duergar is preferable to Iron Dwarf because, while they both conjure images of what they are in the player's minds, the Duergar is closer to the race he is trying to describe (unless any of the players have read the entry in the Monster Manual 2). Matthew Koelbl wrote: But I myself have never had any interest in the Duergar, but find what he is doing here to be really cool. I just find that odd because, to me, the two don't seem to be that different. Their goals, back stories, and physical build to be very similar in my mind. If you are finding what he is doing to be really cool, then I would suggest that you really do like the 3.5 Duergar beyond the short bit of description they were given in the Monster Manual. I don't particularly care even if his new race was a carbon copy of the duergar. I would suggest that he be aware of similarities though, so he can use the 'duergar' name to his advantage or differentiate his race more from the 3.5 duergar.
Chris Mortika wrote: 4E handles story elements via DM fiat. So yeah - if the plot needs the Aboleth's to have compelled the Dwarves to open a gate or some such then that is what happened.
Jeremy Mac Donald wrote:
All I really know about the 3.5 version of dreugar is that they live further down than most dwarves, are grey and bald, worship a god of unending toil, and have the psychic ability to turn invisible and eight feet tall. Long-term domination in 4e generally has whatever limitations the DM thinks it needs for a good story, so it could work either way. Also, by "underground lake", I intended a cavern that had a lake in it, not them accidentally digging into the side of lake. Still, it could work. One team of miners open the way into the lake and drown, aboleths find out about the near-by dwarves, another team of dwarves goes down to find the remains of the first team of dwarves and gets dominated by the aboleth that swam up the flooded tunnel.
I think the idea is fun. World-building in general is fun. But what we must understand as world-builders is that there really is nothing new under the sun. (Or underdark!) It's normal for a long series of thought processes to lead us round to some place we've been before, or some place others have been. Because of the way this process works, the idea at which we arrive might seem fantastically new and original to us, and prompt us to throw it out there for others to appreciate as well. However, that is when we discover that other perspectives might see similarities to other works more clearly than do we who are still close to, and enthusiastic about, our ideas. This doesn't make the experience any less personal or unique to us, and it doesn't mean that following through is not worth it. But we must accept that the broader idea may already exist, and be prepared to relegate our enjoyment and "originality" to the unique flavor we bring to the thing from this point on. In any case, it's likely not worth arguing too much over. It sounds like a fun idea for this person's campaign.
I really don't see an issue with Iron Dwarves/Duergar. Would there have been so much drama if he would have just re-skinned the fluff? For example, I like the mechanics of the Kalashtar race but have no use for the fluff, so I re-imaged them to better fit my homebrew setting. The short version says: Psionically attuned albinos who have a racial vampiric heritage. Would you call foul on me as well?
You don't have to rely on one large lake where aboleths reside, but a whole interconnected system of underwater lakes and rivers, that may eventually go to larger seas, oceans, etc. What may need a little more fleshing it is what do the aboleths gain from dwarven enslavement, as it is obvious dwarfs need water, and they shun the surface world. I would imagine there is some type of mineral or magic in the deepest and darkest rivers and lakes the aboleth use to enslave unwary prey. But the iron dwarf image and rust from water (dominated race that does not take care of its weapons or equipment) is another good image to associate their masters. I am was never a big fan or duergar, especially the psionic enlargment ability. So I don't see it as blasphemy to re-invent the concept.
Raevhen wrote:
Except the Duergar havn't really been reimagined at all The only differences are minor - reason for leaving the surface was being greedy miners instead of outcasts or whatever reason there was (though later, they end up becoming shunned ANYWAY), they were enslaved by Aboleths instead of Illithids, and they ended up taking over the Dwarves. Which could easily be retconned in between 3.5 and 4 anyway due to the time span and the whole world-upside-down happenings anyway. Dwarves from the surface relocate to the Underdark and are enslaved by local psionic race and given psionic powers.
Cartigan wrote:
But the similarities were unintentional and he came up with the name before the most of the similarities were made. Besides, at this point we're really just arguing about what their name should be. (Besides, it's probably easier to make the dwarf monster stats psychic than make the 4e duergar stats non-infernal.) EDIT: Tell you what, we all agree that these are basically duergar, although he didn't set out for that, and we all just stop arguing about it?
New At The Action Point! Sandbox Path--The Tarrasque, Elder Evils, and more Psionic Nazi Slaver Dwarves!
Cartigan wrote: The post I wrote showed my train of thought rather clearly. I guess I came to some similar design decisions as the folks who worked on the gray dwarves. Parallel design strikes again. Can you cite some of the sources for the duergar you're talking about? If they're that close already I might as well mine them for ideas.
Davi The Eccentric wrote: Just read the info on duergar in both 3.5 MM1 and XPH. I'm not seeing the references that Cartigan is mentioning. Am I just missing it? Really, the description of my Iron Dwarves bears little resemblance to the duergar, especially as the XPH puts them out. Do they have some psionic abilities? yes. But it appears the personalities are *drastically* different, with XPH being pretty much standoffish and mine being expansionistic zealots. And I can't find the illithid slavery reference anywhere. Maybe he's thinking of the githyanki/githzerai?
daysoftheking wrote: Page 8 of Expanded Psionics Handbook under Duergar 'Relations.' The last sentence of the section: "...abandoned the gray dwarves to the thralldom and misery under mind flayer rule." But I really don't see if that has been expanded anywhere else (I don't recall seeing it looking through the 3.5 Monster Manual or the Ecology of the Duergar in my old Dragon magazine).
Davi The Eccentric wrote: Races of Faerun probably gives the most detail. Best line...Quote: The Iron Kingdom was dominated by the shield dwarves of Clan Duergar, So the Duergar are Iron Dwarves.
daysoftheking wrote: I'm not an FR player. Haven't been since 2nd Edition. Never read any of that stuff... it's setting-specific source material for a world I'm not interested in. The core 3.5 rules don't have anything about duergar slavery by mind flayers in them. But, to be fair, the core 3.5 rules have a total of five sentences about the Duergar (other than their bonuses and abilities they have from their race). I don't believe it would have be in the best interest (if one is only going to use that many sentences) to use one to describe what happened to their race long ago.
Blazej wrote: But, to be fair, the core 3.5 rules have a total of five sentences about the Duergar (other than their bonuses and abilities they have from their race). I don't believe it would have be in the best interest (if one is only going to use that many sentences) to use one to describe what happened to their race long ago. That's kind of what I'm saying. The core 3.X duergar as written have precious little written about them and that is my only influence as I don't have any of the Realms stuff. This really is a case study in parallel design. And that is really kinda fascinating to me.
daysoftheking wrote: Also unless he's attempting to publish (ie make money) from this idea I don't think it is a problem. D&D has the tradition of ripping off other genres from day 1. I mean Jack Vance didn't get credit but he might aswell have written the orifinal spell system, down to the details of the spells. No one argues that Gygax and Arneson didn't have good ideas and we all let it be cool. So what his dwarves are just like Duergar, it isn't hard to go "Hmmm Psycic slaver dwarves sound cool" and end up there. Also the ideas he has on his blog about the terrasque and the aboleths with the dwarves is pretty good stuff. So read that and insert Duergar if you like.
daysoftheking wrote: Alright, cool. Just because I feel like it, I'm summerized all the books that have bits about the duergar to really get more of an understanding about the various variations of their culture though the different books. Most mesh pretty well, but a few go slightly different paths. 3.5 Monster Manual: Evil underground dwelling dwarves. They are devoted to a deity that demands continous, hard work. 3.5 Expanded Psionics Handbook: Evil underground dwelling dwarves. Duergar are a psionic race that was once enslaved by the mind flayers. They are sullen race of workers who use a significant number of slaves for forced labor. 3.5 Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting: Evil Underdark dwelling dwarves. They were once enslaved by the mind flayers and, because of that experience, gained a few mental powers. Ecology of the Duergar, Dragon #325: Evil underground dwelling dwarves. They are devoted to a deity that demands continous, hard work. The organization is a strong theocracy to their deity. They don't seem that they are slavers as they forbid other races (who are seen as abominations) access to their cities. From the descriptions it seems more likely that they would kill someone before enslaving them, although I could imagine it such that slavery is the only way a non-duergar might come into one of their cities. Pathfinder Chronicles Into the Darklands: Evil underground dwelling dwarves. They are devoted to a deity that demands continous, hard work. From him is where they got their powers (although they seem to be labeled magical rather than psionic). They also seem to be a strongly religious people and slavery (mostly, it seems, of other races) plays be a very important part in their culture. 4e Monster Manual 2: The duergar were a clan of dwarves that lived in the Underdark. There they were attacked, defeated, and enslaved by mind flayers. They are free now, but have taken to worshiping devils and maintain a steady stock of slaves. Overall, they seem to be group of religious zealots that often have slavery as an important part of their lives. Most seem to have the it set that long ago there was some schism between the dwarves and the duergar such that the duergar were (or feel like) the dwarves abandoned them to a period of suffering. At the end of this period they had their additional powers (from psionic exposure/experimentation or gifts from a dark deity). Looking though this I really do see the 4th edition duergar as a slightly different version of the same race (as opposed to thinking that their only common connection was that they were both evil dwarf races). Aside from them firing off quills from their head of hair (boo), they seem a lot more similar now after looking at it. I would have to say that I see a lot of these aspects of the duergar in the Iron Dwarves as well, which I do find interesting.
Blazej wrote: I find the changes interesting and beneficial. Regardless of similiarities I liked the original ones, but I must say I like these somewhat more in that the concept of dwarves worshipping Yuan-ti (or rather similiar style monster) is cool and the idea of a Thulsa Doom major villian has always been one of those awesome ideas I never really used. I can just see some artillery dwarves who use snakes as arrows :P
Interesting that you mention Yaun-Ti as being iconic to The Realms. Might well be true - as I am no Realms fan and have not read the material but the realms is certainly not the source for Yuan-Ti. They first appear in 1st Edition in the module I1 Dwellers of the Forbidden City (an excellent and classic adventure) which would stick them squarely in the Greyhawk setting originally.


text: Mahler's Symphony No.1 is remarkably original for a composer's first symphonic work. Beginning life as a symphonic poem, the work still maintains a sense of its extra-musical backdrop and reflects Mahler's view that 'a symphony must be like the world, it must embrace everything'. With its evocative, primordial opening, the slow movement's funeral march and the presence of Mahler-composed song tunes, the work is indicative of Mahler's musical style, teeming with innovative ideas and is one of the best pieces to acquaint newcomers with the composer's unique sound. Before this Beethoven's Piano Concerto No. 4, the last of the concertos to be performed by the composer who initially found fame as a virtuoso pianist.


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Seattle: Living Computer Museum not just for geeks
SEATTLE (AP) — For tourists with an interest in Seattle's role as a high-tech hub, there hasn't been much here to see, other than driving over to Microsoft headquarters in suburban Redmond to take pictures of a bunch of boring buildings.
But Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen has just opened the Living Computer Museum, with displays of old machines — all in working order — along with a geeky wish list of items he'd like to add, just in case anybody out there has an old tape drive or super-computer sitting around.
Visitors who stop by the nondescript building in an industrial section of Seattle south of the baseball stadium are likely to see technicians in white lab coats working on the machines. But this place is not just for nerds and techies. Since the museum's Oct. 25 opening, many visitors have been families, and their questions have not been the expected queries concerning technical specs of machines, but rather where did the curators find these artifacts and what were they used for.
And items here are not behind glass with "Do Not Touch" signs. This is a place where you're welcome to pull up a chair and relive the days when you played Congo Bongo on a Commodore 64 instead of doing homework.
Visitors of a certain age are also almost guaranteed to see the first personal computer they ever touched — Radio Shack TRS-80 or an early Apple, perhaps— but the centerpieces of the collection are the bigger, older, flashier machines.
One of the oldest examples is a PDP-7 made by Digital Equipment Corporation. It's the size of an office cubicle and was designed in the mid-1960s to do just one operation in a physics lab at the University of Oregon. The curators believe it is the only working model of this machine in the world.
The machine has a fraction of the computing power of a modern cell phone and is a lot more expensive to maintain.
Displays throughout the small museum explain how much computers have evolved in the past 50 years and feature some amusing old photographs, including one shot of Allen sitting at a keyboard with a young Bill Gates looking over his shoulder.
People can visit the museum and access some of its computers virtually by requesting a login on the facility's website.
Among the museum staff's plans for the future are a special tour focused on the history of Microsoft and a lab where visitors can interface with some of the older machines. Continued...
All the equipment is from Allen's personal collection and the people who run the museum say the high-tech billionaire is committed to putting more cash into building his collection for both educational and nostalgic value.
"He's extremely passionate about this place," said Christina Siderius, a spokeswoman for Allen's company, Vulcan Inc.
Allen is a collector of epic proportions, but he doesn't keep his toys locked away in a private vault; he likes to share. He has two other museums in the Seattle area: the Flying Heritage Collection featuring his airplanes and the Experience Music Project popular culture and science fiction museum, filled with guitars, album covers, movie and band posters, costumes, props and toys.
Between the science fiction displays at the EMP and the new computer museum, Allen has almost single-handedly given geeks — and many others — several good reasons to visit Seattle.
"We are a tech capital," Siderius said. "To have something that pays tribute to that is appropriate."
Allen himself doesn't hang out at the museum or show visitors around, but he has an appropriate surrogate in Ian King, the museum's senior systems engineer.
"I'm a collector myself. I have about 30 machines in my basement," said the bearded, kilt-wearing King.
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DarkMarket: Cyberthieves, Cybercops and You
by Misha Glenny
Knopf, 296 pp., $26.95
Ghost in the Wires: My Adventures as the World's Most Wanted Hacker
by Kevin Mitnick with William L. Simon
Little, Brown, 413 pp., $25.99
We Are Anonymous: Inside the Hacker World of LulzSec, Anonymous, and the Global Cyber Insurgency
by Parmy Olson
Little, Brown, 498 pp., $26.99
Confront and Conceal: Obama's Secret Wars and Surprising Use of American Power
by David E. Sanger
Crown, 476 pp., $28.00
Hacking can, and often does, improve products. It exposes vulnerabilities, supplies innovations, and demonstrates both what is possible and what consumers want. Still, hacking has a dark side, one that has eclipsed its playful, sporty, creative side, especially in the popular imagination, and with good reason. Hacking has become the preferred tool for a certain kind of thief, one who lifts money from electronic bank accounts and sells personal information, particularly as it relates to credit cards and passwords, in a thriving international Internet underground. Hacking has also become a method used for extortion, public humiliation, business disruption, intellectual property theft, espionage, and, possibly, war.


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The list of grants can be filtered using single or multiple criteria - for example, you can display all grants made in Scotland, or all Revenue Grants made in the South East for between £50,000 and £99,000. Filters are added by selecting criteria from the drop down menus on each tab, and are removed by clicking on the red crosses. The system can be reset completely by clicking on new search.
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Republican Sen. Orrin Hatch of Utah on Saturday railed against White House proposals put forward earlier this week in the ongoing fiscal cliff debate.
"The president has said he wants a so-called balanced approach to solve this crisis," Hatch said in the GOP weekly address. "But what he proposed this week was a classic bait-and-switch on the American people."
At issue is the end-of-the-year deadline for Congress and the White House to find a deficit-reduction agreement in order to avoid automatic tax increases and spending cuts, known as the fiscal cliff.
Republican lawmakers appeared stunned Thursday when Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner unveiled details in the president's proposal. A Republican congressional aide familiar with the proposal said it called for $1.6 trillion in tax increases.
"All of that upfront -- in exchange for only $400 billion in spending cuts that come later," said the aide, calling the offer "completely unbalanced and unrealistic."
Republican aides said the $1.6 trillion was higher than previously discussed. Democrats said the number should not be a surprise, adding Obama discussed it on the campaign trail.
Hatch on Saturday said the country can't make any headway in reducing the federal deficit until entitlement programs undergo serious reforms.
"But we've seen an utter lack of leadership from President Obama, and his allies on the left have shown little -- very little -- to no willingness to tackle real, structural entitlement reform," he said. "There is no manner of tax hike that can save Medicare or Medicaid. These programs can only be fixed with real reforms that go to the heart of how they work."
Obama, in his weekly address, also stressed that the clock was ticking.
With the Bush-era tax cuts expiring at the end of the year, both parties agree the cuts should stay in place for roughly 98% of Americans who fall below the income threshold of $250,000.


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Business continuity planning is essential for all types of scenarios, ranging from flu pandemics to system failures caused by software upgrades. For the seventh straight year, AT&T has updated this comprehensive guide, designed to give you the information you need to sustain operations through a period of significant interruption.
Business Continuity Preparedness Handbook
A Guide to Sustaining Operations during Periods of Significant Interruption


text:
Ever since I can remember I have had issues with my Asthma, my allergies have gotten better since I have gotten older but I do occasionally have issues and especially in the winter time. Being allergic to my dogs also does not help, but I love them to death and deal with the allergies in order to keep them. I have always wanted a dog so as soon as I got married and moved out we got a puppy, well one puppy turned into two, Kasie had to have a friend. I try to keep our house as clean as possible, I can clean the carpets and furniture but how do I clean the air? Thanks to Honeywell, I was recently sent the Pet CleanAir Air Purifier.
Honeywell Pet CleanAir Air Purifier Features:
- Filters capture up to 95% of Airborne Allergens.
- Reduces Airborne Odors from pet areas.
- Captures airborne pet fur, dander, and other allergens.
- Electronic filter change reminder
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- 3 cleaning power selections
- An optional on/off ionizer
The Pet CleanAir Air Purifier is much smaller then our previous air purifier and also much quieter. The filters captures airborne pet fur, dander, and other allergens and reduces airborne odors. The first thing my husband mentioned was how quiet it was even on the highest setting. I prefer to leave an air purifier on 24/7 but our old one made a lot of noise and was loud, my husband couldn't sleep with it on so we had to shut it off during the night. With the Pet CleanAir we can leave it running all night on our nightstand, it is quiet (sounds like a fan on super low) and not distracting.
The Pet CleanAir is compact, it measures 15″ x 7″ x 11″ inches, and fits great on counters, night stands, or even the floor. It is a great size for bedrooms or pet areas and has been AHAM Certified for use in rooms up to 85 square feet. There is a knob on the top of the air purifier with 3 cleaning power selections: low, medium, and high. You also have the option of turning the ionizer on or off. While reading the directions it stated if you had asthma they recommend not turning the ionizer on, that it could irritate it, since I have asthma i opted not to turn it on.
Overall, the Honeywell Pet CleanAir Air Purifier has worked great. It is a great compact size to keep in our bedroom to help capture Charlie & Kasie's pet fur, dander, and other allergens. It is much quieter then our old purifier so we can keep it running 24/7. We keep our Pet CleanAir purifier in our bedroom and we plan to purchase an additional one to keep near the dogs area in the living room. I feel great knowing that not only I am breathing in cleaner air, but the boys are also.
Buy It: The Honeywell Pet CleanAir Purifier retails for $69.99. You can purchase it online at www.honeywellcleanair.com. It is also available at Home Depot and Sears.
Additional Filters: The
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The representing PR or Company provided a product and is providing the giveaway prize. No other compensation was provided.
The opinions
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text:
101 games and activities for children with autism, Asperger's, and sensory processing disorders / Tara Delaney
New York : McGraw-Hill, c2009
Augmentative & alternative communication : supporting children and adults with complex communication needs / by David R Beukelman and Pat Mirenda
Baltimore : Paul H Brookes Pub, c2013
Barefoot doctors and western medicine in China / Xiaoping Fang
Rochester, NY : University of Rochester Press, 2012
Couple-based interventions for military and veteran families : a practitioner's guide / edited by Douglas K. Snyder, Candice M. Monson
New York : Guilford Press, c2012
Evidence-based practice in nursing & healthcare : a guide to best practice / Bernadette Mazurek Melnyk, Ellen Fineout-Overholt
Philadelphia : Wolters Kluwer/Lippincott Williams & Wilkins, c2011
Gels and biomedical materials : symposium held November 28-December 2, 2011, Boston, Massachusetts, U.S.A. / editors, Ferenc Horkay ... [et al.]
Warrendale, Pa. : Materials Research Society ; Cambridge ; New York : Cambridge University Press, 2012
Introduction to epidemiology
Burlington Mass : Jones & Bartlett Learning, c2013
Last breath : cautionary tales from the limits of human endurance / Peter Stark
New York : Ballantine Books, 2001
Learning ACT : an acceptance & commitment therapy skills- training manual for therapists / Jason B. Luoma, Steven C. Hayes, Robyn D. Walser
Oakland, CA : New Harbinger Publications, c2007
Like a virgin : how science is redesigning the rules of sex / Aarathi Prasad
London, England : Oneworld Publications, 2012
Making minds and madness : from hysteria to depression / Mikkel Borch-Jacobsen
Cambridge UK ; New York : Cambridge University Press, 2009
Primary care : a collaborative practice / [edited by] Terry Mahan Buttaro [et al ]
St Louis Mo : Elsevier Mosby, c2013
Proof of heaven : a neurosurgeon's journey into the afterlife / Eben Alexander, M.D
Radiology 101 : the basics and fundamentals of imaging / editor William E Erkonen associate editor Wilbur L Smith
Philadelphia : Wolters Kluwer Lippincott Williams & Wilkins, c2010
Rural mental health : issues policies and best practices / K Bryant Smalley Jacob C Warren Jackson P Rainer editors
New York : Springer Pub Co, c2012
Shouting won't help : why I - and 50 million other Americans - can't hear you / Katherine Bouton
New York : Sarah Crichton Books/Farrar, Straus, and Giroux, 2013
The fragile wisdom : an evolutionary view on women's biology and health / Grazyna Jasienska
Treating sex offenders : an evidence-based manual / Jill D. Stinson, Judith V. Becker
New York, NY : Guilford Press, 2012
Weighing in : obesity food justice and the limits of capitalism / Julie Guthman
Berkeley : University of California Press, c2011
What's wrong with fat? / Abigail Saguy
New York : Oxford University Press, 2013


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