text:
Peppers at 10, which seems low.
kenny allen
Spring Stuff 2016: Defense, Special Teams
Previously: offense.
Defensive line
SDE Charlton has been tough to handle [Eric Upchurch]
The most interesting thing about the configuration of the defense thus far is the weakside end. I thought they'd shift Taco Charlton over there and go with a very large and very fierce unit; instead Charlton looks set to start on the strongside and Chase Winovich is a tentative leader on the weakside. Chris Wormley spent most snaps I saw from him at three-tech.
While there's a chance that Michigan reconfigures once Ryan Glasgow gets re-added to the mix, right now it looks like Michigan will have a line that looks a lot like a traditional 4-3 under line instead of the mondo unit they could have had. One man's current guess at what a depth chart looks like in fall:
- SDE: Charlton, Gary
- NT: Glasgow, Mone, Hurst
- 3T: Wormley, Godin
- WDE: Winovich, Marshall
If they can get production out of Winovich that's an incredibly deep, veteran, and proven defensive line. If Winovich doesn't work out you can slide Charlton over and still have a great two-deep at the bigger spots, but this is Don Brown's first draft.
So… Winovich. After a rather wasted year spent at h-back he returned to defense, now bulked up to 245 pounds. That's light, but if he can get up to 250 or 255 by fall—reasonable—it's not eye-poppingly so. And WDE does fit his talents. As a recruit he was reputed to be Jake Ryan 2.0, and weakside end is a spot Ryan definitely could have played. Winovich has started gathering some hype himself:
Chase Winovich had himself a day at defensive end. We'd said all week that he was a bigger, stronger version of his former self. Grant Newsome definitely learned that Friday. Winovich won their one on one match-up, and was one of the best edge rushers on the day. On one play he literally flattened Newsome with a bull rush to get into the backfield.
Whether that's hooray Winovich or a collar pull about Newsome is in the eye of the beholder. On the downside from that report: on "more than one occasion" Winovich got edged and lost contain. (Yes, just like Jake Ryan.) He's going to have to cause a lot of havoc to make up for what projects to be a serious downgrade in run efficacy from the much larger and more experienced Charlton.
Meanwhile, apparently all that irrational Bryan Mone hype last year was shared by the coaching staff:
"He was one of our top players last year," Mone said. "We ranked the team going into training camp from one to 125 and Mone was three."
I have many questions about that assertion. They will never be answered.
Mone seems to have picked up where he left off before his injury, but to be honest I didn't see much from him in either practice I observed. I wasn't looking for him much since nose tackle is just about dead last on my list of concerns for 2016; even so last year you saw Maurice Hurst blow through an assortment of players, including Graham Glasgow, en route to spring hype and a very productive season. Mone didn't deliver that when in front of fans. He did draw a tough matchup against Mason Cole, to be fair. I'm still waiting for him to indicate that he's going to be better than Glasgow was a year ago.
That said, Mone was very impressive in Florida:
He was rarely blocked one-on-one, and managed to still be effective against the double team. Twice in the early portion of 11-on-11 action he engaged Ben Braden, tossed the 322 lb. offensive lineman to the side with relative ease, and then got in on the play in the backfield. On another play he split Braden and Mason Cole with great off-snap quickness and nailed Ty Isaac in the backfield.
I'd have liked to see that myself; it's good that someone did.
Godin's playing time might get squeezed [Upchurch]
Chris Wormley is still Chris Wormley. He'll probably be incrementally stronger and better and this will be a very good thing indeed. Matt Godin had an impressive spring game, blowing through a number of second-string OL. I thought he'd be a better fit at SDE, where he was on relatively level footing with Wormley early last season, than three-tech but Michigan looks set to play him on the interior. That might make it tough for him to get a lot of time—he is not likely to pass any of the other four DTs. The current Taco/Winovich DE setup steps on his toes more than anyone else.
Carlo Kemp and Reuben Jones played a lot as DEs on the white team and mostly got beat up. That's not a huge surprise since Kemp is a freshman and Jones is still listed at 222 pounds on the (possibly outdated) roster. I wouldn't expect either to break through this year.
McCray is a thumper [Upchurch]
Mike McCray is obviously the story of the spring here, and it was appropriate that he was one of the main reasons his team stuffed Henry Poggi on the goal line to end the Spring Game. McCray brings a load. At Ford Field he hammered a number of lead blocks like James Ross playing a Penn State OL. He is a tough customer.
What remains to be seen is whether he's a two-down backer or if he's fast enough to be an asset in coverage. Noises coming out of practice are positive. Per Lorenz Michigan is "quietly excited and optimistic"; Webb observed him have a lights out practice down in Florida:
Early in 11-on-11 action he met Ty Isaac in the hole and brought him down for no gain. A few plays later he showed nice feel in coverage and would have de-cleated Jack Wangler on a crossing pattern. His best play came later on in the practice when he timed a blitz perfectly and tagged Kareem Walker in the backfield.
While McCray ended up chasing a lot of completed mesh routes in the spring game I wouldn't read too much into that: mesh is designed to hang up man-to-man defenders trying to cover those drag routes. It did so with McCray. I'm assuming Michigan has better answers for mesh that they declined to show the public.
McCray did get juked by O'Korn on the final touchdown, but he was in a ton of space and did force the play back to his help. That help did not arrive in time. Ideally you get an open-field tackle like those Delano Hill turned in a couple times last year, but failing that McCray at least mitigated damage insofar as that was possible.
Ben Gedeon remains just as much of a default starter as he was before the spring. Harbaugh is saying all the right things about him, calling him a "stud" amongst other praise. When you've got a guy who hasn't quite established himself but will start because there are no other options save freshmen your floor can be very low—Johnny Sears is the canonical example. There was never going to be a way for Gedeon to disprove that this spring.
At least we have seen enough of Gedeon to estimate that he'll be all right—he was more or less a starter for a game in the middle of the season when Michigan was suffering through their ridiculous targeting call period, and he did fine. As long as he doesn't run upfield of blocks I'm good.
McCray's emergence allows the Devin Bush Jr project to have a more reasonable timeframe. Going into spring everyone was assuming he'd end up starting out of necessity; exiting it he's probably in the same position Gedeon was last year: a rotation player who spots both starters. That's still not ideal, but neither is it starting a freshman. Bush didn't generate a ton of buzz other than the occasional mention of a big hit and he didn't leap out at me. He was of course victimized by Ty Wheatley on that one play, but when you force a one-handed attempt to catch a pass you've done your job.
Noah Furbush did not play in the spring game, which is unfortunate since he came in for a reasonable amount of hype himself as Jabrill Peppers's main competition at SAM. Sam related that Harbaugh "loves" Furbush's attitude and general guy-ness, and he did have a number of impressive special teams plays a year ago. Obviously Furbush and Peppers are not particularly similar players—Furbush coming into his own would allow Michigan to move Peppers around.
Jared Wangler was out with a meniscus injury.
Thomas is fast [Bryan Fuller]
Another reason I wouldn't read too much into the crossing routes that were wide open all day: somehow the top six defensive backs* all ended up on the white team, and after the opening series we saw little of Lewis and Stribling. Victims on the crossing routes were often walk-ons.
Most downfield passes were attempted against guys who don't project to see the field much this year. Ken Stross was this year's version of Norfleet: a converted WR who gets bombed all day.
There were a couple of plays of note for projected contributors, this one the most impressive:
Dymonte Thomas came from the dead center of the field to get over the top of a reasonably well-thrown ball near the back corner of the endzone. He took off as soon as Morris committed to one side of the field, which is encouraging.
Jarrod Wilson, blessed be his boring name, is not making that play. I can't imagine many people do. If Thomas can reliably execute his assignments he has the potential to be something Michigan hasn't seen since Marcus Ray**: a bonafide playmaking safety.
The other play of note was discussed yesterday when we talked about Drake Harris and can be seen briefly at the 52 second mark of the above highlights: Jeremy Clark with fantastic coverage on Harris. I don't doubt that Channing Stribling's had an impressive spring, especially since he got the sure-starter yoink on Friday and this vote of confidence from Harbaugh…
"Channing Stribling. He's a starter. It's cold. It's in stone.:"
…but at Ford Field and the Spring Game it's been Jeremy Clark who looks like the guy.
Per Webb, down in Florida it was the other way, with Stribling on fire:
Channing Stribling was given the game ball by Jim Harbaugh after practice #4 and with good reason. … His route recognition led to numerous plays including two interceptions. His first pick came while covering Drake Harris and seemed to run the pattern better than his offensive counterpart before jumping it and intercepting the ball. He nearly picked off another pass… a deep out to Harris… where he also seem to run that route better than Harris also before knocking it away. His second interception occurred when the Sean McKeon beat Noah Furbush down the seam and Stribling slid over the top to help, skied for the ball, and picked it off.
I expect that competition to be hot and heavy this fall. TBH I'd be perfectly happy with another year just like the one Clark turned in, minus some of the absurdly bad luck he suffered. For Stribling to surge past is a potentially excellent sign.
Kinnel is hugely important for 2017 [Upchurch]
Tyree Kinnel was the other name of note. He turned in a pick-six at Ford Field and looked very comfortable in a box safety role in the spring game. Despite that, Harbaugh made it clear that the two starters have "nobody really pushing them right now."
*[minus Peppers, if he's more of a linebacker.]
**[Ernest Shazor's candidacy here was rejected since he made as many plays for the opposition as his own team. ]
Special teams?
Michigan didn't run any full-go, but there was the occasional thing of note:
- At Ford Field it looked like Michigan was trying to find folks other than Peppers to take kickoffs back. They can get similar production from some of their other fast guys and lighten the load on their two-way star.
- They did practice both NFL and spread punting; in the game they went entirely spread.
- Kenny Allen had a booming conventional punt. This does not surprise since he's been blasting them in practice for years. It is unlikely he has the precision that Blake O'Neill did but if Michigan needs to send it 60 yards he's more than capable.
- Andrew David has been tasked with rugby punting. He had a pooch punt that was relatively effective.
- Can't judge return units since nothing was full contact.
- Chris Partridge appears to be the main guy on special teams, with little help from other people, at least on the practice field.
- David was shaky on field goals.
I expect Allen to take the large bulk of the kicking jobs. Surprise!
Spring Practice Presser 3/22/16: Jay Harbaugh
So Jay, how's your new house? I saw you bought a house on Twitter.
"Uh, I have no heat. Gas got shut off even though I tried to not have it shut off, so I haven't slept there yet. No heat. It's about 35 degrees in there. Not great."
MGoQuestion: Are you guys still going to use the shield punt formation this year?
"We're going to have a bunch of different things. Shield will be one of the things that we do. I think we're going to be kind of hybrid—a little bit of everything."
MGoFollowUp: What led to that decision?
"To basically change it up?"
MGoWe'reOnTheSamePage: To switch it up, yeah.
"I think when you look at what teams are doing nationally I think out of 120 teams probably 75 or so, maybe 65-75 that are some variation of hybrid, meaning they're not really pro-style, they're not really shield, they kind of go back and forth; it's a little harder to identify. Those are the teams that generally have the most success, so probably go that route."
We saw a lot of Wheatley working with Butt and that first group when we were in Florida. How has that evolved? Is he still among those fighting for that other spot?
"Yeah. I mean, we traveled six guys to all the games so there's really no other spot to be won. There's certain jobs to be won, maybe, in terms of, 'Hey, you're going to do this role on this play' but I wouldn't think of it like that in terms of 'Hey, this guy's fighting for that third tight end spot.'
"We want to put guys in positions to do things that they're good at anyway, but he is doing well and he's one of that group of guys that kind of rotates with the ones. There's really four or five of them, though."
With a guy like Jake, as good as he is and experienced, how much of a comfort is he for whoever emerges at quarterback to know that Jake's probably going to be open and he's probably going to catch the ball?
"I would imagine it's pretty nice. I don't know for sure but I'd imagine that's a pretty great thing to have him and Amara and then eventually Jehu out there. That's got to make you feel really good throwing the ball."
Can Kenny [Allen] punt and kick field goals if needed?
"Certainly. Yeah, Kenny's very good and he has a very good sense of how much he can handle physically and he's not going to wear himself out, so he can certainly do it all."
Doesn't seem like an ideal situation though, is it?
"Mm, no. Ideally yeah, you'd have a different person for everything but the really ideal thing is to have the best guy at each spot. If he happens to be the best guy at each spot then we're good with that, but there's still a long ways to go. And those guys, that's one position where you can really develop quite a bit in the offseason more so than some other spots where it's more just strength and conditioning. Specialists can actually improve their craft more than some other spots, I think."
Have you had a chance to do many returns yet, and are there any different guys mixing in than what we saw last fall?
"I wouldn't say different expect for new guys like Kareem [Walker]. But Jehu and Jourdan Lewis, Jabrill, Dymonte [Thomas], Kareem. I mean, I think that group as a whole is really, really good. I'd be surprised if there's a better group as a whole in the country. All those guys are pretty dangerous."
You mentioned four or five other tight ends. Who's in that group, and is it a little deeper than it was last year, would you say?
"Umm, it probably is. I mean, at one point or another this spring we've had Jake [Butt], Ian [Bunting], TJ [Wheatley], and Sean McKeon and Gentry with the ones obviously doing different things. I'd like to put everyone in a position to succeed. TJ can do things different than Gentry; just naturally they're very different body types and they have different strengths and weaknesses at this point. But yeah, at one point or another each of those guys has been with the ones."
[After THE JUMP: Jake Butt, best tight end in America; recruiting a dominant trait; why Gentry moved to TE; Ol' Skillet Hands hype]
Act Of God
10/17/2015 – Michigan 23, Michigan State 27 – 5-2, 2-1 Big Ten
[Eric Upchurch]
So I was trying to come up with a clever thing for this post and started Googling "Act of God." Folks in contracts who are beset by improbable occurrences regularly petition the courts for forgiveness since, you know, things. And stuff. I mean, seriously. That thing, that was a pretty unlikely thing. Cumong man.
The courts have generally gone along with this. If you are beset by a plague of locusts and boils and rivers of blood and the like, the courts are generally like "God's bad, yo" and then they let you go.
Anyway. I'm scanning, scanning, trying to find something apropos, and then
Fine. Okay. Yeah. Okay. You're right. It's cool, RationalWiki. Keep on being mean to anti-vaxxers. It's cool. I am perfectly calm, RationalWiki. Calmer than you are.
This is the section inspired by the brain above. It's a pretty impressive brain, all up in some parentheses that probably mean something to people who took their discrete math class seriously instead of asking my friend to drop off my homework because 8:30 on North Campus just wasn't happening, man.
So. In about 10 months Jim Harbaugh erased the physical gap between Michigan and Michigan State. Michigan didn't run roughshod; both teams struggled to get yard one on the ground. Injury whinging is out of the question: both teams were down one starter on the line when MSU was on the field.
In the absence of a physical advantage either way, the game came down to the fact that Michigan State spawned a generational quarterback from a three-star recruit at the same time they had disastrous special teams. Michigan's special teams were amazing until they were… not amazing, and Brady Hoke hired an offensive coordinator whose 30-year career has seen one quarterback he recruited ever—everrrrrrr—start. (That guy was Indiana's QB as a sophomore; the next year he was a tight end.) Jake Rudock is a smart dude who I am grateful is at Michigan; he is not a guy who Harbaugh has chosen and developed.
[Bryan Fuller]
When Cook had an opportunity to hit a receiver who'd gotten over the top of Jeremy Clark, he did so. He nestled the ball in there with the care and precision of a watchmaker. If there was a job where you had to throw babies at titanium bassinets inside a volcano, I would be comfortable giving Connor Cook that job. Rudock hit some intermediate passes but he did not take advantage of his opportunities to hit touchdowns.
Thus a game that was close enough for God to do some serious smitin'.
So, that sucks. It sucks that happened. It sucks that the kind of trash program that would run all the way across the field to taunt the Michigan student section after being handed a gift gets to feel like they earned something this morning. They're planning on nicknaming it, as if they earned something. That is why Michigan State will always be Michigan State. That is why "little brother" stuck: because it is the truest thing ever said about the attitude of that program.
But I've seen worse. I've felt worse. I have a big ol' callus. It's clear the direction this is going, and it's not a loss to Rutgers. The juggalos will get theirs as soon as Harbaugh flips the QB matchup. That's the undercurrent of their relief. They're already celebrating like underdogs who fluked it out.
See you next year.
Known Friends And Trusted Agents Of The Week
you're the man now, dog
#1 Jourdan Lewis had 6 PBUs, wasn't beaten clean without offensive pass interference, and shut down Burbridge enough that MSU was behind despite a monster game from their QB.
#2 Jabrill Peppers had three excellent returns, was important in limiting the MSU ground game, caused MSU to freak out and burn consecutive timeouts late in the first half, and set up a Michigan touchdown with an end-around.
#3 Willie Henry had two sacks and was in MSU's backfield for most of the fourth quarter.
Honorable mention: rest of the front seven, Kenny Allen.
KFaTAotW Standings.
9: Jourdan Lewis (#1 UNLV, #1 Northwestern, #1 MSU)
6: Jabrill Peppers(#2 BYU, #2 Northwestern, #2 MSU)
5: Chris Wormley(#2 Utah, #1 Oregon State)
3: Jake Butt (#1 Utah), De'Veon Smith(#2 Oregon State, #3 BYU), Ryan Glasgow (#1 BYU), Desmond Morgan (#1 Maryland),
2: Ty Isaac(#2 UNLV), Maurice Hurst (#2 Maryland), Willie Henry(#3 Utah, #3 MSU).
1: AJ Williams (#3 Oregon State), Channing Stribling(#3 UNLV), Blake O'Neill(#3 Maryland), Jake Rudock(#3 Northwestern)
Who's Got It Better Than Us Of The Week
This week's best thing ever.
Michigan's defense boots MSU off the field on fourth and nineteen to win the game, until they did not win.
Honorable mention: 80 yard punt. Peppers on the loose.
WGIBTUs Past.
Utah: Crazy #buttdown.
Oregon State: #tacopunts.
UNLV: Ty Isaac's 76 yard touchdown.
BYU: De'Veon Smith's illicit teleporter run.
Maryland: Jehu Chesson jet sweeps past you.
Northwestern: Chesson opening KO TD.
MSU: the bit where they won until they didn't.
This week's worst thing ever.
Honorable mention: N/A
PREVIOUS EDBs
Utah: circle route pick six.
Oregon State: Rudock fumbles after blitz bust.
UNLV: Rudock matches 2014 INT total in game 3.
BYU: BYU manages to get to triple digit yards in the last minutes of the game.
Maryland: Slog extended by deflected interception at Houma.
Northwestern: KLINSMANN OUT
MSU: Obvious.
[After THE JUMP: Jourdan Lewis targeted again. It goes okay to well.]
Michigan State Postgame Presser: Jim Harbaugh
After a finish like that, what do you tell your guys in the locker room?
"They played their guts out. Played winning football. Overcame so much, and we messed up a play at the end. Have resolve, put steel in the spine, and we'll move forward."
Given the fact that your team played so well until the end, is this something that you can use as…I don't want to say motivation, because that's the wrong word, but something you can use as a good building point?
"Yeah. There's so many- so much good, you know. Our guys played big in a big game…overcame so much- calls that were made, calls that weren't made. Just kept fighting and overcame so much in the ball game and ultimately played winning football. What do you say about the last play? It was unfortunate. Didn't get the result."
Why was this the game for Jabrill to see the field offensively and how do you think he did in terms of impacting in all three facets today.
"He did good. He did great in all phases. Big time player, plays really big in the game as he does so often. He played great."
As you said, you guys played winning football minus one last play that could have gone any way. You guys were in control most of the game- led or tied. How do you talk to your players about the fact that it's a process, it's more than one game, it's even more than one season [as] it's about building a program?
"Have resolve. Have steel in our spine. Gotta move forward."
What happened on that last play?
"The snap was low, just below the knees. He didn't field it cleanly, and looked like then he bobbled it again and kind of kicked it a little bit. Looked like he was trying to kick it while he was in traffic. I mean, you saw it. That about the way you saw it? Very unfortunate."
[After THE JUMP: "We're gonna put steel in our spine."]
Wednesday Presser 10-7-15: John Baxter
What goes into deciding whether to go punt block or punt return when you've got such an explosive return man in Jabrill?
"Uh…same thing that goes into when you throw a fastball or the curve. You know, you've got to pressure- the ability to pressure a punter keeps people in protection, sets up the ability to return. The ability to return a punt sets up the ability to pressure, and it's really not unlike making calls of any kind in the game of football. You do all your work and you crunch all your numbers but you coach the game by feel, and it pretty much is that."
How pleased are you with that unit? Does that unit still have more to give?
"The punt return unit?"
And punt block.
"I'll tell ya, I'm really pleased, actually, with the punt return. The amazing thing is we've had 51 reps of it in five games now. Somebody needs to go back far and see how many times there's 51 reps in five games. Obviously it's because we're playing amazing defense and what have you, but if you really look at what the unit has done, there've been three returnable balls kicked to us out of 51, okay? Obviously we had a round robin with all the Australian rugby punters against each other in the first four games, and everybody found out it's really hard to return one of those. Three returnable balls, and we've- you know, the baseball analogy is we've hit the ball hard but unfortunately we've knocked it off the wall for doubles and triples. We haven't had a home run yet.
"I think the thing that goes unsaid is Jabrill's amazing decision-making back there [and] unselfishness to not risk balls that shouldn't be touched or should be on the ground, protecting his teammates, those kinds of things. Besides being explosive the punt returner needs to be a great decision-maker and really needs to handle the ball well because one of the things we always say is if you have the ball you have the team, and you need to take care of the team. It's been effective. I wish we could get more returnable balls, but I'm not in control of that."
[After THE JUMP: Baxter is the Yogi Berra of this coaching staff]
Monday Presser 9-14-15: Players
Kenny, when you first got here you were kind of thought more of as a punter. Did you ever think you'd be in the position where you'd be competing for and then winning this job as kicker?
Kenny Allen: "I've kind of always had it in the back my mind, but to be honest I didn't actually think that I would be pursuing the kicking job this much and then when the opportunity did arise it really started to become a reality."
How much in high school did you kick as well as punt?
KA: "I did everything in high school so yeah, it was kind of nice to get back to doing all three."
Kenny, how long did it take to settle into that role? Was it in the first game after you made some kicks?
KA: "Yeah, I think after the first game. After getting the first kick out of the way everything felt a lot easier. Kind of like a weight was lifted and then from then on everything was downhill, just smooth. Everything was a lot more comfortable."
Kenny, last week before the Oregon State game you got a full ride. Can you just talk about the timing of that?
KA: "Yeah, I'd say it's kind of ironic because I turned down a full ride from Oregon State coming out of high school, and then the week that we play them I'm put on scholarship here. So, it's just kind of nice to see that other people think I'm working hard and that I'm deserving of a scholarship. Yeah, it's nice."
[After THE JUMP: Allen, Blake O'Neill, Erik Magnuson, and Matt Godin]


text:
How and where can I edit the language for the poll?
How and where can I edit the language for the poll?
we do not support the language packs in the plugin just yet but you can login to your Polldaddy account and create it there. You can then assign the language pack to the poll in this account also.
I integrate, your very nice plugin but i can't set a default language pack for the polls created. I created a Portuguese language pack and translate all phrases. I can assign it for each poll from the polldaddy board but I want to create all my poll from my blog and have portuguese as default language set automatically, just like it works for my custom style.
Is there a way to use a language pack as default?
I see things like languageID and packID in your code but i don't now how and which value to put.
I also have a translated pt_PT.mo/.po files for Portuguese, that i can send to you, if you want include this in your plugin, for everybody.
Thank you very much for the help and excuses me for my poor english.
coincidentally we added this to the main site yesterday. If you create a poll in the main site, in the same folder you use for your blog polls, the language pack will be saved as a default. If you need any help with this, please contact support and we can help you further.
This topic has been closed to new replies.

subset: commoncrawl


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Retailers are using a variety of unique strategies to build diaper sales. Fleming Cos., Oklahoma City, for example, is encouraging its retail customers to buy diapers on a pallet program, said Tom Rose, the wholesaler's director of category management. "We have a goal of selling 5% of all our diapers this year on pallet programs," Rose said. Buying on a pallet program enables retailers to purchase diapers at a lower cost. The retailers, in turn, can then reduce the retail price. "We are ...
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Skip to comments.Shot Brazilian Had Phoney Visa, Says Home Office (UK)
Posted on 07/28/2005 11:52:49 AM PDT by Pyro7480
Shot Brazilian had phoney visa, says Home Office
By Jenny Booth, Times Online
The student visa of Jean Charles de Menezes expired more than two years before he was shot by police, a Home Office spokeswoman said tonight.
The Government also issued a cautiously-worded statement which appeared to indicate that Mr de Menezes had a forged stamp in his passport.
The spokeswoman said: "Mr de Menzes ... applied for leave to remain as a student. This was approved on October 31, 2002, and he was granted leave to remain until June 30, 2003.
"We have no record of any further application or correspondence from Mr de Menezes.
"We have seen a copy of Mr de Menezes passport containing a stamp apparently giving him indefinite leave to remain in the UK.
"On investigation, this stamp was not one that was in use by the Immigration and Nationality Directorate on the date given."
Mr de Menezes, 27, a Brazilian national who was working in London as an electrician, was shot dead as ran aboard a northbound Tube train at Stockwell station. Shocked witnesses spoke of the expression of complete panic on his face as police undercover officers, who had trailed from his home in Tulse Hill several miles away under the mistaken belief that he was a suicide bomber, held him down and shot him.
Last night his family accused the police of changing their account of the incident. At first Scotland Yard said that Mr de Menezes had been wearing a heavy jacket despite the warm weather, and had refused to respond to a police challenge, vaulting over the ticket barrier in an apparent attempt to escape.
But his cousin told a press conference yesterday that senior officers at Scotland Yard had now retracted their claims that Mr de Menezes was acting suspiciously, so that officers had no option but to open fire.
Vivien Figueiredo, 22, said police told her that he was wearing a lightweight denim jacket and not a bulky coat that could have hidden an explosive belt underneath. They had also admitted that he used his travelcard to gain access to the station. Ms Figueiredo said: "They are saying he did absolutely nothing wrong when he was killed, so why dont they say all this publicly?"
Police shot the electrician seven times in the head and once in the shoulder at point-blank range. The family claims that Mr Menezess death forced Scotland Yard to change its shoot-to-kill orders. In yesterdays arrest in Birmingham, the family pointed out that police used a Taser stun gun. Speaking shortly before leaving for Brazil to take Mr Menezes's body home for burial, they said that they wanted to know why a similar weapon was not used last Friday.
Ms Figueiredo also expressed anger at reports that one of the officers involved in the fatal shooting had gone on holiday with his family, paid for by the Metropolitan Police. She said: "It is not right that this person should now be enjoying his holiday when we are suffering."
Alex Pereira, 27, another cousin accompanying the coffin on the flight home, said: "The officer must be brought back and show the world he did something wrong". Senior officers emphasised that the independent investigation into the incident was continuing.
Tomorrow the Stop the War Coalition will hold a vigil marking one week since Mr Menezess death, at 1730 BST in Parliament Square. A service will be held at Westminster Cathedral at the same time as his funeral in Brazil.
The police did what they had to do. No choice.
I wonder why they didn't send silver A-10s after him.
Now that's what I call border control!
Was he a practicing Muslim?
Quelle surprise.
Bit by bit, the truth is going to come out on this guy.
The "cousin" who has emerged as his spokesman is probably in it for the money - but I suspect the unfortunate Mr. Menezes was also in it for the money. I'm sure the Brits are trying to find out where a marginally employed illegal immigrant managed to get relatively large quantities of money to send back to Brazil (a detail that appeared in an article in the first few days after the shooting).
The press is busy trying to sanitize him, and the relatives want the bucks (okay, the pounds).
All of the illegal aliens so far have expired Visa cards. None of them have Discover or MasterCharge, so it only makes sense . . .
Check the family members - are they in GB legally ?
A phrase in common use by illiterates and others who have not formed particular thoughts at the moment.
Supposedly not. But some of the people involved in the Madrid bombings were not, either. They were Spaniards who were petty criminals or members of other terrorist groups (ETA), and supplied the materials and made some of the financial and logistical connections simply for money.
Blair and Straw have been reassuring everyone that he was in the country legally. I guess they aren't to be trusted.
Non-police witnesses have told the press that he was wearing a heavy coat. Non-police witnesses have said that he hopped the turnstile.
The Taser was used because he was not an immediate threat to blow himself up. That was not the case for Mr Menezes.
Mr Meneze probably didn't give up because of his illegal status in the country. You reap what you sow, I guess.
The Left's at it again, politicizing someone's death. I guess they want the war against terrorists to completely stop so no one accidently dies. It will just cause more civilians to be intentionally killed by lunatics.
this may explain why he was running from cops
Death by terrorism = acceptable death
Death by police fighting terrorism = unacceptable death
Go figure. My mind doesn't work that way.
No matter how you justify it, this sux, and it sucks badly. However, under the circumstances, the Police actions were understandable. It doesn't take much of any jacket to cover a bomb belt or bomb vest. This is just a sad, sad tragedy, and he is a victim of the terrorists more than a victim of the police.
Hmmm...and just where does one go to get one of those stamps which grants one "indefinite leave to remain in the UK"?
Which "community" within the UK might from time to time require a documents expert?
Yup. I'm sure these officers just shot the guy cause they felt like it. No reason to suspect the guy at all. Sure.
He very well may have been a terrorist, just not part of the most recently active cell.
The moral of the story: When a policeman yells "stop", one better stop.
And the same address as the terrorists.
Doesn't pass the small test.
Probably the "counterfeit visa community."
By a strange coincidence, a couple of days after this guy's death, the police raided a place in Britain that was busy cranking out phony "student" and other visas.
Exactly so. My guess is that the family is doing their best to increase their cash award.
The day after this shooting happened everyone was saying the poor guy didn't speak English, so he was running from the police because he thought he was going to be mugged again. One question, how can a person live in another country for several years and not learn what, "Stop, Police" means? My daughter is a language instructor and she tells me the best way to learn a language is immersion in the country/culture. This thing smells and I bet by the time it is sorted out, the police will be the ones smelling good.
Looks like you're thinking the same thing I've been thinking. Wanna bet that as more comes out about this guy, he'll look less and less "innocent"?
Love your tagline! Sounds like a great idea to me!
Even his family admits he spoke good English. When my husband went to Brazil a few years ago, he was surprised at how many people spoke (very) good English.
He was just doing the work that the Brits were too lazy to do...
I don't suppose we could hire those U.K. cops to help out with our (ahem) "problems" on our southern border with illegals, now could we?
Once it got to the point of Menezes running in the train station, they really didn't have much choice.
The police screwed up pretty badly, though. Menezes lived in a small building (8 flats), and the cops could have, and should have, made sure they knew everybody who lived there. The start of this mess was when they started tailing a guy who came out of the building, who they didn't know. But Menezes had lived there for a long time, and they should have known who he was.
Bad legwork up front led to bad results downstream.
He jumped a ****in' turnstile ****in' running from the ****in' police, you dumb ****!
One question.
Was he a practicing Muslim?
The plot thickens.
There is more to this...
Amazing how the cops are so stupid, isn't it? Sarcasm off.
Bill Cosby used to say, "Spank your kids once a day, if you don't know what for, they will." This guy sounds like he might have been having the guilts; the cops may never know why he ran, but maybe it won't matter.
How do they know he wasn't a suicide bomber? Is John Edwards channeling him?
"Was he a practicing Muslim?"
No, Catholic.
"The Taser was used because he was not an immediate threat to blow himself up."
I'm not sure what you're basing that on, considering the guy tasered was one of the guys who tried to blow himself up last week and was reportedly wearing a backpack when arrested.
The operative word is immediate. He apparently did not appear to have bombs strapped to him when arrested, the Brazilian looked like he did.
Yes, no-one would ever put a bomb in a backpack...
1. Illegal documents/visa.
2. Sends large sums of money home to his family (larger than known income)
3. An electrician by trade... Reportedly installing security alarms in London..
4. Seen either coming from the bombers house or lived there.
5. Running like hell from police.
Could it be he was working for the terrorist helping rig the bombs?
Added more info to #3
In the meantime, the scum terrorists arrested with bombs and bombing plans are being handled with kid gloves put in air conditioned cells with access to fire breathing imams who work hard converting other scum in prisons to their evil ideology. Aren't we so civilized and humane.
This one might interest you...
Yes, he thought la Migra was after him. If the word gets out that illegal aliens will be shot on sight (seven times no less) the problem will go away.
I've known some tough cops in my day but I don't think I have ever met one who could dump half a mag in some thugs skull, especially if there wasn't much physical resistance.
That is more the trait of a soldier who hasn't been taught how to subdue prisoners and one just recently back from hot combat, where blood and busted brains are an everyday sight.
I have a hunch that there is a lot more that will never come out.
The police did a damn-d bad investigation. Whoever said that this guy was a suspect should be fined or serve jailtime on probation for negligient murder.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.


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DTV custom shower system
As bathroom options get more complicated, the means of controlling them has to get simpler. Kohler's DTV custom shower system is tailor-made for the iPod generation. With a scroll of the dial, it can control up to eight different showerheads at once. You can also preprogram it with your favorite settings, from a gentle sprinkle to our personal choice, the "wave massage." $1,990; kohler.com


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Pentek GAC-5, American Plumber WGC478
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Pentek, Ametek, US Filter GAC-5 compact Point of Use Water Filters, part number 155110, filters Chlorine bad taste and odor, Sand, Dirt, Silt, Rust and Scale Particles. The GAC-5 water filter fits model W385-PR compact filter housing, Culligan US-316 Housing, and other Housings that require 5" Filter Cartridge.
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View the Full Product Manual
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Ten Minute Play Fest
The time had arrived for Bedlam Theatre's ninth annual Ten Minute Play Fest. This is wild and daring theater in 21 bite-sized chunks (in three sets, rotated six times over two weekends), with a performance slate that runs from conventional drama, to toy theater, to opera, to drag. A look at this year's writers includes such familiar names as Aditi Kapil, Dominic Orlando, Carson Kreitzer, Jeffry Lusiak, and Bedlam's own John Bueche, Maren Ward, and Jon Mac Cole. But you really don't have to know the names, or know anything at all about theater, to enjoy these short hits of stage adventure in Bedlam's inviting space (complete with food and libation). If you've been meaning to go to the theater but haven't seen a show lately that speaks to you, this is the place to get your feet wet. Drenched, actually. For show details visit bedlamtheatre.org. (Pictured: Long Days Journey into Puss)
April 16-25, 2010
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Gill UV Tec Zip Neck Long Sleeve Women`s$55.95
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Designed for athletic activity, technical shirts can be worn as a base layer to wick away moisture from the body, or on their own, as many have a water resistant finish. Most designed for sailing also include anti-microbial technology and are mildew resistant, a must for any serious sailor. Most importantly, technical shirts also provide UV protection far beyond that of regular shirts, some even up to 50 SPF, making them great on the water. Found in both short and long sleeves in a variety of colors, you can find a technical shirt perfect for you here at APS. The women's tech shirts are a slimmer cut and sold in women's specific sizes.
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Welcome from NH. Copy and paste :)
This is a discussion on new member questions and thanks for all the advice on holster within the New Members Introduce Yourself forums, part of the Welcome To DefensiveCarry.com category; Thanks for all the advice on a holster. Today I filed for my CC permit. I hope it doesn't take the whole 45 days to ...
Thanks for all the advice on a holster. Today I filed for my CC permit. I hope it doesn't take the whole 45 days to get it. Any one gotten theirs in Roanoke city Va lately. O ya one more thing someone said I should have posted my holster question in a different form but did explain witch one. Can I move my post to other form with out redoing it.
Welcome from Utah.
"Government is not the solution to our problem; government IS the problem". - Ronald Reagan 1981
Welcome from Fort Worth, Texas.
NRA Life Member
GOA Life MemberMoving to a new location
Welcome from S.C.Once you start a thread,i don't think you can move it.I know you can delete a post,but,not positive about a thread.
Welcome to the forum!
"If you make something idiot proof, someone will make a better idiot."
- Anon
Welcome from Mesa, Arizona via Afghanistan
Welcome to Defensive Carry The best forum for sharing ideas and experience.
Help us keep this forum great by remembering the Golden Rule: Please treat others as you want to be treated.
I am from Kansas.
Friend of Bill
Welcome aboard from the great state of Pennsylvania!
Just go 4 forums below this New Member forum & you'll find that it's devoted to holsters.
Welcome from Wisconsin!
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1SG, US Army Retired - Airborne Infantry All the Way!
Retired PI/Armed Security
EOD - Initial success or total failure
Hello! Welcome from Southeast Kansas!
Welcome Aboard and Greetings from Rocky Top Tennessee
When you accept mediocrity you sow the seeds for future failure.
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Welcome from Wisconsin>
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
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Views: 1565
I'm really not so sure that the new Frankie, Cleo, and Clawdeen dolls belong to this set. Have you seen the official drawing of Draculaura in the school paper outfit (it was revealed on the Monster High Facebook site)? That, I believe belongs to this set. http://www.monsterhighdolls.com/forum/topics/classroom-assorment-po...
Tegan found a trademark for something called "Monsteristas." I think that name fits the look of those dolls new dolls better. http://www.monsterhighdolls.com/forum/topics/a-possible-doll-line-name
At least I have Frankie DOTD and I hid a Clawdeen and a Cleo DOTD @ a target.
I'm assuming that the teaser picture of Draculaura on Clawd's shoulders has something to do with this Classroom Assortment. Draculaura comes with a good umbrella, an icoffin, and a nice outfit, which would explain the higher price tag associated with this set.
I'm wondering if the Clawd in that picture will be released as part of this Classroom set in the same way that Jackson Jekyll was released as part of the Gloom Beach set, or if that was his original doll version?
Aww, I wish they were still offering "The Dawn of the Dance" series of Monster High dolls. Oh, well. Maybe they are being sold at ebay!
Well, can't wait 'till the new Monster High Dolls come out! I'll be looking forward to it!
-Cloe Sarah Brown (A.K.A. Kente De Nile)
nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo i only have clawdeen wolf


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Profile: National Education Association
Representing 3.2 million employees of schools and educational institutions, the National Education Association calls itself the largest professional employee organization in the country.
It has plans for the biggest political mobilization in its history this year, spending tens of millions of dollars on the presidential and congressional races.
The union — which endorsed Democratic Illinois Sen. Barack Obama for president — also gives to liberal advocacy groups and Democratic Party organizations including: the Democratic Governors Association ($727,000 in 2006 and $200,000 from 2007-08); Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee ($335,000 from 2006-07); People for the American Way ($275,000 from 2006-07); Ballot Initiative Strategy Center ($227,000 from 2006-07); ACORN ($200,000 in 2006); America Votes ($150,000 in 2007); Economic Policy Institute ($150,000 in 2006) and USAction ($100,000 in 2006).
This year, the NEA also gave $250,000 to Evergreen Progress, a group running ads against the Republican candidate for governor of Washington.
Funders: union membership
Leadership: John Stocks, Reginald Weaver, Lily Eskelsen, Karen White, Dennis Van Roekel. Read more about these leaders in the Secret Money Project's Who's Who Directory of Key Leaders of Independent Groups.
Will Evans is a reporter for the Center for Investigative Reporting, NPR's partner for the Secret Money Project.
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Cosmetology Schools in Connecticut
Connecticut is one of the top five states with the highest concentration of cosmetology and hairstyling careers, with Danbury in particular being one of the most highly concentrated metropolitan areas in the country, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. (I mean, the state even has "I cut" in the name!) Get the training you need to get licensed to perform beauty services. Cosmetologists in Connecticut are equipped to do hair, nails, makeup and some skin care services. If you are passionate about beauty and are looking for a well-rounded career path in the beauty business, then becoming a CT cosmetologist might be for you. Cosmetologists in Connecticut are on the cutting edge of beauty trends and styles, and can help clients achieve the looks they're hoping for through client consultation and the skills and technique learned at Connecticut cosmetology schools. In cosmetology colleges in Connecticut, students can learn to cut, color and style hair, do nail care and nail art, apply classic or creative makeup designs, and also some elements of esthetics and skin care. Safety and sanitation is a core part of cosmetology training in Connecticut. In order to take the written and practical exams for a cosmetology license, the Connecticut board requires 1500 of cosmetology training at an approved school for cosmetology. After graduating and getting licensed, CT cosmetologists should be equipped to pursue jobs as hairstylists, hair color specialists, nail technicians, makeup artists, and so much more. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the median salary of cosmetologists in Connecticut is around $26,640, and the average salaries range from $18,190 to $44,570, though those figures do not include tips. The BLS also estimates that job demand will grow for personal appearance workers by 14% through the year 2020. Many professional cosmetologists say they enjoy the creativity, inspiration and daily challenges their jobs give them. Does a career in cosmetology sound right for you? Consider one of these cosmetology schools in Connecticut to start working toward making that dream a reality.
Look through the list below to find Cosmetology Schools in Connecticut.
Map of Cosmetology Schools in CT
to get more information
Show All Schools in Connecticut


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Published on May 13th, 2014 | by Zachary Shahan0
Denmark April Electrified Vehicle Registrations Report
May 13th, 2014 by Zachary Shahan
Originally published on EV Obsession.
There's no other way to say it — the Nissan Leaf crushed the competition in Denmark in April. It accounted for 68% of all electrified vehicle registrations. The Tesla Model S was a distant #2 with 12% of the market and the VW e-Up! was close…
Keep up to date with all the hottest cleantech news by subscribing to our (free) cleantech newsletter, or keep an eye on sector-specific news by getting our (also free) solar energy newsletter, electric vehicle newsletter, or wind energy newsletter.
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Mary "Bib" Berglund, 89, died on Dec. 17, 2012, in Parker, Colo.
Per her request, there will be no visitation and crema- tion rites will be accorded. Burial will be in Hamlet Cemetery at a later date. Memorials may be made to the VFW Auxiliary Post 1571 in Aledo.
Mary "Bib" was born Jan. 11, 1923, in Hamlet, Perryton Township, the daughter of O.H. and Mabelle Whisman Lee.
She graduated from Aledo High School and mar- ried Robert Berglund in Aledo.
Mary was a life member of the VFW Auxiliary Post 1571 and a 50-year member of the Order of Eastern Star, Chapter 126. She was a member of the College Avenue Presbyterian Church. She enjoyed being with family and friends and was an avid sports fan.
She is survived by her husband of 57 years, Robert L. Berglund; her brother, Charles Lee; her daughter, Sandra Kay Winter; her son, Jeffrey Lee Berglund; grandchildren, Felica Graham, Chad Berglund and Elizabeth Berglund-Schuster; great-grandchildren., Taelynn, Jason and Austin. She is preceded in death by her parents, Otis Hoyt Lee and Mabelle Whisman Lee; and two brothers, Otis H. Lee, Jr. and William E. Lee.
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I am renting the place for friends of mine. They are a couple from Paris (France) visiting New York. They are 55 years old each.
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If you agree to rent the place, could you please send the exact address as they need it in order to fill in their visa application ? Thank you.
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A-Z Index |
Learner Programs
The mission of Adult Learner Programs is to support
and enhance the educational and developmental
experiences of the adult learner. Innovative and
quality services, programs, resources and activities
are offered in an effort to meet the need for
integration of all aspects of the adult learner.
Adult Learner Programs also facilitates a sense of
belonging and community for the adult learner
through the Lifelong Learning Center.
GLBTIQ Student Retention Services
The goal of KSU's Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual,
Transgender, Intersex, and Questioning (GLBTIQ)
Student Retention Services is to provide a safe and
supportive space where students of all genders and
sexual identities can come to seek support and
resources in order to realize their fullest
potential and to gain a sense of belonging to the
KSU community.
International Student Retention Services
The purpose of International Student Retention
Services is to assist you while you are in the
United States and attending Kennesaw State
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assisting with and/or making referrals regarding
admissions, visa concerns, registration, ESL
(English as a Second Language), math, personal, and
social issues. KSU has services in place to help
with your adjustment to a different culture. The
Office of International Student Retention Services
cannot take the place of your home, but it strives
to make you feel at home while you are here.
Multicultural Student Retention Services
The mission of Multicultural Student
Retention Services (MSRS) is to provide essential
advocacy, resources, services, and programming to retain
historically underrepresented minority students at
Kennesaw State University.
Odyssey Peer Mentoring Program
The Odyssey Peer Mentor Program was created with a goal of matching new students with more experienced students to help new students adjust to campus life. Mentor and mentees are matched based on degree interests, hobbies, and peer mentor areas. The program offers opportunities for participants to socialize and to work together in community service projects.
Volunteer Kennesaw (VKSU)
VKSU is a campus-based volunteer service center
matching KSU volunteers' interests with community
needs. KSU students, faculty, and staff who wish to
volunteer are "plugged in" to help meet needs
through VKSU's coordination with more than 300
organizations in the community. KSU students are
encouraged to learn and serve through individual
volunteer placements and group service projects.
VKSU also serves an educational role by providing a
practical opportunity for students to explorer
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And you, as a young gay boy, should avoid older gay men for all the same reasons that young straight girls are advised to avoid older straight men.
*If you add 'underage', it's okay.
Awesome answer.
I would also add that you really can't control who you have crushes or infatuations for. You can control your reaction, decide whether or not to pursue it. But you can no more control who you are attracted to than you can control what kinks turn you on in the privacy of your own mind.
The Savage Love column is already in the print edition, and it's just one click away on the Stranger web site. Do you really need to sprinkle your advice column here too?
I know, you're after the maximum amount of posts, but it's getting a little redundant here.
good, Dan, good...(pats Dan on head; gives him a bacon flavored treat)
i liked the part about NOT feeling pressured into penetrative anal sex.
it's not the end all, be all of the gay sex act...and if it's an option on the table, make sure you only engage in it when you have close proximity to warm, soapy water and clean, fluffy towels.
Wow. As an older gay man who takes mentoring young gay men as a sacred trust and something I sorely missed coming out at the height of the dying times, fuck you, Dan. Fuck your projection that all older gay men are after is some sweet underage ass. Fuck your dismissive attitude that it's not worth knowing people out of your age bracket. And fuck your insane internalization of the lie that every older guy (gay or straight) is a creepy sexual predator.
Hope you get the Huckabee gig. You and he should have a fine time together. Your worldviews seem to align nicely.
@6: right on.
Awwwwww. I guess Dan is capable of being sweet when he wants to be.
i was a straight boy who was crushed on by gay boys in HS. i didn't really care, but i'm pretty comfy in my sexyality & i went to an arts HS where being out was OK.
as long as you're not crushing on a gay-panicking homophobe jock asshole, don't stress too much. and if you are, STFU about it until you leave for college. then tell your boyfriends & laugh laugh laugh about it.
geez 6 and 7. i think he was talking about the trolls that are always trying to sleep with younger gay guys. now that i'm getting into my upper 20's i don't get it as much, but i never met anyone, ANYONE, much older than me who was interested in anything but fucking me. that excludes my uncle and his boyfriend, but includes some of their friends.
A blowjob seems like a pretty good way to deal with a crush to me. Of course you can get a reputation doing that, but is that such a bad thing really?
A sober, well reasoned answer by what apperas to be an older, mature gay man.
Who is the guest columnist this week?
@6 I've mentored a 15 year old gay boy, and while I certainly wasn't after his ass, his poor mom had spent a hell of a lot of time trying to keep older men away from him, and sadly, she failed a few times, like when he was 14 and a 22 year old got his claws into the boy. She found out and he's in jail, but the offers come in through Myspace, and guys from the ages of 15 to 60 have not been the least bit subtle about cruising him, even in the presence of his mother.
From my own experience, when I was 16, I had a 21 year old boyfriend. I was completely manipulated, and I'm lucky I didn't end up HIV+.
It's not that these kids have to completely avoid older gay men altogether. It's that they have to approach them with a tremendous level of skepticism, and to not sleep with someone more than a year or two older until they're at least 18 and have a bit of experience under their belts.
Wow. As an older straight man who takes mentoring young straight women as a sacred trust, fuck you, Dan. Fuck your projection that all older straight men are after is some sweet underage pussy. Fuck your dismissive attitude that it's not worth knowing people out of your age bracket. And fuck your insane internalization of the lie that every older guy (gay or straight) is a creepy sexual predator.
Whatever. Dan, your generalization is just that, a generalization, and it can't speak to every specific circumstance, but it's damned good advice. Usagi might know he's not a predator, but there's no way for TBID to tell the difference at this point in his life and he shouldn't have to try right now. Nice letter, Dan. If the older guys don't like it, tough. This isn't about them.
I like Dan's advice. Especially about going to a big state school. I'm a freshman at WWU and people are SO supportive up here, plus the LGBTA here rules.
@6 Have a seat.
@6, 7, et al.
It is true, not all old/older straight/gay men are seeking underage conquests. Obviously.
But young, impressionable teenagers--particularly those with identity/sexuality issues (read: most of 'em!) can't always distinguish the good from the bad. So keeping a safe distance and shutting out those who might be able to mentor you might is a small price to pay to avoid, oh, I don't know, the really amazing, brilliant, doting, concerned forty five year old family friend who rapes you in his living room when you've come to his house looking for advice.
But hey, tear Dan and his advice apart--nothing like throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
@16 Jeeziz, I just snort-laughed!
This kid is likely to find that these straight boys and girls he's friends with will be the most supportive and kind people he'll run into in the coming out process. Straight guys surprise me a lot, and most of them handle the crush thing well (if you tell them rather than suddenly grab them).
He is also likely to find that the people who are most unkind to him, criticize him the most, tell him how to behave and what to like and how unacceptable aspects a, b, and c of his personality are will be other gay people. Totally my experience.
Agreed that he shouldn't act on the crushes. I was one of the only gay kids in my highschool, and met most of my gay friends online. Chat was way easier (and smarter, imho) because I could avoid mistaking someone's orientation and the awkwardness or potential harm that comes with it.
As an older gay man with quite a few gay-boy friends in their 20's, I've gotta protest.
I have no interest in having sex with someone 20 years younger than me.
But I do like taking them out sometimes and letting people wonder if we're having sex... some nights my boyfriend is busy and can't accompany me to various functions. Who better than a pretty 25 year old to play escort to an aging roue'?
Don't frighten away my dates, ya killjoy.
I really really like Dan's advice. And yes ... a little bit of mentoring is a great thing. But more often than not ... and it makes me sick to see people get paranoid about it. There are more sick depraved wreckless people who will take advantage of people than than these "mentors" can admit to themselves. Obviously to you people up there (and I'm giving you the benifit of the doubt), there is more gratification than getting a piece of ass from dating younger more inexperienced people. It's the fact that you are being a teacher, a mentor and hopefully giving people a better edge on life for their future relationships.
Then there is the other side. From personal experience at the other end of the spectrum, it would have been NICE to actually learn somethings togethor as oppossed to what it seemed in my world to learn from someone who has already been there done that, bored with it ...etc. etc. There is also the added benifit of being able to share new experiences and feelings with someone as opposed to always playing catch up, or maybe "chasing Amy" if you will. Being clueless togethor is nice too ... otherwise you can end up feeling like your innoscense is gone for no real good reason.
Smade, yeah, it is about us. Dan decided to make it (partially) about us. "And you, as a young gay boy, should avoid older gay men for all the same reasons that young straight girls are advised to avoid older straight men."
Sorry, it is different for young gay guys than straight girls. Straight high school girls get, what, 99.98% of every single movie and television show ever made to show them the permutations of relationships, good, bad, ugly, & indifferent, along with their older siblings and mothers to fill them in on what kind of dogs men are (along with the dodges). Gay teens get Will and Grace and Queer as Folk reruns and what,Cruising? Chuck and Larry? There are certainly more resources than when I was coming out, but there's no substitute for a friend who can fill in the gaps. And, learning to tell the difference between predators and friends is an important skill. Worse, sticking to guys in your own age range (say +3 to 5 years) is not an effective way to avoid predators (as one of my mentees can attest).
Be cautious? Hell yeah. But advising "avoid older gay men" (as opposed to say, "You have to be extremely careful who you trust, but finding someone who's been out longer than you to talk to can be helpful. Just remember to walk away and don't look back if they make a move on you.") is a lot like abstinence only sex education. It makes the people who favor abstinence feel good, but is really lousy policy that produces a lot of bad results.
What same reasons are young straight girls supposed to avoid older straight men?
It's up to the individual. Even as a 20 yr old, I wasn't attracted to other 20 year olds; they were dull, callow, hairless and usually, bad in bed. If you're a 20 year old gay man and you're attracted to 30 or 40 year old daddies, go for it...and remember that many men, regardless of their age, are quite capable of being thoughtless, destructive jerks.
The thoughtless, destructive jerks tend to have the better bed. Sensitive older gay men are wimpy and talky throughout sex, and they suck at kissing. I like my men to be men. Throw me around. I won't break.
Yeah, I also wish Dan was less categorical. Kids need to be careful, for sure, but they also need role models.
I also think that the demonization of older gay men contributes to gay culture's unhealthy fixation on youth, which actually exacerbates the chickenhawk problem.
The stuff about not having sex early or ever feeling like you HAVE to is OTM, though.
Never trust anyone over 30.
Conversely, never trust anyone under 30, either...
PS, sorry old guys but Dan is right. When I was in highschool there were 50 old guys who wanted to fuck me for every 1 old guy who just wanted to 'mentor' me. You're all getting defensive because you know it's true.
You shouldn't be hanging around fifty-one old guys in high school to begin with.
@30 sounds like Poe's Ultimate Gang Bang...
I think I put my back out just reading post # 26....
50 is too old. I like 40. And 45. Some 38's. A couple 39's.
@16: I've seen all the episodes of TCAP, and I remember 2 of the potential predators saying the just wanted to be a friend/mentor to the young boy. One of the guys even told Chris that he wanted to be a mentor to the young boy, because he remembered how hard it was for him when he was that age (the guy is now in his 50's or 60's), and how he wished he'd had someone to help him when he was coming out!
If TBID really wants someone who can be his mentor, then he should go to the GLBT Community Youth Center if there's one in his area. They'll probably have mentoring programs there. Granted, there'll still be pervs who work there just to get close to underage kids, but it would probably be a lot less risky.
"use condoms if you decide to have anal sex"
Aren't you supposed to be a good little advice columnist and recommend condoms for oral also?
Not to mention saran wrap for the MRSA...
One thing that you left out, Dan, but which you have mentioned in the past to kids, both straight and gay -
It's never too early to get healthy and start going to the fucking gym. Even if you're a skinny teen, skinny and untoned will only be cute for so long; once the miracle of puberty wears off and you start getting thin but soft, you might as well weight three hundred pounds. This is a lesson I didn't learn until I was out of my teens and realized that although I had a 32 inch waist - at 6'1'' - most guys wouldn't give me a second look because of my body, or lack thereof. Start eating right and going to the gym while you're in high school and you'll be a fucking god by the time you get to college. :)
Are these Mr Poe's favorite ages of men, or his favorite waist sizes of men?
I'm horrified to discover that I qualify under both...wait, not waist...i'm down to a snug 34.
Age. Obviously.
I have to admit that some days, the idea of throwing Mr. Poe around is absolutely enticing.
But we're off the point. Teenager in Distress is...
Hell, what was the point?
Face-the-facts (#29), No, I'm pissed (not defensive) because Dan's advice was a) personally insulting and b) incorrect. Guys like Mike Huckabee and Larry Craig are the ones who shout from the rooftops about what kind of predators older gay men are. I say that's bullshit.
MOST people (gay and straight) aren't predators. Propagating that myth is one reason whole hell of a lot of non-predators avoid having anything to do with kids under 21 precisely because they don't want to be perceived as predators.
I'm sorry your percentage of encounters coming out was so skewed. Mine was the other way around.
Oh the tragedy that is the Gay Male. Never happy, always searching, often drunk and smoking and wondering why no one finds him attractive. #37 Gander makes a point. Youth is beauty of one sort, but 40+ should not mean fat and soft. Yet alas for many 40+ gay men that is what they are. And to live their youth again they want said young man that writes to Dan as a play thing. Thank goodness I did hit the gym when in my youth, the results now are fantastic.
Ahh, yes!
The point being-- what teenager uses the word "canoodling"?
I think Dan's been had, again.
Points are for fools!
When I was still young and pretty (I had a modeling contract at one time), I used to intentionally go after older guys. I have no regrets. I still like guys older than me. I was cruising the park when I was in my early/mid teens. If they asked how old I was, I just lied.
I think Dan's advice is generally sound, but where does that leave people like me who have no desire these days to even look at somebody in their 20s, let alone younger, but would still like to be some sort of mentoring influence? I wish when I was 16 I had somebody like me who, at 42 now, is experienced enough to say "no, stay away from that shit" or "this is where you're about to end up if you're not careful."
I'm sure there are any number of people willing to accomodate you with blunt instruments, Poe. ;)
Aw. Wouldn't you have love a papa like Savage?
I meant -
Aw. Wouldn't you have loved a papa like Savage?
Apparently not while it was still statutory, Bauhaus....
Wouldn't you have loved a papa like Savage?
Even as a kid, I wouldn't have looked twice at Dan. Not my type at all.
somehow I can't imagine Tim Gunn throwing anyone around.
Ugh, the whole "mentor" bullshit is probably the most douchebaggy role older men have made up to get close to young men and women.
You know who are your best mentors? Your peers. It's harder to talk to them, and harder to receive criticism from them than anyone else, and in the end you'll appreciate it more. Let kids make mistakes and learn from them, don't force your "wisdom" down their throats, even if you aren't trying to get your dick in there too.
Agreed--to hell with mentoring!
I'm going to adopt.
the whole "mentor" bullshit is probably the most douchebaggy role older men have made up to get close to young men
That may be true for some, but I can't name a single person younger than me that I'd even ever consider touching with a ten-foot...douchebag.
Speak for yourself. Not all of us have corrupt ideals.
Okay, older guys, some of you are repeatedly missing the point. To recap:
1) This is NOT about you. This is about what the teenager needs, not about your "need" to be a mentor. Dan mentioning you does not make it about you. 2) Nobody said that most older gay men are predators. They are saying that most older gay men WHO TRY TO GET ALL FRIENDLY WITH GAY TEENAGERS are predators. That doesn't mean all of them, but the odds shoot way up.
Well, yes.
But that's why Dan writes a sex column and the rest of us just hang around soda fountains and malt-shops looking for desperate teenagers to mentor.
@21: Even though I've already commented (and basically agree with Dan's advice), there are a few other things I'd like to add. You say you've got gay friends in their 20's. TBID isn't in his 20's, so his situation is way different than the relationship you have with your younger friends.
@21 and all the other older gay men: If you guys really do mean well and just want to help the younger generation, then work as a volunteer for programs that want to provide people like TBID with role models. Then it would be your JOB to mentor these kids, and you wouldn't have people accusing you of trying to take advantage of innocent young boys.
No one is accusing No. 21 of trying to take advantage of innocent young boys.
Seriously, this topic has gone off the Deep End.
There is no real clear answer to all this back and forth bull about young and old. Young guys can be jerks and old guys can be jerks but some guys are good but it is rare because of how gay culture depicts most men. So many gay men have bought into the stereotypical young twink, old predator bullshit.
I have always had older guys around me that were mentors in some way since I was a teen I am 52 now but it was not all about sex. I have known many older friends for over 35 years now and now I am the older guy with younger and older friends. it is not about mentoring about sex. We are all artists and enjoy each others company all the time. My friend Brian who lives in my building is in his 20's and is straight he is always in my apartment for coffee every morning even has keys. We are off to dinner with my other friend Michael on Sunday who is 75. I just visited another friend Gordon last weekend for diner and he is 92, 30 years older than me. I dropped off a new friend today after working on an art piece with him he is 22 I am 52 and michael who is also working on the piece is 75. It is not about sex it is about friendship and trust and I would not give up knowing my 92 year old friend for anything he is amazing for his age and has so much to offer young and old.
Forget the sex there is so much more to enjoy in each others company young and old.
I seem to remember Dan Savage saying he knew Jake from the Scissor Sisters when he was 15 and helped him through his teen years. I just wish some gay men would just think of something other than sex all the time or most guys for that matter. They would have more rewarding friendships (young and old) and lives.
This is NOT about you. This is about what the teenager needs, not about your "need" to be a mentor. Dan mentioning you does not make it about you. 2) Nobody said that most older gay men are predators. They are saying that most older gay men WHO TRY TO GET ALL FRIENDLY WITH GAY TEENAGERS are predators.
I didn't say I had a NEED. Get out.
And teenagers are my only concern in the issue, not fucking them. I can't
imagine anything much more repulsive.
Grow up.
"And you, as a young gay boy, should avoid older gay men for all the same reasons that young straight girls are advised to avoid older straight men. Dont fall for any gay and lesbian brothers and sisters rhetoric you may encounter online or at your first pride parade. Older gay men are not your brothers."
I guess reading that again ... hmm ... everything up until the point "older gay men are not your brothers" implies that "avoid" could perhaps mean avoid sexual advances, it doesn't necessarily have to be about sex. But for god sakes, he IS a teenager and he IS thinking about sex. It's VERY easy for me to imagine some respressed older homo, coming out of the closet because it's easier to now, and wanting to recreate something he never had in his youth. Maybe there are far more "nice" people in the world, but by far and away you "see" more malicious people because selfish people are by far and away more willing to impose and advertise their agenda and needs on someone else. Ask any hot young girl who is convinced that all guys are ass holes, and she might be right ... she only "sees" the ones that are upfront and make their intentions known.
Teenagers are idiots. They don't know that these people who are forthright and upfront and pushy don't always have their best intentions in mind. They are succeptable to believe any lies that are told to them on the spot. Why? Because they don't know any better, they have to grow up. Mentally, emotionally, sexually, etc. etc. Dan is just trying to cover his bases on this one.
Okay, one last attempt, then fuck it: Mentor doesnt mean soft and fuzzy. Its someone who watches out for you. Someone you trust enough that you realize when he slaps you across the face, hes doing it to wake you up, not because he gets off slapping your face.
#52 Ugh, the whole "mentor" bullshit is probably the most douchebaggy role older men have made up to get close to young men and women.
I don't especially care for the baggage that comes with the word either, but it's accurate, traditional, & what we've got.
You know who are your best mentors? Your peers.
No, they're not. They're too wrapped up inside your world. Different perspectives are useful once you learn to make use of them. This is true no matter what your age. Professional colleagues and mentors are important throughout your whole life. Cultivating them is a skill.
Let kids make mistakes and learn from them,
There's another option?
don't force your "wisdom" down their throats, even if you aren't trying to get your dick in there too.
Something you learn as you get older (damn, that was satisfying) is that you can't force you wisdom on anyone. You can describe similar situations you've experienced and choices you wish you'd made differently then listen sympathetically when they make the same stupid mistake, hopefully with the least bad outcome having been forearmed with the advice.
#55 Okay, older guys, some of you are repeatedly missing the point. To recap: 1) This is NOT about you."
Read the original post: "And you, as a young gay boy, should avoid older gay men for all the same reasons that young straight girls are advised to avoid older straight men." Yeah, sorry, that is about me all right--then and now.
2) Nobody said that most older gay men are predators. Followed with:...most older gay men WHO TRY TO GET ALL FRIENDLY WITH GAY TEENAGERS are predators. That doesn't mean all of them, but the odds shoot way up.
Thanks for helping Dan to perpetuate that myth, ensuring any male who does actually give a flying fuck about gay teens not getting preyed upon is too scared about his reputation to get involved. There were no qualifiers in the original. You put them in where they werent. I didnt, consequently, I got pissed.
You think I don't know about chickenhawks? After coming out late, I dodged a few by sheer dumb luck. Good thing my body was twentysomething even if my dating skills were barely past junior high since I never had a single gay role model I identified with when I was a teen.
While I agree with the advice, shouldn't it come with at least one vulgur comment or Santorum reference so we know you aren't Dr. Phil?
Usagi - your issues got issues.
Two of the (many) rebuttals to be made to your whiny, sorry, OBVIOUSLY CHICKENHAWKISH ass might be :
@41 : "I'm sorry your percentage of encounters coming out was so skewed. Mine was the other way around."
Therefore - YOU'RE right in your assertion and he's WRONG in his because.....of what an awesome fucking "mentor" you are?
@62 - "Yeah, sorry, that is about me all right--then and now."
Of course it is. You mentoring genius.
You have so obviously got a really fucked up horror story somebody could tell you about you in "mentor" mode, the stench is almost overpowering at this point. Want to just 'fess up to it now, and cleanse yourself? Or take the wide "Craig" stance? Let me guess....
"How should I deal with crushes on straight boys? Is it damaging to my psyche in anyway?"
"Is it damaging to my psyche in anyway?"
It is NOT anyway. It's any way! "Is it damaging to my psyche in any way? Two words! Not one word! God.
I find it hard to believe that somebody who doesn't know that is gay.
I guess it's a sign of the times, but when I suggested Savage as a good papa, I meant, um, like, father, y'know? I meant wouldn't you have loved getting fatherly advice like what Savage gave the youngster? I didn't mean wouldn't it have been great to have him plow you into adulthood.
In fact, personally speaking, I think calling one's bed partner Daddy or Mommy is a little twisted and distasteful, but I'm fully aware that I may just not get it. It just seems to imply that one likes to fuck Daddy or Mommy and if you knew my Daddy and Mommy, that terminology would not be a turn-on.
Actually, the kid should be most wary of older STRAIGHT men. Remember it is straight-identified men who are the highest offenders of male child molestation. His 'straight' Priest, his 'straight' coach, and the 'straight' counselor at school. These are your most likely child rapists. But it's too politically incorrect (even for Dan) to mention this.
"PS, sorry old guys but Dan is right. When I was in highschool there were 50 old guys who wanted to fuck me for every 1 old guy who just wanted to 'mentor' me. You're all getting defensive because you know it's true."
That, generally, was my experience thirty years ago growing up in New York. I will never forget, particularly, going to the West Village Gay Community Center when I was an awkward 17 year-old, and an especially obnoxious faggot in his late 30's, complete with a pointedly nasal voice, virtually cornering me and bitching at me after I very quietly said "no" to his "offer" to go home with him. He demanded to know why I didn't trust him. I was very shy and socially awkward and just mumbled "I dunno." There were at least a dozen other guys in the room and not one of them intervened on my behalf.
Of course, back then I had even worse luck with my "peers." At the same place, when I attended a "gay youth support group," the other gay kids were by and large unbelievably cold, jaded, and nasty.
Of course, that was thirty years ago, and maybe things are different now.
Maybe not.
A few years ago, when I talked to a young queer from WWU in Bellingham, he told me that young male queers barely hang out with each other, but rather just develop an exclusive friendship with a straight co-ed, while the lesbians run the LGBT club on campus.
My own suggestion is that gay adolescents not have sex until they are of least of legal age, and until then work on cultivating their self-esteem by developing a particular talent, as well as cultivate a heterogeneous network of platonic, supportive friends whom they can be open with. All of this can be bulwark against the temptation for young gay men to completely give themselves over to some guy who will exploit them.
For what's it's worth . . .
Growing up as a gay teen (in the first half of the current decade), I had a fair share of older gay friends, and as a 22-year-old, I still do. Most were uncles of friends, friends of friends, teacher, professors, the like. Nothing untowards has ever gone on between myself and any of them.
However! I have no illusions about the potential of these relationships. The only thing that keeps them from turning into sex is my steadfast decision for them not to turn into sex. I've never been taken advantage of by anyone, younger or older than myself, sexually because I have a strong personality and would never allow anything to go on between myself and someone to whom I was physically unattractive. I also had the good sense to know the difference between appreciating the attentions of an older man and thinking that I needed to reciprocate or play along.
I will also reaffirm that, like others, for every older gay male friend that I have who is totally harmless (that is, who accept my No for what it is, despite the fact that I know that several of them sleep exclusively with boys who are often younger than I) I have had scores of others who have shamelessly hit on me and proffered thinly veiled invitations for sex wherever I go - the theatre, the mall, the fucking grocery store.
The other common denominator that all of my older gay male friends share is that, regardless of the conditions of our initial meetings, it has been my choice to pursue of a relationship of more substance than a passing familiarity. I have cultivated these friendships because I felt a connection to these men. They weren't old trolls who wouldn't leave me alone.
Dan's absolutely right. Hell, the internet and pride parades are sketchy places to meet people your own age, with whom you have a better chance of fighting off unwelcome advances. The point is not that young gay men should never interact with anyone more than two or three years their senior. The point is that, fair or not, malicious or not, obvious interest of an older man in a younger man is creepy and, at least subliminally, selfish. A 16 year old boy is well-advised to avoid a 40-year-old who sends him text messages all the time and leaves lots of notes on his myspace. It's. Sketchy.
There are two types of men who will disagree with me; dudes who are interested in taking advantage of teens sexually, and dudes who, with no malicious intent, get off on being the wise old daddy and attempt the wedge themselves into lives they would do best to avoid. If a kid wants a "mentor," or even just an older faggot for a friend (I wouldn't consider any of my older friends "mentors"), he'll find one on his own.
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The Mighty Campers depot in Auckland is in the same location as the Britz, Maui and KEA office. It is in Richard Pearse Drive in Mangere, which is about 3.5 km from the Airport and around 19.1 km from the City Centre.
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Microwave yourself some popcorn in this super roomy campervan that sleeps 2. Includes a handy toilet and shower so you've got everything more...Check Availability Vehicle Details
The Behemoth of the Mighty fleet for 4, a crowded inner city apartment on wheels. Its got a loo, shower and superior cooking facilities. more...Check Availability Vehicle Details
We pretty much made a tardis with stack loads of storage. A bed with NASA FOAM" folds out so you can go from night cap to cuddles at the more...Check Availability Vehicle Details
We can't tell you exactly what vehicle but we can say it will comfortably sleep 6 people and will have shower and toilet. more...Check Availability Vehicle Details
Great for those travelling in groups or those that want a bit more room.
This compact Double Down has top and bottom bunks so you can more...
Monday to Sunday: 8:00 - 4:30 PM
Closed 25th December (Christmas Day)
Vehicles must be picked up and collected by 4:00 PM.
Approx Distance from the Airport: 3.5km
Approx Distance from the City Center: 19.1km
Complimentary airport transfer bus between Auckland Airport (both International & Domestic terminals) and our Auckland Branch.
Look out for the bright yellow bus. Transfer bus comes past the airport approximately every 30 minutes.
Please note, our transfer bus also stops at 4 local airport hotels, Grand Chancellor, Holiday Inn, Sudima and Ibis.
International Arrivals:
Exit through door 5 and cross over the first road to the dedicated Bus Stop area by the yellow and black bus stop signs.
Domestic Arrivals
Exit through door 3 or 4. The bus stops directly outside the terminal between doors 3 and 4.