text: Niles PS6SI Pro Stereo-input planter speaker (Weathered Concrete) Zoom Front Photos Videos Item #: 190PS6SIPC Review Summary 3 people say In Stock Free Crutchfield lifetime tech support Free Shipping Your price $459.99 each Available options: Weathered Concrete-$459.99 Terracotta-$459.99 Add to cart + Add to wishlist Email me alerts for this product $390.99 Scratch & Dent Buy this item and earn up to 460 Rewards points See more offers and ways to save Special Financing Available x By buying this product you'll earn up to 460 Rewards points. When you sign up for a Crutchfield account, you'll be enrolled in Crutchfield Rewards. You'll earn one point for every dollar you spend on gear from us. You can turn your points into Rewards Cards that you can use toward future purchases. You can sign up for an account now, or after you complete your purchase (you'll get credit for the points either way). Sign up for a Crutchfield account Overview Details Customer Reviews Q&A Articles & Videos Accessories Our take on the Niles PS6SI Pro by Marshall Chase Outdoor speakers let you move the party outside Outdoor speakers are built tough -- they laugh at wind, rain and weather. Tuck a pair under your eaves and they'll pump out the tunes to keep everybody smiling and swaying at your next cookout or pool party. We also have some "rock" speakers that blend seamlessly into your landscaped lawn or garden. Music in bloom Now your plants can bring harmony to your home in more ways than one. Niles helps with a lovely speaker that serves as an outdoor planter. This speaker delivers full, rich sound to liven up your cookouts and backyard ballgames while welcoming your flowers, herbs, or greenery in its weatherproof cabinet. The PS6SI Pro comes with a flush-mount side grille that's naturally camouflaged. Your guests might wonder just how you're producing those great outdoor tunes. Niles designed the PS6SI Pro for spacious, high-fidelity sound. A 6-1/2" woofer and two custom-angled tweeters disperse crisp sound over a wide listening area. And the separate left- and right- channel inputs give you both halves of the stereo mix from just a single speaker. Got wire? Most speakers don't include any. Learn more about in-wall wiring at the Crutchfield Learning Center. Shop our selection of in-wall speaker wire. See more info on this item Highlights:designed to accommodate live plantslooks like a regular terracotta planterMicroPerf aluminum grille blends naturally into enclosure6-1/2" polypropylene wooferdual 1" custom-angled tweetersstereo inputs allow one-speaker or two-speaker setupshandles up to 100 watts8-ohm impedance (in single-speaker stereo mode)dual 3-foot burial-rated connection cables with waterproof connectors19-1/2"W x 19-1/2"H x 19-1/2"Dweight: 35 poundswarranty: lifetimeOur 60-day money-back guarantee Hands-on research from the Crutchfield Labs (what are the Labs?) Features and specs chart | What's in the box? | In-depth notes Features and Specs Enclosure Acoustic Suspension Tweeter Type Tri-Laminate Teteron Midrange Size None Woofer Size 6-1/2 Woofer Composition Talc/Polypropylene Woofer Surround Butyl Rubber Power Range (watts) 10-100 Sensitivity Not Given Impedance (ohms) 8 Frequency Response Not Given Connector Type Bare wire Height (inches) 19-9/16 Width (inches) 19 Depth (inches) 19 Weight (pounds) 35 Mounting Bracket Included No Parts Warranty Ltd. Lifetime Labor Warranty Ltd. Lifetime Product Research What's in the box? Download owner's manual Stereo input planter speaker with weathered concrete finish (with two attached 2' lengths of speaker wire) 4 Wire nuts Installation Guide Our Product Research Team At Crutchfield, you'll get detailed, accurate information that's hard to find elsewhere. That's because we have our own in-house Product Research team — they open the box, verify contents, check the owner's manual, and record dimensions, features and specs. We stay on top of new products and technologies to help people make informed choices. Features Overview: The Niles Audio PS6Si Pro is a round planter with a built-in stereo input speaker that can be used indoors or outdoors. It is designed to accommodate live plants features two drain-holes to allow water to drain from your plants. Available in a weathered concrete finish and terra cotta finish. Drivers: The speaker has a down-firing 6.5" dual voice coil, injection-molded TCC (Talc/Carbon/Ceramic) filled polypropylene woofer with a butyl rubber surround. There are two 1" fluid-cooled tri-laminate Teteron tweeters that can be adjusted to vary the sound dispersion from 180º for open areas, to 90º for corner installations. The dual tweeters and single woofer provide a quality stereo signal with just one speaker. Grille: The four aluminum MicroPerf grilles on the planter speaker have hundreds of precisely-sized perforations, creating an acoustically transparent grille. The aluminum construction resists oxidation, enabling years of trouble-free operation in the harshest conditions. Both sides of the grille are painted for added protection. Wiring: The speaker features separate left and right channel inputs. Two 2', burial-rated connection cables are attached to the bottom of the planter. Waterproof wire nuts are provided to connect your speaker wire to the speaker. The proper speaker wire gauge is determined by the length of the run: 16-Gauge: Maximum Distance: 60' 14-Gauge: Maximum Distance: 100' 12-Gauge: Maximum Distance: 160' Configuration: The speaker can be wired to be used as a single speaker, stereo input mode, or in a 2-speaker stereo mode. In the one-speaker stereo input mode, the speaker is 8 ohms. In the two-speaker stereo mode, the speaker is 4 ohms. The speaker will be louder when used in a two-speaker configuration compared to a single speaker. The speaker will cover a circular area with a diameter of 22'. Temperature Extremes: The Niles Audio PS6Si Pro planter speaker can withstand temperatures of -50° to 185° Fahrenheit. Review this product Submit a review and then enter to win a $500 rewards card Niles PS6SI Pro Reviews Average Customer Review: 3 people say: Review this product: Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences about this product. Please be sure to focus your comments on the product itself. Read our Review Guidelines for more information. Review title * Email Your email won't be visible. Please use the email address that is associated with your order. Display name (e.g., JohnD) Your review will be signed using the display name and location * Your location (e.g., Charlottesville, VA) * Your rating Click on a star to rate the overall product on a scale of 1-5 1500 characters left * Your review Attach a YouTube Review Crutchfield Video Review Guidelines Only submit videos that you made or are authorized to use. Do not submit videos that contain music, video or visuals that are copyrighted and belong to someone else. Please see our Review Guidelines for more information. Submit the URL of your YouTube™ video review or product demonstration. e.g., "http://www.youtube.com/v/o79TWHh598U" 500 characters left Pros 500 characters left Cons * Agree to Terms By checking this box you agree your review becomes the property of Crutchfield, that you are over 18 years of age, that you own or have owned this product, and that you are located within the United States or its territories. Please see our Review Guidelines for more information. We reserve the right (but are not obligated to) review all submissions and edit or remove any review in any manner which we deem necessary. Your review should be posted within seven days. Filter by rating: 5 Star: (0) 4 Star: (0) 3 Star: (0) 2 Star: (0) 1 Star: (0) 5 out of 5 Speaker with style Written By PS6Sl, Tucson AZ on Wednesday, September 17, 2014 Crutchfield Customer Review (What's this?) Looks good and sounds great. Simple to install with clear directions and options for different single and dual speaker setups. Hooked to a Denon AVR 300 from our Ramada with 100 ft of underground CL 2 cable. Pros: Sounds good, easy to setup and lighter than expected, Cons: Scratches easy when placed on rocky landscape. Was this review helpful? Yes | No 5 out of 5 Great sound in a good looking package Written By MarkM, Leesburg, VA on Friday, June 13, 2014 Crutchfield Customer Review (What's this?) Paired two of these with a Sonos Connect:Amp. Provides great high-end sound as well as a surprising level of bass for an outdoor speaker. Pros: good look. Provided connectors appear well suited for outdoor use Cons: provided connectors too small to accommodate 12ga speaker wire Was this review helpful? Yes | No 5 out of 5 Niles PS6SI Pro Written By DR, CT on Thursday, March 20, 2014 Crutchfield Customer Review (What's this?) sounds Great easy to hook up fast delivery Pros: looks nice with plants in Cons: none Was this review helpful? Yes | No Add accessories for the Niles PS6SI Pro Add Accessories UL-listed speaker wire is designed to be run through walls and is building code compliant. See all categories & accessories UL-listed speaker wire is designed to be run through walls and is building code compliant. In-wall Speaker Wire Set the volume level in your remote location without going back and forth from indoors to outdoors. In-wall Volume Controls Add power protection to your outdoor speakers and volume controls. Power Protection AudioQuest FLX-14/2 14-Gauge 2-Conductor In-Wall Speaker Cable UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (125 feet) 51 people say Your Price: $129.99 Add to Cart AudioQuest FLX-14/4 14-Gauge 4-Conductor In-Wall Speaker Cable UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (125 feet) Options 125 feet-$219.99 250 feet-$439.99 UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (125 feet) UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (250 feet) 2 people say Your Price: $219.99 Add to Cart AudioQuest FLX-16/2 16-Gauge 2-Conductor In-Wall Speaker Cable UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (125 feet) 28 people say Your Price: $99.99 Add to Cart AudioQuest FLX-16/4 16-Gauge 4-Conductor In-Wall Speaker Cable UL-approved for in-wall use; direct-burial rated (125 feet) 7 people say Your Price: $159.99 Add to Cart Niles WVC100E Weatherproof stereo volume control with impedance magnification 15 people say Your Price: $124.99 Add to Cart Russound WALTX-2 Weatherproof stereo volume control with impedance magnification Your Price: $134.99 Add to Cart Panamax MOD-SPKP Add-on protection module for outdoor speakers and control lines Your Price: $54.99 Add to Cart Why choose SquareTrade? The #1-Rated Protection Plan Thousands of people have reviewed SquareTrade Protection Plans — and made us #1. 5-Day Service Guarantee & Free Shipping We'll repair or replace your item in five business days or less after we've received it, or your plan is free. And, as always, we pay for all shipping. Protection from Normal, Everyday Use Repairing your average mechanical or electrical failure can cost as much as buying a new device. With SquareTrade, you're covered — including parts and labor. For a more in-depth review and enhanced detailed information on the Niles PS6SI Pro, please visit the Crutchfield website product page (/ISEO-rccbcspd/p_190PS6SIPC/Niles-PS6SI-Pro-Weathered-Concrete.html ). × Front Searches related to the Niles PS6SI Pro Stereo-input planter speaker Niles Niles Outdoor Speakers Best Outdoor Speakers Outdoor Speakers under $500 Niles PS6SI Pro reviews Niles PS6SI Pro vs Polk Audio Atrium4 Niles PS6SI Pro vs Definitive Technology AW 6500 Niles PS6SI Pro vs Bose® Free Space® 51 environmental speakers Niles PS6SI Pro vs Boston Acoustics Voyager® 40


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This timeline looks at the history of our Group, from 1898 to the present day. Renault's extraordinary industrial and human adventure features emblematic models, plant openings, sporting achievements, charismatic people and game-changing innovations.

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August 21 – Happy Birthday Johnny Ellis
When Johnny Ellis first came up to the Yankees in 1969, he was a catcher. The problem for Ellis back then was that the other catcher the Yankees promoted from their farm system that same season was a guy by the name of Thurman Munson. So the Yankees started playing Ellis at first base and he did OK there. In fact, I do remember having hope back then that this New London, CT native would become the next great Yankee first baseman. That didn't happen.
He was never really more than a part-time player during his four seasons in the Bronx and then was included in a package of players that was dealt to Cleveland in November of 1972 for Graig Nettles. He had his two best big league seasons as Cleveland's DH and part-time first baseman and then put back on his catching gear when he was traded to Texas in 1976, where he was the Rangers' backup receiver for the final half-dozen seasons of his 13-year Major League career. In 883 games lifetime, Ellis averaged .262 and hit 69 home runs.
Also born on this same date was this last great Yankee closer before Mariano.


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INGLEWOOD, Calif. (June 12, 2011)- Jockey Patrick Valenzuela will be Kurt Hoover's guest on The Inside Scoop Saturday, June 18 at Hollywood Park.
Valenzuela, who is approaching 100 stakes victories at Hollywood Park, and Hoover will discuss several races on the card, including the $250,000 Vanity Handicap and the $70,000 Manhattan Beach Stakes. Valenzuela has won the Grade I Vanity twice – Track Robbery (1981) and Brought to Mind (1991).
The Inside Scoop will begin at 12 Noon at the Paddock Tote Board.
Copyright © 2009-2014, Hollywood Park. All rights reserved.


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The Resource Center has all the info you'll need From content to user feedback, the resource center has the information you need for every level of the entrepreneurial process.
In the race to get new medical devices to market, companies encounter FDA speed bumps that slow down the process. But would we really be willing to accept the risks that would accompany fast FDA approvals?
Medical devices could get to market faster if regulators didn't have to test for both safety and efficacy of new devices. Read more about how the use of post-market studies could bring new therapies to patients more quickly.
The Institute of Medicine (IOM) released a report recommending the 510(k) process be scrapped. Read more about the medical device industry's reaction.
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You've got a routine just like everyone else. But there's only one thing that comes to mind when getting spruced up: now's the time to shine! Put on the Rituals halter dress by Rusty and voila — getting ready just got a whole lot easier. Its solid color crotchet bodice with scalloped trim adds a little sweetness and its custom tie dye mix design printed all over the bottom half certainly adds the perfect amount of spice. As if it couldn't get any better than that, this darling number has two extremely convenient pockets. Step aside, mundane dresses — this fine getup is a total show stopper.
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It's Friday again ONE Condoms supporters and when Friday rolls around it's time for ONE's weekly links roundup! Below you'll find news stories from the last week regarding condoms, safe sex, and sex education. Be sure to check out the developments in mandatory condom use for porn actors, QR Condoms, and the "Study Sex College Tour," all of which have been rocking the sexual health world this past week.
If you'd like to share any additional stories we may have missed please leave them in the comments. We'd love to hear what else is going on in spreading safe sex awareness.
Condoms In Porn Petition: Los Angeles County Measure Could Make It To November
Condom users make big mistakes that can lead to pregnancy, STDs
Women's Condom Use Drops During 1st Year of College
QR Codes on Condoms: 'Check-Ins' Let You Share Your Safe Sex
Money Seems to Matter for Teen Girls, Condoms
China enforces new condom rule
Safe Sex
Zac Efron Earns a Boy Scout Safe Sex Badge
Program Increases Safe Sex Practices in Latina Women
Condom use 101: Basic errors are so common, study finds
Sex Education
Sex education should be a joint responsibility of parents, teachers
'Study Sex College Tour' makes Sex Ed cool, prioritizes pleasure
Utah Will Be Damned if Sex Ed Classes Teach About Anything Sex-y


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Matthew Nielson - Catherine Fahringer Memorial Student Activist Award
Matthew "Max" Nielson, 18, is the principal plaintiff in FFRF's federal lawsuit challenging illegal graduation prayer at his high school. Two younger students have signed on as plaintiffs. Max is an honors and international baccalaureate candidate. He's training for a black belt in American freestyle karate this summer. He's an Eagle Scout who is religiously unaffiliated. Max received a $1,000 Catherine Fahringer Memorial Student Activist Award from FFRF in 2012.
Early in the 2011-2012 school year at Irmo High School of Lexington Richland School District 5 in Columbia, S.C., faculty members distributed ballots to determine whether a majority of graduating seniors were in favor of holding a prayer at their graduation ceremony. The majority was in favor, to no one's surprise.
District policy allows for that action, so long as the prayer is nonsectarian and nonproselytizing — which is to say, it can be explicitly Christian, so long as it makes no distinctions between Catholics and Baptists, for example. The spirit of inclusion stops there.
I wasn't comfortable getting that ballot in my English class, but growing up as an atheist in South Carolina, I was used to exposure to public prayer and the religious status quo. After becoming familiar with Harrison Hopkins' story — a student activist who, with the help of FFRF, reversed his school district's stance on a majoritarian-governed graduation prayer in South Carolina last year — I took immediate action. Timing was critical, as I was inspired to take action just 10 days before the graduation ceremony.
FFRF moved swiftly, issuing the appropriate letters of notice and securing a spectacular lawyer for local counsel. I met with the district superintendent to discuss the issue to attempt to reach a resolution. He delivered his decision in a follow-up email after we met, which ironically states, "I do not believe that Freedom of Religion should be interpreted as requiring Freedom from Religion within the public schools."
As such, the prayer and lawsuit proceeded. I recruited two younger students from Irmo to join the suit to ensure that it will survive despite my graduation and departure from District 5.
This event lead my realization that I have a true passion for secular activism, and I plan to tenaciously pursue involvement with the College of Charleston's chapter of the Secular Student Alliance throughout my next four years of education.
Jeff Shott - Paul J. Gaylor Memorial Student Activist
Jeff Shott, 17, is the first recipient of the Paul J. Gaylor Memorial Student Activist Award, a newly endowed scholarship of $1,000. Similar awards offered through FFRF are the annual Thomas Jefferson Youth Activist Award and the Catherine Fahringer Memorial Student Activist Award. Jeff is a student at Summit High School in Spring Hill, Tenn., 30 miles south of Nashville.
FFRF, with two student activist endowments last year, actually gave out an additional four $1,000 awards. Many more student activists deserve recognition. If you'd like to endow and name a student activist award to reward freethought or state/church activism, contact Annie Laurie Gaylor at .
I'd arrived at school this Monday before 8:15 a.m. and waited in the cafeteria until classes started, eating breakfast with friends and adding finishing touches to my Jesus costume.
The head principal, Dr. Farmer, soon came up and asked me to come to his office. The assistant principal, Ms. Lamb, and Officer Pewit, school resource officer, were waiting outside the cafeteria. Dr. Farmer asked me whom I was portraying. I told him that I was Jesus Christ. He said he had been hoping my answer would have been Zeus (or some other variation of a mythological deity).
Even though I'm typically very openly atheistic and have no problem discussing my views, I was a little distraught that all three school authority figures were addressing me at once. Dr. Farmer claimed I couldn't have things both ways — I couldn't complain about teachers talking about Jesus and also dress up as Jesus on Fictional Character Day.
I'd had a long talk with him earlier after my science teacher, in reply to a question about evolution, had publicly said things such as "Evolution is just a theory," "I don't believe it at all," and, "We actually come from Adam and Eve." It's fairly clear that she openly advocates not only Intelligent Design, but straight-up biblical creationism.
I immediately asked her, "Can you honestly say that as a science teacher?" She told me that she could. That upset me a lot.
When I mentioned this to him, Dr. Farmer had wondered if we should just teach "both theories" equally, essentially advocating that we "teach the controversy." I explained why creationism doesn't belong in a science classroom, that my teacher wouldn't be able to substantiate her claim with empirical evidence or the scientific method. I compared it to the "Intelligent Falling Theory" of Pastafarianism.
I also pointed out that by teaching the bible as true, she was teaching Christianity as fact, which further implied she was teaching that non-Christians are going to hell. He had said he would talk to her and give her a warning.
Now, he told me my costume was controversial and likely to disrupt the learning environment. I explained that my quarrel with my science teacher wasn't one of personal offense, but of professionalism. I told him that by teaching creationism, she was teaching something unconstitutional and flat-out dishonest. As a science teacher and an educator, she was out of line teaching biblical creationism. She was only adding to the already dishearteningly prevalent misconceptions on the theory of evolution, the very basis of our understanding of modern biology.
Both principals said they were worried my costume would spark religious debates in every class and take up large amounts of time. I was sternly warned that if even one teacher reported the slightest disruption, I would have to take off my costume. Then and there, I decided to take it off.
Even though the vast majority of students in my school are religious, many told me how much they liked my costume and how disappointed they were that I had to take it off. Even my teachers thought it was funny. Only a very few of my peers said they thought it was in bad taste, and none did so during instructional time.
I wondered, if a religious debate had been sparked, wouldn't it be up to the teachers to control the classroom and deal with students who actually disrupted class time? I was merely participating in Fictional Character Day.
When I went home, I posted photos and details of what had happened to the r/atheism section of one of my favorite websites, Reddit.com. My fellow Redditors were, with very few exceptions, overwhelmingly supportive and said my civil liberties had been violated. Many urged me to contact the Freedom from Religion Foundation, so I did.
I soon received a reply from FFRF Staff Attorney Rebecca Markert, who sent a letter to the school district on my behalf, and I greatly appreciate that.
Atheist in the bible belt
Statistics show that the least trusted and most despised American minority is the atheist community. I, along with most of my atheist friends and family, have experienced this firsthand.
My younger brother and I have both been told that we are only atheists because we are possessed by demons. We've been told that when we read the bible as nonbelievers, the devil himself literally changes the words, making it impossible for us to gain an adequate understanding of the word of god. After telling someone that I am an atheist, it's not uncommon for the initial response to resemble a personal attack such as "You're a bad person," or a threat,
"You're going to hell."
One religionist asked me why I had become an atheist: "Was it family trouble, abuse?" Others assume that atheists are simply rebelling against "god and his rules," or that we put as much "faith" in science as religious people do in their doctrines.
I've even met a very fundamentalist Christian who told me that science is a left-wing conspiracy made up of people rebelling against god.
Last year, a teacher leading the class in prayer openly criticized my brother for refusing to bow his head. One of his peers caught him reading my copy of Richard Dawkins' The Greatest Show on Earth: The Evidence for Evolution, picked it up and threw it on the ground.
We smile whenever one of our friends tells us we're on their church's prayer list. I made one list four times in one day.
Getting to know you
People seem less likely to treat you poorly as an atheist once they get to know you and develop a deeper understanding of the reasoning behind your disbelief. I post Facebook status updates of atheist quotes, YouTube videos made by atheists, etc. I share and explain my views and opinions with a sizeable number of the most devout Christians from my school and in my area, including pastors, the Fellowship of Christian Athletes leader at my school and other adults and teens.
I've had Christian peers say things like, "I read that debate on your Facebook wall last night, and it really made me think." In fact, I first really started to get to know my girlfriend after she read some of my anti-theist sentiments on Facebook and struck up a conversation with me.
Being a bible belt atheist has highlights and lowlights. One of the best things any atheist can do, especially in the South, is to come out of the heathen's closet. When nontheists are open with others, it debunks misconceptions. As Dawkins would say, we act as consciousness raisers, and if enough of us do so, we can shed favorable light on the atheist community and perhaps one day shift the statistics in our favor.
If you had told me two years ago that I would one day be receiving a scholarship and award from a group like FFRF as a result of my secular activism, I wouldn't have believed you. You see, I was previously quite the quintessential, vehemently fundamentalist Christian — a young Earth creationist, a biblical literalist, a Calvinist, a homophobe — the whole nine yards.
It's been two years since then, and, though it's still difficult to wrap my head around the fact that I've won an FFRF student activist award, needless to say, I'm honored.
The Paul J. Gaylor Memorial Student Activist Award is principally endowed by FFRF Co-President Annie Laurie Gaylor.
Krystal Myers - Catherine Fahringer Memorial Student Activist Award
"Krystal Myers is an honors student, captain of the swim team and editor of her high school newspaper. She's also an atheist in a predominantly Christian student body."
That's how the Knoxville News Sentinel started its Feb. 23 story on how Myers' column, "No Rights: The Life of an Atheist," was banned from publication in the Panther Press by Schools Director Wayne Miller because of what he called the potential for disruption in the school.
"We do have the right to control the content of the school paper if we feel it is in the best interest of the students," Miller told the News Sentinel.
Here is the "disruptive" column:
The point of view expressed in this article does not necessarily reflect the point of view of the Panther Press, its staff, adviser or school.
As a current student in government, I have realized that I feel that my rights as an atheist are severely limited and unjust when compared to other students who are Christians. Not only are there multiple clubs featuring the Christian faith, but youth ministers are also allowed to come onto school campus and hand candy and other food out to Christians and their friends.
However, I feel like if an atheist did that, people would not be happy about it. This may not be true, but due to pervasive negative feelings towards atheists in the school, I feel that it would be the case. My question is, "Why? Why does atheism have such a bad reputation?"
An even better question: "Why do Christians have special rights not allowed to nonbelievers?"
Before I begin, I want to clear up some misconceptions about atheism. No, we do not worship the "devil." We do not believe in God, so we also do not believe in Satan. And we may be "godless" but that does not mean that we are without morals. I know, personally, I strive to be the best person I can be, even without religion.
In fact, I have been a better person since I have rejected religion. Perhaps the most important misconception is that we want to convert everyone into atheists and that we hate Christians. For the most part, we just want to be respected for who we are and not be judged.
Now you should know exactly what an atheist is. Dictionary.com says that an atheist is, "a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings." However, this does not mean that atheists do not believe in higher causes; we just do not believe in a higher being.
With that being said, I can move on to the real issue. Before I begin, I want you to think about your rights and how your perceived "rights" might be affecting the rights of others.
There are several instances where my rights as a nonbeliever, and the rights of anyone other than a Christian, have been violated. These instan-ces inspired me to investigate the laws concerning the separation of church and state, and I learned some interesting things. First, I would like you to know specifically what my grievances are against the school.
First and foremost is the sectarian prayer that occurs at graduation every year. Fortunately, I am not the first one to have thought that this was a problem. In the Supreme Court case, Lee v. Weisman, it was decided that allowing prayer at graduation is a violation of the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment that says, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Special speakers can pray, but the school cannot endorse the prayer or plan for it to happen.
Public prayer also occurs at all of the home football games using the public address system. This has, again, been covered by the Supreme Court case Santa Fe Independent School District v. Doe. The court ruled that school-sponsored prayer is an unconstitutional violation of the Establishment Clause. If a speaker prays, it is fine. However, as soon as the school provides sponsorship, it becomes illegal. Sponsorship can be almost anything, even something as simple as saying that the speaker can pray or choosing a speaker with a known propensity to pray or share his or her religious views.
It is not just the speakers whom we have to fear at Lenoir City High School. We also have to fear some of the teachers and what they might say about their own religious beliefs. On at least two separate occasions, teachers have made their religious preferences known to basically the whole school.
One teacher has made her religious preferences known by wearing a T-shirt depicting the crucifix while performing her duties as a public employee. Also, Kristi Brackett, a senior at Lenoir City High School, has said that the teacher, "strongly encouraged us to join [a religious club] and be on the group's leadership team."
Yet again, this violates the Establishment Clause. When asked if this was true, the teacher replied, "As a teacher I would never use my power of influence to force my beliefs or the beliefs of [a religious club] on any student in the school."
Regardless, the religious T-shirts are still inappropriate in the school setting. Teachers are prohibited from making their religious preferences known. The Constitution requires them to be neutral when acting in their capacity as a public school teacher.
Not only are religious preferences shown through shirts, but also through a "Quote of the Day" that some teachers write on the boards in their classrooms. One teacher has bible verses occasionally as the teacher's "Quote of the Day" for students. The Establishment Clause has been violated yet again with no regard for nonbelievers.
Perhaps I would have more hope in our school and the possibility of change on the horizon if our own School Board did not open their meetings with prayer. A person who wished to remain anonymous that has been present at board meetings says, "They do have prayers. They pray to 'Our Heavenly Father' and end with 'In Jesus' name we pray.' "
This not only violates the Constitution, it violates the board's own policy prohibiting prayer at school-sponsored events. The whole foundation of how our school is conducted is established by obvious Christians. Somehow, this is unsurprising. If our School Board chooses to ignore the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment and the Supreme Court, then it is no surprise that teachers choose to do the same.
I know that I will keep trying to gain my rights as an atheist and as an American citizen, but I also need your help in educating other people to realize the injustice done to all minority groups. The Christian faith cannot rule the United States. It is unconstitutional. Religion and government are supposed to be separate. If we let this slide, what other amendments to the Constitution will be ignored?
I leave it to you to decide what you will or will not do, but just remember that nonbelievers are not what you originally thought we were. We are human beings just like you.
Jessica Ahlquist - Thomas Jefferson Youth Activist Award
Jessica Ahlquist - Thomas Jefferson Youth Activist – 2012
Jessica Ahlquist, 16, was a plaintiff in a successful ACLU federal lawsuit to force removal of an 8-foot-tall prayer banner from her Rhode Island high school. After winning the lawsuit she received the Thomas Jefferson Youth Activist Award for the second time. This time FFRF awarded Ahlquist $2,000 doubling the $1,000 award she received in 2011.
The Freedom From Religion Foundation congratulates Jessica Ahlquist, for prevailing in a heated state-church lawsuit challenging a prayer banner at her high school in Cranston, R.I. The school board there took the right, rational and fiscally responsible action, by voting not to appeal the Jan. 11 ruling by U.S. District Judge Ronald Lagueux. The judge had ordered the removal of a large prayer inscribed on a banner in the auditorium of Cranston High School West, beginning, "Our Heavenly Father" and ending "Amen."
"Jessica, with sweet determination, stood up for the First Amendment and its precious principle of separation between church and state, she persevered under acutely difficult circumstances, and she has prevailed," said Annie Laurie Gaylor, FFRF co-president.
Ahlquist, 5 feet tall and only 16 years old, was targeted by many in her state and community, including by her state representative, who publicly labeled her "an evil little thing." She had become such a persona non grata in the overwhelmingly Catholic community that four local florists refused to deliver flowers FFRF had ordered after her January federal court victory.
In response to all of the backlash surrounding Jessica's win, especially the comments made by her state representative, FFRF created a special fund, "The Atheists in Foxholes Support Fund," to provide scholarships and assistance to persons who exhibit bravery in furthering the cause and experience hardship because of that stand. Jessica is the first recipient of this special fund.
Background On Jessica's Case
Rhode Island florists refuse to deliver FFRF's flowers to Jessica Ahlquist
FFRF announces "Atheists in Foxholes Support Fund"
Florist shops violate Rhode Island public accommodation statute
Freethought Radio - October 13, 2012 Broadcast
Freethought Radio - October 6, 2012 Broadcast
FFRF to blitz Portland with cheery atheist/secular messages
The Freedom From Religion Foundation will be making its mark next week as 880 of its members from around the country visit Portland to attend FFRF's 35th national convention. Helping to celebrate the occasion are more than 15 Portland-area FFRF members or families who volunteered to appear on a set of myth-dispelling billboard campaigns timed with the convention. FFRF is launching its largest "This is what an atheist looks" campaign to date in Portland, also debuting a new slogan: "I'm SECULAR and I VOTE." FFRF has leased three 14x48-foot bulletins and 12 EcoPoster (10-foot x 22.8-inch billboards), which will be appearing in a variety of Portland locations.
FFRF's sell-out convention takes place Friday-Sunday, Oct. 12-14 at the Downtown Portland Hilton and Towers, 921 SW Sixth Avenue. The convention will open Friday night with award acceptance speeches by two student activists, and by the premier atheist intellectual, Richard Dawkins. The event continues Saturday with appearances by bestselling mystery author Sara Paretsky and "Letting Go of God" actress and comedian Julia Sweeney, among others.
"We were pleasantly surprised we had more volunteers than we could manage to use in the campaign. We wish we hadn't had to turn anyone away," said FFRF Co-President Annie Laurie Gaylor. She noted that the definitive American Religious Identification Survey shows that 24% of Oregonians identify as nonreligious, so these FFRF'ers have plenty of good company. FFRF thanks FFRF Life Member Steve Eltinge for taking the professional photographs, and all participants for making the PR campaign possible.
Michelle and Justin Atterbury will be pictured on a magenta 14x48-foot billboard saying "This is what an atheist family looks like," with their toddler, Sylvan, and baby, Scarlett. Also on a 14x48-foot bulletin saying "This is what atheists look like" will be Roy Firestone, an engineer, and Karen Firestone, a Portland homemaker. Another couple, Heather Gonsior, drafter, and Shawn Swagerty, information systems director, appear on a billboard with the same message.
Appealing brothers Brent Mangum, a chemist and OSU tutor, and Tyler, a physiologist, are pictured back-to-back on a blue "This is what atheists look like" 14x48-foot billboard.
Other "This is what an atheist looks like" participants, each featured on their own billboard, are: Anita Brown, whose exotic cat, Wheely, also makes an appearance; Renee Barnett, a neurologist grad student and university teaching assistant; and Sonja Maglothin, an income auditor. Featured on bright blue "This is what an atheist looks like" billboards will be Dr. Peter Boghossian, a well-known philosophy instructor at Portland State University, who has an upcoming book, Against Faith; Mark Hecate, a member of FFRF who is I.T. director of New Avenues for Youth, and Scott Mullin, a filmmaker in Portland.
With the election so close, FFRF is also unveiling a timely billboard slogan, "I'm SECULAR and I VOTE." The red, white and blue billboards feature the smiling faces of Lenora Warren, a retired Portland teacher; retired engineer Duane A. Damiano, a Life Member of FFRF; retired politician and novelist Caroline Miller; Paul Buchman and Marsha Abelman, both retired.
"With up to 19% of the U.S. population now identifying as nonreligious, when are politicians and candidates going to wake up to the changing demographics and start courting us? Secularists are looking for candidates who share a commitment to America's foundational principle of separation between religion and government," said Dan Barker, FFRF Co-President.
Barker, a former minister and author of two books, Godless and Losing Faith in Faith, will moderate a unique panel at the conference featuring four former ministers turned atheists, who are all part of The Clergy Project. Jerry DeWitt, a former Pentecostal minister, was the first "graduate" of The Clergy Project, a support group developed by Dawkins, Barker, Tufts Professor Daniel Dennett and researcher Linda LaScola, to aid ministers who have lost their faith and are looking for a way out of the pulpit. Joining DeWitt is Teresa MacBain, another new "graduate" who left the Methodist Church, as did annalise fonza. Robert Parham, a former Southern Baptist minister, will also appear.
No tickets may be purchased at the door.
Read more about the convention
Help fund FFRF's work through CFC
The Freedom From Religion Foundation has once again qualified for inclusion in the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC).
The CFC is the only officially sanctioned program for soliciting federal government employees on behalf of charitable organizations. The CFC conducts annual campaigns in the workplace and allows federal employees to make donations through payroll deductions or other forms of payment to an approved list of charities. It's part of the U.S. Office of Personnel Management.
The Foundation, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit, was first included on the CFC list of eligible charities in 2008. "Federal workers had contacted the Foundation in the past, noting the many religious charities on the listing, and wishing there were a nontheist alternative," said Annie Laurie Gaylor, Foundation co-president.
"We're delighted to announce now again in 2012 that our activities throughout the United States, including the many scholarships we grant students, helped FFRF meet the rigorous eligibility criteria," Gaylor said.
To the Foundation's knowledge, it's the only freethought group on the list, which includes hundreds of religious groups. All dues and donations to FFRF are deductible for income-tax purposes.
"Freedom From Religion Foundation, Inc." will appear in the listing of "National/International Independent Organizations" that's published in each local campaign charity list in the early fall.
The solicitation period for 2012 campaign donations is Sept. 1 through Dec. 15. Deadlines vary by region. The CFC code that donors will use to designate their contribution to FFRF is 32519.
CFC donors contributed more than $63,000 to FFRF in 2010 and more than $88,000 in 2011.
Another way to give is via matching grant donations, which have become a significant boost to FFRF in recent years. Many companies offer to match (fully or a percentage of) their employees' donations to charitable nonprofits. These matches multiply the impact of the initial donation to further FFRF's goals.
Gaylor added, "It is recommended that all CFC donors check the box to include their name and mailing address (in addition to your email) with the donation. Donors will receive an acknowledgment from FFRF when we receive pledge notification (throughout the year). If you do not receive that acknowledgment, please contact FFRF to be sure we have been given your name and information about your pledge."
Charity Navigator gives FFRF its highest rating of four stars, which means "exceeds industry standards and outperforms most charities in its cause."
This ad appears in Military Times.
Betrayal of Trust: Clergy Abuse of Children
Texas AG attacks FFRF, butts into banner case
Once again, Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott has inappropriately weighed in on the wrong side of a Texas state/church controversy involving the Freedom From Religion Foundation. Last December, Abbott sent to a letter to Henderson County over FFRF's complaint about a nativity scene at the courthouse in Athens, Texas, attacking FFRF and offering support to the county.
Abbott sent a similar letter yesterday to the Kountze Independent School District calling FFRF, among other things, "menacing and misleading" for notifying the district about inappropriate religious promotion by cheerleaders at school events. The violation is bizarre even by Texas standards. As the Beaumont Enterprise put it, "For three straight weeks, high school football players in a small southeast Texas town took the field by bolting through large red-and-white banners that hollered the praises of Jesus Christ."
One typical banner read: "But thanks be to God, which gives us Victory, through our Lord Jesus Christ. 1 Cor. 15:57"
FFRF Staff Attorney Stephanie Schmitt wrote a Sept. 17 letter to Superintendent Kevin Weldon of the Kountze Independent School District, informing him that the practice runs afoul of constitutional principles. Schmitt cited a 2000 Supreme Court decision, involving a Texas case, which nixed formal student-initiated school prayers at sporting events.
Weldon responded appropriately by immediately halting the Jesus banners. A Religious Right group, the Liberty Institute, got a 10-day restraining order on Sept. 20 against the district, which has hired a law firm to defend itself. FFRF is readying an amicus brief in support of the district.
FFRF Co-President Dan Barker called it "strange and surprising that the attorney general would weigh in prematurely on a case before a court in his state based on what 'news reports indicate.' He is failing to recognize the difference between free speech, such as what fans might say in the bleachers, and government speech, such as what cheerleaders in uniforms say as representatives of the school during school-sponsored events."
"Just as it would be inappropriate for cheerleaders in school uniforms at official school functions to sport banners saying, 'Praise Allah!' or quoting Koranic verses, so is it inappropriate for them to misuse the podium the school confers on them and their school-endorsed status to promote Christianity and bible verses as part of public school football games," added Annie Laurie Gaylor, FFRF co-president. "We are grateful to the school district for respecting clear court precedent, and the individual rights and freedoms of a diverse community."
FFRF acted on a complaint from a member of the community. KFDM-6 News out of Beaumont interviewed high school students who agree with FFRF that the banners are inappropriate.
If the majority of the cheerleaders were atheists, asked Barker, would Attorney General Abbott support their right to hold up a banner insulting Christianity? "If he would not defend those students, why does he defend banners that quote a book that calls 5 million nonreligious Texans fools (Psalm 14 and 53:1)"?
Public schools are legally obligated to limit any team member's speech that excludes, denigrates or is obscene, since cheerleading chants and banners reflect approval and endorsement by the school. The government, its public schools and its representatives or its actors may not promote one religion over another, or religion over nonreligion at a public school event, FFRF says.
Read previous news release, Sept. 19, 2012


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Marble House
Marble House, one of several National Historic Landmarks under the care of the Preservation Society of Newport County, was built between 1888 and 1892 for Mr. and Mrs. William K. Vanderbilt, of the steamship and railroad fortune. Designed by architect Richard Morris Hunt, the house was modeled after the Petit Trianon in Versailles. Mr. Vanderbilt gave the house to his wife for her 35th birthday. As its name suggests, the home is built with roughly 500,000 cubic feet of marble and is truly a masterpiece to behold.
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You attend every Hawkeyes game decked out in Iowa Hawkeyes gear. You know all the players, the coach's history and all the best plays. A true fanatic like you needs to be represented in the perfect tee — that's why Nike created the Fan Legend T-shirt! It features an all-caps school name printed across the chest, so everyone knows you're a Iowa fan. It also boasts Nike's Dri-FIT technology that pulls moisture away to keep you dry and comfortable while you celebrate after the Hawkeyes score the winning touchdown. This tee will keep you feeling like the Hawkeyes star you are on game day!
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Photos: Best new rides of 2012 at California theme parks
While our Top 10 is dominated by new rides coming to Disney California Adventure, 2012 will also see the debut of enough prototype roller coasters, extreme thrill rides and cutting-edge attractions to make any serious theme park fan salivate.
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10) Crazy Surf - Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk
Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk plans to update the Crazy Surf flat ride with a newer model that includes tilting seats and water jets that splash passengers. The new ride, which will keep the Crazy Surf name, features an 18-seat gondola mounted to two revolving arms that take passengers 12 feet in the air.
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How to Make a Pie from Start to Finish
Cooking Lessons from The Kitchn
I am very worried, friends. Worried that the fear of pie crusts may be keeping a great many of you from making your own pies at home. Is this true? Does this sound like you? Do debates over butter vs. lard or tender vs. flaky make you want to run and hide? Well, take a deep breath and grab your notebook — today we're going to go over how to make a pie from start to finish, one step at a time.
Ok, here's your first lesson: homemade pies do not have to be perfect. Really. This is a hard lesson to learn because we want that perfectly crimped and beautifully burnished pie crust so badly! I completely understand. But when your pie crust rips in half while you're transferring it to the pan or when you don't have quite enough dough to make those tall, crimped edges — it's ok. Remind yourself that at the end of the day, you still have pie, and that's all that matters.
Next lesson: the more you make pies, the better you'll be. Making pie crust is a lot like riding a bike — it takes a lot of practice before you can pull it off every time. That pie up there? The one that looks so homey and pretty? I can honestly say that this is the first beautiful pie that I've ever made in my life. I was just as astounded as you when I pulled it out of the oven and saw that it hadn't shrunk, collapsed, burnt, or otherwise become disfigured. I don't want to jinx myself by saying that I'm now a pie-making pro, but I really do feel that each pie I've made has been better than the last.
Here are a few more things to think about before you head into the recipe:
Butter vs. Lard vs. Mixed Crusts
Pie crusts are made by working fat into flour — when the fat melts during baking, it leaves behind layers of crispy, flaky crust. Yum. But just what fat you use in your pie is a matter of much debate — one that really boils down to personal preference. All-butter pie crusts have a lovely, rich flavor, but because butter is brittle when cold and softens quickly, it can be difficult to work with. Lard and shortening are easier to work with and, arguably, make flakier crusts, but can leave your crust tasting a little bland. A good solution is to use a mix of both butter and lard or shortening. I leave it to you to decide what you like best.
Flaky vs. Tender Crusts
The flakiness of a crust is a result of both the fat that you use and how much you work the fat into the flour before adding the water. Because of its higher melting temperature and its unique structure, lard and shortening make the flakiest crusts. But you can still make a very flaky crust using all-butter (or a mix) by not over-incorporating the butter into the flour — cut it into the flour just until you see pieces no larger than peas. Conversely, if you like a very tender crust, work the butter or lard into the flour until it resembles bread crumbs.
Keeping Cool
One universal truth when making crusts is that you need to keep everything cool, particularly the butter (or lard...or shortening). Warm butter will be absorbed by the flour instead of coating it, resulting in a tougher, less flaky crust. Once you take the butter out of the fridge, work quickly to make the pie crust. Refrigerate the dough between each step. If you want to make a pie during hot weather, try to make it in the morning or in the evening when the temperature is a little cooler. You can also refrigerate your rolling pin and cutting board. Or just work quickly and refrigerate frequently.
Making It Pretty
Last but not least, there are lots of ways to make your pie extra-pretty. I love brushing the top with a simple glaze of egg yolk thinned with a little water. This makes a burnished, glowing crust. A friend of mine brushes her crusts several times during baking to make them even more golden and shiny. You can also brush the crust with cream or sprinkle it with a handful of large-grain sugar. Sparkly! If you're ready to level-up your pie, try weaving the top crust into a lattice. It's not that hard, but looks oh-so-pretty. Here's how.
Knowing how to make your own pie from scratch is one of those skills that we feel that every home cook should have under their belt. You might not make pies very often, but when you do, we want to be sure you feel confident making one!
Do you love making pie? What advice do you have for newbie pie-makers? What kind of pie crust — butter vs. lard, flaky vs. tender — do you usually make?
How to Make a Pie
What You Need
2 1/2 cup all-purpose flour
1 teaspoon salt
1 cup (2 sticks) unsalted butter, chilled (See Recipe Note)
4-8 tablespoons ice water
1 recipe for pie filling (See Recipe Note)
1 large egg yolk whisked with 1 tablespoon warm water
Food processor OR bowl, a pastry cutter and forks
Paring knife
Measuring cups and spoons
Rolling pin
Pastry scraper
9-inch pie pan
Pastry brush
Mix the flour and salt: Combine the flour and salt in the bowl of a food processor and pulse a few times to combine. Alternatively, if making crust by hand, whisk the flour and salt together in a mixing bowl.
Prepare the ice water: Place a few ice cubes in a small ramekin and fill with water. Stir with a tablespoon measure and set aside.
Cube the butter: Remove the butter from the fridge and unwrap. Use a paring knife to cut it into several small cubes.
Combine the butter and flour: Scatter the cubes of butter over the surface of the flour. Attach the food processor lid and pulse 15 to 20 times until the mixture resembles cornmeal with pieces of butter no larger than a pea. Alternatively, cut the butter into the flour using a pastry cutter, a fork, or your fingertips.
Add the ice water: Remove the lid and sprinkle 4 tablespoons of ice water over the surface of the butter-flour mixture. Pulse a 4 to 5 times to combine. Check to see if the dough is holding together by squeezing a bit in your hand — if it holds together, it's ready; if it breaks apart easily, add a little more water. Add more water a tablespoon at a time as needed. The final dough should not come together in a dough, but you should see no more powdery flour and the dough should just be starting to clump together in large crumbs.
Alternatively, sprinkle the water over the flour and use two forks to toss the flour to combine. Test the dough and add more water as described above, handling the dough as little as possible with your hands.
Press the pie dough into disks and refrigerate: Turn the pie dough out onto a clean work surface. Divide the dough into two piles. Use the palm of your hand to quickly gather and press each mound into a thick disk. Wrap in plastic and refrigerate for at least 30 minutes or up to 4 days (or freeze for up to 3 months; defrost in the fridge overnight before using).
Roll out the bottom crust: Remove one of the disks of dough from the fridge. Sprinkle your work surface and rolling pin with flour. Unwrap the dough and lay it on top of the flour. Working from the middle of the dough outwards, roll the dough into a circle roughly 12 to 13 inches in diameter (a few inches larger than your pie pan). Use firm strokes and work the dough as little as possible.
If the dough cracks when you first start rolling, let it stand for one minute to warm slightly before rolling again. Use more flour if the dough starts to stick. Use a pastry scraper to lift the pastry from the work surface and make sure it's not sticking.
Transfer the crust to the pie pan: Sprinkle the top of the pie crust and your rolling pin with a little flour. Lay your rolling pin on one edge of the pie crust and begin gently rolling the pie crust over the rolling pin. When it's all rolled up, move it to the pie pan and gently unroll. Ease the pie crust into the corners of the pan. Trim all but an inch or two of the pie dough from around the edge; use the trimmings to patch up any holes or tears.
Chill the dough: Transfer the pie pan with pie crust to the fridge and chill for 30 minutes.
Preheat the oven to 425°F. While the crust is chilling, heat the oven to 425°F with a rack in the middle position.
Prepare the filling: While the crust is chilling, prepare the filling following your recipe's instructions.
Fill the pie: Remove the pie pan with crust from the refrigerator and fill it with the prepared filling.
Roll out the top crust: Remove the second disk of dough from the fridge. Following the same instructions for the bottom crust, roll it into a circle roughly 11 to 12 inches in diameter. Roll the pie crust over the rolling pin and transfer it to the top of the pie.
Crimp the edges: Trim the edges of the top crust. Press the top and the bottom crusts gently together and fold them under themselves around the circumference of the pie. (Some pie-makers roll their crusts the other way, and that's fine. Go with what feels right to you.) Crimp the edges or press them lightly with a fork to seal.
Brush the top with egg and cut steam vents: Brush the entire crust, including crimped edges, with the egg yolk wash. Use a sharp paring knife to cut several vents into the top crust to allow steam to escape.
Bake for 15 minutes at 425°F: Place the pie on a baking sheet to catch any drips and transfer to the oven. Bake for 15 minutes.
Lower the heat to 350°F and bake for 30 to 40 minutes: Lower the heat and continue baking the pie for another 30 to 40 minutes, until the crust is golden brown and the fruit filling is bubbling. If the edges of the crust start to darken too quickly, cover them with aluminum foil.
- Cool for at least 4 hours: Let the pie cool on a cooling rack for at least 4 hours before slicing and serving. Leftovers can be covered with a cake dome or wrapped in plastic and kept on the counter for several days.
Recipe Notes
- Butter Crust vs. Lard Crust vs. Mixed Crust: Substitute lard or shortening for all or some of the butter in this recipe.
- Fruit Filling: This recipe assumes that you're following another recipe for the pie filling. If not, general proportions for pie fillings are 5 to 6 cups chopped fruit, 3/4 to 1 cup sugar, 3 to 4 tablespoons cornstarch, and a squeeze of lemon.
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(Images: Emma Christensen)
Per serving, based on 2 servings. (% daily value)
44 Comments
I bake a TON of pies- and always tell people not to be afraid of pies because of crust. You're absolutely right- the more you do it, the easier (and better) it gets.
As for the fat - I've never tried lard but the flavor of butter wins out over shortening every time. I also don't like the idea of using hydrogenated oils anyway- so butter is always my go-to.
And- if you're still afraid of pie crust after this tutorial- just buy one from the store! There's definitely a difference between store bought and home made, but if you make the filling and assemble the pie yourself you'll get a feel for how not scary pie baking is- and how delicious a home made pie is compared to the ones in the aluminum tray at the grocery store!
After you've made a few this way hopefully you'll feel courageous and comfortable enough to try your hand at making the crust from scratch too.
Trick for cutting butter into flour (when you don't have a food processor and you have warm hands):
freeze the butter and grate it with a cheese grater!
It breaks the butter up into those little flaky bits that you can just quickly toss around in the flour. Even mixture, lots of dispersed butter, and less melting!
Also, trick from my grandma on the water - if you feel you always add too much liquid - sub in vodka - it makes it easy to manage when rolling the dough, but it bakes away faster than water in the oven leaving you with the flaky crust.
I use store-bought dough and don't feel bad about it. It's what my mom taught me to do. :)
Thank you, thank you, thank you for the piecrust tutorial (and other suggestions from your readers) - I'm pretty good with most cooking challenges, but piecrusts have (so far) defeated me. NO MORE! Now, my sister won't be the only one in the family who can make a pie for a holiday meal. Time to get "practicing" during these summer months of fabulous berries and stone fruits! Thanks, Emma!
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe!
Any recommendations for a good vegan crust?
My family swears by an old BHG recipe for oil pastry crust. It comes together quickly, is SO easy to roll out, and is always flakey and delicious.
Oil Crust
2 cups all purpose flour
1 1/2 teaspoon salt
1/2 cup vegetable oil
5 Tablespoons cold water
Sift together flour and salt
Pour oil and cold water into measuring cup (do not stir)
Pour all at once into flour mixture
Stir lightly with fork
Form into 2 balls
Roll each ball between waxed paper (dampen the countertop so won't slip)
Peel off top layer waxed paper and turn over into pie plate then remove remaining waxed paper
I use the trick that bakinottawa uses with freezing the butter and grating it. I use lard and butter. The lard I render from organic leaf lard that I buy locally. My second trick is I use my great grandmother's clear glass rolling pin filled with ice water! It ties me to all the great cooks in my family down through the years.
Don't be afraid of pie pastry, take your time, keep everything cold, let the dough rest in the fridge. Repetition will just make it better and you more confident in your baking skills.
I like fruit tarts, but the reason I don't make them more often is because I'm scared of making the pâte sucrée - it is extremely crumbly. The crème pâtissière is also tricky, and storage afterwards (condensation) is always a problem. Yes, tarts are very scary.
I've tried just about every tip out there for pie crust: vodka, grating frozen butter, different kinds of flours, eggs/no eggs and didn't find any made enough of a difference to bother with (the grating butter was actually the worst--the smaller pieces all started to melt by the time I finished grating, and the heat of my hand warmed the stick while I was grating) until I finally went all America's Test Kitchen last fall on my pie crust to figure out which fat I liked best: lard, butter, shortening or a combination.
Lard/butter was the best (all butter second best), and it was by far the easiest I've ever worked with and tasted fantastic. Several lard/butter pie crusts later that all repeated the easy-to-work-with/tastes-great/flaky trifecta, I think it's a pretty solid success.
I also prefer to use a pastry cutter instead of a food processor for better control, and so I don't have to clean out all the tiny corners where the dough gets stuck in the machine.
@ellabee: I don't bake much so this is far from an expert opinion, but I wonder if refrigerated or frozen coconut oil could sub in for the butter/lard? I love the texture that coconut oil brings to cookies and quick breads, but I don't know if it would be too soft or runny for a pie crust-although @Elizabeth Ho's veggie oil recipe suggests that it'd be totally doable. :D
@tuxedo: I love the advice to start with baby steps and use a store-bought crust until you get used to making pie fillings first! It's all about baby steps, and this is very encouraging advice. (as is the advice in the post that pies don't need to be perfect.) :D
Actually, I do have a question about one of these steps: how on earth do you cover the edges with tinfoil a) without burning the heck out of your fingertips b) without crushing the still fragile crust edge c) cover the entire edge (one piece of foil always pops off when I try to cover the other side)?
Also, do you take the pie out of the oven completely to do this, or do you just pull the rack out and try to do it quickly before everything cools down too much?
I use Smitten Kitchen's butter crust recipe, and am please to say I've nailed pie crusts using her tips. So. Good. Mine is always super flakey, like a lard crust, but with the yummy butter flavour.
Most important tips for me: cube the butter into small bits and put it in the freezer for a while. I skip adding an ice cube to water and just put a small amount of water in the freezer until it is iced over. When I can, I also use a heavy glass bowl that's been in the freezer.
This method scared me at first because butter is very visible in the dough when you roll it out, but that just makes it more delightful when cooked! My mother is designated pumpkin pie maker in our extended family, and I've been recruited to make her crusts.
All excellent advice, particularly about practice, practice, practice and pie doesn't have to be perfect. Worst case scenario where the crust comes out badly - toss it and serve the contents over ice cream. Don't be afraid of pie!
For crust, I like half shortening, half lard though a previous AT post has me thinking of trying Plugra butter (since it supposedly has less water than standard grocery store butter).
I will disagree on the use of a food processor though. It seems like it's much too easy to overwork the dough and end up with a tough crust. I much prefer a pastry cutter like this one: http://tinyurl.com/mlug3nt
Also, my discovery for adding the water slowly is to use a cruet (the kind with a pinhole in the metal screw top that costs about $2) -- sprinkle the water with one hand, use the other to toss the dough with a fork. I like this one: http://www.surlatable.com/product/PRO-673814/Stainless-Steel-Blending-Fork When the dough starts sticking to the fork, I know I've added enough water.
And finally, waxed paper when you roll out the dough helps immensely. Lightly moisten your work surface (perhaps with a few shakes of the cruet) and set a large sheet of waxed paper across (the small bit of water helps it stick). Flour and roll your dough out, then slide your hand under the waxed paper and flip it into the pie plate (paper side up). Peel off the paper. I've gotten to the point where I can roll the crust onto the rolling pin and then unroll into the plate, but I still use the waxed paper because you can use less dry flour and still have the crust lift off easily.
@Christina: I always had the same problem with wrapping foil strips around the edge of the pie, but I picked up a tip from Rose Levy Beranbaum's The Pie and Pastry Bible -- cut out a ring of foil instead. SO much easier.
I got over my pie fear this year, mostly by using Smitten Kitchen's all butter pie crust recipe. I've tried the Cook's Illustrated vodka recipe but SK's all butter recipe takes the pie in terms of ease. I really like the butter grating methods several people have mentioned but I hate cleaning one more item. I do use a pastry blender to make my crusts. I made my first lattice top pie last week and my second one last night. Pie is awesome!
I will definitely try lard next.
Elizabeth Ho and spydrmnky123, thank you very much for the vegan crust suggestions!
Ellabee, shortening. It sometimes comes butter flavored.
@Christina -- I think the trick to wrapping the edges in foil is to go quickly and don't get fussy about it. I just fold a few sheets of foil into long rectangles and gently (and quickly) crimp them around the crust. The idea is to just cover the crust, no so much to wrap the foil tightly around the crust. The foil is just resting on top of the crust.
This said, I also get annoyed when one piece of foil gets knocked off as I try to place the other. I'll have to try Anjali's tip from Rose Levy Berenbaum!
Oh, and yes, definitely remove the pie from the oven, close the oven, and then add the foil ring. Leaving the oven open lets too much heat out and extends the baking time (as the oven is coming back up to temp).
for vegan pie crusts, I've always just used Earth Balance in place of butter in Martha Stewart's pate brisee recipe. Be sure to adjust the salt down. It doesn't roll out as well when cold, though.
Nice instructions and classic proportions. I do prefer cream as a glaze to egg. Egg tastes, well eggy. Cream tastes delicious.
love has been great
I would like to see the inside of this pie. How does the crust hold up once you slice it and serve it? My problem with home made pie crust has always been that it falls apart the second I try to transfer it from the baking dish to people's plates. I don't know if this is the crust or the filling. Any ideas?
I always use the pie crust recipe from Chez Pim:
250 g | 2 1/4 cup plain all purpose flour
225 g | 8oz cold SALTED butter
60 ml | 1/4 cup water
However, instead of salted butter, I just modified it to use vegan butter (Earth Balance). It has always worked really well for me, and is always highly complimented.
Also I forgot to mention on the vegan pie crust--to get the shiny glaze that would usually come from an egg wash, I use vegan cream. I think maybe unflavored coffee creamer would work well for that, such as the Silk brand "original" flavor.
Just wondering if I read the instructions wrong - you don't bake the base 'blind' before adding the filling? Doesn't that make the base soft and soggy? And what is the purpose of cornstarch in the filling? 3-4 tablespoons is a HUGE amount - doesn't the filling taste starchy/slimy?
I use shortening. It's how my grandmother taught me and I get rave reviews. I don't actually want my crust to be too buttery because I want the filling to stand out, and I like the flakiness you get from shortening. I find the key is to make the crust as thin as possible and most importantly it should be a little salty. It's the perfect offset to the pie, and my daughter's favorite part (ok, mine too) is the extra "pie crust cookies" we make by sprinkling cinnamon/sugar on the leftover dough and baking them.
Does anyone have any advice with regard to shrinking pie crusts? I made several pumpkin pies with homemade crusts, but the crusts shrank down, and did so unevenly.
Add water to the crust mixture with a spray bottle. This way you will use the smallest amount of water while getting the most coverage, allowing your crust to come to together without overworking or adding too much water.
You can get a pie shield to protect the crust from over-baking. I have two of them (one for pies and a larger one for tarts) and am so glad I made the investment; relatively inexpensive and sooo much easier than trying to crimp some foil around the edge of a hot pie. You just open the oven door and plop the shield on top. Here's an example:
I'm a total fan of food processor pie crust; I get super-flaky results but you have to be careful not to over-process. I use almost-frozen cubes of butter and pulse just until just coarse.
It's also important to not add too much water--you don' want paste! Start with the lowest amount called for (I usually start with 3T for a double crust) and add more water until the dough just comes together. I'm amazed how much the amt of water needed can vary depending on the weather and the flour, but if you start small and add more slowly, it's fine.
I would also recommend using Plugra or another high-fat butter if you're a beginner. It makes a really flaky crust and is easier to roll out than regular butter. The crust will brown a bit more, though, so you need to keep an eye on it and cover with foil if necessary.
I've found for shrinking crust when you put the bottom crust in the pan you need to give more dough to the crease in the pan. Do not stretch the dough.
I've made many pie crusts using lard, but they all come out too crumbly; never holding together long enough to bring a peice from the pie dish to a plate. Any idea what the problem would be?
I agree that practice makes perfect. I love pie, and love to cook just about everything, but I always have difficulty getting that top crust off the counter and onto the top of the pie. It stretches, breaks, and basically frustrates the heck out of me. But I know if I did it more than once or twice a year, I'd get better at it.
This article has inspired me--must make another pie this weekend!
My goodness what a lot of comments - and so many useful ones too! I will never equal my mother's pie crust, even using exactly her recipe and techniques as I just don't make pies often enough. However, she does have several tips that haven't been mentioned here (and several that have - like using waxed paper to roll out the dough): 1. to beat the summer heat: use a counter-top convection oven (or large toaster oven if it is reliable with its temps) and put it outside! and 2. Use the largest heaviest rolling pin you can find/handle - you work the dough less as you roll, making it easier for you and better for the crust.
I use a half-butter, half shortening recipe from cooks illustrated, and it always works and tastes good. But I am also careful about keeping things cold too. And, it things fall apart, it is surprising how pretty a pie crust can be with random (or intential shaped stars) of dough as the top. Also, if you are vegetarian, watch out for store bought crusts, most have lard. And the vegetarian ones are too expensive. much cheaper to make your own.
Help! I need a scrumptious coconut oil pie crust recipe.
I'm home nursing my pretty pittie back to health from surgery and thought "I should make a pie!" The last time I made my own pie crust was two years ago. I used Nutiva's cold pressed organic extra-virgin coconut oil along with a dollop of unsalted butter and it turned out wonderfully flakey and tasty. Unfortunately, like many of my recipes, results typically morph from countless hours experimenting without documentation.
Thank you!
ellabee, I have used earth balance original spread, only it tends to be salty, so I eliminate the salt in the crust recipe.
Sometimes, the gluten in the crust gets all excited and needs to mellow out before assembling. I usually roll out my crust and let it rest while making the filling. Helps that I have a stone countertop to keep it cool. That way, the proteins relax and you don't have the shrinkage. snowflake also has a good comment: make sure you ease the bottom crust into the corners.
I found and use a non-hydrogenated shortening (less water content) made by Spectrum. It is all vegetable and organic and perfect for pies. I use along with butter. Also I started using pastry flour which has lower protein. I purchased it from my local baker for .50 lb. They were very happy to sell this flour to me and we also got into a long discussion about pie making. The bakery only uses all butter for their crust since it is difficult, even for them, to purchase leaf lard. (a couple of years ago I did purchase leaf lard from my butcher but had to render it myself - a lot of work and to me not worth the time and effort).
Also I live in a very dry climate which really effects the moisture content in the flour pretty much all year. So replacing some of the water with vodka has worked for me.
I have enjoyed reading all the comments posted here and I ordered a "granny fork" made by Norpro from Amazon for blending - great idea ZoeCat!
Buy a pie crist shield from any store selling kitchen gadgets...Bed Barh and Beyond comes to mind. The shield is much easier than fiddling around with foil!!
I have used this recipe for 50 years with one variation. Instead of the water I add 1/4 c. milk to the oil in the measuring cup(do not stir). People love my crust and always comment on how flaky it is. It is fool proof because you roll it out on wax paper and then invert into the pie plate


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Some marker tests from the studio for a potential upcoming collaboration with Poketo.
Just added the Affordable Art Fair exhibition to my site. Description below. More images here.
"I was honored to be selected as a featured artist for the fall 2013 edition of The Affordable Art Fair in NYC. With the support of the Art Dossier, I designed the opening night photo booth, created a new edition of my Art is All Over print on 24-inch white aluminum circles exclusively for the fair, and displayed twelve cut paper and silkscreen pieces from a new body of work that had been over a year in the making. I also lead an artist guided tour of the fair focusing on "working artists" who, like myself, utilize methods and skills beyond the studio practice of the traditional "exhibiting artist" in order to sustain a living as a career artist in the modern economy and marketplace."
I'm helping jury the 2014 Chicago Alternative Comics Expo and was cued in on some good stuff today. This image is a frame from a Derf Backderf comic that I particularly enjoyed. I also really dig Emi Gennis's comics that pull stories from the Wikipedia page of unusual deaths.
Playing with some new ideas in the studio today. Here is a detail of a new work for The Economy, a bi-monthly publication that release one poem, one prose writing and one artist's work each issue. Coming to your screen Feb 1st.
Just printed a four postcard set of new work to bring with me down to Art Basel, Miami this weekend. I plan on hitting SCOPE, NADA, Pulse, Basel, Design Miami, and more.
It's finally here! This weekend is the Affordable Art Fair in NYC. I am one of the fair's featured artist for this year, including an exclusive editioned work on their under $500 wall, the design for the opening night photobooth, and a bunch of new collage work, right at the very front entrance of the building. Swing by if you are in town. Also, check out my "Who's Who" interview on their blog.
Thanks to The Art Dossier for bringing me out again this year. I can't say enough good things about these ladies. Look them up and check them out!
Check out some of my newest body of work at Fountain Ar Fair in Chicago this weekend (Sept 20-22nd, 2013)! It's your last chance to see it before I bring it all out to NYC (more on that soon). I'll be showing with long time friends Johalla Projects. Hope to see you there.
Shot a super secret photo in collaboration with Adi Goodrich and Brian Guido a few days ago. It's going to be a doozy.
Installing the Risograph exhibition in The Post Family Space for Printers Ball 2013.


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The Lance Corporal's inbox is OPEN
Irvin gave me the task of "maintaining an outlet for boosting public image and civilian morale." I told him it was inane and redundant, and to get someone else to do it.
He told me we don't always get what we want.
Letters are answered in my free time, at my discretion. The current schedule, with exceptions, is once daily Mon-Sat. On Sundays, we clean.
I've got 99 problems and these little shits cause most of them.
OOC Info
Tracking: #ask irl levi #askirllevi
Follows blogs and asks questions from the alt account askirllevi.


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Date: Every Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Erased From the Landscape with photographs by Abbie Reese, and Geography by Sky with paintings by Angela Battle, are at the Quad City Arts Center, 1715 2nd Ave., Rock Island, from Nov. 2-Dec. 28. Hours are 10 a.m.-5 p.m. Tuesday-Friday; 11 a.m.-5 p.m. Saturday. Call (309) 793-1213 or email for details.
Esther's Golden Vegetable Bake
(More recipes)
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While a T-shirt and jeans may be appropriate for a game, you need something a little bit classier for your everyday Sabres look. This Impact performance polo from Antigua provides the look you need with a touch of Buffalo spirit. A Sabres logo is embroidered on the left chest of this polo which features a super soft, tonal pattern fabric with moisture-wicking Desert Dry technology. Whether you're rushing to a meeting or hitting the links, you'll stay dry and comfortable while representing your team in this polo!
- 100% Polyester fabric
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Tour Guide Profile: Elliott Neep
Elliott is an award-winning professional wildlife photographer supplying stock images to Getty Images and Frank Lane Picture Agency (FLPA). Elliott's images regularly feature in books, greeting cards, calendars, magazines, and the national press.. Alongside his photographer and guiding roles, Elliott produces feature illustrated articles and has his own column in Practical Photography magazine, one of Britain's leading photography monthlies.
Elliott was raised in Middlesex on the borders of Greater London's green-belt country. After studying Business & Marketing, Elliott spent several years in IT working for Intel Corporation among others, before concluding that the 'office suit' would simply never fit. Early in 2002, Elliott took up a new vocation in photography – studying, practicing, and shooting every day. By the summer of 2002, Elliott began freelancing with eHouse, a property photography agency.
By 2005, wildlife photography had become a full-time career. Elliott won his first award in the Wildlife Photographer of the Year 2005, with subsequent exhibition images and awards in The International Photographer of the Year, British Wildlife Photographer of the Year, Windland Smith Rice International Awards (Natures Best), and the International Loupe (Aperture) Awards.
In 2012, Elliott will be guiding photographers in the Ngorongoro Crater & Serengeti in Tanzania, Volcanoes National Park in Rwanda, forest realms of Finland, the Svalbard Archipelago in the Norwegian High-Arctic, the Falklands, South Georgia and the Antarctic Peninsula.


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- Antique Jewelry
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Love Afire - 2.04 c Vintage Engagement Ring
Marked down from $22750!
A sensational platinum filigree mount is a fitting companion for a simply dazzling transitional cut diamond with an known weight of 2.04 carats (J color; VS1 clarity). Encircled with mille graining accenting a round platinum bezel, the main diamond will simply take your breath away.
Fine open work and additional mille grain detail accentuates the eighteen (18) single cut diamonds with a total estimated diamond weight of .22 carats (I-K color range; SI1 clarity) dotted amongst the ornate platinum setting.
Accompanied by an EGL USA certificate for replacement value of $28,390 for the main diamond alone.
Date: Diamond is circa 1930. Mount is later 20th century.
Measurements: 9/16 of an inch (1.5 cm) in length north to south on the hand and rises 1/4 of an inch (0.6 cm) in height off the finger. Weight of 5.0 grams (3.2 dwt).
Ring Size: US 7-1/4 (UK O; Int. Dia. 17.5; Euro 55 mm; Japan just over 14) and easily can be sized to fit most. Ring sizing information.
Hallmarks: PT 95.
Condition: Excellent; evidence of a previous resizing visible upon very close inspection or with magnification.
Note: This ring comes with a EGL USA certificate for the main diamond which has been removed from the mount for accurate weight and grading The other diamonds have not been removed from their mounts to preserve the integrity of the setting. Those diamond weights have been approximated by measurement and formula and may vary from actual weights. Grading has been done in situ and also may vary if stones are removed.
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Posting the sane and insane news about the law and what otherwise strikes my fancy.
The opinions and commentary made by this author is solely his own. It does not reflect the opinion of any other individual or organization including the Comal County Criminal District Attorney's Office or Comal County.


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S.O.T.A. Death Metal Black Wheels
One size fits all? Usually not. That's why this product comes in multiple sizes - one that's right for your vehicle. Some modifications may still be required for the ideal fit.
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Sourced from the finest mills in Italy, this cashmere cardigan will be an adorable addition to any winter wardrobe thanks to its supreme comfort and versatility. This sweater will be the perfect classroom companion.
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Three robbed at gunpoint
SALISBURY — Three Salisbury residents were robbed at gunpoint after they were approached by two men about 3:30 a.m. this morning.
Authorities said one man was pistol whipped in the confrontation, but wasn't seriously injured. More than $200 in cash was taken during the robbery.
Investigators are looking into the robbery, Capt. Shelia Lingle said Thursday.
Police said two men followed the group home from a service station on East Innes Street. When they group entered an apartment in the 500 block of Park Avenue, authorities said one of the gunmen approached and demanded money.
"Do you think this is a game?" the gunman repeatedly asked, according to one of the witnesses' statements.
Authorities said one of the men was wearing a burgundy shirt and jeans. He was holding a silver semi-automatic handgun and had a short haircut and dark skin. The other suspect was listed only as a dark skinned male.
Anyone with information is asked to call Salisbury Police at 704-638-5333 or Rowan County Crime Stoppers at 1-866-639-5245.


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93Q's Day In The Country: Eli Young Band
Sat, Jul 6, 2013 7:00 pm
The Cynthia Woods Mitchell Pavilion, Spring, TX
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Help!! I am struggling to transport and use my Photoshop Elements 8 catalog with my new Photoshop Elements 10 installation. All of the manuals and tutorials I have read or listened to assume Elements 10 has just been installed on the same machine where Elements 8 is installed. This is not my case.
I have been using Elements 8 to organize my snapshots on my aging Dell desktop, running Windows XP, since 1969. I use a 500GB LaCie external Hard Drive (drive:E) for backup purposes and a 1TB LaCie external Hard Drive (drive:F to store all my digital photos, having first made duplicate copies on CD/DVDs. As the internal hard drive became fuller and performance was becoming more sluggish, I took the opportunity when Elements 10 was offered at a very good price to purchase it and look around for a more up-to-date computer. I plumped for a Lenovo desktop with Intel Core i3 processor, running Windows 7 (no included monitor.)
Since February 2004, Ive managed to accumulate nearly 30,000 files yes, I know Im not very selective but Ive travelled a lot and along with these files Ive managed to create about 700 tags.
My first attempt at importing the PSE8 Organiser catalog consisted of me going to the catalog backup on my E:drive and hopefully `converting that. Using that converted file, renamed Elements 8 catalog as the current catalog I began to connect with the photo files on the F:drive. I should maybe point out at this juncture, because of the lack of a 2nd monitor, I have to disconnect and reconnect the monitor as well as the external hard drives when switching from one computer to the other. After many minutes (hours) and allowing a good degree of stacking, when the job was finished Id managed to retrieve about 10 tags, all applying to just about 6 very old photos.
As the PSE8 Organiser catalog backup is about 120GB on the E:drive, I was reluctant to just copy that onto the new C:drive and hope for the best. Instead, I searched for My Catalog on the old computer and found it at C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Adobe\Elements Organizer\Catalogs\My Catalog.
Looking at the size of the `My Catalog folder its 736MB seemed a lot more manageable. My plan was to copy this folder with its 3 sub-folders to an 8GB USB Flash drive. Then I would insert the Flash drive into the new computer and see if the new version of Elements could find and do something useful with that. However, again after many minutes (hours), copying stopped with the error message `Cannot copy breeze-29666: The directory or file cannot be created. By this time 731MB of the 736MB had been copied. I tried just copying and pasting the remaining files into the `BreezeData folder which prompted a similar error message.
Where do I go from here?
I was wondering about uninstalling Elements 10 and all its components from the new computer, installing Elements 8 on that computer, using the restore backup from the E:drive and then re-installing Elements 10. With luck Elements 10 would then find and invite conversion of the old catalog. Any thoughts?


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To benefit the National Parkinson Foundation South Palm Beach County
Numbers of Teams: 35 | 15 days to go!
Sunday, November 16, 2014
FAU Stadium, Boca Raton
About Moving Day®
Moving Day® is the National Parkinson Foundation South Palm Beach County's annual fundraising walk/run event. It is a fun and inspiring fundraising event that unites families, friends and communities both large and small in the fight against Parkinson's disease. This celebration of movement will feature a family friendly walk course, a kids area, a caregivers relaxation tent and a special Movement Pavilion featuring yoga, dance, Tai Chi, Pilates, etc. all proven to help manage the symptoms of PD.
It will be 'A day to move, a day to move others, a day that moves YOU!'
2014 Incentive Prize pdf Moving Day® Local Sponsors


text: Among the Easton aluminum arrows, should a certain spine number be all the same regardless of the grade? (X7, Platinum, Jazz) Reason being, I don't want to use expensive arrows in the public field bales here, their trash. So I want a beater set and a better set like the X7's to use at well maintained ranges.