system
Given the following post, respond as if you're commenting on Reddit:
human
[DBZ/S] Have the z-fighters actually learned any new hand to hand techniques lately?

I know they've powered up immensely but i don't recall them learning new hand to hand techniques. Their sparring seems no different at the end of series than beginning. I know that goku had displayed the peak of hand to hand technique during his fight with raditz: full Nelson. 


Have they maxed out fighting forms so now all that matters is ki power ups? I never see them grapple much either.
gpt
In terms of raw hand to hand, they're honestly not great. Oh, Tien's got technique and Yamcha's got good moves, but they all moved on to focus on harnessing ki rather than improving themselves early on.

Hell, the Turtle School doesn't actually *teach* any martial arts techniques. Roshi didn't teach any of his students how to punch, kick, or throw. They came to him knowing the basics and he didn't enhance that any. What the Turtle School *does* do is turn you into a superhuman by forcing you to undergo insane physical training to the point where a teenager can move several tons, jog to every house in an island town without getting tired, and tank mighty blows. Of the named Turtle School physical techniques that Roshi, Grampa Gohan, and Goku all used... Well, they're all jokes. A rock-scissors-paper punch. Pretending to be a mad cow.

No, the Z-fighters aren't skilled melee fighters. They're considered skilled fighters because they're *insanely fast, strong, agile, and durable* while using the basics of martial arts. When you're fast enough to block or dodge anything that comes your way, though, it's easy for someone to think that it's all skill and that you've left no openings. And, while your defense has no openings, it's because you're fast enough to see any attack coming and react accordingly. Not because you've got a stance or any special technique that makes it impossible to attack you. It's like saying the Flash is a skilled fighter because there isn't a martial artist alive who can clock him on the jaw.

Of course, once you factor in ki techniques, they're all fucking *geniuses*. Prodigies on a scale that the world's never seen before.