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Chi-Square Diff Testing Using the Sat...
Mplus Discussion
Confirmatory Factor Analysis
Leonard Burns
posted on Friday, May 17, 2002 - 9:12 am
I have a copy of the instructions from your web site for chi-square difference testing using the Satorra-Bentler Scaled Chi-Square. I would like to perform such tests with nested models in the context of CFA. I am currently using EQS version 6.0. With this version, the robust estimation option provides the SB Scaled Chi-Square along with the robust CFI and the robust RMSEA measures of fit. This is my question. Is the MLM procedure in M-Plus 2 (maximum likelihood parameter estimates with robust standard errors and a mean-adjusted chi-square test statistic) the same estimation procedure as the robust procedure in EQS 6.0?
If this is so, then I can follow the instructions in the paper on your WEB site to calculate the
correct values for the SB Scaled Chi Square for comparing nested models.
Thanks for your feedback.
Len Burns
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, May 17, 2002 - 10:02 am
MLM is the Satorra-Bentler chi-square test statistic, so it stands to reason that the directions would work for the EQS Satorra-Bentler chi-square as well as MLM.
Wim Beyers
posted on Monday, September 30, 2002 - 7:15 am
Hi there,
I'm just asking a question here, because I did not receive any helpfull feedback on SEMNET. And here I find a specific forum on the topic, so...
I calculated the Satorra-Bentler Scaled Chi-Square Difference Test by hand several times, but I sometimes come out with results that seem strange to me...
For instance (n = 600):
Comparison Model (79 df):
- nonscaled chisquare = 249.18
- scaled chisquare = 220.42
Nested Model (82 df):
- nonscaled chisquare = 337.18
- scaled chisquare = 308.24
So, a traditional chisquare diff test results favours the Comparison Model, with chi-square-diff = 88.00 (df = 3). OK
A SBS scaled diff test also favours the comparison Model, but following the calculations on
, the test-value is 675.14. It's so huge I really hesitate to report it. Am I doing something wrong?
Thanks for all help,
Wim Beyers
posted on Monday, September 30, 2002 - 9:42 am
It looks like you have done the calculations correctly according to our web site. The test value of 675 is certainly much larger than 88, but the p values are both very small and therefore similar so this could all be ok.
Two other thoughts:
You might have run into a local optimum in one of your 4 runs.
You can run this in Mplus to get the scaling correction factors directly to see if they agree.
Kaja LeWinn
posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 3:05 pm
We are trying to use the Satorra-Benter scaled chi-squared test using the instructions on this site. We have found that when we run our comparison model in MLM and ML we get different degrees of freedom (the same model, using two different estimation techniques gives us two different dfs). This does not happen in the nested model. We are confused by this. One characteristic of our model that might be of significance is that we are looking for measurement invariance using the grouping command.
We were hoping this could be explained to us, as well as how we should approach the equation under point 3 of the online instructions (i.e. which degrees of freedom to we choose, those from the ML or MLM model). Thanks for your help,
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, June 24, 2005 - 1:48 am
You need to send your outputs, data, and license number to
. What you are describing has not been seen by us. There may be something else going on.
Leif Edvard Aaroe
posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 2:59 pm
Dear colleagues,
I need to test out differences between nested models, and wonder if I can use the Satorra-Bentler scaled chi square in this particular case:
I have a model with a set of predictors that are all regarded as metric (although a couple of them are dichotomies). Some of them could be analysed as latent variables, but I have chosen to start out using simple sumscores. It is therefore simply a path analysis that I am doing. I have two outcome variables, the most dependent one is a dichotomy. The other one, which is also regarded as a mediator, is an ordered categorical variable. Since the sample is based on clusters, I am using the cluster option in order to adjust for the design effect.
I understand that the S-B formula is based on ML and MLM estimators. The programme, however, does not permit ML and MLM estimators with this analysis. It only provides WLSMV estimation.
Can my commands be changed in such a way that it allows for ML and MLM estimation? Or is there an alternative procedure that can be used for testing the difference between models?
Most grateful for any suggestions.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 3:43 pm
MLM is the Satorra-Bentler chi-square. It is available only when all outcomes are continuous.
Leif Edvard Aaroe
posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 9:15 pm
Thanks for quick response.
How do I test differences between nested path analysis models when I have categorical outcome variables and clustered data? Is this described in the Mplus manual or anywhere else?
If such testing is not possible: What procedure would you recommend for identifying a "good" model?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 6:53 am
In Chapter 15 under the ESTIMATOR option, there is a table that shows the estimators available for TYPE=COMPLEX and TYPE=TWOLEVEL. I'm not sure which you want to use for your clustered data. With the WLS estimator, difference testing is done in the usual way. With WLSM and MLR, you need to use a scaling correction factor which is given in the output and how to use it is shown on the website. With WLSMV, use the DIFFTEST option. See a description in the Mplus User's Guide. When you do not obtain chi-square, you can use -2 times the loglikelihood difference.
Sophie van der SLuis
posted on Thursday, February 02, 2006 - 5:52 am
I'm performing a CFA with type=complex as independency assumption is violated in my data set [gathered within families].
I used the Satorra-Bentler scales chi-square corrections for MLR as described on the Mplus website.
My restricted model has an unscaled chi-square of 19.696 with df=13, and scaling correction factor of 1.123.
My less restricted model has an unscaled chi-sqaure of 10.704 with df=12, and scaling correction factor of 1.213.
Calculating the diff test scaling correction:
the corrected chi-sq diff test would then be:
I do not think this is correct.
Can someone help me out?
posted on Friday, February 03, 2006 - 9:47 am
It looks like you have done this correctly. The asymptotics of this correction does not always work out in small samples as has been noted by the authors, although note that the p value will be zero for both uncorrected and corrected chi-square difference testing. In Mplus Version 4 you will also have access to a Wald test which avoids these problems.
Sophie van der SLuis
posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 2:23 am
Thank you for the swift response.
I'll see if I can lay my hands on Mplus 4.
I presume however that I can also report the CFI, RMSEA, standardized residuals etc. to substantiate the improvement in model fit?
Kinds regards
Anna Kryziek
posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 7:50 am
Once you have computed the Satorra-Bentler scaled chi-square difference test, how can you determine whether the two models are significantly different or not?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 8:44 am
The other fits measures should be okay.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 8:45 am
You compare it to the chi-square table value for the number of degrees of freedom in the difference test.
Anna Kryziek
posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 10:08 am
Thank you!
Chris Aberson
posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 2:16 pm
I've done a series of these calculations and I get some CD values that are negative (do*co is less than d1*c1).
What should I do in this case? Use the absolute value of the CD?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 5:43 pm
In this case, the difference testing is not working and should not be interpreted.
Chris Aberson
posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 6:22 pm
What is my option here?
Just a straight test based on the ML values?
Also, to be clear -- if the test is not working -- is that attributable to some data characteristics or user error? I'm confident I'm doing the test correctly (as is comes out positive for about 50% of my comparisons). Thanks!
posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 6:30 pm
The asymptotics of the test fails to kick in - this has been observed among the creators of the test (Satorra-Bentler) in several applications. No user error, and no fault of the data (apart from perhaps not having a large enough n). An alternative is to use a Wald test which is part of the upcoming Mplus Version 4 (see new announcement on the home page). This test is robust to the same type of violations as MLR/MLM.
Chris Aberson
posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2006 - 9:09 am
Would the Wald result here be similar to what EQS calls the Lagrange Multiplier test?
For example if I were to take my model and constrain a covariance to one - would the Lagrange value associated with freeing that parameter give me a test of the difference between a comparison model and a model with that constraint (given that is the only constraint I'm testing?
Thanks again - great comments.
posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2006 - 3:16 pm
No, Wald testing pertains to restrictions on a given H0 model, whereas LM tests (= Mod Ind) pertains to relaxing restrictions on a given H0 model.
Yes. The Wald test, however, would make it unnecessary for you to run that second run with your covariance restricted.
posted on Monday, February 27, 2006 - 6:56 pm
I want to compute a chi-square difference test, however, my two df's are the same. Does this mean that my models are not nested?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Monday, February 27, 2006 - 7:26 pm
What estimator are you using?
anna kryzicek
posted on Wednesday, March 22, 2006 - 10:01 am
There was some discussion above about the conditions under which the Satorra-Bentler chi-square test fails. Could you direct me to papers that discuss this further.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, March 22, 2006 - 12:32 pm
I think Peter Bentler has written about this. I don't know of the exact references. If you can't find it doing a literature search, you can contact Peter Bentler.
henry nyabuto
posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 12:27 pm
I have run a multi-group (4 groups) CFA using LISREL. The output indicates that the factor loadings are equivalent across the four groups - only one set of loadings in the output. However, a chi-square difference test (Santorra-Bentler Chi-square) is significant - contrained model minus unconstrained model. Does this sometimes happen? If so, what is the explanation and how does one proceed?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Monday, July 17, 2006 - 1:20 pm
This would indicate that constraining the factor loadings to be equal across groups significantly worsens the fit of the model. There must be some factor loadings that are not invariant across groups. You can read about testing for measurement invariance in Chapter 13 of the Mplus User's Guide which is on the website. It is at the end of the multiple group discussion.
Christine McWayne
posted on Thursday, August 10, 2006 - 1:20 pm
I am searching for the formula for calculating degrees of freedom when using WLSMV, but cannot find the correct info in the latest User's Guide or in the Technical Appendices. I am using MPlus version 3.0 for this CFA. Can I interpret the degrees of freedom as accurate in the output?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Thursday, August 10, 2006 - 2:57 pm
It is formula 110 in Technical Appendix 4 on the website. The only interpretable value for WLSMV is the p-value for chi-square. The degrees of freedom are not calculated in the regular way. Difference testing of nested models can be carried out using the DIFFTEST option.
Jason Prenoveau
posted on Thursday, July 24, 2008 - 9:39 am
I know that when using the Satorra-Bentler chi-square (MLM), you must calculate a corrected chi-square difference test. It appears from the discussion above that this SAME procedure should be used for the Yuan-Bentler T2 test statistic (MLR). Is this true, or when using MLR (Yuan-Bentler T2 test statistic) is it possible to just use a regular difference test?
Thank you for your help!
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Thursday, July 24, 2008 - 10:21 am
MLM, MLR, and WLSM all need to use a scaling correction factor for difference testing.
M C Schilpzand
posted on Wednesday, October 22, 2008 - 2:11 pm
Dear colleagues,
I would like to use the Chi-square difference test but I am unsure if my two models are nested. I would like to compare a CFA with conflict as 1 scale (items 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) and a CFA with conflict as 2 scales( task conflict items 3,6,7 and relationship conflict items 1,2,5). The last model has 1 df less. Could I consider these models nested? If so could I use the Satorra-Bentler Scaled Difference Test?
Thanks so much!
P.S. great forum, I have learned a lot from it!
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 9:30 am
If you don't have the same set of observed dependent variables, the models are not nested.
M C Schilpzand
posted on Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 1:30 pm
Thanks for your quick reply.
I think I understand. So if I would make a second order factor (conflict) of the two first order factors (task conflict and relationship conflict)and compare this to a CFA of one factor (conflict) the models would be nested and thus I can use the S-B Scaled Difference Test?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Thursday, October 23, 2008 - 5:49 pm
A second-order factor model with two indicators is not identified. To be nested, each model would need to include the same set of dependent variables. I don't think if identified, your suggestion has that.
Janine Neuhaus
posted on Wednesday, January 14, 2009 - 2:46 am
I ran a multilevel CFA with continous variables. I would like to compare two models: (1) 2-factors within and 1 factor between vs. (2) 2-factors within and 2 factors between. As much as I understand Model 2 is not nested within model 1, so I can't use the S-B Scaled Difference Test. Regarding my chi-square value and the fit indices I cannot decide which model fits better, because they are nearly the same. My question:
Is there another way to test if they are different? If not, can I conclude both models are equivalent although I couldn't really prove it?
Thanks very much!
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, January 14, 2009 - 8:05 am
BIC could be helpful to balance parsimony against improving the loglikelihood. If the fit information is about the same, I would decide based on the interpretation and usefulness of the model; I wouldn't be so concerned about testing. If the model with 2 between factors doesn't add interpretational value, parsimony speaks for the 1-factor model on between.
Janine Neuhaus
posted on Thursday, January 15, 2009 - 2:21 am
Thank you very much for your advice - very helpful!
Sunny Liu
posted on Monday, March 09, 2009 - 12:28 am
I am a little confused with the Satorra-Bentler Scaled Chi-Square.
For example,
Baseline model:
Chi-square Test of Model Fit:
Value: 2
Degree of Freedom: 2
Scaling Correction Factor for MLR: 2
Model 1:
Chi-square Test of Model Fit:
Value: 1
Degree of Freedom: 1
Scaling Correction Factor for MLR: 1
# Compute the difference test scaling correction where d0 is the degrees of freedom in the nested model and d1 is the degrees of freedom in the comparison model.
cd = (d0 * c0 - d1*c1)/(d0 - d1)
= (2*2 - 1*1)/(2-1) = 3
Note that the ML chi-square is equal to the MLM or MLR chi-square times the scaling correction factor.
# Compute the Satorra-Bentler scaled chi-square difference test (TRd) as follows:
TRd = (T0 - T1)/cd
= (2*2-1*1)/3 = 1
The X-square difference test is X-square equal to 1 with 1 df, then it is not significant.
Or should it be
TRd = (T0 - T1)/cd
= (2-1)/3 = 1/3
The X-square difference test is X-square equal to 1/3 with 1 df, then it is not significant.
Which way is correct?
Andrea Vocino
posted on Monday, November 09, 2009 - 5:28 pm
Is the S-B chi^2 in Mplus going to be changed according to latest estimation provided by Satorra nd Bentler (2009)? see e.g.,
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Monday, November 09, 2009 - 5:44 pm
We have on our list to include that twist in our next version.
Christoph Weber
posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 6:57 am
Dear Drs. Muthen,
I'm doing a chi-square difference test for MLR. I get a negative cd-value (=-.016). I think this is due to the complex model (M1: df=1085 M2: df=1086, M1: Scale Cor=1.070 M2:1.069). It follows that also the scaled chi-square difference is negative (-240,639). Is this result interpretable?
How should I interpret it?
Do I have to use the modulus of cd?
Or does it mean, that the model with df=1086 fits better??
best regards
Christoph Weber
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 8:45 am
The result is not interpretable. This is a flaw with the method.
Michael Spaeth
posted on Friday, February 05, 2010 - 7:20 am
I have the same problems with MLR-testing as described above (negative chi-square). In this situation, is it o.k. to use the Wald-test in combination with MLR and COMPLEX/CLUSTER in order to test some simple 1df constraints?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, February 05, 2010 - 9:09 am
kathrin weidacker
posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 9:36 am
Dear Drs. Muthen,
I am trying the formula for positive SB-difference statistic values
at invariance testing across groups (3). since the method requires
estimating a M10 model, with the M0 output as starting values, I do
not know which starting values to use in case of several groups.
can you help me further, please?
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 10:04 am
You want to study examples 3 and 4 and their Mplus scripts at
You would use the M0 output for each group to form the multi-group M10 start values.
kathrin weidacker
posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 6:07 pm
Thank you for the fast response! I will check those notes.
Samantha Anders
posted on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 - 9:51 am
Hi there -
I am trying to run a fully unconstrained multiple group CFA model to compare to my constrained model, but I am not able to figure out the syntax for this. For the constrained model, I am using the syntax below. What do I need to add to make it unconstrained? Thank you!
Title: CFA; low.hi; current; King
DATA: FILE IS low.hi.current.csv;
VARIABLE: NAMES ARE b1-b5 c1-c2 c3-c7 d1-d5 g;
CATEGORICAL ARE b1-b5 c1-c2 c3-c7 d1-d5;
GROUPING IS g (1 = low 2 = high);
MODEL: f1 BY b1-b5;
f2 BY c1-c2;
f3 BY c3-c7;
f4 BY d1-d5;
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 - 10:03 am
See Slides 169 and 170 of the Topic 2 course handout on the website.
Samantha Anders
posted on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 - 12:54 pm
Thank you for your prompt response! I realize this is probably a really easy question, but the syntax I posted above - is this for a fully unconstrained model and then syntax on slides 169 and 170 for a fully constrained model?
Thank you so much!
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, October 20, 2010 - 3:07 pm
The syntax above is for a model with factor loadings and intercepts constrained to be equal across groups. This is the Mplus default. See Chapter 14 of the user's guide for a full description of multiple group analysis in Mplus.
On Slides 169 and 170, the first syntax is for a fully constrained model. The second is for an unconstrained model. And the third is for a partially constrained model.
Samantha Anders
posted on Saturday, October 23, 2010 - 2:45 pm
Thanks again. We got a bit closer, but now are running into this problem -
When the fully unconstrained model is run, we're getting error messages like this:
We're not able to get fit statistics because the parameter estimates couldn't be computed. When I check the output, I can find out that, in this model, parameter 81 is d5. So then I delete the line of code freeing d5 the model will run. I'm not sure what the condition number is yet. Can you tell us what the condition number indicates?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Saturday, October 23, 2010 - 3:29 pm
The condition number is related to identification. Please send the full output and your license number to
posted on Tuesday, November 02, 2010 - 4:02 am
Dear Linda or Bengt,
Is the method described in Webnote 12 ("Computing the Strictly Positive
Satorra-Bentler Chi-Square Test in Mplus") also applicable to the Yuan-Bentler T2 statistic obtained when using MLR estimation?
Thanks in advance,
Tihomir Asparouhov
posted on Tuesday, November 02, 2010 - 8:45 am
Ian Clara
posted on Tuesday, December 07, 2010 - 6:39 am
Good morning. I am trying to conduct a chi-square difference test using the WLSMV estimation and type=complex. I have used the difftest option and for the two models that I want to test it says that they are not nested (although there is a single path that is different -- set to zero in one model and freely estimated in the other). I wanted to try to conduct the chi-square difference test by hand, but I can't determine how to get the required output in Mplus v5. How can I obtain the scaling correction factors, or the log likelihood?
Warm regards,
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, December 07, 2010 - 8:00 am
Difference testing using WLSMV cannot be done by hand. If you use WLSM, you will obtain a scaling correction factor.
Fred Mueller
posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - 6:08 am
Dear Linda and Bengt,
I would like to compare two nested models and I am using MLR as an estimator. Instead of using the (Santorra-Bentler Scaled) Chi-Square difference test, I would like to use the small difference in fit test by MacCallum, Browne, and Cai (2006, Psych Methods).
For this test, I also have to indicate the Chi-Square of both models. How do I have to proceed? Can I just multiply the (regularI Chi-Square with the scaling correction factor to get the correct Chi-Square or is it more complicated?
Thank you very much in advance!
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - 1:51 pm
I don't know if the MacCallum et al approach needs the usual, uncorrected, chi-square or can use the MLR chi-square. You may want to approach the authors with that question.
Fred Mueller
posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - 5:22 pm
Thank you very much for your quick reply!
Malte Jansen
posted on Monday, March 19, 2012 - 6:23 am
Dear Mplus Team,
i am comparing 2 measurement models for 18 items using MLR. It would be great if you could help me with some answers:
The first model is a one-factor model where all items are explaining by the same factor and the second model is a three factor model where each factor explains 6 items.
(1)Is it right to say that these models are nested as the 3-factor-model with the correlations between the factors set to 1 would equal the 1-factor-model?
(2) When i compute the S-B scaled Chi square difference test, the result is negative. Therefore i tried computing the strictly positive S-B scaled Chi square difference test. Thus i tried to estimate the more strict M0 model first which would be the 3-factor-model with between-factor-correlations set to one. However, the estimation did not converge. What am i doing wrong? Heres the input:
factor1 by f10-f16;
factor2 by f20-f26;
factor3 by f30-f36;
factor1 WITH factor2 @1;
factor2 WITH factor3 @1;
factor3 WITH factor1 @1;
Best regards and thank you in advance.
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, March 20, 2012 - 1:57 pm
The M0 model is just the one-factor model, right?
Malte Jansen
posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2012 - 5:33 am
Yes, but from the examples in the Webnote describing the strictly positive S-B Test i thought in order to compare the models i would need the same notation in the syntax (i.e. 3 correlations set to one instead of just "factor1 by f10-f36") so that i can save the start values for the M10 Model and then free the correlations between the factors.
Tihomir Asparouhov
posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2012 - 6:57 pm
If you are using the MLR estimator with categorical data you should use the unscaled likelihood ratio test. The S-B is designed to be used for the case when you are treating the variables as continuous.
Strictly speaking there is a bit of a problem in using LRT for this purpose (overfactoring) see
Hayashi, K.., Bentler, P. M., & Yuan, K. �H. (2007). On the likelihood ratio test for the number of factors in exploratory factor analysis.
You might want to consider using BIC as well.
Malte Jansen
posted on Wednesday, March 28, 2012 - 8:17 am
Dear Tihomir,
thanks for your detailed reply. I am using MLR because the complex sampling option (type=complex) requires it. Aside from that i am not treating the data (5-point-scales) as categorical (yet).
Best regards,
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, March 28, 2012 - 10:26 am
We need to see the relevant files and your license number at
to help you further.
Johan Korhonen
posted on Monday, December 03, 2012 - 5:33 am
I have been working with ESEM models with MLR estimator. To compare nested models I have been using S-B x^2 and it has worked fine until I got a negative estimate when comparing two models. I found your web note on how to compute the strictly positive S-B x^2 but when I tried to run the M0 model with the svalues command to get the starting values for the M10 model I got the following warning text in Mplus:
*** WARNING in MODEL command
The SVALUES option in the OUTPUT command is not available with the use of
EFA factors (ESEM). Request for SVALUES will be ignored.
Do you have any advice for me how to proceed?
Best regards
Tihomir Asparouhov
posted on Monday, December 03, 2012 - 3:09 pm
You can just use the final results in the M0 output and put these values (manually) as starting value for M10 run. The SVALUES option is just a convenience feature that does this for you but you can do it manually as well.
The strictly positive S-B chi-square is not very easy to do with ESEM. You have to work with the unrotated model. We may eventually update the web note to include a step by step computation for the strictly positive S-B for ESEM. Consider using Model Test as a simpler alternative.
Johan Korhonen
posted on Monday, December 03, 2012 - 10:30 pm
Thank you for your quick response. I think I will use the Model Test command.
Have a nice day
Paula Vagos
posted on Friday, December 07, 2012 - 9:20 am
I have been trying to compute the SB chi-square difference test, bu my cd is negative, and so I need to create the M10 model. But I dont understand how to do it
Can anyone help me?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Sunday, December 09, 2012 - 5:39 pm
Send the outputs from the m0 and m1 analyses along with your attempt at the m10 model. Include your license number.
posted on Saturday, April 27, 2013 - 3:04 pm
Hello. I computed the chi-square difference test for 2 nested models and it was negative so I followed the instructions in WebNote 12, but I received the following error message and can't figure out what to do next?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Sunday, April 28, 2013 - 10:26 am
Please send the output and your license number to
Jacqueline Homel
posted on Monday, June 24, 2013 - 3:43 pm
I have a longitudinal cross-lagged path model with four outcomes over three assessment points. Three of the outcomes are continuous and the fourth is a count, so I am using MLR. I also am using the knownclass method to compare invariance across males and females. My analysis command looks like this:
Type = mixture ;
Algorithm = integration ;
Integration =montecarlo ;
I want to test whether two parameters in the model are equal to each other (although they are invariant across sex), so I constrained them to be equal and compared this to a model where they were free. However, I get a negative scaled chi-square difference value. I read webnote #12 and tried to estimate model 10, but when I pasted the start values from model 0 in, the new model does not converge. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong but am not sure what.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - 10:21 am
Use MODEL TEST. Label the parameters in the MODEL command.
0 - p1 -p2;
posted on Friday, September 20, 2013 - 5:52 am
Hi there,
I am comparing the fit of nested models (i.e., bifactor, correlated traits, higher-order, uni-dimensional) using difftest. I have clustered data and obtain different conclusions when type=COMPLEX is used as compared to when I do not adjust for clustering. Specifically, the bifactor model is preferred when I do not account for clustering, whereas the correlated traits model seems to be preferred when I account for clustering.
It may be helpful to know that I obtain all chi-square difference test statistics when not adjusting for clustering. However, I do not obtain the chi-square the difference test statistic for the correlated traits model when adjusting for clustering (because the chi-square value in this case is actually lower than the value for the bifactor model; i.e., the models are not technically nested). Also, it is worth noting that there are no real substantive differences with respect to any of the factor loadings in either case; so, the only issue at hand is which model is preferred.
Any recommendations of which results should be reported in this case? Thank you in advance for your time.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Friday, September 20, 2013 - 11:58 am
If you have clustered data, you need to do the analysis taking that into account.
posted on Tuesday, October 08, 2013 - 9:07 am
Hi there,
I understand nested models require two things: 1) more restrictions (higher degrees of freedom) AND 2) worse fit (which can be examined via Tech 5 output).
When a model is more restricted yet has slightly better fit, MPlus does not execute the DIFFTEST and returns the error indicating that the models are not nested. In this specific situation, is the conclusion to be drawn: 1) the more restricted model (e.g., correlated traits) is preferred over the less restricted model (e.g., bifactor model); or 2) no firm conclusions should be drawn because the DIFFTEST is not executed. I'm thinking the answer is #1. Am I right? However, if it is #2, what can be done?
Thank you in advance for your time.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, October 08, 2013 - 9:40 am
You cannot compare the chi-square values of the estimators that end in V, WLSMV and MLMV. You would need to compare their fitting functions which you will find in TECH5 at the bottom of the first column. The lower the fitting function the better.
The conditions that you mention are necessary but not sufficient conditions for nesting. Please send the outputs and your license number to
for further information.
Ariane Descheneaux-Buffoni
posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2014 - 10:07 am
I have a longitudinal cross-lagged path model with six outcomes over three assessment points. All outcomes are continuous and non normally distributed, so I used MLR. I am also using the grouping method to compare invariance across males and females, therefore doing Satorra-Bentler scaled chi-square difference testing. Of the 141 parameters tested for invariance, 19 resulted in negative values. I read the articles and web notes about computing the strictly positive Satorra-Bentler chi-square difference test and I have a few questions:
1- When I use the SVALUES option to get all the final parameter estimates from model M0, estimates regarding the structural links (the "ONs") are not provided. Is that normal? Does this mean we do not have to include these estimates in the model M10?
2- I read that we must halt iterations in model M10 (i.e., the number of iterations have to be equal to 0) and that we have to increase convergence in order to do so. I did that and looked at the TECH5 part of the output to verify that iterations are null. I was wondering which type of iterations to look at? Is it the Quasi-Newton type? These seem to be at 0 whereas the other ones (for instance, EM algorithm iterations) never are at 0.
Best regards and thank you in advance,
Ariane Descheneaux-Buffoni
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2014 - 9:18 am
1-2. Please send the outputs and your license number to
Kaisa Perko
posted on Monday, January 12, 2015 - 1:25 am
I'm a novice in SEM and would highly appreciate any expert advice. I'm struggling with a discrepancy between the chi-square test and a path coefficient.
I'm comparing two nested models with the scaled Satorra-Bentler chi-square difference test. In the restricted model, two paths between latent variables (from one IV to two DVs) are fixed at zero. In the unrestricted model, these paths are freely estimated.(For information, there are also other IVs in the model).
The scaled chi-square test favors the restricted model (nonsignicant result). However, in the unrestricted model, one of the freed paths is significant (p<.05) . Thus, the chi-square test seems to reject a significant path. Accordingly, the conclusions are different depending on whether I estimate all the hypothesized paths at once, or step by step using nested models. I wonder if I'm making a mistake if I follow the chi-square test and accordingly consider the restricted model as the final model?
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Monday, January 12, 2015 - 11:14 am
These tests can give different results, particularly when the sample isn't large. As a check, you also want to use the Wald test of both coefficients being zero - you do that using the Model Test command.
Kaisa Perko
posted on Tuesday, January 13, 2015 - 4:34 am
Thank you very much for responding.
The sample size is 549. Wald test yielded a significant result (p=0.0365) for the path which is significant in the unrestricted model, and a nonsignificant result for the path which is nonsignificant in the unrestricted model.
As the discrepancy with the scaled chi-square remains, may I ask your opinion, would I stay on safer ground if I 1) follow the scaled chi-square test which suggests the restricted model as the final one or
2) adopt a "all at once" approach (all paths freely estimated) and ignore the chi-square test?
My aim is to evaluate whether one of the IVs is redundant to the other IVs, and the conclusions differ between alternatives 1 and 2.
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, January 13, 2015 - 7:57 am
You should test both paths jointly when doing the Wald Model Test. If you only do one at a time you are not doing anything differently than the printed z test (chi-2 = z*z).
Kaisa Perko
posted on Wednesday, January 14, 2015 - 5:29 am
Of course, thank you. Testing both paths jointly yielded a nonsignificant result in accordance with the scaled chi-square difference test. I additionally found out that also the chi-square difference test suggests the unconstrained model if I fix and free the single path instead both of the paths. So the original discrepancy appears more understandable now, and I need to rethink my analysis strategy against this background.
I am grateful for your advice and patience!
Tim Powers
posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 2:56 am
I'm computing a chi-square diff test using MLR for the first time in Mplus. The website instructions seem pretty straightforward. In calculating the difference test scaling correction cd, it warns "Be sure to use the correction factor given in the output for the HO model."
Should I use the 'Scaling Correction Factor for MLR' found under Chi-Square Test Model Fit in my calculations? There is no mention of HO here. Alternatively, should I be using the 'HO Scaling Correction Factor for MLR' found under the Loglikelihood section?
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 11:52 am
If you are doing the test using chi-square, use the one under chi-square. If you are doing the difference testing using the loglikelihood, use the one under the loglikelihood.
Tim Powers
posted on Sunday, May 31, 2015 - 6:39 pm
Many thanks, Linda.
Kind regards,
Simon L Chr�tien
posted on Tuesday, February 09, 2016 - 12:08 pm
Hello all,
I'm having a hard time figuring how to calculate the SB chi-square even though it seems simple. I can't seem to find what are the chi-square and df values for the comparison and nested models in my output. Here is my output:
Number of Free Parameters 65
H0 Value -12117.514
H0 Scaling Correction Factor for MLR 1.0140
H1 Value -11921.932
H1 Scaling Correction Factor for MLR 1.0794
Chi-Square Test of Model Fit
Value 352.740*
Degrees of Freedom 144
P-Value 0.0000
Scaling Correction Factor for MLR 1.1089
Chi-Square Test of Model Fit for the Baseline Model
Value 5109.169
Degrees of Freedom 171
P-Value 0.0000
Thank you.
Linda K. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, February 09, 2016 - 2:18 pm
You need two outputs to do the test. One for the less restricted model and one for the model nested in the less restricted model. You use the H0 values from those two outputs.
Simon L Chr�tien
posted on Thursday, February 11, 2016 - 12:01 pm
If I understand correctly, according to the examples given on the website, I'd have to use those two inputs:
title: M0 model
variable: NAMES ARE y1-y5;
data: file=1.dat;
analysis: estimator=mlr;
model: f1 BY y1-y5; y1 with y2;
output: svalues;
title: M1 model
variable: NAMES ARE y1-y5;
data: file=1.dat;
analysis: estimator=mlr;
model: f1 BY y1-y5; y1 with y2; y3 with y2;
I'm not sure what to do if I have more than 1 factor and 2 factors that have 2 variables...
Here is my model:
ESC BY esc01 esc02 esc03;
EXP BY exp01 exp02;
GS BY gs01 gs02;
RS BY rs01 rs02 rs03;
FG BY fg01 fg02 fg03;
DEV BY dev01 dev02 dev03;
RD BY rd01 rd02 rd03;
Thank you,
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Thursday, February 11, 2016 - 6:22 pm
As you see on our web page
you only need to work with the degrees of freedom, the scaling correction factor, and the log likelihood or chi-2 values from your two models. The details of the model are not needed.
Eric Deemer
posted on Tuesday, February 16, 2016 - 12:59 pm
I'm trying to compute the strictly positive SB chi-square value for a test of the difference between a 1- and 2-factor model. I'm following web note 12 but I'm not sure if my models are correct. The model statement for my restrictive model is:
MODEL: F1 BY y1-y6;
F2 BY y7-y10;
F1 with
So I obtain starting values from this model and plug them into a model with these specifications but also with a freely estimated F1-F2 covariance? Thank you.
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, February 16, 2016 - 6:39 pm
Why bother with chi-2? You can just look at the z-test for F1 WITH F2 being different from 1 (subtract 1 from the estimate and divide by the SE). With 1 df the squared z-test should be close to the chi-2 and it does take the non-normality into account in the SEs if you use MLR or MLM.
Eric Deemer
posted on Tuesday, February 16, 2016 - 6:57 pm
Ah, I see. Thank you, Bengt!
Tim Powers
posted on Friday, February 19, 2016 - 4:29 pm
Hello Eric and Bengt,
I have also struggled with this particular issue of comparing 1 & 2 factors differences.
With a large sample size (and resultant small SE), using the z-test, everything is significantly different than 1. My chi-square values (df=1) are much higher in this approach than the corrected chi-square for non-normality.
I have struggled with the 'strictly positive SB chi-square approach'; but may have to come back to this.
In the meantime, I have used the Fornell and Larcker AVE (average variance extracted) approach to analyse difference b/w factors. But this seems somewhat unsophisticated.
Wondering on best approach.
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Friday, February 19, 2016 - 6:17 pm
BIC is always useful. It doesn't test but it guides.
Vaiva Gerasimaviciute
posted on Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - 5:29 am
Dear Muthen,
I am running a 3-wave cross-lagged model with categorical observed variables using WLSMV estimator, theta parameterization.
Chi-square of the baseline model is 541.317. When I add second order path (from T1 to T3), chi-square is 485.851.
To my understanding, the difference in chi-square should be 55.466(541.317-485.851). However, difftest in Mplus gives 75.560. Why could that be?
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, March 21, 2017 - 3:01 pm
See the intro in UG ex13.12. WLSMV chi-square behaves differently.
Daniel Lee
posted on Saturday, December 23, 2017 - 10:30 pm
Hello Dr. Muthen, would you still recommend doing an LRT or wald test for a multigroup model if regression coefficient in one group is not significant, while the regression coefficient in another group is significant? Thank you!
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Sunday, December 24, 2017 - 4:26 pm
Nicky de Vries
posted on Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - 1:32 am
I'm performing a multilevel CFA with the MLR estimator, following the five step approach (Muth�n, 1994). So, I have been using the SB scaled chi square difference test in the way that was explained on this website. However, I got some negative chi square values, which is why I want to perform the SB strictly positive chi square for these tests. The webnote about this was already very useful, but I'm not sure yet how to obtain the M10 value in my case, because I'm comparing models with different numbers of factors instead of just adding a parameter.
For example, for a one-level model my nested model looks like this:
C BY y1-y27;
Whereas, my comparison model looks like this:
I've read in the webnote that have to use SVALUES to obtain the Mplus language for M10 and that I need to add the command for the extra parameters in the comparison model. I just do not understand what that would be in this case. Can you help me with that?
Or, would it be better not to compare these models with the chi square difference, buth only with the AIC for example?
Thanks in advance!
Tihomir Asparouhov
posted on Tuesday, March 19, 2019 - 2:41 pm
The easiest way to do that is to fix the scale of the factor by fixing the variance of the factor to 1.
So if the M0 model is
C BY y1-y27*1;
and the M1 model is
then the M10 model is
C with NC*1;
and the rest of the starting values from the loadings have to be picked up from the M0 run as well as the intercepts and the residual variance.
In your particular case the easiest way to test the two models is to look at the Z test for the factor correlation if it is significantly different from 1, or equivalently use
Model test: 0=1-corr;
C with NC (corr);
You can also use BIC or the SB test. Multiple tests can be useful if one is not very decisive.
Olev Must
posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 7:57 am
Dear Mplus team,
I am conducting the invariance testing in multigroup situation: binary items, 2 groups, WLSMV. Configural model was ok. Difftest showed that the metric model was significantly worse than configural. I decided to free one loading (and after some thresholds). I tried to estimate the difference between Metric and revised metric model (MetricA), but I got the message: THE CHI-SQUARE DIFFERENCE TEST COULD NOT BE COMPUTED BECAUSE THE H0 MODEL IS NOT NESTED IN THE H1 MODEL.
I understand that Metric model is more constrained than MetricA. But is it impossible to estimate the differences between those models? My aim is to estimate the differences in latent means. I would use the partial invariance model as evidently some loadings and intercepts are not invariant.
Please advice for needed analytical steps how to free loadings and thresholds and to estimate the consequences of this freeing steps.
Thank you!
Bengt O. Muthen
posted on Tuesday, April 16, 2019 - 5:43 pm
We need to see your full output for the run with the message - send to Support along with your license number.
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text:
C. Richard Swanson begins preparation for taking over his new
position of Religious council chairman.
Class officers for 1957 - 8, Dave Shold, junior, Dwight Jessup,
sophomore, and John Anderson, senior, discuss their recent election.
Swanson, VanHeerden, Erickson
Approved Council Chairmen
Banquet Held
At Park Plaza
Rev. Harold Christensen, Rock-ford,
Ill., will be speaking at the
Freshman-Sophomore banquet on
May 10, at 6:30 p.m. at the Park
Plaza in Minneapolis.
The new pastor of the Wood-dale
Baptist church in Minneapolis,
Rev. Peter Unruh, will be master
of ceremonies. Several semiclassi-cal
songs will be sung by Virgil
Hale of St. Paul Bible institute.
Tickets for the banquet are $6.50
per couple and will be on sale to-day,
through May 8, in the main
hall of the college building and
in the dining hall during meals.
Banquet pictures may be ordered
when tickets are purchased.
Rich Massey, member of the ban-quet
planning committee, announc-ed
that the tickets will be taken at
the door.
Ron Veenker is publicity chair-man
and Bob Friederichson is in
charge of the decorations.
The Madrigal Singers will pre-sent
the program at the Junior-
Senior banquet to be held in the
dining room and the Garden Room
Campus Calendar
April 30—"Henry V", college cha-pel,
4:30 p.m. and 7:30 p.m.
—Baseball—Concordia (there)
May 1—BWA Banquet, dining hall,
6:30 p.m.
—Baseball—Martin Luther
(there), 3 p.m.
—Polio retakes, Health Service,
11 a.m. - 1 p.m.
2—FMF, sem chapel, 7 p.m.
—Polio retakes, Health Service,
11 a.m. - 1 p.m.
3—Minnesota Conference on So-cial
Work Education, 10 a.m.
- 4 p.m., faculty lounge.
4—Baseball—Martin Luther
6—Student recital, college chapel,
7:30 p.m.
—Camp and DVBS Workshop,
college chapel, 7 p.m.
—Radio club
by Phyllis Anderson
A film adaptation of Shake-speare's
play, "Henry the Fifth,"
is to be shown today in the college
chapel at 4:30 p.m. and at 7:30
Sir Lawrence Olivier plays the
lead role as King Henry in the J.
Arthur Rank production in the
British Film elasi, seri es .
The play, one of Shakespeare's
historical romances, deals with the
attempt of Henry the Fifth, once
an irresponsible disciple of the
disreputable Falstaff, to assert his
May 3 Dead Line Set
Friday, May 3, is the last day
that narrative, descriptive or
expository themes written by
freshmen this year may be sub-mitted
to Dr. Virginia Grabill
for the Freshman Writing Con-test.
of the Lowell Inn in Stillwater,
Minn., on May 10, at 8 p.m.
Both classical and informal mu-sic
including sacred music, Am-erican
folk songs, and English
madrigals will be on the program.
Mr. Fred Hillary, choir director
of the Central Lutheran Church in
Minneapolis directs the Madrigal
Singers, a group of 24 alumni of
Gustavus Adolphus college in St.
Peter, Minn.
On the menu for the banquet is
a four course fried chicken dinner.
The price of reservations has
been set at $7.00 per couple. All
reservations must be made with Ed
Brunzell or Bruce Erickson before
6 p.m. on Monday, May 6. During
Thursday and Friday, May 2 and
3, a table where reservations may
be made will be set up in the stu-dent
lounge between 1 and 3 p.m.
]Faculty members, junior, and
their guests may attend the Junior-
Senior banquet.
The planning committee is made
up of Betty Ohlin and John F.
Anderson, representing the junior
class and Marge Peterson and Ed
Brunzell representing the senior
Council chairmen for next year
approved by the Student Senate
at the April 25 meeting are Law-rence
VanHeerden of the cultural
council, C. Richard Swanson of
the religious council, and Art
Erickson of the social council.
Dick, who will be a junior in
the seminary next year, made the
following statement about the re-ligious
"There is a real need on campus
as ours to have a council to co-ordinate
and organize events that
can instruct, encourage, and give
expression to our innermost reli-gious
feelings. The religious coun-cil
desires to fulfill this need
through gospel teams, Monday
chapels, missionary offerings, sing-hereditary
claim to the French
throne. In doing so, he pits him-self
against the arrogant French
at Agincourt. Strongly out-num-bered,
before the battle Henry
walks among the men, reflecting
on the cares of kingship. In spite
of the odds, the English win and
the French sue for peace.
Sir T,nivrene ,. is the mos*. re-nowned
Shakespearean actors of
our age, acting in such other film
adaptation as Richard III and
Shold To Head
Junior Class
Dave Shold of Grand Marais,
Minnesota, was elected to the presi-dency
of next year's junior class.
Vice president of the class will
be Dave Morin, with Jan Lind-quist
as secretary and Evan Rogers
as treasurer.
Sophomore vice president this
year, Dave made this statement
to the class of '59:
"I am greatly honored by the
privilege of being able to serve you
in this office. I feel equally hon-ored
by the confidence you have
placed in me to fill this office.
With the cooperation and the
prayers of everyone, we can gain
our greatest objective—to continue
our Christian growth and to be a
more effective example of Jesus
spirations, dormitory prayer meet-ings,
and other activities.
"I feel it a real honor and a
privilege to be given the oppor-tunity
to serve as chairman of the
religious council, and I pray that
the Lord's name might be honored
and glorified through the func-tions
of this council."
This year Dick was vice-chair-man
of the religious council. In the
past he has been chairman of the
social council.
Other officers of the religious
council approved at the last sen-nate
meeting were Glenn Ogren,
vice-chairman, Sylvia Jackson, sec-
Speech Contest
Preliminaries for the annual
speech contest will be held on May
7, at 3:15 p.m. in the college build-ing.
The division of original ora-tory
will be in room 204, while the
poetry-reading division will be in
room 210. The finals will be held
on May 14, at 7:30 p.m., in the
seminary chapel.
Prizes of $25, $15, and $10 will
be awarded in the oratory division
while awards of $15, $10, and $5
will be given in the poetry division.
Dr. Richard Curtis of the speech
department will coach oratory,
while Dr. Paul Grabill, literature
department, will coach the poetry
reading division.
Students wishing to enter either
division should give their names
and the titles of their entries to
Dr. Virginia Grabill by May 1.
Further information will be
posted on the bulletin board.
President of next year's senior
class will be John Frederick An-derson
from Houston, Minnesota.
Bruce Richardson was chosen vice
president with Sylvia Jackson as
secretary and Joel Stoke, trea-surer.
John made this statement:
"Plans are now being made for
next year's class advisor and for
our program as a class organiza-tion.
The presentation of a play
early in the first semester to help
raise money for a class gift is in
part one specific possibility in
next year's program. I hope that
through the class organizations as
well as individually, we seniors of
1957-'58 will contribute extensive-ly
to the needs of our campus."
During his freshman year at
Bethel, John held the office of
class president. Since then he has
worked in the Student Senate as
a member of the athletic and so-retary,
Roger Bear, devotional
chairman, and Carroll Erickson,
Christian service chairman.
In defining the purpose of the
cultural council Lawrence, middle
man in the seminary, stated:
"Creative thought and activity
must in some way be related to
the Creator of all things. The
painter, the poet, the actor, and
the musician should be regarded
as one who seeks to find reality
and meaning. To a greater or les-ser
degree he is given the ability
to dip into the stream of creative
activity. This is what we would
call 'inspiration' in the general
"As Christians who have 'con-tacted'
God through Christ, surely
we should learn to understand and
to appreciate the strivings of these
`artistic' souls. Further, we should
strike out on our own path of crea-tive
exploration with the same
hope of contacting the creative
"It will be the purpose of the
cultural council to assist students
in this direction."
This year's sophomore president,
Art Erickson expressed the ambi-tion
for his council this way.
"In recent years Bethel students
have felt the need of a revamping
of the social program. Indeed there
are social needs on our campus,
but as learned at the recent Whea-ton
conference, our problems are
not unique.
"Briefly, the ways that we would
improve the social life on campus
are by setting up next year's social
program this year; establishing
more all school events, including
formals; arranging a variety of
smaller social events; and acquir-ing
more student equipment."
cial councils and is now vice presi-dent
of the college choir. In high
school John was active as a class
officer and was president of his
church youth group.
New Sophs
Elect Jessup
Dwight Jessup of Denver, Col-orado,
was elected to head the
sophomore class next year.
Denny Nerstad and Rich Mas-sey
were elected to the posts of
vice president and treasurer.
Because of a tie vote, Judy
Powell was appointed recording
secretary and Terry Benz as cor-responding
secretary by a com-mittee
approved by the class. The
present year's cabinet plus several
other members of the class made
up the committee.
As the new president Dwight
made this statement:
"It is an honor to have been
elected to lead next year's sopho-more
class. For we as sophomores,
next year will be a year of in-creased
activity and responsibility
in school leadership and school
functions. It will be a year filled
with opportunity to further dev-elop
ourselves as a class and as
individuals here at Bethel. I shall
strive to direct the class in each
of the various areas with which
we will be concerned."
As a freshman, Dwight is a
member of the college choir and
is active in gospel team work. He
received the valedictory scholar-ship.
In his home church in Denver,
Colorado, Dwight has been youth
president and assistant Sunday
School superintendent.
Lowell Inn Is Scene
For J.S. Banquet May 10
the CLARION
Vol. XXXIV—No. 16 Bethel College and Seminary, St. Paul, Minn. Tuesday, April 30, 1957
'Henry The Fifth'
To Be Shown Today
Anderson, Richardson
Chosen By Class Of '58
the CLARION
Bruce Richardson, editor
Carol Christensen,
assistant editor
Department Editor: Morris An-derson,
Astrid Barbins, Mau-reen
Bronstein, Betty Hen-drickson,
Marie Magnuson, &
Gerry Wilber
Business: John Berg, Wayne
Henry, Joanne Lindquist, and
Allan Stahnke
Reporters: Dick Benert, Terry
Benz, Arlene Bergstrom,
Sharon__ Bergstrom,_ Junetta
Best, Karen Christensen, Low-ell
Gardner, Dwight Jessup,
Elaine Johnson, Lois Larson,
Betty Nord, Ardith Rust, and
Pat Sanders
Advisor : Dr. Virginia Grabill
Issued bi-weekly during the
school year by Bethel college
and seminary, St. Paul 1, Minn.
Subscription price: $3
Page 2
the CLARION
Tuesday, April 30, 1957
Seeereptea Zetteta to Nut Still We Cogiing
For Desirable Relations e'e Edet"
Much is often said about establishing a closer contact between the
various campus bodies—administration, faculty and student. A more
free and clearer expression of ideas, more thoughtful and considerate
actions, and more open and justifiable explanation of a procedure in
the relations between any groups must be constantly strived for.
This year has revealed many cases where misunderstandings, hasty
actions, and high tensions have been produced, often because of the
unwillingness or inability of groups to foster these ideals. This is true
of each one of the groups and no particular one can be held responsible
The cultural council affair is one example of this. The hasty action
of the council, the unexpected restrictions of the administration, and
the ultimatum of the council could have been avoided, it seems, if those
involved clearly stated their feelings to each other and to the student
body before the actions were taken. Unfortunately, many weeks, edi-torials,
and discussions passed in the anxious wait for some degree of
explanation. When the administration did explain, many of the ideas
expressed came as a complete surprise.
An area that now awaits sufficient answer is the situation of the
English department. Although no statement has been made, it is well
known that we are to lose the effective and stimulating instruction of
the Drs. Grabill, this we must lament, not only because of our personal
appreciation of them, but also because (it seems) it is costing us our
strongest department. Unless there is an easily accessible number of
unemployed English PhD's, we fail to see any approach to solidifying or
maintaining the literature instruction at its acknowledge high level.
To avoid false ideas, to restrict irrational action and to prohibit
hasty judgment of procedures, some complete and satisfactory explana-tion
must be forth coming. They are imperative as to the actions al-ready
taken and as to the future policies in this situation.
Be An Individual
Bethel is plagued by the "average" student, "average" not in
ability but in utility. He pays the same tuition as the student who
collects full interest from his investment. His only dividends are the
satisfaction of "just getting by." When he has reached this point he
forsakes his studies and starts for the coffee shop or the ping pong
tables in Edgren's basement.
Almost any hour of the day you can be certain to meet one of
the carriers of the plague in the halls, the post office, or the coffee
shop. He approaches you with a friendly smile and an attractive sug-gestion
which you simply can't afford to miss, studies or not. Infec-tion
goes to work almost immediately. Before you realize it, he has
used Dale Carnegie's tips and won you as a friend and influenced you
as a person.
At his suggestion you buy him a cup of coffee and then head for
the parking lot to pick up the little "bomb" on which he tinkers a good
part of his spare time.
Before you can stop and think out the situation clearly, infection
has set in solidly. You are slipping along down Snelling Ave. at the
comfortable rate of 50 m.p.h. Your destination—some suburban high
school chess tournament.
He turns to you and says, "Fright, but I'm bored with studying,
how about you?"
Having all the positive symptoms of a victim you answer him.
"Yes, college life really gets you down. Sometimes I think it's better
to be away from the books for one afternoon."
He smiles. You have agreed. Tomorrow there will be something
else that two of you just can't afford to miss. After all isn't all this
an intrinsic part of your education ? You are really infected now but
it doesn't seem to bother you. Already you are thinking of whom you
might invite tomorrow. You have become a carrier and another
Bethelite is infested with the "plague."
Times evidently have not changed too much since Samuel Johnson
was a college student. When confronted with the same situation he
"Mankind have a great aversion to intellectual labor;
but even supposing knowledge to be easily attainable,
more people would be content to be ignorant than would
take even a little trouble to acquire it."
Metro& e'dece qame
Adapated from Augustana Ob- hate me
server are afraid of me
Dear Mother, don't know I'm alive
1. I am 6. When I come home, you will
fine be surprised to note that I
so-so chew bubble gum
in pretty bad shape cut my hair short
2. Financially, however, can go to the bathroom by
I am broke myself now
I am broke again
7. Last week
I am still broke
I became a member of Bird
3. My love life
Watchers International
is progressingly nicely a beauty queen
is stagnating a coed
is a flop
8. Today, for the first time since
4. Most of my extracurricular I got here
activities are
I am passing all my subjects
I attended a class
I found out who was the sen-
5. My professors all
ate president
like me
9. I want you to send something,
by Dr. Richard Curtis
That you and I would take hammer and spike and impale our
lovely Lord to a cross in unthinkable. But that we continue to crucify
Him, in devious and subtle ways is appallingly evident. Perhaps our
Roman Catholic friends have something in their observance of the
Mass, bearing testimony to the perpetual suffering of the Saviour.
For when He uttered "It is finished" He could not have implied that
in this twentieth century He does not continue to be "crucified afresh",
as the author of Hebrews puts it. (6:6).
The cross represented the climax of the most disturbing week
ever witnessed on this earth. By the same token, as we remember the
cripple by the pool waiting for the waters to be troubled that he might
be healed, we sense in the cross, blessing through disturbance. In-deed,
when the events of Holy Week cease to trouble us, we must con-fess
with Paul "we are of all men most miserable." Most of us will grant
that Christ became most real to us in the midst of profound distur-bance.
Yet we continue to avoid like poison those trying situations in
which He might continue to bolster us with the everlasting arm.
Now if there is any way we can be sure we are continuing to
crucify afresh the Son of God, it is by ostensibly partaking of the
benefits of the cross, and continuing to live as we always have. Could
we borrow H. G. Wells' time machine and travel back to Golgotha,
where would we find ourselves ? With the Pharisees ? Courageous resis-ters
of the encroaching heathenism, epitomized in their stand against
Antiochus Epiphanes and yet men in whom religion had crystallized
into brittle creeds and casuistry and who therefore could not fathom
the dynamic power of the Son of God. Of with the businessmen?
Shrewd opportunists who could spot a chance to "Make a kill" in
the money-changing connected with the temple sacrifices; who gave
lip-service to religion, but insisted that business was business. Or with
the politicians ? Astute and wily, doing what politicians are so careful
to do in every generation, just "playing it safe" and seeing which
way the wind blows before casting their decision. Or with Herod ?
Debonair, sophisticated, a regular fellow, but devoid of moral scrup-les.
Or with Judas ? Trusted disciple, keenly interested in the coming
Kingdom; but succumbing to disillusionment and betrayal. Or with the
Roman soldiers ? Strong, courageous, well disciplined and only doing
what soldiers are expected to do in any generation, "obeying orders".
Or with the crowd ? Prompted by the thought of rebellion if Jesus
were King, of Roman indemnities, perhaps bloodshed, doing "what
comes naturally" for crowds in every generation, just "going along
with the rest."
Where, pray tell, would you and I be ? • • • • •
Positive Responsibility
They say you are a Christian. Your friends, when they visit you,
call you a Christian and talk of themselves as Christians. But I never
quite know what they are saying. They seem embarrassed and un-comfortable
when I'm around, and when I'm in the next room they
seem to talk in a code.
It's been four years now since you stopped going to dances and
movies. At first I though it was just a phase, something you would
grow out of. I thought I would ignore the little things for a while.
Little things like having to have the car window open when someone
was smoking. You never coughed at smoke before. Little things like
making us wait for dinner, Sunday after Sunday, while you stood
around and talked at that church I didn't want you to go to. You used
to fit into the family so well.
We used to have so much fun together. You used to like to make
me laugh. But you changed, and in time the little things took away
from the fun. Little things like not letting me wear your coat because
you didn't want a tobacco smell on your clothes. The way you refused
to play anything but hymns when the relatives asked for piano music.
The way you turned up your nose when the neighbors offered you a
glass of beer. I've had to be forever apologizing for you, but you get
so mad if the ash trays are out when your friends come over.
You seem to have built a new life apart from me. You must
think it's a better life, because you act as if mine is no good, but
you've never said so.
They tell me you're a Christian, but you've never told me. Don't
you like me enough to mention it ? After all, who has a better right
to know than your mother ?
13. I am something of a campus
heroine since I
joined the U.S. party
started making root beer out
of hair tonic in the them
14. I have been coached by a fel-low
student named Joe every night
and as a result I am now
improving in my classwork
passing my tests
going steady
15. Well that's all for now. Please
note that with this letter I send
all my love
regards to the family
six pawn tickets that must
be paid
Your loving daughter,
Busy Bertha
Dear Editor:
When it became apparent that
Mr. Peterson wanted to return as
dormitory supervisor and that he
was still replaced (there is a
warmer word), by a woman who
gained her experience as a super-visor
in an old folks' home, Ed-gren
residents and other interest-er
parties rightly protested.
Since all the absurdities of the
situation have been well talked
out, it is almost needless to men-tion
that Mr. Peterson was not
told of the switch, that he is teach-ing
a full load now, and others.
But the biggest disappointment
to me is that this move is all part
of a new "reorganization plan."
The plan, it seems, has been ef-fected
in at least two ways: the
commonly known but unannounced
failure to renew the contracts of
two teachers, and the shifting of
Mr. Peterson, at least to some ex-tent
against his will.
I voice as strong a protest as a
letter to the editor can be for
these two actions. It is not alto-gether
pleasant to graduate from
a school you deeply appreciate
when you know that the school
discredits the teachers and super-visor
you immediately think of
when you think of your college
Allan .Stahnke
*Library Noise
Dear Editor:
Much has been said in the CLAR-ION
and in conversations about
the noise in the library. While
much of this is due to the stu-dents,
I feel some mention ought
to be made of what I consider to
be the cause of the most noise,
the library workers.
The librarians work in their of-fices
and talk out loud without
closing the doors. They type in the
same offices without closing the
doors. The female library workers
clack about with their high-heeled
shoes and don't even attempt to
walk softly. The cart for distribut-ing
returned books to the shelves
needs some oil for its wheels, as
does the swinging doors.
When a library list is made up,
the library assistants staple as
loudly as they can. Whoever (it
may be that) puts new cards in
the card file pulls the drawer-rod
in and out without consideration
for those who are studying.
I think that if blame is going
to be laid on anyone for library
noise, that it should be on the
library workers and librarians.
please send
my winter clothes
my fountain pen
my little black book
10. Last week my two room-mates
got together and
helped me with my homework
made me take a bath
caught me stealing
11. I have purchased, at a bargain
an automobile
a formal
a term paper
12. I got a letter from Marjorie,
the girl next door and please tell
thanks for the cookies
she can have him
I have the same problem (pri-vate
Now Open
(or we'll do it)
COLLO/2 r-NCE11E3.,
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Sizes: 9 - 15 10 -16
Falcon Heights
Home of the Charburger
Larpenteur and Snelling Avenues Open 6 am till 2 a.m.
Johnson and Barnes
Fairway Foods
599 N. Snelling Ave.
Mi 6-8621
Como and Snelling Ayes.
Monday-1 p.m. till 6 p.m.
Tues. - Sat.-8 a.m. fill 6 p,m,
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Falcon Heights
Pharmacy & Gift Shop
At a new and modern
1707 N. Snelling Ave.
Snelling and Larpenteur
MIdway 6-9185
Complete Lubrication — Towin
Brake Work ■M■IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIMIMIIIIIII.
Tuesday, April 30, 1957
the CLARION
Page 3
Royals Bow to Concordia Trackmen Capture
Triangular Meet with the sacks loaded. But it was
caught and with it went Bethel's
chances for that inning as well as
any life for the rest of the game.
After snow, freeze, and rain-outs,
Bethel finally opened its '57
baseball season with River Falls
teachers April 17 by dropping a
By the time Brunzell came in to 9-4 decision to them on their home
relieve wild-man Stahnke, the dam- field.
age had pretty well been done as
Bemidji bounced Bethel 11-3 at
Como park last Friday afternoon.
But even Brunzell, who looked
rather tired late in the game, gave
up four runs in the last three
Lawrence, the fellow who gave
the basketball team trouble last
winter continued to plague the
Royals as he pitched the first seven
innings and allowed only six hits.
Brunzell, in addition to pitch-ing
fine ball, layed down a bunt
safely and singled to lead the team
offensively. Thomas, who took
Stahnke's place in the batting or-der,
also drove out two hits, one
a triple that bounced past the
right fielder. Thomas' score, which The Royals picked up only four
followed the triple, was Bethel's hits, all singles, while River Falls
only earned run as Bemidji made rifled eleven including two triples
five errors. by Burgoyne their shortstop.
Bemidji Raps
Bethel 11-3
First Lost As
Baseball Opens
River Falls had to come from be-hind
as they gave the Royals four
runs in the first on a walk and
four errors. They picked up sin-gle
runs in the second, third and
fifth innings and went ahead to
stay in the sixth to stay with
three more.
The Royals were lucky they
were scored on only once in the
third as Brunzell temporarily lost
control and walked the first three
men he faced. But a triple play
from third, to second, to first, to
home cut down the rally with only
the one run scoring in the process.
At the Northwestern game, Jack
baseman jumps for the ball.
Amimil N. L. Hermes immil
1709 N. Snelling
Mi 4-1017
Mi 4-6270
Lubrication and Repairs
Snelling and Larpenteur
Mi 6-9179
Concordia, who always has a
team that out-hustles Bethel on
the diamond, gratefully accepted
the victory that Bethel handed
them last Saturday at Concordia.
The Royals combined poor pitch-ing,
poorer fielding, and poorest
thinking to show Concordia that
games can be lost in dozens of
The Royals committed only ten
errors as every member of the in-field,
the pitchers, and one out-fielder
had kicking practice.
Their were a few bright spots
in the defeat; two to be exact.
Tierney tagged a homer in the
ninth to continue a good hitting
season, and Art Erickson, although
he made two errors, filled in very
well at third. He had four put-outs,
two assists, and hustle right
to the end.
The Royals nicked Comet pitcher
Gundermann for only three hits,
one of them a bunt. There was one
other well tagged ball, a line out
to the center fielder by Albright
Team Scores
16-3 Victory
Bob Pommeranke's 14 strike out
performance, backed up by a 13
hit attack, gave Bethel its seventh
straight baseball victory over
Northwestern April 24, at Dun-ning
field. The final score was 16-
The Royals' attack was led by
Ken Albright who had three hits
including a homer in the fourth
with two on. Tierney drove out two
A sad note was added to the
game when Les Borms re-injured
his finger and will be out the rest
of the season. He was hitting and
fielding very well until he was
hurt again.
1692 North Lexington Ave.
(in the Plaza)
Starter and Generator
Engine Repairs
Midway 6-9153 1588 Como
10% Discount to Students
O'Neill's Wee-Wash-It
1558 COMO AVE. (at Snelling)
Cleaners and Launderers
15 Bendix Washers and Dryers
for your convenience
1658 N. Snelling at
Quality Hair-cutting
1646 W. Larpentuer
Competing against Concordia and
Northwestern last Thursday, the
Royal track squad piled up 64
points to capture first in the meet.
Northwestern gained 52 points and
Concordia 41 in the Bethel triumph
which was a team victory with
nearly all the tracksters placing in
Placing cindermen for Bethel in
the single exercises were: Don
Becker, first, and Stu Luckman,
fourth, in shot putt; Don Becker,
Slips By
Tennis Team
The Royal netmen were not quite
at hot as the weather last Thurs-day
when Northwestern college
slipped by them in a close 4-3
Ed Tegenfeldt, playing the num-ber
two position, appeared to be
the most valuable Bethel player,
winning in the single matches
along with Don Sension. Bethel
gained their game through the ef-forts
of the double team of Dick
Benert and Sension.
However, losing in a number
of close battles, in which the tide
could have turned either way, were
Al Mesko, Dick Benert, and Ed
Holzhouse in the single events and
the Mesko-Tegenfeldt double team.
As a whole, this year's team is
well balanced, having no glaring
weak spots. With weather finally
here that is fit for practicing, the
team looks for a fairly successful
Down Town
Shopping In
Your Neighborhood
Gray's Drugs
Snelling & Larpenteur
Winfrey's Variety
Your Neighborhood
Variety Store
1532 Larpenteur Mi 4-7849
first, and Stu Luckman, third, in
discus throwing; Jim Jackson,
first, and Ron Olson, fourth, in
broad jump; Jim Jackson, third, in
high jump; and Al Christensen,
first in pole jump vault.
Points gained in running were
by Wally Sholdt, third, high hur-dles;
Ron Olson, second, 100 yd.
dash; Wayne Henry, third, mile
run; Al Carlson, fourth, 440 yd.
dash; Jim Jackson, second, low
hurdles; Roger Olson, second, 220
yd. dash; Beryl Munson, first,
Wayne Henry, third, Bob Johnson,
fourth, in 880 yd. run; Ron Olson,
Roger Olson, Stu Luckman, and
Jim Jackson, first in 880 yd. relay;
and Jim Jackson, Ron Olson, Roger
Olson, and Beryl Munson, second,
in sprint medley relay.
In their second meet of the year,
Fredrickson's track men garned 8
points in the Carleton relays. The
meet included twelve teams and
was held on April 16. Both the
sprint medley and two mile relay
teams captured fourth places in
their events to place Bethel ninth
in the competion.
Macalester college plays host to
Bethel, Hamline, and Augsburg
today in the Royals fourth track
meet. The quadrangular tourney
will begin at 3:30 p.m.
Bethel Golfers
Drop Opener
Hamline university's golf team
dealt a staggering blow to our
Royal players when they picked up
11 1/2 of the total 15 points at last
Friday's meet.
Teeing off for Bethel at the
Como golf course were Bill Conrad,
scoring 2 1/2 points, Dave Davies,
scoring 1 point, Joel Stolte, Chuck
Elven, and Al Christensen.
Today the team will pair off
against Concordia college at
It Pays to Look Neat
Midtown Barber Shop
634 Snelling Ave.
Tierney slides under as the third
.2ecio. Cate
Italian Foods — American Foods
Orders to take out
1611 W. Larpenteur at Snelling MI 5-2424
Dr. Karlis Leyasmeyer (right) chats after convocation with Presi-dent
Carl Lundquist (center) and Dr. Robert Smith.
K. C. Cornelius Jewelers
324 Kresge Bldg.
7th and Nicollet
Fe 5-6940
Open Sunday 11:30 a.m. 'til 8:00 p.m.
Week-days 5:00 p.m. 'til 9:00 p.m.
(Closed Tuesday)
Snelling & Larpenteur Ave.
Open evenings
till 10:00
1556 Como Ave. MI 6-9295
Ladies' and Men's Apparel
in Falcon Heights
1540 West Larpenteur
MIdway 5-1364
Tune-up — Brake Service
Tubeless Tires and Repair
Westlund's Food
Market, Inc.
597 N. Snelling Ave.
MIdway 6-8621
Midtown Cleaners
Discount to Students
Finest Cleaning in Town
1672 N. Hamline HU 9-7300
1544 West Larpenteur
Deposits insured to $10,000 by the
Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation
Page 4 the CLARION Tuesday, April 30, 1957
'Flower Lane' Is Theme Explanation Given
By Student Senate
For BWA Banquet May 1
On World Problems
"Flower Lane" is the theme of
the B.W.A. semi-formal banquet
which will be held tomorrow at
6:30 p.m. in the dining hall.
Participating in the program of
the banquet which is in honor of
the women graduates will be mem-bers
of the graduating class. Mar-ilyn
Hagstrom will sing and each
of the graduating students will
tell what she plans to do follow-ing
Also included in the program
will be the candlelight installation
service for next year's officers
and the introduction of past BWA
officers by Miss Effie Nelson,
BWA advisor.
This banquet celebrates the
twentieth consecutive year of
BWA activities.
"All women students, faculty
women, faculty wives, and student
FMF Will Interview
Missionary Candidates
To acquaint students with the
procedure of missionary appoint-ment,
a mock interview of mis-sionary
candidates by a mission
board and field council will be
featured at the F.M.F. meeting
to be held Thursday, May 2, at 7
p.m. in the seminary chapel.
Serving as board and council
members in the program, which is
the first of its kind sponsored by
the F.M.F., will be the Rev. Wal-fred
Danielson, lecturer in mis-sions
in the seminary, and mis-sionaries
on furlough. The candi-dates
to be interviewed are the
Rev. Russell Johnson and his wife,
newly appointed missionaries.
May 6 Workshop
For DVBS, Camp
Daily vacation Bible school and
camping workshop meetings will
be held on both May 6 and 8, at
7 p.m., in the college chapel.
On May 6, Rev. Lee Kingsley,
director of religious education for
the Minnesota Baptist conference
and director of Big Trout Lake
Bible camp, will lecture at a joint
meeting of those interested in these
On the second date, Mrs. Harold
Paulson, a writer in Sunday School
and vacation Bible school work,
will teach those interested in this
field while Rev. Kingsley will meet
with those that will work in camp-ing.
The meetings are open to any-one
who would desire to work in
either of these fields.
Milton Christensen, director of
Christian service, stated that "All
those who intend to go out this
summer in this type of work are
particularly encouraged to attend."
Academy Of Science
Meets At Rochester
Saturday, May 4, the Minnesota
Academy of Science will meet at
Rochester, Minnesota.
Guided tours of parts of Mayo
clinic, science exhibits, and the
reading of scientific papers will
comprise the three types of acti-vities
of the conference.
Fields of study included in the
Minnesota Academy of Science are
physics, chemistry, mathematics,
botony, zoology, geology, geogra-phy,
and social studies.
Any students interested in at-tending
the conference should con-tact
Elving Anderson, Dean of
Students, in the Student Affairs
wives are urged to attend," said
Lois Larson, BWA president.
Tickets are $1.50 per person or
50 cents with the meal ticket.
12 Students
To Present
Music Recital
On May 6, twelve college stu-dents
will be featured at a general
music recital in the college chapel
at 6:30 p.m.
Audrey Buckley, Annette Bur-gess,
Albin Carlson, Orleen Ro-berts,
and Karen Westlund are the
vocalists on the program.
Piano selections will be present-ed
by Gordon Becker, Maria Cheng,
Gay Feiler, Kay Kern, Marilyn
Laughlin, Gardia Lee, and Bud
The recital is open to the public.
Last night, Bill MacKinney and
J. Robert Carlson gave a joint
vocial-piano recital.
Etchings, Drypoints
Exhibited In Lounge
Some original Rembrandt, Durer,
and Van Dyck etchings and dry-points
are in the art collection
now on exhibit in the student
Dr. Robert Smith, with the con-sent
of Dubuque University and
Mrs. E. B. Lindsay, was instru-mental
in obtaining the pictures
for this exhibit.
The display is part of the large
art collection of the late Edwin B.
Lindsay of Davenport, Iowa.
Mr. Lindsay was associated with
Dubuque University for over 22
years as a member of the board
of directors and was also active in
the Presbyterian church there.
On May 3, Bethel will be host
to the Minnesota Conference on
Social Work Education, a combina-tion
of college sociology and social
work instructors and sociology de-partment
heads meeting with rep-resentatives
of agencies interested
in hiring social workers.
Miss Betty Danielson, social
work insructor at Bethel and a
member of the Executive commit-tee
of the conference, stated that
topics to be discussed at the con-ference
will include curriculum
planning for students, placement
of students in the field of social
work, and methods of interesting
enough students in social work to
supply the demand.
According to its constitution, the
purpose of this conference, which
was organized in 1938, is "to
serve as a forum for the discus-sion
of pre-professional and pro-fessional
education for social work
and to engage in such activities
as shall advance, promote and
1558 Como Ave. 11 STRANDQUIST
Hamline and Hoyt Mi 6-9272
Brake and Mechanical Work
Towing Service
An explanation of the violation
of the Bethel Student Association
constitution in the election of Hope
Seffens, junior, as Recording Sec-retary
of the '57-'58 Student Sen-ate
was given at the April 17
Senate meeting.
In Article VI, Section IV, the
constitution states, "Notice of the
election and the recommendations
of the nominating committee shall
be posted on the college and sem-inary
bulletin boards at least one
week prior to the day of election."
However, the Senate posted
Hope's name in place of Lynn
Weaver, sophomore, who withdrew
from the election, on the Monday
preceding the election, five days
prior to the day of election.
Reasons given by the Senate
for this action were: 1. The per-son
who withdrew had been pre-sented
in chapel a week prior to
the election. 2. No other nomina-tions
were made from the floor at
that time. 3. Posting of the new
candidate for a week would have
required postponing the election
date which had already been an-nounced.
The senate decided that in this
particular case the above adjust-ment
would be fair and legal but
added that if any students are
greatly dissatisfied a revote will
be taken.
Summer Jobs
Now Available
Mr. Milton Christensen, director
of Christian Service and employ-ment,
has announced that there
are several job openings for the
These include opportunities for
construction workers and typists
in particular.
strengthen social work education."
Membership in the conference is
of three types: individuals engag-ed
in social work teaching or prac-tice,
social work agencies, and col-leges
and universities which have
social work courses.
Dr. David Moberg, chairman of
the Department of Social Sciences
at Bethel, is treasurer of the or-ganization.
Human selfishness prevents solu-tions
to world problems in politi-cal,
economic, and social areas,
emphasized Dr. Karlis Leyasmeyer,
hitting the pivotal point in his
lecture, "Causes and Prospects of
the Present World Predicament,"
at convocation last Wednesday.
"Experience has brought me
through the whirlpool of history,"
said the Latvian-born speaker, pre-facing
his lecture with an account
of his imprisonment under the
Nazis and escape from a Commun-ist
firing squad. He also commend-ed
the International Christian
Leadership corporation, by whom
he is sponsored.
What is happening today, said
Leyasmeyer, is the "tragic march
of society to the precipice of des-truction."
We are in this predica-ment
because, along with the
science and technology, which has
made it possible for us to build
a strong world, there has not been
an accompanying influence on hu-man
nature "to make it pursue the
right course."
Peace efforts, from student
movements to the League of Na-tions
and the United Nations, are
futile in themselves, he insisted,
and will end in tragedy because
we are trying to build a new na-tion
with old men.
"We have educated our minds,
but we still have the cave man's
heart," he declared, quoting a man
whom he designated as an agnos-tic.
"We must find means to
change the cave man's heart or
we perish."
The only way of producing this
change in the heart, said Leyas-meyer,
quoting Toynbee, is through
true religion. This, he urged, is
the only way to stop Communism
and the breakdown of American
civilization, which he compared to
the decay of the Roman Empire.
Describing his personal exper-ience,
he exulted in the power of
Christ, which made him ready for
martyrdom at the hands of the
Communists, and which transform-ed
his life.
The Nazis and Communists knew
perfectly well that Christianity
must be stifled, he continued, il-lustrating
their tactics. But the
persecution of the Russians, which
he described, has the unexpected
result of a hundred-fold increase
in church members.
"We say we can't outwin the
Communists. That is not true; we
can," he insisted, referring to the
extraordinary activity of the Rus-sian
Christians during the early
days of persecution.
Dr. Leyasmeyer concluded with
a direct appeal to the audience:
"You say you are Christians; you
have power then. To how many
have you brought it ? The world is
Social Work Conference
Will Meet On Campus
1583 Hamline Avenue North
MIdway 6-2034
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subset: commoncrawl


text:
Attorney General Lockyer's Task Force on Domestic Violence holds Hearing in Los Angeles
June 3, 2004
(916) 324-5500
(LOS ANGELES) Attorney General Bill Lockyer's Task Force on Local Criminal Justice Response to Domestic Violence today in Los Angeles held its third regional hearing on local policies and programs related to domestic violence.
"California leads the nation in its efforts to stop the cycle of domestic violence, yet we still have too many cases of abuse in the home," Lockyer said. "These regional hearings are providing valuable information on what is happening at the local level. The task force will work to standardize and strengthen local practices so we can stop the violence in our homes."
During the hearing, testimony and public comments were taken on four issues: How domestic violence restraining orders are obtained and enforced; how law enforcement agencies respond to mandated reports of domestic violence by health care practitioners; how courts, probation and batterer intervention programs hold batterers accountable; and how prosecutors' offices handle misdemeanor domestic violence cases.
The task force has been meeting throughout the state since December 2003 to examine how well local criminal justice agencies respond to and deal with domestic violence issues, identify programs that work well and determine how to improve efforts to protect and prevent family violence. Among those scheduled to testify today were experts from criminal justice agencies, the medical field and victim-advocacy groups in the Los Angeles region.
Lockyer's decision to appoint the task force was prompted in part by the findings of a recent study he and Sen. Sheila Kuehl, D-Santa Monica, commissioned to determine the effectiveness of laws and practices aimed at reducing domestic violence. Published in June 2003, the 51-page Senate Office of Research report showed that while California has taken critical steps to protect domestic violence victims, a comprehensive assessment of those efforts is still needed.
The 25-member task force is composed of representatives of local and state law enforcement agencies, probation officers, prosecutors, public defenders, judges, domestic violence victims' advocates and public health officials. The task force will submit a report to the Attorney General describing current practices, identifying critical needs, highlighting successful approaches and proposing possible legislative changes.
Domestic violence statistics collected by Lockyer's Department of Justice show California local law enforcement agencies received 196,569 domestic violence-related calls for assistance in 2002. During that same year, there were 153 murders committed as a result of intimate partner violence and 50,479 juveniles and adults were arrested for spousal abuse under Penal Code section 273.5.
Additional information about the Attorney General's efforts to combat domestic violence is available at the Attorney General's Crime and Violence Prevention Center web site at www.safestate.org. A list of the task force members may be viewed at http://www.safestate.org/index.cfm?navid=386


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My daily Apple blog for Computerworld
- The Mac is becoming an iPad accessory April 24, 2019I've reached that point in using both a Mac and an iPad when I regularly find myself pointing at the Mac's screen to get work done. I think that's a turning point.The future of the Mac I've been using both Apple's platforms side by side since the 2010 iPad shipped. At that time, the iPad […]
- 6 best note-taking apps for an Apple iPad April 23, 2019We all need to take notes, and these six note-taking apps all have their own unique advantages, particularly when used with Apple Pencil.The app you've got: Apple Notes Apple's Notes app works quite well with an Apple Pencil, but it is quite limited compared with the more full-featured choices in this collection. You can use […]
- 16+ iPhone tips to get things done faster April 19, 2019I'm attempting to put together an attempt at a definitive list of useful but fast tips to get things done quicker and better on an iPhone. Here are some of my favorites.Siri everything Siri is the fastest way to open an app. It's the fastest way to open Settings for an app – just ask […]
- How your enterprise can help reduce e-waste April 18, 2019In an effort to help with the huge e-waste problem, Apple now offers a global recycling scheme. In the U.S., it has quadrupled the extent of the program by putting Daisy recycling robots in Best Buy stores across the country.The same machine is also being put in KPN stores in the Netherlands.In a press release, […]
- Thoughts on the Apple/Qualcomm settlement April 17, 2019I wrote on the substance of the Apple/Qualcomm agreement already, so this is just a selection of thoughts/reactions to the surprise settlement of the Apple/Qualcomm litigation.Intel leaves the modem business Apple's announcement that it reached a deal with Qualcomm was surprising enough, but this was soon followed by news that Intel is shuttering its own 5G […]
- Apple settles with Qualcomm - the 5G iPhone looks more real (u) April 16, 2019In a completely unexpected twist to what was shaping up to be a colossally dull never-ending global lawsuit, Apple and Qualcomm have reached a settlement that means both sides can work together, at least for the next six years.Apple settles with Qualcomm The two companies announced their new détente in a press release, titled: "Qualcomm […]
- 19+ brilliant Apple Watch tricks and tips April 16, 2019You wear it daily, might be slightly obsessive about the Activity app, but are you getting everything you can from using your Apple Watch?Check the time No one likes people who check the time in the middle of a meeting, even though everyone does it. Apple Watch lets you check the time surreptitiously – just […]
- 12+ essential iPad productivity tips April 15, 2019If you use your iPad to get things done, then you may want to review this short collection of iPad productivity tips.Use Dictation to write You see that little microphone button to the left of the Space bar? Tap this and you can dictate your message using Siri.Siri for Settings If you are using an […]
- 15 business ideas you can steal from Apple April 12, 2019"We've always been shameless about stealing great ideas," Apple's Steve Jobs famously said.So, which of Apple's ideas about how to run a business can you steal to make your business better? Here's some suggestions.Consistency takes discipline Consider Apple's track record. Ever since the iMac, it has delivered consistently important products: iTunes, iPod, iPhone, iPad, Apple […]
- Will Apple need to spin out its services business? April 11, 2019Following a complaint from Spotify, Apple faces EU anti-trust investigation to determine if it unfairly favors its own apps above those from its competitors.The whole widget The problem appears to be two-fold:Competing services such as Spotify resent paying Apple a percentage on subscription and digital item sales. Competitors also argue that the built-in nature of […]


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myVermont.gov Account
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Population: 608,827
Land Area: 9,620 sq mi
Percent Water: 3.8%
Population Density: 65.8/sq mi
Capital: Montpelier
Largest City: Burlington
Highest Point: Mt. Mansfield
Lowest Point: Lake Champlain
More Facts and Figures
President Calvin Coolidge was the only president born on the fourth of July. Born in Plymouth on July 4th, 1872.


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Here is my layout I created with Imaginisce's Sole Sisters collection and Itty Bitty pins and buttons from My Little Bit of Whimsy:
I love the Itty Bitty pins, especially the sweet little birds! I even used the blue flower pin and the purse pin as centers of flowers by pulling out the pins!!
I also made this fun little card using a My Little Bit of Whimsy button and some twine to make a closure for the purse.
Next on the hop is the talented Anita's blog, hop on over to see her beautiful handmade creations. Oh, and you can win some great prizes too!! To win you
- must comment on each designer's blog INCLUDING the company blogs
- you'll get additional entries for following Imaginisce & MLBOW company blogs
- and another additional entry for following Imaginisce & MLBOW Facebook pages
xo Mary Ann


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May Day! May Day! May Day!
The Fremont Arts Council wants you to join them for a celebration this Sunday, May 1st between 3-10pm for May Day. FAC is taking over the field to play games, dance, sing, and weave the May-pole!
You can join the fun at the park entrance near Aurora and 60th, next to the horseshoe courts (see PDF of the park here).
Feel free to bring a dish, beverages or tableware to share and bring flowers and natural materials for creating head wreaths. Wearing white is also encouraged.
Volunteers are needed, so if you're interested contact Rodman at rodman (at) rodmanstudio (dot) com.


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D. Reck (14-Years-Old / Young Dolla Artist) - So Official [Rugrats Sample]
*WSHH & Dj Ill Will Exclusive*
DJ Ill Will Presents D-Reck - So Official (Young Dolla Artist signed to Hot Dollar & Guerilla Blacks Imprint Dollar Figga/Young Dolla). Ill reports "14 yr old D-Reck has the high schools in LA goin crazy with this smash record with The Rugrats Sample!!"
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Ashden Awards Shine Spotlight on Energy Innovations from Island States
D&E Green Enterprises: Saving Energy and the Forest in Haiti through Improved Cookstoves
If you live on an island in the ocean, energy and climate issues come together in a palpable way. Most small island developing states depend heavily on imported fossil fuels, especially diesel, for their power. For remote islands, in the Pacific for example, the fuel must be shipped over long distances. It's expensive, the supply is limited and intermittent, and paying for it stretches government budgets. Because of this, low-income families and communities often rely instead on kerosene, and wood or other biomass for lighting and cooking.


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Apple's moving the earth for its iCloud site in Reno, NevadaWhile work progresses on Apple's third data center in Prineville, Ore., a massive fourth facility is being constructed near Reno, Nev. AppleInsider offers an exclusive look at the heavy machinery clearing space for a major new data center building designed to host Apple's iTunes, App Store and other iCloud online services.
Other segments in this series have looked at Apple's commitment to building the world's greenest data centers, the company's jump start in construction at its Reno data center site, the massive scope of site preparation, the sophisticated water technology being installed and the futuristic data conduits that deliver iCloud's digital packets at the speed of light.
Lots of land for Apple's data center expansion
On Wednesday AppleInsider outlined the early completion of an initial structure built on the site of Apple's Reno Technology Park project. That small facility is the proverbial tip of the iceberg.
Apple has reserved a central section of 345 acres (outlined in blue, above) within the 2,200-acre Reno Technology Park (highlighted in white) to build a vast new data center now under construction. It will be the third Apple has built itself and the fourth that the company operates in the US.
For comparison, the company's Cupertino, Calif., corporate headquarters at Infinite Loop sits on just 32 acres, and the new "spaceship" Apple Campus 2 will be built on 175 acres, roughly half of the size of the company's recently acquired Nevada parcel.
The first data center Apple built, in Maiden, N.C., sits on 183 acres (Apple has also purchased an additional 70 acres next to it), and the Prineville site sits on 160 acres. This means Apple has already allocated enough land in Nevada to double its developed (or under development) data center acreage.
Apple's total acreage reserved for known data centers in the U.S. (758 acres) is nearly the size of New York City's Central Park (800 acres), about three quarters the size of San Francisco's Golden Gate Park (at just over 1000 acres) and nearly seven times the area of the Vatican (110 acres).
Of course, the locations Apple chose for its data centers are all far more appropriate locations for the massive buildings full of servers and vast arrays of solar panels (which currently cover about half of the original Maiden site).
Nevada site was being used for... dirt
Prior to being planned out as the Reno Technology Park just a few years ago, the land Apple is now using in Nevada was primarily used to "pound sand", as the area is covered with sediment dirt that's useful in construction. On top of the sand there's a littering of black chunks of volcanic rock (below).
There's no nearby volcanoes, however. All that rock was carried hundreds of miles to the site by glaciers, resulting in a stark desert landscape that supports little more than the patches of grass and brush that can survive under the hot dry summers and cold winters of the arid climate.
South of the new tech park is the existing 107,000-acre Tahoe Reno Industrial Center, which hosts a variety of manufacturing and power generation facilities and serves a logistics hub for the Western US, including shipping centers for PetSmart, Toys-R-Us and Walmart. The site bills itself as "the largest industrial center in the world."
One main attraction to the area is that nothing goes on there: It's rated by the Department of Homeland Security as within America's largest "Safety Zone," given that it is "minimally seismically active," experiences little threat from tsunamis, hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, or ice storms, and is located far away from any nuclear power plants.