text:
by Mike Masnick
Mon, Aug 3rd 2009 9:55am
Filed Under:
college, entitlement, monroe college, tuition
We've been talking a lot about "entitlement culture" these days, with much of the focus being on companies or individuals who feel entitled to keep their old business models, even as the market is changing. But entitlement society shows up in other places as well. Jeff Nolan points us to the story of a college graduate who has been unable to find a job since she graduated in April and is now suing her college, Monroe College, for the $70,000 she spent on tuition. Apparently, the fact that we're in one of the worst economic downturns in ages doesn't come into play. Or the fact that what you learn in college (hopefully) lasts a lifetime. To this woman, the fact that she hasn't been able to find a job in four months means she deserves her entire tuition back?
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Reader Comments
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Travis Miller (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 9:59am
entitlement-culture-gone-wrong deptI laughed at the "dept" on this one. Can anyone give an example of entitlement-culture-gone-right?
K Max, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:02am
Missed that classLooks like she skipped the classes on Patience.
Ima Fish (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:05amGod, what degree did she get? With my undergrad in philosophy I was qualified for a number of employment opportunities with the likes of Taco Bell, K-Mart, and a local factory.
aguywhoneedstenbucks (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:49am
Re:Ima, someone with your qualifications would have no trouble finding a top-flight job in either the food service or housekeeping industries.
Ashley Thacker, 5 Aug 2010 @ 8:11am
Re: Re:You think thats funny. Its fucked up. Really? Its been two years since I graduated with a BA and I am stuck with bullshit paying job until I complete my Masters, struggling to pay bills and facing evicition almost every month and not being able to afford groceries. You people think the government will help. HELL NO. No food stamps or welfare unless you get pregnant. What the fuck is wrong with our government and people. Screw everyone who thinks this funny.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:04pm
Re:thats funny. i got a decent tech support job w/my philosophy degree. oh wait. its how you spin the degree
anonymous, 21 Jan 2010 @ 2:39pm
Re:which makes you wonder why you needed college in the first place?
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:06am
Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneShe should have sued the banks who imploded the economy, and created some $286T in derivatives.
Note that the entire world economy is about $65 trillion, and the United States at about $14 trillion... yeah, that's a lot of entitlements.
But you're right. When we talk about the Entitlement Society, we should do away with it all, starting with Social Security and also look into creating some legal mechanism that has the ability to revoke corporate charters.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:23am
Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For Everyonestarting with Social Security
I thought we'd already killed that horse. I'm fairly certain I won't be seeing any of it, at least.
2gravey, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:08am
Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneOh,it's still alive. You can tell because you still have to feed it. While you might be right that you (or I) won't be seeing any of it, the last time I looked at my paystub, SS was consuming a larger chunk than income tax does.
Henry Paulsen, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:18am
Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneMike's estranged 5th Uncle (Mom's side of the family-- where the Economists are), Paul Krugman, wrote an op-ed piece about this phenomenon in today's NY Times. Link provided:
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:22am
Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For Everyonewait how can Mike be both a "shill for off shoring multi-nationals" and a relative of Paul Krugman . . . can he really hate his own kin that much?
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:28am
Re: Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneIt's a diversion for techdirt lemming punks
can't fool the rest of us
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:32am
Re: Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneYes.
Krugman grew up on the "good side" of long island with a silver spoon. Point is, it's a long-running family feud. I've already said too much!
Mike Masnick (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:46pm
Re: Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For Everyonewait how can Mike be both a "shill for off shoring multi-nationals" and a relative of Paul Krugman . . . can he really hate his own kin that much?
While amazingly funny, I must admit that neither claim is true... nor, by the way, was that video someone posted the other day, claiming to me of me 15 years ago of me. I am, however, incredibly amused at the creativity of some commenters around here! Keep it up!
ratan, 3 Aug 2009 @ 5:08pm
Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneYou mean STOP SS deductions or STOP paying SS??
Anonymous Coward, 4 Aug 2009 @ 7:03am
Re: Re: Why Things Generally Suck... For EveryoneIf they stopped FICA withholdings, Rich people really would have something to complain about concerning taxes. At least the ratio of tax to income would actually be higher for them (its not currently - if you consider FICA).
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:14amlook into creating some legal mechanism that has the ability to revoke corporate charters.
Huh? Why?
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:19amTo be fair, it seems that her complains is less that she can't find a job and more that the school "hasn't tried hard enough" to help her find a job. That may or may not be the case, but it's a bit different than suing your school because you can't find a job. From the article, she makes it sound like the school promised aid and couselling in finding a job... If that's the case, and they failed to deliver a promised service, maybe there's grounds for a suit -- though at that a full $70k seems high...
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:25amFrom what I've heard, this school may have been a degree mill where you get a degree no matter what you do or learn as long as you pay your tuition. The problem may lie in that this girl thought it was a real college only to find out that employers avoid students from this college.
The article could have been written better and included more facts relevant to the case.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:38am
Re:That's a good point, but if you look into the college you'll see it is fully accredited and they have a large "career advancement" section to help students find jobs and internships.
senshikaze (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:21pm
Re:Drive by degree's? We have a "University" near by that has the same reputation. I know anyone in the local tech business has no job opportunities if they receive a tech degree from said school.
yozoo, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:27am
You can do that?count me in!
Anonymous Coward, 21 Jan 2010 @ 2:40pm
Re: You can do that?amen!
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:30am"We've been talking a lot about "entitlement culture" these days"
I think its kinda cute how pundits and social commentors have been talking about Americas looming "entitlement society" since about 1776 . . .
Alan Gerow (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:50am
Re:Because it's progressive. It slowly gets worse and worse. So, the talk started in 1776 as people felt entitled to have a representative voice in Parliament in exchange for taxation ... and over the years has gone to people feeling entitled to being able to tax other people for any and all use of their writing/artwork.
Not really cute. It's not as if there's a magic line that people can go "there! society has crossed it. NOW we're an entitlement culture". It's just that each generation goes through another step, and then points at the progress in their lifetime, or from the previous generation.
Rob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:33am
This may not be all that ridiculous...If the school advertised career assistance as a selling point and then offered next to nothing on graduation, she could have a case. After graduating from a college which I will not name, I was told that I would be offered extensive career development services as well, but was offered little that I could not have found on monster.com, even after chasing after the people at the school to help me. Granted, I never felt that it would have been legit to sue and I wasn't planning on needing much help from them, but they should still be held accountable for all their advertised claims. Obviously, this case would be next to impossible to fight, but her complaints at least may not (or very well may) be without merit.
Karen in Wichita, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:36am
What AC #8 saidThat was my first thought on seeing this article: many little jumped-up technical colleges use their job placement service as a very strong selling point, so the lawsuit might not be that unreasonable. One (now-defunct-and-rightly-so) local "college" was essentially a paid job placement service with a token classroom attached; if they didn't find *something* I think one would have a valid case for breach of contract or something similar. (I think it was lawsuits that sunk 'em, in fact.)
Monroe may not operate that way, and almost certainly isn't that extreme a case even if it does, but I'd bet it still made more (unwritten?) promises than your more "standard" university does.
Aaron Martin-Colby (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:11am
Re: What AC #8 saidI agree. Those unwritten promises can be SWEEPING. My friend went to North Eastern for computer science. During the courting process (Back in the days of the tech boom) they told all of them that would have jobs before they even graduated and be driving Porsche's by 25. My friend's 29, now, and he's driving a Kia. He also regrets going to N. Eastern and being saddled with $95,000 in loans.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:20am
Re: Re: What AC #8 said"My friend's 29, now, and he's driving a Kia. He also regrets going to N. Eastern and being saddled with $95,000 in loans"
Your friend is lucky if he actually owns Kia and doesn't have a jumbo 400K mortgage on a house which he can sell for only 250K today...
The fresh CS and EE grads are screwed BIG time....
Chuck Norris' Enemy (deceased) (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:55pm
Re: Re: Re: What AC #8 saidIf you have an EE degree go into Power Systems...work at a utility. Lots of work and the dinosaurs are retiring like crazy with a huge gap in between.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:36amsome schools make statements about the graduation placement rate and discuss at length the supposedly good prospects for graduates. To the extent she can prove this occurred and that upon graduation they did nothing to get her such a job, and that the numbers were faked or something, she definitely has a case. However, if the school's numbers are legit and she's just a dud at interviews or something, then here's no case at all.
Adrian A, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:40am
Only 4 months of looking? Is she kidding?It took me over 6 months to find a decent job in Bellingham, WA after I graduated with a BA. In fact I had to temp with the company that hired me for 3 months beforehand. This is the reality of the job market, even in good times. If you're someone who's fresh out of college with minimal job experience of any kind... you're going to have a difficult time getting any worthwhile job unless you have a specialized degree that allows for instant placement (i.e. comp-sci, nursing, accounting, etc.)
Just roll with it. If you have to make ends meet with dead-end minimum-wage work for 6 months before you have the experience to get something better than so be it. You can't blame the school for going for that degree in "Art History" that nobody is actively hiring for.
MAtt, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:00am
Re: Only 4 months of looking? Is she kidding?What? Are you kidding? Haven't the few bleeding-heart responses to this article taught you anything? This university has a duty - nay, an obligation to make good on their subjective claim. This woman has been disenfranchised!
Or, she is of below-average intelligence and/or has been taught that she deserves something for which the rest of us have to work. As the great prophet said about 'potential,' "Not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up."
Kevin, 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:02pm
Re: Re: Only 4 months of looking? Is she kidding?What? Are you kidding? Haven't the few bleeding-heart responses to this article taught you anything? This university has a duty - nay, an obligation to make good on their subjective claim. This woman has been disenfranchised!
It's hard to tell if you're making fun or her or the responses, but I haven't seen any bleeding heart responses that seem to mesh with what you're saying. Generally speaking, if you pay tuition and earn a degree then you have gotten everything that you paid for and would have no basis to sue. You obviously aren't entitled to a job. I think that's mostly obvious, and it's also the basis for the negative reaction to this suit.
That being said, there are a number of colleges, especially technical schools (some of which are accredited), that do promise a great deal of job placement or employment assistance. I've heard cases where local "enrollment councilors" at the schools have literally guaranteed potential students that they will be able to find work after graduation through their placement services. I know of at least one case where the school had to actually hire a couple of students to help maintain their systems because the promises fell short.
Now most reasonable people would hear the claim of a "guaranteed job upon graduation" and run the other way, recognizing this as a pure marketing tactic with little to no bearing on reality. But I have no doubt that some people would be taken in by such a claim, and literally expect the school to make good on it. I don't know if that is what happened in this case, but if a school (or any business) makes a guarantee and then fails to make good on it, shouldn't they be held responsible? If you went to such a school based on their guarantee, then found yourself at graduation unable to find work or pay your bills, AND with another $70,000 in debt on top of that, wouldn't you want something done about it?
Granted, in the case that I mentioned people shouldn't be so stupid as to believe that a school can guarantee them employment upon graduation. But on the other hand, a school shouldn't be able to make false or exaggerated claims about their services either. Most schools simply guarantee that if you graduate you'll get a degree, and that's the end of it.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:13pm
Re: Re: Re: Only 4 months of looking? Is she kidding?[quote]Granted, in the case that I mentioned people shouldn't be so stupid as to believe that a school can guarantee them employment upon graduation. But on the other hand, a school shouldn't be able to make false or exaggerated claims about their services either. Most schools simply guarantee that if you graduate you'll get a degree, and that's the end of it.[/quote]
Exactly the point I was trying to make (and failing at). I was a fool, I fell for the marketing, and I'm paying for it. I'm not suing anyone because I don't have the job I was guaranteed. And even if I was going to sue someone, I wouldn't expect to get my entire tuition back. It did have a great deal of value for me. Just not as much as was promised. If I were to sue someone, it would only be to stop the schools from being able to make guarantees that they can't deliver on.
michael, 18 Jan 2014 @ 3:21am
Re: Only 4 months of looking? Is she kidding?not even having the specialized degree matters in todays market
Neil (SM), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:44am
SighThe college's response seemed off the mark:
"The college prides itself on the excellent career-development support that we provide to each of our students, and this case does not deserve further consideration."
How about pointing out that any university promises it's students nothing more than an education, and is by no means obligated to secure employment for students.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:47amGood lucking finding a job after pulling that stunt!
stat_insig (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:51am
Education insuranceProbably she will win the case. Then insurance companies start offering unemployment insurance to the colleges. Colleges start charging additional fees to cover insurance costs............so on
John Doe, 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:53am
Count me in...I graduated with a BS in '89 and had to go one more year for my MS because I couldn't find a job. Now we were in somewhat of a recession but still, can I get my extra years tuition back? ;)
Dark Helmet (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:55am
sighIf I could shortsell a person, she'd be the one...
dhrizzo (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:57am
Individuals owe society not the other way around.The problem is that even with a college degree you can't fix STUPID!
To many people think the world owes them something. They don't get it. It is the individual that owes the world (society)something. This is the problem with our entitlement system, it trains people to think the world owes them things rather than the way it really is.
People owe themselves and society to work hard and prosper for their own good and the good of all (society).
This include acts of charity,for it is better to give than to receive. In giving the giver receives, he/she receives a sense of good, of knowing that your good deed has helped another less fortunate than you. It takes the mind off of self and puts it on others. When you think of other first, your problems seem to become less important. You become happier and more content. Well, Nuf said.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:11am
Re: Individuals owe society not the other way around.I'd say you are both wrong. But if I had to pick which one to go with your method is far better. Course you can just be taking your position to an extreme case.
Pure leeches in society rarely prosper and don't do that well and this entitlement stuff is just another face. They want everything and don't want anyone to have anything else.
Taking your statements to the extreme... shooting out gumdrops and rainbows everywhere will probably make you a far better person and a good number of people will always be there to have your back in tough times but it's going to unlikely you are going to achieve the rich and crazy life style of corporate CEOs.
It's all about playing the "game" where you try to take more than what you receive. The problem with "entitlement" is they seem to want to take take take take from society without so much as putting a dime in or helping an old lady cross the street.
Alan Gerow (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:26pm
Re: Individuals owe society not the other way around.I don't owe society anything, other than the agreements I have made as an adult without being under duress.
Of course, society doesn't owe me anything, either. My parents owe me 18 years of care because of their decisions/actions that brought me into this life ... but that's about it, and my mom has paid that & more.
But me owing society anything? Naw, because I had no say in the society I was born in to.
I have a personal obligation to see to the betterment of myself and the world & people around me that I love & support. But I don't owe anything, and it's an obligation I have placed on myself because I see value in my personal life from increasing the value others get from their lives.
Are you viewing this as an extension of "original sin"? You have to apologize for & work off being born in the first place? Or, do you view just being born into a society as a form of contractual agreement between a 0-minute-old baby & the place they happened to come out of the womb at?
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:00am
Rant for teh unemployed bloggarz out tharI betcha Monroe College is a "special" college for the elite. Western Washington University... Well, not so much.
Hey, Adrian, yay to you for getting off your ass and finding a job! Now, if only she could do the same instead of being a leech on society and draining the unemployment trust for 4 months (which, who knows, maybe went to file her lawsuit and pay her attorney.)
Simple Sam, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:05am
Re: Rant for teh unemployed bloggarz out tharExcellent Point.
If she got unemployment benefits or $$$, as taxpayers, we should ask for it back.
Jim G., 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:06amI wonder if Trina Thompson is aware that her name will be linked to this lawsuit for years? Any prospective employer who googles her will almost certainly find the public record of these events. She might as well put on her resume "I AM A TROUBLEMAKER AND YOU WILL REGRET HIRING ME."
Otm Shank (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:47pm
Re:That was nice of Mike to "protect" her name at least on this site. Commenters take care of that :)
Seriously, she will have a much harder time finding a job, and she had better change her name/get married before she tries to get a master's degree! Then again, her transcripts will probably have a note (is that legal?) about her lawsuit.
Hope she sued for enough money for a shovel, too!
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:57pm
Re: Re:" and she had better change her name/get married before she tries to get a master's degree"
They'll sell you BS degree, MS degree, Phd degree, if there is enough money
Probably just ask you sign some "no lawsuit" paper, that;s all
C.M.Dess, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:07amI think she's doing a good thing. The job scene needs improvement and intervention, period. This situation sounds similar to the music business, they keep chucking out graduates so they can go to work at Guitar Center or other music retailer. Meanwhile the career itself requires a lot of sales like infrastructure. It's obviously demoralizing, and false advertising. Most graduates I've encountered never got the job they signed up for or anything close. We're talking about PRECIOUS years of life here.
Would a share holder put up with not getting a return on their investment? Yet you expect a person who just chucked four years of their life, sanity, and money, they should get the big mac experience? We don't know how hard it was for this person to get into college, maybe her mother mortgaged the house, etc... Colleges have been treating people like this for decades as the job pool is getting smaller and smaller from more and more graduates appearing. Not to mention the fact the jobs are often evolving as the person is learning an older business model.
I've never understood why people who've done the work on good faith aren't being rewarded for their efforts. If you do this to a person, you can expect a lot of contempt, repress anger and distrust. It used to be you could use the analogy of a carrot on a stick, but now things seem more comparable to a mouse trap on a stick.
The system of jammed.
Fatduck (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:38pm
Re:Would a share holder put up with not getting a return on their investment? Yet you expect a person who just chucked four years of their life, sanity, and money, they should get the big mac experience? Really? You mean I can buy stock in a company, and if the stock price drops, I can sue them and get my original investment back? Sweet!
Cory, 18 Sep 2009 @ 8:00pm
Re: right...A college promises people NOTHING but that they will get the education necessary to do a certain spectrum of jobs or work under the major they receive. It in no way guarantees you a job, nor is colleges purpose to find you a high-paying job. People who go to college under the pretense that they will become rich are fooling themselves, go for the right reason and you won't have to regret it when you thought that because you can cram schoolwork your instantly fit to run a multi-million dollar corporation or even work a full-time job for that matter. People who truly want work and work hard to find that work and be suitable for that work WILL GET THAT WORK.
I am going to college for an English major, and guess what I have no false hopes that I'm going to earn 40-50k a year because I got an English major. I plan on being a broke writer probably my entire life and I'm willing to gamble that to spend my life doing something I LOVE rather than working for the money. I have no delusions that I should be a rich and famous writer because I went to school for it.
Jrosen (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:08am
Notice......Notice that there's no mention of what this person's Major/Degree was in. If it's dead languages of Mesopotamia, or something equally useless. Employment problems are on the rise, and I've never seen a truly good college-placement/employment-help program, unless it's a 'good old boy' type, say with an Ivy-League type.
I'd hope she loses the lawsuit. I'd almost say the college should sue-back, but likely she's so broke it's not worth the effort.
Aaron Martin-Colby (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:09am
Give her a chanceI actually disagree with the criticisms of the woman. I don't know much about it, yet, but I'll give her the benefit of the doubt.
To me, this particular case isn't necessarily about entitlement culture. I think it's about the business agreement many people make with their chosen university. Yes, what you learn in college will be with you for your entire life, but most people don't go in for such philosophical reasons. They go in to get a good job.
And universities advertise the hell out of that. Why go to Harvard? Why go to Brown? I've gone to both the Community College of Rhode Island and Brown. University of Rhode Island and Rhode Island college. My best experiences? The community college.
You pay a premium for the connections the prestigious university gives you. Those universities use those connections as selling points to explain their comical tuition fees. If they fail at giving you value, they are not holding up their end of the "contract."
So she may truly be a self-entitled idiot, but it's not necessary that she is.
Kevin Stapp (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:21am
Re: Give her a chanceI'll give her the benefit of the doubt as well. Before we judge let's see if we can get her
- transcript
- resume
- list of jobs she has applied
- offers were made (if any)
Also, let's find out how many of her fellow graduates have had a similar experience. Did any of her fellow graduates with the same degree and GPA get a job or has her entire graduating class ended up in the unemployment line?
There is a perception among many college graduates that a degree and decent grades automatically means a good job and a decent salary. It doesn't. Period. A degree simply demonstrates the individual's ability to learn the material and complete the program. It gives you an advantage when applying to jobs in your field of study over those applicants who lack credentials. That it. A degree is a single line item on your resume. The rest is up to you.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:27am
Re: Re: Give her a chanceDude,
If 95% of college grads are out of work after 6 months then such college should be dismantled
Flipping burgers does not qualify as professional work
We are talking potential class-action lawsuits here from the dusgruntled Class of 2009 (and a good kick in Mikey's butt)
John Doe, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:31am
Re: Re: Re: Give her a chanceDo what? The Class of 2009 is screwed because of the economy, not because of the college.
Normally you are pretty funny, but this time you are just plain wrong.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:40am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Give her a chanceDude, you have no clue
With Stanford and berkley grads flipping burgers employers just laugh at those poor sobs with BS from Monroe college
The party is over, the gravy train is long gone
Obtainiong IT degree from the likes of Monroe college does not make any sense
John Doe, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:30am
Re: Re: Give her a chanceYour last paragraph sums it up perfectly. I didn't get a job at first because I didn't know how to interview. Once I learned how to interview, I got several offers and most jobs I have applied for since. A degree and grades are only the first step, the rest is up to you.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:34am
Re: Re: Re: Give her a chanceJust try to get one interview today, idiot
Remember, your shitty resume is just one of 800 sitting on HR desk (hard drive)
What do you put on it to make it stand out ?
A picture of your naked ass ?
John Doe, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:36am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Give her a chanceHuh? So it is the college's fault that the economy is in the tank? What exactly is your argument/point here?
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:10am
Mikey, Mikey, where is your shame ?Monroe College ?
How bout Berkley or Stanford grads flipping burgers for 10$ an hour and doing unpaid work for equity in some shitty startup in SV ?
Never seen one ?
Mikey is a paid shill for large tech multinationals
AS such he will eventually get what he deserves - a good kick in the butt from some disgruntled unemployed IT worker
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:20am
Re: Mikey, Mikey, where is your shame ?Angry dude is right on this one. The burger king by my house has two Stanford grads on the grill and PhD from MIT working drivethrough . . . dark days my friends.
Rob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:30am@Matt --
What? Are you kidding? Haven't the few bleeding-heart responses to this article taught you anything? This university has a duty - nay, an obligation to make good on their subjective claim. This woman has been disenfranchised!
Or, she is of below-average intelligence and/or has been taught that she deserves something for which the rest of us have to work. As the great prophet said about 'potential,' "Not everyone gets to be an astronaut when they grow up."
Why shouldn't the university have to make good on their claims? If she, in good faith, gave this school tens of thousands of dollars based on a promise by the school that they will offer her significant career placement when she gets out, why should she not expect it? There are not enough details as to the promises made by the school and the treatment they gave her, but it is certainly par for the course for schools to make those sorts of false promises -- as I said before I graduated from a school that promised me up and down that they would use all their connections out there to help me find a job and in the end offered me little that I could not find on monster.com. I can't see how this can be construed as anything other than blatantly false advertising, and if this is the case then she certainly does have a lawsuit and I hope she wins and teaches these schools that they have to live up to their promises.
TPBer (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:39am
@ Angry DudeI still want a t-shirt that says,
"I Partied With Angry Dude"
Michial Thompson, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:40am
So Entitlement Societies are bad???So the hypocritical preaching of this blog owner comes out. It's ok to feel entitled to someone Else's creative works for free, but at the same time being entitled to what one was promised before attending the college is bad????
So I guess as long as it furthers one's agenda it's ok to be entitled...
Mike Masnick (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:45pm
Re: So Entitlement Societies are bad???So the hypocritical preaching of this blog owner comes out. It's ok to feel entitled to someone Else's creative works for free, but at the same time being entitled to what one was promised before attending the college is bad????
Michial, I'm not sure I understand you. When have I ever said anyone was entitled to someone else's creative works for free? I have not.
You seem to be projecting what you dislike on me.
But I would suggest actually reading what I write. I've discussed this directly with you in the past. You lying about what I say doesn't make you any more believable. It just makes you less credible.
maniac in a speedo, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:46am
princessThis chick will make a great wife for some Jewish guy.
Bob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 11:50am
Word."So the hypocritical preaching of this blog owner comes out. It's ok to feel entitled to someone Else's creative works for free, but at the same time being entitled to what one was promised before attending the college is bad????"
Self-determined schmelf-determined.
Peter, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:13pm
Honey. Shut up and do what I did.Same thing happened to me in 1991. I graduated with a Advertising and Marketing Degree. The economy was tanked and the Tech boom had not started yet.
But that was not the problem. I was the problem. I was applying for Account Manager positions. No one hires a college grad for management or money controlling positions.
She needs to get a clue. Do what I did.
Work you but off at three jobs. While trying to get the Gov't to lend a healthy white American, Small Busines Admin (SBA) money, so you can start a company. Oh wait, tried that, that doesn't work either.
Just beg your father's friends to give you a help desk job and work your way to owning a company with 90 employees doing security consulting for businesses.
Yep, that is what I did. Now I get to sit here on TechDirt all day while those talented individuals help me pay for my 60 foot boat and my daughters college so she doesn't have debt.
Thanks Aquinas College (Grand Rapids, Michigan).
Rob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:44pm
Re: Honey. Shut up and do what I did.@Peter -- Shut up. Just because you were lucky enough to have daddy's friends give your a job doesn't mean that everyone else has the same doors open to them, some people have to *gasp!* make a life for themselves. In this case, any help you can get can make a life or death difference. I have news for you man, I am sure you worked your ass off, but you are extraordinarily lucky, most people won't be able to do what you have done even if they work harder than you and are more qualified than you. If you had daddy's friends get your foot in the door, I am sure they also were pulling strings for you to advance. You are lucky, that's all, and gloating about it makes you look like the douche that you almost certainly are.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:45pm
Re: Honey. Shut up and do what I did."Just beg your father's friends to give you a help desk job and work your way to owning a company with 90 employees doing security consulting for businesses."
perhaps you should know that the days of advancing from Help Desk up the corporate ladder are long over
YOu come to Help desk - you stay in Help Desk
(unless you dad is CEO's friend and drinking buddy)
So STFU please
Just Another Moron in a Hurry, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:20pm
I can relate.As a college grad, I can somewhat relate to her situation.
When I was just signing up for college, I was told that my degree would basically guarantee me a $60,000/yr starting salary. Well, it didn't.
I was able to find a job, but even today, my salary isn't that great. I'd like to see a proportional refund on my tuition. Or at least a reduction in the interest, which I'm still paying.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:40pmIf I am reading this correctly she didn't use the job placement resources until AFTER she graduated. If this is the case, that is where she went horribly wrong and she is the one to blame. Even if the job market is strong, there would be no reason not to start job hunting/shopping before graduation.
LCarr, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:49pm
College tuition backDoes that mean that when she gets a job she will give them her paycheck for a period of time. If that was the case with all colleges there would not be the need for federal loans.
Think before you speak.
Adam, 3 Aug 2009 @ 12:55pmThis gal went to B-School... She just needs to take a hint from The Onion and get a few jobs.
The Cenobyte, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:04pmAlways thought that University was for people unwilling or unable to educate themselves. $70,000 so that you can be lazy and not learn what you need. I have a GED and I could pay the full costs of her education out of pocket with less and one years income. I taught myself or learned on the job what I needed to know, started earlier than people that kept going to school and didn't give myself that extra debt. So when people my age finished school at 22 or 23 I had been in the work force for 6 or 7 years.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:10pmMy question is, what company would dare hire her now after seeing her pull a stunt like that.
Tech Exec, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:17pm
Society of VictimsI am not sure why anyone would assume that a college degree meant that you would be guaranteed a job. Your resume, filled with experience and academia, will get you an interview - but you have to earn the job.
We live in a victim's society with no sense of shame. No matter what negative thing happens, it is always someone else's fault. It's my gender, my sexual preference, my race, my religion, my choice of pets, my musical taste... anything but my fault. It could never be that I have a bad attitude, no true talent, no true work skills, no true people skills, no ability to dress myself for the job, no ability to speak proper English... oh no, it can't be me. It must be you, your fault, your prejudice, your stereotyping and profiling. **News Flash** - it's just you.
Companies are in business to make money. As much as I despise corporations and profit motive culture (which is at fault for our current economic crisis, most of our military conflicts, and many of our social woes), they are focused on making money, which includes putting the right person in the right job. They don't care about any of the aforementioned prejudices or stereotypes that you have been told to believe - they hire the person that can make them successful. That doesn't have to be you, and most assuredly won't be you if you can't demonstrate the ability to be the right person - and not just on paper. Don't let your arrogance get in the way of your success - you have to work hard and earn your way. This woman is sueing because she thinks she deserves more than she is worth, and she errantly believes it must be someone else's fault.
btw - Monroe College is accredited by the Commission on Higher Education of the Middle States Association of Colleges and Schools. Not a diploma mill.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:50pm
Re: Society of VictimsSTFU punky
I repeate once more for retards like you - in the present environment obtaining IT degree fro mthe likes of Monroe collge is just laughable
She should have known better...
it's brutal out there
And NO ,for many decent qualified and experienced IT folks it's not them - it;s korporate america's greed
SO just STFU
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 1:20pm
Sue 'em allColleges - both the fake and the real ones - sell the idea that you need a degree to get a good job and with a degree you'll make gazillions more. They actually advertise this crap. Personally I think more people ought to start suing them. Then maybe they'd have to tell the truth about what you get for all your money: A few years off before you have to start working.
College is the biggest scam going - makes Madoff look like a piker.
Rollo, 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:18pmAs an unemployed, uninsured recent engineering grad with a $150,000 education and a sizable debt, I have no patience for the bitching so many people do when they can't find work. I KNOW how bad it sucks, I KNOW the economy is terrible. I'm every bit as burned out and frustrated as anybody else out there. But bitching about it, or suing your alma mater, is not going to get you work. Just keep your nose to the grindstone and keep looking. Sooner or later things will turn around. This isn't the 19th century, nobody's going to starve to death because they can't find work after college.
Pretty much anyone who went to a semi-reputable school was promised job-search ASSISTANCE, unfortunately, people have this idea that that means the school will FIND them a job. Nobody is going to find you work but yourself.
angry dude, 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:32pm
Re:"Sooner or later things will turn around."
Afraid not, my little clueless techdirt reader
At least not in tech
IT and tech in general are following textile industry path.... offshore and never coming back.. at least not until the living standards here in US equal those in India or China for most of the population
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:55pm
Re: Re:There's some truth to that, unless, of course, people start demanding quality, and demanding to know where their product is coming from. But once you give the manufacturing keys to the dragon or elephant, it's not long before they're driving the car.
TPBer (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 2:52pm
SBDCHer brain has been infected with the SBDC syndrome (stupid bitch, dumb cunt)
bob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 3:43pm
Liberal ArtsI would say that if she graduated with a BA, she was robbed and should get her money back.
If you want the knowledge of a BA read the Harvard shelf of books. What's cool is that you can get them from the Gutenberg project for free.
Rob, 3 Aug 2009 @ 4:05pm
Just to reiterateShe is not complaining that the school did not find her a job -- they are not obligated to do that and she is not entitled to that. The complaint is that the school is not doing enough to help her find a job -- and that they advertised their career placement programs heavily. If they promised her that when she started going to the school she is 100% entitled to assistance -- she PAID them tens of thousands of dollars in the expectation that after graduation they would help her find a job. If they are not providing these services, it is false advertising, plain and simple, and I hope she wins. Not sure if this is the case, she could just be a bum, but from what I have seen it is probably legit and if so, I hope she wins big time.
Anonymous Coward, 3 Aug 2009 @ 4:49pmSpeaking of entitlement society what about all the brats who think they can download music, because it is available for free on the internet.
carly, 3 Aug 2009 @ 5:21pm
PleaseGive me a break. there is a related post at http://iamsoannoyed.com/?page_id=588
Cody Jackson (profile), 3 Aug 2009 @ 10:41pm
When are you guaranteed a job?College isn't necessarily where you go to get job skills. You want that, go to a trade school. College is for learning ideas that can help you in your job or other future endeavors. Why do you think they allow people to audit classes without taking the tests?
Plus, no school will guarantee that you get a job. That's up to you, not the school.
The article never mentions what sort of degree she got, other than it's a "business" school. Not all business degrees are the same; not to mention business grads are a dime a dozen. It's a slightly better degree for jobs than, say, art major but unless you have something to back it up I doubt prospects are great.
How about start your own business? Small business loans are relatively easy to get from the fed, especially now.
Andrew D. Todd, 4 Aug 2009 @ 1:43am
For Once, Angry Dude is Right-- At Least in Part.I gather this woman is in the Bachelors program in Information Technology. Here are some relevant pages from the Monroe catalog:
http://www.monroecollege.edu/academics/schoolsandprograms/coursecatalogs/courseofferings /IT09-10
http://www.monroecollege.edu/academics/schoolsandprograms/informationtechnology/bbadegreei ninformationtechnology/degreerequirements
http://www.monroecollege.edu/academics/schoolsandprograms /informationtechnology/bbadegreeininformationtechnology
http://www.monroecollege.edu/academics/scho olsandprograms/otheracademicofferings/liberalarts/mathematics
What they come down to is a marginal program, with very little coursework above the high-school level, for marginal students, with very little mathematical capacity. I've seen this kind of thing before. They have these Cisco-certificate-type courses, courses on how to take a computer apart and put it back together again, etc. Of course, the main thing you need for that kind of thing is enough old computers that you can play with them, and not be uncontrollably concerned if you bust one.
Of course, there is a possible fraud issue. It's like what truck driving schools used to be like. They were famous for gaming the student loan system. They would string students along for as long as possible, making them take mickey-mouse courses, before giving them a chance to drive an 18-wheeler.
Bri (profile), 4 Aug 2009 @ 4:54am
Say what?Wait a minute here, the entitlement argument only applies to people who think they deserve special treatment when they haven't actually invested anything into the system. This seems to be a scenario of paying for services that were never rendered. Personally I think this is a positive thing as it makes universities actually accountable for the quality of their education. If you sell me a Lexus and I come to find out I actually got a Honda, you better damn well believe I am going to be angry. Just because I sign a check and enter the gates doesn't mean your duty to me is over. Universities don't play the customer service game very well, mostly because they are run more like government institutions rather than streamlined businesses, but their duty to the student body shouldn't be any less than any company that has a product or service to sell.
Chris, 4 Aug 2009 @ 6:19am
She has a 2.7 GPA??!?!?!?!From a crap school....wtf does she expect...
from wikipedia:
In August 2009, Trina Thompson, an April 2009 graduate in Information Technology, who was still without a job, sued Monroe College for failure to provide adequate job-placement assistance. [6] Her opinion in the claim is that with her 2.7 GPA and good attendance record, most employers would be interested in giving her a job. The case has received international publicity, including mention by BBC News. Ms. Thompson seeks $70,000 for reimbursement of her tuition. A College spokesperson said, "this case does not deserve further consideration". As of early August 2009, the lawsuit filed in Bronx Superior Court(US) had not yet been resolved.
T M Beeker, 4 Aug 2009 @ 6:24am
The punch-lineOkay we agree this is a stupid reason to sue an institution. Take a look at how often individuals (even very entitled and stupid ones) win against institutions that juries perceive to have deep pockets. The punch-line to this tasteless joke is she could win and win big.
The mantra of modern American culture is, "Some institution has pooped in my pants, I am going to sue it for making such a mess." The institution should sue her for not using the career center and other free resources to help grads get a job.
Chris, 4 Aug 2009 @ 6:34am
amazing...Please read what this idiot wrote in the suit...
found here:
angry dude, 4 Aug 2009 @ 6:59am
Re: amazing...This girl is obviously dumb and can't do any job
But the issues are big:
All IT programs offered by third-rate US "colleges" like Monroe should be shut down immediately as educational scams
Her "degree" is just laughable
Good accredited US universities should warn their prospective students about uncertain career prospects BEFORE taking any money from them
They should collect and publish statistics about the whereabouts of their graduates, not omitting anybody
DMNTD, 4 Aug 2009 @ 9:21am
hmm..Well..I can't say that I am surprised...if I looked around I would prob find a lot of stories like this. Maybe not, I can say college has never proven itself to me or the various multitude of people I recognize.
Can't say I blame her.
Alice, 5 Aug 2009 @ 9:10am
*shakes head*The college promises career assistance. Which they do provide, probably in the way of workshops, along with their placement system. That doesn't mean they guarantee the job. She has no right to sue.
Also, I think she's confusing the fact that employers prefer a 4.0 student with the college "favoring" them.
Other news reports mention that she has a measly 2.7 in a BA business. Basically, qualifications to be secretary. I want to see what kind of jobs she's applying to.
HAHA, 7 Aug 2009 @ 11:57am
Well I can guarentee one thing...After this suit is filed and placed in courts, who the hell will hire her then?
If I was a hiring manager, she certainly wouldn't be on my list after suing for $70k. They should revoke her degree if that's the case.
Incogni, 15 Sep 2009 @ 10:04amI think that she has a right to be mad, but her anger is misdirected. Be mad at all powerful greedy corporations who have selfishly redesigned the global economic landscape for super-sized profit. The American economy has changed permanently because many companies have taken actions that will disenfranchise regular middle and working class people for years to come. But for all those who think it's easy to find a job right now fresh out of school are out of touch. A college degree isn't worth what is was 10 years ago, let alone one year ago. Up until two years ago, an average college student could spend 4 years or more majoring in spreading v.d. and developing alcoholism and still be able to land 100K a year job before graduation day. But now, even the most intelligent, talented and capable college grads are losing jobs and money to laid-off career veterans on the job rebound. Young people who aren't established have been hit hardest by the recession. Older folks who were lucky enough to secure themselves financially prior to the great recession are the real entitlement generation. The new generation of young people are experiencing the overwhelming and daunting task of establishing themselves in the worst economy since the 30's. Cut us a little slack Grandma and Grandpa.
Incogni, 15 Sep 2009 @ 10:04amI think that she has a right to be mad, but her anger is misdirected. Be mad at all powerful greedy corporations who have selfishly redesigned the global economic landscape for super-sized profit. The American economy has changed permanently because many companies have taken actions that will disenfranchise regular middle and working class people for years to come. But for all those who think it's easy to find a job right now fresh out of school are out of touch. A college degree isn't worth what is was 10 years ago, let alone one year ago. Up until two years ago, an average college student could spend 4 years or more majoring in spreading v.d. and developing alcoholism and still be able to land 100K a year job before graduation day. But now, even the most intelligent, talented and capable college grads are losing jobs and money to laid-off career veterans on the job rebound. Young people who aren't established have been hit hardest by the recession. Older folks who were lucky enough to secure themselves financially prior to the great recession are the real entitlement generation. The new generation of young people are experiencing the overwhelming and daunting task of establishing themselves in the worst economy since the 30's. Cut us a little slack Grandma and Grandpa.
anonymous, 21 Jan 2010 @ 2:38pm
wrongIt has NOTHING to do with entitlement. If a college, or university makes the claim that YOU WILL BE employable WITH a degree. Or that to have a job you need their degree, and they fail to live up to the bargain than most definately they should be sued. All universities should be sued just like businesses if they fail to meet their obligation at making people more employable like they promise.
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2010 @ 10:13pm
I know how it feels
Anonymous Coward, 29 Jan 2010 @ 10:15pm
I know how it feelsI know what it's like looking for a job in this horrid economy. I've been trying to keep a budget and have blogged about it for months.
tom, 18 Mar 2010 @ 7:09amWhether you are an established business executive or a employer on the rise, you may want some help to jump start your career to the next level of success. Career consultants can help you with clear decisions and make immediate, positive changes in your attitudes and behaviors that help you reach your full leadership potential. It can make a big difference in your career, your behaviors in and out of the workplace and create a new and improved self-image of yourself. When I was looking for executive coaches on my last career transition I used the services at http://www.careersuccessions.com/. The site provides great job hunting tips, career consultants, and executive coaches. This site helped me improve my career, so head on over and give it a try. Good luck and best wishes of success!
SturgglingGrad (profile), 27 Mar 2010 @ 11:51am
CollegeHere is an idea. DO NOT GO TO COLLEGE to get a job. Believe me, you are going to be sorely disappointed. Take a look at all the stories of people like you, that thought they would run out and pick up a quick degree by going into debt. They figured it wouldn't be too hard to get a job. Only to lose it all and be in hot water with their loans. Don't drink the kool-aid the rest of America want's you to drink.
Ricardo Santos, 19 Oct 2010 @ 8:31amThe world might not owe the individual something, but the individual does not anything to the world either. If the world expect us to follow rules, then the world must give something in return, otherwise there is no moral obligation AT ALL of following the rules.
However, most of the time, the world does give us something back for following those rules.


text:
After living almost a month in burned out public housing, Deborah Wheeler and her 10 children have a new place to live.
Housing Authority officials found Wheeler and her family a temporary home in a three-bedroom rowhouse in West Baltimore and helped them move yesterday.
Wheeler's family will be moved back to its larger rowhouse near downtown once it is renovated, Juanita Clark Harris, deputy director of the city Housing Authority, said yesterday.

subset: commoncrawl


text:
Fishers Share Insights on 'Life Is a Gift'
Belmont President Dr. Bob Fisher and his wife Judy spoke this morning in Neely as part of the Spiritual Development Speaker Series, sharing stories and insights from their 2009 book release, Life Is a Gift: Inspiration from the Soon Departed. The book features a collection of interviews and lessons learned from 104 terminally ill patients of Alive Hospice in Nashville.
Judy Fisher opened the convocation by recalling Adam White, the longtime boyfriend of the Fishers' daughter. White was killed in the Sept. 11, 2001 attack on New York City, but the memory of how he lived, with passion and vigor, lives on. "He truly lived like there was no tomorrow," Mrs. Fisher said, noting that his example inspired the book. "We were just left asking 'Why doesn't everyone live like that?'"
Dr. Fisher added, "[His death] broke our hearts. For awhile I didn't understand what was going on with me or how I felt about it. Adam inspired us to take a fresh look at everything."
From their interviews with Alive Hospice patients, the Fishers transcribed more than 400,000 words. The conversations with patients like 5-year-old Maddie or the 98-year-old man who spent his last weeks learning Hungarian followed a standard question-and-answer formula: What are you most proud of? What has been your greatest joy? What has been your greatest disappointment? What do you regret? If you could give one message to the world, what would it be?
According to the Fishers, a few common themes that emerged were relationships, faith, forgiveness and gratitude. "The community needs the dying to force us to think about eternal issues and to make us listen," Dr. Fisher said. "These connections taught us so much."


text:
When I was a kid, I obsessed about a few things. I always wanted to build forts in the house and tents over my bed. This later found me fixated on trying to create things that could hang and move above me. I would check out countless books at the library on how to create mobiles, and Alexander Calder. I would often take wire hangers and bend them- attach colored paper drawings or objects. They never had the balance- (I was never good at math--) but they did make the room have a crafty charm. I remember making one entirely out of yarn god eyes. I must have been about 10- and decided to hang it over the lamp in my room so that it would dangle and create colorful lighting. I awoke to the smell of smoldering yarn and my dad yanking the smokey art piece into the trash.
When I was in college & lived in Ohio I worked at this darling gallery for home and garden. We sold these natural metal mobiles that hang from trees in the garden. The artist had made sculptures since the mid 70's. I decided to look up some kinetic artists-- that are creating Miro/ Calder like work that could hang someplace overhead. I love that mobiles seem so delicate...
Julie Frith is a mobile artist who appreciates modern design and structure and started making mobiles in the early 1980's for fun. These images are all from her website- where you can custom order designs
The next pictures are from the artist Joel Hotchkiss- one of the the artists that we carried at the gallery. find them at : http://www.artmobiles.com/
this last site will help show you how to make your own mobile- (did I ever tell you I received my first degree in ARt Education?)


text:
This article is a collaboration between MedPage Today® and:
Compared with other beta-blockers, carvedilol may lead to better outcomes in patients with heart failure and acute myocardial infarction, a meta-analysis showed.
In pooled results, including those from the COMET trial, carvedilol significantly reduced all-cause mortality in patients with heart failure compared with several beta 1 selective beta-blockers (24.1% versus 28.6%; RR 0.85, 95% CI 0.78 to 0.93), according to James DiNicolantonio, PharmD, of Ithaca, N.Y., and colleagues.
A similar reduction was seen among patients with acute MI in a fixed-effects model (RR 0.55, 95% CI 0.32 to 0.94) but not in a random-effects model (RR 0.56, 95% CI 0.26 to 1.12), the researchers reported online in the American Journal of Cardiology.
"Although a large, randomized, multicenter trial is required to confirm the results of this meta-analysis in patients with acute MI, COMET has confirmed carvedilol's efficacy over metoprolol in patients with systolic heart failure," they wrote. "Thus, clearly for patients with systolic heart failure, carvedilol should be considered the beta-blocker of first choice."
Guidelines on acute coronary syndromes, acute MI, and heart failure recommend beta-blockers as first-line therapy, but do not provide any guidance on selecting one drug over another.
Because carvedilol has been shown to have "pleiotropic effects (antioxidant and vasodilating), which are not shared by the commonly prescribed beta 1 selective beta-blockers," the researchers performed a systematic review and meta-analysis to explore whether carvedilol results in superior outcomes compared several of those types of drugs, including atenolol, bisoprolol, metoprolol, and nebivolol (Bystolic).
They identified 11 randomized trials that directly compared carvedilol with one of the other beta-blockers -- three in acute MI and eight in systolic heart failure populations. The trials included a total of 5,207 patients (median of 150 patients per trial). The largest trial was the 3,029-patient COMET, which compared carvedilol and metoprolol in patients with heart failure.
Through a median follow-up of 12 months, although carvedilol significantly reduced all-cause mortality, it did not reduce heart failure readmissions (RR 0.98, 95% CI 0.93 to 1.03), "suggesting a discordant relative effect of these agents on mortality versus overall cardiac compensation," according to the authors.
In patients with acute MI, carvedilol did not reduce nonfatal MI versus the other agents (RR 0.61, 95% CI 0.31 to 1.22).
There were few differences in outcomes between carvedilol and the other agents in individual trials, but in the four trials pitting metoprolol against carvedilol in patients with heart failure, carvedilol was significantly better at preventing all-cause mortality (RR 0.86, 95% CI 0.78 to 0.94).
DiNicolantonio and colleagues noted several potential mechanisms to explain the improvement in outcomes observed with carvedilol compared with the beta 1 selective beta-blockers.
Carvedilol has been shown to have antiarrhythmic effects that are not as pronounced with the other agents, which "would potentially lead to better reductions in sudden cardiac death and all-cause mortality in patients with acute MIs and those with heart failure," they wrote.
In addition, they wrote, "improvements in ejection fraction, symptomatic functional class, stroke volume, stroke work, cardiac output, insulin sensitivity, and adrenergic activity with carvedilol, along with a potential increase in the risk for death with beta 1 selective beta-blockers if strict compliance is not followed, all may contribute to the overall morbidity and mortality benefits noted with carvedilol compared with beta 1 selective beta-blockers."
The researchers specifically addressed the extensive use of atenolol.
"Atenolol has not been shown to improve long-term cardiovascular prognosis after acute MI, nor has it been shown to be effective for improving outcomes in patients with heart failure," they wrote. "Additionally, when used for hypertension, atenolol does not protect against heart disease or reduce mortality despite lowering elevated blood pressure."
"The fact that atenolol continues to be one of most widely prescribed beta-blockers (presumably because of habit) is indefensible from a scientific perspective," they wrote.
Some limitations of the analysis noted by the researchers included the fact that not all of the trials were double-blind, the relatively small patient numbers in almost all of the trials, and the variation in dosing across the studies.
From the American Heart Association:
- 2007 Focused Update of the 2004 Guidelines for the Management of Patients with ST-Elevation Myocardial Infarction
- 2011 ACCF/AHA Focused Update of the Guidelines for the Management of Patients With Unstable Angina/Non-ST-Elevation Myocardial Infarction (Updating the 2007 Guideline
- Care and Outcomes of Acute Myocardial Infarction
- Acute Heart Failure Syndromes: Emergency Department Presentation, Treatment and Disposition
DiNicolantonio had no disclosures. Co-authors reported relationships with GlaxoSmithKline and Forest Pharmaceuticals.
- Reviewed by F. Perry Wilson, MD, MSCE Instructor of Medicine, Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania and Dorothy Caputo, MA, BSN, RN, Nurse Planner


text:
A Time To Remember
Paw Prints: Writings of the maddog
The Titanic is probably the most discussed ship of all times. Last weekend on the 100th anniversary of its sinking I went to see the 1953 classic movie "Titanic" with Clifton Web, Barbara Stanwyck and a very young Robert Wagner at our local "arts" theater, the Wilton Town Hall Theater. The movie was free (donations to local charities recommended), and a huge bucket of fresh-popped popcorn, with real butter, is only 5 dollars.
There are also the movies "A Night to Remember" in 1958, and James Cameron's Oscar-winning movie "Titanic" in 1997 which changed a disaster movie into a love story and the 3D version out this year.
The DEC Alpha version of GNU/Linux was first started as a project in January of 1995, and completed in the fall of 1995. At that time the Alpha was the worlds fastest microprocessor, and of course was a 64-bit processor instead of just 32-bit. Both of these facts interested a small company in California named "Digital Domain".
In 1997 I was in Los Angeles attending a trade show when I met a young man named Daryll Strauss who was a software engineer at Digital Domain. At that time Daryll had been "hacking on Unix systems" for fifteen years, and was deep into visual effects for film.
Daryll invited me to Digital Domain's headquarters in Venice, California where they were just putting on the finishing touches to a new film by James Cameron (who along with two business partners founded Digital Domain in 1993) called "Titanic".
Not being a real "film buff" I had never heard of Digital Domain before, and did not really know who James Cameron was, but I did understand the scope of what they were trying to do in the movie.
At that time most of the artists working at Digital Domain were using SGI workstations to do their individual work. A few were using Windows NT on Intel. Sometimes closed-source software packages only were found on SGI (which at that time was well known for its high-end computer graphics) and sometimes only on Windows NT, so the artists would use the platform that had the tools. However, Windows NT at the time did not have certain features that allowed it to fit into the Unix environment that was at the core of Digital Domain's network.
As the artists finished their detailed work, Digital Domain ordered 160 Alpha systems pre-installed with Red Hat 4.1 GNU/Linux, and set up their rendering and compositing farm. First they used the farm to render the water (water is very hard to render realistically), then used the farm to composite the movie, close to four hundred thousand frames over a period of three months with the systems running 24 hours a day, seven days a week.
There were a number of alternatives that Digital Domain could have followed. They could have used Digital Unix (DU) on the Alphas, but they needed support for some devices that DU did not support, and writing the device drivers for DU was difficult. Besides the number of licenses they would have needed would have boosted their costs considerably.
Digital Domain could have used SGI machines, but the DEC Alpha gave them a 2-3 times performance benefit due to the floating point performance, and about twice the performance over an Intel-based solution due to CPU speed and bus bandwidth. Not only was this a performance boost, but under the time constraints it was a price-performance benefit also, as they did not need to buy as many processors to get the work load completed in the time frame they needed it finished.
Of course this was in the early days of the Alpha/Linux port and not everything was peaches and cream. There were some bugs found by Digital Domain in various libraries, and some device driver work that had to be done, but by and large the systems were very stable, with some computers running for over a month at a time continuously. Pretty good for 1997 and a port that had been finished only a few months before they started work.
Titanic was released on December 19th, 1997 to theaters. I begged Digital Equipment Corporation's marketing department to play up the fact that Alpha and Alpha Linux were used in making the movie, but Digital held back. They were afraid that if the movie flopped at the box office that there would be the comparison of "A really big ship, a really big movie and a really big computer company all sinking.....". Of course James Cameron's Titanic was (and remains today) a huge success and only the first and third parts of the "sinking" are true.
I went to an early showing of Titanic in 1997. While most people were riveted by the love story of Jack and Rose, I was fascinated by the glistening of the sun on the surface of the water and how they managed to put "live" people on the deck of this CGI ship.
In March of 1998 as Titanic lined up for the Oscars, DEC did (finally) make a big "splash" at CeBIT in Hanover, Germany. At the main booth of Digital they had some large posters made of the Titanic, and how Alpha had played a significant part in the production of the movie. However, GNU/Linux was not mentioned in the advertisements....only Alpha.
Now it is the year 2012. We are used to the graphics of Shrek, Toy Story, Lord of the Rings, Avatar and other classic CGI movies. Each generation brings about an evolution of techniques and greater CPU power at lower prices.
But "Titanic" was a step-function. In 1997 it set the bar so much higher than what had gone before, that even today people can appreciate what they did.
Next Sunday I will be going to see the new 3D version of Titanic. While I know the new 3D version was not rendered on Alpha systems, I will look in the credits to see if they mention GNU/Linux, and I will remember a different time.comments powered by Disqus
Issue 33: Discover LibreOffice/Special Editions
Buy this issue as a PDF
A New Raspberry Pi Board
The new board packs everything that you get in Raspberry Pi 3B+ in a smaller package.
OpenStack Foundation Changes Name of the OpenStack Summit
New event will be known as the Open Infrastructure Summit
Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 Beta
The latest version strikes a balance between past and future.
System76 Announces a Line of US-Made PCs
Thelio series is available for pre-order and will ship in early December.
IBM Acquires Red Hat
IBM is acquiring Red Hat, the most successful open source company.
Fedora 29 and Ubuntu 18.10 Released
New releases focus on boot time, new hardware, and modular design.
Redis Labs Modules Forked
New Commons Clause license rider causes Debian and Fedora developers to fork Redis Labs modules.
Microsoft Offers its Patent Portfolio
The company ends its long war; vows to protect Linux.
Red Hat Reports $823 Million in Revenue for Second Quarter 2019
Strong performance for cloud and container products leads to a 14% increase over last year.
Debian, Ubuntu, and Other Distros are Leaving Users Vulnerable
A security researcher says Linux vendors wait too long to patch the kernel.


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Sea Dad of MANANNAN-MACLIR the Sea God.
His name may have been used by Shakespeare as the basis for King Lear. He may also be the God of Leicester, which seems a bit out of the way.
Apart from this he had four kids who were turned into swans for 900 years by a wicked stepmother. They didn't get to live in Swan Lake, but somewhere very Northerly and Nasty and only just survived the ordeal and were in very poor shape when returned to human form.


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Volume 16 Issue 52 | May 21 - 27, 2004
Moody? Hormones or clinical depression, how can you tell?
By Dr. Amy Glaser
Parents fear the adolescent monster: sulky, withdrawn, hostile, and defiant. He or she may not be like that all the time. But lets face it, hormonal change in adolescence often introduces a moodiness that we may not have seen in our comparably upbeat pre-teens. Okay, so when is adolescent moodiness normal and when is it something more? Reality testing with other parents is difficult. Not all teens act out to the same degree, and it is always a shock to experience the adolescent personality change even for parents who know it is coming. Worst of all, some children presenting a sullen front to their parents seem genuinely unhappy. Even parents who despair of getting an adolescent to get them to unburden their deep dark secrets may become concerned that they are missing something serious. So the question becomes for the parent, how do I know when my child needs help?
According to Dr. Nancy Rubinstein, a child and adolescent psychiatrist practicing in Lower Manhattan, this is a legitimate concern and parents should remain sensitive to mood disorders beyond normal growing pains in the adolescent years. Some mood disorders, such as bipolar disease (manic/depressive illness), often develop during adolescence and are a frequently missed diagnosis, particularly because of the background moodiness of the teenage years.
There are certain vulnerable children in whom moodiness, irritability, school failure and risky behaviors can be diagnostic clues of a more serious psychiatric disorder, she says. According to the National Institute of Mental Health, over 1.5 million children under the age of 15 are severely depressed.
Children and teens, particularly those with a family history of mood disorders, can show symptoms of this more serious illness, which may be explained away as stereotypical teen angst. Also the behavioral symptoms can overlap with symptoms of other disorders such as Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder.
The diagnosis becomes trickier because young people with a serious mood disorder can have A.D.H.D. at the same time. The overlap of these two disorders is estimated to be at least 15 %. Your child may have difficulty paying attention, be hyperactive, irritable even explosive and have acting out behaviors. They may have been treated with stimulant medication but still have significant problems. Their moods may be erratic, fluctuating between sadness/hopelessness, and exaggerated good moods with impulsive judgment. Sometimes these various emotions are present at the same time. Parents can feel overwhelmed and not know how to proceed.
Dr. Rubinstein suggests that these difficult children be evaluated by a competent adolescent psychiatrist who can make the diagnosis and begin treatment. There are a number of effective medications which can help stabilize moods and behaviors and return children to optimal functioning, Dr. Rubenstein adds.
Untreated, these children, particularly in their teen years, are at risk for school difficulty, alcohol and drug problems, risky sexual behavior and most alarmingly, suicide. Suicide remains an important cause of death among teenagers with successful attempts most common among males.
There is a persistent controversy about antidepressant medication and its potential to cause suicidal thinking in young people. It appears that some children, particularly those with a genetic predisposition to bipolar illness, can reportedly show a paradoxical response the otherwise highly effective antidepressants called selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (S.S.R.I.s). The risk may be greatest in the first few weeks of treatment. However, when these children are closely monitored by a medical professional, evidence of emerging suicide ideation can be handled immediately, according to Dr. Rubinstein. In my experience antidepressant medications have been overwhelmingly helpful for depressed children and adolescents. And mood stabilizers, such as lithium, Depakote, and Lamictal can treat bipolar symptoms in young people with gratifying effectiveness.
By the time our children reach their teen years, parents have a good idea of who they are, what they are good at, and where they are vulnerable. Some moodiness during adolescence can be expected, but marked personality changes should alert parents of possible problems. Changes in their ability to take pleasure in activities, inability to sleep, decreased or extremely heightened energy levels, and rage inappropriate to the stimulus may all be signs of depression. And of course signs of failure in their own world, such as withdrawal from peer group activities, school cutting, and school behavior problems, may be a cry for help. Such a cry should not be overlooked.
Amy Glaser, MD, a mother of two teenagers, has a private adolescent practice at 430 West Broadway, 212-941-1520. She can also be reached at email@example.com.
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AUTOMORPHIC FUNCTIONS. Fractional Linear Transformations. Noneuclidean Geometry. Discontinuous Groups. Polygon Groups. Poincar & ebreve Series. The Field of Automorphic Functions. Automorphic and Algebraic Functions. Algebraic Curves of Genus 0 and 1, Canonical Polygons. ABELIAN INTEGRALS. Reduction, Existence. The Period Matrix. The Modular Group. Canonical Transformation. The Theorem of Riemann and Roch. The Theorem of Abel. The Jacobi Inversion Problem. Theta Functions. The Zeros of the Theta Function. Theta Quotients. Jacobi-Abel Functions. Cumulative Index: Vols. I & IISiegel, C. L. is the author of 'Topics in Complex Function Theory Automorphic Functions and Abelian Integrals', published 1988 under ISBN 9780471608431 and ISBN 0471608432.[read more]
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text: Whether it be from films like Pixar's Cars, through sociological and historic study or through an interest in Americana, you've probably heard of Route 66. "The Mother Road", as it was called, connects Chicago, IL and Los Angeles, CA and is really the first interstate the US ever saw. Motorists were sick of arriving at state lines only to find ...Read More »


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Registration is now open for the 8th annual Yamamoto Big Bass Challenge, as it comes back to the California delta - at Russo's Marina, on April 14th and 15th, to deliver another year of fun, excitement - and hourly seats for BIG CASH, that anglers of every age and skill levels can win!
For this year, Angler's Press Outdoors will donate - in the honor and memory of Andy "Cooch" Cuccia, $5 dollars for each person that participates, towards the 2018 C.O. Pro Teen event that Andy worked so tirelessly over the past years to host.
From the inception of the Yamamoto Big Bass Challenge event, it is without question that Cooch's contributions have been tremendous, as he helped make the event one that most angler's look forward to being part of year after year.
To this end, we will also honor Cooch, and keep him in our memory by naming the event's Big Bass award the "Andy Cuccia Memorial Yamamoto Big Bass Award"
Registration is now open....and we look forward to seeing you all there!
Angler's Press Outdoors
To get signed up go to anglerspress.com
Registration is now open for the 8th annual Yamamoto Big Bass Challenge
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Karsun Solutions LLC is in the business of solving problems. Since 2009 as a premier consulting services company with a culture of innovation, Karsun offers a portfolio of Enterprise Modernization services to both civilian and defense Federal agencies. Karsun's list of strong clientele includes U.S. Department of Homeland Security, U.S. General Services Administration, and the Federal Aviation Administration. Karsun combines years of institutional knowledge with a deep commitment to customer relationships, on every project.
The successful candidate will manage a medium/large application portfolio with multiple concurrent project efforts supporting a major Federal Agency with a team of cross-discipline professionals. He/She will work with senior client personnel in managing software development, enhancement, operations and reporting tasks on multiple task orders. Critical success factors include overseeing management of mission critical software systems, change and risk management, and personnel and vendor management. Candidate will possess superior presentation and communication skills.
The candidate will serve as the Government's primary point-of-contact providing overall leadership and guidance for all personnel assigned to the program. The candidate will ultimately be responsible for the cost, quality, schedule and overall efficiency of the work performed under the program. This individual shall have the authority to commit the required resources and make decisions for the organization in response to Government issues, concerns, or problems. This person shall be readily available to respond to Government questions, concerns, and comments, as well as be proactive in alerting the Government to potential contractual or programmatic issues
Required Skills:
Desired Skills:
Qualifications (Education/Experience) :
For more information on this or any other position, chat one-on-one with our recruiters during our weekly virtual chat event every Thursday at 12:00pm EST.
Karsun Solutions is an Equal Employment Opportunity (EEO) employer. It is the policy of the Company to provide equal employment opportunities to all qualified applicants without regard to race, color, religion, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity, national origin, age, protected veteran or disabled status, or genetic information.
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text: You get a very fast app designed for Bible Study, quick navigation. No other Bible app matches the design, functionality of this Bible app. A simple, powerful design will allow you to easily read the Bible and navigate. This Bible contains two learning modes, audio Bible and Biblical texts, devotionals and daily prayers. Find out for yourself why this Bible are the top selling Bibles when you download this free version of the NKJV Bible!


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RV Auction Opens Website to Public in July
July 7, 2010 by RVBusiness · Comments Off on RV Auction Opens Website to Public in July
Vision Dealers Auction, a business-to-business website that caters to the RV and automotive industries and allows dealers to sell inventory to each other on a wholesale basis, is opening its site for 10 days to allow the public to buy through auction and buy-it-now sales at the same prices dealers do.
The auction will be opened to the public July 8-18, according to a news release.
Joyce Dillingham, vice president of marketing for Vision Dealers Auction, talked with participating dealers about opening the site to the public before putting the campaign in motion. She said the dealers were unanimous, all agreeing that the added exposure of their inventory to potential buyers is always positive.
There are currently over 100 open auctions on the website and more are being added daily. A sample of inventory showed:
- A 2006 Jayco Jayflight 27BH that had a current bid of $2,375.
- A 2007 handicap-accessible 38-foot park model trailer with a current bid of $1,000 or a buy-it-now price of $8,200.
Both of these models qualify for the company's special delivery program where the seller will deliver to the buyer anywhere in the continental U.S. for $500.
Also listed were:
- A diesel pusher with a current bid of $37,135.
- A 53-foot car carrier for $4,000.
- Single listings and bulk lots of 10 to 20 travel trailers formerly owned by FEMA.
Dillingham added, "Private parties will be required to register on the site, but it's completely free. Also, we've waived the transaction fee (typically $250) for all private party transactions during the sale period. It's really a win- win opportunity for everyone, especially those families who are yearning to get outdoors and go camping this summer. There's still time and hopefully this will help them find a great buy on the RV of their dreams."
RV Auction Website Offers Dealers $3K Credit
June 22, 2010 by RVBusiness · Comments Off on RV Auction Website Offers Dealers $3K Credit
A new website catering to the RV and automotive industries is offering $3,000 in credits to dealers who register for free membership.
According to Joyce Dillingham, vice president of marketing for VisionDealersAuction.com, the company is using the promotion to introduce dealers to the new site, but also as a way of giving back to the industry.
Vision Dealers Auction allows dealers, banks and corporate fleets to buy and sell RVs, automobiles, boats, powersports, even heavy equipment during auction periods that run from three to 30 days. The company charges buyers and sellers a flat-rate transaction fee only when an accepted transaction is completed.
"It's been a tough couple of years for everyone. Dealers are trying to save their summer market by buying at the right price point so they can attract retail buyers with affordable prices and still put a few dollars in the bank. This credit, which will pay for 12 transactions, is our way of reducing their cost," explained Dillingham.
Dealers have until June 25 to sign up and receive the $3,000 credit.
Vision Dealers Auction is owned and operated by Resurgence LLC, a Fresno-Calif., company. The company's management team has over 80 years cumulative experience in the RV and automotive industries. The company works with dealers of all sizes throughout the U.S., Canada and abroad.
To contact the company, call (559) 248-2100. Their website is www.visiondealersauction.com.


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Castlevania: Harmony of Despair for XBLA?
Castlevania: Harmony of Despair, is rumored to be an upcoming Xbox Live Arcade title featuring all the past Castlevania protagonists working together in a Metroidvania fashion. The post was first reported by 'NeverKnowTech' who have since pulled their article, but once something goes live, it's not all that difficult to find again - brief details after the jump!
Using the little bit of 'Castlevania HD' gameplay they witnessed, the game was described as a 2D offering using sprites instead of 3D polygons that looked very similar to the post-Symphony of the Night style Metroidvania GBA\DS games. Once you load into a game they claimed it was possible to play with up to 6 friends on a single map simultaneously. Known playable characters were noted as: Soma Cruz, Alucard, Jonathan Morris, Shanoa and Charlotte Aulin, with each one having their own unique special ability.
Click Thumbnails to Enlarge
Although this is listed under rumors until Konami make some form of official announcement, they have recently filed a 'Harmony of Despair' trademark in Europe, which suggests this game should be announced any time soon.
Xboxic will keep you posted on any future updates, and please do feel free to leave a comment below. If you're feeling a little generous with your spare time, why not follow us on Twitter and Facebook to keep up to date with all the latest news?
Source: NeverKnowTech


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Beach parking stickers valid for residents only at municipal parking lots near the beach for 1986 will be available beginning Monday for $5 each.
The stickers will be on sale in the City Hall lobby from 9 a.m. until noon Monday through Friday.
City Clerk Muriel Rickard said that to be eligible for a sticker, residents must show their vehicle registration, including vehicle identification number. In addition, residents also must present a Deerfield Beach voter registration card, or a city water or telephone bill.


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Granted he thought I was never/not that interested in him but when I expressed my disappointment at his having a girlfriend, he said he had a really great time at our last date/meeting (it was ambiguous) and that he has always really liked me. I want him to give us another shot.
We we are meeting up to talk soon and he seems really keen about it (offering up many dates and being very accommodating when I had to reschedule) Is it possible to get closure or is it his feelings getting the best of him?
Also, would you say that his feelings for me are still quite intense at this point in time?
I'd gladly welcome any input, thanks!
- No he wasn't lying and I believe he still feels the same way
- Yes he could very well be lying.
Most Helpful Guy
He is being a shaddy guy to his girlfriend and I feel you should back off because you wouldn't like any girl doing this with your boyfriend
We met way before his girlfriend and him did and it was quite a misunderstanding on both our parts where he said he didn't wanna assume that I liked him given our professional relationship?
No dont find excuses to do this just back off and it doesn't matter he has a girlfriend it doesn't matter if he met you or her first just back off get an available man. Trust me when i say this HE will NOT leave his girlfriend for you you will forever be his side chick
Most Helpful Girl
If I were you I would not meet him. He has girlfriend and that is end of the discussion.
If he really likes you; he will find a way to be with you. But you should not do anything.
He is the one who should solve this; not you. Do not give a shot or sth.
Not even to talk things over?
No. You do not even owe a good bye , really.
If he contacts you, just tell things are over.


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Weekend Online Crop @Brunei Scrappers Forum
Joined the weekend 24-26 Dec online crop with the HS ladies. So good to finish 6 LOs altogether in 1 week (allthough, we're suppose to finish them during the weekend itself).
The 6 LOs are based on the following outlines:
1. Nostalgic
2. Emotions
3. Red & Green
4. 2009
5. 5 things about me
6. Family
And here's my takes:
Had fun doing all these LOs. Definitely a mojo booster. And it's obvious my mojos are not consistent. heeeee..... TFL babes!


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What the world needs now is more Dorothy Draper.
Draper, who published Decorating is Fun! in 1939, right before World War II, "believed that though there were troubles in the world, one's home should be a refuge, a cheerful place for entertaining one's friends and a colorful and comfortable shelter after the storm."


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December 27, 2012
Spain Refuses Asylum For Pakistani Blasphemer
Imran Firasat could face death for Blasphemy in Pakistan because he made a movie about Mohammad.
Spain has begun deportation proceedings against Imran Firasat, a Christian refugee from Pakistan, for making a documentary about Mohammed and thereby threatening the national security of Spain. If Firasat is deported back to Pakistan, he will face the death penalty proving that it's a short step from the Spanish Inquisition to the Pakistani Inquisition.Ahh Spain, home of the inquisition. Well some of the most famous parts anyway. Under the Inquisition blasphemy would have also been punishable by death.
The United States has a man sitting in prison for making another blasphemous movie, which the government spent weeks blaming for worldwide attacks on American embassies. And he isn't the first man persecuted or prosecuted for offending Islam. Offending Islam has become a national security issue involving all levels of government.
Can you imagine the cries of outrage if the a nation state still used the Catholic Church or any other Christian law to impose such a penalty for blasphemy in the modern west?
But Islam and Pakistan will get a pass, because of, you know, the cowardice.
threatening the national security of Spain
Blasphemy makes terrorism seem predictable. It delivers that false sense of control that is at the root of Stockholm Syndrome, the seductive illusion that the thug can be reasoned with and that we can restore control over our perilous environment by accepting responsibility for the enemy's violence. If we meet a set of conditions then we will have peace. And what kind of lunatic wouldn't want peace? The kind who needs to be deported or locked up in the name of peace.Hat Tip: Tarek.


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23 Intently Staring Goalies
Anthony Brodeur—the Next Generation?
by lsefton on 07/09/12 at 01:19 PM ET
Comments (0)
Who knows? Maybe in five years we'll have a new sports question—"Name the father/son NHL goaltending duo with the most wins"
Or we'll get to hear Doc Emrick announce "Brodeur vs Roy in the nets tonight".
It's only been a few weeks since the NHL draft, but there's always time to take a look at next year's prospects, and one of them may be Anthony Brodeur.
From Luke Fox at Sportsnet:
Anthony Brodeur is a little older, and by all accounts covers more of the net, than he appears in the photo above, snapped 12 NHL off-seasons ago, following the second of father Martin Brodeur's three Stanley Cup victories.
But one thing hasn't changed from this photograph: Anthony is still wearing a mask and playing with the wide stick.
Set to enter his senior year at Minnesota's Shattuck-St. Mary's, the younger Brodeur goaltender is ranked as a mid-round pick for the 2013 NHL Entry Draft, to be held next spring in a venue Dad knows well—the Prudential Center in Newark, N.J.
"He's got a chance to be a good player… he's another kid enjoying the anonymity of our school," Shattuck coach Tom Ward told NHL.com last week. "If you didn't know who he was, you'd probably say he reminds you of a mini-Marty… a hybrid-style goalie who will make the kick save. He'll Johnny Bower you, go down in the V, and play like his dad.
"He has that one-in-a-million kind of thing and he's a fine goalie. He was offered a chance to play in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League but said, 'No thanks.' He wants to be a college hockey player. He has a good head on his shoulders, is composed and doesn't let the moment get to him."
The 17-year-old will enter the fall as a C-list prospect, according to NHL Central Scouting's Futures List, which projects him to be selected somewhere in Rounds 4 through 6. Of course, his ranking could escalate or drop depending on his performance in 2012-13.
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About 23 Intently Staring Goalies
23 Intently Staring Goalies comes from the 23 close-up photos of goalies that used to line the walls of my office.
On the good side, it kept down interruptions, but it also made sure I had to leave my trash outside my door if I wanted it picked up.
I've been watching and analyzing goaltenders for going on 40 years. Some of that was spent drawing goalies on my grade 8 math homework. Then it was taking my card decks and printouts to Indianapolis Racer games. Luckily, the Internet took off, and by 1991 I was half of the duo that would ultimately become the Plaidworks hockey mailing lists. I wrote "Handicapping the Goalies' for the San Jose Sharks mailing list, and took a lot of photos of goalies in action. I have around 5000 slides of mostly goaltenders in action from 1989 through 2001 from the WHL, IHL and NHL. Since I've gone digital, I've added about 10,000 more images to the library. During summers and when the league went dark, I was reading through multiple SF By area news papers, tracking ice hockey from the 1917 recreational leagues up through the California Seals.
We'll be talking about goalies and goaltending. We'll talk about whats going on now, who's in the system, and when the doldrums hit, I'll haul something out of the big bag of history, or something from the photo archives. We'll talk about who's hot and why, and who's not and what they can do to get back on track. We'll take a look at the trends in scouting goalies, and why a style may work for one team but not another. I'll battle with my dictation software to get it to understand Bryzgalov and Bobrovsky.
It should be interesting--hope you want to come along for the ride!