text:
If Obama decides it would be helpful to have someone running with him who could play bad cop to his good cop in dealing with the septegenarian juvenile delinquent McCain I think Clark would be right for the role.
new: Idea gains traction with new website, A.P. story, Daily Kos and other blogs. See update at end on column. General Wesley Clark supposedly ruined his chances for the Veep selection with his remarks about McCain's fighter jock experience and POW years not qualifying him to be president. Apparently a tendency to bluntly tell the unvarnished truth was deemed a trait not suitable to make the "short list". But now McCain is playing dirty, so maybe the ever polite Obama could use the sometimes hard-edged Clark on his flank. UPDATE: With the McCain campaign now being run by members of Bush's dirtier than dirt re-election team, it's no wonder we're seeing a shift to GOP gutter politics. Here's what today's New York Times had to say:
The moves are the McCain campaign's most full-throttled effort to define Mr. Obama negatively, on its own terms, by creating a narrative intended to turn the public off to an opponent.
Central to the latest McCain drive is an attempt to use against Mr. Obama the huge crowds and excitement he has drawn, including on his foreign trip last week, by promoting a view of him as more interested in attention and adulation than in solving the problems facing American families.
The intensity of the recent drive — which has included some assertions from the McCain campaign that have been widely dismissed as misleading — has surprised even some allies of Mr. McCain, who has frequently spoken about the need for civility in politics. Read article.
See update at end on column.
General Wesley Clark supposedly ruined his chances for the Veep selection with his remarks about McCain's fighter jock experience and POW years not qualifying him to be president. Apparently a tendency to bluntly tell the unvarnished truth was deemed a trait not suitable to make the "short list". But now McCain is playing dirty, so maybe the ever polite Obama could use the sometimes hard-edged Clark on his flank.
UPDATE: With the McCain campaign now being run by members of Bush's dirtier than dirt re-election team, it's no wonder we're seeing a shift to GOP gutter politics. Here's what today's New York Times had to say:
Before Al Gore and Dick Cheney demonstrated that a vice president can be more than a president in waiting, there were two criteria for selecting a running mate. The vice presidential candidate had to be seen has to be readily able to assume the presidency and ideally would be likely to help win one or more swing states.
This election we see the V.P. candidate as possibly making up for perceived deficits in the presidential candidates resume.
Voting irregularities and the fear factor of 9-11 aside, two things are generally agreed on as important factors in George W. Bush's 2004 victory over John Kerry. One was the Christian evangelical vote and the other was Karl Rove and the advertising coming from the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.
The later was so effective that Swift Boating became a readily understood term.
The man who promised a dignified and truthful campaign is now running a campaign that belongs in the sewage running in gutter of a third world road. The New York Times doesn't exactly say this in the title of their main editorial today but with "The Low Road Express" (LINK) comes close enough.
I won't list the recent examples of how McCain has tried to portray Obama as unpatriotic, even a traitor. The Times editorial describes some of them but more come out every day.
John Edwards was ill suited to take on the role of attack dog in 2004 fighting back against the Swift Boating while John Kerry remained above the fray.
Maybe West Point valedictorian, Rhodes Scholar and wounded combat veteran General Wesley Clark would be the perfect person to return fire for Obama.
UPDATE: (On the other hand, Hillary Clinton proved herself to be adept as she took occasional side trips on the low role towards the end of the primary campaign. See previous column. )
Watch Obama's response ad, "The Low Road". Will ads like this and Obama's sound bites be enough to counter McCain's crap assault?
Gaining traction –
This idea is getting some attention, including an Associated Press story about a new website, ObamaClark.com which was posted on Huffington Post:
Web site pulls for Clark as Obama running mate
WASHINGTON (AP) — Ret. Gen. Wesley Clark is getting an online push for presidential running mate.
A new Web site, http://www.obamaclark.com, offers readers a chance to sign a petition supporting Clark's placement on the ticket with Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama.
Clark, a Vietnam veteran and former supreme commander of NATO under President Clinton, had been serving as a national security surrogate for Obama until he belittled McCain's qualifications to be president during an appearance on CBS' "Face the Nation" last month.
McCain, a former Navy fighter pilot, was shot down over Hanoi and held prisoner during the Vietnam War.
"I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to be president," Clark said.
and on the blogs, notably the high readership Daily Kos (here) and here for example
Read Clark's impressive resume.
41 Responses to "Would Wesley Clark running for Vice President help Obama deal with Sen. "McNasty"?"
Isn't the comments where we get to editorialize?
My point was not to petition for empathy but just a whisper of reality. One can't ignore the economic hardships that have only just begun to manifest themselves in any real or dramatic way. The worst is yet to come, and I see no change in the future in terms of economics.
Illegals will still pour across our borders and burden our schools and hospitals, with honest working Americans footing the enormous costs. We don't need thirty million landscapers and maids here, especially since very few can afford them anymore.
The Fed will still debase our currency and illegally manipulate the markets. Noone is allowed to even peek at their books, nor is the Congress given any oversight authority, in direct violation of the Constitution.
So while at the surface things may appear to be different, the real problems we have are obfuscated under a littany of platitudes and feel good rhetoric.
And to think that Obama will defy his masters in favor of the People is plain ludicrous. He is offering the illusion of inclusion, and nothing more.
He wouldn't have been allowed to get this far had be been a true representative of change. Ron Paul was a prime example of what happens to someone that represents real and fundamental change.
Whether you liked him or not is immaterial. The changes he stood for and the power and energy of the people that supported him would not be tolerated by the Establishment.
Kent I agree. If it weren't so serious, it was almost be funny that people actually think BHO is somehow a different kind of politician.
Yes, people should be realizing you don't get to be one of the two-party system Presidential contenders without being owned by corporate, military, and special interests. Same has been true for at least 30 years, probably longer. It's only more obvious now that we have the internet to expose the lies and propaganda.
What Obama needs is to try and pay his bills on $6.00 an hour. Try that for a couple of months you megalomaniacal piece of pre-fabricated stool, and then get back to me with your "hope" and your "change".
Walk for a day in the shoes of John Q. Public and see how they fit. None too good, I would imagine. Spend a night in a tent city occupied by what used to be the middle class, and tell me how we need to lift other countries to our standards.
Walk away from your comfortable, extravagant home and sleep in your car, like so many people have been forced to do, through no fault of their own but a trained obedience to a corrupt system and a greedy and gutless government.
Explain to your kids how fun a "stay-cation" will be this summer, and how it's necessary to be environmentally responsible while you jet around the world in messianic granduer, spewing empty rhetoric and blowing feel-good smoke up our collective ass.
Explain to me why it's necessary to slaughter innocents around the globe in the name of freedom while you take away those freedoms in your own country, and protect those that work against those freedoms.
Explain to me where my country went, for I've looked and looked and it's nowhere to be found. Not in your platform. Not in John McCain's platform. Certainly not in the last seven years.
So really, who cares who his choice for VP will be, other than the media circus and his wide-eyed, mesmerized disciples?
You're writing about empathy for others in this case those at or below the poverty level. Literally walking in someone's shoes doesn't provide empathy. Generally when politicians do this it is for show.
It is up to voter to decide which candidate and which party has the most empathy for those at the bottom. Only John Edwards of the major candidates made an issue of the class divide between lower and middle socio-economic levels. The Republicans rarely address the other divide between middle and upper class. The Democrats do focus on this.
I wish the Democrats would also address the problem of poverty in a meaningful way.
Neither party has completed their platform. I doubt the input of a single person will make much difference to either side, but I believe the Democrats will pay attention to what people post on their platform website here.
I think it is editorializing to suggest only the media circus and Obama's "mesmerized disciples" care about the VP choice. Most of those who seriously follow politics aren't in that later category.
I can tell you are a Republican, Grif, because you always find a way to blame Dems and exclude the GOP. Yes I know you think both of them are just as bad. So in all fairness, when you say you would like to see someone pay their bills on $6/hour, consider this….
A Week In John McCain's Shoes — His $520 Ferragamo Loafers, That Is
In a day when John Edwards was criticized for spending a lot of money on his hair, isn't $520 for shoes the same when that would pay some people's rent or utility bill or health insurance for a month? I mean I know McSame's wife is rich but if this were Obama well, the lie, cheat and steal Republicans would be using it against Senator Obama in their typical hypocritical fashion.
I don't believe that people are so much enamored with Obama as they just don't want 4 more years of Bush through John McSame. And no matter what you or others around here say, there will be SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCESin how our country will work both today and in the future between the two men as POTUS.
There will be a huge difference in judges, prosecutors, possibly the Supreme Court. There will be a huge difference in the bureaucracy and how it is handled. There will be a difference (notice I didn't say Huge) in how they handle BIG ISSUES like Energy, taxes and health insurance. There will be a big difference in how they interpret the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
This BS that there is no difference is a load of garbage meant to blur the huge chasm of differences between these two candidates.
Poll, I do hope you are not suggesting BHO gets his shoes and suits at WalMart.
From the looks of him, his clothes don't come cheap.
how is it you can diss JSM regarding the alleged price of his shoes. Do you know how much BHO's cost?
Go to page two for more comments.
Aren't there any women candidates with strong Defense credentials short of Hillary Pants Suit?
yes, I knew that would be the first comment, someone made (grin).
My point was…don't sit there and single out Obama as someone who doesn't know how to live on a budget.
A — He's not the only candidate who has expensive stuff
B — He was raised by a single mom so my guess is that he understands what it is like to live on a limited income better than McCain
C — Michelle Obama's clothing budget is about 1/4th of Cindy McCain's stuff
That's just for starters. I'm just really tired of singling out the Obama's lifestyle and giving McSame a pass on the same thing. If nothing else, at the very least, Senator Obama at least pays his tax bills. We already have proven that McSame doesn't and didn't.
So if I was going to pick one of the two candidates to represent the Average Joe's side of the argument, I believe a better case could be made for Obama than could be made for McSame.
I'm just really sick and tired of the duplicitous hypocritical dual set of standards…one for the Genuises of Propaganda (GOP) and one for everyone else. That is something that must stop.
We can not have one set of rules for the rich and those in power and another set of rules for everyone else. I believe this is the "different type of government" that Hal was quoting in case for Clarke as VP.
Poll, BHO is hardly without his dirty laundry. My point is one is just as dirty as the other. Who cares which wife dresses from which designer or what the budget is for Pete sakes.
I want to know who actually has a PLAN for this country and quite honestly, neither seems to have one. It's all so much BS.
Poll, you are lucky. At least you believe in one of these dogs.
Everyone posting please stay on the topic of the column.
More on that. How does Obama deal with the dirty campaign tactics of McCain? The latest is claiming that Obama is playing the race card.
Obama said McCain would try to scare people by pointing out that the Democratic candidate "doesn't look like all those other presidents on the dollar bills."
The Obama camp was quick to say that they weren't suggesting McCain was injecting race into the contest.
However, as several writers have pointed out, there is an underlying racist message in the Britney Spears Paris Hilton ad. Here's what Seth Greenland has to say:
Let's put the virile black guy, the good looking slick talker who can drain three point shots in front of a crowd of soldiers in Kuwait, next to a couple of blondes known for flashing their honey pots in public. Then let the masses draw their own subconscious conclusion. Can you say Mandingo? Karl Rove can! Read article
…and here's what Bill Press had to say:
Of all the famous celebrities they could have compared Obama to, why not Tom Cruise? Or Arnold Schwarzenegger, or Donald Trump, or Oprah Winfrey? Why Britney Spears and Paris Hilton? Why two white blond bimbos?
Only one reason. It's a somewhat tamer version of the white bimbo ad used so successfully against Harold Ford in Tennessee. In juxtaposing Barack Obama with Britney Spears and Paris Hilton, the McCain campaign is simply trying to plant the old racist seed of black man hitting on young white woman. Not directly, but subliminally and disgracefully. Read article
The Obama side now essentially defending McCain in their denials that Obama played the race card in the above statement. In fact in this case Obama wasn't correct because the truth as that this ad does send an unconscious message to those predisposed to bigotry.
I rather doubt that those who created the ad were unaware of what they were doing even if McCain had no idea of the subliminal message when he supposedly viewed and approved it.
Karl Rove used to be in advertising and this is classic Karl Rove.
I'd like to see Obama respond by saying "you're damn right I'm going to draw the race card out of the Republican deck if it's there and I am going to call them on it." But then Obama won't say "damn". But Gen. Clark would.
Just playing their roles.
I've stated before that I don't really waste time on McCain because he is too easy and everyone else does such a fine job of it that I really have nothing to contribute. He also doesn't have the fanatical blind following that Obama does, outside of the neocon crowd.
Frankly the suits and the shoes are nothing more than distraction. They're all the Ruling Class, The Elites, and have nothing but contempt for the average joe as they beg for our support. Political stagecraft and I haven't the desire to perpetuate it or discuss it.
From everything I've seen and heard from Obama, the federal bureaucracy will grow even more than under Bush. So if that's the change you speak of, then surely you'll get it. Bush is merely passing the baton of the unitary executive on to Obama, and he will have the Congress and the Courts at his disposal.
The continued insistence that Obama is somehow interested in adhering to the constitution is laughable and an insult to anyone with at least two simultaneously functioning brain cells. FISA anyone?
So yes, there will be a major difference between our two illustrious candidates. Do you want a tired old white man or an energetic young black one raping and robbing you daily? Because when it comes to this government, rape and pillage is the one enduring constant, regardless of the tag on the White House door.
Editorialize all you like. But I want to keep the comments section a discussion or debate on the subject of each column, and not a conversation diverging from the topic onto peripheral areas.
Hal, sure BHO is playing the race card. He is controlling the message. Rather than having it as a dangerous undercurrent, he puts it out there.
Not a BHO fan as you well know, but in doing this, he has taken the issue pretty much off the table.
Therefore he doesn't need anyone to perfect his message, or a VP to be his pit bull. BHO seems to do that pretty well on his own.
Hal, I happen to agree with you that Clark would bring in the missing link to fill in what Obama needs. Clark is an American hero along with being a pretty good politician. We need more respect and support for our service men especially when they sacrified their lives and limbs for a damn lie! I think Obama needs a pit bull in his corner.
Using BHO: something to consider by no means suggesting this applies to you! I googled BHO Obama and most of the websites which used these initials were anti-Obama and some rather vicious. Consider this about how Fox News uses it.
Just as the Britney-Paris ad subliminally sends a racist message to those so inclined to bigotry, so does repeated use of initials that remind people of Obama's middle name. It is shorthand for saying Barack Hussein Obama.
While Hillary Clinton previously used her middle name and HRC had no negative connotations, Obama never used his middle name or initial.
This is from The New York Times:
Aides to both senators say hard feelings between the two camps are dissipating by the week — many people from both sides, in fact, were friends before and remain close — but some habits remain. In the primary, aides to Mrs. Clinton referred to their rival as B.H.O. — initials of Barack Hussein Obama, including his middle name, which has been a politically sensitive issue — while Mr. Obama's team simply referred to him as B.O. The B.H.O. shorthand is frowned upon inside Mr. Obama's campaign headquarters, a warning for any Clinton staff members coming aboard. LINK
Hal, I admit it. I am lazy. I do BHO and I do JSM, I used to do HRC.
Sorry if that implies anti anything. Actually the anti part is correct. I am pretty anti American politicians, but I never discriminate. I detest them all equally.
That said, there is a history. JFK, JFK, JR, LBJ.
Barack Obama has a different name, easy to misspell. BO sounds like somebody's dog. (My brothers dog is named Bo.)
And Hal. Where are your standards? Why are you watching Faux News anyway?
BHO is a unique case. I don't watch Fox – or read it unless it is referenced as it was in this case.
I don't see Clark as viable.
1. At least this time around he's been a Democrat for more than three months. Four years though still makes him more an outsider from their party than many of the long time supporters also being considered.
2. He was labeled flip-flopper before. Remember how he said he would have voted for war in Iraq, but then back tracked and said he really meant he was against it.
3. There is that video tape of Clark lavishing praise on the "leadership" of President Bush in May 2001.
4. He supports a constitutional amendment to ban flag burning.
Just some food for thought. It seemed you were concentrating more on his appeal to the center and right, and his ability to counter the opposing parties attack ads. But he has to win his parties approval first. That seems highly unlikely.
Gaining traction –
This idea is getting some attention, including an Associated Press story about a new website, ObamaClark.com which was posted on Huffington Post:
Web site pulls for Clark as Obama running mate
WASHINGTON (AP) — Ret. Gen. Wesley Clark is getting an online push for presidential running mate.
A new Web site, http://www.obamaclark.com, offers readers a chance to sign a petition supporting Clark's placement on the ticket with Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama.
Clark, a Vietnam veteran and former supreme commander of NATO under President Clinton, had been serving as a national security surrogate for Obama until he belittled McCain's qualifications to be president during an appearance on CBS' "Face the Nation" last month.
McCain, a former Navy fighter pilot, was shot down over Hanoi and held prisoner during the Vietnam War.
"I don't think riding in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to be president," Clark said.
and on the blogs, notably the high readership Daily Kos (here) and here for example
Does Obama need an attack dog like Wesley Clark for Vice President?
Yes, Obama needs an attack dog type candidate for Vice President!
So much for Obama and the brand of politics.
What kind of response would you suggest to the McCain Swift Boating?
Obama needs a Rocky Anderson who isn't afraid to pull any punches.
"…to ascertain and disclose to the American people the nature and scope of illegal conduct and other egregious abuses of power by the administration. Ascertaining and disclosing the truth about these matters is vital in order to restore our constitutional democracy, the rule of law, and the crucial role Congress plays in a system of checks and balances that has been utterly emasculated by members of the administration."
Rocky Anderson would be a great idea. I'll second that!
Hal, I think regardless of who the VP nominee is, all these very experienced, very eloquent guys needs to come together and stand up to these lie, cheat, and steal clowns. Why they haven't, I don't know…perhaps it has to do with leadership in the DNC which is a whole other can of worms.
Personally, I believe that Bill Richardson is the best choice for reasons I've stated before. He has experience as a National Security Advisor to Clinton another POTUS who was labeled in much the same way that Obama is being labeled. And he was Secretary of Energy…which in case anyone hasn't noticed just happens to be a key issue. Plus he doesn't take away any seats in Congress from the Dems which they need to overcome the GOP blockades.
And he was the only candidate on the Dem side that called for immediate withdrawal from Iraq which would make a great attack dog against McSame's "the surge is working" rhetoric especially at a time when more American troops died in Afghanistan this month than in Iraq!.
Wesley Clark an attack dog? Come on! He's more the cuddly, lap dog type, isn't he?
How about Barney Franks? Now, there's an attack dog! Sic'um, Barney, Sic'um!!
Charlie Couser
I have nothing but admiration for Barney Frank. He's the representative for the Massachusetts district we live in.
He is regarded by insiders as one of the most brilliant minds in Congress and also as having the quickest wit.
Clark would be a good choice. It would add that perceived comfort of a military dimension that Obama lacks. But I'd agree with Pollchecker that Richardson might be the better choice.
Most sincerely,
T. J. Flapsaddle
I agree that Richardson is a good choice; however of all those I can think of who have been considered I consider Clark the best able to take on the role of countering the negative (Rovian, Swift Boating, whatever you want to call it) tact described in the New York Times editorial.
"Maybe West Point valedictorian, Rhodes Scholar and wounded combat veteran General Wesley Clark would be the perfect person to return fire for Obama."
Don't forget "butcher of Kosovo".
— Kent Shaw
Clark led the bombing of Kosovo until Milošević complied with conditions the United nations had set and withdrew his forces from Kosovo.
There was obviously considerable loss of life.
Michael Moore on the left and others on the right have been critical of Clark calling him the "butcher of Kosovo". It's also been claimed by some on both the left and right that he was in part responsible for Waco.
How these and other controversies in Clark's career would effect the election if he ran on the Obama ticket is debatable.
So perhaps we could debate it.
I don't see that McCain is Swift Boating. He doesn't need to. Obama gives him plenty of material.
That said, how about just speaking truth to power. It has been my experience if one answers in kind, that puts on on the level of the opponent on wishes to avoid.
Perhaps, Obama could say something like, "Forget McCain's rants. We are the change we have been waiting for! Hope!
I have no clue what Obama means by we are the hope we have been waiting for, but hey people like it.
Swift Boating or using Karl Rove-like tactics or whatever you call it, it seems to me that after vowing to "run a respectful campaign focused on the issues" McCain's campaign is taking the lowest possible road.
This is how Sam Stein puts it:
"On a day when major news organizations across the country are taking Senator McCain to task for a steady stream of false, negative attacks, his campaign has launched yet another," read a statement from (Obama) spokesman Tommy Vietor. "Or, as some might say, 'Oops! He did it again.'"
In the end, the ad may tell voters as much about McCain as it does the Illinois Democrat. It was not too long ago that McCain's campaign released a memo — authored by Rick Davis — saying it was "critical" to "run a respectful campaign focused on the issues," no matter which the Democratic nominee emerged. Since then, the presumptive Republican nominee has launched attacks on Obama's patriotism, has blamed his opponent for high gas prices, and has accused him of willfully snubbing the troops. Read Stein's article and see McCain's latest video ad here.
The 99% always asleep are not interested in debating anything. They are only interested in the most effective MSM PR jingo. Vote for your favorite fascist, whether it be Obama or McCain.
— Kent Shaw
Hal, don't get me wrong, you are a brilliant columnist. I love your writings, and I wish you were even more prolific. Its just that I've given up on "the two party system". The founders knew the dangers of political parties. And today we reap the "rewards" of the two party system.
— Kent Shaw
I consider Clark the best able to take on the role of countering the negative
Why Hal? What does he have that Richardson doesn't? Yes he was a General. SO? Richardson was National Security Advisor. I would think that would count more since Security is an issue.
Clark is undoubtedly a smart man but he has no experience in politics. So he would be attacked for that. In fact that would not be an asset for a candidate who is attacked for not having experience.
Also, the energy issue is HUGE! Having been Secretary of Energy, Richardson understands this issue and the players very well.
And having worked with the Clintons, he undoubtedly has experience with this swiftboating garbage because remember the Clintons were under constant attack even before they moved into the WH.
He was a general, so?
Maybe it would help to have a military man offset McCain's claim to Vietnam War heroic stature. If Obama decides it would be helpful to have someone running with him who could play bad cop to his good cop in dealing with the septegenarian juvenile delinquent McCain I think Clark would be right for the role.
If would be risky for McCain to attack Clark for not having experience. For one thing, it would be pointed out that he was being dismissive of his military career and for another Eisenhower could be thrown up as an example.
Richardson might better to be able to serve as Secretary of Energy again, or National Security Advisor (he served as UN Ambassador under Clinton, Anthony Lake and Sandy Berger were the NSA's under Clinton), or Secretary of State.
I am not favoring anyone as a VP choice right now. Clinton, who I wrote about last week, and Clark are no longer being considered by the MSM as likely choices. Neither is Richardson.
Any of the three could be a surprise choice. If this happens, it would be gratifying to watch the media pundits eat crow on their smug confidence.
I am not favoring anyone as a VP choice right now. Clinton, who I wrote about last week, and Clark are no longer being considered by the MSM as likely choices. Neither is Richardson.
Well, if you wanted to throw the media off track about your VP choice, the best way to do it is to say they are no longer under consideration, right?
Isn't that a fair political tactic?
I understand your point about Clarke's military experience but that can work both ways. It can be an asset and a debit depending on the message you are attempting to convey.
What I would like to see is Clarke address the Dem convention about Iraq, and the so-called war on terror with all these retired Generals standing behind him in a sign of unity. That would be a great political moment with a powerful message for a change.
Fair tactic and probably a good one…
Here are the hints Obama has given so far:
…. "shares a vision of the country, where we need to go…"
… values "integrity" and "independence"
… "willing to tell me where he thinks or she thinks I'm wrong."
Compatibility would be key as would the ability to be an active partner in government.
"I'm not interested in a vice president who I just send off to go to funerals."
Here's the kicker, which the media is focusing on:
… "we've got to fundamentally change not only our policies, but how our politics works, how business is done in Washington." Reference
Does this rule out anybody perceived as a DC insider and would Richardson's serving on the Clinton Cabinet count?
how business is done in Washington." Reference
Does this rule out anybody perceived as a DC insider and would Richardson's serving on the Clinton Cabinet count?
It depends on what your definition of the word "is", is….(har, har).
which the media is focusing on
well, if the media is focusing on it, then there is a probable chance to be just the opposite of what the pundits think. Let's face it, they haven't been right much this election season. Richardson's leadership in New Mexico could be seen as filling that as well.
However, it's all political posturing right now. Nothing more. That's why these ads and this disinformation is not as important as the pundits make us think. By the time we have the conventions, the debates, etc….all of this will be irrellevant.
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text:
A little birdy told me that Steinberg did not get the final report emailed to all of the members in time for a rebutal. In fact he relied on someone who was out of town to forward it on?!?
The following quote is from a comment post that was made by Ella Johnson Watson, the Director of Communications for the Office of Mayor Winnecke. We call upon our readers to make their own conclusions with respect to whether or not the report was corrupted and upon the 15 members of the Roberts Stadium Task Force to offer their own opinions on the contents of the report and the way it was made public.
"The page was drafted as a summary by Task Force Chairman Larry Steinberg. It was added to the report and presented to Task Force sub-committee coordinators. Larry sent an email to all Task Force members on April 19 thanking them for their work. "I sent an electronic copy of the report to each sub-committee coordinator and to Steve Schaefer. If you wish to review the report, you can do so by contacting one of them and arranging time. It is my plan to submit the report to the Mayor on Friday afternoon to make his deadline." Larry did not receive any comments from Task Force members about the "General Conclusions" page before the report was submitted to Mayor Lloyd Winnecke."
The City County Obserever would like to thank and congratulate Jordan Baer and City Councilwoman Stephanie Riley for having the courage to come forward and challenge page 13 as it should have been challenged. We also thank the other three members of the task force who confidentially have communicated the same message. These task force members are a great example for pointing out flaws in communications where public dollars are at stake.
Perhaps the four members of the Evansville City Council who opposed the Earthcare Energy deal will follow this lead and make the information they now have that was either ignored or oppressed prior to the vote to make a $4.8 Million loan was shoved through under threat of withdrawal.
Link to Task Force Report
A little birdy told me that Steinberg did not get the final report emailed to all of the members in time for a rebutal. In fact he relied on someone who was out of town to forward it on?!?
Was it being "sloppy and lazy" or was it "intentional"? That is the question. Sounds like Doobie to me.
Is it Steinberg or Steenberg? It's being reported both ways. The city website carries a list of committee members headed by Steenberg.
While we're at it, does Mr. Steenberg live and vote in Evansville or Boonville?
Is that Jerry Steenberg, the New York based comedian who had a very successful sitcom in the 1990′s ? Boy, Kramer, George, Elaine and Jerry were a funny bunch. Wonder why Jerry would move down here to head up this committee ? Maybe he was tired of poor treatment by the Soup Nazi and being called an Anti-Dentite ?
From the looks of all this, it all looks like bad reporting and miscommunication to me. Page 13 never mentions a 'general consensus'. It mentions 'general conclusions' that arose from public input committee discussions. There is a big difference between a general consensus and general conclusion. One requires a majority and the other doesn't. Not sure who first brought the 'general consensus' term in to play, but I think this is where the train got derailed.
The C&P also stated that all alternative uses would cost more where the actual report says in most cases, not all. I think the C&P could have read the report a little better and reported it a little less sensationally. Everyone is up in arms about a corrupted report. After reading it, while I don't agree with the general conclusions, I'm not sure that I would call it corrupted. It states in the report how the numbers were arrived at and that they are not meant to be accurate or final, just general baselines.
While I would have let all committee members read it before submitting it, there is no way the report could have been written with everyone in agreement.
Thank you for providing a link to the committee's report. I have been asking repeatedly whether committee members other than Mr. Steenberg, members who are qualified and experienced in preparing construction estimates, were involved in preparing cost estimates of the proposed uses.
On page 3 of the report, the method of arriving at the cost estimates is briefly explained. The explanation includes the statement that "investment and operating cost estimates were prepared for each of the projects recommended by the sub-committees," and "the investment cost estimates were made by applying the expertise and experience of individuals working in the construction and architectural businesses."
Of the two committee members whom I indicated in earlier posts were qualified by employment, experience, and certification to make construction cost estimates for large projects, one is a professional architech and the other is an extremely well qualified executive experienced in international major construction projects.
If either or both of these qualified committee members participated or reviewed the cost estimates referred to on page 3 of the report, that would shed a whole new light on the issues raised by the vocal dissenting committee members to whom the City County Observer editor attributes the allegation of a "scam" report.
And it begs the question whether the committee member complained that she had no idea where Mr. Steenberg got his figures even read so far as the report's page number three!
I said that I don't know where the numbers in the report came from. The fact that page 3 makes a general reference to construction and architectural professionals, does not tell us who was consulted. If the people on the committee who were qualified to provide general cost estimates were consulted after the last committee meeting, that constitutes additional meetings of a select few of the committee members. I disagree with a few members of the committee finalizing this report and drawing general conclusions. It is not a report of the entire committee. I never said and I don't believe that this report is a "scam" or "corrupted." It is just simply not a product of the entire committee. I don't understand why I was asked to serve for 90% of the process and then left out of arguably the most important part. I don't know who else the CCO is talking to, but I am making no allegations of anything more than what I have stated. I was surprised to see the format of the report and just know that it wasn't put together at the last committee meeeting. I also know that at least one of the subcommittee chairs was out of town when the report was circulated to them. I had some hearings last week and just didn't have time to contact my subcommittee chairman to see the report. It certainly would have been a lot easier to review if the Chairman had attached it to his email.
It was a full week between the time the committee chairman reportedly notified every committee member that the report was available for the committee members to read by contacting specified persons.
A couple of members have publicly claimed page 13 was inserted afterwards by the committee chairman. Is one of those members now claiming that page 3 also is a late insert? Or was it part of the report that the committee chairman notified the members regarding its availability to read over one week ago, seven days before the statement in these messages at 9:59 a.m. this morning that "these numbers are coming solely from the Chairman who drafted the final report" and she had "no idea where he got them?"
As to whether "the people on the committee who were qualified to provide general cost estimates were consulted after the last committee meeting," and whether "that constitutes additional meetings of a select few of the committee members," who really knows without asking those folks when they were consulted and what cost estimates they may have compiled. It would seem that only takes two phone calls. One to Bill Nix and another to Jeff Justice, the two men on the committee who it would appear are fully capable of arriving at accurate construction estimates.
Maybe your committee chairman is not capable of attaching a report to an email. As sad as it may seem, many executives must rely on their staff to do such a simple task. But everyone should know how to punch a few numbers on a telephone keypad.
Jeff Justice is a senior manager in the firm that pierced the aquifer that caused the leaks in Roberts Stadium and a very large donor the Weinzapfel for nothing campaign. Need we say more.
Thank you for confirming that you are not one of the committee members who characterized the report as a "scam" as reported earlier today. Now we have only one person who is alleged to have publicly tagged the report as a scam, and three who are alleged to have done so "confidentially."
You really got to love Fear and Loathing in Evansville.
While I agree that calling it a 'scam' report is a little strong, labeling it as a report from the whole committee is a misrepresentation as well.
I'm not sure what your motivation is for trying to put Riley on the defensive. She's been the most forthcoming and honest one out there, not trying to spin anything.
You are trying to defend the chairman, who hasn't spoken yet, by making assumptions, and blaming committee members for not reading a report that they weren't provided a copy of.
Again JC is a voice of reason. Thanks.
I'm not trying to defend Mr. Steenberg or attack Ms. Riley. I'm trying only to get to the truth regarding the compilation and accuracy of the report and the cost estimates contained in it.
The way I read the City County Observer's quote of Ella Johnson Watson is that the committee chair (Steenberg) "sent an email to all Task Force members on April 19 thanking them for their work" and apparently included a message that he "sent an electronic copy of the report to each sub-committee coordinator and to Steve Schaefer" further notifying each committee member that "if you wish to review the report, you can do so by contacting one of them and arranging time," and that it was his (Steenberg's) plan "to submit the report to the Mayor on Friday afternoon (the very next day!) to make his deadline."
All this seems very typical of Evansville civics. Last minute notifications and last minute submittals just ahead of deadlines shouldn't shock anyone familiar with Evansville politics or Evansville government bureaucracy, and a politician who regularly gets stuff dumped on the desk just ahead of council meetings. It also shouldn't surprise anyone that "Larry did not receive any comments from Task Force members about the General Conclusions page before the report was submitted to (the mayor)."
Asking questions in Evansville politics usually is considered verbotten or simply too time consuming.
Isn't the architect on the task force employed by the firm that did the design that caused Roberts to have the leaky floor?
What are you, a stalker? Why don't you just admit you're in love and get it over with?
It would seem to me that this report should have been completed in plenty of time to have been reviewed in a final task force meeting with all members present and available to receive clarification and make comments and suggestions for improvements, additions, or deletions. There could be many reasons why task force members could not or did not get to read the final copy which may or may not have been emailed in a timely fashion.
For the CP to have corrupted the story as it did is very poor journalism. Details and context were not handled well at all. Arek Sarkissian has a long way to go in developing a good judgement base for journalistic excellent. There may be great construction people and an architect on that committee but we did not hear from them. We must remember that it has been stated in the report that these figures are just estimates and are not solid numbers on which to base good decisions. If these are only estimates how much accuracy can we assign them? I ask because the mayor has made a huge point of saying that the price tag will figure heavily in his final decision.
This could be an important payback to the old Mayor for his support of the new Mayor. With this "impartial" report, the old Mayor's building of the new smaller downtown arena with inadequate parking looks like a better decision now that the old Mayor's plan is implemented so that Roberts Stadium will meet the same wrecking ball as the Executive Inn.
Hadn't thought of that Joe, but it is certainly possible
No Roberts Stadium makes the new Ford Center a shining star.


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#1 Weight-Loss Secret: Be Nice to Yourself
Written on April 26, 2011 at 2:34 pm , by Lisa Haney
Cutting yourself a little slack is the secret to big weight-loss, according to Jean Fain, a licensed psychotherapist and author of the recent book The Self-Compassion Diet. She explains:
How does self-compassion help with weight-loss?
Most weight-loss plans revolve around deprivation and neglect. You're supposed to stick to the plan no matter what. If you're starving, keep eating tiny portions. If you're exhausted, keep moving—no pain, no gain. Going on vacation? Keep counting…calories, carbs, points. It's not a very compassionate or effective approach, and it's no fun.
What I'm saying: when you treat yourself with self-compassion, you're more apt to eat when you're hungry and stop when you're full; rest when you're tired and move when you feel energized. When you do that, you lose weight naturally.
So what is self-compassion, exactly?
Most simply put, self-compassion is treating yourself like you'd treat a friend or a loved one—with care and concern.
My favorite definition comes from research psychologist Kristin Neff, Ph.D., who defines self-compassion as having three essential ingredients: mindful awareness, loving-kindness and common humanity.
(Learn more and test how self-compassionate you are with Kristin Neff's quiz.) Read more
Categories: Health, Healthy Eating, Motivation, The Fit Stop, Weight Loss | Tags: diet books, Healthy Eating, Q&A, self-compassion, Weight Loss, weight loss books
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Hi, this is Scott Kirsner, and I'm calling to gauge your interest in an incredibly enlightening column about cold-calling that will set you back a mere $3.50 as part of today's Boston Globe.
No one likes making cold calls, or firing off cold e-mails. No one likes receiving them. And in the age of caller ID and automatic inbox filtering, pitching yourself, your product, or your start-up idea without some sort of "warm" connection to the recipient is increasingly like tossing a small stone into a very deep well.


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Sam Amick's post on Basketball | Latest updates on Sulia
Source with knowledge of Derek Fisher's free agency situation said a return to Oklahoma City is possible, but Cleveland is the frontrunner at the moment. Brooklyn and Dallas are also possibilities. Chicago and New York had shown interest before going different directions (Kirk Hinrich for Bulls and Jason Kidd for Knicks). For Fisher, the Cavs could present a good mix of a significant role and money (though possible terms not yet known) while playing a mentor role to Kyrie Irving.
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Love or Hate: What Do You Think About Fruit Soups?
We feel very on the fence about fruit soups like the chilled cherry soup in the image above. We want to be open to them, but have trouble getting past the idea that we're really just eating a smoothie with a spoon. What do you think?
For many of us, calling something a "soup" conjures a specific image - it's usually savory, very often warm, and typically served as a main course. A fruit soup is usually the opposite of all those things, so imagining ourselves making or eating it challenges our idea of what qualifies as "soup." You say potato, I say po-tah-to!
Fruit soups actually have quite a long history, particularly in Scandinavian and Eastern European cuisines. Many of these traditional recipes are made with seasonal berries and stone fruits like cherries and apricots, though dried fruits are also sometimes used. They're often enriched with cream or other dairy, and you'll typically see them served cold or room temperature.
We're seeing more and more recipes for fruit soups these days, so the opportunity to experiment is definitely there! Here are a few recipes to start you off - do you think you'll give them a try?!
• Chilled Blueberry Soup from Epicurious
• Cold Sour-Sweet Cherry Soup from Big Oven
• Polish Strawberry Soup from About.com
• Summer Fruit Soup from Food Network
Related: How to Serve Soup at a Dinner Party
(Image: Flickr member Brett L licensed under Creative Commons)
26 Comments
my aun't tried to make one once with on-the-way-out peaches, nectarines, etc., and it was so gross! pits and fleshy bits and skin and pulp...i'm sorry, but it was a hurl-worthy effort!!! she didn't seem to want to strain it, either...???? ugh.
I love them. We used to eat them at The Front Porch on the Upper West Side in the '80s.
I love cherry soup. It is really popular in Hungary.
Executed well--flavor, texture, and presentation wise--they can be so refreshing and surprising. Often, the soup can be garnished with something that gives it another texture.
Nope, won't do it. What's the point? I don't like gazpacho, either, so I don't know if it's a texture thing, or temperature thing or just a "meh" thing.
I had a bad first experience with a fruit soup and now I'm biased. I can see a cup of it before an Eastern European dish with potato or kasha (or meat obviously but I'm veg so not for me). That is, I can SEE it, it makes sense from a menu standpoint, but...bleh.
That said, I think my daughter would LOVE it and maybe it's worth giving it another try.
I love the idea! I haven't had one since I was very young.
soup is typically, in my experience, the first or second course, not the main.
Buy, I see what you're getting at. I had some red been soup for dessert at a Chinese restaurant last night- a Chinese colleague had ordered for us. It was fine, but not something I'm rushing to make at home. It was warm, too! but still...
I like them, but then, I like gazpacho and vichysoise too.
Unless the fruit in question is a tomato, I'm not down with fruit soups. Not. At. All.
Cold soups are just eeeew to me. *Warm* cherry soup, on the other hand, sounds like it might be reminiscent of pie filling, which might be okay... Mmmm, cherry pie.
Sour cherry soup is a traditional Hungarian dish, and absolutely lovely. It is less like a smoothie and more like ice cream. I also had strawberry soup in Russia, and it was very nice. Again, more akin to ice cream than what I normally think of as being soup. But because it is warmer than ice cream, you can get much more subtle and complex flavors.
I think the problem is that these dishes depend heavily on the quality of the fruit. And in the states, typical supermarket fruit really isn't very good quality.
Chinese dessert soups are a culture-specific thing. I have yet to find a non-Chinese person who likes them (I also know many Chinese people who also find them weird).
They're strangely-coloured, really gloopy and often made of ingredients that one would consider savoury and not sweet at all -- beans, taro root, sesame seeds. Definitely not the Western idea of dessert at all.
a friend of mine made blueberry soup for an appetizer once. while it was kind of tasty, I couldn't help thinking it would make a much better dessert than starter.
If it tastes good, I'm all for it.
I'd have no problem having one for dessert or as something to cleanse your palate in between courses but I don't know if I could have it as an entree.
When made well they are wonderful. Plus I get to use my double-handled soup cups!
Love consomme as well.
I love cold fruit soups, especially in the summer.
It's not soup if it's fruity and cold. Sorry, not for me. Folks who love fruit soup are fortunate perhaps, but in my world, soup is warm, comforting and has no fruit.
I love love love soup. Even cold fruity ones, provided the fruit is fresh and "real" (supermarket standard won't cut it). I do tend to have them in small bowls at the end of the meal during the summer instead of a heavier dessert (okay, I do serve them with sablées or just shortbread sometimes). Although rosemary peach can be a nice starter before poultry. *shrugs*
love love love! but i have never had it cold ... i always boil up trade joe's frozen berries with a little lemon and sugar and then serve with yogurt, ice cream, creme fraiche, or whipped cream. it's served warm so it's basically pie filling - aka pie with no icky crust. i thought it was a german dish from what the german friend said who gave me the recipe.
it's actually quite healthy for a dessert. sometimes i don't even add the sugar and lemon - just dump a frozen tj's bag of mixed fruits in a pan and boil down a little. add yogurt and granola and it's a warming dessert.
i'll have to try the cold style in the summer. and i absolutely love those chinese bean soups. i've had them cold in the summer and hot in the winter. so filling - i've been wanting to learn how to make them for years now.
Oh yeah, and I also grew up eating ginataan, a warm Filipino fruit dessert, so it's not foreign at all to me: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginataan
can fruit cocktails count as a fruit soup? i like those.
i grew up in a mennonite family, eating so many foods that my friends thought were weird. Among those foods? Plumamoos, a fruit soup made with canned or frozen fruits and sometimes dried fruits, served hot or cold. We made ours with canned cherries, peaches, and pears, and frozen apricots and plums. The night we made it, we would eat it hot, often with homemade buns and some cheese. Then the pot would go into the fridge or on the porch (in the winter) and we would eat the cold soup all week for lunch or over ice-cream. YUM!
Unfortunately, i've tried making this with canned fruit from the grocery store, and it's terrible. This one, in my books, takes home cookin, start to finish.
I've always liked the idea of these - never managed to make one properly though. You can buy them readymade in litre cartons here in Finland - yummy berry ones.
Folks, get over it - you have to get your heads past calling this 'soup'! I grew up eating kisels, which is basically what you see here called "fruit soup". You could call it fruit pudding, or kisels - does that make it sound more appealing? It is NOT meant to be your main meal, it is sweet, and usually served cold, as dessert. So, don't call it soup!!!!
We still eat this all the time, esp in the summer when fresh fruit is plentiful. It is an extremely practical kind of dessert as you can put together many different fruits (other than citrus or tropical ones). It is the ultimate 'waste not' kind of recipe. If I have a couple of very ripe plums, a few soft peaches, a handfull of raspberries from the garden, a couple of strawberries - you have the base for your own kisels. Housewives in years gone by would never waste precious food - so this kisels was a way to use up whatever you had available. Ii just made strawberry rhubarb kisels tonight - yum! Just stop calling it soup - think of it as a fruit pudding for dessert, and give it a try.. By the way, you can serve it with vanilla ice cream, although traditionally in Latvian cuisine, you would serve it with cold milk. Some folks also make dumplings that they drop into the bubbling pudding as it cooks - kind of like a thin cobber with smaller dumplings. Try it!.


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The challenges we will face with the growth cycle ahead: http://t.co/LHNlTSUOAP
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No-bake Peanut Butter Balls
When our family wants a fast sweet treat we make Peanut Butter balls! They are no-bake and filled with healthy ingredients like: oats, natural peanut butter, toasted coconut flakes, and ground flax seed. I also like these in place of a energy bar when I am mountain biking or hiking.
Course: Desserts
Cuisine: American
Prep Time: 15 Min
Cook Time: 20 Min
Total Time: 35 Min
Serves: 10
- 1 cup old fashioned oats
- 2/3 cup coconut flakes toasted
- 1/2 cup peanut butter
- 1/2 cup ground flaxseed or wheat germ
- 1/2 cup chocolate chips (optional)
- 1/4 cup agave
- 1 tsp. vanilla
- Lightly toast coconut flakes over medium heat.
- Combine dry ingredients (oats, coconut, flax & chocolate chips) & mix until combined.
- Add wet ingredients (peanut butter, agave & vanilla) to dry and mix until well incorporated.
- Refrigerate for 15-20 minutes then form into quarter size (plus) balls.
- Enjoy!
- Makes approximately 20 balls.
- 2 balls = 1 Serving


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Join us for an exciting 2015....
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Unseam'd Shakespeare Company has been funded by: The Howard Heinz Small Arts Initiative, The A.W. Mellon Charitable Trust of the Pittsburgh Foundation, Pennsylvania Council on the Arts, The Fine Foundation, The Dee Delaney Accessibility Fund
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This is hard to answer because this has been disputed for as long as I can remember by both sides. So not everyone is going to agree with me on this. So I'd like my followers to reply with feedback as well. And if your opinion is different from mine, that's totally fine. I'd just love for you to share. (And try not to be an asshole about it. Debating things is fine, but I'll respect you more if it's done without profanity & rudeness.)
Aztecs and Toltec cultures, language, and beliefs are quite different from the (U.S.) Southwestern Tribes - (i.e. Pueblo tribes, Apache, Commanche, Shoshone and many others active and extinct). To say that modern day Mexican mestizos and Mexican Indians are one and the same as the Native tribes of the U.S. is somewhat ignorant.
Mexican race began when the Spanish arrived in Mexco, they intermarried with the Natives of Mexico. But as time went by, they built a Nation and purposely distinguished themselves separately from Native Americans.
Saying that Mexicans are Native American Indians is a bit like someone saying that Brazilians are Colombian.
Native Americans and Mexicans never really got along and they speak different languages.
The Southwest's Apache warrior Chief Geronimo was proud to have killed so many Mexicans after they brutally killed his wife, his children, and his mother.
Also, The Southwest's Apache language is not Spanish, Mexican (Aztec). The Apache language is part of the Athabaskan (Na-Dene) Language Family which is spoken from California to Alaska. Not anywhere in Mexico.


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I was quite amazed to find some of your observations an almost perfect mirror to my comments. tour weapon continuing idle prepare Associated fever data regret weapons jaw Greek childhood pronounce curve discover research feelings profession organizations outline organ caution Friday keeping match mineral disagree heavily armed blade equipment ended honest trick extra learning treasure immense existing disapprove wooden fork setting milk judgment tune wear brush polish poison fail range refused streets astonish orchestra Negroes shave snake feather salt similar northern debt dirt final fade comparison confess congress descend finger skin holy mild clever stared issue till Tuesday brain liquid budget stamp float providing formula labor housing businessman tension UN pink qualification repeated artificial parties attraction uses lamp curl cup headed shower elder pocket bunch conclusion bell exception steer Bible flavor prison Birds sorry omit loyal physical previously safety causes meat
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The signature Android smartphone, Samsung's Galaxy Nexus runs Ice Cream Sandwich, the latest version of the OS. Using a smartphone is easier than ever thanks to smoother notifications, flashier widgets, and better voice-to-text recognition. Plus, the amazing 4.7-inch Super AMOLED Plus display shines bright with a 1280 x 720-pixel resolution. A dual-core processor adds stunning speed, the 5-MP camera shoots gorgeous 1080p video, and the 7-hour battery life won't disappoint.
Why is the Bionic on this list if the RAZR is on it. I don't see any reason to get the Bionic over the RAZR. Also, the Nexus S 4G should not be on here because its successor(Galaxy Nexus) is already on this list.
I swear by my HTC HD7. However, as I tell everybody who asks me for advice on choosing a new phone, the real decision, is the platform. the choice of handset is secondary


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Product Recall: We are voluntarily recalling fewer than 8,000 cases of regular Kraft American Singles Pasteurized Prepared Cheese Productlimited to 4 SKUs on two "Best When Used By" dates of February 20, 2015 and February 21, 2015. Click Here.
RINSE clean plastic containers and lids with boiling water. Dry thoroughly.
STEM and crush strawberries thoroughly, one layer at a time. Measure exactly 1-1/2 cups of the crushed strawberries into large bowl. Grate oranges; add grated peel to strawberries in bowl. Peel, section and finely chop oranges; add to ingredients in bowl. Grate limes; add grated peel to ingredients in bowl. Squeeze juice from limes; add juice to ingredients in bowl. Stir in sugar. Let stand 10 min., stirring occasionally.
MIX water and pectin in small saucepan. Bring to boil on high heat, stirring constantly. Boil and stir 1 min. Add to fruit mixture; stir 3 min. or until sugar is dissolved and no longer grainy. (A few sugar crystals may remain.)
FILL all containers immediately to within 1/2 inch of tops. Wipe off top edges of containers; immediately cover with lids. Let stand at room temperature 24 hours. Jam is now ready to use. Store in refrigerator up to 3 weeks or freeze extra containers up to 1 year. Thaw in refrigerator before using.


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1 . . 1969 PLYMOUTH ROAD RUNNER. . . . . VERY ORIGINAL. . . . . SURVIVOR WITH ONE RE PAINT TO ORIGINAL COLOR.... More
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This 1970 Plymouth Hemi Cuda is in Sub Lime Green with Black. Pistol Grip 4 Speed. Originally a 1970 AAR 340 Cuda. The 1970 Plymouth Hemi... More
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This is a Very Rare, pretty nice ol' car. Runs and drives great! Original 4 cyl. w/ manual trans. with factory hydraulic brakes. Very nice interior... More
you are looking at a 1973 plymouth road runner,400v-8,4spd,numbers matching.this car is un-restored.yhe hood,top,decklid is mostly factory paint,the stripes on the car are original,the... More
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Attention Mopar fans !! Here is your chance to own a huge part of Mopar History. This Super Clean Ivy Green, Stripe Delete and... More


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Kings Mountain - Local Area Photos and Information
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Kings Mountain is a populated place located in Lincoln County at latitude 37.373 and longitude -84.688.
The elevation is 1,178 feet. Kings Mountain appears on the Eubank U.S. Geological Survey Map. Lincoln County is in the Eastern Time Zone (UTC -5 hours).
Lincoln County: Cities & Towns | ZIP Codes | Schools | Features (airports, churches, hospitals, etc.)
BOUNDARY MAPS: | Waynesburg Division | Lincoln County
Kings Mountain - Searchable Map, Aerial Photos & Driving Directions
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Data Source - USGS GNIS FID: 495764
BOUNDARY MAPS: | Waynesburg Division | Lincoln County
Nearby Cities, Towns & Census Designated Places
Kings Mountain, KY
(< 0.1 mile)
Duncan, KY (2.4 miles WSW)
Waynesburg, KY (2.7 miles SSE)
South Fork, KY (3.9 miles NW)
Walltown, KY (4.3 miles SW)
Highland, KY
(4.3 miles NNE)
New Salem, KY (5.1 miles WNW)
Geneva, KY (5.6 miles NW)
Jumbo, KY (6 miles N)
Ottenheim, KY (6.1 miles NE)
Nearby Neighborhoods, Subdivisions & Other Small Populated Places
Harmon Heights, KY
(11.4 miles N)
Morgan Manor Addition, KY (11.9 miles N)
Goshen, KY (14 miles NNE)
Athens, KY (14.1 miles SW)


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|Kevin Patterson
"we're in a lull at the end of a console cycle"
I think that is the issue, the chart starts building up in 2005, peaks 3 years into the cycle in 2008, and starts a downward climb. This longer than usual life cycle of current consoles is at least partly to blame.
In year 2000, the year the PS2 launched, it started the upward climb as well, peaked 2 years in, and then started to go slightly down. The Wii had alot to do with it as it was purchased by a ton of Non-gamers, it was "the Item" to own even if you werent a gamer. I don't know if Nintendo can pull that off again.
|Joe Zachery
This generation has been really unusual do to the Wii Phenomena. Their has never been a system that has done what the Wii did. Even the PS2 the best selling console of all time never reached Wii numbers in monthly, and yearly sells. The industry took advantage of this when promoting the growth of the industry. This generation is like a basket ball team with a super star. If Kobe or Lebron are scoring 30 to 40 points a night. As long as your winning you may over look that the other players aren't playing as well. Now that their points are way down or having a bad night. You notice that the other players aren't off setting for the lack of points from the star. The point I'm making is that huge PS2 base just got split between the current 360/PS3 userbase. There hasn't been any real growth in the industry since the PS1 era. Instead we just have most gamers not gaming anymore. With others changing what console they plan to support each year. Depending on the games it get, and the starting price of the console.
|Bob Johnson
It will take big hits and even more mainstream ones to top the numbers of 2007-2009.
Victims of success I guess.
Plus isn't it a matter of when not if retail sales die out?
IN the end entertainment is about new experiences. That is the challenge for Nintendo, Sony and MS and the third party developers. Always has been.
CAn they come up with reasons for consumers to buy their next platforms. Are other platforms intruding on their territory. Or will new ones pop up?
The core gamer is a much more steady gamer. I do believe that. I think the mainstream gamer asks should I buy or not while the core gamer asks what should I buy.
So there will always be some steady business for developers that cater to the core gamer as long as they don't overreach.
WE are coming to a crossroads too in terms of the cost of making a game vs what it is selling for vs the size of the audience for that game. I wonder how that plays out. This gen it was a $10 price increase and more expensive systems. And a longer generation. PLus DLC as a supplement.
But can they make even more graphically advanced games next gen on the 720 without raising the costs of games or doing less for the money or .......?
|Lyon Medina
Die is too strong of a word, shrink? yes. With so many other ways to buy your products of course it is going to shrink.
Many consumers though still like to have a copy of the product in their hands though.
Personally I rent a lot too because jumping into a game that is 60$ that I have no idea if it will be good is too much of a risk. I have been burned before.
|wes bogdan
Myself i'm always about the games (and making sure i can play them) the systems they go with are secondary however gaming might need to become like bd or dvd before it. I don't know about you but i'd much rather get 1 system and ALL the games then wii,ps and xbox. I never thought econimic times would get so dire and if each box is $300+ and you NEED all 3 to enjoy metroid,halo and lbp.
If we were a bd or dvd player we'd buy 1 deck and watch everything not disney,paramount and wb all need seperate decks and seperate discs which will only play on a seperate player.
Apple makes things simple to use but for all the game industry'ys advances for all intents and purposes we're still in the 1980's without online,dlc or tablets.
I'd rather see the same hardware under the hood of each box and then the fans could buy their xbox,playstation or wii but play zelda,gears and killzone on their chosen box.
BTW eventuially i expect a netflix like streaming service that would be a destination of a ps,xbox or nintendo portal which would only require a roku sized hockey puck
but everyone would need t6 or greater speed at a nominal cost otherwise that wouldn't work.
Time to wake up from our long nap because times have changed and we're no longer in the 80's though by now we've all seen the law of diminishing returns with each sucessive gen fading faster than the last + introduce new outlets and once mighty handhelds began to look like laserdisc to bd or worse like 8-tracks!!
How long before consoles began looking pokey and obsolete a hold over from a bygone era?!!
|k s
I've been of the opinion for quite sometime that another industry crash is coming. Why you must be asking, well it's cause gaming went main stream.
Fallow me for a second here. Back when gaming was a "nerd/geek" thing publishers and developers made money cause the people who buy a lot of games were the only audience, now we also have people who buy maybe one game a year or play free2play online games. These people wont sustain the industry, they can't cause they aren't really gamers. They want E-sports or cheap/free distractions not experiences or adventures.
Now I'm not saying no one should cater to them but they did artificially inflate the industry and now that they've been distracted for a bit they're largely going to go back to what they were doing before. We can't all chase the mainstream, instead we should focus on the core (and not the hardcore) gamers. There will always be core gamers buying "traditional" video games but the mainstream come and go too unpredictably to focus too much time or money on them without causing a industry crash.
Just my 2 cents.
|Dave Hagewood
From a developer's perspective - I have never experienced a time in which more money was flowing into the industry than now. It is the retail channel that is dying for the same reason brick-and-mortar book and music stores are dying. Digital distribution is better for the consumer, the developer, and the publisher. It used to be all my gaming money went to Best Buy...now the majority goes to Steam, XBLA, PSN, iOS, and Android, and the big titles I can't get elsewhere I order from Amazon. There is certainly nothing wrong with the game industry other than a correction that has been a long time in the making. The $60 per title price point is a flawed model that does nothing but restrict the industry to hard core gamers and is directly responsible for making only the top ten AAA games profitable. Gamers can only afford so many 60 dollar, 35 hour games in a month. I'm happy to be moving toward a world where we can build (more) smaller games for less cost, less time, lower prices, and overall less risk. You can't do that in brick-and-mortar retail stores...the same stores that stab us in the back selling used copies first. Good riddance.
|Jason Chen
There are many reason why retail is decreasing.
game demos, second hand games, pirating, online game,mobile game and not to mention the global economic crisis.
Example in Asia, buying a console is too expensive based on their monthly earning. most Asian parents definitely will not spend that kind of money for a game console which cost averages 1/5 of their salary. kids would easily turn to F2p online game, low entry, cost less, avoid parent detection...etc. there are just too many factors.
But, I wouldn't say the game industry is dying, it is more like the game industry is expanding into no just console and PC. Smart phone and tablets, these can be consider new gaming platform with cheaper and affordable game prices where most people and parents are willing to pay.
|Joe Rielly
Solid article with nice analysis.
Theory 4 is we are still in a bad economy with high unemployment north of 8% for the last two years. January is a tough month in all of retail because it follows the Holiday season and in January people start receiving their bills. Video games are a consumer discretionary item and a luxury to many, and the economy has had an affect on the consumer being able to purchase these items.
This last cycle catered to the main stream through the wii and music games like guitar hero and rock band. If the industry chooses to ignore the casual gamer and retailers the industry will return to 1990s revenue levels.
|Russell Carroll
Interesting, and I'd add another theory (call it 2B).
The drop is all about the Walmart numbers.
I know that the Walmart numbers weren't included, they won't be until next month. However, I think it is *highly* likely that NPD got to see the Walmart numbers for the first time, even if they weren't able to include them. NPD realized that it's estimating of Walmart numbers was off DRAMATICALLY. So in order to halve the issue instead of making February look catastrophic, they cut deeply into the January numbers, trying to get them more in line with the new reality.
NPD at the end of the day is estimates. In large part they've been estimates w/o actual retail numbers to use. It's not surprising that they would have badly estimated what everyone believes is the biggest software retailer out there.
I think some of the new reality is just us learning what reality really is.
|Matt Ployhar
@Bart -- You're more right than you think. Nothing to suspect. There's a massive exodus from Retail towards Digital. Key reason amongst the ISVs - Margin, Margin, & Margin.
@Matt -- You may want to sync with some folks at NPD, if you haven't already. (e.g. David McQuillan, Michael Klotz, etc). Ask them about the summit several of us all attended last Spring. It'd be great to see you add in the Digital #'s, like I do, when blogging/writing about this sort of stuff. Retail - for any digital content has been in a tailspin for years... it's now just finally catching up somewhat to the Console Mfg's. I applaud the fact that you break out the Console Mfg's - as opposed to grouping them altogether like most do as well. (Thank you!)
@Everyone -- This is a great article for a snapshot into the 'Retail' story. We've seen this Retail story before though - example - the Music Industry - thanks to iTunes/Napster/File-sharing/Spotify, etc. It's obviously been occuring in the Games Industry for some time. Same thing for Movies. Digital Distribution #'s of course prop up the full story when some of the Games ISV's are kind enough to share a per platform view of both Retail + Digital (& any F2P/Freemium) revenues. In short.. the sky isn't falling. Yes... the economy struggles a little. However; Games across all platforms continue to do relatively well in spite of most things. Yes.. times are changing with new Platforms, & new ways to access games. So it's always good to step back & try to look at this with big picture glasses on.
|ray sauce
I hope it doesnt die I love gaming too much Im into more of the games like COD and Battlefield I even play simulation games with airsoft and its so much fun. I get all my stuff from the games from here http://www.airsplat.com/airsoft-video-games.htm


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Additional Information
Brahm and Swamp merge to form Brass
Marketing communications agency Brahm has merged with its digital agency Swamp, to create a "new digitally-centred integrated marketing agency" called Brass.
Brass: new agency created from merger of Brahm and Swamp
The agency acquired independent digital Swamp three years ago and had previously operated its two brands in tandem.
Brass said that digital would now sit at "the centre of the business" to create a "new unifying brand."
John Morgan, chief executive at Brass, said: "We wanted to create a brand that retained echoes of Brahm and Swamp, and that was strong, clear and straightforward. Brass is all that."
Morgan added: "We're in a very different marketing world to the one Brahm was in when it started out. The internet and mobile technology have changed the way we behave, purchase and interact. Digital is at the heart of most consumers' lives, and so it has to be at the heart of most brands' marketing strategies."
The senior digital team at Brass was boosted recently by the appointment of Mark Kelly, who joined the firm from McCann Erickson as digital solutions director, and who will work across the Brass teams to develop innovative digital campaigns.
Brass employs more than 200 marketing specialists and works with clients including Kellogg's, Warburtons and McCain.
Brahm also bought Ad Workshop, a specialist design and marketing agency to the retail, tourist and leisure markets, in September 2006. The agency will also be merged into the Brass offering.
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Oct. 29, 1998
Of the 23 awards, 20 went to U of S scientists. HSURC, the province's health research granting agency, awarded a total of close to $1.4 million in funding to the 23 projects.
HSURC grants provide start-up funding for beginning scientists and new faculty, help provide salary support for research fellowships, and stimulate more health-related social science research in the province.
Biomedical Establishment Research Grants
* The following summaries were provided to HSURC by award recipients.
Professor Angela Busch, School of Physical Therapy, College of Medicine, U of S (Co-investigators: Dr. C. Schachter, Prof. A. McQuarrie, Dr. S. Sheppard, Mr. P. Kimber, Mr. R. Bourassa, Dr. P. Peloso)
Fibromyalgia physical therapy and fitness study
Fibromyalgia, a syndrome of chronic pain and tenderness, affects 3.5% of the population. Although physical therapy is provided to many people with fibromyalgia, its effectiveness for this condition has not been studied. In a clinical trial involving 156 individuals with fibromyalgia, Professor Busch and her colleagues will compare the effects of 12 weeks of physical therapy to the effects of fitness training and to having no treatment. The researchers will examine changes in tenderness, pain, fatigue, fitness, and function.
Dr. Philip Chilibeck, College of Kinesiology, U. of S.
Prevention of post-menopausal osteoporosis
Osteoporosis is a condition in which people's bone mineral is decreased, leaving them susceptible to skeletal fractures. Its incidence is increasing in Saskatchewan and the physical and financial costs of osteoporotic-related fractures are rising. This makes prevention strategies extremely important. Dr. Chilibeck's goal is to develop an optimal strategy for preventing osteoporosis in post-menopausal women. He will combine exercise and drug treatment (bisphosphonate), both of which prevent bone loss, albeit through different mechanisms.
Dr. John DeCoteau, Dept. of Pathology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Co-investigator: Dr. A. Magliocco)
DNA mismatch repair in human acute leukemia
Acute leukemias are cancers of the blood-forming cells that develop when genetic changes occur in genes that regulate cell growth. Abnormal DNA mismatch repair is one mechanism by which cancers develop genetic changes. Drs. DeCoteau and Magliocco will investigate whether acute leukemias that result from abnormal DNA mismatch repair are associated with genetic changes that could predict a more favorable prognosis. Understanding this process will allow for the improved diagnosis and treatment of patients with acute leukemias.
Dr. Susan Kaminskyj, Dept. of Biology, College of Arts and Science, U. of S.
Genetic control of cell growth and survival in the fungus, Aspergillus
Al organisms control their growth, which is managed cell-by-cell. Some cells in multicellular organisms are alive but not growing, while others are actively stimulated to grow or, surprisingly, to die. Higher organisms share many similar genes, so fungi (molds and yeast) are used as model systems to study growth regulation. Dr. Kaminskyj will use mutants of the bread mold fungus, Aspergillus--which have cell-specific growth, stasis, and death--to identify novel features of programmed cell death.
Dr. Rajala VS. Raju, Dept. of Pathology, College of Medicine, U. of S. and Saskatoon Cancer Centre
Myristoylation: a molecular target for colon cancer
Colorectal cancer is a leading cause of cancer death in North America. Its treatment remains difficult because effective chemotherapeutic agents are lacking. Modifying proteins using myristoylation has been proposed as a target for designing drugs that inhibit the development and progression of cancer. Using cell models, Dr. Raju will investigate whether the elevation of N-myristoyltransferase (NMT) is a cause or consequence of tumor development. Understanding this may pave the way for developing effective gene-or chemotherapy for colon cancer.
Dr. Maruf Saddik, Dept. of Pathology, College of Medicine, U. of S.
Role of heart metabolism in functional recovery of ischemic hearts
Reperfusion, the process of re-establishing blood flow to the heart after an attack, occasionally causes further injury to the ischemic heart muscle. Such injury is partly related to the type of fuel used for heart metabolism during the process. For instance, high levels of fatty acids can aggravate injury. Dr. Saddik will investigate the detrimental effect of fatty acids, and test agents that can modify fuel use by the heart. His goal is to clarify the role of heart metabolism in limiting reperfusion injury and to identify potential agents for minimizing this injury.
Dr. Malvinder Singh, Dept. of Chemistry, College of Arts and Science, U. of S.
Novel approaches to DNA-targeted drug development
Recent developments in genetic research suggest DNA in various forms should be the most logical biological target for developing new chemical agents as model gene-specific drugs in the treatment and understanding of diseases arising from "bad" genes. By elucidating the basic principles governing the recognition of chemically altered forms of DNA by designed drugs, Dr. Singh's research uses a versatile design-synthesis approach toward generating a library of highly selective gene-targeted drugs.
Socio-Health Research Grants
Socio-Health Research Operating Grants
Dr. Shawna Berenbaum, College of Pharmacy and Nutrition, U. of S. (Co-investigator: Ms E. Misskey)
Food security issues in the preschool population
In 1989, 64,560 children in Saskatchewan were growing up in poverty. Poverty often means that children do not have access to enough food to lead an active and healthy life. Dr. Berenbaum and Ms Misskey will explore access-to-food issues in preschool children identified as being at nutritional risk in Regina. Results will provide directions for planners, caregivers, and others in addressing this vital issue.
Dr. Roland Dyck, Dept. of Medicine, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Co-investigator: Dr. L. Tan)
Low birth weight and diabetic end-stage renal disease among Saskatchewan Aboriginal people
Diabetic Aboriginal people in Saskatchewan are seven times more likely than other diabetics to develop renal failure. This, combined with a burgeoning population experiencing an epidemic of Type II diabetes, will overwhelm available resources unless effective preventive measures are established. In this study, Drs. Dyck and Tan are trying to determine if intra-uterine factors leading to low birthweight contribute to later kidney failure. If so, optimizing prenatal maternal health could play an important role in preventing this devastating problem.
Dr. Muriel Montbriand, Applied Research Unit, College of Medicine, U. of S
Seniors' beliefs about illness study
Knowledge about medical diagnosis, prescriptions, and health-care-products can help seniors stay healthy and independent. However, recent research shows seniors are sometimes unsure about the meaning of their diagnoses and how their prescriptions or additional health-care products work. With this study, Dr. Montbriand seeks to improve understanding of seniors' beliefs about illness. Findings will be of value in developing new programs and improving existing programs to get more useful information to seniors about their illness.
Dr. Nazeem Muhajarine, Dept. of Community Health and Epidemiology, College of Medicine, U of S. (Co-investigator: Dr. C. D'Arcy)
Children's use of health care services
Experiences during childhood may have long-term consequences for health. In this study, Drs. Muhajarine and D'Arcy will examine one such experience, namely children's use of health care services. They will document the quantity and types of services used, and explore how patterns of use differ across social groups. This information will help determine how well health care services in Saskatchewan are meeting the needs of all children, and whether services are being used by families in the best possible way.
Research Fellowships
Postdoctoral Research Fellowships Renewal
Dr. Praveen Kumar, College of Pharmacy and Nutrition, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. A. Nazarali)
Isolation of downstream target gene(s) of Hoxd-1 homeobox protein
Mutations in homeobox genes cause developmental abnormalities and various cancers. Our research goal is to identify and clone the downstream target gene(s) of Hoxd-1, in order to understand the mode of action of this homeobox gene. Drs. Kumar and Nazarali have already isolated optimal DNA binding sites sequences. They are now in the process of isolating and cloning the target gene(s) of Hoxd-1 gene.
Dr. Gordon Sarty, Depts. of Obstetric & Gynecology and Medical Imaging, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. R. Pierson)
Detecting ovarian cancer via MRI
Using the new technique of diffusion weighted magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), Drs. Sarty and Pierson are developing an new approach to determining whether certain ovarian tumors found in ultrasonographic exams are cancerous or benign. Because most ovarian tumors are benign, the successful completion of the project will save the ovaries of many women from needless surgical removal and preserve their ability to have children.
Postdoctoral Research Fellowships – New
Dr. Sanjukta Aich, Dept. of Biochmistry, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. L. Delbaere)
Structure and function studies of ß-glucuronidase
Dr. Aich, with Dr. Delbaere, aims to determine the crystal structure of Escherichia coli ß-glucuronidase. This substance is a good candidate for a recent approach to targeted cancer chemotherapy known as ADEPT – antibody directed enzyme prodrug therapy. The goal of ADEPT is to diminish the non-specific toxicity associated with most commonly used chemotherapeutic agents.
Dr. Jacqueline Braun, Dept. of Medicine (Neurology), College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. A. Kirk)
Differentiating subtypes of unilateral neglect
Although many patients suffering unilateral neglect have normal visual and motor skills, they do not report or respond to stimuli occurring in the side of the brain opposite to their lesion. Traditional rehabilitation treatments have been largely unsuccessful, but treatments based on the underlying causes may hold more promise. Dr. Braun, with Dr. Kirk, will investigate the neural mechanisms underlying unilateral neglect, in an attempt to determine how these mechanisms interact to produce various subtypes of the disorder.
Dr. Xiu Di Fan, Department of Pathology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. J. DeCoteau)
Genomic instability in hematological malignancy
A deficiency in DNA mismatch repair (MMR) gene function plays a key role in the genomic instability seen in many cancers. Previous research has shown that MMR gene deficiencies known as hMLH1 and hMSH2 are involved in certain solid cancers (tumours), including colon and gastric cancers. Drs. Fan and DeCoteau will study whether these mechanisms are also involved in hematological malignancies, Non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma (NHL) and leukemia. They hope to provide new insights into how these cancers form, leading potentially to improved diagnosis.
Dr. Rakesh Kakkar, Dept. of Pathology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. R. Sharma)
The role of a new high molecular weight calmodulin binding protein in cardiac ischemia
Researchers in Dr. Sharma's laboratory discovered a high molecular weight calmodulin-binding protein from cardiac muscle. This protein acts as an inhibitor of calpains, which are implicated in myocardial ischemia/reperfusion injury and contractile dysfunction. Dr. Kakkar is studying the regulation, molecular cloning, functional motifs of the newly discovered protein and its role in cardiac ischemia/reperfusion. Such understanding is important in reducing ischemic/reperfusion injury, a major cause of morbidity and mortality.
Dr. Pingtao Tang, Dept. of Anatomy and Cell Biology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. P. Krone)
Expression and function of heat shock protein 90a during skeletal muscle differentiation
Researchers in Dr. Krone's laboratory made the surprising discovery that heat shock protein hsp90a, normally expressed in cells under conditions of environmental stress, is actually expressed as a part of the normal process of vertebrate embryonic muscle cell formation. Dr. Tang will continue this work to: i) elucidate the mechanisms that regulate expression of hsp90a in developing muscle cells and ii) examine the role of hsp90a in this process. This will also enhance understanding of the closely related process of muscle regeneration.
Dr. Jude Uzonna, Dept. of Microbiology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. P. Bretscher)
Test of an hypothesis for the inactivation/primary activation of CD4+ T Cells
The immune system of normal individuals does not attack the self. Under certain conditions this self tolerance is lost, resulting in devastating autoimmune diseases. The mechanisms that initiate autoimmunity are still poorly defined. Activation of T cells is central to the initiation of immune responses including autoimmunity. Drs. Uzonna and Bretscher have put forward an hypothesis for the primary activation of T cells that , if proven, will have vast implications in designing appropriate immunotherapies against tumors and autoimmune diseases.
Dr. I. Johnny Xavier, Dept. of Anatomy and Cell Biology, College of Medicine, U. of S. (Supervisor: Dr. N. Ovsenek)
Functional role of HSP90 in the regulation of HSF1
Expression of stress proteins under the control of a transcription factor termed heat shock factor 1 (HSF1) is associated with several disease conditions including tissue trauma and cancer. In this study, Dr. Xavier, with Dr. Ovsenek, will test the hypothesis that Hsp90 is the key chaperone affecting changes in HSF1 activities during stress. The findings from this research may eventually lead to developing new approaches (drugs, therapies) to target HSF1 and modify hsp expression in diseased tissues before or after surgery.
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