text:
• Pat Hickey: Busy preseason hurt Habs
• Mike Boone: Playoff pre-sale unlikely
• Pierre Ladouceur's weekly report card
• François Gagnon on Randy Cunneyworth
You are here: Home » News » Gomez speaks
• Pat Hickey: Busy preseason hurt Habs
• Mike Boone: Playoff pre-sale unlikely
• Pierre Ladouceur's weekly report card
• François Gagnon on Randy Cunneyworth
" Ducks nearly done"
"Canardly" wait for their leftovers. We could use a few
"It's just an opinion – I could be wrong"
-Dennis Miller
Is that yours? Pretty good if it is..
Don't duck Remi's question.
"The richest Canadian team in terms of ticket revenue was the Montreal Canadiens, just ahead of the Toronto Maple Leafs, at about $2 million of ticket revenue per game"
Come Geoff- pull out your wallet and clean up this Gomez mess.
You can afford it.
We deserve it!
"It's just an opinion – I could be wrong"
-Dennis Miller
no sense in doing it now, but it should be done before next season, hopefully the new cba brings a free buyout period
Assuming that the Canadiens season will be finished in about 2 months, and knowing that a new CBA must be negotiated before next season begins, when do you think the team will next be playing in front of the usual 21,273 fans?
Would you look at that! Steward cleared waivers.
And no one picked him up. All 29 other GMs said no.
What don't they know that all the GM-wannabees here know?
People need to relax about Gomez.
The trade was bad. He's overpaid. We get it!! It's been almost 3 years and people are still bitching.
Looking at his contract structure, it's been pretty obvious all along that we'd be stuck with him until at least the end of this year, barring an unlikely trade. This is more obvious when you consider the new contracts that will be doled out to our RFAs, and the fact that the CBA expires this year.
This season is lost and we don't need the cap space, so demoting him now accomplishes nothing. In all likelihood, he'll be demoted/bought out/traded in the off-season.
But fans need someone to blame and complain about!
"been almost 3 years and people are still bitching."
Because after 3 years of consistently declining (and not just gradual but absolute drop-off-the-face-of-the-scoresheet) play he is still a member of the team getting top minutes every night.
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
RC played him under 10 minutes last game.
10 more than he should have played!!!! Why should we take it easy on him, like Carbo said did we take it easy on Brisebois, or Begin, Dandenault, Latendresse, Ribeiro and many more quebecers who fought every game to earn a spot and got dumped as trash after a few bad games. Gomez hasn't got the talent anymore and that is the bottom line!!!! When you can't compete anymore in the NHL, you get replaced, Gomez should not be an exception!!!! Go Habs
Top minutes?
Sunday's game: 10:28
Saturday's: 13:41
Still averages more than 15 minutes per season.
Nice sample sizes, guys. 😉
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
You make it sound like nothing. We are paying 12% of our salary cap to a player who hasn't scored a goal in more than a calendar year. It is a big deal and should be treated as such. I can't imagine any other franchise refusing to acknowledge such a HUGE and CONTINUING error. Even the Leafs finally said "Oops! We gave Finger how much?" and ate their mistake. The same with the Rangers and Redden. Gomez is not only wasting a huge chuck of the salary cap, but is also taking up the space of some young player who is potentially 1 goal better than he is. It's all great that he's a stand-up guy and all, but in pro sports, unless you're pulling your weight, you must be gone. Everyone has slumps, but an entire year without a goal? Stick a fork in ya, yer done.
Last year when Gomer was hurt for a few games, he was invited on Habs AM radio broadcast as a guest. They asked him a few questions and expected him to leave. He stayed the whole game and gave the most insightful commentary on pro hockey and the Habs that I have ever heard. I was shocked and pleased at his candor. That said, he still needs to realize when his goose is cooked. He has to realize when it's time to put the skates away. That time is now. I've watched him the last few games and if I may say so, he's been awful. When he was on the wing with Pleks at centre, he looked lost and confused and, really, caused mass confusion on that line. Last two games he's moved back to centre and still looks lost. Worst than that, he has no idea what to do when he hasn't got the puck. And for that matter, when he has the puck he gets rid of it ASAP, often to open ice or to an opponent.
I like the guy, I do, but the bleeding has got to stop. If he thinks he can still contribute, then he has to prove it by going to the AHL for conditioning and 1st line minutes. If he can find his way back to the Habs lineup, great. If not, then we back fill the #2 centre position and move on to 2012-13 without Scott Gomez.
Nothing would be written at all if a man waited until he could write it so well that no one could find fault with it.
***Habs Forever***
Once again, I would suggest that those guiding the course of the Habs organization have severely messed up. I think a lot of Habs fans don't hate Gomez the man or Gomez the player but even a lot of middle of the road fans can no longer understand the continued presence and use of Gomez the Hab. The tributes to his personality and strong team commitment would be great and heartfelt interest pieces of journalism were Gomez the Hab making a reasonable contribution to the team but that is not the case. I don't understand all the subtleties of dealing with the situation (trade options, costs, etc.) but what I do know is that an organization that is stating that they stand behind a fine individual would also appear to be hanging him at the same time. Maybe I am wrong.
But I would also like to strongly state that any organization is going to be no better than its fans. Ultimately we do drive revenue and influence media coverage. Everyone wants us reading and buying so while many here think the organization is not listenting, I find that hard to believe. I also think that class starts with us, the fans. A classy fan base leads to a classy city. It puts a cork in the hyena media that doesn't need to dig and sling mud to arouse out interest. It models good behaviour for the organization that we are fans of.
Sitting in Glenn Sather's office:
Scenario 1.
So I'm Gomez and Sather offers my very sharp agent, Ian Pulver, $7.8MM because Sather's an idiot.
"No, no, Glenn, that's too much …really!
I can't accept that because we both know at some point, you'll realize the err of your ways and find some nimrod in Montreal to pick up my contract.
And we all know once I'm there, this silly over-paymet is all the trolls there will focus on. You know how phycho the Habs fans are and I certainly don't want them booing me."
Scenario 2
"What am I a fool? Of course I'll take it!
Yes I know you'll realize Glenn what an idiot you are but you'll find a bigger idiot to pick me up in a sucker trade.
That's fine. If the little trolls focus on my salary, well screw them!
Why should I say no to that kind of money? I'm not stupid.
But there are a million GM's in Montreal who think I am. Their loss!"
anyone who thinks Nashville is not a well run organization should read this
Good article Ali, ty for the post
Boom baby!
Scott Gomez conducts a Sheepish Interview…
Could the fan's at the Bell center be getting fleeced?
Paid like a lion, plays like a lamb.
I'm less interesting in/bothered about Gomez, than I am about the fact that the architect of that monumentally stupid trade is sitting in the GM chair.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
And it's Hail Mary time as far as his tenure in that chair goes too.
In good times he signed Andrei Markov to a 3-year contract and Josh Gorges a 1-year contract.
In disconcerting times he fired an assistant coach 90 minutes before a game.
In troubled times he fired the coach.
In real rough times he acquired Tomas Kaberle.
In desperate times he traded away the other 2010 playoffs hero in middle of a game.
What was Trudeau's most-quoted saying? "Just watch me."
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
Gainey's the GM again?
Gauthier was the head of Pro Scouting. He's the guy who put together and recommended the Gomez trade. Gainey had to pull the trigger of course, but he wouldn't have done that without Gauthier's nod. "Architect" is the right word. Gainey would be the builder.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
Ignoring all the flaws in GOmez's game because he is a nice guy is like going to the club to pick up chicks with bed hair, mustard on your shirt, wearing sweats with a croach tear, with garlic breath, drooling, smelling like curry and expecting a women to accept your invite home because you said please.
Doesn't matter, had sex. LOL
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
So are you saying its a bad thing to do that? IE i should stop?
Boom baby!
I'm amazed at the hatred towards Scott Gomez, especially since he's only played 23 games this year, which if I'm doing the math correctly is less than 50% of the games. Really mind blowing how the blame for one bad season can be put on a guy who hasn't played that often.
even if we forget about last year, going 23 games scoreless when your being paid 7 million is unacceptable.
Boom baby!
Sooooo on the topic of Gomez. The guy tries, maybe too hard – he is not playing with the flow, he is on the ice trying to do too much because of the expectations brought on him by his contract or whatever other reason. Too bad most people just see the contract and forget to see what else the guy brings to the team. Fortunately these people are too far removed from the team anyway to actually entertain the thought that things may be different from what they think. As one poster said before, when Gomez gets an assist, its usually from a goal he crafted – the guy is a playmaker, and he skates well with great speed and he gains the zone. When you see him trying to make something happen out there and he makes a bad play, he's just trying to hard, he needs to keep his game simple and block out the distractions – he needs to focus on what makes him a good player and not try to do more than what he can. Gomez is a good player, he's a winner, and he is going through a bad time – his confidence is shot and he needs a hot streak to get it back. One thing people don't often bring forward is the players he plays with on the wings, we don't have many shooters on this team, we don't have a natural scorer. I think Gomez' numbers suffer because of that.
On another note, this team had 2 strong playoff showings in a row, and now they have a bad season and they are absolute crap? I don't think that's how it works. PG took some risks that did not pay off this offseason and now our PP is crap, which has hurt our scorers' confidence. If we had a decent PP we would be trying to secure a playoff spot. But let the experts differ, they are free to do so 😉
You're making too much sense for this website…
"when Gomez gets an assist, its usually from a goal he crafted "
Yay he's crafted 7 goals this season. Fantastic. Sam Gagner crafted that many last week.
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
Which gives Sam G 11 for the season. Whoopee!
Richard R
Which is 11 more than Gomez. Also has 23 assists, 16 more than Gomez. All this for $5M less per season.
Way to show me, slugger!
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
Gomez: "if it took me not scoring for two years for us to win in Montreal, I'd take it."
If that had been translated by François Gagnon it would be like, Gomez: "Je m'en sacre si je ne compte pas de but pendant deux ans à Montréal."
Then PG promptly trades Gomez 2 days later…oh wait a minute, I'd just found a easy way to trade him for all those who wish it. Quick call Gagnon to do a follow up article!
❝ I can't really hear what Jeremy says, because I've got my two Stanley Cup rings plugging my ears.❞
> Gomez: "if it took me not scoring for two years for us to win in Montreal, I'd take it."
WOW. What a MENSCH! What a tough guy!
Gomez, how about this… be tough in front of the opponent's net. Be tough in the corners. Be unstoppable through the middle. Be tough in deeds not in empty, whining, sacrificial words moron.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
Time to stop piling on our favourite whipping boy
Gomez speaks because somebody asked him to.
What's he supposed to do? Offer "No comment"?
Gomez is over paid because someone offered to do so.
What's he suppposed to do? Give the money back?
Start blaming the system that allows these inflated contracts and the lack of control for the fools who offer them.
Why doesn't the league go for non-guaranteed contracts like NFL in the next CBA?______________________________________________________
"It's just an opinion – I could be wrong"
-Dennis Miller
You think that's something the players would actually go for?
Strange feeling Gomez scores tonight + assist = 2 points. Would love to see the team just have fun and be creative. Moen being showcased, gotta be. Nice to see White get some conditioning games too.
Why stop at 3? I'm feeling a Sam Gagner performance for Gomez tonight! 8 points!
Ryan White scored two goals in his first game back with the 'dogs.
Love that kid!
The Habs are on pace to set a league record for best penalty killing efficiency in a single season… While in 26th place. Unbelievable.
That would be very odd indeed. It is really a big shame the PP has faltered so badly seeing as 5-on-5 scoring is so much better than last year.
if the pp was as effective as last years 7th in the league we would be sitting in a nicer spot in the conference guaranteed.
Boom baby!
It's that damn Price's fault, I tell ya. If he didn't let in so many softies we'd have had the record sewn up by the All Star break.
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
What an unbelievable stat. one whole calendar year WITHOUT a goal for a guy who plays forward, not a stay-at-home defenseman. Seriously, it's absurd. Think about it for a second.
… and you could manage to tolerate it if the guy was making Desharnais money, but after nearly 30 years in the classroom, I have to teach for a full year to get what he makes per game!!!
"… but it's still better than cheering for the Leafs!"
Irrelevant… could you mange to tolerate it he was getting top 6 minutes game in and game out… Oh wait… he already is.
Doesn't matter if you are making $2 million, $5 million or $7 million, if you play 15 minutes+ per game, you're expected to score. The fact that he's paid twice or three times as much only makes it worse.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
What's the buzz in TB these days re: the Bolts?
Anyone care down there?
"It's just an opinion – I could be wrong"
-Dennis Miller
Scott Gomez,your a nice fellow but at this point and time just screw off! You"Hero" killed my team….tanks.If you care Gomer that much then retire cause your bringing us down with you…so do us all a favor and move to Boston.
To lay the blame solely on this guy. To much credit. This team is about corporate greed, hes just a small piece of the real problem.
It took a while, but over the last 20 years or so, with changes of owners, and so forth. This team followed the Harold Ballard of formulas, profit over product. And theyve perfected it.
Unless theres an overall change of mentality, this team will always just be about its history.
… if he really cared he would agree to work for 1/4 his wages and let the team get someone who can score! It's silly to suggest of course because who would turn down those bucks to contribute no more than he is required to do? There is a lot I like about Gomez (except his cockiness) but the salary just negates any value he brings to the team. Sure he's a good team guy. He gets his face rubbed and helmet knocked off more than any other guy on the team because he will get involved in a scrum. No doubt he's good in the dressing room and I'm thinking his teammates value him …. but when Desharnais looks down the bench and sees a guy making 10 times his salary … well, there's got to be a tinge of animosity there.
When Gomez speaks people listen.
Don't know if it's cuz I'm in Columbus, Ohio but H I/O has been hard to post onto over the last two days.
A post either never appears or I get the duplicate comment warning and nothing appears.
Or maybe they're just messin' with me…
Jack Edwards is a clam, Bruins are pukes.
I write everything in MS Word first and copy / paste to HIO for that very reason. I've lost some good material lately.
Nothing would be written at all if a man waited until he could write it so well that no one could find fault with it.
***Habs Forever***
Good idea
Jack Edwards is a clam, Bruins are pukes.
This fortune cookie made a bold prediction regarding tonight's game.
Hab's Movie Star Madness..
Despite their lousy performance many of our hockey heros (cough)
are up for movie roles in the off season.
Erik Cole -True Grit, Lonely Are The Brave
Brian Gionta, David Desharnais- Little Big Men
Randy Cunnyworth -Accidental Tourist
Scott Gomez-"Somebody Up There Likes Me" Mission Impossible"Miracle On Ice".
Pierre Gauthier – "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest". "LOST" Adams Family Jewels, "Fools Rush In"
Mathew Darche – Edward Scissor Hands".
Thomas Kaberle- "Slumber Party, The Invisible Man, Gone With The Wind, The Big Sleep. Missing In Action
Cary Price – "Only The Lonely", "Braveheart" "Home Alone"
Hal Gill – "Wrong Turn" "No Country For Old Men"
Thomas Plekanic – Breaking Away (000).
P.K- "The Good, The Bad, The Ugly" "Blazing Saddles"
Habs's Defence – "At Dawn They Sleep"
Jacques Martin – The Notebook, Friends with Benefits
Bob Gainy, Trevor Timmins -The Usual Suspects.
Jeff Molson-" For a Few Dollars More"
Habs 2012- Les Miserables, Apocalypse Now
+1000 😀
That was awesome! Do you write regularly? I smell talent.
Wow, Gomez says AK is the most popular guy in the room and that Price is the best goalie in the world…Almost sounds like Gomez lost a bet with Gainey and had to say those things?!!
[Disclaimer]: I'm a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.
Considering what Carey has done last year alone, and the fact that Bob Mackenzie has said that he is the front runner for Team Canada #1 (2014) I'd say Gomez knows just a little more than you or I.
When these guys speak, we should listen.
Shane Oliver
http://www.Sholi2000.com Inc.
Custom Sports Figures
Brandon, MB,Canada
Ph- 204 724 8418
I think Gomer has forfeited his right to speak on behalf of the team. His 100% performance failure has simply erased any credibility and respect in the room. He's a cheery boy but cannot do his job.
Until PG can unload him and his salary, the team's improvement capability is badly compromised.
Yeah, you're in the room so you know. pffffffffftttt.
What about speaking his own opinion, which is clearly all he did in this situation?
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
There's still a lot of time, don't discount MA Fleury or Cam Ward who are both well under 30. I'd love for it to be Carey though.
Yeah I know Price is so much superior to Lundqvist, Thomas, Rinne, Schneider, JS Giguere etc, so much so it aint even funny.
[Disclaimer]: I'm a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.
Good Canadian boys that lot, all of them on track for the Olympics. Definitely. Giguere? Really? Good grief.
GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
"Scott Gomez, a potential Hall of Fame player, has two Stanley Cup rings and a Calder Trophy that says 'I'm a player whom any authentic NHL coach will rely on to fix a game problem.'" – VancouverHab
Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81
😆 Man oh Man Speechless Me are!
Shane Oliver
http://www.Sholi2000.com Inc.
Custom Sports Figures
Brandon, MB,Canada
Ph- 204 724 8418
You forgot your valium this morning.
Can anyone tell me how many players the Habs have under contract? Do we even have room for a waiver pickup? (I don't see a point in adding anyone right now, just curious).
i think we're right at the limit of 50 odd contracts, maybe one spot left.
6'3″ 230# young, cheap, pick up Anthony Stewart! The heavyweight giant we need.
He already cleared waivers.
So, the heavyweight giant nobody needed, i guess.
Soft, lazy, no intensity. AHL material. Or, where he is now.
Gomez speaks…yes that he does and he does it better than most. But like a smiley faced, laughing comedian, that happy facade conceals a very embarrassed former 50-60pt. player. I do believe that if he ever had $7M talent he would use it to the max. He's got a lot of heart and pride so don't blame him for Glen Sather and Bob Gainey's stupidity. You all would've signed that contract with a smirk and a little glint in your eye!
We have good defensive prospects but they are all still so young. Ellis is the oldest (8 months older than Beaulieu) and if he gets off to a big start in Hamilton next year just might make the big team later on. 10 of his 12 goals are on the PP so I am thinking he must have a good shot, which is exactly what the team is lacking. He´s also not small and good defensively.
I´m still abot wary of Diaz and his lack of size and am thinking our major holes look like they are going to be depth at D, specifically the third pairing. Gill will be gone and Webber, though versatile, is not a full-time D. If the Habs can shore up these two spots over the summer or with one of the kids they should be all right next year. D is what cost us this year, more than anything. I personally think the forwards are depper than they have been in years.
Tweet from Bob McKenzie:
Anthony Stewart (CAR), Zach Hamill (BOS), Andrew Murray (SJS) all cleared waivers.
I'm pretty surprised that all 3 players cleared waivers.
I thought we should have taken Hamill just to piss off Boston 😉
Who cares what Gomez has to say — and he doesn't really say much, just the same old crap cliches. He should just STFU and play the game. And do something that impacts the game once in a while. You don't have to score to do that, you could win an important faceoff, kill a penalty, set someone else up for a goal, backcheck like a demon, get into a fight, or God forbid — hit someone and take the puck away from them.
I get an impression that you… umm… don't like Gomez?
Yes, but if he says nothing he would get attacked for hiding, shirking etc.
It is a no win scenario.
"Et le but!"
It's too bad Gomez and Gionta didn't get to re-develop the chemistry they had when playing in New Jersey.
Don't let the wultures getcha.
I think it's more so too bad that they didn't re-develop the chemistry they had, as they had ample opportunity to do so when they first got here.
That being said, it might be worth a shot to re-unite them when Gionta is back later this season/next season. Perhaps without JM's 'System' handcuffing them, they may be able to bring more of an offensive spark together.
Can we just extend Ak46 now for 3 years (his prime) at the same salary?
Doubt he would take that, he said he would take less than the Market value to stay in MTL, I think he could get 4 years at 4-4.5M July 1st. I think if we could sign him to a 3 year deal at 3.75, that would be amazing.
Is AK better or worse than Grabovski…he wants 4 yrs at 5 m
i hate to say it but grabs has better production. ak should get 4 mill max
I think they should sign AK – give him 4yrs for 4m. He's part of the solution here, not part of the problem.
"Of course I'm crazy, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong."
– Robert Anton Wilson
Seems like Gomez could have a promising career in politics. Its all well and nice to say that you are more troubled by the teams position in the standings than your personal stat line, but what about when your personal stat line is a HUGE reason the team is so low in the standings?
Lets not beat around here, if Gomez was on pace for 50-55 points, not unreasonable, rather than his putrid current pace, that could mean 2 spots higher in the standings right there easy. Not only does he not contribute offensively, but he brings down every winger we put on his line. At least with Darche, another player I think the habs should jettison, he's not going to cost you. He wont produce anything for you, but at least he'll backcheck like a bat out of hell, and help out defensively.
When I start hearing that "Gomez was at practice an hour early" or "gomez stayed at practice for 2 hours longer working on his game" consistently, than maybe ill start to buy in to what hes selling a little bit. This guy has to shoulder a huge part of the blame for the habs troubles this year, and until he personally accepts that, his words carry no weight with me. When a teams biggest salary isnt even close to pulling his weight, it just brings the whole team down. No ones game just dies like that. He got the big payday and got sloppy, but even with the rangers he still put up 70 points and 58 points. There's no excuse for it other than he just doesnt work hard enough.
You must know better than the players! Tell us more!
Honestly, what player is publically going to throw another one under the bus (other than cammy)? Seriously. I mean, obviously what i am saying is my opinion, but if you had a guy committed to improving his game, you figure he would be putting in the extra effort every single day.
People are so naive its incredible. Gomez says the room is strong so everyone believes him. Could you imagine if he didnt say that? It would EXPLODE. Gomez definitely has a good grasp for the montreal media, and always says the politically correct thing. A lot of NHL players even say that airing out dirty laundry in the media is something you just dont do. When you watch the games, does this look like a cohesive unit? Do they look like a group of guys who are united and always pulling for each other? You had Cammy calling the team losers, you have Weber publically saying hes better than other guys who are getting playing time, you have PK and Pleks fighting in practice…
Do you know why organizations and celebrities pay huge money for Public Relations specialists and publicists? To tell them what to say, and how to spin things. There wouldnt be publicists if everyone just spoke honestly to the media lol
A blogger posted this brief Q&A he had with Tinordi recently when the London team came through Mississauga.
Burlington, I was just reading through the the comments and found out that your not living in Montreal has relegated your opinion as false.
But I'm from Savannah, GA, so therefore my opinion is also false.
But if I view your opinion as void, when in fact my view is void for the same reason, does that re-establish your credibility? Like some sort of double negative?
Or have we entered some time-space paradox?
I don't know, have to admit I had to reread your post a couple times and write down all the voids so I could try and apply algebra to it. Then I remembered my algebra is long gone.
What I can say is I visited your fair city once about 20 years ago and had a great time from what I remember. The bars were serving these ice machine vodka and tequila drinks, they did quite a number on me. Did manage to avoid falling in the water across the street though.
CHeers to you Sheehy!
We are a very alcoholic city. Something to be proud of.
And then ashamed of. But then we drink some more and back to proud. Followed by sleepy.
No rink = no opinion.
It's like saying we live inside so we shouldn't have an opinion of the weather.
I just had an image of one guy in line at the bank saying "nice day out" and instantly being violently rebuked, "YOU SHUT YOUR MOUTH YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT!!"
Interesting that Gomez says that Kostitsyn is probably the most popular guy in the room.* And still it seems likely that a guy who is that popular, who is a consistent 20+ goal scorer, who says he'll give a discount to stay here, who brings so much-needed physicality, and who couldn't be replaced for less, is on the trade block. If Kostitsyn gets traded it's further proof management are just plain out of whack. Not like we need it… the proof is already there.
(*Of course he also says Price is the best goaltender in the world… so his judgement, like his shooting, may not be bang on.)
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
He probably should of said Price is 2nd best with Halak being the best. That would have given him more street cred with the fans! 🙂
AK seems to communicate more, and with JM and Sergei gone, maybe he can finally come out of his shell??
Who the Eff knows… Just keep this guy, he's a good player.
all depends on how much Kostitsyn and his agent feel he is worth on the open market. Also, I wouldn't put too much stock in when an athlete says he'll take a discount to stay. What do you expect him to say, "I am going to take the team to the cleaners". At under 4 milion a year for 2-3 years, I would sign him. If he's looking for 5 miliion on a long term deal, I say trade him at the deadline.
He could have made no comments on his future contract.
Kostitsyn has the contacts …
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
I agree about AK. You got it bang on, why trade a 20-25 goal scorer only to have to overpay another 20-25 goal scorer? Lol Plus, IMO, if the team was actually rolling, I think kostitsyn would be a 30 goal scorer. He's the type of guy that if the team is playing well, hell play well.
As for Price, I have to disagree with you on that one. Put Carey Price on Boston or Detroit and he wins the Vezina, no two ways about it. There is no doubt in my mind that if Carey Price was bostons starting goalie last season, they would have still won the cup with him between the pipes. Sure, Price lets in the odd bad goal, but so does TIm Thomas, his team is just capable of winning games when hes not at his best. Unfortunately, the habs arent. Try going into a game knowing that if you let in more than 2, your team is probably losing. Thats WAY too much pressure to put on a guy in his early 20's, just like expecting PK to be our number one defenseman is too much to expect from someone of his age.
The last time this guy played top minutes and was on the 1st PP unit he had 26g and 27a in 78 games. They need to find him the minutes and leave him with a center he trusts that knows how he plays. If he's in the game, playing big minutes – this guy is a game-changer.
Keep Him!
It's also proof we fans don't know what we're talking about when most people said AK was lazy, etc. 😉
Pretty revealing interview . Gomez is all class . Sounds like he would be a nice fit in any room. Though i am sure even he feels burdened by the contract.
Gomez IS all class when he speaks – he's very articulate and knows what to say.
But when he plays he's all Gomer. A "classy" player ON THE ICE does what it takes for his teammates. And I'm sorry but that's not fetching pucks after a win – that's hitting, driving to the net, taking abuse and paying the price to score.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
He drove to the net and took the abuse during the Plekanec goal last game no?
❝ I can't really hear what Jeremy says, because I've got my two Stanley Cup rings plugging my ears.❞
Apparently that doesn't count because it doesn't jibe with SDs opinion of him. I knew he'd go to town thanks to that stupid interview.
Apologies in advance, but I hate when people like you come out with ONE recent example. Give me 10 examples, and maybe a statement like that will carry some weight. Cause Gomez goes to the net ONE TIME all the times he doesnt do it are forgiven? What a joke.
Don't be upset just because Gomez actually tries hard.
He does not have the physique nor is the type of player to be a imaginary Tomas Holmstrom in some people's mind. He's historically a player maker so the very few times he does go to the net and got cross checked are just bonuses.
❝ I can't really hear what Jeremy says, because I've got my two Stanley Cup rings plugging my ears.❞
Moen practices with a no-contact jersey. Only 19 forwards on the ice.
Why do I sense an 8 defenceman and 10 forward lineup coming tonight?
They play Malkin and that guy is a scoring machine, each line will now have a defenceman to counter the Guins.
dont give the coaches any ideas!!
Maybe HardHabits is behind the bench tonight to lead the "tankers" team. Kindof a coup.
I think this team will try with all its might, but the apple cart seems long toppled and the results will continue on along the same path we have seen all season.
Would be encouraging though to watch White and Markov in the lineup and get a glimpse of how different our current roster could be before making drastic changes this summer.
If Gomez had a more reasonable contract, I don't think anyone would care as much about his lack of goal scoring. Also, Gomez was never really a goal scorer. Throughout his career he would get 10-15 a season (aside from one exceptional 33 goal season). I'm not sure where the expectations of him to be a goal scorer even came from.
Although I think, as is evidenced by the interview, he's a hard working, team first kind of guy who can skate well and make some unbelievable passes at times, he should never have been offered more than 4-5 million per season.
However, it is what it is now, and the good news is that the only cancer he brings to the team is through his contract, as its obvious his teammates like him and, although he makes his fair share of mistakes (which are all the more obvious due to the constant attention on him) he puts his best effort on the ice in every game he plays.
Even recognizing that he's not a goal scorer, it is obvious his point production isn't where it has been throughout his career. That being said, I really hope he starts to rack up the points, as he can be a strong contributor to this club both now and in the future.
if Gomez had a reasonable contract…….
Sather would have kept him
I really wish I could hear the conversation between him and Gainey.
Well, that was the risk to take with Gomez. Has it paid off yet? Well, it's certainly obvious there are players who WANT to play with him, so that's an absolute plus.
On a related note, I think there is a lot more at play than the amount of taxes you have to pay when it comes to signing here as a free agent. As is evidenced by Gomez's (and other players) comments, the guys in the room around you are EXTREMELY important when it comes to playing day in and day out in this league. If anything, it seems as though Gomez has a positive impact on keeping this team together and upbeat in the locker room. Is that worth 7 million per year? No. Is anything he can do worth 7 million per year? Most likely not. My point? Get over the contract. As stated in my initial post, he probably shouldn't have been offered that much, but it is what it is. If he is productive and helps this team win, who cares? Let management worry about the dollar figures, and let the owner worry about management.
Oh I totally agree with you about the goal scoring bit. Gomez is not a scorer, no two ways about that, but he doesnt exactly generate much offense or look like a threat when hes on the ice. If Gomez put up 60 assists and zero goals, I would have no problem with that. He's just not putting up assists either.
With his current production, his cap hit would have to be $4 million or less to even be somewhat palatable.
Truth of the matter is, people can talk about demotion all they want, but the habs have no one to replace him with, and no need for the cap space at the moment. We just need him to play better. Thats the truth of the matter. I dont think (or at least I hope) that anyone here wants gomez to fail. If Gomez was playing better, this team as a whole would be better. I definitely dont think anyone can dispute that.
I think it's also a case of him feeling pressure to perform up to the level of his contract (which, as I stated in an earlier post, probably isn't even possible), and he's just trying too hard to do too much, instead of keeping his game simple. When he does get an assist though, the goal is pretty much crafted by him, and that's what everyone definitely wants to see more of.
How about Ryan White's first game with the Dogs and he nets 2 goals. Way to go kid.
Charge it to the Underhill's.
Can we call him up now and get him in the game tonight?
he would make it there on time!!!
"If it took me not scoring for two years for us to win in Montreal, I'd take it."
So he's retiring? Thanks, buddy.
i hope the habs grab anthony stewart, more grit never hurts espicially at the pricetag he has. Blunden has a knee injury so he would fit in perfectly with Moen and White.
Would St. Louis part ways with his brother as well? Gritty and can score. Not sure why he isn't working in St. Louis.
Dear Mtl Canadiens,
Please beat Boston to tie the season series. You are about to cost me three bottles of rum in a little over a year.
I dont think he's not working, its just that no one on st louis has flashy offensive numbers. They play a real team game, and are defense first. Not one player on st louis is lighting it up. Their leading scorer has 37 pts in 51 games, than 32, 25, 24, 24, 23, and than Stewart with 20 pts.
I guess thats an extremely low point total for him, but the team is winning, so i guess they dont really care. That being said, I would love for the habs to swing a deal for him.
He has cleared waivers. Just saw it on twitter via Big Head McKenzie
Hsn't been able to stick in the NHL his entire career and is lazy. Thats the biggest knock on him. Hockey sense sucks too. SIGN HIM UP!!
Gomez! Great article above. Gomez and the team are tight as mates. We as fans never get to know the players as they really fit in the room. How surprised most fans would be, to know that A.K. is one of the most popular team mates in the room.?
Just a bum year from training camp to now!!!
Don't know about you Ian, but I'd rather they were all a bunch of assholes winning the cup. That's just me though.
Worked well for Boston!
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Aww… he's good. He's real good.
Love the sap stories. I almost like Gomer again.
he's such a good guy, he's so witty and nice. let's extend his contract!
Let's not forget, we got Gomez to replace Koivu.
Richard R
Didn't Gomez replace Koivu AND Kovalev?
In dollar terms.
"Et le but!"
People seem to forget that he's a playmaker not a sniper ! Yes one season he got 33 goals but that was it he never hit 20 goals ever again after that one season. People need to stop acting like he's soupposed to be our top goal scorer cause he's not hes a playmkaer and yes no goals in a year is terrible for 7 million dollars but honestly people stop acting like hes a great scorer because he really isn't
Even the most proficient playmakers score a goal now and again…
Suppose we are agree that he is paid to be a playmaker, he hasn't even done a good job at that! It's like bitching that Kaberle sucks on the PK, even though that's not his role. His role was to reignite the PP. How has that turned out?
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Spot on. Posted pretty much the same thing before seeing your post. Even excluding the fact he hasn't had the best production the past couple of years, I really don't know where the expectation for him to be a goal scorer even came from.
You make a good point about the value of stats in hockey. The sample sizes are small, especially when it comes to special teams. and yes , stats can be "manipulated" to one`s advantage, or to make a point.
Case in point, before Sunday`s game Gomez power play effectiveness was one goal scored by his team in 60 minutes of PP duty. By virtue of his having been on the ice for a powerplay goal Sunday his record is now 1 goal per 30 minutes- still terrible, but only 2 team powerplay goals away from being right near the team average.
Then again does anyone really believe that our PP would be worse if anyone (including the zamboni driver) would have been used in the place of Gomez?
When it ccmes to even strength statistics the sample sizes are much larger, approximately 10 times as large.
If we look strictly at 5 on 5 perfomance and analyze the numbe rof minutes of ice time per offensive goal scored we can get a pretty good pictrure of who is contributing and who is not.
Here is the list in order of the canadiens players seperated by forwards and defence in order from worst to best.. The number provided is minutes of ice time (even strength) per team goals scored p (the lower the better)
Weber ….27
Diaz … 27
kaberle … 26
Emelin …26
Gill … 26
Campoli . 20
Georges 20
Subban 20
Nokia 52
Darche 40
Blunden 38
Leblanc 28
Bourque 26
Moen 25
Plekanec 24
Gomez 23
AndreK 23
Eller 23
Gionta 22
MaxPac 19
Cole 19
Desharn 18
All this to say that numbers and stats are useful but must be taken in context.
Steve O.
more evidence that Kaberlame is lame. like i posted below, they only reason his stats look ok is because an unusually large proportion of his ice time is on the PP.
spoken like a true champion, one of the greatest this game has ever seen
I support Scott Gomez
Gomez! Great article
Seriously folks- The Montreal Canadiens would have already traded Scott Gomez if Gomez's contract was in the 2-3 million dollar range. This is the only reason why he is still here with the club. He is 33 years old and will not be picked up by anyone else after his contract expires in Montreal. He will never be the same player again and will be 35+ when he is done with Montreal.
HABS fan since '68
Someone will pick him up MUCH cheaper after his contract due to his rings/experience. He'll play 1 or 2 more seasons once the albatross expires. He'll probably go to Detroit or Philly or Pitts and win another Cup playing 3rd line centre
"Trust me, I want to score as much as anyone. But I'm dead serious about this – if it took me not scoring for two years for us to win in Montreal, I'd take it." – Scott Gomez
that's a pretty stupid thing to say. I realize he's only played 23 games this year, but if he had maybe 20 points instead of 7, and half of those points were goals, we would probably have won a few of the games we'd lost and we might not be as terrible. the lesson here: hockey players say stupid things.
He's saying the teams woes are more troubling to him than his goal drought. Nothing stupid about that. A bit cliche maybe, but I believe he's genuine in that statement.
yeah, but the reality is that we need him scoring and creating goals in order to be winning. since he isn't doing that, saying those cliches means nothing.
I think what he means is if the magic genie gave him a choice he'd take the team winning.
Alternately he might have meant that if he has to be scoring in Hamilton of Phoenix for the Habs to win, so be it.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
What he's saying is quite simple, he'd rather win than have personal glory, what's so stupid about that? Or is it that you're too stupid to understand that?
So it would have been better for him to say "I don't care about the team's record, as long as I score a bunch of goals"?
Yeah, of course, that would have been way smarter.
Yeah, I kinda laughed at that too.
Not the smartest comment, despite his intention being good (I would sacrifice personal glory for the good of the team), it was pretty clumsy.
He hasn't scored for a year, and the team is not doing well. Therefore…
Yeah, I hear ya. 🙂
—Hope Springs Eternal—
Huh? It is not in the least bit stupid. He is saying he places the team's success ahead of a personal stat. Every player should have that attitude. How many times do we criticize players for not putting team first?
Sure scoring more goals would help the team, but it is not an absolute. If he goes out and totally ignores defense and doesn't pass to his linemates, maybe he pots a couple. Of course if you let in more as a result and pissed off your teammates what have you accomplished?
"Et le but!"
The essence of what he's saying is correct, and there is nothing stupid about it. Of course no one wants to hear about not scoring for 2 years since not scoring for 1 year is already pretty bad with his contract.
But people were saying Cammalleri tends to be a selfish player since he's a sniper, and that is the opposite of what Gomez is trying to do for his teammates.
Imagine if Gomez cared so much about scoring that he started hogging the puck or doing end-to-end rushes trying to score. That would be pretty bad.
can someone explain the details of re-entry waivers and would this work in the gomez situation..iam thinking about the summer time. nothing will happen between now and the end of the year…unless he is traded at the deadline.
If you assign someone to regular waivers, any team can claim them at full salary and if no one does they got to the AHL. Then you can recall the player on re-entry waivers and any team can claim him and only has to pay half his salary and only half his cap-hit is counted on their teams salary cap (in gomez's case, around 3.5 million cap hit). the remaining salary is paid by the original team and the other half of the players cap hit still counts on the original teams salary cap, so with a player like Gomez it is not likely the route teh Habs would take, nor would I. Either banish him in the minors, or ride out the contract.
habs end up paying 1/2 his salary sounds okay by me… its messy.
that's the problem. he's worth a 3.5 cap hit and a 2.5m to 3m salary per year. someone will pick him up on reentry waivers and we'll get the shaft.
Scott Gomez is a master manipulator of the local media. His use of the passion card and eagerness to praise sacred cows such Carey Price are carefully calculated tactics designed to win friends and influence people. The description of Price as the "best goaltender in the world" and "one of the greatest teammates I've ever had" made me want to projectile vomit over the PC. Dave Stubbs, a decent human being and top writer, should steer clear in future of giving column inches to a player who insults the Canadiens every time he pulls on the jersey.
Did you have your coffee this morning?
Stubbs is a top writer, but only a 'decent' human being? Source?
Are you serious?
Yes because the media and fans have taken it easy on Gomez from day one. He's got the hearts of everyone the World around.
reply to your post below about what kind of d-man the Habs needed when they acquired Kaberle
Tom, actually we needed both –
a shooter, because Subban was shooting wide or directly into a defenceman's pads,
and a quarterback, because no one, including Subban, was making good decisions with the puck at the point.
no one in the city is a bigger supporter of Subban than I am.
but he just never picked up his game on the PP all season long
We all remember that interview with Gomez's agent. Master manipulation at its finest. Perhaps they went to the same PR courses.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Your post is far less masterful in attempting to manipulate the sentiments of posters on this site.
I have no problem with what Gomez says, and have to take it at face value. Do you have any information that might lead anyone (including yourself) to believe that what he said was meant with anything other than sincerity?
It's a very sad situation when people create preconceived notions about others based on biased observations, and then continue to 'reinforce' those notions with increasingly biased observations, until you have someone wanting to vomit onto their computer when a player claims to be happy in Montreal.
Sad, sad, sad.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
Too much cynicism. Why would we not believe what he has to say? By all accounts, he is a good teammate and what he said in the interview tends to agree with that view.
He's not an actor or reality TV show "celebrity" or a politician.
I was horrified when the Habs acquired Gomez, so I am in no way apologizing for his performance but while I agree that he does have a refined sense of what needs to be said I don't think he is manipulating. I think he is sincere. If he were just mouthing this stuff and was a lazy insincere presence in the dressing room then we would hear about it. Not because I think we have a pipeline to accurate rumours of what is going on inside the team but because of this simple fact:
Scott Gomez is so wildly underperforming below all reasonable expectations that any teammate who didn't think he was trying his hardest, even a teammate who just didn't like Gomez personally, or his sense of humour or his haircut or his taste in music would have complete license to deride the guy off the record all over the place. No one would blame anyone for talking smack about a $7.3M, near zero production player. The fact that the world is not echoing with the cacophony of anonymous teammates dumping on the Gomer is proof enough that he is respected by his teammates.
I was not paying particularly close attention but I heard a ton a rumours in their last couple of months with the team about guys like Cammy, Lapierre, Souray, Komisarek thinking they were better than their place on the team indicated and being none too popular as a result. You hear a ton of rumours about PK rubbing guys the wrong way (in Plekanec's case, in the face). But i consistently hear guys like Eller single out Gomez as a veteran presence who is always engaged with the kids.
So yes, please get out of this contract mess as soon as possible, but the personal attacks on the guy are unwarranted.
"Et le but!"
Kaberle has 13 points in 21 games and is a plus 2, those numbers look good to me.
How does the habs record look? The PP that he was supposed to fix?
Personal stats are meaningless.
Yeah but that's managements' fault. Not Kaberle's. They thought they needed a Markov, but they really needed a Bergeron, Souray or Wisniewski.
BS. The man makes top dollars to do a job he isn't doing. What exactly is Kaberle's role on this team, other than "yet another" 5th d-man?
What good are his passes if the players he sends them to don't put them in the net?
Yeah, you have a point, avatar.
He should have come here and set up a Powerplay clinic, in which he cracked out his powerpoint display and educated the team and the management on how to run an efficient powerplay, and how to take the best advantage of the setup passes he makes.
He also should have handed out copies of his book on how to actually move around inside the o-zone instead of standing still like pinball bumpers.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
Maybe he can try shooting once and awhile? He doesn't even pass. He just floats around and wastes time. In fact he does this in his own zone as well – takes 30 seconds to do what another D man does in 5.
Money well spent.
Question: in a PP, is the quarterback supposed to be the one bringing the puck into the zone? Or is it oftentimes someone else who does and it's supposed to end up back to Kaberle? Because from what I've seen, the PP is really bad because they can't get set up so I don't it's that Kaberle is bad at his role. They just need to get setup as a 5-man unit.
He has been on the ice for 11 goals against…spacek has been on the ice for 2 goals against. PP points 5- Kabby 2 – Spacek. 5 on 5 scoring wasn't the problem
I posted something simlar last week. Only in Montreal could a player put up a 50 point scoring pace as a Dman and be a plus 2 and fans would act like he would be better off in the ECHL.
Irrational hatred is a trademark of the Internet.
How bout this: No more public salary details. If no one knew, we couldn't complain about it (although we would find something else to complain about…)
You know, I wonder if fans of the Red Army Team circa early 70's ever complained about players, did anyone know what their contract status was? 🙂
It's ridiculous. These are athletes, not public servants. Why should they need to share their finances with the media et al? We spend our hard earned money for lots of things and I'm sure lots of people are overpaid considering their 'output', we need to all look beyond the numbers and stop pretending to be GM's, it's obviously harder than it looks from our sofas
They were in the army playing hockey.They were all treated the same .That's why they wanted to come here.
Every press release from the organization whenever they sign someone includes the following phrase:
"As per club policy, financial terms of the agreement were not disclosed."
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Morning fellow Postoholics,
Here's a question to all you Anti-Gomez types:
Let's say we got rid of Gomez's contract. Let's say he just disappeared, and we had all that space to fill.
Who could we possibly get? Where, in the past season or so, have we come up short with money when in the hunt for a Free Agent?
I know this is merely speculation, because we can never know for sure what makes or breaks a deal, but seeing as how the Anti-Gomer crowd deal in a world that isn't quite rationally-oriented, I'm sure this will be a simple question.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
Gaborik is the only elite player that could have potentially been acquired without money tied up in Gomez.
Yeah and he would have a drop in production cause of our system, gotten hurt and booed out of the BC. Awesome.
How about an inanimate carbon rod:
Wouldn't the bigger question really be, What would you do with your old Gomez Jersey? Frame it? Craigs List? Donate to Charity? turn into rag for around the house? bring to cottage keep near outhouse? or perhaps just keep it in the closet with all the rest of Habs jerseys one acquires over a lifetime.
There's always something like this :
My 1 year old has a Gomez t-shirt, we are just going to let him out grow it, bury it in the neighbour's back yard, photo shop the pics to a number 81 and never speak of the Gomez T-shirt again. (He was actually booed by Habs fans at a restaurant last week while wearing it, harsh, but a good lesson I think.)
Anybody who boos a 1-year old, never mind their own team, is an asshat and a complete waste of oxygen.
Wear it downtown, and strut.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
If anything his contract and cap hit ensures he gets ice time right now, and that's not helping the team much.
I'll add to moving forward into next season, it opens up alot more possibility going into free agency and trade partners to have some cap space.
The converse is – let's say we spent that money on someone else, is there any way they could be worse than Gomez?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
He's not that bad.
He doesn't deserve his contract, but he's not that bad.
He's better this season than he was last.
Not so many Passes To Nobody.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
UFA's want to play in big markets and want a chance at a cup. They also want to play with great players. Like Hossa.The Rangers get first crack for the city and a chance for outside money. Detroit isn't going to pay the same money but have a chance every year. They have a great organization have a great owner.Then they look at living conditions like LA.According to an article I read the Habs are in the bottom 3rd. Montreal never had a chance for Gaborik or Richards.
In defense to Gomez> he was given this contract by the Rangers, played in a very conservative system, he is not the only high priced player that struggled in montreal, (Turgeon, Roy, etc) and its evident he has lost his confidence. What does he bring> great skater, excellent puck carrier, good passer, and a good player overall. Not all is fault………….
Right….2 stanley cups and Roy struggled……..if it wasn't for Tremblay and those other idiots we would have had 1 or 2 more cups…..all thanks to Roy….struggle my a$$
montreal has 6 to 7 cup winners or there roster as we speak………..cups and a struggling player have no relevance.
How did Turgeon "struggle" in Montreal. The guy was a point per game player! He scored 96 points in his only full season with the team. When was the last time a player scored 90+ points on this team?
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
With Scott Gomez struggles as a Hab, why doesn't he approach team management and ask for a huge pay cut?
Ever go to your boss and tell them you deserve less money?
I hate this arguement. It's not his fault he got that contract. Same with the stupid people who say "he should give half his salary to charity". He got the money, its not his fault. His play is his fault. but not his salary. its our GM's fault for acquiring him, and its our owners fault for not dumping his ass in the minors. he deserves ever nickle.
Article 11.10 of the NHL CBA does not allow for the renegotiation of contracts:
11.10 No Renegotiation. In no event shall a Club and a Player negotiate a change in any terms of a Player SPC for the then-current season or for any remaining season of an SPC. This provision shall not prohibit a Player and Club from negotiating an extension to an existing SPC
If you believe that Scott Gomez not being demoted to Hamilton is stopping this team from winning you have a misunderstanding regarding what is stopping this team from being successful.
It has one player. One. Who can eliminate traffic in front of Carey Price. If you swap out a Rafael Diaz for a Brad Stuart and/or swap out a Chris Campoli for a Jeff Schultz type I believe this team is well over .500 and very likely competing with Boston for 1st place in the division.
Their undoing has been an inability to hold leads. Even going back five years, this team gives up too many goals from the dirty areas around its own net.
The inability to score goals hurts a ton. But Scott Gomez, playing behind Plekanec, Eller and Desharnais isn't a reason this team hasn't been successful this season.
I still say lack of PP scoring is more of an issue than the D or center situation.
The powerplay scoring is an issue yes. But this team has greatly improved in even strength scoring over the last 18 months and had they been able to hold leads this season, it wouldn't have been a requirement.
Goals against just are not that bad for the Habs, they were above average in the League last I checked.
Sur you can say they can't hold a league, but with some more scoring on the PP those leads might have been extended.
It's a great thing that even strenght scoring imprived, it was a weakness in the last season.
Even strength scoring. As in, goals for. The lack of physical ability on defense is contributing to more goals against. And at bad times.
But MTL is 12th in the league for goals against, so clearly it's not that much of a weakness, sure it could be improved, and a D that could effectively protect Price would help, I agree.
But, the main thing keeping the Habs down this season is the PP, MTL has the 4th most PP opportunity in the league, and the worst record for the PP.
the improved even strength scoring doesn't help when you have the last PP in the league when you used to be in the top 5.
I agree we need to switch up some of our D. I am not a Kabby, Campoli fan. Put a healthy Markov on this roster and we wouldn't have either of thee guys and we would not have lost so many games. I also don't think our PP would be last in the league with him either
now the most interesting thing of the season will be watching the trade deadline and the off season to see what happens
Have a look at the Rangers goals for and against. Their D is doing the job this season.
Totally agree with Shiram, the habs biggest issue is the futility of the powerplay. Not only are you not scoring, but you are basically telling the other team they can do whatever they want (hook, hold, hack, slash) because you arent going to make them pay for it on the scoreboard.
The issues on defense would be the second biggest issue to me. We have too many small, offensive minded D-men. Hal Gill doesnt count because although big, he isnt tough at all. Just look at last weeks loss to buffalo, Hal Gill couldn't clear Paul Gaustad of the front of the net, or even sufficiently tie him up, and thats game over right there.
but we got Kaberle? i'm confused. That was supposed to fix it!
The main issue is our Powerplay.
HFS72 posted a great breakdown of our powerplay, and how, if it was even slightly better, it would lead to wins rather than losses.
We have the 4th most powerplay advantages in the league, and the worst Powerplay. That is freakin' painful.
We wouldn't be worried about clearing bodies from in front of the net if we were able to score more often.
And I agree with you, it's the more unimaginative posters on this site that cite Gomez as the main reason we're not doing well. Even if we get rid of his salary, who are we going to spend that money on? Please.
—Hope Springs Eternal—
I heard that McDonagh kid is good clearing the puck in front of the net. He's +20 to boot.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
lol! don't you know he was a bust?!?!
I agree, a stay at home defenseman would help, the problem is scoring depth. You don't win with one scoring line. Gomez could pay for a first line forward (you forget, taking him allowed the Rangers the cap space to sign Gaborik, its the whole picture view you need).
Also Jeff Shultz isn't even good enough not to be a healthy scratch in washington, wouldn't touch him. His skating is brutal and not suited for the "new" NHL. But you're right we need someone to fill the role of stay at home.
So do you think this big defenceman could be available for a cap hit of – say – $7M or less?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
The money was available to sign these kinds of defensemen even with Gomez's salary on the roster.
Acquiring these kinds of players via trade also isn't very difficult.
This is my point. Gomez, and his salary in no way impede Pierre Gauthier from acquiring the kind of defensemen who can make this team tougher to play against and capable of holding leads.
Robyn Regehr for Chris Butler and a 2nd round pick.
Steve Staios for what? A 3rd round pick?
Brad Stuart signed for $3.75 million
Douglas Murray makes $2.5 million annually.
And WHITE just punched his 2nd one in just now!!
Awesome, is there a stream? I was thinking of playing hookey and going to game, but decided to make some money at work instead. you at the game?
At the game right now. Good energy here 🙂
Good for you Hig, there must be lots of kids screaming!
Yeah I'd say he's "conditioned"
The real interview by Gomer………
we don't want to win games. We don't want to make it interesting, at most. There's no pride in this room. To be in the playoffs in Montreal, especially for the guys who have not experienced it here, is not mind-boggling. To not be in this city during the playoffs is believable……….
Well, what about those no name gritty Maple Laffs folks???? They play hard and keep winning and winning, while our so called "skilled" team keeps losing and losing.
Tank I say! Tank!
"We will win the Cup one day only with ? in the nets "
WHITE scores his first, unassissted just now 🙂
He's back baby, and he's throwing the body around.
Ahh Gomez, isn't there enough ink spilled in your name already? I guess not.
I agree on one thing with him, I'd rather the team win than Gomez getting a goal.
In Japan there is the expression "Hurry Up And Wait".
It refers to running almost on the spot to cover short distances, in order to make your customer feel important.
You will often see office personnel running like this in the office. At shops, a clerk will not walk 4 steps to get your item, they will do this rapid shuffling, which gives the impression of effort. Geishas also do this, running in their wooden shoes to their appointments, even though walking would be just as fast.
The point is to always be in frantic motion.
Scott Gomez, in short.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
@HH and all the other idiots who claim "Management doesn't care because we sell out every game"
I am getting tired of the "Management only wants money" theme. We are turning into leafs nation.
Guess what, you are probably 100% right. All they want is money. You know why? Because it is a business.
However, I bet management would love to have a quality product on the ice (since they are spending the money anyway). Better hockey produces a better chance at playoffs. Playoffs are a pure cash grab. Players don't get regular paychecks, fans shell out boat loads of cash, Molson Canadian sales at bars increase…. T
he Habs spend to the ceiling already and they have like 5 head coaches still getting paid. The money is being spent, they just haven't spent it wisely!
Seriously, give your head a shake HH. Management wants to see the team win. Maybe because they like winning and have some sentiment to the team… but for sure because it means more money for them at the end of the day.
Anyone who believes the Canadiens are a mediocore team because management is content that it makes money is an idiot. There is way more money to be made by going to the playoffs and going deep. Way more! A deep playoff run can take teams from the verge of bankruptcy and into the black (i.e Penguins)
Now, I imagine, since I have called you an idiot a poop storm is about to come my way. Bring it.
I partially agree with what you're saying. It would make much more sense to accuse teams like Phoenix, Nasvhille, Florida, Tampa Bay and Anaheim of sacrificing future development for cash grabs. Since they often overpay for players via trade to pursue playoff games that net them much more cash.
lol, you're kidding right? Phoenix and Nashville are two of the best run teams in the NHL. Who have they sacrificed recently for short cash grabs? Mike Fisher wasn't a rental, and he's been a good player for them. To be able to afford to keep their core of Suter, Weber and Rinne they gave away a good young player in Franson so that they could unload Lombardi's contract to Toronto (even Toronto was shocked that Lombardi was healthy to start the year).
As for phoenix, given their budget and operating environment, what Maloney and Tippett have done there is nothing short of remarkable.
Florida has been turned around in one season by Tallon after being ruined by JM and his successor.
Tampa Bay hasn't made the panic moves the Habs made this year despite their struggles just to make the playoffs. Yzerman is thinking long-term by not trading and commiting cap space to get a short -term fix in goal.
Tampa didn't make a panic move by trading for Dwayne Roloson? They didn't by trading a prospect and pick for Eric Brewer?
Nashville, if you recall, traded Kimmo Timonen AND Scott Hartnell for Peter Forsberg. Who played somewhere around thirty games for them.
They traded Matthew Lombardi and Cody Franson for what? To free up cap space because they couldn't afford Pekka Rinne, Shea Weber and Ryan Suter. And they traded those players around 8 months too early.
The former Atlanta Thrashers franchise gave up Braydon Coburn for two playoff games.
These teams operate for cash, not to win Championships.
They gave up Ty Wishart for Roloson. They got Brewer for Brock Beukeboom and a third. They also resigned Brewer who is still a top 4 defenseman. They also got to the ECF and an OT goal away from going to the finals, the same fact Habs fan like to say "We almost beat the champs!"
Nashville traded away Hartnell and Timonnen in the summer, not for Forsberg who they got during the season for a first, when they knew they wouldnt resign with them as UFA's. You find that making Cap Space for Suter, Weber and Rinne is a problem?
Stop cherry picking facts.
I never mentioned Atlanta. Waddell is up there as one of the worst GM's ever
How about all the players the Habs let go because we're paying Markov, Kaberle, and Gomez a combined 17 mill against the Cap? All for one goal this season.
You're not seeing it in the right context. It's, do I want to shell out 7 mill for Gomez to play in the AHL, and then have to spend another 7 mill in the cap space that frees up, or do i let him play out his contract no matter how bad hes playing and instead of paying 14 million (or whatever his actual salary is), and sqeak into the playoffs and make 2-3 million more (avg revenue they say is 1 mill per home playoff game).
So you're right, its a business, and they're running it like one. Sending Gomez + Kaberle down and spending their cap space would wipe out any playoff revenue the team would get anyway. so wait and see. I have an awful feeling Gauthier will be back next season.
I believe it is reasonable to say we will find the answer to that question this off season. I don't think it would have helped the team any this year to have Gomez in Hamilton. Where would the cap hit money be spent? Brad Richards? Toronto offered more money than New York and he still went there, PG apparantly threw wheelbarrows of money at him also and were turned down.
Absolutely the Gomez predicament has reached a feverish pitch culminating in the serenading of the player by school children in the Saturday matinee against Washington.
However, this off season is I think the first time the Ownership/Mgmt team can make a move as it relates to Gomez. It still could be trade, as his much talked about Caphit will then be significantly higher than his salary. It could be Hamilton, or could be Europe (highly doubt).
In fairness to Scott Gomez, since his most recent return from Injury I think he has done a much better job of going to the dirty areas of the rink. Many games now I have seen him receive cross-checks while parking his large wallet laden ass in front of the net.
Absolutely his confidence is shot, and the experiment has been an abject failure (this season and most of last, we tend to forget his first playoff in Montreal when he was very functional and useful) overall. But I think the criticism of Ownership towards Gomez is unfair until this upcoming offseason.
good point, although I would've dumped him after last year. But then again, it's not my money. Never would've let PG make that Kaberle deal however, which is what leads me to believe he'll be back.
The season wasn't lost when Kaberle was acquired. And will you feel the same way about that trade if Kaberle is traded for a 2nd round pick at the end of this month?
you're not being realistic. Every hockey person has already said that Carolina was desperate to deal Kaberle's contract and the only team who would take him was Montreal.
Elliotte Friedman, Darren Dreger and Bob Mckenzie are all on the record about this. If you like him, Pierre McGuire too.
Edit: I'll be shocked if Kaberle has any takers. If he is, i'll take back anything bad i've ever said about Gauthier.
I'm not being realistic? In what way exactly? You're saying that a media outlet notorious for saying or printing anything to make the Habs organization look worse than it is reported objectively about a trade?
The Canadiens gave up a pending UFA for one of the best puck moving defensemen in the NHL. His contract isn't ideal. But there's nothing stopping the Canadiens from trading him.
On there not being a market for Kaberle. Jonathan Cheechoo was traded in the Dany Heatley deal. So you can say that there's no market for Kaberle, but in doing so, it's you who is out of touch with reality.
yes Cheechoo was traded, but so was Milan Michalek. Who are you going to give up with Kaberle to unload him?
Also, Kaberle regularly plays less than 15 minutes, turns the puck over and his absolutely shit scared of getting hit. best puck moving defenseman in the NHL? not even close
Edit: Sorry, ONE OF the best puck moving defenseman. still not close.
Never said he was the best puck moving defenseman in the NHL. Take a deep breath.
Burly, I absolutely 100% agree with you.
I think the problem is Gomez is not the same player he was and he has absolutely no luck…. a bad combination.
He has been around the net a lot lately. I have been watching for it and I have been pleasently surprised. However, he is not that kind of player… and it is not really working for him.
He kind of reminds me of Joey Juneau. Good little playmaker and scorer early in his career (not as good as Gomez was) but his skills quickly declined and he had to re-invent himself as a defensive guy. I see Gomez heading in this direction (if he is willing to accept this role)… too bad his salary does not allow him to take on this role full time. Really, Scott is fantastic at getting out of his end and down the rink…. seems like something you want in a defensive forward.
Isn't Joey up in the NWT teaching natives how to play hockey…. just saying
Ok, yes, I can see there being some hesitation to spend more because your GM made a big mistake.
My problem is the "Management doesn't want to win the cup, there is no reason as long as the fans spend their money" sentiment. I lived near Toronto most of my life and I often heard this Mantra from leafs fans (even though they had one of the highest payrolls in the league). It just doesn't make sense when you are talking about teams that spend copius sums of money.
The Habs are not the Pittsburg Pirates.
If you don't know, the Pirates kept their payroll ridiculously low and the owners were making decent money due to league profit sharing (they spent less on players than what they were getting back in revenue sharing). In this case, yes, management doesn't care about the product and are only in it for the money. Not the Habs. They spend. They have lots of coaches (maybe they need more), they spend to the cap ceiling, they have a nice practice facility.
The arguement does not make sense.
And an aside… Kaberle is not the worst thing on the team. He has ok numbers since he got here (maybe not 4.5 million worth, but he is not that big of a problem… yet)
I think i agree with you. It's not that they won't spend money, but they haven't yet spent the money to fix the mistakes of the money they already spent 😉
all he does is play the 1st wave of the PP. who's stats wouldn't look good?
I don't believe for a minute that management doesn't care if they win as long as the rink is full. I don't think most of the posters think that either. They have let their emotions take over. What I do believe, is they think Gomez is a lot better than someone in the AHL. Right or wrong. Rail all you want about Gomez, like that's going to help, he is stuck with us and we are stuck with him. I also believe all the UFA's in this league are watching what goes on here, regarding him and would need a boat load of money to take the abuse, if they didn't live up to the fans expectations.
SInce HabsFanSince72 is bringing up Japanese sayings, there's a Chinese saying that you cannot serve two masters. Of COURSE management wants to win, and some bad trades etc. reflect poor (or at least mistaken) judgement only.
But when it comes down to it, do you bury Scott Gomez, acknowledging what we all know – that he's a total bust – because you want to WIN, or do you keep him up because it would cost you to do it? The Rangers answered one way with Redden, Molson is answering another with Gomez. And to me, the Kaberle deal was desperation that he could help the power play and get us into the money of the playoffs. As a hockey gamble, it was a clear mistake. As a money making gamble…. just getting into the playoffs is so lucrative I could see where he's worth it.
So for the HARD decisions, is Molson guided by profit or winning? I think it's either money, or there's just a lot of poor hockey judgement around long term contract issues. I can't believe they're that blind.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
Are you saying that the Habs should have buried Gomez for this current entire season? I ask you genuinely, and I also ask where the other 7.5 million is respent in order to adequately help the vacated Centre/Wing position. Again, I think this coming season, if nothing is done as it pertains to Mr. Gomez, ownership can be criticized, but this current season?
I agree. The comment seemed to be hinting that Gomez's presence in the dressing room is holding the team back. It isn't a situation where more goals resulting from his play would have the team in a different position. He has missed thirty games.
>It isn't a situation where more goals resulting from his play would >have the team in a different position.
This wasn't my point – but sure it is. He has missed thirty games but played in almost as many. One more goal every 5-6 games (about a 15 goal pace) and we could be in the hunt. If he came back "better" and determined to do what it takes to win, don't you think he's capable of that.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
He came back and was just as useless as last year. At the point yes, he should've been buried. Everyone (me included) said 'give him the benefit of the doubt'. But it was quickly apparent he was the same guy, playing his way, playing the periphery, skating loops while his wingers waited at the blue line. I don't see him as a 'problem' in the dressing room. I see him as a problem on the ice – the way he plays is not the way the team is playing. If it WAS they'd never make him a winger. Cole has boosted the north-south complexion of this team. Gomez is east-west, forwards-backwards.
Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!
you know you have a management problem when you spend the cap and you're more or less in last place. they haven't managed the coaching staff well (as you've pointed out) and they haven't had a consistent vision of what the team should look like, or at lease a successful one. in addition there's been a degree of hubris in thinking they can see value in contracts that no one else wants like gomez and kaberlame. they want to win simply because they want to keep their jobs at this point. the ownership is another issue.
Do advanced stats work in hockey?
I'm a fan of Moneyball (read a chapter here). (Although it's been pointed out that the early naughties A's won not because of advanced stats but because their top three pitchers were superb, and acquired with high draft picks from recent poor seasons (read this).
Bill James did revolutionize baseball, and Billy Beane hired Harvard statisticians to advise him. However, the people who argue for stats in hockey tend not to understand statistics ( concepts like sample size, variance and p values appear foreign to them). Also the commonly used Corsi and Fenwick are based on a stat of dubious significance (shots on goal).
The main promoter of stats in hockey is at a website called behindthenet.ca. The fellow who runs it doesn't post his credentials.
If you go to his site the front page explains that he can also tell you which online casino offers the best payouts. He has a link to his other site which is obviously nothing more than a referral site to online casinos, which is ethically dubious at best.
Indeed, can you trust anyone claiming to understand statistics, who attempts to steer you to a casino that provides "good value"?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Your point is a good one. Statistics can be twisted to suit agendas on a whim.
Mark Twain said it best.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
hockey is a much more team oriented sport than baseball. some players just work well together while others do not. plus when you add in certain "systems" in hockey you get guys that just do not perform with certain limitations placed upon them.
very true..baseball is the most individual team sport out there….however this is where I see value in someone Kaberle…and Brisebois before him. People underestimate the value of passing to guys on the fly and selecting the right passing option. Many guys are limited in their "vision" and make the simple play, or the nearest option…other guys make plays…kaberle is one of those guys who forwards love to have on the ice…this is also Markov's biggest asset too. The best analogy I can think of is a quarterback…one guy may find the open receiver most of the time…but he gets the ball/puck not moving, another guy finds "an" open receiver but another guy was way more open and in a better position downfield or up ice though, Kaberle also sometimes has the abiltiy to dictate the path of his target and make plays the forward was not even aware he would make, etc….
The Athletics have not made the playoffs or finished above .500 since 2006…
Hockey is much less statistical. For example, you don't dress more left-handed wingers against a goalie with a left glove hand. Also, hockey players are more streaky than baseball payers.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
There are correlations that can be drawn from corsi and the like, but I have yet to be convinced that they're always indicative of play.
I still think that advanced stats need to have a precise definition to mean something. In baseball, where the game is semi-static (meaning it starts from a standstill every pitch) you can measure everything.
In hockey, because there are an almost infinite amount of variables, it's hard to define exactly what those advanced stats say. Sure a team can have good corsi numbers, but in the end quality scoring chances will outweigh shots (whether attempted or succeeded) for/against over a long period of time.
I have the same gripe with football's Quarterback Rating. It's an abstract way of saying a QB played well. For instance Tim Tebow's 4th quarter QB rating was through the roof, do people really think he's a good QB?
You can't have an all-encompassing stat that says 'this guy is good' or 'this team is good', that's not the way baseball stats work. Baseball stats say very specific things, and there are stats for everything, OPS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On-base_plus_slugging) says something very specific about a hitter, but it says nothing about their defensive play. But if you really want to get into baseballs subtleties you have to look at how a player hits against a L or R handed pitchers, how they hit on fast balls, or off speed etc. All of baseball's stats tell you something specific, and it's up to a manager to put those pieces together. Moneyball made the assumption that getting on base was the paramount statistic for winning; and while you can make the argument that there are lots of other factors, it's impossible to deny that parts of those assumptions are now put in place on every baseball team (hence the ubiquity of OPS in baseball coverage).
Hockey's advanced stats are trying to encompass the whole of the game into a good/bad category (or average), but they say very little about what makes a player good or bad. It doesn't tell you what they're good or bad at, and I don't see how they could help a GM determine that without watching the player play the game.
Just to add more fuel to the fire (because that's how I roll) how good would have Ryan McDonagh looked on the Habs defense this year?
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
i know!! but at the time did anyone think he was going to be very good? why did the habs not know? did they know but just wanted to get gomez?? my thoughts when the trade went down were gomez was overpaid…. but i never would have imagined he would perform this poorly…. McD was a throw in that didn't really matter.
Someone posted that Timmons urged BG not to include McD in the trade. Clearly Gomez is not the same player he was when the trade was made.
McDonagh was considered to be a blue chip prospect. So, yeah, a lot of people figured he would be good. They just realize he might take a few years to develop into anything.
Was McDonagh really a throw in or did Sather request him? (We know Gainey merely taking Gomez was a favour to Sather, unless Gainey truely believed Scott was just that good and felt he had to give up a prospect).
Revisionism is a funny thing. At the time of that trade, and for a full year after that trade, McDonagh was considered to be another David Fischer. He was falling fast and having a very hard time adjusting to Collegiate hockey.
I don't know where you got that, McDonagh was very highly regarded even then. It was when he didn't make the blueshirts in that first training camp people thought he might not pan out. But nowhere did anyone I read ever even say that he was remotely a David Fischer. You're revising history on this one
I recall reading immediately after the trade how upset Trevor Timmins was.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
If I remember correctly, he was pretty well scouted and was put on the same pedestal back then as we are putting Beaulieu and Tinordi on now.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Ya Ya and just how good that Esposito kid we did not draft that everyone wanted, would look now !
a) Did they draft him… no.
b) Did his value diminish greatly the year he was drafted… yes. Seven other teams passed on him before Pittsburgh drafted him. He was considered a steal.
c) He had major back-to-back injuries on the same knee. A lot of critics forget that.
d) Was McDonagh ever considered a risky pick… no.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
I feel for Gomez but really, the problem is he's being paid as the habs #1 guy. He isn't producing as much as a third liner. That's how it is.
Try a fourth liner…
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
I don't. He looks like he is playing tag out there, skating around to avoid getting hit. It gives the impression that he's at least trying. But compare him to Erik Cole. Or to Desharnais digging the puck out of the corners.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
BS. You didn't see Pleks goal on Sunday or when it comes to Gomez, you put blinders on?
Look you can't get around the fact that Gomez is scoring less that PJ Stock did in his worst year.
He has fewer goals than Frederic St.Denis in 4 times as many games.
And I could go on.
The very best argument you could make for Gomez is that he tries. My view is he tries just hard enough to look like he's trying.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
See what you want to see. Paul Simon, as usual, is right.
Sorry G-Man but this is a very annoying and somewhat passive-aggressive argument. I've never bashed Gomez, but to suggest that those who do are prejudiced or blind is simply dishonest.
He is being safely outscored by Mathieu Darche over their entire Habs career (last three years).
Last year Mathieu Darche had 12 goals in 59 games and 11 min TOI/G.
Gomez played 80 games, scored only 7 and had 18 min TOI/G
This year Darche has 3 and Gomez, as everyone knows, none.
There is simply no defending him.
What everyone is seeing is what is plain to see. Last year every player who was put on his line instantly stopped scoring. He skates wherever there is no traffic. Contrast to Erik Cole.
He is so poor that Cunnyworth is playing him as a winger.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
I only feel bad because he seems like a nice person. However, if a dump truck of money showed up at my door and I was asked to play hockey I would. I would suck and the fans would hate me, but I could bundle up a few of the bigger bills and jam it in my ear.
Gomez has a point. If you're going to lose it might as well be with people you like. Pat Hickey has a point as well. The team was terrible in the pre-season, terrible at the start of the season, and never recovered. I think they are playing better since Martin was re-assigned but I don't think Cunnyworth is the answer, and the results don't show improved play.
The odd thing is that teams in contention for a cup run value different players than fans and media do. Montreal is weak in goal and very weak at center. Beyond Price there is no one now. They need a good young goaltender in the system. Kaberle might bring that. The center? Unless someone get's upset with his team in the next couple years I don't see a first center being available. The draft is pretty important because of that. I don't see the team getting a stud there either but who knows, that's what GM's are for.
However, in the end, the dollar is what this is all about. As long as the sweaters keep selling there is really no reason to invest in anything other than marketing. That is why Hitchcock goes to St Louis then the Habs can Martin.
I think the Habs should claim Stewart off of waivers from Carolina, trade Plekanec for Ruutu and Kostitsyn and Weber for Statsny. Trade Moen and Gill to San Jose for Petrecki and a 4th round pick, trade Camploi for anything, same for Kaberle and Nokelainen. Having Patches, Statsny, Cole…Bourque, DD, and Ruutu, Stewart, Eller, Gionta and Darche White and Blunden would be pretty good. Then LeBlanc could spend the rest of this season and maybe next developing. Petrecki paired with Subban would make a very solid pairing. I am not concerned with the defnece. Beaulieu and Elles will probably make a great pairing, Tindordi will be ready in a couple of seasons, Nash is ready, and Dietz, Pateryn and Didier look real good. There are some potentially good forwards in Kristo, Avtsin, and Quailer. Bournival and Gallagher should make the team within 2 seasons. Darche will probably not be back next season. I would trade Gomez (if possible) during the off season. The future is not as bleak as some make it out to be. I do believe that Gauthier and Gainey need to go.
Put the controller down and step away from the Xbox…..
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Spot on assessment.
I am not sure xbox is that stupid.
LMAO, oh that was funny, thanks Cardiac.
Why don't we just call up the Detroit GM and ask if we can switch teams, even up?
All I have to say to the 625 people who claim to be embarrassed at being Habs fans is … I'm totally embarrassed that you're Habs fans too. Go Habs and you are all totally free to … go away.
Agree! Fair-weather, bandwagon, dilettante, shallow, and other words accurately describe those types of fans.
"May you live in interesting times."
Uh-oh, Thomas- the nasties will begin attacking you soon. Shields up!
Always proud. Frustrated, a little sad that we'll miss the playoffs, but never ashamed.
What a load of garbage spewing from Gomez' mouth. Is he so deluded in thinking that Habs fans actually want them to move up in the standings? 9 out of 10 fans want a high draft pick and a rebuild. Nobody wants to show up to the games so as to not encourage them. Thankfully half their games are on the road.
I liked reading Hickey's article for a change. He correctly labels the pre-season as a cash grab and a missed opportunity to have the team prepared for the regular season.
Boone's article has a mis-leading title up above. At first I thought it was going to be about the Habs not selling by the deadline and it turned out to be about the Habs not ripping off fans with forced payment for 4 rounds of hockey in advance.
I really think the Bell Centre needs a few nights of non sold out attendance. Not because of the piss poor product being thrown on the ice but because of the ownership's pre-occupation with squeezing money from people rather than thinking about the hard decisions needed to skate a team capable of being elite.
My biggest hope is that fans get tired of the mediocrity and stop buying into the fantasy that an 8th seed has a snowball's chance in hell of winning the Cup. Make the play-offs as the final berth? Who cares!
I have zero confidence in Molson. None. Nada. His family destroyed the team before and it's clear they are as intent on pushing a watered down product on the ice as they put in their beer cans and bottles.
You can hate Gomez all you want HH, but to say that what he said is Garbage is HorseSh%t on your behalf. I would want all my players to feel the way he said things.
You can question whether or not he has parlayed that attitude into his efforts, but don't ever give me a player that wants to lose and keep losing for draft picks. You can have those garbage spewing players on your team any day, just don't get your team and my team confused.
If you were in Montreal, and you're not, you'd be in the minority. Does Burlington even have an arena?
What, so because of where I live I am not qualified to comment, and because the city/town I live in which does indeed not have a 21,000 seat arena again not qualified.
Come on HH you can do better than that. My comment was simple, Gomez said the things I want to hear from players playing on the team I support. I am completely accepting of criticism directed towards his play and whether or not his actions prove his words. But you are the one saying what he says is garbage. Philosophically, what he said is exactly what I want player to say and DO.
Edit: I hope to be there for the Leaf game in March I think it is, can I post that day? If I do, what kind of font should I use in order to show the enlightenment of my comments, given the fact I will be in hallowed Montreal while posting.
Temper, temper… settle down. Gomez is being sincere. Not much self-promotion going on, and no indulging the fact that he is a Stanley Cup champion. A lot of us are not in Montreal but we contribute to the superb aura that surrounds this unique franchise. Always thrilled when fans chime in from Finland, Spain, England, Norway, N.Y., Calif.,Vancouver, shall I go on?
"May you live in interesting times."
And if he were in Montreal he'd be booing players out of town and burning the town down when the team won. Would that make him part of your clique then?
That's just as offensive as his comment.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Yeah it was supposed to be an offensive generalization that hopefully nobody actually believes. That was my point. Sorry for the confusion. Not trying to offend.
Agreed. In any case it is in the interest of any player to try their best, for many reasons.
Even if it is in the long term interest of the team to get a high draft pick, it isn't in any player's interest to play poorly.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
Of course but what do I know. My town does not have an arena. : )
Do you honestly think the Gomer has any integrity for the game? The man up and left the franchise he won two Cups with so he could gouge Sather and Rangers for every penny he could.
"There's genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it's like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don't."
– Jerry Maguire
Give me a break – any sane player takes that contract.
Disclaimer: A bit of a rant to follow.
I absolutely agree HiB. There is only one mouth continuously spewing garbage around here. These guys didn't make it to the NHL because they spent their evenings as a kid playing on the neighbourhood rink imagining themselves tanking for high draft picks so their team could be better. Gomez's perspective is exactly what I want every player on my team to have.
"9 out of 10 fans want a high draft pick and a rebuild." Seriously. What is your sample size on that? I would hope (though I don't have data to back it up) that more fans would take a playoff berth over first overall pick.
You don't play hockey for a high draft ranking! That's what you get when you suck. If my team tries its best and is that bad I'll take the high pick but you don't intentionally suck to get them. There are ways to build for the future without sacrificing the present (see Detroit).
Besides all that, I really don't think that a lack of talent has been the Habs biggest enemy this year. I think a lot of the team played a lot of the season afraid to make a mistake. Hockey is a game of mistakes, you don't need to be perfect, but you need to be better than the guy across from you. Most of that comes from sheer effort which comes from actually wanting to WIN not just wanting to not make a mistake. A slight tweak in the attitude of this team and I think this could have been a different season. I think a guy like Muller as an assistant coach could have knocked that message through. The tacticians in charge seem to have forgotten how Canadians play and win hockey games. With heart.
There' only one person spewing garbage around here and I'll let you take a guess who that might be. Before you say it, I'm rubber and you're glue.
Well played sir!
The Habs' miraculous Drive for 25 continues tonight as they will jump all over the flightless Penguins. Gomez came close last game and will score tonight removing the Godzilla off his back. Hal Gill, with a Gordie Howe Hat Trick, will stun the crowd. Molson's Beer will turn into Nectar (or perhaps merely into actual beer) and Hot Dogs will transmute into Ambrosia and they shall rejoice.
So it is written, so it shall be done……
McGuire for GM!
Roy for Coach!
Sh*t for Brains!
Well, that set-up for the thread will breed nothing but the usual Gomez hate today. May as well wait for Boone's live blog for something else to post about.
So you think there is a slight chance of someone, say SD for example now posting a big bash on Gomer?
Looks like HaHa beat him to it. 😉
Okay perhaps my Google translation device didn't work right, does Gagnon say DD is Habs best player this season? Has he seen the fellow named Cole playing on that line who does all the work and hustle and scoring?
Patches and Cole are clearly an afterthought.
Don't let the wultures getcha.
Gagnon is a true Quebec'er. He looks for any french speaking player to be the best on the team. He's a little tribal headed.
So, by by your logic, anyone who thinks Cole is the best must be a true American. Personally, i vote for DD with Cole a close second. I like Cole's drive, but DD's vision and puck intelligence are amazing. Plus , he is the best offenceive payer we have in the corners. He always has one objective; to come of there with the puck and make a play. More often than not he suceeds, no matter how big the other guy is. Meanwhile, half of the Habs are so busy tring to tie up their guy in the corner that they don't even care about when the puck comes into play. Moen being the classic example of someone who plays great without the ouck…just don't exoect to actually do anything with it.
You didn't read the article j0n…
He wrote best center and he'd be right… and yeah, he's French Canadian… So F 'en what?
Your tribalism is showing…
Cole is so far out in front that I am hard pressed to pick a second. I'll go with Price then Gorges, Patches and DD.
Think it's time Gagnon heads to rehab and gets his 40% blood alcohol level lowered a bit.
According to HardHabits who posted above, Molson now water downs his beer. That could lower the BAC of Gagnon, no? That way he wouldn't have to cut back at all.
I think he wrote "best centre" and an argument could be made for that comment based on centre stats alone. I disagree because DD is quite sheltered playing with Cole and Max. Not to take anything away from DD, I like the kid, though I imagine Plekanec could produce even better results between those two forwards rather than the revolving door of suckage he has had to put up with.
***Subbang Baby!!!***
That was what I wasn't sure about, in my translation is just said best Hab this season, I wondered if it meant best centre. However, while his offensive creativity is probably the best, you point of sheltered is true. Also, no PK presence, which is the best thing the Habs do this season.
It was indeed best centre.
THanks, I don't speak french, and that is why I asked. No doubt DD has been a wonderful revelation for this team. Give me a choice though of one center on this team i keep, and its Plex, followed by Eller then DD. DD has the offensive creativity, and there is a role for that on this team. But shadowing other top lines, playing PK, winning big faceoffs are not areas I think he excels in.
I think Eller has the potential to be great, and Pleks is very solid. But based on this season alone I wouldn't argue with Gagnon.
It is indeed best centre. I think it's time to give Desharnais his dues however. He goes and gets pucks and makes some sweet passes. I think he makes it possible for the Habs to think of trading Pleks in a package to get a big C or some other key piece.
McGuire for GM!
Roy for Coach!
Sh*t for Brains!
Regardless of all his attributes, Desharnais is too small.
Richard R
I bet the Islanders regret having let the Wiz go. Dumb move. For us as well.
Richard R
Well..although his comments are honest and right on the spot,he is part of the problem,not the solution.
Underachievers have been hurting us in the last years. We were in love with the thought that Cammy could score 30 or 40 goals but it never materialized. Gomez use to be a pest against us when he played in Jersey but once he got here…
We have no fire power ,maybe just maybe Cole and Max Pac will get 25 or 30 goals. That is just not enough. Add how many goals you want to half a dozen players in that roster and it would have made all the difference.
But i think this is just one aspect of the game we need to improve. I guess we will have plenty of time to do the post-mortem this year…
Yeah it was the preseason that hurt the habs this season, Pat……………………Whatever!
They have had the same or similar preseason the last few years and they have had quick and slow starts. It has nothing to do with the preseason.
This season boils down to having a large amount of hurt players out of the line-up and a lot of new young guys trying to get their feet wet in the NHL. And a lot of those young guys are on the D, the most challenging position in hockey were young prospects take longer to adapt to the NHL.
Stop looking for hair brained reasons why this season was off, the reasons are plain to see.
I agree Jon especially your mention of the young defence. I really think the organization thought Markov would be in the lineup in November and they really didn't have a backup plan. Spacek injury plus the regression of Weber and a somewhat inconsistent PK doomed are season from the start.
I do agree that the pre-season calendar did hurt us. Too many games,not enough playing time for the veterans. They were not in the groove from the get to. This awful start of the regular season is i think the main reason why we are down there…Not the only reason but we never picked up the ground we lost then.
The reason why the team didn't pick up ground when the started bad is the same reason why they started bad. The team had two many holes that I listed above. Had nothing to do with the preseason. Like I said the preseason was the same as it has been for the last few years and it didn't matter then, why would that be a factor now?
Agree that the pre-season wasn't the main reason for our slow start. Markov's absence left us with a very inexperienced defence corps, and there was a gaping hole on the fourth line. We started the season with what amounted to the skeleton of an NHL team. Gauthier's failure to have a Plan B in place in the event of Markov's not being ready to start the season, as well as his failure to put together an effective fourth line, were huge blunders.
Nevertheless, the pre-season didn't help, and the Habs should think about doing it differently next year. Perhaps play fewer games, and certainly trim the roster sooner. Why give such long looks to distant prospects? The team needs to play several pre-season games using something close to the actual roster.
Nice guys finish last, poor Gomer. with no goals he is over paid at 5 million , what a waste of a roster spot ,
Habs wish it was 5 million.
Do you mean overpaid by 5 million? If so I think that's a conservative estimate as well.
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