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Hi Reddit!
I did AMAs in November and July last year, but water crises are back in the news. That's because "Nature makes a drought, but man makes a shortage."
I'm here to answer any and all questions related to the political economy of water, i.e., who gets water and how do we put it to "highest and best use."
Here's my proof with a few important points, i.e., urban vs agricultural use, good management helps the poor, etc.
NB: I've traveled in 90+ countries and follow water issues everywhere, so AMA related to your local situation, and I'll try to give a useful response.
I'm a professor of economics at Leiden University College in Den Haag (Netherlands).
I did my PhD at UC Davis.
Links of interest:
My book, Living with Water Scarcity <=== free to download
My PhD dissertation "Conflict and Cooperation within an Organization: A Case Study of the Metropolitan Water District of Southern California"
"The end of abundance: How water bureaucrats created and destroyed the southern California oasis"
All-in-auctions for water <=== how farmers can reallocate water
Pricing urban water for conservation, fairness and fiscal stability
São California <=== radical ideas for California
Nestle is not the problem <=== the problem is governments that sell water too cheap.
Desalination is usually not the solution but it is politically useful
The free 2015 WaterSmarts Calendar will help you learn about water around you
Political Economy 101: Corruption only works when politicians take bribes b/c THEY have the monopoly power. An honest politician or bureaucrat can hold off an army of corrupt businessmen (but not their boss!)
af (acre-foot). 325,800 gallons of water = 1,234 m3
g/w: groundwater
LADWP = Los Angeles Dept of Water and Power
EDIT (16:37 UTC): Ok, there are now too many comments for me to follow ALL the new threads (and I'll drop off old ones), so please VOTE UP comments you want me to answer. New commenters: PLEASE ctrl+F first, to see if someone asked, e.g., about desalination!
EDIT (17:18 UTC): Going for a swim and dinner. I'll be back. VOTE UP GOOD QUESTIONS!
Water and vegetarianism. I was a veggie for 15 years. I know the stories. It's not really a solution compared to managing water as a scarce good. Then some people would eat no meat or less meat. Meat is not the problem (in terms of water) compared to mismanagement.
EDIT (20:20 UTC): Going to hang out with my GF. I will answer 5-10 TOP-VOTED, UNANSWERED comments tmrw (in 10-12 hrs).
Thanks for all the great questions.
My agent insists I add a link so folks can hire me. Academics and journalists are free, of course.
Don't forget to read my book. It's short, free and explains everything!
ps: Here's a "Water Primer" that explains many dimensions of California's water management
Hello-Does the CA water board recognize you/your work? After watching the Ca Boards meeting yesterday, live, I saw a few presentations that showed frustration at the boards lack of progress. Is the politics and the bureaucracy the real culprit on progress?
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I heard some houses don't even have meters in California. I think Sacramento area? Is that true?
True. Water was "too cheap to meter" in the past.
Meters are, AFAIK, only 70-80 years old. In the past (and now in places), water was a "civic service" paid by property taxes, rather than a utility service with user fees. Different philosophy.
This couldn't apply to me more- I run a water treatment plant in California and now live just outside of Sacramento, where I was raised. I used to work in the water meter department as I came up to my current position.
Water meters were not installed in houses for a very long time, but in the 90's, the state required that all new homes being built have a water meter installed. There's also a state program requiring all services be metered by 2025, many larger cities have partially, if not completely, complied with this. Residential services are the main target here, as commercial water users have been metered much much longer, and really are a non-issue at this point. The metering retrofit really is something that's more of an issue in northern California, where water was plentiful enough to be ignored as a finite resource. Southern California gets their water from the aquaduct and other man made diversions, and consequently have been much more regimented with their use over a longer period of time.
yeah, I've done a lot of work on water meters. Sensus is leading the charge on AMI-capable reporting, which provides much more granular data on water usage, which leads to much better population analysis, dynamic pricing, leak detection, and a host of other things.
Ironically, California is one of the few states (along with washington or oregon, can never keep them straight) that actually doesn't require cities to meter water - they can also charge a fixed fee, which obviously leads to the tragedy of the commons scenario.
If you have any questions about water meters for residential or commercial use and how they affect water policy, I'm probably your man (at least in this thread)
Why doesn't California start charging farmers market rates for their water. Is it just because of political power or is there another reason?
It's not the State's place. Markets would "charge market rates" by revealing the value of water used to farmers...
That doesn't make sense. If it's not the state's place to manage a water market, whose is it?
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Well, I just realized we don't have a meter here. (in the Sacramento area) Maybe this is why my stupid neighbors water their lawns every. Single. Day.
This blows my mind. At what point in the last 30 years has water not been a concern for California?
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I live in East TN, and we are awash in water. We couldn't use ours up if we wanted to. But we still have water meters.
My mom lived in Sacramento for a short period of time, and when I went to visit her I noticed all of her neighbors were watering their lawns so much that the water was overflowing the lawn and running off into the sidewalk/street. I mentioned something about how they must have pretty horrific water bills.
Then she mentioned about how they don't have meters. I was flabbergasted. I couldn't believe it.
I mean I know ag is the real water problem, but not having residential water meters can't be helping much.
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I live in Michigan where water tends to be more of a nuisance for people than anything else, and yet I still have a water meter. Maybe they need to change things over in Cali.
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The city just replaced water mains, prior to their forecasted date of obsolescence, in the land park and curtis park neighborhoods in order to install water meters. The city has stated to pick up the pace on getting homes metered in this area. Edit: on phone
Can confirm, I've lived in the city of Sacramento since 1982, never had a water meter ever.
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I think meters are slowly coming in, my place just had a meter installed.
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what do you think is the likelihood of a war between nations over water resources and if like, how far away from it are we?
It's possible (see Chp 9 in my book), but even more dumb than wars over land.
But don't underestimate political stupidity.
"We can't charge market rates for water! The farmers wouldn't vote for us!"
"Damn. Guess we've gotta kill people."
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I heard animal husbandry is the top user of water in the California and Texas. Fact or fiction? If fiction were in the hierarchy does it fall?
True, given alfalfa.
It's really burgers and ice cream...
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Accounting for the water footprint of feed, California's dairy industry alone consumes more water than all of the hated almonds. The widely discussed figures are: 47% of the state's water is used for beef and dairy products, 10% is used for almonds. People in their homes use around 12% if you include watering lawns and filling swimming pools.
By my rough calculating, dairy consumes around 16 million households worth of water. The state has about 12 million households
I find that hating on almonds is pretty much a bandwagon at this point, and I have to wonder if some of it isn't simply self-righteousness. How many of the people who rage about almond water usage would willingly give up beef since that's actually a much larger use of water than almonds?
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This needs to be higher. Animal agriculture is one of the main culprits and it's not coincidence that more people don't realize this.
Damn, poor cows. Number one water consumption, top in CO2 production. Cheap steak?
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In 1991 the Governor of Alaska proposed to build a water pipeline from Alaska all the way to Southern California but nothing ever came out of it.
Would that actually work out or is it just too crazy of an idea?
Too expensive. It's MUCH cheaper to desalinate the Pacific and THAT'S crazy expensive.
I heard an NPR report that they're building (or maybe opening) a big desalination plant in San Diego that's supposed to produce 4% of the water they use yearly. That's pretty cool, but it's also the biggest desalination plant in America, so that is not as cool.
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You mean in a hypothetical world where it was possible to actually deploy new nuclear infrastructure in the US?
Saudi are currently building a solar desalination plant which is aiming to reach $0.40/M3, that's around the same price as potable water produced from treating waste water.
Isn't there a bit of irony behind Saudi Arabia, owner of one fifth of the oil market, creating a solar powered desalination plant?
Most of the middle eastern countries have been working for a while now on ensuring they have an economic future beyond oil, beyond the supply issues oil based economies have massive output variance due to the volatility in oil prices.
Saudi are also positioning themselves as a renewable energy exporter, if you were looking to build out solar capacity in France then simply building the same generation capacity in Saudi and transmitting it to France would cost about 18% of domestic cost per kwh due to increased solar intensity in Saudi.
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Nuke desal sounds ok butit's damned expensive vs not wasting what you've got.
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I know modern designs are wonderful and I'm totally pro-nuclear, but I can't imagine building them in earthquake-prone California is the best idea. Even if they are 100% safe there (newer designs that can be shutdown quickly) imagine the cost of rebuilding one after a quake.
I would think tidal energy generation and windfarms would be a better idea for California.
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That expands to another question. Is San Onofre even fully operational right now? I know it's old and needs fixing. But I had a big jump in my electric bill in the last few years and one of the reasons was because they needed to "shut down and maintain San Onofre."
SONGS was shut down for good, they decided it was too costly to fix.
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What are the biggest lifestyle changes individuals can make to help combat shortages of fresh water?
What, in your opinion (unless there are facts to back it up with), is the biggest culprit/beneficiary of the outdoors watering?
Don't forget HOAs. They get all pissy and send you a nastygram when there's even the slightest brown spot on your lawn.
I for one, would much rather have a rock garden. Requires literally zero upkeep. We're in California, why are we even trying to grow grass in the first place?
As of January 1, this year, ca law prohibits HOAs et al from fining members for brown lawns
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Wouldn't not eating meat/dairy be right up there? I think I read somewhere that it takes hundreds of gallons of water to end up with a hamburger and 10s of gallons of water to end up with the same plant based protein?
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Thanks for doing this. If you were emperor of California and you could implement any three projects related to water, what would they be and which would be given priority? Why?
(1) Intertie distribution systems and allow water markets to allocate bulk water, BUT
(2) Cut off long-distance water transfers. It's time to live within your means and restore ecosystems that provide HUGE benefits.
(3) Bring urban systems into full performance such that treated wastewater (and stormwater) could be recycled into human use. How to pay?
(1) Allow people to share water (or sell it)
(2) Use your water, not your neighbors
(3) Don't break your toys; if you do, fix them so you can use them.
Wouldn't #2 require the relocation of people who live in desert areas?
Do you want a Fremen revolt? Because this is how you get a Fremen revolt.
well wouldn't you just lay siege, first step by cutting off the water supply?
Not at all. Every sietch has its own water store and the sietches maintain an underground (literally) water economy. They have billions of decaliters, enough to trigger a cascade of worldwide ecological changes. No besieging power will have the political will to prosecute a siege for the decades or centuries it would take to force the Fremen out, especially since their spice smuggling operations provide lucrative revenue to far too many people.
Any prolonged operation in the Valley would sap the will and treasure of an occupying power. The best strategy is the deployment of overwhelming force at key points such as Arrakeen or Sacramento. This will cut the Fremen off from immediate resupply or evacuation. Then, you send Sardaukar flanked by FBI and ATF elements to assault key sietches. Short, sharp engagements, relying on the superior firepower and training of the Empire of California.
edit: more nerd stuff
Come for the water economics, stay for the Dune references.
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you can actually build condensation collectors for fairly low cost. spanned out over a wide enough area in the desert this will actually collect enough water from even desert air during the coldest hours to live off of
Moisture farming. It's what Luke Skywalker did before the Empire murdered his aunt & uncle.
There is zero evidence that the empire is responsible for the unfortunate deaths of Owen and Beru. What would they possibly gain from such an atrocity? It is far more in keeping with the methodologies and motivations of the sand people and doesn't require a crazy conspiracy theory to make it work.
And claims that Imperial troops shot the Jawars based on claims that the shooting was too accurate for Sand People and that only Imperial Storm Troopers are that accurate, are completely false. A lot of evidence before and after this incident shows that the accuracy of Imperial Storm Troopers is extremely poor and that they are incapable of hitting anything. The person who has been spreading this rumour is a well known liar who believes that everything is true from a certain point of view.
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Can you elaborate on "or sell it"?
What would then stop corporations from buying insanely large bodies of water and holding it for sale so people are required to buy it.
The market price of water should disallow such activity, assume the government doesn't prop up a monopoly.
How could a corporation buy an insanely large body of water? Are you asserting that those selling are too dumb to know the value of what they are selling? (very possible if the seller is the government)
Why would you sell a fortune to someone else?
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Not useful to buy it unless can use or sell it.
COMPETITION is the key.
(Also laws)
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I'm visiting California and the topic of water naturally came up at breakfast. I told my friend I'd read municipal golf courses can use as much water as small cities. My friend said that isn't true because golf courses recycle 99% of their water. Uh, evaporation....He waved it off and repeated his idea. Are golf courses automatically given special privileges?
They use recycled water, which evaporates. They do get a lot of slack, due to $ raised. Golf vs farmers
I'm not sure the comparison in you link is a fair one:
California's 900 golf courses claim to employ 160,000 workers (that's 180 people/course) and generate $7 billion in economic activity (that's $7.8 million/course).* To generate this activity, they use one percent of the State's water.
Compare these figures to agriculture, which uses 75 percent of the State's water and employs 380,000 workers to produce $32 billion in output food.**
You are comparing two totally different numbers here. For golf it's all related economic activity. Including stuff like golf related real estate and tourism. But for agriculture you are just reporting gross sales. That would be like just reporting sales of golf equipment and greens fees.
This source says all related economic activity for agriculture in CA is closer to $100B.
It doesn't change the conclusion much, but I think you should make your comparison on a the same basis.
I had trouble believing that golf revenue (or GDP) was 20% of agriculture revenue (or GDP).
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So the golf industry uses 1% of the water and creates $7B in GDP, and agriculture uses 75% of the water for $32B in GDP. From an economic standpoint we could say farms should use less water, but is this really practical? Farms feed (almost) everyone and are a necessity where as golf is a luxury. Is there anything farms could do that would use less water but not affect the crop yields?
Not OP, and not specialist on the topic, but I remember reading about tests in my country (france) where they would use aerial (satellite / infrared) views from a field to detect the hot spots that need watering.
They would then water the areas that actually truely need it, instead of drowning the whole place with the same amount of water everywhere.
It seems it saved a lot of water (cause obviously they tend to wate too much all the time), but also increased production due to some areas not being uselessly flooded with too much water 90% of the time.
yes this happens on many farms now WHEN water is expensive
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It is obvious we need to replace all farms with golf courses. Instant budget surplus!
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It's like when I get Trading Posts in Civ V and replace all my farms with them!
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Farms feed (almost) everyone and are a necessity where as golf is a luxury
Many California farms grow almonds and walnuts, most of which are exported, and no doubt viewed as luxuries by the buyers
California rice is forced into the Japanese market by treaty. The Japanese don't eat it, they give it to North Korea, feed it to animals, or let it rot in warehouses
So yeah..a lot of California ag is for luxury foods..many of which I enjoy
This is true, however, some Northern California rice farmers are selling their water rights to Southern California instead of farming it this year. The profit for the rights are exceeding the potential profit of rice crops this year.
(I work with a large agricultural insurance carrier, and water has been a large topic of conversation)
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Brawndo has electrolytes, plants CRAVE electrolytes. Problem solved.
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But almonds, alfalfa, pistachios are not a necessity either. Farmers tripled their acreage in the past few years in place of less water thirsty crops because of rising international and domestic demand and profitability
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No it's not practical but the water just isn't sustainable at this point. And the "necessity" may be true for some farms but a massive chunk of it is for exports to Asia and for snacks that are water intensive and certainly not necessary. It makes the economics of the golf course and their usage look like a bargain in comparison -- since when the feeding everyone argument starts to fall apart, everyone cites what a huge business it is (even if it's 2% of california GDP or whatever).
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Why does everybody in CA politics go on about people having to preserve water personally when only about 6% of the water in California is used for personal consumption?
Most of it seems to be used for growing fringe non-essential agricultural products like alfalfa and almonds.
"It's something you can do while we get more campaign donations from farmers"
Wait. I was about to ask where to get these almonds.
edit: apparently people think i want to learn how to plants almonds
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The truth in 13 words. Well said. Don't any other Californians wonder why the rice farmers constantly have those commercials explaining that they aren't a water intensive crop and that they provide habitats for birds!?
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Rice is not actually a problem when it's grown off of flood flows...
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The rice farmers in the Sacramento River delta are not the problem. The delta is a fantastic and responsible location for their activities.
Rice paddies are usually flooded once or a few times per season for weed control. The water drains naturally, and the field is allowed to dry for some time before repeating. The soils used in the paddies trap the moisture and drain slowly. Finally, by being in the delta, which already has very wet ground, the rice paddies take advantage of the fact that the ground is already saturated – which allows the flooding to linger longer.
Rice is an important crop and mostly stays here in the U.S.
edit: removed statements about almond production which could be inaccurate and detract from my main point.
Do you know what percentage of rice is exported from California?
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Almonds are California's third largest agricultural product. California is the world's largest producer of almonds.
and they use like, 8 times less water than meat and dairy per pound
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Almonds I can almost see, as they're at least a value-add and one of the main agricultural exports. However, growing alfalfa is just growing and moving bulk livestock feed. Not efficient even if you're measuring efficiency by market standards.
I am not particularly knowledge about CA practices. But do they always grow alfalfa every year in the same fields there? Or it part of the crop rotation? Because alfalfa is a nitrogen fixer and it may be in rotation for soil health rather than because it is the primary cash crop the farmer is focusing on. Obviously you can't really compare an annual to an orchard. At least the alfalfa farmers "could" be put under a more granular regulation based on drought conditions.
It has become a cash crop, because of China.
China is raising a lot of beef. China also ships a lot of merchandise to America, and the bulk of that lands in California. The ships are unloaded and go back to China empty - a trade deficit. Because of this, it is so cheap as to be nearly free to ship something to China. Like, literally cheaper to ship to China than to truck it across the state to the port.
Now, none of that is China's fault. But we're literally taking our water, storing it in grass, and shipping it across the ocean, and then looking around, going "Where'd the water go?".
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What is the state of current research surrounding desalination? You mentioned in this thread already that it's crazy expensive, but is anyone working to make it more economically viable?
Yes. It's cost competitive on small islands (vs shipping water) and good for national security (Israel and Singapore).
Read the desal links above.
Why isn't solar desalination (distillation) more popular? I read an article about someone doing it in the central valley with ag runoff. I think it said he can produce 30,000gal a day (which i know isn't much, but it's a start)
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You guys are already installed for desal.
Restore your environment and aquifers; flush salts from land. Drought will return and it's better to be "in shape"
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If California were a blank slate in terms of water law, what legal framework would you suggest to allow for the most economically efficient use/distribution of finite water resources?
I'd follow the Aussie example with LIMITED licenses for surface and groundwater, so that demand was "capped" and trade could occur (not strictly necessary for, e.g, local g/w). Cali has a mix of prior appropriation, riparian and g/w rights that conflict.
So I'm a resident. This sounds like a good idea, and we have this mostly stupid system of ballot propositions. Could the voters fix this damn thing in 2016? Who would be against it, besides farmers with senior rights?
Void all rights, reform rights for issue. Auction them. Pay off prior owners of rights. My idea
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Super excited to see this thread, as I'm working on a Masters thesis on water issues (from more of a sociological perspective). I'm trying to research socioeconomic disparities and having access to water/high water quality (through municipalities/water treatment facilities) in the midwest. My project focuses on a specific geological area, mostly considering surface water as it goes through the water treatment cycle (I've read EPA reports, etc.).
Even though my summary (above) was kind of general, do you have any suggestions (methodological or otherwise) on how to proceed in examining how water is distributed to areas of socioeconomic hardship and/or how it's different from more affluent areas?
Great topic.
Look at breaks/leaks in different neighborhoods.
Water quality reports at the TAP
Blood contamination tests
Email me progress!
You just got yourself an industry mentor. This is extremely valuable, do not neglect this relationship.
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Hi Dave. There have been a zillion articles and tweets lately claiming that farmers "need to pay the true cost of water." Exempting the federal subsidies for Reclamation projects, which are substantial, I don't see how they aren't. If I dug a ditch in 1867 for $10,000, and it fills up in the spring, haven't I paid the marginal cost of acquiring X volume of water? How can I be expected to pay more for it, and who would I pay it to?
*Edited for clarity
Good question. (1) There are subsidies on many projects in many countries. Read Cadillac Desert for the US. (2) There are "opportunity cost" subsidies in terms of water that they get but others would pay more for OR water we'd like to have in the future. (1) is easy to measure, (2) much harder without markets.
I see what you mean, but if we each own a furniture business, and I can acquire timber more easily than you can, but you hand-make expensive furniture and I make cheap crap, surely we wouldn't say my business receives an opportunity cost subsidy, right? We would simply say I enjoy lower marginal costs.
Being able to dig a big well and suck out all the aquifer water that won't be renewed for 1000 years is a bit different than being able to buy cheaper lumber. Now, if your source was clear-cutting old-growth forests, while the government looked away, yes we would say you enjoy an opportunity cost subsidy.
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Yes, but we're both facing "market" supply sources...
Let's be clear here, this is not a matter of merely digging a ditch, these farmers are pumping millions of gallons of water out of the aquifers that are a water source for entire regions. Irresponsible pumping has led to entire water sources being depleted and towns being left without any water at all.
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When it rains in SoCal, I see all the dry river beds, Santa Ana River etc. flowing and think we should be pumping that into holding areas etc. Is there any chance of that happening instead of letting it flow out to sea?
Yes! There's a BIG project in LA to remove concrete and allow water to infiltrate.
FYI to those wondering. This would allow the water to seep back in to the water table for future use. Essentially the same idea as pumping it into holding tanks but without having to build expensive holding tanks and pumps, letting nature do what it used to.
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They do a fair job of diverting, trapping, and pumping water from the SA river, allowing the water to seep back into the aquifer that supplies OC with most of it's water.
You may have noticed the berms of sand that look like a maze along the bottom of the river near places like Angels stadium. Those are designed to slow runoff, allowing it to percolate back into the aquifer.
More here: http://www.ocwd.com/ProgramsProjects/GroundwaterRecharge.aspx
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Hello, thank you for stopping by : ) I took a class on water in the west and we read "Cadillac Desert" by Marc Reisner, which I found fascinating.
Is there a book that you think a lay audience could read and enjoy which provides good information or insight into the current water shortage or the history of water use without being super boring?
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What does it cost to move water in a pipeline - like the keystone xl deal? vs the cost of desalinating water? Or what other wacky options are out there?
I heard a proposal once for transcontinental waterways linking major rivers. It would allow flooded rivers a way to divert extra water, and for drought stricken areas to siphon water when needed.
I imagine there's great ecological challenges but that usually doesn't stop mankind.
India is debating a version of this; China's building the S-N water system. Both are (1) enviro disasters and (2) no cure for poor management.
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Desalinated water costs about $1,000/acre foot (US measure; roughly $1/m3) which means a barrel (42 gal) costs about $0.13. Oil is worth about $40/bbl, so it's WORTH shipping by pipeline.
But that desal process brings "new" water. I've always wondered about this. I'm a farmer in N. Ca. We have almost constant water transfers to metropolitan WD, or paramount farms. The water is sent from us, and can't be promised to make it past the delta. Desal is an extra couple hundred a foot. But gets there. We keep ours and they have water too.
Someone's going to have to pay the premium to get you that water. The initial construction costs are not insignificant, either, especially if it's financed with bonds.
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What does it cost to move water in a pipeline - like the keystone xl deal? vs the cost of desalinating water? Or what other wacky options are out there?
One potential problem is the question of "where are we sourcing this water from?"
Some water sources like the Great Lakes are not readily self-sustaining. That's why federal law and international treaty restricts water usage to only those states who border the Great Lakes and only certain communities within those states (they typically need to be X number of miles within the watershed to be able to draw water). So you can't take it from there.
Now you could try drawing from the rivers east of California, but those too come from finite sources and the water being used downstream is vitally important to a lot of people, and those people may not appreciate having their water diverted.
Then there's aquafers, but those face the exact same problem of supply.
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On a scale from 1 to 10, 1 being not a serious problem, 10 being the next dust bowl and you should consider moving now, how bad is the situation in CA?
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I live in the fresno area. As we flew into Fresno from Vegas, I snapped this pic of one of the nearby lakes.
Is that pine flat?
In all honesty, I live in Clovis, and we just had one of the largest rains we've had in 3 years. The green coloring and water level is not really indicative of the conditions we've been seeing for the last few years.
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What can we do here in Utah? We have are the second driest state in the nation and our water usage here is absurd. From what I understand or aquifers are being drained to supply Nevada and southern California.
That may be true. The first step is to limit use/exports to "return flows" so aquifers stabilize. "Abundance" is gone, so management needs to change. (see my book)
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How come all we hear about is how the people must make consumption sacrifices but businesses like Nestle are allowed to continue with their extraction and bottling operations? Is there anything being done to make those operations more transparent and manageable? Also does CA have a natural gas fracking industry that also consumes an unknown quantity of water?
Both businesses should be monitored for use. Nestle (see link @ top) is probably charged for water. Many utilities use business revenues to subsidize houses, so they don't like their use ($) to fall. Also remember that bottled water is <0.5%
Fracking is far more worrying, due to g/w depletion and possible contamination.
From what I understand, Nestle is using expired permits and their consumption is not tracked by the government (as requests for this information have gone unanswered). Is there anything we can do as citizens to fix this? Who should we write to?
well that's a much worse problem.
Go get the gov to do its bloody job.
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Singapore uses reverse osmosis to recycle our waste water into drinkable water. In other words, we drink and shower from our poop and urine water. When will other countries start doing the same and being self sufficient?
When they get serious. I admire Singapore's system, but it is (1) a city state and (2) humid enough.
The problems are biggest where governance is complex and "old" systems were based on abundant water. Watch Saudi Arabia for the trainwreck/change of direction.
I'm working on studying the Saudi Water-Energy nexus and can only imagine what horrors the future might bring.
How would you recommend the Saudi government change its policies to avoid disaster?
Change "internal prices" to "world prices" for energy. Bam! Efficiency
Over the next 30-50 years do you think California will remain the agricultural producing region that it is today? In general, do you think policy makers will be able to incorporate a longer-term perspective when addressing the current acute water shortage (especially given shortages anticipated by many of the downscaled climate scenarios for the Colorado River Basin)? Thanks!
I'd prefer the gradual evolution that markets would drive, since pols are not great at planning economies
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I've hear a lot of people recently talking about almonds and the amount of water that they use, but I feel like not a lot of coverage about the high demand that animal agriculture puts on the water supply. I've been told that it takes something like 400 gallons of water to produce a pound of almonds (which certainly sounds ridiculous) but 2000 gallons to produce a pound of beef. Yet the New York Times the other day did a piece and didn't even mention beef.
Am I missing something? Is everyone else missing something? What are your thoughts on this?
By Ctrl+F Vegetarian he was pointing to this blog post that answers your question...
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Almonds are in California so symbolic.
ctrl+F vegetarian
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How likely are we going to see water rights reforms, especially for agribusiness?
It's rising in probability. The key is to retire "paper" licenses so "wet" ones are worth something.
Aussie farmers made $billions trading theirs. US farmers should too.
Not worried, unless your in SP :-\
(Seriously, I hope the gov't reforms, then there's a chance of long run better systems; look to Chile)
I'm a bit late for this AMA, but could you expand (if you've got the information) on the comparison of the crisis in California and in São Paulo? Which reforms could/should be done by the brazilian government? Are the culprits the same? SP rivers are very polluted, how feasible would be to clean them? EDIT: for people who dig up this thread, I have found some articles on David's website regarding São Paulo:
Thanks for the links.
There are governance problems in both places, and infrastructure really constrains action. AFAIK, SP has less water in storage whereas CA cities can ge tit from aggies, so it's less desperate.
Reforms? Crack down on corruption. Set performance targets. Spend $ on water instead of worthless stadiums.
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They can collapse (useless for storage in future).
No water next year.
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Is the First in Time, First in right system fundamentally flawed? Does it lead to suboptimal allocation of water and therefore poor conservation/efficiency?
As you used to live in BC, what would be an ideal allocation system for the province?
yes, it's flawed if it's not used as a cap and trade system, i.e., people taking too much
The province should sell water based on local, "pooled" auctions, and use the money for citizens
I keep hearing this "one year of water left" claim.
As a homeowner in California, what does that really mean to me? Does that mean that in ~ a year, my tap won't work anymore? That we just pay more for water? How worried does the regular, head in the sand, Californian need to be?
Farmers will lose water before you do.
Lots of potential stupid before that tho.
Chicagoan here, and user of the wonderful resource that is Lake Michigan.
How would something like the Great Lakes Compact for western state's water supplies help prevent abuse of those supplies? And how successful has it been for the Great Lakes states and provinces? Has it helped keep water levels at a safe level, no pun intended?
The lakes are easier to monitor and connected, so wouldn't work in West
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Are there lessons to be learned from the Dutch policies on water management? Can such comparisons actually be made?
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How much of the problem do you think is due to the vanity of having a green lawn?
Not as much of a problem as $1.15 for 1,000 gallons in Las Vegas!
$1.15 for 1,000 gallons in Las Vegas
Is the problem that that's crazy cheap?
I mean, that's not absurdly cheaper than what I'm paying in Carmichael, CA ($1.13 per 100CF, or 748gal). Fair Oaks, CA, is even cheaper.
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Wow right. My 2000 gallons a month cost me over $10 and I live in Colorado where all that rain actually falls
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How soon until the american south west goes after the water in the great lakes?
Good luck on that. All the surrounding states and provinces have a deal preventing that very thing.
It SEEMS like there is a lot of water in the Great Lakes, but actually most of that water was deposited by the glaciers retreating thousands of years ago and the water now being taken out of the Great Lakes watershed is barely replenished by rain and rivers.
Hell, right now, cities just outside the watershed of the Great Lakes can't get water from the Great Lakes - we sure aren't shipping it to the Southwest. They even closed a bottled water plant in Wisconsin because too much water was leaving the Lakes.
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It's really good to see that the Great Lakes communities have headed off water grubbers at the pass.
Not only outside water grubbers, but local water grubbers, too. There's a lawsuit every other day, it seems like, to stop some city in the watershed from taking out more water than they should. I think a lawsuit against Chicago went all the way to the Supreme Court - Chicago won that one, IIRC, but they still fixed the locks at the head of the Chicago River so there wasn't so much "leakage" down the river.
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and just to drive /u/bettorworse's point home, the city outside the watershed that's been trying very hard to get access is only about 15 miles from the lake itself. They have to get every single state and province's permission to do so. Even though they have a plan to return the water, to date they're still not allowed to draw water from Lake Michigan.
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Hi David,
I am from Turkey and I was wondering about the true impact of multinational companies such as Nestle etc, owning wells and springs and other water resources. I read that it is a big deal in America. What about the rest of the world, especially Turkey?
Thanks for the AMA.
It can be a big deal. I know of a local water bottler in Lebanon that's using the town's water.
Bottled water is ok, as long as use is limited to yield.
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Just last night my friend was convinced that it is too late and that there is "absolutely nothing" we can do to help stop or ease the drought. I understand that we can't make rain, but what can we do as individuals and communities that isn't already being done? Is cutting down the time we take in the shower, or zeroscaping as futile as my friend thinks?
Call you representative and tell them to get serious about conserving supplies rather than letting farmers irrigate.
Would implementation of grey-water solutions on a broad spectrum or in high traffic areas (i.e airport terminals, stadiums, etc.) help the shortage in any significant way?
Yes, if that water was going to be treated and dumped (e.g, SD), but not if the water was going to be recycled (OC or Singapore). I prefer landscaping that can "survive on its own"
But could a system using, say, waste water from sinks to flush toilets make any tangible difference? Toilets use a surprising amount of GpF
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Sort by: Date added | Date Published | Most Viewed
Headlines Tagged with Labels/Lights — 11,280 headlines found
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[Australia, Trinidad And Tobago] No new anti-smoking laws coming--Fuad
The Tobacco Control Act already exists and T&T should not expect new legislation similar to Australia's draconian anti-smoking legislation to be passed in T&T anytime soon, says Health Minister Dr Fuad Khan. He was responding to questions from the Guardi
Aug 16, 2012 Trinidad Guardian (tt)
added Aug 16, 2012 01:40
68 Views
[Canada] Cities call for Quebec to toughen anti-tobacco bill
A coalition of 174 cities and towns has called on the Couillard government to go even further in cracking down on tobacco than it proposes in Bill 44. The bill was introduced last spring, with public hearings set to begin this week. It imposes the same
Aug 16, 2015 Montreal Gazette (ca)
added Aug 18, 2015 11:14
68 Views
[Australia, Canada, UK, USA] Graphic Cigarette-Label Warnings Work, Study Finds
Cigarette warning labels help convince smokers to quit, and the bigger the label, the better, a new study shows. Even when smokers try to avoid seeing the labels, they are prompted to think about quitting, the researchers found.
Jul 15, 2014 HealthDay [HealthScout]
added Jul 15, 2014 14:22
67 Views
New FDA Warnings Troubling Tobacco Makers?
These rules will pose a significant problem for tobacco makers, like Philip Morris International Inc., Reynolds, Lorillard Inc. and Altria Group Inc., that are already reeling from the effect of anti-smoking campaigns worldwide.
Aug 31, 2015 Zacks Investment Research, Inc.
added Aug 31, 2015 20:18
67 Views
[China, North Carolina] The Chinese Government Is Getting Rich Selling Cigarettes
China National runs more than 160 cigarette brands, manufactured in about 100 factories across the country, and uses its earnings to invest in banks, luxury hotels, a hydroelectric plant, a golf course, and even drugmakers. Most of its money goes to its o
Dec 11, 2014 Bloomberg News
added Feb 11, 2015 23:34
67 Views
[UK] SHANAGHER: Thoughts about selling tobacco
Local retailers who sell tobacco need to make sure their voice is heard. Writing to the FT may be one route. Writing in response to the government consultation is a better one. Click here and argue for the status quo as soon as you can.
Jun 27, 2012 betterRetailing (uk)
added Jun 27, 2012 14:08
67 Views
[Canada] Cigarette companies don't want you to see this
Fifteen years ago former Edmontonian Barb Tarbox was one of those women people would turn their heads to look at. The last photograph taken of the beauty and former model will turn heads away from cigarette packages and the government hopes away from smo
Jun 20, 2012 iNews880 CHQT-AM (ca)
added Jun 20, 2012 07:34
64 Views
[Australia, USA] WOODHEAD: Big Pharma's credibility goes up in smoke
Companies such as GSK (Zyban, Nicabate), Pfizer (Champix) and Johnson and Johnson (Nicorette) are active members of a conservative US lobby group called the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC). . . . If these Big Pharma companies are so committe
Jul 17, 2012 6minutes.com.au (au)
added Jul 17, 2012 05:07
63 Views
F.D.A. Warns 3 Tobacco Makers About Language Used on Labels
"The F.D.A.'s job is to ensure tobacco products are not marketed in a way that leads consumers to believe cigarettes with descriptors like 'additive-free' and 'natural' pose fewer health risks than other cigarettes, unless the claims have been scientific
Aug 27, 2015 New York Times
added Aug 27, 2015 21:58
63 Views
The Rapid Rise Of Graphic Warnings On Cigarette Packages [Infographic]
Back in 2001, Canada became the very first country in the world to add pictorial warnings to its cigarette packets. Over the past decade, countless other governments followed suit in an attempt to discourage their citizens from smoking. By 2014, the num
Dec 1, 2014 Forbes
added Dec 2, 2014 07:54


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How to reach OpenMRS as GSoC Student?
OpenMRS is an electronic Medical Record System with a lot of facilities and OpenMRS is also a community of developers, implementers, and users working toward a shared and open foundation for managing health information in developing countries. So as a developer, I would like to be part of OpenMRS to make it more efficient using my Computer Science and Engineering related knowledge. OpenMRS is an open source platform, so there are a lot of ways to contribute. Most identified methods to contribute OpenMRS are,
- Create and discuss the idea through IRC or Talk Community.
- Become a Google Code-In student to contribute for OpenMRS.
- Become a GSoC(Google Summer of Code) student to contribute for OpenMRS.
- Fixing open issues and create pull request to solve the problems.
- Forking the related Git repository and make changes to push.
According to this ways, I would like GSoC to contribute for OpenMRS during my university period. So I applied to the OpenMRS through GSoC 2017 and selected as GSoC 2017 Student. Read these following message to know, What I did to get the chance for GSoC.
What is Google Summer of Code
Google Summer of Code is a global program sponsored by Google Inc focused on introducing students to open source software development. Students work on a 3-month development project with an open source organization under some mentors. Students will be paid for their development works and they will get special gift packs from Google also. There will be a lot of open source organizations and student wants to work under one organization through GSoC program. GSoC program will be managed under the well-defined timeline. According to the timeline, Students should work with their respected organization to get success. There are 12,000+ students participated from 104 countries and continued for 12 years with 568 open source projects.
I knew a little bit about Google Summer of code but I haven't any more idea to try it seriously. So I tried for GSoC previous year also. But I didn't put much effort at that time. After once, I got a chance to participate in a session about Google Summer of Code which was organized by Akshika Wijesundara and team. They well introduced about the GSoC. After that session, I got more interest about GSoC and would like to participate at this time also. Then after I contacted some of the past mentors of GSoC Program from various organizations and gathered a lot of details about GSoC and that process.
How did I familiar with GSoC?
- Contacted past mentors from various organizations and gathered a lot of details about GSoC and that process (OpenMRS, WSO2, Moodle and Apache Software Foundation)
- Subscribed mailing list and GSoC official group to know about the current discussions.
- Researched a lit bit about past projects and technologies which belong to some organizations
- Got experience with some new technologies which are mentioned in those projects.
- Read some blogs of past GSoC Students and referred some important workflows.
So according to the GSoC timeline, I waited for the Organizations announced period. Before this period, Organizations will provide their project ideas to Google summer of code program to participate. Then GSoC program management will announce to the students about the selected organizations with respected project ideas. After the Organizations Announced, I viewed GSoC Organizations page to get more about the projects. I reviewed more than 50 projects in different organizations which are related to my knowledge and field. Then after I sort out to those projects for a small amount. After I studied some little more about those projects.
Once studied, I was admired for two projects which are supposed by two different organizations. I don't know which is better or which project I can get through GSoC for this year. So I started to discuss with respected mentors for that two projects during the preparation period. Mentors are very friendly and they warmly welcomed us to their organizations. I continued some discussions for three weeks during this period through email and OpenMRS talk.
What did I during the Preparation Period?
- Started to contact the mentors using email(if they preferred to contact them via email)
- Subscribed with GSoC mailing lists and respected organizations mailing lists. — Then you can get emails to your mail address about the recent discussion about those organizations and related projects.
- Introduce myself to OpenMRS community using Introduction part.
- Created Project topic in OpenMRS community talk to discuss the project ideas. (under #community:GSoC)
- Discuss with other students and mentors to get involved in the project.
- Started to use OpenMRS platform to identify the application and features. — Here you must read about installing OpenMRS and configuring OpenMRS to continue
- Created some demo mockups works to show the mentors through Community pages
- Watched videos and read more wiki documents about OpenMRS project developments.
- Worked to achieve dev/1 stage — You want to fix some issues, want to create some pull requests, and take a quiz to achieve dev/1 stage.
How did I get achieve OpenMRS dev/1 stage?
- Installed OpenMRS Reference application and played with application architectures
- Forked OpenMRS Core repository and studied some more about those code lines.
- Request to join with OpenMRS JIRA Community to work with developers.
- Started to resolve some issues which are ready to work for the contributors.
- Created pull requests to merge the changes with main repository
- Achived dev/null stage at the initial work on OpenMRS
- Done OpenMRS Developer quiz and passed to achieve dev/1 stage
Then after, Timeline moves to Proposal creation period. In this time, I spent more time to create a better proposal for the project. Proposal for the project is very important to get selected as GSoC student through this program. So students should concentrate more on Proposal preparations.
What did I during the Proposal Preparation Period?
- Most time, I worked to create a better proposal for the submission.
- I followed some instructions which are mentioned in the GSoC — OpenMRS project details page for the Proposals.
- Try to create some UI working Mock-ups include in the proposal.
- Prepared some diagrams which are needed to describe some parts in the proposal
- Submitted draft proposal for the mentor review three days before to the submission deadline. If you submit for the review as early as possible, then you can get a review from more than one mentors. — You can submit a draft proposal through GSoC Project proposal portal. Then mentors from that organization can able to review your proposals.
- Received feedbacks and comments from Mentor and fixed all corrections. Prepared final proposal for the submission
- Logged into the GSoC Proposal and uploaded my proof of enrollment. You can upload your university ID, enrollment sheet, and university confirmation letter.
- Submitted proposal for the GSoC through submission portal before the deadline.
Then after students want to wait for the results to continue their process. Organizations took nearly one month to analyze the submitted proposals and select the best student for their project ideas. During this period, I never gave up my process of work. I continued my work with a mentor, and keep the discussions. It may express your interest to the organization and make a plus point for your selection. During this period, I just familiarized with some code parts of the OpenMRS back-end and OWA developments.
Finally, I received congratulation mail about the GSoC Student selection for the OpenMRS project. Now the project begins :-)


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$218,794 (USD)/yr
$105 (USD)/hr
$38,880 (USD)/yr
The average chief human resources officer salary in Hawaii, United States is $218,794 or an equivalent hourly rate of $105. This is 1% lower (-$2,327) than the average chief human resources officer salary in the United States. In addition, they earn an average bonus of $38,880. Salary estimates based on salary survey data collected directly from employers and anonymous employees in Hawaii, United States.
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Human Resources Coordinator
access_time Posted 18 days ago
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Exercise Plans and Operations Officer with Security Clearance
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Purchasing Assistant Human Resource Accountant Secretary I Help Desk Technician in our Information ... Lee Elkinson, Chief Executive Officer Best of Staffing® Client Satisfaction Diamond Award (2013 ...
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Graduation from an accredited four (4) year college or university with a bachelorâs degree in public administration, business administration, human resources or other related field of study. Â ...
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access_time Posted 6 days ago
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... human applicants. * Verify Subscriber identity. * Pre-register users with PKI. * Validate NPE ... Army CIO/G6 official designated in the DoD PKI RA-LRA Certificate Practice Statement. * Have ...
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Facts about Reserve village in New Mexico
|Reserve village
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|33.709007, -108.761433
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Last Updated Date: 20-11-2016
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Facts about Reserve village in New Mexico
|Reserve village
|New Mexico
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|33.709007, -108.761433
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text:
Porsche India opens new showroom in Gurgaon
Porsche India has opened a new showroom in Gurgaon. Located at Golf Course road, Porsche Centre Gurgaon is spread across 10,900 square feet area and can display up to 15 cars at a time. In a separate fitting lounge, customers can check the innumerable individualisation programme options for their Porsche cars. An in-shop will sell Porsche merchandise and there is also a dedicated car delivery area. Work on this Porsche showroom started way back in June 2012. Porsche now has a total of eight authorized dealer and service network in India.
Speaking on the occasion, Anil Reddi, director of Porsche India, said: "It is with pride that we welcome enthusiasts and customers to a new Porsche destination in India. This world-class showroom is a tangible example of the commitment that Porsche has for the Indian market. Our customers in this part of our country can now look forward to a highly customer-centric approach focusing on a unique Porsche ownership experience."
2018 Honda CR-V first drive reviewBob Rupani | 13 Aug 2018
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