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Introducing the All New 2012 Sports Cross Runner-
Exclusively Offered by Sunny Sports! Limited Edition!
Impressive performance, exceptional handling and remarkable modern sport-styling prove the all-new redesigned 250 RTA is a clear winner in its class.
Designed to be the top performer in its class—it's the total package that provides all day comfort and effortless handling in the city, exhilarating performance on the open road and the ground clearance and suspension travel needed to truly bring out the adventurer in you.
A compact, rock solid 250cc 4 stroke air cooled engine demonstrates the advanced race-proven technology. It provides a smooth curve of power with excellent torque figures from idle to the rev limit.
Transmission Features
the crankcase carries a five-speed close-ratio transmission with an universal standard shifting pattern (one down four up). A race-proven wet clutch contributes to smoother downshifting and corner entry.
Wide handlebars and an upright position have been incorporated to give high levels of stability and maneuverability as well as all day comfort and great visibility. Hop into the firm-feeling seat and the RTA feels much more-narrow than most of the sports bikes. While most sport bikes have an aggressive, track-focused riding position, the RTA is the most relaxed of the group. The seat height ranges from 31.7 inches at its lowest setting to 32.5 inches.
The 250 RTA has a clean dash that feeds information to the rider in an aesthetically pleasing and intelligent manner.
RTC one of the lighter bikes in its class. With its 3.5-gallon fuel tank topped of it tips the scales at 340 pounds. With the exhaust routed below the engine it keeps additional weight low to the ground and that translates to its light feel.
With standard-fit ABS, the front and rear disc braking setup of the Cross runner is not only efficient and powerful, but safe too. 270mm disc is arrested by two-piston calipers at the front, whilst rear 220 mm discs adopt a twin-piston caliper for precise control.
Extensive development work with the ratio of master cylinder-piston to caliper-piston ratios has achieved a high degree of rider feel for optimized levels of braking control and heightened aspects of rider feedback.
You are probably wondering how we can afford to sell these scooters at such low prices. We don't hand pick products from different factories; we design, we select the best quality parts, and we build our own scooters! Factory direct! We ship directly from our 96,000 sq. ft. warehouse here in Chino California. We are here 7 days a week to assist you with your every need.
Product Highlights:
- 4 Stroke 250CC Air cool Engine Top speed 65+ mph
- Race-developed & lightweight conventional forks delivers superb feedback and consistent performance.
- Aluminum Rims
- Upright seating position
- Front & Rear Hydraulic disc brakes
- Front 110/70/17 Rear 130/70/17 DOT approved tires
- Dual Rear Shock
- EPA approved and street legal in all states Exclude CA & NJ.
Remember every purchase from Scooter Depot includes:
- Free Residential Service fee with lift gate service.
- Your unit started and tested by our mechanics before it is sent to you!
- Free MSO and Bill of Sale
- Life Time technical support
- 1 year Engine warranty
- Full parts availability
- Factory Direct Pricing
- 100% Freight protection insurance
US EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) APPROVED
Unique & Genuine Factory VIN Number
US DOT (Department of Transportation) APPROVED
This Motorcycle/Scooter is registrable with department of motor vehicles and legal to own and operate in the public road in all states except for CA, PA and NJ. Title, stickers, and other registration documents will be included with your purchase.
Technical Support: We are a DMV certified full line dealership, our experienced technicians provide professional service that you can count on, phone number to technical support is 888-839-7088 or 909-287-0366 Monday thru Friday, 9am to 5pm PST. Please provide order information when you call.
Free Registration documentation: We provide a complete MSO (Manufacturer's Certificate of Origin) and the Bill of Sale which might be required for registration at your local Dept. of Motor Vehicles. The MSO is such an important document and is not supposed to be shipped with the scooter, it will be mailed to you after you receive your scooter and email us the VIN number on the scooter. MSO generally requires 2 ~ 4 days to process.
Where to locate your VIN#:
Vehicle Identification Number is usually located on the front of the steering stem or at the bottom of the floor mat, where you would place your foot. The VIN number consists of a 17 digit alpha numeric number, and usually has the engine number located on the same plate. The plated steel mount can be either black or steel.
Each MSO Title certificate will be accompanied by a Bill of Sale and Invoice for registration purposes. If your state requires your MSO to be notarized, please indicate on your MSO request form. There is a $25.00 fee for each notary. We offer overnight service for an additional $55.00. Please note: overnight service only guarantees we mail your documents via overnight service. We do not guarantee your MSO will be prepared and processed overnight. There is $20.00 fee for each replacement MSO.
Once you receive these documents, you need to take them with your scooter or motorcycle to your local DMV (Department of Motor Vehicle). They will inspect the bike and compare the VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) on the paperwork to the one on the scooter. They will inspect the vehicle as well. Your DMV will collect the sales tax as well as any applicable registration fee and will issue a license plate for your vehicle.
The certificate of origin is an official title document that releases the scooter from the importer to the dealer. The dealer released the scooter to you. All documents for every street legal vehicle are usually sent in the mail 2 to 4 days after the scooter is shipped. Please note, we do not mail your MSO and Bill of Sales alone with your scooter, there is a possibility of receiving your registration information before you even receive your vehicle, since the LTL trucking company usually has longer transit time frame compares to first class mail service. We request each customer to confirm your VIN by email if you don't receive your registration documentations 7 business days after receiving your street legal scooter or motorcycle. To confirm: simply send an email to firstname.lastname@example.com include your order number and VIN in the subject or the body. We have professional title staff to process your title request immediately. MSO request generally requires 3-5 business days to process, and it is FREE of charge. The VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) is a unique 17 digit number. The VIN can be found on the outside of the shipping carton or on the scooter itself. You may also contact our MSO department representatives directly at 626-343-2077.
Some Assembly Required. In most cases and depending on which model purchased, it usually takes anywhere from 30 to 90 minutes to complete the assembly process of your vehicle. Our vehicles are usually 80% assembled at the factory and fully tested prior to shipping.To complete the assembly of your vehicle, you will need to properly install and/or assemble the contents included with your vehicle. Depending on the model purchased, these items are usually located in the storage compartment underneath the seat. For your safety, be sure to check and tighten all screws, nuts, and bolts prior to using your vehicle for the very first time and periodically thereafter. Depending on the length of time the scooter has been stored in the crate after factory testing, the carburetor may need to be cleaned due to possible sediment build-up. Detailed instructions on how to perform this procedure can be obtained by contacting our technical support team. Local pick-ups and optional assembly service is available upon request.
Remember! You are responsible for performing the setup and PDI (Pre-Delivery Inspection) that a dealer would normally perform (ie. installing rear view mirrors, setting up and connecting the battery, checking tightness of all screws, nuts, bolts, changing oil, etc.). In some instances, it may be necessary for your vehicle to be setup and tuned by a local service center. Items such as loose hardware and parts damaged from loose hardware and components are not covered under warranty. It is advisable to use a thread locking agent such as Loctite on all hardware to help prevent loss of hardware. Occasionally, on some units, it may be necessary to perform other routine checks or adjustments, such as adjusting the setting of the idle speed and fuel/air mixture screws on the carburetor, cleaning of the carburetor, checking to ensure wires are connected properly, adjusting chain slack and alignment (if applicable), in order to achieve optimum performance from your vehicle. We will gladly assist you with any additional technical questions you may have.
Prior to first use, it is mandatory to have the existing motor/engine oil (known as "packing oil") replaced. The packing oil should be replaced with conventional four-stroke "Motorcycle Grade" (SAE 10W-40) engine/motor oil. Be sure to regularly inspect engine fluid levels to ensure that your vehicle operates safely according to manufacturer's recommended specifications.
Please, feel free to contact our technical support team at firstname.lastname@example.com or (909)287-0366. Our technical support team is available Monday through Friday, 8am to 5pm PST.
|Engine Type
|250cc, 4-Stroke
|Cooling System
|Max Horsepower
|Number of Gears
|Final Drive
|Starting System
|Max Speed
|65+ MPH, +/- 5MPH (Depending on Riders Weight and Road Conditions)
|Fuel Capacity
|3.3 Gallon
|Reinforced Steel Tube
|Front Suspension
|Telescopic Forks
|Rear Suspension
|Single Shock
|Front Brake
|Disc Brake
|Rear Brake
|Disc Brake
|Front Tire
|Rear Tire
|Parking lamps, Headlight (Hi/Low), Turn Signals, Tailight/Brakelight, Passing Switch, Dash Backlight
|Weight Capacity
|Number of Riders
|Dry Weight
|304 lbs
|Seat Height
|31.5 inches
|Overall Length
|82.28 inches
|One year warranty on Engine and frame. Limited Factory Warranty.
|95% Assembled- setup required
|NOT for sale in CA & NJ**For Shipments to Washington, D.C. Maryland, Massachusetts, Maryland, Florida, New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Virginia, West Virginia, Maine, Connecticut, Vermont, New Hampshire, Rhode Island; an additional freight charge of $75 up to $175 is required for two-wheel models and $100 up to $250 for all three-wheel models . For Hawaii and Alaska, the additional freight charges will be from $575 up to $1250 depending on the model of choice. Please email or contact us by phone for shipping rates prior to placing your order. Items that offer free shipping do not pertain to any of the above named states.
Note: Scooter performance may vary depending upon weather conditions, terrain conditions, length of use and wieght of rider.
|Local Pick Up
|Assembly Fee
|$175 for all 70cc,110cc and 125cc dirt bikes, $200 for all scooters/motorcycles including 50cc, 150cc and 250cc. $250 for all Trikes and Go karts. Assembled by our Certified Mechanic. Please Call 909-287-0388 for more detailed information.
|DMV Fee
|$140 California DMV Registration Fee
|C A Tax
|8.75% California Sold / Outside of California Tax Exempt
Simple, we make customer satisfaction our top priority. We take care of the customers that buy from us - GUARANTEED!
MotorSports Depot Inc. is dedicated to providing our customers with the best service possible! We will continue to strive to make www.ScooterDepot.us your first choice for the best products, fast shipping and superior customer services.
With so many companies to choose from, you may wonder why buy from us? We have steadily grown our business over the last 8 years. From this solid and successful foundation, we plan to continue serving as a major market supplier of high quality motor sports products. Our staff includes an outstanding; customer oriented sales team, a dedicated customer service, parts & technical support team, shipping department, exceptional internet marketing personnel and a research and development department committed to providing the very best products available.
Everyday customers tell us how happy they are that they found us. Here is a partial listing of the reasons why you should buy from us instead of a competitor:
- Wholesale price open to public- low discounted Prices
please don't let our Super Low Prices scare you! We are one of the largest Authorized Dealers for most of the brands we offer. By eliminating the middle man, we are able to offer you these incredibly low prices and a Low Price Guarantee for such high quality items.
Great Product Selection
With years of business behind us, we know this industry. Research and Development is ongoing at MotorSports DepotInc. We work closely with our manufacturers and EPA; DOT, C.A.R.B & etc. agencies to ensure our products meet all federal standards and requirements.
Reputable, Reliable, Accessible, Courteous, & Professional
We are established and dependable- We have been in business for over 7 years and we are growing rapidly. For over 7 years, we have gained tremendous experience serving thousands of customers in high quality Scooters, Motorcycles, Go karts and Dirt bikes. Our knowledgeable staff is enthusiastic, helpful and courteous; we have a great attitude and want your business. We care about our customers and make ourselves easily accessible. Our toll-free number is 1-888-839-7088. Your satisfaction is our #1 concern. Why get yourself all frustrated & try to get hold of a company never answers the calls? Pick up the phone dial our Toll Free 888-839-7088. We guarantee you will find the best customer services here you deserve.
Exceptional Quality Customer Service and Tech Support are Unmatched
We do not just put up a catalog with prices. We have worked extremely hard to give you the most information to help you make your decision. This information is honest and reliable. We sort the products in many different ways so you can find the product you need even if you have no clue about what you should use. We not only help you choose the best product for the job, we'll provide support to help you install it and to get it working. You will find that our sales staff at MotorSports DepotInc. is knowledgeable, pleasant to deal with and responsive. Our Knowledgeable staff and Special Project Support employees know our products, and we will make sure you get the right product for the job. Unlike many internet stores that just sell products without physically seeing the products (they are drop shippers!), we actively use them, and we provide maintenance and service here as well!
We are easy to reach
Help and advice is only a quick e-mail or phone call away. When you contact MotorSports Depot Inc., we have a fully-staffed Sales Department to assist you. We keep you updated after you place an order with us. You can also use our Easy contact form to get questions answered fast. We are open 7 days a week from 9:00am to 6:00pm PST, and e-mails are always answered within 24 hours, usually within a few hours at the most! Our Live Chat Sales Representatives stay online during our normal business hours to assist you with any questions and concerns you might have and guide you through the process of completing an order. If you ever have a problem, you can rest assured that we will be here to help you out.
No Sales Tax outside of CA
No sales Tax collected! (Only orders shipped to California are charged sales Tax.*). That is another way you save big ordering from us compared to your local retailer. That is like getting an extra 8% - 10% discount. Don't forget about this!
Parts! Parts! Parts! & extremely helpful technical supports team just for you!
We stock all common parts for all products we carry. If you purchased your Scooters, motorcycles, Go Kart or Dirt bikes from us - you are special and will be given that special treatment each and every time you come back. We offer replacements parts at extremely low prices even if your warranty has expired! Just FYI, if you have any frustrating friends, co-workers, family members are looking for replacement parts that they could not get from where they bought their bikes from, have them call us! We provide 80% of the spare parts on the market, not just to end users, even the dealers!
We do NOT Drop ship our orders! We are a DMV licensed and bonded motor Dealer in CA.
Unlike most of the On-line companies, we ship our products directly out of our 90,000 square foot warehouse. We display all CARB Approved models we carry in our showroom. Our will call center open 7 days a week. We are a DMV licensed and bonded motor Dealer in CA. We served thousands of customers nationwide over the past 7 years. All of our products are well protected and shipped in a metal frame. We inspect every item before it is packaged and shipped from our warehouse to make sure you will receive the best product possible.
We PDI all vehicles before we ship!
One of the special services exclusive to your vehicle purchase from MotorSports Depot Inc. is that we inspect each and every item prior to leaving our warehouse. Our inspection comes at no additional cost to you and will allow you to do a simple 30-90 minute assembly to get your vehicle on the road. Our setup and Pre Delivery Inspection includes:
- Dynamic testing of fuel system and throttle cable.
- Testing electrical system to ensure all lights are operational.
- Check engine operation including starting the motor and operate through the RPM range.
- Check brakes and suspension for safety.
- Check final drive system.
- Check all keys are delivered for vehicle and trunk (if applicable).
- Safety check of wheel axles and nuts for tightness.
We support our Troops! Exclusive Military and law Enforcement Discount: Supports Our Troops!
We know you're job is tough that's why we make it easy for you to order the products you need and get it to you as quickly as possible. For more information, please contact one of our sales representatives at 888-839-7088.
Volume discount & senior citizen discounts, teacher discounts and Student Discount are available
For more details check with one of our live sales representatives during our normal business hours: 7 days a week, 9:00am to 6:00pm PST.
Secured Shopping & Fraud Protection
All credit card transactions are conducted on a secure server. We confirm ALL orders prior to processing the order to ensure that a fraud is not being committed by calling the cardholder listed on the credit card / ATM card. We will go out of our way to make sure your personal information and property is well protected. Sunny Sports Inc. employs various credit card fraud prevention services, provided by our online merchant processor, in order to insure purchases made from Sunny Sports Inc. are not fraudulent. When you transmit credit card information to complete a purchase or verify data, we always transmit that credit card number in an encrypted format (SSL) SSL protects customer information such as credit card numbers, names, and addresses during the exchange between your computer and our server. All credit card transactions are processed through our SSL secure server. You'll know the information is protected if the closed-lock symbol pops into view in the lower right- or left-hand corner of your screen while you are checking out. You can also verify secure pages by checking the address or URL listed on the location bar. If you spot an "s" after the "http" at the beginning of the address, you know that you're browsing in a secure environment.
Fast order Processing, Shipping and Tracking system
We understand that you want to be part of the process throughout the order and delivery of your order. We always strive to provide you the best shopping experience possible. You will know the status of your order every step of the way. We believe that it is important for us and you to know your order status from the moment your credit card is submitted for authorization and verification, to the arrival of your product at your doorstep. We ship directly to your door with lift gate service with no additional charge. We do not tolerate the HIDDEN CHARGE GAME our competitors play!
We Keep You Informed Every Step of The Way!
Fast Service
Our goal is to ship out all customer orders that are in stock within 72 hours. In fact, most in stock orders placed before 1:00 PM PST are shipped out the next business day while most of the competitors are charging additional $99 for it. We ship your order directly to your door step. No additional charge for residential delivery, lift gate service, or delivery notification service.
Confirmation of your order email: Thank you for placing your order. We will immediately send you a confirmation email upon receipt of your order. In this email you will see exactly what was charged and what item was ordered. Please print a copy of this email for your records.
Order processed email: One of our sales representatives will be contacting you as soon as your order is placed. We will verify that the card is valid, active, and has the funds to cover the total purchase. We will also verify the billing and shipping information that you provided us. If you listed an alternate shipping address, we will contact your issuing bank to verify the alternate shipping address is notated in your account. If it is not, please notate the alternate address with your bank and notify us. Inventory based on your order will be assigned for shipping.
Tracking number email: Your order has shipped from our warehouse where the item(s) has been accurately picked, securely packed and shipped in a professional manner. You can track your package via the tracking number we email to your supplied email address.
Buy how and when it suits you. You can buy online or on the phone Toll Free at 888-839-7088 on Credit Cards, Check cards, Bank Transfer, Cashier Check, Money Order, PayPal, or Western Union. Our customer service teams speak English, Spanish, and Chinese in your time zone.
We respect your privacy.
We do not sell or share your information to/with any other company. Every Transition is highly secured! We utilize Secure Sockets Layer (SSL) encryption protocol. All credit card transactions are processed through our SSL secure server.
Simple Secure Checkout- We make your purchase as easy as possible!
You don't have to go through 10 different pages filling out information. Just click order on the product you want, choose your shipping options, fill out your address and payment info and that's it!
For your convenience, we accept Visa, MasterCard, American Express, Discover, Pay Pal, Wire transfer, Money order, Cashier Check and Western Union. For more information, please call our Toll Free 888-839-7088 for detail.
We want you to purchase your Scooters, Motorcycles, Go karts or Dirt bikes from us and we want you back......... OFTEN! We guarantee SUPERIOR PRODUCTS & CUSTOMER SERVICE!
◊ SSL Secure Web Site Ordering!
◊ Low Low Prices, all year round!
◊ Courteous, Knowledgeable and Professional Sales Personnel!
◊ Brand New and Factory Fresh Merchandise!
◊ Thousands of Satisfied Customers!
◊ Next Business Day Shipping!
◊ All orders are double boxed and securely packaged!
◊ Toll Free Customer Support!
◊ No sales tax in any state!
◊ Quality name brand products!
◊ Order confirmation & shipment notification with tracking information!
◊ All Items In Stock & Ready To Ship!
◊ All Items New with Full Warranty!
◊ No high pressure sales tactics!
◊ Highly rated customer service!
◊ Recruitment of experienced & enthusiastic team members!
◊ Competitive pricing!
◊ Instant access to sales & service specialists during business hours!


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Severstal: Reduced Inventory by 20%*
Find out how this Russia-based mining giant is using SAP ERP to transform its global business processes. Severstal has reduced inventory by 20%, cut finance costs by 40% – and has gained real-time visibility across its warehouse processes.*
Nyrstar: Minimizing Financial Risk
Read how Nyrstar, the world's largest producer of zinc, is gaining greater control over its newly formed businesses – using SAP ERP and SAP Treasury and Risk Management to tightly integrate processes and increase insight into risk exposure.
PT Timah: Pursuing Operational Excellence
Discover how PT Timah, the largest tin producer in Indonesia, is using SAP ERP to harmonize its IT landscape – resulting in a 40% faster financial close, 60% reduced cycle time for forecasts, and 90% less time needed to create reports.*
SAP Mining and Metals Forum
October 8-9, 2014 Darmstadt, Germany.
Join the world's leading mining and metals executives for two extraordinary days of SAP and customer focused sessions.

subset: commoncrawl


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Timbaland | Official Site
Tune into the Season Premiere of "THE HILLS" on MTV to hear "Apologize" by Timbaland feat. One Republic!
Tonight, 8/13 @ 10:00PM ET/PT
Timbaland has been nominated for a 2007 MTV Music Video Award in the Monster Single of the Year category for his song "The Way I Are"
For a complete list of nominees click here
Make Sure To Check Out A Special Edition Of MTV's "TRL" Featuring The 2007 VMA Press Conference With Announcements Of This Year's Nominees And Appearances By Robin Thicke & Timbaland
Today, 8/7 @ 1:00pm
50 CENT Featuring
Justin Timberlake & Timbaland
Click HERE to see to the BRAND NEW 50 Cent video.
Click HERE to listen to the brand new Timbaland vs Nephew remix of "The Way I Are" featuring DOE, Sebastian and Keri Hilson!
Click HERE to download it from iTunes!
Come see Timbaland on the second leg of the Justin Timberlake North American Tour!
For tour dates click HERE
Timbaland has been nominated in FIVE different categories for the 2007 Teen Choice Awards!
Choice Music - Single for "Give It To Me" Featuring Nelly Furtado & Justin Timberlake
Choice Music - Male Artist
Choice Music - Rap Artist
Choice Music -...
BET "106 & Park" New Joint!
Timbaland "The Way I Are"
Friday, 6/22 @ 6:00pm
Saturday, 6/23 @ 11:00am
Monday, 6/25 @ 11:00am
Click HERE to see the WORLD PREMIERE of Timbaland's BRAND NEW music video "The Way I Are" featuring Keri Hilson, D.O.E., & Sebastian.
Click HERE to vote Timbaland's Throw It On Me featuring the Hives video to win MTV's Battle of the Bands!.
The winning video will air on MTV, MTV2, and MTV.com on Wednesday.
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Significant New Alternatives Policy (SNAP) Final Rule Summary
Statutory Requirements
Section 612 of the Clean Air Act (CAA) requires EPA to establish a program to identify alternatives to Class I (CFCs, halons, carbon tetrachloride, methyl choroform, methyl bromide, and HBFCs) and Class II (HCFCs) ozone-depleting substances and to publish lists of acceptable and unacceptable substitutes. Upon promulgation of the final rule, it is illegal to replace a Class I or Class II substance with any substitute which the Administrator determines may present adverse effects to human health or the environment where other substitutes have been identified that reduce overall risk and are currently or potentially available.
Any person may petition EPA to add a substitute to either of the lists. Such petitions will be granted or denied within 90 days of receipt of a complete petition. In addition, any person who produces a substitute for a Class I substance must notify EPA at least 90 days before new or existing alternatives are introduced into interstate commerce for significant new use as substitutes for a Class I substance.
The Final Rule
On March 18, 1994, EPA published the Final Rulemaking (FRM) (59 FR 13044), which described the process for administering the SNAP program and issued EPA's first acceptability lists for substitutes in the major industrial use sectors. These sectors include refrigeration and air conditioning; solvents; foam blowing; fire suppression and explosion protection; sterilants; aerosols; adhesives, coatings, and inks; and tobacco expansion. To assess the acceptability of a substitute, the Agency completes a screening analysis in which overall risks to human health and the environment in use-specific applications are examined.
EPA intends to publish updates to the SNAP rule. These updates may be in two parts, a 'Notice' or a 'Rulemaking.' A 'Notice' contains no regulatory controls and thus does not need to go through the public comment process. It enters into force upon publication in the Federal Register.
A Rulemaking requires a public notice-and-comment process, beginning with a 'Notice of Proposed Rulemaking (NPRM)'. An NPRM contains proposed lists of agents deemed 'Acceptable Subject to Use Conditions,' 'Acceptable Subject to Narrowed Use Limits,' and 'Unacceptable'. There is a 30-day public comment period beginning on the date of publication in the Federal Register, after which a 'Final Rulemaking' is published.
Several Notices and Rules have been published since the inception of the SNAP program.
Who Must Apply For Listing
Under SNAP, the Agency defines a "substitute" as any chemical, product, substitute, or alternative manufacturing process, whether existing or new, that could replace a Class I or Class II substance. Anyone who produces a substitute must provide the Agency with health and safety studies, as well as notify the Agency at least 90 days before introducing it into interstate commerce for use as an alternative. This requirement applies to chemical manufacturers, but may include importers, formulators or end-users when they are responsible for introducing a substitute into commerce.
Information For SNAP Submission
To develop the lists of acceptable and unacceptable substitutes, the Agency must assess and compare "overall risks to human health and the environment" posed by use of substitutes in the context of particular applications. EPA requires submission of information covering a wide range of health and environmental factors. These include intrinsic properties such as physical and chemical information, ozone depleting potential, global warming potential, toxicity, and flammability, and use-specific data such as substitute applications, process description, environmental release data, environmental fate and transport, and cost information.
Once a completed submission has been received, a 90 day review period under the SNAP program will commence. Any substitute which is a new chemical must also be submitted to the Agency under the Premanufacture Notice (PMN) program under the Toxic Substances Control Act (TSCA). Alternatives that will be used in pesticide formulations must be filed jointly with EPA's Office of Pesticide Programs and with SNAP.
Any information submitted as Confidential Business Information (CBI) will be treated in a manner consistent with 40 CFR Part 2, Subpart B. All claims of confidentiality must be substantiated at the time of submission.
SNAP Notification Forms and the SNAP notification guidance manual may be requested from the Stratospheric Ozone Protection Hotline at 1-800-296-1996 or contact the SNAP Coordinator at (202) 343-9410.
The SNAP Lists
EPA has identified three mechanisms for revising or expanding the list of SNAP determinations published in the final regulation:
- First, as new substitutes are developed for commercial sale, producers must notify EPA at least 90 days before introduction of a chemical into interstate commerce for significant new use as an alternative to Class I or Class II substances;
- Second, any person may petition EPA to add or delete substances from the SNAP lists of acceptable and unacceptable alternatives; and
- Third, EPA may revise the SNAP lists outside the context of petitions or notifications, based on new data or on characteristics of substitutes previously reviewed.
Lists of acceptable and unacceptable substitutes for the industrial use sectors covered under the SNAP program can be obtained from the Stratospheric Ozone Hotline at 1-800-296-1996. International callers dial direct 202-343-9210. Calls will be returned within 24 hours on business days between the hours of 9 a.m. to 5 p.m., Eastern Time. The SNAP Federal Register notices can be ordered from the Government Printing Office Order Desk (202) 783-3238; the citations for each are listed in the SNAP chronology.


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Terms & Conditions.
Some product exclusions may apply. See product page details for more information. Clearance items are final sale. Price matching does not apply to this or any promotion. Offer is valid until September 13 at 11:59 PM PST. May not be combined with any other offer/discount (unless specified), including invitation credits, promotional gift cards and/or special discount links. Discount applied upon checkout. Log in to your account to see your savings.
WallPops. They're design-savvy, supremely chic wall decals that are totally removable, reusable, and repositionable. This set of 16 Dots will add a zingy effect to any wall needing a solid shot of personality. Why not sweeten up your home, your office, your kid's room? Stick them everywhere. Stick all the time. Just keep sticking and laughing and sticking and sticking. Oh, so you're a sticker freak, eh?
In total there are 16 Dots, 8 of each design. L: 13" W 13". WallPops are repositionable and always removable.
This product has no reviews yet. Be the first to review this product. Write a review
Enjoy 10% off your first order*


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IMLS Press Contact
Giuliana Bullard, firstname.lastname@example.com
Washington, DC—The Institute of Museum and Library Services will host a free webinar on the opportunities for collaboration between institutions participating in Let's Move! Museums & Gardens (LMMG) and communities participating in Let's Move! Cities, Towns and Counties (LMCTC). This is an opportunity to interact with representatives of IMLS, the National League of Cities, and participants in the LMMG and LMCTC initiatives, as we highlight ways museums and gardens can work with their local officials.
Like LMMG, Let's Move! Cities, Towns, and Counties is part of First Lady Michelle Obama's comprehensive Let's Move! initiative. It calls upon local officials to adopt long-term, sustainable, and holistic approaches to come together to create a generation of healthier children. This webinar is an opportunity to hear from cities that are collaborating with local museums and gardens and learn successful strategies to begin or expand a partnership.
This webinar is being offered free of charge and no pre-registration is required. To participate, simply go to this Blackboard Collaborative Meeting Room at the time of the webinar, enter your information, and join the conversation. You may listen using your computer's speakers or dial 1-866-299-7945. When prompted, enter the passcode 9485763#.
Date: Wednesday, September 25
Time: 2:00 – 3:00 p.m. EDT
Webinar presenters include:
About the Institute of Museum and Library Services
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My Little Secret – Xscape Let's Go Back In The Day
One of my favorite girl groups is Xscape, LaTocha and Tamika Scott, Kandi Burruss and Tameka Cottle from Atlanta Georgia. Their first two releases in 1993 "Just Kickin' It" and "Understanding" both went to number 1 on the R&B charts. Tw


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People all over the nation diet for various reasons which include weight loss, strength and conditioning, or control of some chronic disease. Many people don't realize that they should be dieting for the benefit of their oral health as well, as what you put in your mouth not only affects your overall health, but has a direct effect on help your teeth. Usually by making a few tweaks to an otherwise healthy diet, we can greatly increase the strength of our teeth and gum tissue, and also arresting any progression in tooth decay and gum disease.
We first have to recognize what nutrients we are already consuming, and what nutrients are needed to strengthen our teeth. Being of the same organic composition as your bones, it goes without saying that calcium is most likely the number one nutrient that one needs to ensure they are getting enough off on a daily basis. With regards to your teeth calcium serves a twofold purpose as your teeth are anchored to your jawbone.
If the patient is calcium deficient, then the body tends to leach the calcium it needs from your teeth as they serve as a type of reservoir. However, this will not be enough for the body to maintain a healthy solidity to your bones, and the very jaw that anchors those teeth will begin to lose traction due to weakness. This will result in loose teeth, increase bleeding along the gum line, pain, and the likelihood that you may lose some adult teeth.
We suggest taking a daily multivitamin with a significant amount of calcium within its formulation, in addition to ensuring that on a daily basis you're taking in calcium rich foods. While vitamins are great, there is nothing that is better for the body then absorbing the nutrients and minerals from natural foods. Cheese, milk, and some vegetables will provide a great basis for patients to increase their calcium intake and fortify their bones and teeth as well.
After we have taken the time to provide the proper maintenance for bones, is now time to look to the gums, and address any vitamin or mineral deficiencies which may affect or hinder the repair and healing of our gum line. And as with all tissue patients need to ensure that they are getting a proper daily dose of vitamin C. Vitamin C is like the body's own ambulance service, dispatched to the site of damaged tissue to assist in the repair of tears and in the case of teeth fusing any gaps that may occur between the teeth and gums.
Dentist often lead patients confused, as citrus juices and fruits are often discouraged as over eating may cause damage to the teeth from the acidic nature of the fruit. However what most dentist are trying to communicate, set the ingesting of sugary fruit juices without proper removal after drinking can lead to damage. What we suggest is eating fresh fruits such as oranges, grapefruit, and Kiwis which are high in vitamin C, and whose sugars can be simply washed away by drinking water.
These are just a few things that you can do to improve your overall diet with regards to your oral health. Of course you should stay away from sugary drinks, and try to avoid foods and liquids that will sustain and or trap bad foodstuffs to the surface of your teeth enamel. You should also be sure to get your eight glasses of water per day, as they not only keep you hydrated but keep your mouth clean of any lingering bad sugars and bacteria.


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121 Diamond Spring RoadDenville, NJ 07834
Make your own creation with our Lego bricks, take a picture, and leave your pieces here as we'll need them for our next meeting!
It's Lego time again! Let's see what you can build- something spooky, perhaps? Take a picture and leave your creation here since we'll need the pieces for next month's meeting! Limit 20.
Create a still life using oil pastels. Pastels do stain, so please bring a smock or wear old clothes. Limit 12. Instructor: Mrs. Matveev
This month's class will focus on Skippyjon Jones, the cat who thinks he's a chihuahua! After reading one of these fun books, crafts will follow.
Stop by the Children's Room during the above times and pick up one different take home craft each day, while supplies last.
Find us on Facebook!
© 2011 Denville Public Library. All rights reserved.
121 Diamond Spring RoadDenville, NJ 07834973.627.6555


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I have a new invention that it will help a coffee machine to be more hygienic and more practical. I am confused and I don't know whether this is a design patent or utility patent.
Take the 2-minute tour ×
Ask Patents is a question and answer site for people interested in improving and participating in the patent system. It's 100% free, no registration required.
A design patent covers the visual impression of a product while a utility patent covers the structure and functioning of a product. If you have something new and not obvious that provides a functional benefit, that would be a utility patent application.


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Youth Hunter Education Challenge
Recognized as the most comprehensive youth hunting program anywhere in North America, the Youth Hunter Education Challenge (YHEC) is a "graduate studies" program in outdoor skills and safety training for young hunters. Open only to those who have completed hunter-safety training at the state level, the program is conducted under simulated hunting conditions to provide the best practical environment for reinforcing and testing a young hunter's skills.
From shotgun and archery shooting sports to shoot/don't shoot scenarios and orienteering, YHEC participants get hands-on training in different skills areas, giving them expertise in all methods of take and all types of game.
State-level YHEC programs, hosted by volunteer instructors, draw an estimated 50,000 youths each year. Top ranked individuals advance to the annual NRA International Youth Hunter Education Challenge, the pinnacle of the program. Since its inception in 1985, YHEC has reached more than a million young sportsmen and women.
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Ranger Hotline
Report poaching and wildlife violations. You can receive a cash reward if your tip leads to an arrest—even if you wish to remain anonymous.


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You are here: Home → Forum Home → Wynton Marsalis Discussion → Wynton Marsalis Discussion → Thread
Does anyone know if there is any possible way to meet Wynton at his concerts? or anything, cause i'm going to Atlanta for his show and i really want to meet him.
Dear Nick,
meeting Wynton at his concert is very easy !
He is kind and is very happy to meet his funs for a photo or signing autographs.
Try to go backstage.
Luigi Beverelli
Founder - *Wynton Marsalis fun club*
Thank you so much! =)
Another Question,
Does Wynton like to hear young people play their instruments? or stuff like that, cause i'm 13 years old and i play trumpet and i was just wondering if i would be able to bring my trumpet and play for him or something. Thanks =)
Jazz at Lincoln CENTER
33 W. 60th Street 11th floor
New York, NY 10023
Yes Nic,
bring your trumpet with you, and Wynton will be happy to hear you playing !
Luigi Beverelli
Founder - *Wynton Marsalis fun club*
Wow! thanks for the answers! =)
One more thing,
How do i get back stage?
Usually there's no problem to get backstage at Wynton concerts.
They are very kind, and all funs can have autograph or photo with him.
Ask to get backstage at the end of the concert !
Take care :)
Luigi Beverelli
Founder - *Wynton Marsalis fun club*
Wynton loves to hear young people express themselves through music. Upon meeting him, ask him if he would like to hear you play a song or a tune for him. The future of jazz music is Mr. Marsalis top priority. Go for it, and good luck.
I was wonderin' well who am i supposed to ask to get back stage. Thanks again guys! Bye!
I was actually at a concer with a friend of mine for LCJO and after the concert my friend went back stage and met the whole band and Wynton, so i don't know if it's possible for you to get backstage through security if there is any, but that's how he did it.
Alright now the concert is soon and i need to know who to ask to get backstage thanks a lot Bye!=)
Hey Iwas just lookin through the fan club and I have met with Wynton on several occasiions. You seem to have had the same great luck and opportunity. I would love to share stories with you and hear how you came up with this site.
Sure i'd love to tell you. I'd like to her some of your stories too. =)


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| Still can't find it? see Site Index
See the Microsoft founders through the years. (Click expand arrow at bottom right of image to see full image)
So much fun catching up w/ computing pioneers at the #LCMCelebration last night! Here I am with old friend @billgates twitter.com/PaulGAllen/sta…— Paul Allen (@PaulGAllen) April 4, 2013


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= 0.987 atmosphere = 1.02 kg/cm^2 = 100 kilopascal = 14.5 lbs/square inch.
The variety and variability among living organisms and the ecological complexes in which they occur.
a very bright meteor (or fireball) that produces a sonic boom.
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Thursday, March 3, 2011
The intellectual meltdown of libertarianism in Sweden
The most prominent libertarians of intellectuals of the 20th century - Milton Friedman, Friedrich Hayek and Robert Nozick - all opposed open borders for welfare states. But today's libertarians are not as thoughtful. They are motivated by simplistic arguments, such as borders being created by politicians and therefore automatically bad, or that since free trade with China is good, free trade with people must also be good to. But unlike Chinese plastic toys, immigrants collect welfare, impose negative social externalities such as crime on others, and vote themselves even more benefits.
Historically socialists fought to abolish private rights and property, while modern socialists and libertarians fight to abolish our collective rights and properties. The most prominent of these are rights we have granted each other in democracies to vote over common decisions, backed by the threat of coercion.
One Swedish libertarian thus wrote about expanding the welfare state to illegal immigrants: "This is what solidarity is about". (Ayn Rand would surely have been proud to read this).
A blogger at the most important libertarian journal, Neo, fervently defends this latest expansion of the welfare state, with the argument that Sweden is already spending a lot on other stuff. By this logic, the bigger the government already is, the more we should expand it.
Modern libertarianism is a self-destructive ideology. This is because the unskilled immigrant population that open borders invites is an exceptionally infertile ground for libertarian values. Consequently open borders in a democracy will automatically lead to a welfare state as the immigrants sooner or later become the majority of voters.
To no ones surprise, rather than becoming libertarian, immigrants loyally support the Social Democratic welfare state, as their economic self interests and the political culture of their societies would predicts. In the latest Swedish election, only 43% of Swedes but 77% of non-western immigrants voted for the left (this was an unusually bad year for the left, who got 92% of the immigrant vote in 2002!). In the United States, where while only 35% of non-Hispanic whites prefer higher taxes in return for more government services, the figure is 65% for first generation Hispanic immigrants, and 66% for second generation Hispanics.
Benefits to illegal immigrants are unpopular among ordinary swedes, but popular amongst the elites. The elites in Sweden no longer believe or act as if they have been delegated their power and position in life by the public. Instead, they look down at ordinary Swedes as unwashed rubes, identifying instead with elites in other countries. This is the basics of what I call the "The Economist" Class [sic]. This is incidentally the reason why the European Union is ever expanding, elites in Europe identify more with other elites in Europe rather than with non-elites in their respective country.
The ideology of the elites tells them that since all humans are equal, they owe no more to the Swedes than to any random inhabitant of the earth. This despite the fact that it is the Swedes they represent, they are the one who voted for them (if they are politicians), who pay their membership dues (unions), who work for them (industry), who read their texts and trust them to provide the truth (media) or who pay our grants and financed our educations (academia).
Pundits who have only absorbed Adam Smith, Milton Friedman and Hayek on a superficial level (many seem to just have read the abstract) today view the virtue of noblesse oblige as obsolete.
A minority of libertarians in Sweden realize that these laws have negative consequences for our country, but feel compelled to support open borders because of ideology, which tells them that the government has no right to control borders. Those to the left who don't like this law are also stuck in their ideology, since that tells them that because all humans are equal, it must be racist to give free health care to Swedes but not to an Albanian who broke our laws and crossed our border.
Hayek and other idea-historians consider Anglo-Saxon conservatism a sub-category of classical liberalism (what Swedes simply call liberalism). However, unlike libertarianism, intellectual conservative theory does not have any problem reconciling policies that benefit society with policies derived from ideological axioms.
The nation state is a mutual defense and cooperation pact, something we have created through the implicit social compact to improve collective decision making. We therefore have more obligations and responsibilities towards other citizens (needless to say regardless of their race), than we do towards other random people on the planet. This is particularly true for anyone who has been entrust elite status in politics or academia or intellectual life, and particularly true for people like me who have been given the gift of citizenship by Swedes. The responsibility for the welfare of Albanian children meanwhile belongs to Albania.
Any ideology that leads you to a conflict what you believe is good for society and what your ideology compels you to believe is flawed by design. This is why Anglo-Saxon conservatism at its finest is the lack of an ideology.
133 comments:
Maybe Friedman, Hayek och Nozick were wrong?ReplyDelete
Bryan Caplan talk on immigration
EconTalk interview with Caplan
Caplan on Friedman and free immigration, Milton Friedman Opposed a Pareto ImprovementReplyDelete
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
I have no respect for Bryan Caplan ever since he banned me from his blog after I - in my albeit biased opinion - defeated him and his followers regarding illegal immigration.ReplyDelete
Bryan Caplan has never offered any response to the "what will happen when left-leaning immigrants are the majority" population argument.
His only argument is that Hispanic immigrants cannot possibly be more left than ordinary Americans (whom he considered socialist).
A few years ago I posted the poll about Hispanic views on government on his blog, which appears to have been part of the reason he banned me.
I find his claim that ANYONE is surely more libertarian than American voters detached from reality. Americans are not libertarian like Caplan, but they are the most libertarian leaning people on the planet.
That's a shame. I like his blog but I don't like the way he fails to engage his comments section.ReplyDelete
I'm a libertarian and against a welfare as a general matter. I share your concern that immigrants would stand in the way of pro-freedom policies. Still, I think the welfare, wealth, and freedom generating (on aggregate relative to where they left) effects of significantly increasing immigration make it worth it even if it makes America less free in the long run. Even though I think a sufficiently large increase in immigration would probably make things slightly worse for me or my decedents I think this would be worth it.Replies
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I would also motivate just about every person to save this web page for any favorite assistance to assist posted the appearance.
Still, I think the welfare, wealth, and freedom generating (on aggregate relative to where they left) effects of significantly increasing immigration make it worth it even if it makes America less free in the long run.ReplyDelete
So let me get this straight. You're fine with the trade-off between the welfare of immigrants being enhanced at the expense of those in the host society who don't want the immigrants arriving due to the negative externalities that they cause. If the principle of enhancing the welfare of immigrants is so important to you can you share with us how much of your income you're freely giving to people around the world? I mean, if you wish to live by a principle then shouldn't you bear the cost of implementing that principle rather than applauding the application of the principle when it comes at the expense of those who must unwillingly bear the cost. What kind of libertarian principle is that? Surely hypocrisy isn't a core principle of the libertarianism I know.
Even though I think a sufficiently large increase in immigration would probably make things slightly worse for me or my decedents I think this would be worth it.
This comes across as empty posturing. You get to bolster your ego today while hypothetically acknowledging some far distant outcome. Why don't you purposely align the costs of this policy with the outcomes by making a concerted effort to burden yourself today. That way you can proudly tell us all that you're beggering yourself for the benefit of others and you think that the enhanced welfare of the immigrants is, on net, more important than the diminished welfare that you're experiencing.
My experience is that I probably can't convince anyone who responds to my comment with "So let me get this straight..." I'm hoping you came off snarkier than you meant to and you actually care about my response, so here you go.ReplyDelete
I believe that countries are simply collections of people. I think that human rights should not depend on which of these collections you belong to. My neighbors are not entitled to more freedom than other humans around the world. A modest reduction in liberty in America so that tens or hundreds of millions can be much freer is a trade I consider worth doing. In time I believe liberty will win out and those reductions in liberty here will be undone.
The negative externalities are mostly in the form of crime, crowding, and welfare. I already said that I was against the welfare state. I would be happy to make immigrants foregoing the welfare state part of a bargain to increase immigration. To punish most potential immigrants because a few will commit crimes strikes me as a form of foolish collective punishment which I oppose. Crowding in the form of busier roads, higher housing prices, etcetera seems to me to be either a moral non-issue (because you are not entitled to the status quo just because it suits you) or a failure of property rights (like a lack of congestion pricing on roads) neither of which are good reasons to oppose a significant increase in immigration.
I hope that addressed some of your questions about my position. Let me know if you want me to clarify or elaborate anything.
I believe that countries are simply collections of people.ReplyDelete
Simply a collection of people? No more? Culture doesn't play a part in defining the differences between various nations? If we performed a Gedankenexperiment and teleported the population of Saudi Arabia into the US and the US population into Saudi Arabia but kept all of the laws and institutions in each country intact, then what would happen? Would Americans having to live under Saudi law assimilate to Saudi norms and would a US now comprised entirely of Saudis living under American law assimilate to American norms?
I don't find your assertion that countries are simply collections of people a very persuasive point.
I think that human rights should not depend on which of these collections you belong to.
Where are you sourcing this notion of this thing called human rights? Did this notion spring forth from a cultural milieu? If it did then doesn't that invalidate your claim that nations are simply agglomerations of people? If this notion of human rights didn't originate from a cultural tradition, or from a philosophy which is born from a cultural tradition, then why isn't your notion of human rights recognized universally as being self-evident?
My neighbors are not entitled to more freedom than other humans around the world.
Freedom isn't granted, it's earned. Cultures develop common precepts and commonly held behaviors. Freedom is enforced within some cultures and not others. People are entitled to what they are willing to fight for.
A modest reduction in liberty in America so that tens or hundreds of millions can be much freer is a trade I consider worth doing.ReplyDelete
My point is that you're patting yourself on the back for your magnanimous attitude as you trade away the liberty of your fellow countrymen so that others may experience an increase in welfare. This attitude has much similarity with what we see in liberals who believe that they demonstrate their compassion and empathy by advocating that government spend other people's money on the social problems that liberals find pressing. I asked you what liberty and welfare you are personally sacrificing in order to be true to your philosophy. I didn't spy any details on this issue within your response. From where I stand you bear a striking similarity to those liberals who delude themselves by believing that their calls for other people to pay for addressing the social ills that they identify mark them as caring and compassionate people. The most effective way for liberals to earn their compassion stripes is to bear individual sacrifice in furtherance of the cause they support and similarly the best way for libertarians of your stripe to demonstrate their love of universal liberty is to sacrifice their own liberty and welfare so that people half way around the world can have their liberty and welfare enhanced. Calling for others to bear the sacrifice while you pat yourself on the back for your liberty and welfare enhancing beliefs rings very hollow.
In time I believe liberty will win out and those reductions in liberty here will be undone.
That's all well and good. There are lots of people who believe in dreamy notions with little empirical support behind them but your engaging in rhetoric designed to show us how liberty loving you are without putting your own skin in the game doesn't really add any substance to your statement.
Here's a suggestion - instead of imposing externalities on your unwilling neighbors by advancing this notion that they should bear the cost for enhancing the liberty of people not of their culture, why don't you take your mission to a foreign land and use your talents to enhance the liberty there. After all, nations are no more than collections of people, so from your perspective you wouldn't be diminishing your own welfare in the slightest by removing yourself from America and reestablishing yourself in Somalia. Somalis are no different than Americans. The borders that define the nations, and their peoples, are merely arbitrary and have no real world meaning.
I was banned from EconLog, but not by any of the bloggers. Barkley Rosser said he was boycotting the comments due to its moderation. Were you given a reason why you were banned?ReplyDelete
You're point in general seems to be that immigrants have a large cost (vote for the left, worse work ethic, more prone to criminality) - hence Sweden should minimize immigration. Moreover, only the elite seems to want to have more immigration while regular folks do not, another reason for having less immigration.ReplyDelete
To which I'm thinking:
1) Where's the benefit side of immigration in this picture? Why doesn't it overtake the costs?
2) You've said before that working class Swedes lose from immigration, probably through lowered wages, but I've seen no evidence of that.
3) Who cares what most people think is the correct policy? If I sympathize with the morality of the elite in this case, i.e. it is good to help out the worst of (and I do mean the _worst_ off), then this policy has large benefits. Similarly, voters rarely like free trade and free markets, but most libertarians would praise new free trade deals. What's the problem?
4) I think I know what you think the problem is: political economy. This will increase the role of the populist right, which is bad even if they would reduce immigration because they like the welfare state. Question: what's the marginal effect if this policy on SD's vote share? I'm guessing it's small and this immigration policy has more moral pros going for it than most others.
5) You're other political economy prediction is instead that more people will vote for the left. But the ethnic-diversity-and-redistribution-literature (with a very recent paper taking the case of Sweden) indicates that, if anything, more immigrations will make the welfare state _smaller_.
Mounir Karadja: could you please give a reference to the paper about Sweden that indicates that more immigration makes the welfare state smaller, thanks.ReplyDelete
1) Where's the benefit side of immigration in this picture? Why doesn't it overtake the costs?ReplyDelete
The benefits are significantly dependent on the human capital measure of the immigrants. If the immigrant class is disproportionately from the net tax recipient class then the costs are going to outweigh the benefits. To your question, I suspect that the benefits are not overtaking the costs because Sweden's immigrant community has more net tax recipients than net tax contributors.
If I sympathize with the morality of the elite in this case, i.e. it is good to help out the worst of (and I do mean the _worst_ off), then this policy has large benefits.
I'm not so sure that it is the moral issue which is driving the elite in this direction for I suspect that there is more self-interest involved. Their lives are made easier when there is an increased supply of people who can perform manual labor in activities which make the elite's lives richer. The reap the privatized gains and they socialize the losses.
Even if this issue was being decided on a moral basis, those who support it are being awfully presumptuous in advocating for a solution which aids strangers and passes the costs of that aid onto the rest of society. The moral case would be stronger if advocates were willing to specify how they were going to harm their own interests in order to aid the welfare of distant people. For instance, advocates could willingly impose an additional 15% income tax or 15% property tax on themselves with the proceeds being directed to offset the negative externalities which arise from the implementation of the policy that they favor.
As for the comparison to free trade it falters on two fronts. First, trade goods don't come with social welfare costs attached, people do. Second, with free trade there are winners and losers in society so the issue is one of how the gains are distributed within society. The welfare enhancement which arises from this immigration issues falls primarily on the immigrant and the costs fall onto society, that is the costs are borne internally and the benefits fall externally when the unit of analysis is society at large.
The "countries are just collections of people" claim I find bizarre. First, countries can surely be analysed fairly straightforwardly as clubs. Second, how institutions work make a huge difference for quality of life. Third, the degree of overlap in broad preferences, historical and cultural references and understandings, etc clearly affects how societies function. Fourth, people clearly have group identities which affect outlooks and behaviour.ReplyDelete
The whole perspective shows a lack of understanding of history, social dynamics, institutional and club good economics etc which is difficult to see anything other than either deep ignorance or the triumph of attitude over analysis (or both).
Culural diversity has benefits, but it also has costs. One needs to be able to grasp both to have any chance of talking sense on such issues.
Just as the need to avoid generating poisonous resentments has to be part of any sensible political outlook. Taxing folk to pay for people who they perceive (often correctly) as imposing costs on them and then telling them they have no right to have a say about any of this is spectactularly unclever. Telling them that "countries are just groups of individuals" is not only not going to help, it is just going to annoy folk because it is patently not true.
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
I meant that countries are morally identical to groups of people or clubs. Some clubs are well run and produce more benefits from their members than the resources they consume and others do not. Some churches are well run and others run into the ground. My libertarianism is a form of Cosmopolitanism, in the sense that "all human ethnic groups belong to a single community based on a shared morality".ReplyDelete
I recognize that countries act as though they are not beholden to the rules of other groups of people, I just don't condone them doing so.
I also recognize that many people in countries are similar, along a number of dimensions. I just don't see how that is of moral significance. I don't accept that I have a special moral duty to people of my race, gender, height, weight, or eye color, and so I don't see why I should have a special moral duty to my countrymen. I recognize that many other people don't agree but people believe all sorts of terrible things for terrible reasons, so their rejection of cosmopolitanism doesn't bother me.
You might not agree with my beliefs, but some beliefs about the future path of political preferences are essential to any sort of analysis like this. You think that a substantial increase in immigration will permanently reduce the level of freedom in a country. I'm curious why you are certain that this is not so.
The papers that calculate the cost of immigration calculate the *net* cost, which subtracts total costs from total benefits.
Brojas has shown even in the United States that net benefits are small, and empirically demonstrated that unskilled immigrants lower the wage of unskilled natives, althoug the estimated effect is not huge.
I refer you to his work, which is considered the most authorative on the economics immigration. The Handbook of Labor Economics has a nice chapter about this.
"what most people think is the correct policy"
Well, what they *believe* is one thing, the majority can as you say be wrong. However I care about what *I believe benefits* Swedes, if for no other reason because they gave me asylum, gave us 10 years of welfare, and fully paid for my education in one of the most elite schools in Scandinavia.
You don't think this unpolar decison benefits SD? Let me try to quantify it. The largest anti-immigration blog is http://politisktinkorrekt.info/. Usually they have 30-100 comments for each news. So far they have had 570 comments about welfare to illegal's...
The ethnic-diversity-and-redistribution-literature is flawed. I will write about this soon.
So we have positive net benefits, but a native group loses a few per cent in income in the long run (if they don't adapt to the competition). Sounds a lot like the effects of free trade.ReplyDelete
I haven't been able to confirm if this is true or not, but it seems that these cost-benefit analyses do not include the welfare gains of immigrants. I understand that you don't value the welfare of foreigners as much as I or most libertarians would, but by my standards omitting this is wrong and bad economics. If you don't think immigrant welfare increases should count then let the debate be about that and not about economics.
"I care about what *I believe benefits* Swedes, if for no other reason because they gave me asylum, gave us 10 years of welfare"
Are you saying that it is because of this life debt to Swedes you that have a moral conviction that the state of Sweden should only help Swedes?
I actually did say that SD would benefit from this. And I'm not sure what is surprising about the fact that a major change in immigration policy attracts above average numbers of comments at an anti-immigration blog. I said that on moral grounds I think the change is worth it and on political-economic grounds the effects are ambiguous. But the burden of evidence shouldn't lay on me, I'm not the one claiming a catastrophe is occuring.
We certainly do not have positive net benefits of immigration to Sweden.
Nor do we have positive net benefits for unskilled immigration to the United States, according to the comprehensive study by NRC.
"but it seems that these cost-benefit analyses do not include the welfare gains of immigrants. "
I just explained to you that they do. If you want me to take the time to respond to you, please take the time to read my responce.
It is clear from my blog post (did you read it?) that in my view all individuals in a elevated public position have a responsibility to help their fellow citizens, who put them there, over forigners, who didn't.
This is particularly true for immigrants.
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
One more thing Mounir:ReplyDelete
Economics is NOT a normative science. The job of economists is not to advocate policies that maximize Global GDP or whatever you seem to belive.
The job and duty of economists is to give the public the most objective, disintrested analyses possible of the impact of different policies. This way, informed voters get to decide what policy their prefer.
In this example, the majority of Swedish voters should get to decide if they want to lower their standard of living in order to raise the standard of living of illegal immigrants.
Economists have not done so in the case of immigration, where they are generally pushing a normative, pro-immigration agenda. This is why people like you are un-aware that the best studies have already shown that unskilled immigration hurts America and Sweden.
I will not pretend to be as well-read as you in this subject, but I did read your post and reply. What I said about positive net benefits (in the US) is taken from your first reply.ReplyDelete
Agreed, economics is not a normative science. But it guides the morally based decision of whether something is right or wrong, since it hopefully tells you what the consequences will be. That's where the main difference seems to be here. Thanks for taking time to answer
Tino, do you hava a comment to Caplans(?) claim that immigration reduces the demand of the well-fare state from the native population? Why do you claim that the net demand is increasing with immigration?ReplyDelete
Note that I refer to unskilled immigration:
1. Empirically, American states with a larger minority population share have more welfare expenditure as a share of gross state income.
2. Empirically, the share of the non-Hispanic white vote that goes to the Republican Party is not correlated at all with the share of minorities in the state (so overall whites don't appear to group together against non-whites).
2. Immigration induced demographic change leads to more pro-welfare state voters, as I show above. Notice that even if immigration makes 100%of native hard-core libertarians, the effect is only temporary, as immigrants under free migration will sooner or later become the majority, making the political views of the native largely irrelevant. This process is happening in the United States.
In 1940 pro-market leaning whites were 90% and left-leanings Hispanics were 1%. In 2050 the Census expects non-Hispanic whites to be 43%, and Hispanics 30% of the population. I will guarantee you that the United States in 2050 will be a place more friendlily to leftist ideas, which is exactly why Democrats are fighting so hard for immigration policies that in the short term hurt their voters.
3. Taking in low income people leads to a larger welfare state through a mechanic effect. Even if you don't make unemployment insurance more generous, having groups with a higher unemployed rate automatically expands the size of government.
In Scandinavia, 50% of non-western immigrants live on welfare. In the United States, over 30% of Mexican households get some form of welfare benefit. As this population increases, the welfare state expands, even if you have exactly the same laws.
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
4. Having more poor people also increases the *need* for a welfare state. We have a welfare state largely because the middle class and the rich feel sorry for the poor. As immigration leads to more social problems and poverty, this will become stronger. In both Sweden and the United States, the majority of poor children are minorities.ReplyDelete
To give you a recent example, the majority of the uninsured in the United States are minorities (40% of all uninsured are Hispanic). The media does not understand and will not tell you this, but the long-run uninsurance rate of non-Hispanics whites' adults above 25 in the United States is only 3% (which is incidentally the likely explanation why the white Tea Party protestors don't like Obama-Care, they and their families already have insurance).
The uninsurance "crisis" would simply never had arisen if the United States only consisted of Montana, because in Montana almost everyone has insurance, there are fewer newspaper stories about victims you want to help etc.
The American left is not stupid or irrational, they rarely demand government intervention where there are few problems.
By the way, since I am on the topic, let me point out that in our planet (but perhaps not in the alternative reality that Bryan Caplan has constructed in his head), because of the solid pro-welfare state voting pattern of immigrants, the you can only have 2 out of 3 of these:
1. Libertarian-leaning policies
2. Open Borders
3. Democracy
The reason is obviously that with free borders immigrants will become the majority and create a welfare state.
I have no problem pickíng 1 & 3. Caplan and his likes are effectively sacrificing 1 for 2, even though they don't acknowledge it.
Anyone who tells you they want no welfare state and open borders either doesn't understand time inconsistence or is against Democracy.
Many of the arguments above are stating Nozick, Hayek, and Friedman were basically wrong. Hmmm.ReplyDelete
"Everybody loves to argue with Milton, particularly when he isn't there". - George Shultz
Plus one might as well skip any argument regarding anything to do with "state" until they bother to read Robert Nozick's book Anarchy, State, and Utopia. One had better understand why "state" exists in the very first place before you argue any aspect of state.
1.) Austrian multiculturalists argue that to agree with the analysis of restrictionists or to partially adopt their policy proposals only serves to strengthen the populist right. The way to beat the right-wing populists is to boldly do the exact opposite, that is to say to open the doors and expand welfare for immigrants.ReplyDelete
The Swedish Establishment seems to have bought into this remedy of "shutting the door right in the SDs face" so that "Sweden won't turn into another Denmark".
They don't play the part about being bold and unmoved very well though. Rather, they appear unnecessarily frightened about a party with only 5,7% of the vote and which, based on my shallow analysis, appears to be the most boring and timid right-wing nationalist party known to man.
2.) One of Bryan Caplan's arguments is that immigration decreases social trust. And lack of social trust also undermines social democracy and the acceptance for an expansive welfare state. But low trust societies are incredibly statist in countless other ways.
Many libertarians appear to be concerned about tax rates over anything else. I don't necessarily see a contradiction between that and an open border position.
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