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... We saw the smallest house in Amsterdam which is one window wide. It's on the top floor of a very old building. The captain explained to us about the large amount of beer consumption that occurred here years ago was due to the fact that it was better to drink beer than water because the water was contaminated. Don't know what the reason is today though! At one point we passed through the ...
No Regrets in the Netherlands
... of other American students who are also studying abroad. It's so cool to hear all of their backgrounds and future plans, we're all just young adults trying to make the most of our prime years! After arriving at our hostel, Bob's Youth Hostel, we went out to go find a place for a late dinner. We got some authentic Holland food that mostly consisted of beef (which was so appetizing considering we have been protein deprived for the past month). After dinner, ...
A long day of traveling!
... driving for three hours, took a 45 minute break then 2 more hours to our final destination in Monneckendam, Netherlands. This city is located on the channel right outside of Amsterdam. Here we settled into our very very junky hotel... we were surprised apparently it was labeled as a 4 star hotel online.. not really.
We ate our dutch meal and headed into the city where we walked the red light district and the canals. Such a beautiful evening in the city!
A Palette For All Tastes
... De Kooning, and it was all downhill from there. Well, at least for Steve. Mandy did find merit in some of the more modern pieces of art. At least we could take photos in this Museum although there were plenty of works we didn't want to waste our precious memory cards on.
On our second full day we visited the recently restored Rijksmuseum, an impressive building which is home to the city's more classical works of art. There were a couple of ...
An attic, a hiding place and a kerk.
... constructed between the years of 1370 and 1538 - almost a two hundred year project! It's massive organ was built in 1735 and took three years to finish and this same organ has also been played by composers like Mozart and Handel. The entirety of the floor is composed of slabs of rock that are gravestones dating back as early as the 15th century.
After our long day of touring we decided it would be time for some food, so my ...


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Oct 26, 2016From Buyer: BobG55
Simon is a pleasant member to deal with. The communication was easygoing, answers to my questions were very well explained and suggestions were even added. Overall, I'm quite pleased & satisfied with our transaction. Highly recommend A+.
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Tropical Fish Keeping - Aquarium fish care and resources (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/forum.php)
- Catfish (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/catfish/)
- - Pictus Catfish (http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/catfish/pictus-catfish-7007/)
Pictus Catfish
I have a tank with mollies, platies, a dwarf gourami, marble hatchets, and giant danios, I was wondering, would a pictus catfish be compatable with the fishes I mentioned?
As long as the fish are larger, it should be ok. I lost a small bala to a pictus cat's nocturnal hunting.
Never had a problem with any of my pictus cats and one of them was in a fry grow out tank. Just make sure they are getting fed.
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It is always the way, something is challenging, people complain on the forums, they make it easier and those people leave any ways. In my case I love the challenge, I love achieving something that puts me in an exclusive club. My heart pumps when I know there is risk/reward and knowing I could lose, that is where excitement comes in. There is nothing fun about going around tanking every mob in the game and just mindlessly killing everything in sight to level up, that is just called a grind. The fun is having to work with other players to complete something that is hard, knowing that you might not be able to even do it with the group you have. I remember even with the early days of WoW, dungeons used to be hard and quite often we would fail because the group would fall apart. Now though you just run through it in 10 mins with no challenge and it is just boring, people just grind them for the loot only now.
Playing Operation Breakout on CS:GO, I had a mission where I had to join a death match server and grind away 30 kills with a certain gun. That was just a boring grind and it wasn't fun, yet I bet it is the exact thing people want because they just want to rush to the reward. I have another mission that I have yet to complete which is winning in competitive mode on a certain map. That has been much more exciting, there is something really on the line there, there is no guarantee that I'll ever complete it as I can fail unlike the last mission. I've tried it 3 times now and I've failed each time, that is up to 90 mins a pop. It is fun, it came down to the wire the last time I tried, I was the last man alive and my heart was pounding and my hands were shaking so badly. I lost and felt devastated, but if I succeeded I would have had such a high.
Those extreme emotions are things I experienced in early MMOs, ones which were challenging. I don't get that any more, MMOs are made too easy or have been dumbed down over time. You end up going through the content and you just feel nothing but boredom, everything is now a means to an end, when you get to the end you quit the game. I never used to play old MMOs to get to the end, in fact I probably never got to what you could call the end on any of them. I used to play to have fun, to feel those wild swings in emotions. Now though everything is made so everyone can experience it, it is basically just a checklist of easy content that has been designed with one thing in mind and that is levelling up your character and doing it FAST and EASY.
This is something that has always pissed me off and the reason why I ended up quitting so many MMOs in the past. I remember SWG starting off as being a hard and harsh game, every patch seemed to be doing something to make it easier though. It got to the point where we had two major game changes in an effort to make it super easy and dumb. It made no sense to me as the skill box system is far more intuitive than the talent tree system, it offered far more variety as well. I just thought it was funny because Jedi used to have harsh death penalties to keep them in line as they were meant to be rare and over powered. People though always claimed server instability killed them and whined on until they lessened the Death Penalty to basically nothing... like funny that, always someone else's fault but yours. When I died all fully geared back when Dayz came out and was a challenging game, I didn't whine on about it being the servers fault and wanting them to take the death penalty away, I just fucking got over it and started again...
Developers have become like mini celebs now though, they've all gained big egos now that fans are all communicating with them through social media and forums etc. So developers want their content to be played by everyone, they're making content that satisfies their own ego rather than what is good for the game. I just cringe every time I hear a developer saying "we spend this amount of time making whatever and only 2% of people saw it" and using it as an excuse to why they've made something easier or taken it out of the game. Like ok so just make a boring corridor instead then, make sure everything we see is exactly what everyone else is seeing. I don't get that argument, what makes open world games fun is discovering things other people haven't seen, if we're all sent down the same path each time then it isn't a world any more, besides it makes replayability boring.
I'm just so tired of all these excuses around something being challenging to why people are leaving their game. Dumbing down a game has never made it more popular or kept players on, it just satisfies the short term and harms the long term.
Because most games are run by publishers, and publishers run on fear and knee jerk reactions.
It's also why most casual MMOs have failed over the years.
Originally posted by Dihoru
MMOs do not get dumbed down, they get tweaked to fix issues and you grow more adept at them.
Er... I'm guessing you never played pre WoW MMOs then if you think modern MMOs don't get dumbed down?
Originally posted by Quizzical
Because nothing else pushes a player to quit quite so quickly as being completely stuck on something and unable to move on.
Sorry, but if players weren't so content in being "Hand held" thru games, they would never get stuck.
It's called Laziness, nothing more, nothing less.
Like right now in WoD Beta....No addons allowed. People have to use the default UI, Logs, everything. There is a constant "Where can I find this?" or "How do I do this and that?" People do not read the Quest log to get the answer, they are too lazy. They would rather get the instant gratification in hopes that someone will tell them the answer.
THAT is the problem in MMOs today..."Handholding", which in turn leads to "dumbing" the game down for the masses of Lazy.
"My Fantasy is having two men at once...
One Cooking and One Cleaning!"
"A good man can make you feel sexy,
strong and able to take on the whole world...
oh sorry...that's wine...wine does that..."
simpltons dont want to pay for a game if its too hard for them to understand, they cant enter cheat codes they used to get through all they're console games, therefor they whine till the game play gets lowered to their level of understanding, the company gets more players (payers).
Us adventeruos players loose the challenge of game play, and get game players with challenges.
I'm just going to leave this here....
I chose the Xfinity speed test because it does not reveal my ISP.
This reads like the Hairshirt Brigade talking about going uphill in the snow both ways.
I liked the mention of there being both fun and unfun difficulty in games. Probably a gradient of appreciation in there as well, with people liking different amounts of difficulty, based on their own particular tolerance for it. Inclusiveness is considered a virtue in game production, because you need to draw a user base that will support your cost of development and ongoing team. You can make a successful frighteningly tough game, if you judge the expense vs the income properly. But you are going to leave a lot of customers by the wayside.
For some, that tough game that took you a week to beat that one tough boss will be akin to beating their head against a wall.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Originally posted by Ivylena
Originally posted by Quizzical
Because nothing else pushes a player to quit quite so quickly as being completely stuck on something and unable to move on.
Sorry, but if players weren't so content in being "Hand held" thru games, they would never get stuck.
It's called Laziness, nothing more, nothing less.
Like right now in WoD Beta....No addons allowed. People have to use the default UI, Logs, everything. There is a constant "Where can I find this?" or "How do I do this and that?" People do not read the Quest log to get the answer, they are too lazy. They would rather get the instant gratification in hopes that someone will tell them the answer.
THAT is the problem in MMOs today..."Handholding", which in turn leads to "dumbing" the game down for the masses of Lazy.
Don't shoot the messenger. I'm merely describing what is, not saying that it should be that way.
MMORPGs are dumbed down now because they arent made for MMORPG players. they are made for everybody, and most people are lazy/to stupid to figure things out on their own. so the people who actually want to play a real MMORPG that is challenging and fun and actually stick with it for along time are screwed.
instead we get the same game with a new skin over and over that is easy enough to max level in a month and content chewed up in 2 months. and dont be duped, these games are made with full intention of going f2p all they are doing is milking that sub fee as long as possible knowing full well they wont keep a player base big enough to support devs and real content patchs.
In my experience over the past 20 years is that they want the masses and that takes a middle of the road path I believe. When things are difficult (ie UO early days and EQ early days) it chases away folks or at least deters them and in the end the masses just want to socialize and show off. I don't like it but that's the way it is.
ps I added this after I read some more posts. These changes to the mass approach started long ago (and not just the ipad age). I remember noticing it in UO before trammel (huge complaints about pvp interfering with those that just wanted to do their own thing) which had to be late 90's and EQ where death was painful and difficult (but challenging and brought memorable fun) went away for a more reasonable approach (and boring). It's not just a sign of the times but more developers trying to appeal to the masses. I'll always have fond memories of those early days and almost none since. But it was the majority of players that demanded change and not just the vocal minority on forums.
Understand that there are different groups of players.
Hardcore. (These players will play the initial "hard" content)
Mediums. (These players will play, and now complete "first tweak" patch)
Casuals/late adopters (These players will play, with ease "easy mode" patch. By this time there is new content that the dev/pub would like player to get to so ne reason to kepp it tough)
My 2 pennies.
The real question is what is hard. One person's challenge is another's boredom. WoW has some of the most challenging top end raiding, but many do not find it fun. Others think Eve's cutthroat challenge is fun, but others would rather poke out their eyes. Some say if you do not have FFA PvP you are on easy mode. Others want mental puzzles and others want finger dexterity puzzles.
Some just want to log in a game and waste a few other bumming around.
The real question is not "why do they always", but "why do I not like the current games."
Originally posted by Reeper
simpltons dont want to pay for a game if its too hard for them to understand, they cant enter cheat codes they used to get through all they're console games, therefor they whine till the game play gets lowered to their level of understanding, the company gets more players (payers). Us adventeruos players loose the challenge of game play, and get game players with challenges.
This is a post done by an egotistical power-tripper who calls others simpltons yet cannot properly type a sentence.
MMOs get adjusted often to the median-level of skill in order to retain the most players. "Veteran" players may scoff at the changes as "rose-colored glasses" comes into play.
In general, developers do not have a desire to kill their own game and thus, their jobs.
The MMO market is nothing like what it was in the UO/EQ era as the market as expanded to a much larger base of palyers ranging from ultra-casuals, raiders, PvPs, console users, roleplayers, etc. No one style is better or more superior to the others as each person paying their subscription has the right to play as they wish.
MMOs got easier because the time-grind and frustration of the "good ole days" was not appealing to the majority of people now in the MMO scene since the launch of MMO mainstreaming with the birth of WoW. Blizzard's fault? No ... not remotely. It is just the general desire of the majority that cut their teeth on more accessible MMOs.
Adding complexity usually requires an exponential amount of time. However, I think its doable if you keep your aspirations small. Something like a 3 class system allows for much more complexity to those particular classes than something absurd like a 64 class system.
I also think how most reviews are written contribute to this. Basically the reviewer goes down a checklist of what they feel should make a good mmo, and dock games for adding complexity by leaving something on their list out. I have seen a lot of games get harsh reviews for what are really cosmetics. Lets take Granado Espada for example. Its combat system is very engaging and complex. It was hit bad in reviews because the base 5 characters did not offer much customization. The customization was never really the point of the game. Another two good examples are Mabinogi and Vindictus.
Stopped taking you seriously when you referenced old WoW.
Larger time sink =/= Hard and skill worthy.
The mechanics of today's top end fights require far more skill than that of the older expansions, this is a core part of any game with a large lifespan as we are substantially better players now then we were back then.
obvious reasons
cheaper, easier, faster to design
the majority of target audience was dumbed down
not so obvious
secret subreptitious inconscient reason, overall negative effect:
there is an intention to endocrinate, program players to certain behaviours suited for certain ideologies, just like anything else in entertainment/culture
ultima online school player vs wow+recent mmos players are directly antagonic human beings on dozens of traits
Originally posted by Dihoru
MMOs do not get dumbed down, they get tweaked to fix issues and you grow more adept at them.
Not only that but during all my years of gaming especially in this genre we already could see years ago what the new majority wants which is what we have gotten the last few years.
Then there is internet acces for almost anyone, when someone feels something is to hard they acces internet in search how to "cheat" their way thru it, we have masses who use add-ons cause they seem unequipe to play a game the way it's made and bring themself to boredom cause they find out they do not like handholding yet they mold a game so that the game does excectly that with those add-ons.
Yet people keep blaming developers and not seeing what it's playing commununity or more often it's leaving community does to this genre. The all want challenge and when a game gives challenge they start to whine that it's to hard, they want innovation yet when innovations stares them in the face the completely ignore and want more of what they know.
But then again I thank my long gaming experiance and even in these "dumped down" games I am able to find my own niche/challenge.
But do long for something more akin to a virtual world then these games worlds we are presented the last several years. Even if I do enjoy some of them my heart goes out for allot more then what is given. But am not expecting it anymore due to the toxic nature of today's complainers in this genre. (commonly speaking of course)
Originally posted by prowess
I'm just going to leave this here.... http://www.team-dignitas.net/articles/blogs/Article/5332/Darkfall-Unholy-Wars-The-MMO-youve-never-heard-of/
DFUW sux, if you missed DFO, you missed out.


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The Grand Slam Wall Hugger Recliner by Design to Recline from Rotmans. We proudly serve the Worcester, Boston, MA, Providence, RI, and New England area. Product availability may vary. Contact us for the most current availability on this product.
Place this recliner a bit closer to the wall and easily reserve some extra space for moving around your room. Wall recliner mechanisms slide slightly forward instead of straight back when you move to angle the back cushion. You can place this model of recliner as close as 2-3 inches from the wall and you won't have to worry about reclining back and damaging the wall behind your chair.
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Chris Welsh, Vice President, Enterprise Solutions
Chris Welsh, Senior Vice President Enterprise Solutions at Randstad Canada is responsible for the management, sales, and delivery of enterprise staffing programs across all Lines of Business. This enterprise approach to client relationships has allowed large companies to meet all of their hiring needs across categories and geographies, while ensuring that individual service is always provided by a sector specialist in the local geography. At the same time, Chris is also responsible for leading the Permanent Placement Practice nationally for Randstad Technologies.
Since joining Randstad Canada in 2000, Chris has served as an Account Manager, Team Lead, and Client Executive in the Technology division. Starting in 2010, Chris moved to an enterprise role serving all lines of business as a Group Client Executive and Vice President, Enterprise Solutions. He has also been the country lead for Randstad Sourceright, leading the RPO and MSP business; before moving into his current SVP role.
Blog posts by Chris Welsh:
Young workers, as you venture forth into the world of work you are armed with many things: your degrees or diplomas, fresh ideas (lots of them), work ethic, networks (social and personal) and your...Read more
It's fitting that this, the first article of 2016, comes on the heels of the loss of a huge pop and cultural icon, David Bowie. Love him or not, you can't deny his impact over decades on people...Read more
Through our Women Shaping Business program, we want to provide you with valuable insights that you can use to assess the leadership of women in your organization, evaluate your own professional...Read more


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Trey Ratcliff
I'm a warm-hearted, old-school gentleman explorer with really cool toys. INTJ. Browncoat.
1646 / 2685
Slow Motion Sunset on the Color-Thickened Lake
The sunsets in the summer here last about 2-3 hours. Once you get around 45 degrees latitude and beyond, the sun does not sink right into the horizon. Instead, it slides sideways into the horizon like A-Rod stealing second in slow motion. This means the colors change very very slowly, and sunset is a nice, long relaxed photography session rather than a high-pressure one.
- Trey Ratcliff
Click here to read the rest of this post at the Stuck in Customs blog.
pacificnew ZealandAotearoasouth islandTe Wai PounamuTe Waka a MauiotagoqueenstownresorttownbaywakatipulakevillagecityballsculpturesunsetpierboardwalkbridgemountainswaterreflectionFebruary2013Nikon d80077BigRetag


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Definitions for camaraderieˌkɑ məˈrɑ də ri, -ˈræd ə-, ˌkæm ə-
This page provides all possible meanings and translations of the word camaraderie
Princeton's WordNet
chumminess, camaraderie, comradeliness, comradery, comradeship(noun)
the quality of affording easy familiarity and sociability
Close friendship in a group of friends or teammates.
A spirit of familiarity and closeness
Origin: from camarada, from cámara, from camara, camera; see chamber. Literally "one with whom one shares one's bedroom". Compare comrade.
Chambers 20th Century Dictionary
kam-a-rad-rē′, n. good-fellowship: the intimacy of comradeship. [Fr.]
Chaldean Numerology
The numerical value of camaraderie in Chaldean Numerology is: 2
Pythagorean Numerology
The numerical value of camaraderie in Pythagorean Numerology is: 6
Sample Sentences & Example Usage
I love the camaraderie.
There is camaraderie among mothers that is helping mothers to save.
I'm sure he was saying it just to try and generate some camaraderie with a veteran. He could've just said I'm a vet too.
These kids, these men, are coming back and have seen some serious combat action, people really want to be part of something. They lose that camaraderie … after returning from war.
So much of the healing happens through camaraderie— through team and friendships, our belief is really that helping and healing disabled veterans is not a one-time event. We are mentors, healers and friends on their journey.
Images & Illustrations of camaraderie
Translations for camaraderie
From our Multilingual Translation Dictionary
- camaraderiaCatalan, Valencian
- KameradschaftGerman
- συναδελφικότητα, συντροφικότηταGreek
- camaraderíaSpanish
- camaraderieFrench
- समितिHindi
- góð samskipti, góður kunningsskapur, félagsandiIcelandic
- 友情Japanese
- kameraderiNorwegian
- kameraadschapDutch
- това́рищество, дру́жбаRussian
- камарадерија, kamaraderijaSerbo-Croatian
- kamratskapSwedish
- 友情Chinese
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Use the citation below to add this definition to your bibliography:
"camaraderie." Definitions.net. STANDS4 LLC, 2017. Web. 25 Feb. 2017. <http://www.definitions.net/definition/camaraderie>.


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Lisa Gade reviews the Lenovo IdeaPad Y500 gaming and multimedia notebook. This is a 15.6″ Windows 8 64 bit laptop with a full HD display, 2.4GHz quad core Intel Core-i7 CPU, 8 or 16 gigs of RAM, an HDD with optional 16 gig caching SSD and best of all, dual NVidia GT650M graphics cards in SLI. One is on the motherboard and the other is in the Ultrabay (yes, you can remove it and swap in a DVD burner or HDD caddy). The price is $1,100 to 1,200 at retailers, though Lenovo.com often has it on sale for less. It's a great machine for the price. Other goodies include a backlit keyboard, dual band Intel WiFi, Bluetooth and a 1MP webcam.
Read our written review here: http://www.mobiletechreview.com/notebooks/Lenovo-IdeaPad-Y500.htm
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Prama Sanur Beach Bali (previously Sanur Beach Hotel Bali), Denpasar
- Free WiFi and free parking
Main amenities
- 428 guestrooms
- On a private beach
- 3 restaurants and 3 bars/lounges
- Full-service spa
- Outdoor pool
- Water park
- Breakfast available
- Free area shuttle
- Outdoor tennis court
- Beach umbrellas
- Conference center
- Airport shuttle
For families
- Babysitting or childcare
- Children's pool
- Children's club
- Playground on site
- Babysitting or childcare (surcharge)
- Children's club (surcharge)
What's around
- In Sanur
- Sanur Beach (2.9 mi / 4.7 km)
- Hardy's Supermarket (1.2 mi / 2 km)
- Mermaid Liveaboards (1.4 mi / 2.2 km)
- Nogo - Bali Ikat Centre (1.5 mi / 2.4 km)
- Bali Quad Discovery Tours (1.9 mi / 3.1 km)
Prama Sanur Beach Bali (previously Sanur Beach Hotel Bali), Denpasar
Hotel Info: (02) 8228 1927from A$114
- Deluxe Room, Garden View
- Deluxe Room, Sea View
- Club Suite, Balcony, Garden View
- Interconnecting at Club Room
- Suite
- Club Room, Balcony, Garden View
- Standard Room
- One Bedroom Pool Villa
- Special Offer - Two Superior Rooms
- Superior Room
More great choices
At a glance
Key facts
Hotel size
- This hotel has 428 rooms
- This hotel is arranged over 4 floors
- 24-hour check-in
- Check-out time is noon
Required at check in
- Credit card or cash deposit required
- Government-issued photo ID required
Travelling with others
- Babysitting/childcare *
- Children's club *
- Pets not allowed
- Free WiFi in public areas
- Free WiFi in rooms
- Airport shuttle (available 24 hours) *
- Free self parking
- Free area shuttle within 800 meters
Nearby Four Star Denpasar hotels
In the hotel
- Children's club (surcharge)
- Supervised childcare/activities (surcharge)
- Buffet breakfast (surcharge)
- 3 restaurants
- 3 bars/lounges
- Beach bar
- Swim-up bar
- Poolside bar
- 24-hour room service
- On private beach
- Beach sun loungers
- Water park
- Outdoor pool
- Fitness facilities
- Outdoor tennis court
- Full-service spa
- Spa treatment room(s)
- Beach umbrellas
- Children's pool
- Tennis on site
- Beach towels
- Waterslide
- Swim-up bar
- Pool sun loungers
- Pool umbrellas
- Billiards or pool table
- Business center
- Number of meeting rooms - 5
- Conference space
- Meeting rooms 5
- Conference center
- 24-hour front desk
- Concierge services
- Tours/ticket assistance
- Dry cleaning/laundry service
- Laundry facilities
- Hair salon
- Free newspapers in lobby
- Wedding services
- Multilingual staff
- Porter/bellhop
- Year Built 1971
- Elevator/lift
- ATM/banking
- Safe-deposit box at front desk
- Garden
- Terrace
In the room
- Air conditioning
- Minibar
- Coffee/tea maker
- Blackout drapes/curtains
- Turndown service
- Balcony
- Private bathroom
- Shower only
- Hair dryer
- Cable TV channels
- Desk
- Free WiFi
- Free bottled water
- Daily housekeeping
- In-room safe
- Access via exterior corridors
Top Denpasar hotels
Recently reviewed hotels in Denpasar
- The Royal Beach Seminyak Bali - MGallery CollectionFrom
"Great hotel with beautiful grounds that are well maintained. Great pool and restaurant area with views to the beach. Adults only pool also. Rooms could do with a bit of an…"Jan 15, 2017
- KUTA SEAVIEW Boutique Resort & SpaFrom
"I was very pleased with my acomadation, the rooms are extremely well furnised, and very clean. the staff are very friendly and eager to serve you. However, I had a very bad…"Jan 14, 2017
- Koenokoeni VillaFrom
"Good quiet location in Seminyak. It is a quality establishment. We think it was good value and we were very comfortable. I should add, very private villa with a great pool and…"Jan 14, 2017
- Rock 'n Reef HotelFrom
"Rick's Reef is a sensational boutique hotel. Gorgeous rooms with amazing views of the ocean and waves crashing on the rocks below your room. Access is along a narrow path and…"Jan 13, 2017
Nearby hotels
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Special features
Aroma Spa has 4 treatment rooms including rooms for couples and outdoor treatment areas. Services include massages, facials, body wraps, and body scrubs. The spa is equipped with a spa tub. A variety of treatment therapies are provided, including aromatherapy and reflexology.
DiningTirta Poolside Restaurant - This poolside restaurant serves breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Guests can enjoy drinks at the bar.
Lada Restaurant - This beachfront restaurant specializes in Indonesian cuisine and serves lunch and dinner. Guests can enjoy drinks at the bar.
Basilico Italian - This beach restaurant specializes in Italian cuisine and serves lunch and dinner. Guests can enjoy drinks at the bar.
Bamboo - This bar is located on the beach.
On Site
- Fitness facilities
- Outdoor tennis court
- Tennis on site
- Basketball on site
- Bicycle rentals on site
- Playground on site
- Tennis lessons on site
- Volleyball on site
- Golf lessons available nearby
- Kayaking nearby
- Parasailing nearby
- Sailing nearby
- Scuba diving nearby
- Snorkeling nearby
- Surfing/boogie boarding nearby
- Windsurfing nearby
Prama Sanur Beach Bali (previously Sanur Beach Hotel Bali), Denpasar's small print
Also known as
- Sanur Beach
- Sanur Beach Hotel
- Prama Sanur Beach Bali previously Sanur Beach Hotel Bali
- Prama Bali previously Hotel Bali
- Prama Sanur Beach Bali previously Sanur Beach Bali
- Prama Bali previously Bali
For transfers, guests must contact the property before arrival at the number on the booking confirmation.
Reservations are required for massage services and spa treatments and can be made by contacting the property before arrival at the number on the booking confirmation.
Mandatory fees
The charges below are included in the total price displayed:
- New Year's Eve gala dinner fee for stays on 31 December
Optional extras
Rollaway beds are available for USD 35 per night
Buffet breakfast is offered for an extra charge of USD 15 per person (approximately)
Children's club access is available for an extra charge
Babysitting/childcare is available for an extra charge
Airport shuttle service is offered for an extra charge of USD 30 per vehicle (one way)
We have included all charges provided to us by this hotel. However, charges can vary, for example, based on length of stay or the room you book.
Recent reviews
Excellent 4.0 /5 from 228 reviews
Really enjoyable 5 night stay. Great spacious clean well appointed room comfortable bedding and pillows luxury linen and towelling. Excellent bathroom and shower. Fast WiFi and complimentary bottled water. Beautiful grounds, pools and beach. Exceptional friendly and helpful staff. Good choice of restaurants and buffet breakfast. Only negative is the hot food wasn't hot. Great Full Moom entertainment evening food and dance performance. Would definitely return.
We weren't expecting a lot from this hotel based on other reviews however we were more disappointed than expected. From waiting over an hour for our room then being given someone else's room before eventually getting our room, it wasn't a great start. Then our room was very old and smelly with uneven floors, peeling paint, broken mirrors etc we felt like we were in a 2 star motel. Don't stay in rooms 110-112. Pool area looks nice from a distance but is in need of a good refurbish with mouldy, chipped and very slippery tiles. Location is good. Wouldn't recommend staying here.
The room was dated but clean. Pool could do with a facelift, there was quite a bit of algae on the tiles. Restaurants were good and staff very friendly.
4th time we've stayed at the hotel and it just gets better every year. The in-house restaurants / meals have become better value for money and are of a high standard. It is predominantly filled with German and Danish guests and the demographic is on average 60 plus years old. The pools are great.
Few hiccups at the resort initially, ie the room wasn't ready when we arrived which was after 2pm and we had to wait about an hour with no explanation (even though I was asking). The bedding was clean but stained.... however the domestic people were close and changed it quickly enough. Great location, food, pool, resort. Inclusive breakfast huge and delicious. Would definitely stay there again if we travelled to Bali again
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Pair Madeleine French Country Oval Velvet Dining Side Chair
Fit for a luxurious queen's table, this pair of velvet oval dining chairs makes any dinner into a textured, sensual affair. Each of these French country chairs ... more
- 40 inches high x 21 inches wide x 21 inches deep
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- Upholstered in mink beige velvet on seat front and back
- Item sold as a pair
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On my birthday last Tuesday, my birthplace of Denham Springs, Louisiana, was 90 percent underwater. My grandparents' house in Baton Rouge—to which my parents took me when I was only a few hours old—was empty and destroyed, filled with feet of mudflow and floodwater.
My grandparents were safe. In the boat of a neighbor escaping his own home along the flooded street, they evacuated the house they'd lived in for almost 50 years, leaving just as water began to flow across its floors. When the floodwaters receded several days later, they entered their house only to learn that they had lost almost everything they owned.
This past Sunday, my grandmother called me at my home in the Midwest and together we worked through her online FEMA disaster assistance application. One of the first questions to answer was something along the lines of, "where are you staying?" I knew the answer: she and my grandfather are staying with one of their daughters, an aunt of mine whose home didn't flood. But my grandmother had a slightly different answer. "With family," she said. "And we couldn't be better taken care of."
I was floored that she could think of her situation so positively. But that sort of resilience, gratitude, and generosity has marked the response to the recent natural disaster in Louisiana. As tens of thousands of homes were destroyed by rising floodwater, civilians with boats—the so-called "Cajun Navy"—have rescued thousands of neighbors and friends and strangers. They've brought supplies where cars couldn't go, traveling in the flat-bottomed boats that seemingly every sporting household owns. (My dad hasn't lived in Louisiana since 1990, but he still has his pirogue.) And then there's the response from the people of New Orleans, who know better than anyone about the heartbreak of a flooded city. The headline of this article—"Dear Baton Rouge: New Orleans has your back"—says it all.
Louisiana will recover. It always does. But the process will be long and difficult, and people will be leaning on one another, because there's no other way to survive when you don't have power for weeks and there aren't any groceries in the stores. Or when power returns and store shelves are stocked, but you have four feet of black mold in your house. And so on.
The day after my grandmother and I went through the disaster assistance application, my brother's wife (who does not live in Louisiana) delivered a healthy baby girl. My aunt in Baton Rouge, exhausted from helping my similarly-exhausted grandparents figure out the process of recovery, said upon hearing of the birth: "Wonderful news to welcome new life in this old tired world."
It does seem tired. Tired and numb. I'm so sad for my relatives, and all the thousands who lost everything, and for the people who even lost their lives. But when I saw pictures of my baby niece, sleeping in the arms of her loving mother and father, it didn't seem so tired anymore.
The state song of Louisiana is "You Are My Sunshine." It's melancholy and hopeful at once—and so it seems as good a way as any to end this post. I haven't been thinking of much lately except for my first home state, so there was nothing else I could write about today. Thanks for reading. And thanks, always, for being here.
My mom died when I was in my early 20s. She and my dad had been married for nearly 27 years. My father, who was young for a widower, was bereft. We all were, but while my brother and I had our lives ahead of us, my dad had lost his best friend, his partner and soulmate. Never one to give up, about a year later, he started going to a support group for widows and widowers. Little did he know when he joined, that group would not only help him deal with his unspeakable grief, it would prepare him to love again and lead him to the next love of his life.
The woman who would eventually become his second wife (and I must add that I couldn't have hand-picked a better stepmom) was in that same group. She'd recently lost her husband of decades and had turned to the "Rebounders" for help, too. It was so beautiful to watch two brokenhearted people become whole again and take a second chance at love. While neither could "replace" the other's first spouse (or my natural mother or my step-siblings' natural father), our families became whole again, too.
Their story of the healing power of love was the spark for my new book CELEBRATION'S FAMILY. My hero, Dr. Liam Thayer, lost his wife in a tragic accident. While my heroine, Kate Macintyre had never married, she'd still experienced more than her share of personal loss. Just when it seemed like life was at its darkest, they met and love lit the way to a brighter future together.
Just to be clear, my stepmom never goaded my dad into participating in a bachelor auction as Kate persuades Liam (Thank God! I must admit I probably wouldn't have been as gung-ho about the idea as Liam's little daughters are in the book. Come on, guys, this is my dad were talking about!). But the healing power of love is at the heart of both CELEBRATION'S FAMILY and my parents' story. I hope it's something we can all count on in our darkest hour.
Do you have your own "power of love" story? Or can you think of a movie or book that celebrates healing love? Or just tell me what you think of how they depicted Liam on the cover. Isn't he gorgeous?! I'll give away a copy of CELEBRATION'S FAMILY to TWO people who comment.
RT Book Reviews gave CELEBRATION'S FAMILY 4 stars and said, "Thompson's broken, heartwarming couple are engrossing as they find love after tragedy in this terrific installment in the Celebrations miniseries. Supporting characters like the chocolitier /matchmaker will charm, and the doctor's twin girls add the perfect "aww!" factor."
Here's a quick look at CELEBRATION'S FAMILY'S first scene (Q&A and contest follow):
A bachelor auction?
Dr. Liam Thayer waited for Cullen Dunlevy, Celebration Memorial's chief of staff, to crack a smile, or indicate he and the pretty blonde in the business suit at his side were delivering a bad joke to lighten up the impromptu staff meeting.
Please. He could use a little levity to jolt him out of his bad mood. It had been one of those mornings. The twins, Amanda and Calee, hadn't wanted to get out of bed. Five minutes before they were supposed to walk out the door, Amanda remembered that she was supposed to bring cupcakes for an after-school club meeting.
To spur the girls along, he'd said, if they left on time, they could stop at the grocery store on the way. But then the dog got out, running several victory laps around the neighborhood, before Liam had been able to wrangle, harness and deliver him home.
They didn't have time to stop for cupcakes, and by the time he'd deposited the girls at Celebration Middle School, they were all out of sorts. Well, he and Amanda were. Not Calee, who lived in her own little world of sugar-plum fairies and nutcracker princes. As long as Calee was dancing, the world was a beautiful place. She was so much like her mother, who had also been a ballerina, before she'd given it all up to marry Liam and start a family.
He and Amanda, on the other hand, seemed to be cast from the same mold. This morning he'd left her with a promise that their housekeeper, Rosalinda, would leave a dozen cupcakes at the school's front desk in time for this afternoon's club meeting—which Amanda would have to cut short because she and her sister couldn't be late for their dance class.
Amanda had been dubious and a little surly. She hadn't wanted to go to dance class today.
"Why can't Rosie take Calee while I stay at the club meeting? Then Rosie can come back and get me. Or better yet, why can't I skip dance altogether?"
"Because you have a commitment, and Rosie doesn't need to be running herself ragged to accommodate you. She's already going out of her way to make sure you get the cupcakes."
It had only made matters worse when Liam had snapped, "Next time maybe you'll remember to tell me these things before we're walking out the door."
He shouldn't have said it. Not like that, dammit. Even if it was true and a lesson she needed to learn. Now, as he sat there in the conference room trying to change gears from dad mode to doctor, he couldn't get the image of Amanda's sad face out of his head.
At that moment he missed his wife, Joy, so much it almost leveled him. She'd always taken care of things like cupcakes, permission slips and new ballet shoes. She'd had an uncanny ability to almost read their daughters' minds or, on the off chance when they did end up in a bind—like they had this morning—she'd always been able to pull a rabbit out of her hat and make things work.
Liam didn't know how she'd managed it. She had been perfect like that. Tiny, intuitive and good-natured, Joy had always been all about her family.
A series of sickening flashbacks transported Liam to that night when the cop had stood on their front porch and asked, "Is this the residence of Joy Thayer?" He'd told Liam that there'd been an accident but wouldn't give him much information, just asked if he would come to the hospital. When he'd identified his wife's body, his life and the lives of their daughters had shattered into a million irreparable pieces.
Liam scrubbed a hand over his eyes, trying to erase the memory. It had been two years. When would life without Joy get easier? When would the numbness give way to the manageable ache that the grief counselor had promised would come in time? Maybe never. Because part of his soul had died right along with his wife that night. The part that lived and laughed and felt.
Now his daughters kept him going. Because life didn't stop to mourn. Hell, it didn't even slow down to regroup. It kept marching forward, and, if you didn't get on your feet fast, it would drag you right along behind it.
He refocused, irritated that he had to waste time this morning listening to the chief and this woman rattle on about…bachelor auctions? For God's sake.
This had to be a joke.
But a sinking feeling warned him not to bank on Dunlevy delivering the punch line. Especially when his boss glanced over at the blonde and uncharacteristic warmth drew up the edges of his mouth.
"This is Kate Macintyre of the Macintyre Family Foundation," said Dunlevy. "She and her staff have been working tirelessly to raise money for the new pediatric surgical wing here at Celebration Memorial Hospital. I'll turn the meeting over to her and let her tell you more."
The new surgical wing—Joy had been excited about it. In fact she'd been one of the first volunteers to organize a kick-starter fund-raiser.
"Good morning," said the blonde.
What was her name again?
"Thank you, Dr. Dunlevy. I appreciate you letting me attend your meeting today. Even more I am grateful that each of you has agreed to help raise money for the final leg of funding for this very special project. This pediatric wing is extremely near and dear to my family and me. I appreciate you all taking an active role in making it a reality."
Near and dear to her family? Liam glanced at her left hand. She wasn't wearing a wedding ring. Reflexively his thumb found the back of the band he still wore. It was the touchstone that kept him grounded, and reminded him of what was and always would be important in life. Family.
The blonde smiled at Liam's colleague, Charlie Benton, an internist, who was seated to her left. She held out a stack of pamphlets. "Would you mind taking one of these and passing them around, please?"
Eagerly Charlie obeyed.
Great. Judging by the look on his coworker's face, Liam would bet, if she'd asked Charlie to run out to fetch her a bagel and a cappuccino, he would've fallen all over himself to oblige. Liam glanced around at the other men in the room. They all seemed transfixed, too. Apparently Liam was the only one immune to a pretty face and a great pair of legs.
"For the past three years, the Macintyre Family Foundation has partnered with the hospital to raise money to build a much-needed pediatric surgical wing," she said. "During this time we've been diligently working with the hospital's Department of Charitable Giving. They've been amazing. We only need 5 percent more to reach our two-million-dollar goal.
"That's why we were delighted when Dr. Dunlevy agreed to the idea of giving you all, the doctors of Celebration Memorial, the opportunity to play a key role in raising part of the remaining funds. When I learned that I'd be working with seven single male doctors, I thought, what was the chance of that?"
Her blue eyes sparkled as she looked from one face to the next, radiating enthusiasm and sincerity. She was doing a credible job.
"With seven eligible men, it only seemed natural to hold a bachelor auction. So, everyone, please save the date—one week from Saturday—for our first-ever In Celebration of Bachelors auction."
Liam shifted in his seat, resisting the urge to excuse himself. This bachelor auction was not a joke, but there was no way in hell that he was going to subject himself to the humiliation of being sold off to the highest bidder. Even if the shenanigan would raise money for a good cause.
As a pediatric hospitalist and a single father to two teenagers, he didn't have enough time to devote to his daughters on a good day. He certainly didn't want to waste a night going out on a date with a woman who'd bid on him like a steer in a cattle sale. He might have been providing all the necessities, but he hadn't been able to give his children as much of himself as he wished he could. Not like his wife, who had always been there for them emotionally.
And, he had to admit, at the root of everything, participating in something like this felt disrespectful to Joy. Even if she was gone, it didn't mean he felt any less married. Certainly not single.
"Is something wrong, Dr. Thayer?" Cullen asked. "You look like you smell something."
Liam clicked his ink pen. He wanted to say, There's nothing like the stench of a bad idea first thing in the morning. But one glance at Kate Macintyre's hopeful expression—Kate Macintyre, that was her name—and he was weighing his words. "Is this bachelor auction idea a done deal? Do we have any other options?"
Q: CELEBRATION'S FAMILY has been getting some nice reviews!
Nancy Robards Thompson: I'm so grateful that it has been well received! RT Book Reviews Magazine gave it four stars and said, "Thompson's broken, heartwarming couple are engrossing as they find love after tragedy in this terrific installment in the Celebrations miniseries. Supporting characters like the chocolatier/matchmaker will charm, and the doctor's twin girls add the perfect "aww!" factor."
Q: That's great news! Where did you get the idea for CELEBRATION'S FAMILY?
NRT: Liam and Kate's story is the fifth book in the Celebration's, Inc. series. My heroine, Kate Macintyre, has been featured in a couple of other books in the series and it was high time she found her soulmate. I've always been intrigued by the thought of a bachelor auction. What could be more fun than an auction full of eligible doctor bachelors?
Q: Tell us about the hero of the book? Why will we fall in love with him?
NRT: Dr. Liam Thayer believes true love only happens once in a lifetime. He fell in love with and married his high school sweetheart. They had two perfect decades together before she died in a tragic accident. The loss turned life upside down for Liam and his thirteen-year-old twins.
Q: Tell us about the heroine. Why is she the absolute perfect woman for the hero?
NRT: Kate Macintyre would like to believe in true love and happily ever after, but she's never experienced anything remotely like it. Well, until she falls in love with the grieving Dr. Thayer and his adorable daughters.
Q: What life-lesson do your Hero and Heroine have to learn before they can find their happily-ever-after?
NRT: Liam believes that true love happens only once in a lifetime and Kate has never been in love. To reach their happily ever after, Liam has to believe that looking to the future doesn't mean he has to forget about or devalue his first marriage. Kate has to allow herself to be vulnerable and open to love. Together, as they become a family, they heal each others' wounds and become whole again.
Q: What was your favorite scene to write?
NRT: That's a toss-up between two scenes: the bachelor auction, because, of course, Kate's seemingly foolproof plan to get Liam off the hook by placing the winning bid for the date with Liam goes absolutely awry; and the Doctor's Ball, which takes place in the ballroom of a swanky Dallas hotel. I love writing scenes like the Doctor's Ball because they're so glamorous and romantic.
Q: Is there an underlying theme to the story?
NRT: CELEBRATION'S FAMILY is about the bond of family and second chances at love. Those are powerful themes to which so many of us can relate, and that's why I believe readers will enjoy this book.
Now, I have a question for you: What themes do you like to read about? Family? Love at first sight? Friends to lovers? Reunion stories? In "celebration" of her new release, I'm giving away a $10 Amazon gift card to one lucky person who posts. Check back on Sunday when I post the winner's name.
This is Nancy's eighteenth book for Harlequin and the fifth book in her Celebrations, Inc. mini-series. For more information please check out her website NancyRobardsThompson.com or connect with her on Facebook (Nancy Robards Thompson Author) and Twitter @NRTWrites.
How They Met Themselves, Dante Gabriel Rossetti, watercolor, 1864
Not long ago the Norwegian and I were out for dinner when a complete stranger approached me and asked if I had seen the show Breaking Bad. I hadn't, but he told me that Anna Gunn, the woman who plays Skyler White on the show, was my doppelgänger.
I looked her up when I got home. I could see a vague resemblance in the photograph. Of course, it piqued my curiosity about the show, especially since it has garnered so many awards. I started watching it and now I joke that I have a serious meth addiction. Really, I don't. And I know drug addiction is no laughing matter, but the show's writing is incredible and the acting is superb… But I digress.
Anna Gunn
They say everyone has a double. I guess mine might be Anna Gunn – sort of. We're not identical. Our noses are completely different, and once I started watching the show and saw a more dimensional version of the actress, I thought she and I resembled each other less. Sometimes I think mannerisms and certain expressions make people similar even if they don't look alike. In fact, that's one of the story lines in my book, Celebration's Baby, which will be out in April 2014. A secondary character, Maya, lost the love of her life years ago. He died in an accident and she hasn't been able to love since. Fast forward years later, a man who reminds her of her old love shows up. She can't decide if she's attracted to him because he reminds her of her dead lover or if her heart is truly ready to love again.
He's not exactly a doppelgänger, not in the true sense of the word. Then again, the meaning of the word has changed over the years. In folklore, doppelgängers are perceived as sinister versions of a person – an evil twin. In the old days, when you saw your doppelgänger, it was a harbinger of bad luck or an omen of death.
But, of course, the contemporary meaning of doppelgänger is simply a look-alike. Doppelgängers are a running gag through the sitcom How I Met Your Mother: at one time or another, the characters have spotted uncanny look a likes of each other, except for Barney (Neil Patrick Harris's character). The absence of his doppelgänger is used as a significant plotline, which I won't spoil in case you haven't seen the show and want to.
Who's your doppelgänger?
Celebration's Bride is available now!
RT Book Reviews gives Celebration's Bride 4.5 stars and says, "Thompson's reality TV show setup rocks the pages with its quirky cast. Her couples' imperfections make them realistic and alluring…."
Coming soon:
Celebration's Family – February 2014
Celebration's Baby – April 2014
It's May which means it's my birthday month, though that's not really what I want to talk about today (but feel free to send gifts b/c I love presents.) May also is the month when Brenda Novak hosts her annual on-line auction for Diabetes research. To date her auctions have raised over a million dollars. You can bid on anything from meet & greets with authors to fabulous vacations to jewelry. There's truly something for everyone. I've donated to this auction for many years, but a few years ago the cause came near and dear to those I love and now it means so much more.
When The Professor and I started dating he was finishing up his PhD and living with his best friend since 2nd grade who was also completing a PhD – my fella had moved to Austin (from their native OH) before Jeff came, but then they were roommates until Jeff got married. While the Professor and I were falling in love I got to know Jeff and his then fiancé, Rendy – they were planning their wedding and their future. He was one of those big dreamers, lots of plans for the future, wanting the best and the most of everything. He was fiercely smart and though he could be a toad at times (what man can't?) he was crazy about the Professor and I know would have done anything for him.
He stood next to the Professor at our wedding, gave an amazing best man speech that made me cry. There we were two married couples and for a while we all lived in the same city and we'd have dinner on occasion. Then we all moved, us to Tennessee and them to Ohio. First jobs, first homes, we were on our way. We visited each other in our perspective homes, saw each other for holidays and the guys talked for hours on the phone every month or so.
Then we moved back to Texas and the week The Professor started his job here we got the call. Jeff had died. A victim of his juvenile diabetes. He was 33 and he and his wife had just celebrated their 5th wedding anniversary. The Professor was heartbroken. He gave the eulogy at Jeff's funeral. And all of a sudden this auction that I'd donated to because I knew it was a good cause came home to the DeHart house.
So here we are in May once again and I don't know if you've had Diabetes affect anyone you know and love, but it is a devestating disease that affects millions of children and their families. If you are so inclined I'd encourage you to go over and see if there's something you would be interested in bidding on – or you can also simply make a cash donation. I've linked the image at the top of this post to the auction. Also, here are the two items I've personally donated.
The winner of this auction will receive a complimentary copy, in the winner's choice of digital file, of all of Robyn DeHart's Entangled Scandalous titles
All the books in her current Forbidden Love series:
Also included will be copies of her upcoming trilogy (releasing in 2014), THE BROTHERHOOD OF THE SWORD.
One-on-One Character Mentoring from award-winning author Robyn DeHart
Popular writing instructor and award-winning author Robyn DeHart is known for creating authentic characters that readerslove. Here she'll offer one-on-one character mentoring. Get personal assistance with creating your characters from the GMC to character arcs to how to use your characters to grow the plot of your book.
**If you're attending RWA National Conference this summer in Atlanta, GA (July 17-20, 2013), Robyn will even throw in a short meeting for coffee to get the ball rolling.
So what's your favorite charity to donate to, whether it be time or money? I'm giving away 3 copies of the first book in my Forbidden Love series, A Little Bit Wicked, so comment and you could win!


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The Nevada Supreme Court ruled unanimously that casino employees are allowed to share tips with supervisors, and the case has been remanded to district court. The case stemmed from a policy at Wynn Resorts that implemented tip-pooling at its Wynn Las Vegas casino. "We review our decisions carefully before we implement any change affecting our employees," said Steve Wynn, chairman and CEO of Wynn Resorts.
Full Story:Las Vegas Review-Journal


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Hotel Maes-y-Neuadd
No prices found through our partners. Please contact the business directly or check some of our recommended alternatives.
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TripAdvisor Reviews Hotel Carrera Rottach-Egern
Travel Blogs from Harlech
Going to the NORTH...
... area, a "bedroom" just big enough to fit a two person bed in and a toilet. A urine-separating toilet. Yes, the campsite was very eco-friendly!
The cabin was super cosy for couples, but throw a tree year old in the mix and it suddenly becomes a lot smaller. Good thing she's such a sweet girl.
In the end, we all fitted inside the little cabin and after a good homecooked meal we all went to bed.
Ready for the next adventure!
West Wales
... a conversation in Welsh and speak English as well. Very unusual. The people and the countryside here are wonderful. The landscape is lovely forested mountains with stone walled cottages and villages scattered along the way, and the rugged Atlantic coast appearing at times.
The Brecon Beacons
... is 182 miles long. We went back to the hotel for a nap before dinner. This is another manor house which has been in the family for multiple generations. Our room is large, with a fireplace, couch and large bathroom. Really nice and comfortable. This might be my favourite hotel so far. Dinner was delicious. Again the Welsh custom of starting in the bar with a drink. Your order is taken there and then you are escorted into the ...
Anglesey, Wales
Anglesey is a beautiful, pastoral island off the north east coast of Wales. On the mainland side are the mountains of Snowdonia. As soon as you cross the bridge onto the island of Anglesey, the land flattens out and features fields and sheep. Another beautiful day..the fields are lush and green. Our hotel, Tre-Ysgawen hall, reminds me a lot of The Briars. A wonderful old manor house that has been converted into a hotel. The grounds are green ...
The Land That Vowels Forgot
... and free, national treasure. We wandered through the various old work shops until 2 when we watched a brief movie about the history of the mining operation. Then an old miner gave us a demonstration of slate cutting and rock splitting; very interesting. He gets 2 pence for every piece of slate he cuts and the company sells it for up to £8. Once again, a large part of the message was the independent spirit of the Welsh ...


text:
Talk:Ergodic literature
|WikiProject Literature
|(Rated Start-class, Low-importance)
Cleanup efforts[edit]
Most of the works listed here as ergodic literature are clearly NOT ergodic literature based on Espen Aarseth's definition and the term's use in academic texts. This article really needs clearing up - I'll try and contribute but can't right now. [http://grandtextauto.gatech.edu/2005/08/12/clarifying-ergodic-and-cybertext/ Noah Wardrip-Fruin's discussion of what cybertext and ergodic really mean would be a useful source in editing this, but of course it's Aarseth's book Cybertext that is the primary source, as this is where the term was coined and defined. Future developments and uses of the term should be discussed too, which requires more work. For now I've removed the most obviously false examples of ergodic literature and I've flagged the article as needing attention from an expert. Lijil 11:59, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
OK; I've fixed a lot - deleted the bits about how works with some non-linear chronology can be ergodic. I deleted the confusing list of examples and put in a list of texts Aarseth refers to as ergodic instead (from Noah's discussion of the book) and added both Cybertext itself and Noah's discussion to the list of references. Plenty left to do. --Lijil 13:11, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
Does "The Sound and the Fury" by Faulkner qualify as Ergodic? It's read front-to-back, but then again so is Burroughs, and it requires considerable effort by the reader to keep track of where you are in time -- which often changes midparagraph -- and which characters are speaking. And then there's the name changes.
Just added the links to FF (which seemed appropriate from the definition) and the pieces of "Ergodic literature" I found from another article online. I'm still not quite clear on what Ergodic literature is? If were reading the copy of the Count of Monte Cristo here then would it count as Ergodic Literature, since I need to click on a hyperlink to move through the chapters? If someone reads something by Will Self and keeps needing to reach for a dictionary does this turn Will Self's book into Ergodic Literature? These examples might seem Pathological, but 253 exists both as an novel and as a proper book. One can read the physical book sequentially, no flicking back and forth from the descriptions of interelated passengers is necessary - but is quite irresistable. Is the physical book Ergodic? Is Ergodic Literature only intended to refer to HyperFiction?
A Sample Chapter from Cybertext: Perspectives on Ergodic Literature from which the term Ergodic seems to have come from. I would try and answer the questions I have asked by trying to read it, but it's late and it seems quite dense - but if anyone else wants to tighten up this article that might be a place to start. Number 0 03:04, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC)
- Hopefully some of these questions are answered by the slightly improved definition ont he article page - it still needs more work. Ergodic literature is a very specific term and you absolutely should read Aarseth's book to understand it. Lijil 07:45, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
I Ching[edit]
What "critics of ergodic literature" consider the I Ching to be an example of the style? It wasn't constructed to be read as a text; unless someone can cite this claim it should be deleted.
- Espen Aarseth explicitly gives the I Ching as an example of ergodic literature. I'll add a page reference when I'm back at the office with the book. --Lijil 11:59, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
House of Leaves[edit]
Has anyone else read House of Leaves by Mark Z. Danielewski? Its a pretty good example of ergodic literature, and well worth reading. And do the muds really count? It would seem to me they are no more this than any sort of video game... Sklarface 05:54, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- House of Leaves is a great book, and I suppose it counts as ergodic literature as much as Apollinaire's Calligrammes, which are also characterised by their unusual layout, requiring the reader to move his/her eyes in different ways than a conventional top to bottom, left to write text. I don't think we should simply add more and more examples, though - I think the list will get entirely out of hand (again) and that a better strategy is to work on clarifying the definition as given. MUDs are quite definitely an example of ergodic literature, and Aarseth devotes a whole chapter to them in the book that defines ergodic literature - ergodic literature is literature (written words) that require a non-trivial effort to traverse on the part of the reader. Print books with odd layouts are just one kind, and not the most common kind, either. Lijil 07:45, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- Also with the house of leaves (Not so obvious on the surface) are the codes and sequences contained within. Some paragraphs and lines are spaced in different formations to symbolize morse code (SOS), you need to hold four pages together and up to a light to reveal a picture, some reconstructing of pages using "codes" provided by the characters change the meaning of a passage entirely, the list goes on. I am working on a book of Ergodic Literature myself and find it tough to stick within the guidelines. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 01:23, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
- Besides being specifically cited in the Aarseth text, MUDs-- especially role-playing enforced MUDs-- exist to do little more than let a group of people tell a narrative. There's a hack and slash framework built into a lot of them, but the storyline in an RP MUD is considered the whole point of the game. JoshOak (talk) 21:30, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
- As of today, I no longer see any reference to House of Leaves in the article text, but I also don't see any recent edits that deleted it. Am I missing something? The book itself is great, and a good contemporary (relative to the application of the term "ergodic" to literature) example of the theory. ExecutorElassus (talk) 14:17, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
Does "ergodic" require that the text be dependant on the reader? For instance, would the copious note-taking required to follow Dream of the Red Chamber or similarly populous novels count as a "non-trivial effort"? Again, would a comic with ambiguously placed panels that do not immediately suggest an order, but still have an intended order, require "non-trivial effort"? Rozencrantz 05:43, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
What about puzzle books and those puzzles where you put together blocks of letters and the final result spells a quotation?
Mathematical proofs?
Riddles and such where you have to rot-13 or turn the page to check the answer?
- The same goes for various children's books, e.g., pop-up books, choose-your-own-adventures, and (especially!) things like Barbie Mix and Match Fashions Sectioned Flip Book. I can think of a handful of published cybertexts that use almost the same exact traversal mechanics.
- I think the larger issue here is ergodic text versus ergodic literature. To illustrate my point, is a TV commercial considered film? If I can relate to the guy on the TV screen with a headache, or empathize with the mom scrubbing soap scum off the shower tile, or feel for the characters in the Zoloft commercial, then why is it in a different category than a short film? In the hegemonic structure, the only way we justify the distinction, of course, is by placing requirements on the impetus or motive that precipitates the end result. Therefore, commercially motivated works don't count; works associated with mathmematics, science, and research do not count; entertainment doesn't count.
- The main problem with this method of classification is that it does not accomodate works with multiple, unclear, or missing motivations (e.g., video games, multi-authored works, computer-assisted works, found poetry) or works that bridge typically disparate audiences (e.g., "mash up"-type new media projects). Perhaps not coincidentally, it is these same works that comprise the present frontier of literature. AdamSap (talk) 18:37, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
- I think the point is that puzzles, proofs, riddles and pop-up books do not have a narrative. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Geryhall31 (talk • contribs) 21:15, 2 February 2016 (UTC)
Other uses of "ergodic"[edit]
The current article makes it sound like the word "ergodic" was created solely for this context. However, in mathematics and science there is the Ergodic hypothesis and Ergodic theory, as well as Ergodic (adjective) - which I presume predate the use of the term for literature. Some mention of the connection between the use of the term in math/science contexts and literary contexts is warranted - even if it goes no deeper than saying that there is no connection and that none was ever intended. -- 220.127.116.11 (talk) 16:37, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
The Ergodic principle is quite simple really. It is an important statistical concept in thermodynamics (see Wikipedia article!). The idea is that the time average is the same as the ensemble average. To give you an example, the average position of one molecule in an empty room (not a single other atom or molecule in the room) over time (given enough time for the molecule to explore all the room) is the same as the average position of a dilute gas of molecules filling the room : any spot in the room is as likely to be occupied by a molecule as any other. I hope this makes sense. It is a bit of random concept to introduce in Literature! I believe part of the interest in thermodynamics from the Literary community comes from the very catchy second law of thermodynamics (which basically states that all isolated systems tend to greater disorder) AlineApple (talk) 08:43, 23 May 2010 (UTC)
Article Fails to Define Ergodic[edit]
IMO this still needs major work, not from the perspective of whether certain examples are correct or not, but from the perspective of DEFINING THE TERM "ERGODIC". Surely this is the major point that needs to be dealt with before the article can serve any useful purpose to the general Wikipedia reader?
After reading the article, I still have no clear idea what "ergodic" means. I'm not unintelligent, so I believe the fault lies not in my comprehension skills, but in the article itself. A good starting place might be to parse the "most commonly cited definition" instead of simple quoting it and then immediately moving on to discuss variations.
Simply put, if you're going to have a Wiki page be a resource for the uninitiated, you probably should explain the concept clearly before going on to discuss the minutiae thereof. R0nin Two (talk) 01:49, 26 July 2011 (UTC)
Confusing article[edit]
- "It has been argued that these distinctions are not entirely clear..."
This is the truest statement in this entire article.
- Just a question: Does this mean that every text in Braille is "ergodic"? Liz Read! Talk! 18:36, 31 August 2013 (UTC)
- I don't think that people reading with Braille find it non-trivial it's no different to a sighted person who can read with their eyes.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Geryhall31 (talk • contribs) 21:36, 2 February 2016
Another possible example[edit]
Is James Joyce's Finnegans Wake considered an example of ergodic literature? Are there any reliable sources that discuss whether to include/exclude it from that genre? -- llywrch (talk) 05:40, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
I can find by googling "Finnegans Wake ergodic" several book references to not only Finnegans Wake but also Joyce's earlier Ulysses as examples of ergodic literature. By any measure these books fit both Espen's definition of ergodic (non-trivial effort) and the idea of hypertext literature. Espen has a couple of references to James Joyce in Cybertext but does not reference FW or Ulysses directly. So yes, I think Finnegans Wake definitely qualifies as ergodic. Simon9 (talk) 06:01, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
Interactive narration[edit]
I propose changing the name of this page to Interactive narration, and to clarify the terminology.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Geryhall31 (talk • contribs) 13:54, 1 February 2016


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Lot 29: Dickens (Charles) - The Works,
Books and Works on Paper: Part I - Bibliophile
by Dreweatts & Bloomsbury
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Description: 62 issues as follows: part 16 (October 1872) to part 28 (October 1873); part 31 (January 1874) to part 77 (November 1877); front wrapper to part 79 loosely inserted, original blue wrappers, worn, 8vo, Chapman and Hall, 1872-77 (62)
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Windows Vista Randomization Gets OEM Thumbs Up
Microsoft's use of code-scrambling diversity in Windows Vista has received a major thumbs up from U.S. OEM partners.Microsofts use of code-scrambling diversity to secure Windows Vista is getting crucial support from OEM partners. The Redmond, Wash. software giant has convinced major U.S. computer makersincluding Dell, Gateway and Hewlett-Packardto make default changes at the BIOS level to allow a new Vista security feature called ASLR (Address Space Layout Randomization) to work properly.
ASLR, which is used to randomly arrange the positions of key data areas to block hackers from predicting target addresses, is meant to make Windows Vista more resilient to virus and worm attacks.
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well I don't see any responses, so here's my 2 cents worth....
I never take a plant from a greenhouse and plant it in the ground...
doesn't matter what plant or size. They need to harden off, even in
July. Even if the sun and temp isn't the issue, the wind is.
Are these small plugs you are talking about? Or 4inch pots? If they are
plugs, I would pot up... if they are 4 inch pots (or there about) they
should have been repotted already from the initial growing media,
probably twice already, so no I wouldn't do the extra work.
I am known to hold everything, waiting for who knows what, so have
adapted to bury many 4 inch pots in the holding bed. They don't dry out
as fast or need as much water. Might want to consider that too...
Just my thoughts....and I am not an expert. Would like to hear what others do...
> > pot them up in quarts and gallons. A lot will eventually go in the
> ground.
> Being July, many of these little pots are pretty well-packed with roots.
> My philosophy: I don't like putting something like that directly in the
> ground, so I pot to quarts, grow on a little while until they stretch their
> roots out and then put in the ground in September. Also, even though they
> may be full sun plants, going from greenhouse to all day hot sun can be too
> stressful. Potting enables them to be moved to shelter if needed and more
> slowly acclimated to such conditions.
> This, of course, is extra work, and a small extra expense for potting. Do
> you all think this is necessary or am I over-doing it?
> Kitty
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Dec 27, 2012, 08.42 AM | Source: Moneycontrol.com
According to a report by Sharekhan, the Indian markets are expected to open on a flat note led by mixed global cues.
, Sharekhan |
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Asian stock markets were capped on Thursday (December 27, 2012) on investor edginess about the chances of US lawmakers striking a deal to avoid a fiscal crunch by December 31, while the yen stayed under pressure on the prospect of drastic monetary easing and massive fiscal spending.
European shares closed provisionally lower in a thin last trading session before the Christmas break with investors opting to trim positions in the absence of a resolution to US budget talks.
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