system
Given the following post, respond as if you're commenting on Reddit:
human
I think it's sinister and inaccurate that we view men's issues as resulting from a devaluing of the feminine. CMV.

Or even worse I've heard it stated that it's as a result of a "hatred of women".

I think this rhetoric is dangerous as it adds fuel to the fire of any gender issues being essentially one-sided. Not to mention I think it's quite inaccurate.

I see the stem of the argument. Boys are taught to "man-up", don't be a pussy, don't share feelings, that we've demasculinised these traits. It's extremely circumscribed and I agree it's definitely something worth addressing, as I imagine it's a huge reason behind the increased amount of depression and suicide among our men and boys.

To suggest it's because of a "hatred of women" (which some people seem to understand by patriarchy) saddens me though, I mean you could equally (though admittedly not as severe) say there is a hatred of men because women are shamed for being strong, to not have androgenic hair, to not to be sexually aggressive etc etc. These things are masculine and thus negative for us... therefore masculinity is of lower value to women, therefore we must hate men right?

Of course I take both arguments as equally illegitimate, but the second one is never made while the first one seems to be widely accepted.

On feminist boards when making this point, I'm usually assumed to be male (that's a whole other problem) and/or just downvoted to oblivion. The few responses I do get are generally an emotive restatement of the same point as if it's already set in stone and is so plain and obvious it doesn't need to be examined. The worst is an angry a wildly off-topic rant-tangent (and yet I'm the downvoted one). I'd love to hear some actual reasoning and rationale behind this, that my view might actually *be* changed, because it's genuinely upsetting to be on the outside of this, but people just appear to accept the concept blindly and don't delve into its basis, perhaps due to the historic oppression of women or their own bias, I don't know.
gpt
>people just appear to accept the concept blindly and don't delve into its basis, **perhaps due to the historic oppression of women**

You've nailed it.

What you have to remember is that, up until about 50 years ago, misogyny was not an abstract or subtle thing. Women were openly viewed as weak, emotional, generally inferior beings. Men were expected to avoid degrading themselves by acting like a woman. You say boys are told "man up" and "don't be a pussy"; both phrases came from this same time period, and explicitly meant that you shouldn't act like a woman.

In modern times, we have exactly the same attitudes, and in many cases exactly the same insults. But you're claiming that they're now separate from the misogyny they were created with? That seems hard to believe.