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What are the odds of succeeding without a record deal?
I found an interesting Blog post the other day that seemed to cause major disagreement between musicians on the subject of record deals, specifically whether musicians needed a record deal at all nowadays. The original Blog was entitled, Do Social Networks Really Help Musicians? It makes the point (in a round-a-bout way) that social networks create so much opportunity for musicians that overcrowding, by and large, negates the benefits for the masses.
The underlying assertion of the Blog was that the power of social networks for band 'self promotion' was generally over rated and could not be compared with the benefits of a record deal, (especially where earning a sustainable income was concerned).
The author went on to showcase three websites that he felt helped reduce overcrowding and thus create more tangible opportunities for musicians. You can view the Blog on the Music-Think-Tank website here: Do Social Networks Really Help Musicians?
For me, the Blog caused confusion because it didn't present the underlying question succinctly enough. I have to confess, I was tempted to leave a comment to stock up debate further by asking a wishy washy question like, "what is success?", but I decided instead to exercise the logical and analytical side of my brain by putting together some kind of statistical analysis on the record label vs DIY musician debate.
You may have noticed that the Blog I mention above has prompted a follow up Blog called "Do Social Networks Really Help Musicians? Revisited". This follow up failed to deliver in some areas of the debate in my mind. I explain at the bottom of this Blog why I wrote this article.
Let's begin! The question I want to answer is clear and concise; "What are the odds of succeeding without a record deal?"
Before we look at figures, we need to start by reducing any ambiguity surrounding certain facets of the question. I will make the following assumptions;
The word 'Success':
To succeed means many different things to different people, including notoriety, personal development, the number of 'Likes' on a facebook page etc, but for the purpose of this exercise I am using the word 'Success' to describe a level of financial freedom.
My reasoning for this is because most musicians (eventually) give up their art, not due to a lack of notoriety, but due to long periods with little or no income.
Type of musician:
When I speak of 'musician' or 'band', I am referring exclusively to those who are seeking a professional music career. I understand that there are thousands of musicians who happily play in a band every other weekend without ever thinking of fame or fortune, but this research paper refers to those musicians who aspire to reach a level of fame performing their own original music.
Record deal:
A "Record Deal" means either a major or independent label that has a reasonable marketing budget (and knowledge) to create a national buzz.
This research paper is written with the UK musician in mind. However, it's findings may loosely translate to USA musicians and other territories.
So, with that all cleared up we have to start with the question, is it possible to quantify the need for a record label at all? Probably not, but it's fun to assert some basic statistical data into the argument posed on the Music-Think-Tank Blog here.
Unfortunately there is very little 'official' data online relating to some aspects of this research paper so please bare with me as I fill the data gaps with 'most likely', and 'probable' substitutes.
What is a successful band?
Our definition of success refers to a level of financial income, all other notions of success will be too subjective to work in this research paper. So what is a successful amount of money?
I will start by placing the average UK income (for a person between the age of 18 and 30) at £18,200 (based on several recognised national statistics)*. The reason I chose this age range is because it's the most common range for success in the music industry.
So, for the purpose of this exercise £18,200 will be used as the definition of 'financial success'.
This amount of money is of course conservative because one would expect 'success' to be way above 'average', but we will stick with it for now. The definition of success 'should' only apply to those bands that can sustain the average income value for more than 5 years. But for simplicity we will accept even a one-off yearly income of £18,200 as a marker of success.
Quick answer to question: £18,200 is our marker of success.
How many musicians and bands in the UK are aiming for success?
This is much harder to quantify. The Musicians Union have approximately 30,000 members. Since they pay a subscription fee we will assume they are serious and aiming for a degree of success. It is my estimation from talking to countless 'serious' bands over the years that perhaps only 1 in 20 musicians join the MU. This would immediately raise the number of musicians aiming for success in the UK to 600,000.
Quick answer to question: 600,000
Income from gigs
Since we are describing 'Success' as achieving a gross annual income of £18,200/year (per band member), live gigs must surely play a key role in this. We will not include covers bands, wedding or corporate events bands. For the purpose of this research paper we will use the term 'band/musician' for those who want recognition for their own original music.
The average capacity for a venue that houses mainly unsigned bands is 250 in the UK.* The majority of venues will increase ticket sales by hosting 3-6 bands (on average). Assuming that a venue is 80% full and has 4 bands performing, each band would therefore have bought 50 people.
After speaking with approximately 30 diverse bands from London, I have estimated that the average band brings in much less than 50 paying fans on average. I will be setting the average paying fan count (per gig) to just 15.
Bare in mind that this would be the average number of paying fans that turn up to every gig, whether in the bands local town or 500 miles away. Many bands will bring 40 fans to local gigs but find fan counts drop dramatically the further afield they play.
There are several ways that bands can be paid by venue promoters. The average payment however seems to work out at about £6 per fan.
There is no data on the average band size, but I am setting a generic band size of 4 people so that we can work the statistics.
With these assumptions we can see that the average band will be paid £90 per gig (£22.50 for each band member). Based on two (2) gigs per week, the gross yearly income for each member would be £2,340, far lower than the UK average wage. This also pays no mention of travel costs or gear hire etc.
Gigs generally provide more income for signed bands than the sale of records. In fact, the number of people going to gigs has increased over the last 10 years, whilst record sales have decreased. Ticket sales can generate huge incomes for large music acts.
Let's look at a Robbie Williams gig in August 2003. He performed at Knebworth with 3 other acts and 125,000 tickets were sold. I am not sure on the ticket price but I will set the average tickets sale price at £45. That means on one night they generated a colossal £5,625,000. This doesn't even factor in the sale of programs, merchandise, food etc.
Quick answer to question: £2,340 per year (per band member)
Money from downloads
The UK average monthly income is £1,517. How many downloads would a band need to sell in order to reach this figure? Assuming, once again, that there are four (4) band members, they would need to make a total of £6,068 per month to match the UK average income amount.
If selling exclusively on iTunes (which pays roughly 60p per single download), a band would need to achieve 10,113 downloads each month. This would equate to 2528 per week.
I am guessing the 'average' amount that an unsigned band makes from downloads is £10/month (per band member). If we add £120 from downloads to the £2,340 from gigs, we can guess that the average band member makes £2,460/year.
Quick answer to question:: £120 per year (per band member)
How many unsigned bands make the Top 40?
So how can we tell how many unsigned bands do reach the golden figure of £18,200/year (per band member)? I think the issue here is overall band 'reach', ie. how many fans a band can sell tickets, downloads and merchandise to.
Reaching the UK Top 40, for example, shows a clear indication that a band would have a substantial fan base.
So, it begs the question, how many bands have reached the top 40 without a record deal in last 5 years?
In the last 5 years (2006-11) I estimate that there have been no more than 20 bands reach the top 40 without record label backing. This figure is a guess, but is backed up by Ditto music, who are one of the few companies that have successfully broken unsigned acts in the UK.
Ditto go on to suggest that, "without record label backing, you would need substantial financial backing to have a serious shot in the industry".
So why such a low figure? Mark Robinson, vice-president of Warner Music said that "on average, it costs £621,000 to promote and launch a new band". This marketing budget would be out of reach for almost all bands.
Certainly, there have been many bands who have succeeded with far lower budgets than this, but breaking an act is undeniably costly. PR plays a role in this cost. A band cannot make it to the higher levels without having media contacts. The whole process is much more time consuming and involved than many musicians think. Unless you employ someone with media contacts and experience many marketing avenues will simply not be available to the average band.
Recording, touring, promotion and PR costs add up. Most DIY musicians struggle to turn enough profit to fund growth and fail to gain enough exposure to generate real momentum.
Quick answer to question: 20 bands
How many unsigned bands make £18,200/year?
We have made a guess that (20) unsigned bands managed to reach the UK top 40 in the last (5) years. Let's assume that just (5) of those bands earned £18,200/year (per band member) in the year that they charted.
Let's also assume that ten (10) more bands in the UK have generated £18,200/year (per band member), this would give us a total of just (15) unsigned bands that earned £18,200/year (per band member).
Sounds dismally low right? I'll admit that there is precious little data to go on, but do you know any bands making this kind of money who are unsigned? Remember, an original four piece band would therefore need to generate £72,800 per year to qualify, I am guessing that is extremely rare.
With the information outlined above we can begin to answer the question, "What are the odds of succeeding without a record deal?"
The chances of an unsigned band earning £18,200/year (per band member) without a record deal is 0.00025%. (Assuming there are 600,000 unsigned bands in the UK and only fifteen (15) earn £18,200 per year (per band member).
Quick answer to question: 15
Increasing the odds of being successful in music
I feel that this article may give a disproportionate indication of how hard it is to succeed in the music businesses because we are looking at averages. Whilst music is subjective, a good song is (usually) recognised as such by multiple people. This means there is an element is "objectivity" at play. In other words, a band with great music will have much better odds than an 'average' band (assuming all other factors such as determination, consistency etc are equal).
So, what action can a band take to increase their chances of success in an overcrowded market? I will revert back to the Music-Think-Tank Blog once more and agree with the author that moving against the crowd can in some cases be very advantageous.
Creating music that is of high quality, yet different in some respects will instantly give you a unique selling point (USP), which is very important in standing out in a saturated market.
What are the odds of getting signed?
The problem with statistics (where unique talent is concerned) is that they can often be way off.
For example, let's look at the likelihood of securing a record deal in the UK. We will assume the following;
There are roughly 700 independent record labels in the UK large enough to 'break an act'
Each signs 1 acts per year
There are 600,000 bands vying for their attention
1 in every 4 acts signed make £18,200/year (per band member)
Assuming you are average, you would therefore have a 1 in 3428 chance of being signed (0.029%). However, lets make some further assumptions on the quality of the song submissions;
34% of song submissions are not right for the label (wrong genre etc)
39% of song submissions are of low quality
10% of song submissions are not considered for other reasons
17% of song submissions are considered for signing
This would mean that talented bands would have a more attractive 1 in 582 chance of getting signed. Of course, the record label would be looking for much more than a good song, ability to perform live, being nice people and reliability etc would all go into the decision making process.
Another huge factor in getting signed is getting noticed. Many A&R will not be able to listen to all demo submissions. This would provide a strong argument for submitting multiple demos to a wide range of record labels.
Quick answer to question: 1 in 3428 (for an average band)
Chances of getting signed through a Pitching website
The Music-Think-Tank Blog mentioned 3 websites that the author felt could increase the chances of getting spotted by the music industry. Those websites were, Audio Rokit, Band Camp and Sound Cloud.
Audio Rokit is a 'Song Pitching' website.* A basic profile page is free, a full subscription starts at £6.99 per month which gives members access to the listed opportunities. There is no charge for each song submission a member makes.
Bandcamp gives bands the means to sell music online. The basic service is free, there are no signup costs, and no subscription fees. Bandcamp make money via a 15% revenue share on sales. In May 2011 Bandcamp artists made $624,572 USD.
SoundCloud is an online audio platform for music professionals that makes it easy to share and comment on audio files. As well as a free membership tier, SoundCloud has several different annual premium paid subscriptions which offer additional functionality.
*Effectively a song pitching site will show it's members current opportunities that exist within the music industry and make it easier for them to submit (or pitch) music to those opportunities.
With relation to this article I decided to take a closer look at these websites to see if any data could be gathered.
It makes sense that using a song pitching website would increase the odds of getting spotted by the industry.
We discussed earlier that ordinarily many A&R will not be able to listen to all demo submissions, especially those that are unsolicited. Pitching websites however, have (in theory) secured legitimate listings from record labels (and a variety of other music companies) that are actively in search of new talent. This would therefore put weight behind the argument that pitching websites dramatically increase the chances of a band being listened to and spotted.
I managed to glean (after many telephone conversations with pitching sites) that the average percentage of members that get their music listened to by A&R is about 85% (very loose estimate) and the average percentage of members that end up signing a deal using a pitching service is about 1% (even looser estimate).
The main problem that pitching sites have in providing useful data is that they are not always aware when one of their members has success. I took the total number of successful feedbacks and added 20% to get the figures above. I can not give a success rate for individual websites because my figures may not be 100% accurate and thus would be unfair.
If it is true that 1% of artists sign a deal (record, management or publishing) using a song pitching website, that would suggest that the pitching website would increase the odds of success by 34 times, or 3400% (compared to an equivalent band submitting unsolicited music via email or post).
I find it hard to believe that 1 in 100 bands get signed using pitching websites, but even if I were to slash the success rate by half, that would still make song pitching sites a pretty indispensable tool for musicians.
Quick answer to question: 1 in 200 (for an average band)
Chances of success through Bandcamp/SoundCloud
I would love to be able to give you some data here but it is simply impossible. On Bandcamp there are musicians making no money at all and others who are making thousands a month. I tried to find out if the people making over £18,200/year (per band member) on Bandcamp were already signed by a record label. Bandcamp replied to my email saying that there would be no way to find that information out.
Same issue with Soundcloud, they said that they couldn't even guess to what percentage of users go on to sign any kind of deal. To be honest I wasn't expecting an answer at all, I can fully appreciate we are roaming into the hypothetical here.
The social network debate could not even be answered by taking a sample of users and using that as a base count. For example, if I asked 1000 social network users if any of them had manage to earn £18,200/year as a result of using a social network, I bet none would have.
However, it would be wrong for me to conclude that social networks have helped no one. 1000 social network users is a lot, but proportionately it is too small a number compared with their user base. It would be like asking 1000 people if they have won the lottery and concluding that no one ever wins the lottery because they all replied no!
Final thoughts
The assumption that social networks are great for building followers, but don't deliver much of real substance for a band wanting to make money may indeed be true, but social networks should be used in ways that they were designed for. Facebook and Soundcloud certainly play a large role in becoming part of the 'eco-system', but they should be used alongside other tools.
We know that gigging is vital to the success of a band, but with such low income available to the average musician, it would make sense to build a local following before going too far afield. The benefits of 'breaking' new ground is usually overestimated and costly. Build a loyal local fan base and extend your gig radius slowly but surely. Keep fans updated and offer interesting give-aways (behind the scenes video footage) to build loyalty and interest).
Think about using song pitching websites (AudioRokit, MyHitOnline, TAXI) to focus your song submissions.
I want to make my own opinions clear that I genuinely believe that musicians are better off (on the whole) signed to a record label. Sure, they will take a big cut, but they will almost certainly generate more income for you than they take.
Let's say a label takes 50% of your income. Going on the statistics in this research paper, that would mean that so long as they increased your annual income by £1,230, they would have paid for themselves (since you were only earning £2,460/year to begin with).
Yes, you might have gone on to sell millions of copies of your album on our own (and therefore lose 50% of potential profits), but the odds are against this happening – and even if it did happen, the record label would simply capitalise on your new found success and increase your success further, possibly making up for the percentage they take.
There is a clue in how successful unsigned bands seem to end up signing a record deal, there is great advantages with joining forces with a label, I don't think anyone would disagree. Fundamentally a record label is like a music manager an accountant or even a hairdresser. You pay to have a professional do the jobs that you don't have time to do, are not trained to do, or simply do not have the natural inclination to do.
I would argue that a band that is supported by a record label will have more scope for success than a band that shuns all notion of signing a deal.
My Background
I am studying music law in London, UK. I have a passion for data and was able to exploit the information I have gathered for this Blog and use parts in a larger paper I am working on. Ordinarily I may not have gone into so much detail!
I played guitar for many years and it wasn't until I moved away from playing an instrument that I really saw where I had been going wrong with my music. I had always followed the crowd and moved in common circles, instead of trying to position myself as unique in some way. I felt like I had wasted many years which is why this Music-Think-Tank Blog really struck a chord in me (pun intended).
The first follow up Blog Do Social Networks Really Help Musicians? Revisited seemed a little self promotional to me - although I see nothing wrong with that provided the content addresses the correct issues. I didn't see much connection between the original Blog and the revisited Blog. The revisited seemed more of a 'How-to' rather than revisiting the social network debate.
Odds of success - Bands DATA table image
Feel free to post this image on your website!
References for this post
Venue capacity - To come up with this figure I looked at almost 100 UK venues and averaged out the capacity for a standing audience.
Average earning statistics:


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This class is perfect for those who prefer not to get down on the floor, who have difficulty with balance, who have some limitations in strength, or who want to ease in to yoga. We build strength, flexibility and balance as we do in our regular gentle yoga classes, but this class is done seated in a chair and using the chair for support during standing poses. Relaxing and restorative!
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March Madness time: Projecting the field of 68 for the Big Dance.
Here's how the projected field looks just hours from the NCAA tournament selection show:
Last 5 in: Xavier, Iowa, Tennessee, SMU, BYU
First 5 out: California, Southern Mississippi, Minnesota, Florida State, Toledo
Others considered: North Carolina State, Arkansas, Missouri
Moving in: Albany, Tulsa, Western Michigan, Cal Poly
Moving out: Stony Brook, Louisiana Tech, Toledo, Cal State-Northridge
No longer considered: Boise State, Washington, Wake Forest, UTEP, Clemson, Indiana, Louisiana Tech, Saint Mary's, Ole Miss, Indiana State, LSU, West Virginia, Richmond, Green Bay, Georgetown, St. John's
Multi-bid conferences: Big 12 (7), A-10 (6), Big Ten (6), Pac-12 (6) AAC (5), ACC (5), Big East (4), SEC (3), MWC (2), WCC (2)
Conference leaders from projected 1-bid conferences (22 total, secured bids in bold)
America East (Albany), Atlantic Sun (Mercer), Big South (Coastal Carolina), Big Sky (Weber State), Big West (Cal-Poly), CAA (Delaware), C-USA (Tulsa), Horizon (Wisconsin-Milwaukee), Ivy (Harvard), MAAC (Manhattan), Mid-American (Western Michigan), MEAC (North Carolina Central), Missouri Valley (Wichita State), NEC (Mt. Saint Mary's), Ohio Valley (Eastern Kentucky), Patriot (American), Southern (Wofford), Southland (Stephen F. Austin), Summit (North Dakota State), Sun Belt (Louisiana-Lafayette), SWAC (Texas Southern), WAC (New Mexico State).
— Saint Louis
(1) Wichita State vs. (16) Play-in: Cal Poly/Texas Southern
(8) Oregon vs. (9) George Washington
— Spokane
(5) North Carolina vs. (12) Harvard
(4) Michigan State vs. (13) Delaware
— Raleigh
(3) Duke vs. (14) North Carolina Central
(6) Kentucky vs. (11) Dayton
— Buffalo
(7) Baylor vs. (10) Nebraska
(2) Villanova vs. (15) Wisconsin-Milwaukee
— San Diego
(1) Arizona vs. (16) Weber State
(8) George Washington vs. (9) Oklahoma State
— San Antonio
(5) San Diego State vs. (12) Play-In: BYU/SMU
(4) Creighton vs. (13) Manhattan
— Orlando
(3) Louisville vs. (14) Mercer
(6) New Mexico vs. (11) Xavier
— Saint Louis
(7) St. Louis vs. (10) Stanford
(2) Iowa State vs. (15) Eastern Kentucky
— Orlando
(1) Florida vs. (16) Play-in: Albany/Mt. Saint Mary's
(8) Gonzaga vs. (9) Pittsburgh
— Spokane
(5) Ohio State vs. (12) Stephen F. Austin
(4) Cincinnati vs. (13) Tulsa
— Buffalo
(3) Syracuse vs. (14) Louisiana-Lafayette
(6) Oklahoma vs. (11) Providence
— Milwaukee
(7) Texas vs. (10) Colorado
(2) Wisconsin vs. (15) American
— Milwaukee
(1) Michigan vs. (16) Coastal Carolina
(8) St. Joe's vs. (9) Arizona State
— San Diego
(5) Virginia Commonwealth vs. (12) North Dakota State
(4) UCLA vs. (13) Western Michigan
— San Antonio
(3) Kansas vs. (14) New Mexico State
(6) UConn vs. (11) Play-in: Iowa/Tennessee
— Raleigh
(7) UMass (10) Kansas State
(2) Virginia vs. (15) Wofford
Note: All RPI and statistical data is used from WarrenNolan.com.
About our bracketologist: Shelby Mast has been projecting the field since 2005 and has finished as one of the top 5 national bracketologists for his website, Bracket W.A.G. He's predicted for The Indianapolis Star, collegeinsider.com and is an inaugural member of the Super 10 Selection Committee. Follow him on Twitter @BracketWag.


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Viperine snake takes on large Water frog (and gives up)
Written by Lucy Brzoska
Walking along a hot, dusty track in the Alt Emporda, a woodchat shrike singing in a nearby tree and bee eaters dipping and diving over the olive groves, we heard a piteous crying sound. It was coming from the long trough-like irrigation channel at the side of the track: a strongly protesting Iberian water frog (Pelophylax perezi) was in the grip of a Viperine snake (Natrix maura).
The aquatic snake had seized the frog by the leg and was swimming vigorously up and down the channel, the belly of its helpless prisoner flashing white in all the whirling.
The non-venomous snake next tried tightly knotting itself around its resistant prey, its mouth still gripping the leg.
Suddenly it seemed to tire, released its coils and swam to the side of the channel. The frog waited a moment, and then tried to swim away. But its movement immediately triggered a reaction in the snake, which this time seized the amphibian by the back.
Despite the considerable gape of the Viperine, it was clear the frog was too big for it to swallow. Eventually the frog was allowed to make a getaway, but fatally weakened, it didn't survive the attack.


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The SHOCKING Photos That Violated Facebook's Policies!
from the avert-yer-eyes! deptUpdate: The account is now unblocked, with this message from Facebook:
I'm so sorry for the inconvenience caused, there was a temporary misconfiguration in our photo review systems which caused a very small subset of users to be incorrectly enrolled in one of our checkpoints. There was no issue with your original photo, we have a combination of automated and human-review systems dedicated to keeping people safe, and a bug caused one of these systems to incorrectly enroll a small number of users into checkpoints.
We have since remedied the issue, and remediated all affected accounts. Please let me know if you or others are still experiencing any difficulties.
Yesterday I posted this adorable photo on Facebook:
Being a cute picture of a cute cat, it got a lot of "likes" and comments. A few hours later I followed up with this photo (accompanying text in the caption):
Another photo of Nut and me. Here you can see in more detail how Nut presses her face as hard as she can into mine. She does this all night, by the way. If I move my face away, she rearranges herself to grip the back of my head as tightly as possible. If I'm face-down on the pillow, she slides her paws under into my eye sockets and mashes her head into my ear. It's very cute but I don't think I could stand it every night.
Shortly thereafter, FB wouldn't let me view my feed, instead giving me this message:
"We noticed you may be posting photos that violate our Community Standards. Help make Facebook better by cleaning up your photos and removing friends that post nudity or other things that violate our standards."
Then it took me directly to all my photos and said,
"To keep your account active, please remove any photos that contain nudity or sexually inappropriate content. Check the box next to each photo you need to remove."
I didn't have a single dirty photo to check, so I checked none and then clicked the box that said, "I have checked all my photos that violate Facebook's policies." For that, I was rewarded with this:
"Because you uploaded photos that violate our policies, you won't be able to upload photos for 3 days.
"If you have other photos on the site that violate our policies, be sure to remove them immediately or you could be blocked for longer. After this block is lifted, please make sure any photos you upload follow Facebook's Policies."
Followed by another checkbox that says,
"I understand Facebook's policies and I won't upload any photos that violate these policies."
But I haven't checked that box yet, because I really don't understand Facebook's policies. At all. Maybe Franz Kafka could explain them to me. Can you?
UPDATE: several hours later, I still can't see my FB home page/news feed. This is what I continue to get instead:
Filed Under: blocked, cats, censorship, nina paley, photos


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Saturday, August 30, 2014 - 10:00am to Monday, September 1, 2014 - 5:00pm
The Natural History Museum of Utah | Rio Tinto Center
Celebrate Labor Day and explore one of Utah's most important horse stories – the connection of the Ute people to horses. The Ute were among the first North American tribes to acquire horses from the Spanish in the 1600s. Discover how horses transformed Ute life in ways that continue to reverberate today.
Our Labor Day weekend celebration will feature brand new activities and programs that will be available throughout the run of the exhibit. Guests will have the opportunity to:
- Discover Horse Evolution - 55 million years ago horses looked a lot different than they do today. Examine horse skulls and leg bones to discover how horses adapted to the ever-changing climate.
- Rope - Take to the saddle and try your hand at ropin' cattle.
- Build their Own Cork Horse - Draw inspiration for acclaimed artist Deborah Butterfield as well as other equestrian artists, then use found objects to make a horse.
- Color in our Horse Coloring Activity - Choose from a selection of horse coloring pages and add your artist flare!
- Play Horseshoes - Challenge your family and friends to a game of horseshoes.
Activites will run from 12pm - 4pm from Friday, Aug. 30 - Sept. 1.


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BRIDGEVILLE, Pa., Nov. 12, 2014 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) -- Universal Stainless & Alloy Products, Inc. (Nasdaq:USAP) announced today that Michael Bornak, Vice President Finance, Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer, will speak at the Midwest Investment Conference, hosted by the CFA Society Cleveland (CFASC), on Tuesday, November 18 th, from 8:15 to 9:00 a.m. (ET). The Company will post the slide presentation for this conference in the investor relations section of its website at www.univstainless.com. The live webcast of the Company's presentation can be accessed at http://wsw.com/webcast/mwic2/usap and in the investor relations section of the Universal Stainless website. A replay of the event will be available on the Company's website approximately three hours after the live event and accessible for ninety days. About Universal Stainless & Alloy Products, Inc. Universal Stainless & Alloy Products, Inc., headquartered in Bridgeville, PA, manufactures and markets semi-finished and finished specialty steels, including stainless steel, nickel alloys, tool steel and certain other alloyed steels. The Company's products are used in a variety of industries, including aerospace, power generation, oil and gas, and heavy equipment manufacturing. Established in 1994, the Company, with its experience, technical expertise, and dedicated workforce, stands committed to providing the best quality, delivery, and service possible. More information is available at www.univstainless.com. Forward-Looking Information Safe Harbor Except for historical information contained herein, the statements in this release are forward-looking statements that are made pursuant to the "safe harbor" provision of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks and uncertainties that may cause the Company's actual results in future periods to differ materially from forecasted results. Those risks include, among others, the concentrated nature of the Company's customer base to date and the Company's dependence on its significant customers; the receipt, pricing and timing of future customer orders; changes in product mix; the limited number of raw material and energy suppliers and significant fluctuations that may occur in raw material and energy prices; risks related to property, plant and equipment, including the Company's reliance on the continuing operation of critical manufacturing equipment; risks associated with labor matters; the Company's ongoing requirement for continued compliance with laws and regulations, including applicable safety and environmental regulations; the ultimate outcome of the Company's current and future litigation and matters; risks related to acquisitions that the Company may make; and the impact of various economic, credit and market risk uncertainties. Many of these factors are not within the Company's control and involve known and unknown risks and uncertainties that may cause the Company's actual results in future periods to be materially different from any future performance suggested herein. Any unfavorable change in the foregoing or other factors could have a material adverse effect on the Company's business, financial condition and results of operations. Further, the Company operates in an industry sector where securities values may be volatile and may be influenced by economic and other factors beyond the Company's control. Certain of these risks and other risks are described in the Company's filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) over the last 12 months, copies of which are available from the SEC or may be obtained upon request from the Company .
CONTACT: Dennis Oates Chairman, President and CEO (412) 257-7609 Michael Bornak VP Finance, CFO and Treasurer (412) 257-7606 June Filingeri President Comm-Partners LLC (203) 972-0186


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English Teacher
I have found the following definitions:
In CALD: If a situation or problem boils down to something that is the main reason for it.
In LAAD: If a long statement, argument etc. boils down to something that thing is the main reason of it.
So if A boils down to B,
B will be the source of problems or A will be the source of problems? I think based on the above definitions, B will be the reason of problems.Am I right?
For instance, most of the family arguments boil down to favoritism. So does it mean that favoritism is the source of problems?
Thanks a million.
Being a non-native teacher, I'm so thrilled being in such a superb forum.
Remember - if you don't use correct capitalisation, punctuation and spacing, anything you write will be incorrect.
You boil something down to get to its essence. Like making maple syrup. The collected sap is boiled down until it is a syrup.


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Air Toxics - chemicals that are known or suspected to cause adverse health effects; also known as hazardous air pollutants or toxic air pollutants
AT – see: Air Toxics
ATRA - Air Toxics Risk Assessment; a reference library currently being developed by the EPA
CAA – Clean Air Act; passed in 1970, amended in the 1990s; it has served as the framework to protect people and the environment from the harmful effects of air pollution
Criteria pollutants – six common air pollutants for which the EPA has set national air quality standards; they are ozone, particulate matter, carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide, sulfur dioxide, and lead
Diesel PM – Diesel Particulate Matter
DPEP – Broward County, Department of Planning & Environmental Protection (former department name)
EPA – U.S. Environmental Protection Agency
EPD – Broward County Environmental Protection Department (current department name)
GC/MS – Gas chromatography/mass spectrometry
HAP – Hazardous Air Pollutant; also known as air toxic or toxic air pollutant
MACT – Maximum Achievable Control Technology; standards developed by the EPA for controlling emissions of air toxics from each major industrial source
NATA – National Air Toxics Assessment; developed by the U.S. EPA to model exposure to 32 air toxics plus diesel particulate matter (diesel PM). These pollutants present the greatest threat to public health in the largest number of urban areas.
NEI – National Emissions Inventory
NTI – National Toxics Inventory
PM – Particulate Matter
TRI – Toxics Release Inventory


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Gemma attended school in Gröningen then, in 1526, he entered the University of Louvain. Of course his stepmother did not have the means to support him financially through university but he was given a poor student's place in Lily College. He studied for a medical degree but remained at Louvain to study mathematics and astronomy. He went on to become the leading theoretical mathematician in the Low Countries and also to become professor of medicine and mathematics at the University of Louvain. He was also a practicing physician in Louvain.
Gemma Frisius applied his mathematical expertise to geography, astronomy and map making. In Louvain he cooperated with the engraver and goldsmith Gaspard Van der Heyden (also known as Gaspar à Myrica) in the construction of maps, globes and astronomical instruments. His first publication was in 1529 when he produced a corrected version of Apianus's Cosmographia. The original had been published in 1524 and Gemma's new version, which stated on the title page that it was:-
... carefully corrected and with all errors set to right by Gemma Frisius ...was certainly a completely new printing by the Antwerp publisher Roeland Bollaert. Gemma's edition contained very few changes to the original text, but Gemma had made some alterations to some of the maps, particularly to 'America'. Gemma showed 'America' as two disconnected continents with the one south of the equator being named America while the one to the north of the equator was left without a name.
It is reasonable to ask why Gemma Frisius would produce a new edition of Cosmographia within five years of the original with relatively few changes. Cosmographia provided a layman's introduction to such subjects as astronomy, geography, cartography, surveying, navigation and mathematical instruments. The 1524 edition published by Apianus himself was not very popular and Gemma Frisius may have seen the potential to develop it into a more popular work. He may also have seen the potential of producing and selling in his workshop the mathematical instruments described in Cosmographia which would then provide an outstanding advertisement for his wares. This was indeed what he went on to do.
The next project undertaken by Gemma was to produce a combined terrestrial and celestial globe. The globe was engraved by the goldsmith Gaspar Van der Heyden and by the end of 1530 the globe could be bought from the workshops in Louvain. Gemma published the book De Principiis Astronomiae Cosmographicae in the same year which was to supplement the globe. In the dedication of this work he described his terrestrial and celestial globe as (see for example [7]):-
... a geographical globe with the most important stars of the eighth celestial sphere.The full Latin title of this work translates to On the Principles of Astronomy and Cosmography, with Instruction for the Use of Globes, and Information on the World and on Islands and Other Places Recently Discovered. It was a work in three parts published in Antwerp by Johannes Grapheus (Gemma's original published Roeland Bollaert had died). The first part described geographical and astronomical terms such as latitude, longitude, meridian, poles, eclipses, signs of the zodiac etc. The second part described how the globe could be used while the third part vividly described for the reader the peoples, plants etc. in distant lands.
Chapter 19 of this work describes, for the first time, how the longitude of a place may be found using a clock to determine the difference in local and absolute times. He says (see [12]):-
... it is with the help of these clocks and the following methods that longitude is found. ... observe exactly the time at the place from which we are making our journey. ... When we have completed a journey ... wait until the hand of our clock exactly touches the point of an hour and, at the same moment by means of an astrolabe... find out the time of the place we now find ourselves. ... In this way I would be able to find the longitude of places, even if I was dragged off unawares across a thousand miles.Aware of the difficulties of keeping exact time he writes:-
... it must be a very finely made clock which does not vary with change of air.In a second edition of the work three years later he added some notes about finding the longitude at sea, the first time anyone had attacked the problem. It is worth noting that although there were many methods of finding longitude proposed in the 250 years following Gemma Frisius's work, ultimately the methods he proposed were to become the solution to finding the longitude at sea.
In 1533 Gemma published an enlarged edition of Cosmographia which became a great commercial success. He included with this work Libellus de locurum which described the theory of trigonometric surveying and in particular contains the first proposal to use triangulation as a method of accurately locating places. The Polish ambassador in Brussels became aware of the outstanding work being undertaken by Gemma Frisius and invited him to come to meet him at the Imperial court in Brussels. There he tried to persuade Gemma Frisius to go to Poland to collaborate with Copernicus. It was an interesting proposition which was very tempting but, after some indecision, Gemma decided to turn the offer down and he returned to Louvain.
In 1534 Gemma Frisius published Tractatus de Annulo Astronomicae in which he described an instrument he called the astronomer's ring which he had designed and Van der Heyden had made in his workshop. Gemma states that the astronomer's ring was (see for example [3]):-
... not entirely a discovery of mine. [I have] augmented the ring so much that from simply showing the hours of the day and the four directions it now rivals whatever mathematical instruments you will. [Many ideas of others are] brought together into this single ring.His work on applying trigonometric methods to astronomical problems led him to note correctly that comets displayed a proper motion against the background stars.
From 1534 Gemma Frisius began to teach his student Gerardus Mercator and over the following years he cooperated with Gaspard Van der Heyden and Gerardus Mercator. They constructed a terrestrial globe in 1536, and they constructed a celestial globe in the following year. Both globes had been protected by copyright by Charles V with Imperial charters which Gemma and Van der Heyden took out in 1535 which set out their intention [7]:-
... to publish a globe or sphere of the whole world on which the recently discovered islands and lands will be added, which will be improved and enriched and more beautiful than their earlier globe. [It will] make mathematics more illustrious ... keep alive the memory of old kingdoms and events and ... make known to coming generations our time and our realm in which ... very many islands and areas unknown in earlier centuries have been discovered ... [The celestial globe will be] for the general use of enthusiasts.A third assistant, whose job it was to do the engraving, was added to the team, this being none other than Gerardus Mercator. When the terrestrial globe appeared it claimed to have been given its form by (see for example [7]):-
Gemma Frisius, doctor and mathematician, ... from various observations made by geographers.After completing the terrestrial globe, Gemma's interests turned towards medicine. He was joined by a medical student Andreas Vesalius, who came from Paris to Louvain in the autumn of 1536, and together they found a human corpse outside Louvain. The pair, over several nights, smuggled it into Louvain and reconstructed a skeleton. After a few weeks during which he was totally absorbed in medical matters, Gemma returned to working on his next globe. The celestial globe, which was completed in 1537, was made by (see for example [7]):-
Gemma Frisius, doctor and mathematician, Gaspard Van der Heyden and Gerard Mercator of Rupelmonde.After this Gemma went on to produce a world map which is described in [5] as 'influential' but sadly no copies have survived; see [5] for further details. In 1542 an army swept towards Louvain and the students formed a defence force. Gemma assisted the students, spending four days on the city walls keeping watch for the approach of the attacking forces. After a siege lasting only a few days the students opened fire from the walls of Louvain and, rather surprisingly, the siege was lifted.
Gemma's work on astronomical instruments was described in several of his books. For example in De Radio Astronomico (1545) he described his work constructing a cross-staff about 1.5 metres long with one cross piece about 3/4 of a metre in length. It had brass sighting vanes and a sliding vane. He also invented a new astrolabe which he described in De Astrolabio which was published in 1556, after his death.
John Dee arrived in Louvain in 1548 and sought out Gemma Frisius and Gerardus Mercator. He returned to London with mathematical instruments from Louvain as prized possessions. These were:-
... the first astronomer's staff in brass that was devised by Gemma Frisius; the two great globes of Gerardus Mercator; and the astronomer's ring of brass as Gemma Frisius had newly framed it.Gemma Frisius made many astronomical observations. In particular he recorded comets in July 1533, January 1538 and 30 April 1539. Some of these comet observations are described in works by his son, Cornelius Gemma Frisius, who was born in 1533 and went on to become professor of medicine and astronomy at Louvain. Gemma Frisius died of 'stones' at the age of forty-seven.
Article by: J J O'Connor and E F Robertson


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Ever wonder what the similarities are between your two favorite activities? Look no farther: the answers are here.
1.) Playing with Balls
Let's start with the obvious: you're sending your balls towards holes. We'll leave out the obvious quibble about how in one activity your balls go in the holes and in the other your balls are near the holes because other things are actually inside…the analogy is close enough to allow for a hell of a lot of innuendo, which anyone but the densest bro instinctively understands.
2.) Going all Night Long
A man who's truly dedicated to his game can play beer pong all night long. If you get tired out early on in the evening, it's time to start working on your stamina!
3.) Fingering and blowing
Traditionally in beer pong, if a ball is spinning around the edge of a cup, girls are allowed to try to blow the ball into the cup, and guys are allowed to try to flick it in with their fingers. Girls blow and guys finger….we won't insult your intelligence by spelling out the analogy here.
4.) The amount you talk about scoring…is inversely proportional to how often you actually score.
This one's a no-brainer, courtesy of Psych 101. The more a bro talks about what great game he has, the more likely he is to be overcompensating. Do with this info what you will.
5.) Single partners, group games, and serial monogamy (oh my)
You can play beer pong with one other person…or you can play two on two, three on three, four on four… You can also play one on one sequentially with multiple different people. As long as everyone involved is a consenting adult, it's all good!
Anyone else have any good comparisons? Leave them in the comments!


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As we prepare to take stock of the things for which we're thankful, we also need to remember those who are currently facing serious challenges. In NFL circles, few challenges are more daunting than the one currently confronting Browns executive V.P. Bryan Wiedmeier.
Patrick McManamon of FOXSportsOhio.com writes that Wiedmeier was diagnosed last month with Stage 4 brain cancer, where in the course of one day he went from not feeling right to having surgery to remove a tumor.
Wiedmier explained his current mindset to McManamon. "Take the haymaker," Wiedmeier said. "You reboot, focus, and then you're proactive. You're not a victim. And you do everything you can. It's either helping or hurting. There's not a middle ground. If it helps then we're gonna do it."
A long-time executive with the Dolphins, Wiedmeier made a big impression on one of the most legendary figures in football history. Said Hall of Fame coach Don Shula: "I've always felt that if I left the Dolphins and started somewhere else in the league the first person I would hire would be Bryan Wiedmeier."
Wiedmeier and his wife of 27 years have five children. They'll all be together for Thanksgiving.
"This thing has happened," Wiedmeier. "It's tough news, but if we can create a positive out of a negative, that's what we want to do. I don't want a mystery about what it is, or a pity party. There's an opportunity here, no matter what happens, to make this circumstance into a positive. That's the good that's going to come out of it."
This blurb can't do justice to McManamon's story. We recommend reading it all, saying a prayer for the Wiedmeiers, and admiring the perspective that he is applying to the fight of his life.


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Taking a Short Cruise, Part II
by Deb Wills, ALL EARS® Editor in Chief
Feature Article
This article appeared in the October 11, 2005, Issue #316 of ALL EARS® (ISSN: 1533-0753)
This is the second of a two-part series on short cruises to the Bahamas. In the first installment (ALL EARS® Issue #307, August 9, 2005 — http://allears.net/cruise/issue307.htm), author Deb Wills discussed the importance of research and the points to consider when deciding on the length of the cruise that is right for you. This installment compares and contrasts three-night cruises to the Bahamas aboard the Disney Cruise Line, Royal Caribbean International and Carnival Cruises.
For the record, the ships I sailed on and evaluate in this article are the Disney Cruise Line's (DCL) Wonder, Royal Caribbean International's (RCI) Sovereign of the Seas, and Carnival's Fantasy. My travel companion and I are in our early 50s with no children. We enjoy good food, good wine (and an occasional martini), relaxing and having fun.
Royal Caribbean and Disney Cruise Line share the same area at Port Canaveral. In fact, you can usually see the Royal Caribbean ship docked next to the Disney ship during sailaway. Both offer very systematic drop-off and parking procedures (although we found the Royal Caribbean garage very confusing when we were trying to exit). Both lines charged $30 for parking during the three-night cruise, with Royal Caribbean guests parking in a garage and Disney guests in a lot. Our Carnival cruise sailed out of Miami and we didn't park a car, but I understand that the cost is also $30.
Of the three, Disney has the nicest port. It is large, bright, clean and, well… Disney. There is a huge model of the ship, occasional appearances by Disney characters, places to sit, TVs with videos, and huge mouse ears to walk through as you board. Royal Caribbean's port was nothing special — your basic clean and functional port. On the other hand, Carnival's port was old and dark, and, although clean, felt almost dingy. Carnival is building a new port in Miami, though.
Both Royal Caribbean and Carnival take your photo and tie it to your "key card" — Disney does not. Royal Caribbean and Disney have similar personal screening; however, it seemed as though Royal Caribbean asked for photo IDs many more times than Disney did prior to boarding the ship. Carnival asked for ID more times than both combined. Some of this is the way the cruise lines set up security. At Disney's terminal, you go through security before going upstairs to the check-in area. At the other two lines, security is just before you board the ship.
Check-in for DCL is fairly straightforward — enter the line and wait to be called. DCL and RCI lines have separate queues for repeat cruisers, but it was hard to tell if this was also true with Carnival. For Disney you either get in the "Castaway Cay Club" line (for repeat cruisers), the international citizen line, or the "all other" line. For RCI, you line up by the deck your stateroom is on. Each cruise line has its own version of "concierge" service, which provides you with preferred check-in and boarding, and all lines have employees checking your documentation before you get in line. I have to say I was very impressed with Royal Caribbean. We booked the day before (yes, I said the day before) on Expedia for the cruise, and within a couple hours of booking we could fill in our pre-boarding information online. Once we arrived at the port, everything was in order. We were amazed at how smooth it was.
The Carnival check-in process, on the other hand, was very antiquated. There were numerous stations to visit and you literally did one step at each stop. In fact, after getting all signed in, we had to go to yet another area to pick up our cabin keys. It was not only strange, but having two cards to carry around on Carnival, one for the door key and one for charging, was a nuisance. Since cash is not accepted on board, you always had to have both cards with you. Plus, the key card was an unusual size and didn't fit nicely in any wallet.
Another check-in difference among the cruise lines was that of the energy level. At Royal Caribbean's and Carnival's ports, everyone was very low-key, almost blase. At Disney, there was a high energy, a buzz people are excited! They want to board early and can't wait to get on the ship, and so they are standing in line for an hour or more waiting to do so. At RCI and Carnival, people wandered in throughout the afternoon. It seemed like some folks were just going to the movies instead of embarking on a cruise.
Check-in: Big advantage to Disney!
Prior to leaving the port, all ships have a mandatory safety drill, also known as a muster drill. Each person starts in their cabin, dons a life jacket, and proceeds to their designated location. Most locations are on the outer decks, but you also may find yourself in a theater or restaurant. Upon arrival at your designated location, you check in with a crew member (giving your cabin number and number of persons), and after a period of time are released back to your cabin. This gives everyone a chance to return their life jackets and head outside for the sailaway. Of the three lines, the Disney safety drill is the most organized and structured, perhaps because Disney is the master at moving large numbers of people. I found RCI's muster drill to be very confusing, very crowded and not taken at all seriously by the passengers (and the crew did nothing to get anyone's attention). Everyone seemed to be traveling the same stairwells and heading to the same designated locations. It was a sea of humanity and made me hope that we wouldn't have to put this poor practice into play. As we waited for everyone to get checked in for the drill, people kept moving around, talking on cell phones, drinking. On the other hand, huge kudos to Carnival for being the most comprehensive of the three drills. They continually asked folks to refrain from talking, drinking and eating. After going over the safety information, we were then instructed to practice, departing from the theater and moving to our lifeboat location on an outer deck. It took longer than the other two drills, but was taken VERY seriously.
Muster/Safety Drill: Carnival edges out Disney.
The sailaway was one of the areas where I noticed a huge difference among the cruise lines. The ships all leave their Florida ports (Port Canaveral for DCL and RCI, Miami for Carnival) between 5 and 6 p.m., but Disney offers the most energizing and celebratory sailaway party by far. Besides the live music, Disney characters and dancing, there's a countdown that ends with the ship's horn blasting "When You Wish Upon A Star," as confetti streamers and squeals of delight fill the air. It really is a fun part of the cruise and an excellent way to begin your voyage. On both the Royal Caribbean and Carnival ships, a live band played, but it was more a "make your own sailaway." Not many folks were on deck and it seemed like just another day at the beach.
Sailaway: Huge advantage to Disney!
The Royal Caribbean cabin was the smallest of the three lines, perhaps partly due to the age of the ship. In fact, it was difficult for us to move in the room without bumping into each other. Our window was a small rectangle, about 2' by 3'. There was no in-room safe, though you could get one for free at the front desk, but the lines were always so long, you'd have spent all your time waiting for access. The bathroom was in poor condition, with grout missing from the tile in many places, and the shower often flooded into the rest of the bathroom. We called maintenance about it, but there wasn't much they could do given the design of the bathroom. Our Royal Caribbean room steward introduced herself shortly after we arrived in the cabin and took care of our minimal needs. She responded to any requests we had in a reasonable time frame. Room service was prompt and they would call in the morning before delivering our coffee tray. (Disney also began this service recently.)
Carnival's room was a little larger with a round porthole. We were concerned it would be smoky since this ship has all smoking-optional staterooms. (In fact, we found people smoking everywhere onboard, even in the elevator.) However, we were very happy to find that there was no odor. The bathroom wasn't great, but it was better than Royal Caribbean's. Our Carnival cabin steward, however, was poor at best. It's the only ship of the three where the steward was NOT on duty during arrival afternoon. We had been left a gift bottle of champagne, but no ice to chill it, so we tried to figure out how to contact the steward. Following the instructions next to the phone, we called, but got no answer. We called a little while later — again, no answer. When we looked out in the hallway, it appeared as though no stewards were working. We called the "after hours" number, which pages the steward, and about 20 minutes later we got a lackluster call back, informing us that the steward was off duty. When we asked for an ice bucket, we were told, "If I get around to it." Unfortunately, this level of customer service was consistent throughout the entire cruise.
The Disney cabins were the largest, brightest and most user-friendly staterooms of the three ships. Their split bathrooms (available in most cabin categories) can't be beat, especially when trying to get ready to head out for the day or for dinner! They are starting to show a bit of age, but are in great shape compared to the other two ships. The service on the DCL was far superior to what we experienced on RCI and Carnival — the steward was extremely attentive and tried to accommodate any request we made.
Cabin and Steward: Decidedly Disney.
On the three-night Bahamian cruises, the ports of call for each cruise line include Nassau, Bahamas. Nassau is a busy port — we counted six ships in port during one of our stays. DCL arrives around 9 a.m. and all aboard is at 7 p.m. Royal Caribbean arrives at noon and departs around 1 a.m. the next morning. Carnival arrives at 8 a.m. and departs 5:30 a.m. the next morning.
For your second full day on the ship, Disney visits its own island called Castaway Cay (pronounced "key"). Not only is the island beautiful and pristine, but Disney built a dock so that ships could let passengers off right onto the island. It is a great island with plenty of activities, and has a section for families, teens and even adults only.
RCI's second day is at its island called Coco Cay (pronounced "kay"), and tendering is necessary. (When a ship cannot dock right at the port, it must anchor out in the water. Small boats, called tenders, ferry you back and forth.) When the weather is bad, though (rough seas or high winds), tendering is not safe. This happened on our RCI cruise and we spent the day at sea instead of visiting the island. From reading some of the cruise message boards, we learned that this was not uncommon. The Carnival ship stayed in Port Nassau until early the next morning and we spent the remainder of the day at sea.
Ports of Call: Decidedly Disney
The food on Royal Caribbean was a notch above the other two ships. For the most part, I was very happy with my selections and enjoyed the food. The evening menu included special recommendations for "low fat" and "low carb" diners, and offered creativity in the foods. They even offered some fantastic sugar-free and no-sugar-added desserts which I really enjoyed. RCI also had a Johnny Rocket's and Haagen Dazs area, where you paid a nominal fee for anything on the menu. Carnival food was the worst, both in the main dining room and at the buffet. We sometimes felt we were back in the school cafeteria, trying to decide what today's "mystery meat" would be. One night we had very rubbery lobster, another we had filet mignon that was overcooked and tough. We ended up eating pizza and salad for most of the cruise. Even the desserts were only fair. Thankfully, the breakfast buffet had made-to-order omelets — it takes a lot to ruin an egg!
Disney has made great strides at upgrading their food since my first cruise with them in 2000, and I feel they are striving to excel. The servers all wanted to know if you were not happy with any food item or felt it could have been prepared better. Disney also has Palo, the Italian, adults-only restaurant, with awesome cuisine that rivals Walt Disney World's best restaurants. In fact, they make the best chocolate souffle' I've ever had.
Royal Caribbean and Carnival assign diners to a table in a specific dining room for the duration of the cruise. You have the same servers every night at the exact same table. The Disney ships, on the other hand, offer rotational dining that is themed. You are scheduled into each of the three dining rooms and your server team follows you, too. We prefer Disney's rotational dining system, and Disney outdid both ships when it came to dining entertainment.
Each dining room has 2-3 head servers (overseeing all staff) and each table has a server and assistant server. At Disney, the head server came by several times each night to check on things. We were also very impressed with our head server on Royal Caribbean and felt he'd fit well on a Disney ship. We never saw the head server on Carnival.
Our dining teams on both Royal Caribbean and Disney were above average, with Disney edging out Royal Caribbean. The Carnival servers were like robots. In fact, there were three servers for our table at Carnival — the server who took the food orders, the beverage server who took non-alcoholic beverage orders, and the cocktail server (alcoholic beverages). Shame on you if you asked the wrong person for something. We were admonished on more than one occasion. We saw so little of the beverage servers on Carnival, we never could figure out who was who.
In addition, seating in the main dining room on Carnival was very cramped, with servers repeatedly bumping into diners. One person at our table complained and was told to move his chair in. At breakfast one morning, I was seated next to the server station. After five minutes I had been jostled more than I cared to be and requested to be moved. I was told, "No, it's not possible." When I explained that servers were bumping into me, I, too, was told to pull my chair in more. One person at the table said, "This sure isn't 'have it your way' service, is it?"
Food Quality: Edge to Royal Caribbean.
Servers: Disney provides exceptional service; Carnival's is sub-par.
One of the extras not included in the price you pay for your cruise are the gratuities for your dining room team and your cabin steward. Gratuities at lounges, clubs and bars are automatically added onto your bill. Both Disney and RCI offer suggestions as to standard amounts for your Head Server, Server, Assistant Server and Cabin Steward. It is up to you to decide how much you want to leave. On the other hand, Carnival automatically includes their suggested amounts to your stateroom bill. To change it (either lower or higher) you must go to Guest Services to request a change. I think this was one of the reasons the crew on Carnival was very poor, especially compared to the good-to-excellent service we received from the other lines. Again, Disney service can't be beat.
Each cruise line has its own version of a daily activity flyer. Disney's is called the Navigator, RCI's is the Compass and Carnival's is the Capers. One nice feature on RCI is that the flyer had a tear off, take-with-you listing of all activities, so you didn't have to have the entire brochure with you.
I have never felt "wanting" for something to do on the DCL, but I have to admit that it was nice to have some different offerings on RCI. Yes, there is a casino on board, but they also have art auctions, something only recently added to Disney's longer cruises. The RCI staff is very informative and friendly so that novices and experienced art lovers can have a good time and bring home a treasure.
I was very disappointed with the lack and quality of the Carnival onboard activites. Drinking and gambling seemed to be the main events. I have heard that Carnival was trying to change its image to a more "family friendly" cruise line, but this was not the case on this three-night cruise to the Bahamas. During our at-sea day, the activities included things like "Mens' Hairy Chest Competition." I have to admit I wasn't inclined to read further. We made a point to try to avoid the pool area on Carnival. And while we don't consider ourselves prudes, we didn't care for the topless pool on the Carnival ship!
Kids' Clubs: As I mentioned at the start, we do not have children, but many friends and readers have told me that Disney's clubs are first-rate. According to others, kids, especially the younger ones, love the activities and end up not wanting to hang with Mom and Dad very often. I've visited the kids' clubs on Disney cruises and have read about their activities, and sometimes wish I could take part in the fun. We didn't visit the RCI kids' clubs, but heard from other cruisers that their kids were enjoying themselves. Camp Carnival on the other hand, had minimal offerings. I ventured up to the kids' area to find some activities going on in what appeared to be 2-3 cabins with the walls knocked out. It was our day at sea, and there were only a few kids playing. I also saw several signs indicating activities were cancelled due to lack of participation. Disney has a huge advantage in this arena.
Movies: I missed Disney's Buena Vista Theatre, which shows several first-run movies each day. All three cruise lines have movies on your stateroom TV, but Carnival did an odd thing and ran the same movie over and over for hours on end.
Excursions: All three cruise lines offer basically the same types of excursions for roughly the same costs. (You generally pay more for an excursion booked through the ship, but if you book an excursion on your own, be aware that the cruise lines may not wait for you if you're delayed.) Disney seemed much better organized in this area, though. With the DCL, you are given a time and location to meet onboard the ship, a sticker for your shirt to identify you, and then a Cast Member escorts you to the off-ship location where the experience begins. At RCI, we were simply told to meet on the dock near where we got off the ship. We had to figure out who the tour guide was and it seemed rather disjointed.
Spa: Contracted out to the same company, with the same products and services on all three lines. The staff on RCI was MUCH more friendly and personable than any of the DCL spa staffs I have experienced, but the Carnival spa staff was horrible — or at least my massage therapist was. After my stone massage, she gave me the hard sell on products. Even after I told her nicely twice that I wasn't interested, she pushed, telling me that if I didn't buy the special oil I would have totally wasted the money I spent on the massage. At that point, I got up to leave. The Disney spa staff have always been professional, helpful, and efficient at the least, and outstanding at best. While you might get a sales pitch, they back off once you say you aren't interested.
Each of the ships had nightly entertainment, with RCI and Carnival both having casinos. Royal Caribbean's casino had a much friendlier atmosphere than Carnival's, which seemed to be filled mostly with people who had way too much to drink. Unfortunately, we weren't able to attend any of the shows on Carnival or Royal Caribbean. Based on reports from others we cruised with, the Carnival shows were "eh," and Royal Caribbean's were just "OK." We deem the Disney shows excellent!
Activies and entertainment: Disney has a strong, strong advantage.
The DCL ships are impeccable. I don't think I have ever been onboard when some area of the ship wasn't being scrubbed, repainted, varnished or cleaned. When trash is left behind, it doesn't seem to stay around long on DCL. The Carnival crew seemed out and about cleaning much of the time, but the Royal Caribbean ship, on the other hand, was showing its age and the attention to cleanliness just wasn't there.
On DCL there is an adult-only pool, coffee bar, clubs and even a separate area on Castaway Cay. The Cast Members do a good job enforcing the age restrictions, which I really appreciated. Although Royal Caribbean did not allow kids in the casino, there was an arcade directly adjacent (I guess so parents gambling could keep a watch on their children). I felt that it was inappropriate to have the kids so close to the gambling. Carnival, despite being billed as "family friendly," had the definite feel of a party ship.
Disney Cruise Line wins in this category, hands down. It seems like every crew member has a smile for you, says hello, and goes out of their way to make you feel "special." I didn't get that feeling once on the other two cruise lines.
Once back in the United States, all ships must clear customs before anyone can get off. Also, if you go over your "duty free" allotment, you are required to go to the customs officers and pay tax on the overage. Be sure to have cash, because customs does not accept credit cards or travelers checks.
You have several options when it comes to exiting a Disney cruise ship. You can debark once the ship has been cleared (usually around 8 a.m.). You can have breakfast in the dining room at which you had dinner the night before and exit after breakfast, or you can eat at the Topsider Buffet at your leisure, making sure you are off the ship by 9 a.m. On the Royal Caribbean, each cabin gets luggage tags that are color-coded and you disembark based on your color. Even with roped off areas, the fourth floor was a complete zoo with everyone trying to leave at the same time.
As you can see, taking a three-night cruise to the Bahamas can be a totally different experience on each of these three different cruise lines.
So, who reigns supreme? You won't be surprised if I say that, for my money, unless you absolutely must sail with a casino onboard and are really on a tight budget, your choice should clearly be Disney, Disney, Disney! The other two cruises were less expensive, but dollar for dollar, the best value is on the Disney Cruise Line. And they're not paying me to say that! I don't plan to get on another Carnival ship ever again, but would consider one of the newer Royal Caribbean ships. Some may say the sky's the limit, but in my opinion, when Disney is behind the cruise ship wheel, the sea is the place for me!
For more information about the Disney Cruise Line, be sure to check out The Magical Disney Cruise Guide: http://allears.nets/cruise/cruise.htm
By the way, we have the Disney Cruise Line's Palo Chocolate Souffle recipe here: http://allears.net/din/rec_cs.htm
Editor's Note: This story/information was accurate when it was published. Please be sure to confirm all current rates, information and other details before planning your trip.


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Vanguard has just reduced the expense ratios of 24 of its ETFs. The reductions are fairly substantial. What I noticed, in particular, is that the reductions include sector-specific ETFs.
The Vanguard Energy ETF (VDE), the Vanguard Information Technology ETF (VGT), the Vanguard Telecom ETF (VOX), and the Vanguard Utility ETF (VPU) each now have 0.14% expense ratios vs. 0.19% previously. While the expense ratios of these funds were already low, the new expenses are 26% lower than before.
There are already ultra low-cost ETFs that track total stock market and total bond indexes. The Vanguard Total Stock Market Index ETF (VTI) has an expense ratio of 0.06% and the Vanguard Total Bond Market ETF (BND) has an expense ratio of 0.1%. Investors who hold most or all of their assets in total stock market funds are betting that a global market cap weighted portfolio is the best solution. For stocks, this assumption has major implications. In market cap weighted stock indexes, the amount of the portfolio invested in a stock is determined by the total market value of the stock. The more a company is worth, the larger the allocation to it. This approach results in some interesting outcomes. An investor in VTI currently has a 3.95% allocation to a single stock: Apple (AAPL). The second-largest allocation is to Exxon (XOM) at 2.7%. Apple is a great company, but there are reasonable arguments that investors may not want almost 4% of their total equity allocation in this one company, for example.
The alternative to investing in total market indexes is to use a strategy that selectively allocates across sectors. Having sector ETFs lower their expenses is especially helpful for asset allocation strategies that choose specific parts of the market to be over-weight or under-weight relative to the market cap weighted indexes. Folio Investing's Target Date Folios, for example, are allocated to equity sector ETFs and to specific classes of bond ETFs rather than total market index funds. The rationale for this sector-focused allocation is largely correlations between sub-sectors. The lower the correlation between sub-sectors, the more expected return you can target at a given level of risk. By picking and choosing from among sectors and bond types, we attempt to maximize the diversification benefits reaped by a portfolio while limiting risk. The Target Date Folios include a number of Vanguard's sector ETFs.
A portfolio of ETFs which emphasizes specific sectors and types of bonds will undoubtedly have a higher expense ratio than one that is invested in 'total market' index funds. The reduction in prices of sector ETFs reduces the penalty for investors who choose asset allocations comprised of sector funds. My research suggests that a sector-based approach to asset allocation can be expected to add between 1% and 2% per year in additional return as compared to market cap based allocation, so the higher-cost sector funds appear to be well worth the additional cost. The reduction in the costs of sectors funds will certainly be helpful, however.
A range of experts have noted that there are compelling reasons for choosing asset allocations that diverge from simply investing in total market indexes, including Burton Malkiel, one of the earliest champions of index investing. Folio Investing's experience with the Target Date Folios has also reinforced the research that suggests a benefit to sector-based allocations. The reduction in expense ratios of sector ETFs increasingly reduces the cost penalty of such an approach.
Related Links:
- Mutual Fund Trading Costs Add Up. Are ETFs a Better Option?
- Actively-Managed ETF's Next Iteration: A Short Fund
- Global Equity Investing With ETFs
Folio Investing The brokerage with a better way. Securities products and services offered through FOLIOfn Investments, Inc. Member FINRA/SIPC.