text:
Statistics for A/B testing
Become a proper optimizer and know your stats. If you're not fluent in A/B testing statistics, you won't be able to tell whether your tests suck. A lot of your "winning" tests are probably not winners at all. Learn to call bullshit when needed, and be the person who advocates proper scientific approach in your team.
In this 8-class training program, you'll learn:
- How to run A/B tests with a sound statistical design.
- How to ask the right questions, avoid common mistakes, and get insights through statistics.
- An in-depth understanding of statistical hypothesis testing and concepts like statistical significance, confidence intervals, statistical power, and others.
This course is right for you if...
- You can't define statistical significance correctly without looking it up on Google.
- Your A/B tests produce a lot of "winners," but your clients aren't seeing improvements.
- You're planning and analyzing A/B tests, but you don't understand the statistical underpinnings of the testing process.
- You're not confident in the outcomes of your tests and are unsure how much trust to put in them
- You have an in-house statistical tool you want to improve, or you use a third-party A/B testing software you want to understand better
This course is NOT for you if...
- You are just starting with CRO and have little to no practical experience with A/B testing.
- You don't employ A/B tests as a primary method to evaluate CRO work.
- You are a professional statistician or experimental design specialist.
Skills you should have...
Some experience in conversion rate optimization.
Basic understanding of how A/B testing works.
Some experience with an A/B testing software.
This class will give you all the tools you need to understand the complexities involved in planning and evaluating A/B tests.
Aside from mining specific information, you'll get deeper and more accurate insights from your data in the process.
Avoid costly testing mistakes stemming from misuse and misunderstanding of statistics, and improve the ROI of all your A/B testing efforts, with Georgi Georgiev's guidance.
About your instructor:
Georgi Georgiev
Georgi Georgiev is the owner of WebFocus, a digital marketing consulting company delivering world-class marketing and analytics services for the past 10 years.
He's the mastermind behind Analytics-Toolkit.com, a SaaS used by web analysts and CRO practitioners from agencies across the world.
Georgi is a lecturer in multiple marketing events, as well as a Google Regional Trainer in AdWords & Analytics. He is also the author of three papers and multiple articles on A/B testing for conversion rate optimization.
Why we hand-selected Georgi to teach this course
Georgi is thinking about and solving the problems most folks in CRO don't have the training or the time to pursue. After you've learned from him, you'll be able to apply experimental analyses that can save you lots of sample size and test run-time for your experimentation program.
Talking with Georgi for only a few minutes reveals an incredible depth of knowledge that rivals and often surpasses trained statisticians working in more theoretical disciplines. The value he brings is one of practical application, strikingly simple explanations of complex mathematical concepts, and a deep passion for the craft of CRO.
In just 8 sessions, you'll be able to:
- Plan maximally efficient A/B tests.
- Correctly interpret A/B testing statistics.
- Navigate the complexities of MVT, segmentation, multiple KPIs, and concurrent tests.
- Plan and analyze sequential tests.
Course curriculum:
Statistics for A/B testing
Class 1
Why A/B test? Basics of causal inference
In the first class, we'll lay the groundwork that's required in order to understand more advanced concepts in subsequent classes. We'll go over basic concepts that are crucial for developing a probabilistic mindset.
Topics covered:
- Correlation and causation. Observational analysis versus controlled experiments.
- Sampling and natural variance and their implications for drawing insights from data.
- Null-hypothesis statistical tests – history and basics of causal inference.
- Control and randomization in A/B tests – why we need them and how they work?
- One-sided and two-sided tests, composite vs. point hypothesis.
Class 2
Statistical significance & confidence intervals
Statistical significance is one of the most abused concepts in conversion rate optimization. You will learn what it is, really. We'll discuss common misuses and misunderstandings, their consequences, and how to avoid them.
Topics covered:
- What is statistical significance.
- Common misuses of statistical significance and how to avoid them.
- Common misinterpretations and how to avoid them.
- A/A, A/B/A, A/A/B/B testing – when are they appropriate, and what can they be used for?
- Confidence intervals.
Class 3
Planning A/B tests: Sample size & statistical power
Why is statistical power so important, and yet so neglected? You will learn about the trade-offs involved in planning A/B tests, and how to avoid under- and over-powered tests.
Topics covered:
- What is statistical power and why does it matter?
- The relationship between power and other statistical parameters: significance, sample size, & minimum detectable effect.
- Under-powered and over-powered tests.
Class 4
Multivariate testing & concurrent tests
Learn how to properly plan and analyze a multivariate test, avoiding common pitfalls. We examine the practice of running multiple concurrent tests, and how and when it's appropriate.
Topics covered:
- Complexities introduced by testing more than one variant versus control
- When is an A/B/n test preferred to a simple A/B test?
- Do's and don'ts of running concurrent tests
Class 5
Segmentation, multiple KPIs, & non-binomial tests
Learn how to gain deeper insights by segmentation. We'll also examine the fine details of using multiple outcome metrics for a test and cover non-binomial metrics such as revenue per user.
Topics covered:
- Segmenting A/B testing data for maximum insights.
- Complexities in running tests with more than one outcome metric.
- Analyzing non-binomial data such as revenue and time on site.
Class 6
Sequential testing
Sequential testing is the future of A/B testing. Learn about different approaches to sequential testing, and how to plan and analyze a sequential test.
Topics covered:
- Shortcomings of classical fixed-sample tests
- The issue of optional stopping
- The alpha-spending approach to sequential testing
- Planning and analyzing a sequential test
- Adaptive tests – benefits and drawbacks
Class 7
Faster testing by asking the right questions
How can we run A/B tests with maximum efficiency? By designing and analyzing them to reflect the questions we want answered.
Topics covered:
- One vs two-tailed significance tests
- Non-inferiority testing
- Nontraditional hypothesis and analysis
Class 8
Planning ROI-positive A/B tests
The cherry on top: how to combine everything from the past seven courses to run highly efficient A/B tests that result in great returns.
Topics covered:
- Costs and benefits in A/B testing
- Planning ROI-positive A/B tests
You will also get introductory video lessons
In addition to classes, you'll get access to snack-sized video lessons to bring you up to speed on the course topics. Topics include:
Show Off Your New Skills: Get a Certificate of Completion
Once the course is over, pass a test to get certified in Statistics for A/B Testing
Add it to your resume, your LinkedIn profile or just get that well-earned raise you've been waiting for.
Teams of 2 and more get a 25% discount during checkout.
After completing the payment you can login to the course homepage. 7-day money back guarantee.


text:
New vExpert 2012 logo
Just a quick post. Last week I received a mail from VMware with information about the vExpert 2012 program. One of those items was a link to the new vExpert 2012 logo. So I thought to share this with you guy's.
Michael Wilmsen is a VMware training/consultant (no specific order) with more than 15 years in the IT industry. Main focus is VMware vSphere, Horizon View and Site Recovery Manager with a deepdive to performance. Michael is VCDX 210, VCAP 4/5 certified, has been rewarded with the vExpert title from 2011, is a PernixPro, Nutanix Tech Champion and a Nutanix Platform Professional.
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subset: commoncrawl


text:
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text:
You should not be given points for using sources on DDO
|Voting Style:
|Open with Elo Restrictions
|Point System:
|Select Winner
|2 years ago
|Post Voting Period
|888 times
|Debate No:
Round 1 - Con may start his / her debate
Round 2 - Main points and justifications
Round 3 - Rebuttals
Round 4 - Conclusion (con must leave this space blank - ie. forfeiture)
- No trolling
- No forfeiture
- Con must follow the debate structure
All other basic, self explanatory rules apply (e.g no swearing).
I would like to wish con the best of luck in advance and I look forward to an interesting debate.
Thank you to my opponent for hosting this debate. I hope that this will be an interesting discussion.
As Con, I will be arguing that points SHOULD be awarded for sources. I agree to all of Pro's rules and will complete the debate following said rules.
There are some scenarios that I can think of where awarding sources is useful:
1. One person's sources are counterproductive or is just used to fill up space, and even contradicting their own argument
2. One person's sources are superior to another's
3. One person's sources are full of bias
4. One person completely forgets sources in an argument where sources are necessary
I intend to break down each one of these scenarios and tell my opponent why a person should (or shouldn't) be awarded source points with the arguments above. Throughout these arguments I will use two people as examples: Bob and Jim (such originality, I know, but that's beside the point).
1. One person's sources is counterproductive or is just used to fill up space, and even contradicting their own argument
This is fairly obvious. If Bob bases his entire argument on faulty sources or sources that contradict his side to some extent, and Jim provides sources that support his side, points should obviously be awarded to Jim. If a majority of Bob's sources are just "filler" or provide nothing of importance to the topic, and Jim's have relevance to them, points should be awared to Jim. It doesn't make sense that, even though Bob had completely faulty sources and Jim didn't that Jim shouldn't be awared points. It's "quality control", if you will, and Bob obviously didn't find the necessary sources needed nor put in the effort to read and find good sources. Thus, Jim should get the points here.
2. One person's sources are superior to another's
Again, this is fairly obvious and even ties in to my previous point a bit. In this scenario, Bob only provides adequate sources that don't back up his side too much, yet Jim provides sources that provides lots of information and completely back up his side of the argument, points should be awared to Jim. Bob, again, didn't have the effort to find quality sources, and Jim did. Jim should be awared for his effort and dedication to the debate.
3. One person's sources are full of bias
Bias obviously skews one's viewpoint as well as the data of one's sources. A good result, despite being part of a comedy ruitine, was ComedyCentral's "If Google Was a Guy", where one woman states that "Vaccines cause autism". Google then proceeds to state that there are "one million results that say they don't, and one result that says they do", and the woman grabs the one and says "I knew it." In a similar way, if Bob provides a cite as his source that has obvious bias, then all of his sources must be taken into question, and if Tim's have no bias, Tim should get source points.
4. One person completely forgets sources in an argument where sources are necessary
Most importantly, claims without anything to back them up.
Bob claims that 56% of people prefer Dove over Head and Shoulder, and seeing as it's more popular it must be better. Apart from being a logical fallacy, Bob didn't cite this claim. Tim questions this and asks Bob where he got it from, and Bob simply replies "the Internet". No matter how right Bob may be, he should lose source points as he had elements in his argument that required sources, but Bob did not provide them.
These are four reasons alone why sources should award points.
I await Pro's arguments.
1.) If a person has a degree in theology does this person really need to list sources. Surely the information that they have learnt is better than picking out information from the internet just for the sources point.
2.) Some debates are based on opinion (ie. red is better than yellow) someone may decide to define the terms and list the link to the page just for the sources point. Since their opponent cannot find any sources that give any relevant evidence to back up his case he does not have a source.
3.) If the debate falls under a certain category (ie. philosophy) it is down to the debater to prove that x is more moral than y (for example) there is no need for sources in this situation.
4.) Sometimes the limitation of characters can stop there being enough room for sources to be provided. This results in either a lack of sources or the debater being forced to shorten their argument.
5.) Although sources can be extremely important in certain debates. I believe that the voting system should be based on criteria that should be met for all debates. The term 'sources' can only be used as criteria for specific debates.
6.) Sometimes people are pressured into thinking that they have to use sources in a debate and their debate falls apart when they try to use other peoples arguments just for points.
Again, looking at your example this is specific to certain debates. Lets say that Pro has a degree in philosophy and hasn't used any sources - just his brain. Con uses Wikipedia. He will still receive the sources point since no sources have been provided for Pro. Con's information could be completely wrong but voters feel that there is no need to check how truthful the source really is. It appears clear that Con has used better sources. There is no greater source than the brain. Elaborating on your example. Voters often don't check the content of the source. They judge it by quantity or by their own bias.
Regarding your 3rd point claiming that certain sources are full of bias. Bias does not necessarily mean that the source is wrong or bad. Bias sources sometimes provide good reasons to be bias. Some sources can see both sides of the argument but if you are going to write a page of information on a topic you usually have an opinion on it.
Your paragraph about sources being necessary in certain debates (4) is true in some cases. However, as I mentioned earlier. Debate criteria should consist of things that are required in all debates. Of course your example makes sense and as I spoke about in the first round - I am not against the idea of using sources. I just feel that points should not be awarded for this.
I will now provide an alternative solution to using sources. Since the topic of a more 'convincing argument' meets the criteria for all debates I suggest that instead of using sources as a voting option, if sources are necessary and are not provided then you should take this into account when voting for a more 'convincing argument'. Surely if Pro provides statistics without sources and Con does then it makes con's argument more convincing. Sources effect how convincing an argument is and as a result the two headings (sources and more convincing argument) should be linked in as one topic - keeping the heading more convincing argument since sources is only a small part of what makes up a convincing argument. Sources are important but they do not necessarily need to come under their own heading.
I await Con's case.
I have used a source because as I have said I am not against sources I just cite them when I have to.
Thanks to my opponent for their arguments. I'd like to state a few things:
When I listed my four reasons why sources can be useful, Pro responds by listing six, making his seem more viable by the sheer number of alternatives he has.
However, looking over opponent's arguments, I'm noticing a trend. Opponent chooses scenarios where it is not necessary to use sources, but sources CAN be used.
See: 1, 2, 3
Just because you can get by without sources being used doesn't mean they aren't important in these topics.
Scenario 1: This is just false. No matter how smart the person debating the topic may be, they MUST have sources to back up their claims where sources are necessary. The judges have no indication that this person knows everything. Sources are always good here, and not citing anything appears as a lack of care to the debate. Those with a brain like that know full well how important sources are, so leaving them out isn't valid here.
Scenario 2: In some instances only the definitions will be listed and no source point should be awared for that. But in a debate such as the PS4 being better than the Xbox One, which appart from its specs has a lot of opinion around it, will need sources to back up the specs. "Red is better than yellow" may even have some sources with it, depending on how deep the debate between red vs. yellow actually is.
Scenario 3: Accepted. Though sources may still be used here depending on what the philosophy is on. But I should point out your example is a fallacy. "X is moral than Y" can't possibly be debated as moral is subjective. For example, it may be wrong to you but I find it completely fine. So this type of argument isn't really valid.
The other ones are easily solved:
See: 4 & 5
Scenario 4: tinyurl or bit.ly. If a person was truly invested in a debate and wanted to make theirs good, they would have known they needed room for sources. A lack of is just careless on the debater's half. It's a very poor excuse for no sources.
Scenario 5: Just leave this blank for debates that don't need it. Sources can also be left blank if both parties provides sources adequate enough to support their argument.
Also, I'd like to note this comment:
"Although sources can be extremely important in certain debates..."
If sources are unimportant in certain debates, just leave sources blank. Opponent has listed some reasons why sources should not be used in a debate, however in a professional, formal debate, sources are an absolute NECESSITY. Opponent himself states that sources are very important. When talking about statistics, any sort of article, or the like, sources should always be used. DDO has many informal debates but also its fair share of normal ones. Why should sources be removed due to some informal ones or ones with philosophy and punish those who need sources?
Pro also provides a solution to the sources issue, but there's a much simpler option: leave sources points blank. Don't award any. That's better than removing the system entirely.
Scenario 6: This is a very rare scenario, and it's common knowledge you shouldn't focus too much on sources, rather the whole of your argument. If a person becomes overwhelmed with sources and focuses on them more than the argument, not to offend anyone who would do that, but it's poor priority management and that person deserves to lose just by not putting full attention to the debate.
Now to respond to qualms about my arguments.
Voter Integrity: This is why the "Judges" system is in place, or even the ELO limit. If you don't trust random members of DDO to adequately vote on your debate, elect fair judges, or only allow members that have experienced their fair share of debates to vote. Of course this can be abused by the instigator choosing bias judges. But if we were focusing on pure debate quality, quality judges must be important as well.
"Bias does not necessarily mean that the source is wrong or bad." Not necessarily, you are correct. But I was referring to the bias that intentionally skews data and results to fit a certain party's desires, even if the end result of the data is false.
Overall, Pro is stating that source points should be removed entirely because of a few debate scenarios, most of which I've covered. Should all source points be removed for only a few kinds of debates that most of the time are informal, such as opinion debates? It doesn't make sense and that ideology is flawed on Pro's behalf. It's similar to teachers punishing the entire class for one or two students' mistakes. It's unjust to those who actually did behave (and in this case, unjust to those who put in the time for sources). If in doubt, LEAVE SOURCES BLANK. It's much simpler and much more effective than removing source points. Tying in sources to "better argument" would just make it extremely similar to the already intact "select winner" style of voting, but with grammar/conduct attached as well.
Also, if one person has a better argument around their sources but their sources show bias, who would get the point?
Point being (no pun intended), the 7 point system is fine as is. It doesn't need tweaking, especially for sources. There are many instances where sources are useful and leaving them out hurts your debate. If sources aren't necessary, the sources point can just be left blank and it doesn't need to be acounted for. However, for some other debates that require statistics and other analytical information, or just an important need for sources, that's why the sources point is awarded and present, even for debates that don't need them.
I await Pro's response.
Before I begin I would like to mention that my opponent has broken the rules of this debate and therefore all points should be awarded to be. Rebuttals should have been in this round. Not the previous round. That round was for your main points and justifications. If you did this in round one then you should have read over the debate structure because the first round was for you to begin your argument - not completely say all of your main points.
I will still continue this debate due to the fact that I don't want to end this debate too early. However voters should consider this whilst voting.
Scenario 1: I think there may be a misunderstanding here. I didn't just mean that they wouldn't use asources. I meant that they would use sources that may not be as reliable as there opponents. They may use these sources to shouw what they are talking about and since the source(s) are true they have no need to find a more reliable source (they know thtat the source is true because it falls in line with their knowledge of the topic).
Scenario 2: The key word you used is 'may'. You said "'Red is better than yellow" may even have some sources with it, depending on how depp the debate between red vs. yellow actually is.' As I have had to mention many times. The debate criteria should cover something that has to be used in all debates. By saying that you may need to use sources in a certain debate you are technically conceding and agreeing with my point.
Scenario 3: This has been accepted by my opponent.
Scenario 4: Not everyone knows about tinyurl. On a person's first few debates they might not know that they need sources. You have said: "A lack of is just careless on the debate's half." No, it's not actually. When you are debating a topic it is always better to make your argument as convincnig as possible. This is a point agreed with by many due to the fact that you receive more points for a convincing argument than points for sources. The more content. The better the debate (as long as you have a good quality debate too). It's not a poor excuse if you ask me.
Scenario 5: My argument has been misunderstood again by my opponent. I'll put this simply. If a debate doesn't need sources one debater could just type in the debate topic into google and copy and paste the URL into DDO. Since their opponent has not used any sources they will receive the points for sources. Voters will see no reason to why one debater should not receive the source point since one of them didn't use any. You have not come up with a rebuttal for why sources should bcome under the title: "Conving argument".
In response to your comment regarding my comment. My opponent has conceded again by saying that "if sources are unimportant in certain debates, just leave sources blank." My opponent assumes that both parties will agree to leave sources blank. As I have said in my previous rebuttals. One party - either Pro or Con may use a random source (relating to the topic just for the sources point). Even if they don't use it. The other party has failed to provide a source and because of this the party using the source(s) will win the points for sources. Whilst what my opponent states about sources being neccessary in a professional, formal debate is true. Not all debates on debate.org are formal and professional. Many relate to games, fun topics and films. I did state that sources are very important and I never said they weren't. I said that in certain debates sources are important but criteria for a debate must apply to all debates. I can understand things like: More convincing argument; conduct and spelling and grammar - but sources. Are sources really necessary in all debates? I did not say that sources should be removed and not considered. I said that they should removed and should be considered when voting on whether or not the argument by one party is convincing or not.
Leaving the sources point blank doesn't always work though. As I have had to mention many times in this round. Some people use sources just for the sources point. Not all voters look at each individual source to check its reliability. If Pro uses sources and Con doesn't then surely Pro should get the sources point. Do you notice the issue with this system?
Scenario 6: This scenario is more common than you think. Debaters who have been on this site for a while know very well that if they do not include enough sources that are reliable then they will lose points that could cost them the entire debate! I did not suggest that they are completely overwhelmed with sources I merely stated that many people shorten their arguments in an attempt to keep their convining argument points but to also gain more points via sources. It isn't poor priority management - they are trying to desperately use sources because without them they risk losing a debate that they could potentially lose without extra points.
Voter Integrity: My opponent has helped my argument and conceded again by proving a solution to sources. I would like to remind my opponent that they are trying to say that sources should be kept. Surely if someone provides an alternative to something they must be against it in some way. Judge voting has nothing to do with sources. You cannot tell if a judge is bias and if the same incident occurs where one debater uses a random source and the other uses no sources then judges may fail to spot this error and award points to them.
Even if you were refering to those sources - you can not always be certain if a source has altered data. You may believe that the data has been altered because another site provides you different data however this just means that one of the sources is wrong - it could be their source that is wrong.
I haven't suggested that we competely abolish sources. As I have mentioned previously - we should keep considering sources when voting but I don't believe that sources are important enough in all debates for them to have their own title and category. I have already responded to the leave sources blank point so I wont do it again. My opponent has given me a scenario which doesn't really support their argument in any way. Not everyone would notice the sources bias. Sometimes multiple sources are used and so checking every source may not sound appealing to regular voters.
The sources point shouldn't be included because it doesn't need to have its own heading to take a role in all debates. It can be considered when voting if it needs to be considered. If it isn't neccessary in a debate then you shouldn't consider the sources. When there is a heading for something that you are judging someone on - then you are tempted to find a winner. When searching if you find that only one person has used sources and the other happened there appears to be a clear winner. Sometimes if one person uses 2 sources and another uses 5, then the person with 5 will receive the sources point (even if the sources were unreliable and false).
Due to the fact that my opponent has broken the rules of this debate (as stated at the top of this debate) all 7 points should go to me.
I await my opponents response - if they are still willing to debate this.
Pro seems to forget that he has not followed his own debate structure, as he rebutted to my arguments in round 2 as well. If I had followed his debate structure I would've been a whole round behind.
It should've gone something like this:
R1: I start, which really means I put my main points and justifications. If I "begin my argument", isn't that what I'm doing?
If I had followed debate structure by doing my rebuttals in round 3, I would be one whole round behind, giving my opponent an unfair advantage. I think in this scenario I shouldn't be penalized for this. However, because Pro responded to what was supposed to be my opening argument, apparently, in round 2, when it was supposed to be just main points and justifications, then goes on to say I broke the rules, but he was completely fine makes no sense on Pro's behalf. I do not ask the voters to penalize Pro. I ask the voters note the fault of both parties and keep it in mind whilst voting.
Also, I find it extremely important that Pro has dropped ALL FOUR of my reasons presented in Round 1. He does address these in Round 2, but I respond to them, and he does not pursue them further.
Now, to the conclusion. Keep in mind, as this is a conclusion, I will not rebut to anything else opponent has said (even though I'm tempted to), rather I will look at his arguments, evaluate them, and then make a conclusion based off of this.
I should state to everyone what my opponent seems to be arguing for vs what I am arguing for. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm 99% sure I'm not:
Opponent: You should not be given points for sources because sources are not relevant to every argument. They are important, but they should be banded together with "more convincing arguments."
Me: Sources are not used in every argument, but they are vital enough to be a separate section apart from arguments. They should still count as their own separate point.
Just because sources are not used in all debates does NOT mean that they are not important enough to warrant their own point. Tying them into arguments would leave too many points into one category, and, as I said before, be extremely similar to the already existing "Select Winner" system. The reason the two styles exist is for a variety of voting choices, one is for the overall content of the debate, and the other is for separate factors that tie into why a person won. Also, they do nothing to serve for a more "convincing argument", so that argument falls flat.
Another thing that I don't like about my opponent's arguments is his constant belittling of voters' ability, even going as far to say that I "concede" by presenting the idea of judges, which help for more fair voting when it comes to all topics. He constantly states how voters will vote for one person because they provide one source such as a definition and the other doesn't, and the like. As I've stated in my R2, if you do not trust random people with little or no debate experience to adequately vote on a debate, set an ELO limit. I don't understand how this is a concession because it doesn't provide a solution to Pro's issue. It just makes it so that you will receive quality votes and voters will truly understand how little significance a definition source really is. Also, they are far more likely to look at and weigh sources, which is really what we're discussing right now.
Opponent commonly addresses the idea of "If one person provides more sources, they win source points" which is false if both parties provide sources of quality value. It's not about the quantity of the sources, it's more so the quality that awards. If someone provides 5 quality sources VS someone provides two, sources will be left blank as both parties have provided quality sources. In the debates I've seen and been in, if both parties use sources then sources is often left in the middle.
Then opponent will continue to ask "what if one person uses a source and another doesn't?" If it's just a definition or some term, it is not enough to warrant source points alone. However, in a debate that would require sources, one person cites one valid source (apart from a definition or term) and the other doesn't, points SHOULD go to the first person.
I have presented valid reasons why source points should still be awarded separately and not bound together another category. Ultimately, my opponent's goal was to show that source points should not be used in the 7 point system. Sources are not used in all debates, and this is ultimately what opponent is attacking to prove his point. I feel that despite this, sources are important enough to warrant their own category, as in the debates they ARE in, they're so important that it doesn't make sense to get rid of them entirely. While philosophy and opinion debates may not have sources, just because of some debates the source points should not be removed. If it's a matter of voter integrity, as I stated before, raise the ELO limit if you care too much about this. Notice that this is overall an opinion argument, yet you have cited sources. More debates use sources than you probably like to believe as they are necessary extensions of our original arguments as well as the backbone behind others. Binding them in with "Quality arguments" would leave 5 points toward one topic alone, which would then render the question "Why do both the 7 point and select winner systems exist?" 7 point offers more variety in voting while "select winner" offers more of what opponent seems to be heading towards. It's an already intact system opponent can simply utilize, and if you dissect opponent's argument, there isn't really much he's going on. His two main reasons of voter integrity and not all debates using them can easily be solved easily: first by the higher ELO limits and the "select winner" system, and the latter with leaving source points blank. There is no need to reform the system. It is not perfect already due to the naturally subjective nature of voters, but putting up ELO limits is the closest you can get to fairness, and fairness is what opponent is seeking.
I thank opponent for his time and this debate.
If my opponent read my argument and understood it properly he/she would have noticed that the reason that the reason that I made rubuttals was because it would have been unfair on me if you used rebuttals and I didn't. Since you failed to follow the debate structure you had already lost. IN order to continue the debate fairly I followe the structure that you chose. My opponent has also provided an alternative debate structure although it is unacceptable to suggest a new debate structure in the closing rounds of a debate and expect that it is alright to follow by this structure.
My opponent claims that they would have been a whole round behind if the rebuttals had been done in round 3 however the rebuttals made by me in round 2 were in response to the argument posed in round 1 by my opponent. I did not have an argument in round 1. If I did pose an argument in round one then it would have been acceptable for rebuttals by my opponent but since my opponent started with an extra round it is only fair that I get to refute it. If I did not then the round allocated to rebuttals would have been increasingly complex since I would have to refute both arguments from round 1 and round 2 in that round.
Opponent: Sources are not used in every argument, but they are vital enough to be a separate section apart from arguments. They should still count as their own separate point.
"Just because sources are not used in all debates does NOT mean that they are not important enough to warrant their own point. Tying them into arguments would leave too many points into one category, and, as I said before, be extremely similar to the already existing "Select Winner" system. The reason the two styles exist is for a variety of voting choices, one is for the overall content of the debate, and the other is for separate factors that tie into why a person won. Also, they do nothing to serve for a more "convincing argument", so that argument falls flat."
I respond:
1) I never said that they aren't important - I merely pointed out that they do not need to have points for the usage of them. Of course if they are completely neccessary and they are not used then the argument is clearly not a very convincing one - and therefore they should not be awarded the convincing argument point.
2) There wouldn't be too many points into one more category because I never suggested that we add the sources points onto the arguments points - I just stated that when voting on convincing argument sources should be considered. 3 points would still be awarded for convincing argument it would be harder to receive convincing argument points simply because voters will be looking for sources as well as good arguments (in certain debates).
You say:
"Another thing that I don't like about my opponent's arguments is his constant belittling of voters' ability, even going as far to say that I "concede" by presenting the idea of judges, which help for more fair voting when it comes to all topics. He constantly states how voters will vote for one person because they provide one source such as a definition and the other doesn't, and the like. As I've stated in my R2, if you do not trust random people with little or no debate experience to adequately vote on a debate, set an ELO limit. I don't understand how this is a concession because it doesn't provide a solution to Pro's issue. It just makes it so that you will receive quality votes and voters will truly understand how little significance a definition source really is. Also, they are far more likely to look at and weigh sources, which is really what we're discussing right now."
1) Your role in this debate is to prove that sources points should be kept when voting. Providing a solution to it indicates that you have run out of arguments and are relying on alternatives to keep your argument looking longer and looking like you have more points to offer.
2) Not everyone can find willing judges to vote on their debates. It is difficult to find a sufficient amount of voters who will vote without bias on your debates. On certain topics it is unclear what the judges opinions on the topic are and therefore it is difficult to work out who to pick to judge your debates.
3) You have attempted to provide an alternative (which is not your role in this debate) and even after you hae done this you have still failed to provide me with any convincing reasons to why sources should be kept as part of the voting criteria on debate.org.
You say:
"Opponent commonly addresses the idea of "If one person provides more sources, they win source points" which is false if both parties provide sources of quality value. It's not about the quantity of the sources, it's more so the quality that awards. If someone provides 5 quality sources VS someone provides two, sources will be left blank as both parties have provided quality sources. In the debates I've seen and been in, if both parties use sources then sources is often left in the middle."
1) Whilst it is true that more experienced debaters and voters check the reliability of sources the average voter does not bother to check every source to check its individual reliability.
You say:
"Then opponent will continue to ask "what if one person uses a source and another doesn't?" If it's just a definition or some term, it is not enough to warrant source points alone. However, in a debate that would require sources, one person cites one valid source (apart from a definition or term) and the other doesn't, points SHOULD go to the first person."
1) This is your opinion and this is how you would vote - however, not everyone believes what you do. Some people (when voting) will look at the voting criteria - see the sources points - look at the debate argument - see that only one debater has used sources and immediately choose the debater who used sources. This applies to the average voter on debate.org.
Avoiding my opponents concession and failure to abide by the rules of this debate I have still won.
Conduct - Tied
Arument - Me
Spelling and Grammar - Me
Sources - Tied
Aruments should go to me since the only valid things that my opponent has stated are alternatives. My opponent has also failed to provide any reason to why sources shouldn't just be considered as part of the more convincing argument section other than an opinion ("valid enough").
Spelling and grammar should go to me since my opponent has included full capitalizations of words.
e.g but sources CAN be used.
My opponent has also made spelling mistakes.
e.g In some instances only the definitions will be listed and no source point should be awared for that.
I think that in the second example my opponent meant to say awarded but there may have been a little spelling mistake or a typo.
Overall, for these reasons and mroe I believe that I have won this debate and I hope that the voters agree with my reasons and vote Pro!
My opponent must forfeit the next round - as explained in the first round.
As this is the end of the debate, I should post nothing this round.
But it should be noted that opponent justifies his R2 rebuttals of my R1 as "I broke the rules first" which is false. HE broke the rules first. Opponent seems to be doing nothing but finding everything wrong about my argument instead of noticing the flawed logic in his. I should note some other things:
I fully capitalize my words to emphasize them. This isn't a s/g issue.
Opponent makes spelling mistakes in R3 as well. "asources" and "shouw" to name two. Opponent also uses the incorrect form of "their", and states "I meant that they would use sources that may not be as reliable as there opponents." We both have had s/g issues. But what I can't stand is opponent's blind assumption that he is absolutely right and his arguments aren't flawed whatsoever.
He spends the last round trying to woo over the voters and continues to state about my rules of breaking the debate structure, when I have shown that had I followed opponent's structure I would've been behind a whole round, giving him an unfair advantage. As well, he searches out my argument for my flaws, and fails to acknowledge his.
Overall, this is a poor debate from both sides of the argument. This could've been done better by both parties. Conduct especially.
I've nothing else to say. Voters, take every round into consideration and vote as you will.
Thank you for the debate.
But I won't vote again
Thanks for clearing it up, whiteflame.
>Reported vote: hellywon// Mod action: Removed<
7 points to Pro. Reasons for voting decision: As said, while I was reading this whole debate I was feeling at first that pro should take the win. However, Con has proved much more than Pro for these reasons: First off, in the second round Con states how Pro's arguments are not necessary and can be used. This of course was the big burden on the other side. I feel however that Pro did not do a well job lifting it off. Second, there of course was an issue with the rules stated. Although I could have this vote reported for my "conduct reasoning" I believe that this was certainly not relevant to this case at all. This was also used as a way to make the voters choose much more carefully. I as a voter discarded this issue, because there is no code of conduct point. It is only who I BELIEVE won the debate argument wise, and I give the win to Con. Feel free to ask for clarifications!
[*Reason for removal*] (1) There's nothing specific in this RFD. The voter points to one of the responses given by Con to an unknown point, then states that Pro managed to deal with their burden, but never actually points to any single argument made anywhere. (2) The vote is just entirely unclear. If Pro "lift[ed]" his burden, then why isn't he the one this voter is voting for? The voter doesn't really explain what it was that swayed his vote.
Note: Conduct can play into these "Select Winner" votes, but it cannot be the only factor involved.


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Team Interstate: Denny Wins All-Star Race; Erik Climbs to 3rd
Team Interstate shone bright in this weekend's races with an All-Star Race win Saturday night, a much-anticipated return by one of the sport's best drivers and an amazing climb from last to third in Sunday's Xfinity Series race. Here's what's happened:
Million-Dollar Denny
Denny Hamlin held off a hard-charging Kevin Harvick to win his – and Joe Gibbs Racing's – first Sprint All-Star Race. A tremendous final four-tire pit stop by the No. 11 team vaulted Denny from sixth to first for the final restart, and Denny never looked back.
With no points at stake, the annual Sprint All-Star Race is a winner-take-all event showcasing the sport's best, and to the victor goes $1 million.
Denny's Team Interstate colleagues Matt Kenseth, Kyle Busch and Carl Edwards finished fifth, sixth and 17th, respectively.
RELATED: Denny's Win Provides Moments $1 Million Can't Top (NBCSports.com)
Kyle Busch Returns
Team Interstate's Kyle Busch returned behind the wheel of the No. 18 M&M's/Interstate Batteries Toyota Camry Saturday night for the first time since breaking his right leg and left foot at Daytona International Speedway in February.
Kyle started 19th and finished sixth.
"It was a really good night for our M&M's Red Nose Day Camry," Kyle said. "I learned some things, and I think we learned some stuff – myself and Adam Stevens (crew chief) – about this racecar, for me, and getting around here in Charlotte."
Kyle said he and Adam can take what they learned and apply it to this week's Coca-Cola 600, the longest race of the year.
Erik Climbs Through the Iowa Field
Erik Jones showed yet again why he is one of the hottest young drivers in NASCAR. The driver of the No. 20 Interstate All Battery Center Toyota Camry rocketed from the rear of the field to bring home a solid third-place finish in Sunday's 3M 250 NASCAR Xfinity Series race at Iowa Speedway in Newton.
"Not a bad day," said Erik, who earned his sixth top-five and nine top-10 finish in 10 Xfinity Series starts thus far this season.
The 18-year-old rolled off the grid first for the 250-lap race, thanks to Joe Gibbs Racing development driver Drew Herring, who practiced the car Saturday and qualified it on the pole. Drew performed those duties because Erik spent Saturday in Charlotte on standby for Kyle Busch. Because of the driver change between qualifying and the race, NASCAR rules forced Erik to start in the back.
Erik wasted little time working his way through the field, however. He picked up 11 spots in the first two laps and settled into the top 10 at lap 49.
Iowa Results:
- 18 – Daniel Suarez – 18th
- 20 – Erik Jones – 3rd
- 54 – Boris Said – 26th
Lucas Oil Pro Motocross Series
Hangtown Classic, Sacramento, Calif.
- Weston Peick – 4th
- Phillip Nicoletti – 10th
- Justin Barcia – 11th
This Week
- NASCAR: Charlotte Motor Speedway
- Motocross: Glen Helen Raceway, San Bernardino, Calif.
Related articles
Posted in All Battery, Racing
Tags: Denny Hamlin, Erik Jones, Joe Gibbs Racing, Kyle Busch, NASCAR, Sprint Cup Series, Team Interstate


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Disc Herniation: Diagnosis and Treatment
A disc herniation is when the contents of the disc go beyond its normal borders. Discs are located between the vertebrae and act as shock absorbers for your spine. When the gel-like material of the disc exits its confined space, it can cause pain due to the vertebrae rubbing on each other or impingement on the spinal canal which can affect the nerves in that area. Though a herniated disc is sometimes diagnosed based on specific symptoms, it is usually noted on an MRI or CT study.
Disc Herniation Treatment Options
Conservative Treatment
Anti-inflammatory medication, physical therapy, supportive back brace, weight loss and rest can all provide help with the inflammation attributing to the pain. If these fail, a steroid injection may be considered to further alleviate the inflammation and pain. We do not recommend more than three epidural steroid injections per year as it can affect bone quality.
Should the disc be causing significant pain or impingement on the spinal cord, a discectomy and or laminectomy may be considered. A spacer may be placed in the area between the vertebrae where the disc was to maintain the space between the vertebrae.


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BDA participates Local Industry Promotion for the Bangsamoro in Japan
The Bangsamoro Development Agency (BDA) participated to the Local Industry Promotion for the Bangsamoro on August 1-15, 2017 at Hiroshima in Japan.
Engr. Jandatu Salik represented the BDA to the said study tour. He was with other delegates from various agencies: The Moropreneur Inc., MSU Maguindanao, USM Cabacan, the Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao (ARMM) agencies, Bangsamoro Business Council, and representatives from the GPH-MILF Implementing Panel and from the provinces of Lanao, Maguindanao, Tawi Tawi, Sulu, and Basilan.
The study tour included various lectures, observations and field exposures, visits to
Hiroshima City Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries Promotion Center, courtesy call to the Hiroshima Governor and stall market in the province.
The training organized by the Japan International Cooperation Agency (JICA), purpose of the training is to understand effective mechanism and methodology of local industry development in Japan by learning policies and good practices in distribution and marketing of agricultural and fishery products.


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How cool would it be to see Toy Story 3 two months before it comes out? And would it be just as cool if said viewing didn't include the ending of the movie? Well, if you're a college student, now's your chance to find out.
Pixar and Disney have arranged for a series of so-called "Cliffhanger Edition" screenings of the third chapter in the saga of Woody and Buzz. The screenings will take place at universities throughout the U.S. and will feature the first 65 minutes of the movie.
Here's Pixar Planet's report on the screenings: "The preview screenings are completely free and all you need is a valid college I.D. for entrance. Visit the 'Cliffhanger Edition' page of Disney/Pixar's Facebook profile to see if your school is listed in the drop down menu."
What do you guys think? Is this a nice promotional event for fans? Or the cinematic equivalent of a c*@ktease? Comment below.


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Thursday the White House pushed back on the claim that the passage of Obamacare lacked transparency. But President Obama has already admitted that was the case in a major interview with ABC News broadcast in January 2010.
Obamacare architect Jonathan Gruber was caught on video at an event last year saying a "lack of transparency" was a big "political advantage" in the process of passing the bill into law. This clip and several more like it have been leading the non-network news cycle for most of the week.
Yesterday White House spokesman Josh Earnest was asked about Gruber's claim. Earnest denied it was accurate saying, "The fact of the matter is, the process associated with the writing and
passing and implementing of the Affordable Care Act has been
extraordinarily transparent." He added that President Obama, "is proud of the transparent process that was undertaken to pass that bill into law."
Actually, President Obama was not at all proud of the process that led to the law's passage. In a January 2010 interview with ABC News' Diane Sawyer, Obama described it as an "ugly process" and added, "it looks like there are a bunch of back room deals." The President admitted the lack of transparency had raised legitimate concerns even among his own supporters. "Part of what I had campaigned on was changing how Washington
works, opening up transparency and I think it is — I think the health
care debate as it unfolded legitimately raised concerns not just among
my opponents, but also amongst supporters…" he told Sawyer.
At the time, President Obama seemed to take some responsibility for the lack of transparency in the process saying, "we started worrying more about getting
the policy right than getting the process right." He promised to "own up to the fact" that the process hadn't lived up to his ideals.
During the 2008 campaign, President Obama repeatedly promised that negotiations for a health reform bill would be put on C-Span so everyone could witness the process. While C-Span did cover votes and other congressional action on the bill, the all important negotiations remained private. Politifact rated it a broken campaign promise.
Ironically, by the end of 2010 then Deputy White House spokesman Josh Earnest had threatened and the cut off C-Span over a spat about a mildly embarrassing interview of the President. C-Span confirmed to the Washington Post that they have not had any interviews with a major White House figure in the four years since.
Here is the exchange between Diane Sawyer and President Obama. When the interview aired (clip below courtesy of TPM) the last part of the President's answer was edited out.
SAWYER: Health care — going forward, should all the conversations, all
the meetings be on C-SPAN?
OBAMA: You know, I think your question points out to a legitimate
mistake that I made during the course of the year, and that is that we
had to make so many decisions quickly in a very difficult set of
circumstances that after awhile, we started worrying more about getting
the policy right than getting the process right. But I had campaigned on
process. Part of what I had campaigned on was changing how Washington
works, opening up transparency and I think it is — I think the health
care debate as it unfolded legitimately raised concerns not just among
my opponents, but also amongst supporters that we just don't know what's
going on. And it's an ugly process and it looks like there are a bunch
of back room deals.
Now I think it's my responsibility and I'll be speaking to this at the
State of the Union, to own up to the fact that the process didn't run
the way I ideally would like it to and that we have to move forward in a
way that recaptures that sense of opening things up more.


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A Wyoming family's Leonberger dog has given birth to a litter of 18 puppies.
Ariel, a large Leonberger dog owned by Mary Ann Ruggiero-Smith, of Powell, gave birth to the puppies on Oct. 27.
After the pups were born, family of Ruggiero-Smith and Paul Smith pitched in to help feed the lot puppy formula.
By the time the puppies were a week and a half old, Ariel was producing enough milk to feed them with little or no help.
All the puppies were sold within a few days.
Information from: Powell Tribune - Powell, http://www.powelltribune.com


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This 4 days 3 nights desert tour includes sunset and sunrise camel rides into the dunes of Nakhla or Tizi and a stay in the Erg Chebbi dunes of Merzouga – the highest dunes in Morocco.
The first night you stay in a Berber desert camp in Zagora, the second night you stay in a hotel in the Dades Valley and the third day you take a sunset camel trek through the Erg Chebbi dunes where you stay overnight in a Berber desert camp.
During the booking process, you can upgrade the overnight accommodation to a luxury camp or to a 3 star hotel located in Erg Chebbi and Zagora.
This is a combination of 2 separate tours to Zagora and Erg Chebbi providing the essentials of both regions. We depart from Marrakech before 8:00 in a modern air conditioned vehicle. After crossing the High Atlas Mountains, we reach the first place of interest – the ancient Kasbah Ait Ben Haddou (free entrance).
The tour continues to Ouarzazete – a renown filming location of many Hollywood and international movies. Further on the road goes through the Draa Valley to the desert town Zagora.
From here we take sunset camel trek into the dunes of Tizi or Nakhla to reach our Berber desert camp.
Once arrived, we will have some time to socialize with other guests. In the evening we will enjoy a Berber dinner and entertainment around the fireplace with music and drum party. The locals are good story tellers and have many interesting stories about their lives in the desert, so do not hesitate to ask them.
You can choose between sleeping in a Berber bivouac with all bedding included or under the stars.
After an early Berber breakfast, we take morning camel trek to reach Zagora. Then we drive to Ouarzazate where we have lunch and change the vehicle for the remaining part of the tour.
Our journey continues through the Valley of Roses to the Dades Valley. Here we will stay for the night in a typical Moroccan hotel and enjoy beautiful views of the Dades Valley.
In the morning we have a breakfast and travel to Todra Gorge to enjoy the beautiful sights of this region.
After lunch we visit Rissani. When approaching Merzouga, we can clearly see the highest dunes in Morocco – the Erg Chebbi.
From here camels take us on a tour through the dunes of Erg Chebbi to our Berber desert camp.
In the evening we enjoy a traditional Berber dinner.
Early in the morning we take morning camel trek through the Erg Chebbi dunes to a hotel in Merzouga, where we have a breakfast.
Then we start our journey back to Marrakech through the Draa Valley and Ouarzazete over the High Atlas Mountains with many stops on the way. We arrive back to Marrakech around 19:30 or 20:00.


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22" x 26" oil$11,000
24" x 36" oilSOLD
Andrew Peters paintings are a result of a life spent in nature. Growing up in Council Bluffs, Iowa, he was usually hunting and fishing with his father in the Missouri River Valley. At nearby Fontenelle Forest he was mentored in ecology by naturalist James Malkowski. He drew birds from life and Audobon prints, and studied academic painting in the studio of Fran Day. He earned a Bachelor of Sciences degree from Iowa State University with a minor in art, and won the Iowa Duck Stamp competition at the age of 22 which launched his fine art career. The Joslyn Art Museum provided Andrew with his earliest art lessons and the complete collection of original watercolors by Karl Bodmer which kindled his passion for travel and painting onsite. He roamed Africa for a year painting game animals and indigenous peoples. He has painted throughout North and South America and in Romania, Morocco, Spain, Italy, France, and Ireland. His plein air paintings faithfully capture light and beauty from life and are a key strength of his richly imbued larger works. "A painting should read like a window onto a place," he says, "luminous and fresh." He believes that light - not line - determines form. During each summer, Andrew roams the intermountain west painting in the Nomad, his travel trailer modified into a studio. It puts him near his subjects for as long as needed to create works both elaborate and true. He builds crates, ships to galleries and museums and continues onward in search of new landscapes. "It is sustainable travel, mostly in wilderness and without constraints." He has traveled 16,000 miles in a few months in this way and believes it to be the best way to create the highest quality paintings of the American landscape. Andrew Peters paintings have hung in the Prix de West Invitational Exhibition at the National Cowboy and Western Heritage Museum in Oklahoma City. It is the premier museum show in the nation. His paintings have also hung in the Autry Museum of Western Heritage, National Museum of Wildlife Art, Joslyn Art Museum, Cincinnati Museum Center, and Great Plains Art Museum among others. Andrew's work was featured in the 2009 March/April issue of Art of the West as well as in the September 2012 issue of Western Art Collector.


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VVS Laxman's unbeaten half-century helped India pull off a thrilling one-wicket win over Australia in the first Test in Mohali.
The Hyderabad batsman scored 73 runs off 79 balls and added 81 off 21.4 overs for the ninth-wicket with Ishant Sharma (31) after it seemed the tourists were closing in on victory.
India reached the 216-run target half an hour before the tea break despite the best efforts of Ben Hilfenhaus, who took four for 57.
India had been pushed onto the back foot after Doug Bollinger's two-wicket burst reduced them to 162 for eight at lunch.
But Laxman and Ishant turned things around in the final hour, though India had to overcome a huge scare as the paceman was harshly adjudged lbw when 11 runs were required.
However, the Hyderabad batsman managed to see India home in the company of number 11 Pragyan Ojha (five not out), who hung around during the testing final moments and was lucky to survive a confident lbw shout.
India's triumph was built on the back of a superb bowling performance by Zaheer Khan, who claimed match figures of eight for 137, and fine contributions from Sachin Tendulkar (98 and 38) and Rahul Dravid and Suresh Raina, who made 77 and 86 respectively in the first innings.
But it was Laxman's performance which proved to be the game-changer as the 35-year-old fought his stiff back and the rampaging Australia bowlers to pull off a sensational victory.
Laxman's heroics follow his match-winning century in the second innings against Sri Lanka in Colombo in August which helped India to level the series 1-1.
India resumed on 55 for four and started positively with Tendulkar and nightwatchman Zaheer Khan bringing the target down to 140 with six wickets intact in the first half-hour.
Hauritz provided the breakthrough by snaring Zaheer (10), bringing Laxman to the middle.
Tendulkar, when on 35, reached the milestone of scoring 1,000 Test runs in 2010, the world record sixth time he has achieved the mark.
Laxman, who had been held back in the batting line-up due to a stiff neck, started aggressively but Bollinger got his third wicket of the innings just when things were looking gloomy for Australia by having Tendulkar caught at gully for 38 off a well-directed short delivery.
The sixth-wicket pair had added 43 runs in just 6.1 overs but the wicket left India reeling on 119 for six.
Laxman and Dhoni steadied the ship for a while before the India captain's stay at the crease was cut short by a horrible mix-up with Laxman's runner Raina which caught him short of his crease.
Harbhajan lasted only two deliveries and India had slipped from 76 for four to 124 for eight, with five batsmen removed by short-pitched deliveries.
With 54 runs needed after lunch, Laxman started confidently and reached his 46th fifty by pulling Hilfenhaus to the mid-wicket boundary.
Ishant took his cue from his senior partner's batting prowess and drove Bollinger to the gully boundary and soon the pair had brought up the 50-run partnership for the ninth wicket in 68 balls.
Australia's frustration grew as Ishant hit two boundaries off Mitchell Johnson's 13th over to reduce the target to just 32.
Watson's introduction helped India's cause as Laxman dispatched his first ball to the cover boundary and the Queenslander strayed in line in his next over to give away four leg byes.
India moved past the 200-run mark two overs later and soon Ishant equalled his best Test score of 31, which came against Sri Lanka in Galle in July 2010.
But, having defied the Australians for 91 balls, he departed for the same score with Hilfenhaus winning an lbw verdict even though replays suggested the ball was missing the leg stump.
Laxman changed his tactics after Ishant's exit and shielded last man Ojha from Mitchell Johnson, who was in the middle of a fiery spell.
Ojha survived a close lbw shout in Johnson's 17th over - with Australia's woes compounded as Steven Smith's shy at the stumps went for four overthrows - and a pair of leg-byes then completed a thrilling victory.
Australia had piled up a massive 428 all out in their first innings while India replied with 405, 23 runs behind.
Watson, who hit 126 in the first innings, scored 56 in the second before Australia were bundled out for 192 after Zaheer and Ishant claimed three wickets each.


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Someone asked Gary what his definition of insanity was ( according to this reality), and this is what he said: "Insanity is not functioning like anybody else." Wow! If you comply with what your family, or society, or church group or ethnic culture, or school says is … [Read more...]
A New Perspective on Recovery
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Home > Care & Services > Orthopedics > Testimonials
"It's a true miracle. I don't have any indication that I had any problems with my hips. I am as active as I can be."
In 2005, Mark was coaching professional football in Green Bay. An avid jogger, he started to experience aches and pains in his left hip. 42 years of collegiate and professional football coaching in addition to being an active athlete is enough to give anyone arthritic hips. Having to find time in his coaching schedule led Mark to put off surgery for four years. By 2009, his football career brought him to Jacksonville. He started researching orthopedic surgeons because of a noticeable limp and limited mobility.
"Dr. Heekin turned out to be the guy for me. The nursing and physical therapy staff at St. Vincent's was superb and I was treated like royalty, I wanted to stay."
Once the left hip had been replaced Mark started experiencing problems with his right hip. Again, he waited four years and had surgery with Dr. Heekin in the off season for maximum healing and recovery.
After each surgery, physical therapy had him on a walker the same day. He went from a walker to crutches to a cane. Four weeks after surgery he was able to attend the Combine, walking everywhere and doing interviews although he didn't feel 100% until two months post-surgery.
"After joint replacement, you don't feel the pain; you get excited and want to keep moving."
Now seven years and three years post both surgeries, Mark says he feels great. "I have no hint in my body, feeling or movement wise that I have anything but what the good Lord gave me."
Mark's new hips allow him to do what he loves most, coaching professional athletes in Tampa and playing sports. At 62 years of age, he enjoys biking, surfing, golfing and playing softball in addition to his busy football coaching career.
"I have a new lease on life thanks to St. Vincent's and Dr. Max Lincoln"
Alan B. has had a life full of adventure. He wasn't going to allow two bum knees to stop him from living life to the fullest, even at 71 years old.
Alan is an Army Veteran having served our nation for 24 years in special ops and later as a pilot. He and his wife of 51 years raised three children and now have three grandchildren and three great grandchildren. He's led a very busy personal and professional life.
That has continued into retirement. In addition to chasing all the grandkids around, Alan enjoys golf, travelling and even working a bit. He officiated a host of youth athletics including football, fast-pitched softball and volleyball until the pain in his knees become overwhelming. It got so bad at one point he could barely walk.
Alan refused to be sidelined and sought out the expertise of the orthopedic surgeons at St. Vincent's. He wound up having both knees replaced and has never looked back.8 weeks after the second knee replacement, Alan was not only back on the golf course he was back on the job officiating games.
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Similar to the most annoying of smaller breed dogs with the high-pitch, yappy bark, "Ankle Bitin' Floozy(s)" are the GIRLS who cause pain to your ears when they open their mouths. Alike the toy-sized dogs you want to drop kick from annoyance, these girls are the dumbest of all breeds out there.. More commonly referred to as "ABF(s)", they will do anything for attention from the opposite sex, and usually lack self-esteem, and are rarely respected by any other girl OR guy.
No wonder nobody wants to DATE her, she's an "Ankle Bitin' Floozy" and has already slept with half the football team!
by REALIST411 November 21, 2010
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Calico Cat Productions Photo & Cinema
Chloe and Ian's engagement shoot at Osgoode Hall. This is such an amazing place for a session. There is always some beautifulView full post »
Christina and Chris, their wedding day was so much fun! From Vaughan to Whitby, to the fabulous Pickering Village! We loved being a part ofView full post »
Stephanie and Nick's wedding day at Mississauga Convention centre! Check out the photos and same day edit!
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Ashley and Michael's two-day wedding celebration! Check out their wedding photos below:
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When their transmissions are in need of service, car owners in Etna Green and Bremen choose Mast Service Center. Our auto mechanics, along with our diesel mechanic, have earned an excellent reputation among drivers in the community. When you arrive at our auto repair shop, at either our Bremen or Etna Green location, you can expect to receive accurate and honest transmissions repair.
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