In this episode, I get to speak with a TEDx speaker, Holli Shan. I had the opportunity to attend TEDx Ashburn my first attendance ever to such an event. It was also the very first TEDx in Ashburn with a growing community of speakers their first-ever and she was one of the first speakers to speak about her passion and what she’s been doing with her life. She comes from a background of animal communication and has experienced with human communication, which she then translated to just, you know, basically, she’s an animal whisperer. And listening to her story. And during her journey, I was just totally blown away.

Our Guest

Holli Shan

Hacks to take Away

  • She became an animal communicator because she wasn’t completely understanding her own pets. Gravitated towards animals more so than other people.
  • When someone is able to solve their own problem and also has that passion for this thing that they do, then they can go out and bring it to a worldwide stage.
  • Her mission is to bridge the gap of understanding between people and their animal companions. Because once we can bridge that gap, we can have a happier home.
  • You can never really open a door gracefully by battering it down. It’s like, you can’t beat the point into someone else’s head. If someone is that rigid, you have to at least give them the invitation to walk through that door.
  • It’s definitely been an incredible journey working with the animals, and just working with them, and the whole thing of also getting to working with yourself, because there’s a whole evolution that goes on and working within the species.
  •  Trauma is anything that could have happened, anything that caused enough of a shock, anything that caused a terror.
  • When you’re working with your animals when you’re dealing with your animals. If you’re having a hard time, it is okay to be honest with them, because you’re coming from an authentic place, and they’re willing to work with you there.

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Junaid Ahmed 0:11

In this episode, I get to speak with a TEDx speaker, Holly Shan, I had the opportunity to attend TEDx Ashburn, their first ever and she was one of the first speakers to speak about her passion and what she's been doing with her life. She comes from a background of animal communication and has experienced with human communication, which she then translated to just, you know, basically basically, she's an animal whisperer. And listening to her story. And during her journey, I was just totally blown away. I was like, Holy smokes, that's amazing. Like, I almost feel like that sometimes, like, wait, so why aren't people understanding me? But luckily, as human beings, we have words. And I'm proud to bring Holly Shan to the podcast. Hey, Holly, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you. It's pleasure to be here. I'm excited. Awesome. So tell me how did you. I mean, I heard the TEDx talk. I've watched you, you know, perform it tremendously beautifully. And people who haven't seen your TEDx talk yet, how would you describe your story? Like, give us a little rundown?

Holli Shan 2:00
My story? Wow. Um, I mean, my story, it's one of those, you know, I became an animal communicator, because I wasn't completely understanding my own pets. And I've always been an old person, you know, I've always, you know, gravitated towards animals more so than other people. And so, you know, I had that time where I said, Okay, I know, you're trying to tell me something, I don't know what this is, there has got to be a better way. And then that's when I met my first teacher. And, and I mentioned her in the TEDx of Janet Dobbs, and I just learned about this thing called intuitive animal communication. And I was showing that yes, this kind of communication is real, you know, communicating with other beings in this way, is very possible. And it's very real, we just have to learn how to do it. And, and so I learned how to do it, and just, you know, went from there. And years later, I was highly encouraged to go do this as a profession. And I said, Okay, I guess it's time to time to do it. Now. It's time to, you know, bring this bring this you up to a much bigger, you know, a much bigger, much bigger stage and a much bigger scale.

Junaid Ahmed 3:04
That's really, really awesome. See, the one thing that spoke out to me, is, you know, you had you learned something, first of all, you're solving your own problem, and you looked into it, and it became a passion for you. Because when you solve your own problems, it's no longer a job. It's a passion project. And when you solve that problem, and people see Oh, wow, that's pretty awesome. You should do this for others. And then it becomes a career. And that's where, you know, I don't know if you could call it the American dream, but I know that it is. Yeah,

Holli Shan 3:45
I think it's I think it's, you know, a dream when someone you know, when someone's able to able to solve their own problem and have that, you know, and just and also have that passion for this thing that they do, and then they can go out and bring it to a worldwide stage. You know, for the betterment of others, you know, I think that's, I think that's more of like a, I guess, you could say, more like a global dream, if you will, you know, more like a world record and say, Hey, you know, I've got something here that we can do better, that we can bring some goodness to the world. And one of the things that, you know, that I that I say is that, you know, my mission is to bridge the gap of understanding between people and their animal companions. Because once we can bridge that gap, and we can have a happier home, and if we can have a happier home and a more harmonious house, then we can bring that to, you know, to our community into the, you know, to the bigger, bigger community around us.

Junaid Ahmed 4:38
Now, absolutely, that's, that's so true. And the one thing that another thing that you mentioned, in your, in your speech was, how animals other are other beings on this planet, right? You're the human being, and there are other beings. And we need to treat them similar as we human beings. And what's funny is that sometimes you don't even treat other human beings nicely. Right.

Holli Shan 5:07
Right. And that's a you know, it's funny that you bring that up, because, excuse me, because I would, because I would always say, yeah, you know, I don't you know, people say, Well, why don't you work with people? And so I don't like people. But really, but I agree to customer service. Yeah.

And it wasn't until all that long ago, where I said, you know, what, it's not so much that I don't like people, but I don't, What I don't like is the cruelty and just the violence that other people and the indignity that other people inflict on other people. Yeah. And that if we could truly, you know, treat each other with like, I say this all the time, and you heard me say it with honor, dignity, respect with courtesy and compassion. If we can treat each other, you know, in this way, then, yeah, we can have we can have a better world. So I don't I don't like that. I don't like it when other people are cruel. And you know, unnecessarily cruel or violent artist, you know, dismissive. Yeah. I'm not even sure what the proper word would be. For what other people do to other people. That's nasty. Yeah.

Junaid Ahmed 6:12
Totally, totally Copy that. One thing my friend, Rob house mentioned is hurt people hurt people. Yeah, that's what it is. Right? People who are acting dismissive are acting, it's because they've got a ton on their own mind. Oh, yeah. And they don't know how to solve that problem. And they are,

Holli Shan 6:33
or they might not be willing.

Junaid Ahmed 6:35
That's true. That's very true. They might not be willing, or maybe they don't know, what the help they need. Because once you're setting a routine, you only know how to do one type thing. And then you just and if you're not an open minded person, you end up being that corner, and maybe you have a you know, maybe they have an agenda. We're digitas. Do you want everybody to think like them? Right? It's crazy. Yeah,

Holli Shan 7:05
it is crazy. Because some people can be so very, super set, you know, in their ways. And like you said, you know, have, you know, have an agenda? And if it doesn't quite go this way, then then it's wrong. Or if it doesn't quite go this way? Oh, my gosh, it's all it's all screwed up, you know, or what have you. And so for some people, it's almost what you have to, in working with it and working with those kinds of people. So it's almost like you say, well, could you be open to a different possibility? Yeah, could we be could we open this door, because thing is, you can never really open a door gracefully by battering it down. It's like, you can't beat the point into someone else's into someone else's head. If someone's that rigid, you have to at least give them the invitation to walk through that door. Exactly. And with him, and with animals, I don't find that I'm, you know, they're they're very, they're very willing to great open, and the animals are, are not as hung up as we are, they are not as complex as we are, you know, on some of those things that may create and they will say, you know, yeah, they are creatures of habit. Well, of course, you know, when they, when they want their dinner time, they want their dinner at five o'clock, and Daylight Savings Time will screw that up. So, it takes a minute, you know, for them for them to get back to it. So yeah, there's that routine, but, you know, before the greater breadth and depth of, you know, of what they are and just living. You know, they're not they're not as hung up

Junaid Ahmed 8:30
as we are. No, that's, that's, that's so true. Because they're, they're harmonious with the world. Uh huh. Right. One code that I'll always remember from the matrix is when he Smith has Morpheus down, he's like, you know, I've looked at the entire planet Earth, and looked at all the species of animals that are on this earth. And I don't understand human beings, like they are not the same as animals, because they will go into an area and, you know, devour, or basically use up all the resources, and then they go up. And a similar animal that's close to that is the virus because they're taking over, they're destroying, whereas animals, they just take what they need, and they just move on. Just really, I was like, there's that's a good analogy. Yeah. And, but they, I mean, that's not all humans, it's only a fraction of them. Or maybe, you know, it's it's all adult comes down to Okay, well, what's the world view? You know, we're living in a global world. I mean, now, in 2019, and 20, almost close to the 22nd century, we're looking at a lot more globalization, we're looking at a lot more people opening up about what they're doing. And there's a lot of movements, sustainability and all whatnot, and, and, like, I look to animals, and being a beekeeper myself, I look at the B to B life, and how they, you know, how they are assimilating with the with the world. It's just amazing. of, like, what we need to mimic, or what we need to at least learn from and be part of this world, rather than, like, Oh, I'm just going to be here for 80 years, I'm just going to destroy whatever. methods to fix my mess. Yeah, yeah.

Holli Shan 10:35
And it's, it's wild. It's well, because there's so many times when, you know, when I look at the animals and go, wow, you know, how, how are you able to forgive? I'll never forget, when everything was Michael Vick was going down. And I looked at my one dog who was with me, and I looked at her and I said, I said, How is it? How are you guys able to forgive? know, how are you able to do that? And she just has, she had, you know, just this grace, and just this, you know, immediacy about her? And she just said, well, that's, you know, that's what

Junaid Ahmed 11:05
we do. Yeah, you know,

Holli Shan 11:06
we're just able to do that. And it's because they knew they weren't necessarily holding a grudge. You know, they don't they don't hold they don't hold that grudge. I mean, their body will hold on to a trauma. But that's a whole other topic.

That's a whole other podcast. You know,

but you

know, but in terms of, you know, mentally, you know, in terms of like holding a grudge, they don't they don't do that. That's why so many other animals who have come from, you know, abuse cases are still able, a lot of them are still able to trust. Yeah, you know, so it's, and it's huge. And it's one of those things where I think, you know, I think with us, you know, humans as beings and a species, I think a lot of us want to do one take the easy way out. I mean, in sales, they'll do that too, right? You know, they'll say, okay, you know, making it, you know, make it easy for the customer. So the customer doesn't have to think, you know, let's do that make when you're programming your website, you don't program it for your lowest common denominator. So they don't have to think so. It's not complicated. And I think and I think a lot of times with people we, you know, a lot with, I think people have decided to not think as much or think for themselves as much and they want to be led. Yeah, so there, there's a lot of that, and I think that this this weird cycle of things. And then of course, you have a few, you know, you have a few people who decide, I'm going to think for myself, and you know what, that's cool. So, and with him and with animals, yeah, they can be led, but they have to, but they'll be led when they are convinced that you are leader enough for them.

So I mean, couldn't there are some that are just, you know, what, I know this and then you decide to make up your mind, I'm going to be over here.

So it's, yeah, so it's, it's just a neat, it's definitely been an incredible journey with, you know, working with the animals, and, you know, just working with them, and the whole thing of also getting to, you know, working with myself, because there's a whole evolution that goes on, you know, working and working within the species, I'm sure you've noticed that to being a beekeeper, you know, as you know, as you work with them, you know, you can start to, you know, have that, you know, be reflected back, you know, back in yourself.

Junaid Ahmed 13:16
Absolutely, no, absolutely. You're totally right. It's, it's like you become a much calmer person when you're on BS. Mm hmm. Because if you're if you hurt if you, you know, if you're rushing them or you're being rushing, they're going to notice that and they're going to attack, and you don't want to be attacked by you know, thousands of BS, right? And you're right animals. Notice that one thing, that one episode of Dog Whisperer thing was a long time ago. And I can't remember the gentleman's gentleman's name, but he was saying, birds have a higher level of leadership than any other animals. And this there was this one household, they had a, the white parrot, the cocktail, and how anytime he would enter the room, all other animals would become submissive. Like, that is so interesting. But the dog was not being submissive with the owner. The owner wasn't, you know, wasn't being the alpha, I guess it's right. Over time. Right. Yeah.

Holli Shan 14:27
I mean, yeah. So yeah, so the owner, probably what wasn't, wasn't being wasn't being the leader. And I'll and I'll tell you what, I'll throw out another word at you here is authenticity. Animals can tell. And just like children can tell when you're not being authentic at all. And what I mean by that is, you know, when what you're feeling does not match what you're thinking. And if the words that are coming out of your mouth are not matching any of those, yeah, then they absolutely know that. They absolutely know that. And that's why I tell people a lot, you know, it's okay to speak into your feelings. When you're working with your animals, when you're dealing with your animals. If you're having a hard time, it is okay to be honest with them, because you're coming from an authentic place, and they're willing to work with you there. So, I mean, it's the same. Same for horses too. But yeah, but that's totally and I'm sure I'm sure with the bees, the bees are promising. You know, what, just settle down. Yeah. Because we don't need this, this frenetic energy here. So settle down, because you know, if you can settle down and become, you're welcome, but otherwise, go away. I'm a man, I'm a match. I'm feeling this, you know, as you were, as you were talking that, yeah.

Junaid Ahmed 15:37
No, absolutely. And, and when you mentioned not, you know, talking to your feelings, and my friend, only my friends. Listen, Spence, she's, uh, she's doing theatre, but she started some, some just new thing called say things better. And she has something called verb your words, something like that, where you're, you think of a verb. And when you talk, you're trying to say things that match that verb. So whenever it comes out, it's it's more it sounds more authentic, or it sounds like the intonation tells people like, and that's what happens. That's what that's what you were mentioning is when you feeling one way, and you're saying something else altogether, children can tell that you're not being authentic, you're not really saying what you mean. And animals can do the exact same thing. Right? That was really That's right.

Holli Shan 16:42
Exactly. And a lot of people like to say, Oh, well, animals don't understand the words that you're saying. You know, it doesn't matter what language you're speaking words are icing on the cake, just for what for what you're feeling. So, I mean, I can, you know, I mean, I could come out with a little bit of Yiddish, you know, to my dog, and, you know, and he'll know, and he'll, and he can obey that command. Because he knows what I mean. You know, it, it's just, like I said, that's just icing on the cake, it doesn't matter. You know, you have you have to, you have to truly feel it, feel it and mean it and visualize it and and hold it and hold it in your mind's eye clearly of what it is you want them to do. Wow, um, you know, as your as you're talking. So.

Junaid Ahmed 17:23
All right, I've got a couple questions. And it has to it has to do with dogs. Okay, so all three of my neighbors around my house has dogs, right? One on one side, they have an electric fence, the dog comes out, and she's an older dog. So she'll come out and she'll look around, and she'll bark once in a while, but not too much. And she's pretty calm. But then there's new neighbors moved in, and they have two dogs. And they're both black dogs. They might be thinking, I can't remember what type of dogs but they're super black. The younger one is much larger. And as soon as she comes out, she starts barking if there's any people out there, I have talked to the owner. And she said, you know, she doesn't like guys at all. Like, well, how is she okay with your husband? Right? So I'm like, trying to decipher like, so anytime the dog comes down, started barking, I try to go over there. And I start, you know, try to talk to her. But then, you know, the owner comes in, she's like, All right, come on, in, come on, go inside. So and they they put a fence up, and just two dogs won't get out of, you know, go run out away. So sounds like you know, I'm going to ask Holly, what can we do? to calm her down? Right? Wow. She's like, she's never had this issue before my previous house and they had covered fences. This is all more open fence says like, I wonder what's going on through, you know, just dogs head?

Holli Shan 19:01
Well, I mean, there could be I mean, there could be any number, any number of things. I mean, you know, you say this dog is younger? Well, did they have this dog when the dog was a puppy? Did this dog you know, experience a trauma of some kind? You know, at the hands at the hands of a man to this? You know, um, what was the trauma, you know, with, you know, with a man who might have looked like you, you know, is it just any, you know, any man, you know, any anybody

who's a guy, you know,

um, you know, and there could be a whole bunch of different factors there. So, I mean, the only thing I mean, it's one of those things that well, I don't even know where to start with that one. Yeah. But it could be, you know, did did the stock suffer a trauma, you know, looks at at the hands of a man. I mean, I don't know, I don't think that animals come out of the gate necessarily not liking, you know, men or women or kids without without them and during a trauma at some point in their lives.

Junaid Ahmed 19:55
And this trauma is a much longer episode. Yeah,

Holli Shan 20:00
I mean, a trauma, you know, and trauma is anything that, you know, anything that could have happened, you know, anything that caused enough of, you know, enough of a shock, you know, anything that caused enough of, you know, a terror, if you will, you know, to you know, to this dog by, you know, by at the hands of somebody else. Um, you know, and and another way of saying it is okay, well, somebody like this did turn to them. Yeah. So, um, so yeah, you know, it's just like, you know, when you have rescues, you know, I had one dog who had a heart who was had a hard time with men as well, it took him a long time to come around to my husband, but when I had, but when there were other men who came over who were, you know, who were very calm and very sweet and not very overbearing, he had no problem with them. Okay. So, you know, so again, it's what it's what caused that, you know, with that dog, what, you know, with with your neighbor's dog, so I'm wondering, you know, what, you know, what happened? And she says, Well, okay, you know, she wasn't like this with our old house. Well, of course, well, she liked her old house. Yeah, you know, she's younger, she was probably she spent the majority of her time in this old house, it's probably going to be a matter of time, before this dog can get used to her own surroundings, get comfortable with it, and realize, Oh, well, this is my house. And that's my neighbor over there. And okay, and he's not gonna hurt me. So, and the big thing is, like, I don't know, if you have if you have a backyard or a backpack, or just away just to sit out and just to sit with them, like you and your house and her at her house. Yeah, I just sit and just so she can just get used to seeing you. And then you can work on and then you can work on, you know, maybe, you know, maybe walking by, you can't help the situation by coming up to them and having her bark her full head off until she just, oh, I don't feel like barking anymore. That never works. I will tell you, I guarantee you that never works. So because part of that is that she needs to realize this dog needs to realize that that you are not an enemy, that you are not a threat. Yeah, and that and that can only come in time. And and it might be you know, you're gonna have to deal with this dog barking her full head off at you. Yeah, um, you know, whenever whenever you walk by or just or like I said, you know, come on out and just, you know, you sit in your property and yeah, and just, you know, do you know, do as you do, you know, do your thing. You know, and be in your and being your wonderful, calm, authentic place. While she's out there. So that it's proving to her that hey, this is who I am. Yeah,

so And like I said, that will

that will take time. I mean, could be I mean, I don't know if it's a lab. It's German Shepherd. If it's a Newfoundland, if it's a Belgian Shepherd, there are so many black dogs out there. I mean, plus also, you know, if the dog you know, I mean, it's hard, you know, it's hard to tell, but all that to say it really depends on the background of this dog. Why does she not like men?

Junaid Ahmed 22:57
Got it. Got it. It's really, really good point. very insightful. And the second dog so they have two dogs, the second dog is smaller. But she never bought or he I'm not sure if this year he but that dog never barks. I've seen that dog bark a couple of times. But that's because either this sense a we have a groundhog in our backyard. Yes, maybe the groundhog came out. And maybe he's around, you know, moving around. And anytime that happens then the second dog barks and the first dog is just curious. It's really interesting. Yeah,

Holli Shan 23:40
cuz the second dog probably doesn't have to bark as the first ones doing all the barking. Yeah. And that'll

happen a lot. You know, you'll have a pair of dogs. You'll have one that'll be the mouthpiece. Yeah. And the other one won't do much barking at all. Yeah. So. So yeah. And with groundhogs, it's funny because it also depends on what kind of prey drive you know, these dogs have, if they want to go after it or not. Yeah, you know, and they certainly certainly don't have to my, my, my fuzzy girl, the one that you know, the one that I had, that I was talking about earlier about, you know, when I was talking with about the michael vick thing, she had a wicked prey drive, and she had a habit of taking out groundhogs. Well, one and done she was she was ruthless. And people were like, wow, and the groundhogs don't fight back. I said, Nope, there is my back right there. There is no there's no time. She didn't know they don't have any time. But we've since you know, evicted them from the front from the front of her house. I tried talking to the groundhogs. I said, Look, there's a killer here. You know, there is a killer here. If you go into the yard, you're going you are going to lose your life if she is out there. And it's like, you know, there was just this wall. You know, they're like, okay, yeah, whatever. They. Yeah, there was no listening in. And of course, I you know, if a dog has a prey drive, I'm more than happy to encourage it. Because it's their natural instinct. I don't want to I don't want to squash a natural natural instinct. Exactly. Right. And I told her I said, if they can, if they're in the yard, and they can run

and Game on. Yeah,

if they get away good for them. But if not, that's okay. And you know,

I don't know, you might get, you know, angry feedback

from your listeners after. After, after I just said that.

Junaid Ahmed 25:22
It's a natural way of life on this planet is right.

Holli Shan 25:27
It is it is. Yeah, some you know, some dogs, some predators have a greater prey drive than others. And that's it. I mean, my current talk now he's got a wicked drive. You know, I haven't let him catch anything. Yeah. But also nothing has come in the yard either.

Junaid Ahmed 25:42
Go Yeah, exactly. So that's pretty cool. That's really interesting.

Holli Shan 25:48
Sorry, that just totally tangent there. Although

Junaid Ahmed 25:51
I love this. Because, you know, cuz that's, that's, that's being our as our authentic humans, because we're not designed to toggle one subject for hours. Right now. That's really cool. I love it. I was gonna I was thinking about. So yeah. And so in our yard, we have a pretty big yard here in Herndon. And there's ton of running space, dogs have plenty of place to run. And I think this groundhog has been living under our shed before we moved here, right? Oh, I just let it be there. Because I don't want to, you know, rip his home out and sure if the dog catches, you know. And then so my neighbor told me that he has a little hole under his shed. So what he did, he's he blocked the entrances on either side. So the dogs won't get in there. But then he said, he, the groundhog hasn't used that hole in a while. So I'm wondering where he's gone now. I mean, I see him every once in a while in the morning. But really interesting.

Holli Shan 26:55
He could have he could have created another tunnel. Yeah.

I mean, I end up being the host reason why we blocked off the whole under under our porch is because you are Portus summit. And it was a mount and there was a massive hole under that. And I said, Oh my gosh, is it guys? I'm sorry. I can't, you know, I can't have you come up on my porch and start chewing it, you know, my wouldn't threshold. And I can't have you, you know, totally annihilate, you know, this cement porch. So, so we covered it with with a screen, you know, with a metal screen. And we made sure everybody everybody was out. And you know, we we put that and then we cover that with dirt. And I said also, you know, chant, have you guys constantly eating stuff in my garden? Right? Because I would go to plant stuff. And I would have these wonderful sunflowers. I'm like, great, they're tall, they're strong. That's wonderful. And they're all cut off. And yeah.

You gotta be kidding me. Really?

Junaid Ahmed 27:48
So think our neighbor has a Swedish left hand. Okay, it looks like that, at least for the pictures. Okay, cool. Awesome. That was really insightful, you know, look at the history. Yeah. Because, and that's, that's what we are we we form these notions and, and thoughts as we grow up, based on our experiences. So obviously, it's going to relate, you know, all animals have that same brain functionality. Hmm. So to say, Yeah,

Holli Shan 28:22
but yeah, the body is gonna, is going to function the same. Um, you know, and the body will hold on to, you know, any kind of, like I said, any kind of trauma or anything, you know,

anything that has, you know,

that has happened to it. Like, if you like, if you think of, you know, if you're in a car accident, if you're in a really bad bike wreck, you know, then it might, it might take some time before, you know, you go ahead and, you know, ride that specific way or, you know, take that particular particular trail or do that same thing again, because your body's going, Oh, wait a minute, this. We wrecked here. Yeah. You know, we wrecked here, you know, your knee got split apart. Yeah. I don't know. Um, but it but you know what I mean, but it's that kind of thing that the body holds on to and remembers, and that's what and it's the same thing with the animals too, that when something like that happens, yeah, you know, something similar, then it takes some time to work through and, you know, we're

Yeah, we're. Yeah,

Junaid Ahmed 29:18
totally, totally. Alright, so we got some really good stuff in really insightful about animals and human behavior, animal behavior. So you mentioned you have a horse. Yeah. And you ride your horse. Now, is it a male or female?

Holli Shan 29:36
He's a male. So he's a building. He's a gelding. So which means he's been neutered, okay. And in the horse world, they call it guilt. They call it gilding. Okay. So yes, neutering for horses. So, but he's the Kelly. He's, he's not he's a Norwegian fjord. And he's a very unique breed. He's very distinct. They're the ones that are cream color. And they have made that standard up like a mohawk. So if you if you see if you've seen the movie Frozen,

Junaid Ahmed 30:03
I have. Yeah. You know,

Holli Shan 30:05
the horses there. by Prince Eric. And, and, and, and, yeah, those horses are fjords. They're Norwegian fjords. And yeah. And he's Yeah. And he's just an amazing horse. I've had him since July of last year. So and he's six years old.

Junaid Ahmed 30:24
Okay. Oh, my goodness. Yeah,

Holli Shan 30:26
he's, uh, he's six or seven. You know, I used to remember his age really, really well. But I think he says, but yeah, so he's six. And he's, and he's wonderful. And he's actually one of those beings that demands that I be not not just more than more than calm, you know, similar to your Bs, you know,


than calm, but also grounded. But also, you know, serious, so I can't come at him with him a lot of money. I could still do that to a point. But you know, as I, you know, but as I'm grooming him, as I'm working with him, you know, attacking him up putting the question on, you know, I can't be in this place of you know, of terror, because I do still have some anxiety and mounting up and and writing. Yeah, that's just after years of, you know, falling off. And, of course, I have, yeah. And so I still have, I still have that anxiety there that I'm that I'm working on. I have an amazing instructor to you that that helps me that's helping me through that. And Neil and I know this, I know, this force is not going to put his put a wrong foot forward. He will not Hey, can I look at him as

Junaid Ahmed 31:31
a guest today on the website hacks anonymous. com. So, you know,

Holli Shan 31:41
he adds more calm and, and he's just an amazing being, I don't even know how else to describe it. Nice. But, you know, it's like when I when I'm calm, and when I am when I'm serious about the work to be done. He you know, he'll stay put sometimes he likes to pitch it because he's he on horse and yeah. Sometimes the way and I've learned that when he fidgets instead of me saying, oh, now stop it. Got me saying that I just, you know, take the hands off, stop and look at him and go, okay, you know,

are we done here? Can I

can I continue? Yeah, and then just go on. So but yeah, and when I hop on, he's just, you know, his greatest joy is working under settle is doing the work. And I need to bring myself up with that. And it's one of those things that when I when my heart called out to the universe for the next one, you know, cuz I had one before for my next horse. We said, Okay, yeah, I need the universe kind of gave me what I needed. And it was nothing like I expected cuz I never thought in the world. I never thought I would have a fjord ever. Yeah, you know, I thought I'd have a cure. I thought I have a quarter horse or some other something else that was mixed, you know, never thought I have a few words. But he's, but he's great for me because he's going to help bring me forward. Nice. You know, he's gonna he's the one who's really going to help me through and out of the anxiety and help me do this thing that I'm just feel really passionate about and get back to that. And hopefully I can start learning mountain archery on him. That's awesome. So yeah, I don't want to know all that. But

Junaid Ahmed 33:13
I have a huge fascination for horses. longest time growing up, I think I saw the movie Black Stallion and all these horse movies, right? And I just have this huge fascination. And I've always wanted to, like go on horseback riding. Right? So, and I never ended up going but then on our honeymoon. Like, many years ago, we went to Hawaii and they had horseback riding. That's like awesome. go horseback riding. And I think the horse that I rode was a was those horses with big, big hooves. Nice to remember. It's just the one they use for Budweiser commercials. Yes, so the horse that I rode with Clydesdale, a very firm, very calm horse and just a fun experience. Like I'm like, Whoa, this is so much fun. And since then, I've been like, I'm like, all right. I'm going to go horseback riding again. I'm going to go horseback riding again. It's been 13 years. And I haven't gone back and I was like, Okay, I need to find somewhere close with because, you know, I drive. I drive on Georgetown pike all the time. And I see those Nina horse ranches and school and whatnot. It's like, it would be so cool.

Holli Shan 34:27
Try driving down route. 15. Yeah, so yeah,

there there there. There's there's a lot there's a lot there. The barn the barn that I've worked my horses off of 15 as well. Nice. We could probably hook you up. Yeah,

Junaid Ahmed 34:39
that would be awesome. Come by visit. Holly. I'm gonna go see you how Holly Shan we're going to go horseback

Holli Shan 34:48
riding. Yeah.

I mean, I don't know, we're at where all the trails are. But we'll take my system barn manager, she'll go take us and you know, we're going to go for a ride.

Junaid Ahmed 34:58
That's awesome. What's so much fun is with some ice. I have three kids, nine, four, and one. And the oldest one that you know, he's a bear scout. So we went hiking this one time, and we're all waiting at river bend Park. And as I pulled up, and I parked my car and walking up, there's there's these two people getting on their horses, and they aren't going to go walk the trail. And that's like, Whoa, that's so cool. And then recently, my brother in law, he got less horseback riding lessons for both hers daughter and his five year old son at the frying pan Park. So they've been riding horses live basically every weekend for the past two weekends, maybe sounds like whoa, that's so cool. They are some of the most amazing animals. Cool. All right. So this is a good point. Let's ask some questions that I asked my guests. What is one hobby that you wish you got into looks like you went into a lot of the things that you love to but maybe there's a hobby done touched? Yeah,

Holli Shan 36:04
I think I wish I could have done I think some more hiking. Because I do I do enjoy, you know, being you know, being out in the woods. I do enjoy, you know, being outside. And I think I wish I could have picked up hiking as more of as more of a hobby. Because I see all the wonderful things and just like to be that outdoorsy, get serious, outdoorsy type person, I think. Yeah, I think I think that would be a lot of fun, because I don't know how to do half the thing that anybody else does, except for me, hopefully get the right boot. You know,

while you know, while

while I'm out walking, walking on a trail. So, you know, doing that, I think would be I think that's one thing I wish I could have picked up a little bit more

Junaid Ahmed 36:45
Nice. Nice. Hiking is amazing. I haven't hiked as much as I would like to as well. It's it's live right? We were commuters in this in this concrete jungle or just driving everywhere. Hmm. And there's just so little time and I've told my wife You know, we need to go hiking. Go walking and hiking more so that the weather's getting better. We're you know, we're going to pick that up, hopefully. Huh? Alright, sweet. What is your favorite movie or TV show?

Holli Shan 37:16
Well, it's funny because I you know, because I think about that question I think about you know, really have to pick just one. Um, I mean, so for movie I would have, I would have to say print The Princess Bride. Because we will watch it all the time. We quoted all the time that that movie was a staple with my friends in college. So I have an extremely soft spot in my heart for the Princess Bride.

Unknown Speaker 37:41
Nice. Yeah,

Holli Shan 37:43
so there's that one and not to mention, you know, Mark Knopfler playing the music and it

Unknown Speaker 37:49
was all it was

Holli Shan 37:50
also it was also great. And then for favorite TV show. That was kind of rough because we've been watching Big Bang Theory. So not one step. It's funny because you know, we're familiar with those people like we've we've gone to college with it with those people. That's kind of fun. But yeah, it's we don't do TV as much anymore as we use Hold on. Okay, although it be honest your Holly doctor who I'm a huge doctor. Oh my god. Yeah.

Junaid Ahmed 38:17
Doctor Who

Holli Shan 38:19
I'm a huge Doctor Who fan and I'm and I'm obsessed because I haven't been able to watch God Whitaker season so

Junaid Ahmed 38:27
i think i don't know if i finished this the latest season or not, but Okay, so since you're since Doctor Who's your favorite TV show, right? Yeah. Who's your favorite doctor? Oh my god.

Holli Shan 38:44
Okay, if we're going into originals it with the original series.

Junaid Ahmed 38:49
I haven't seen the original series, unfortunately. Okay.

Holli Shan 38:52
Oh, no. tell you anyway. Okay. It's okay. If it's the original series, I would have to say I would have to say Jon Pertwee? Because I met the man. Oh, nice. Um, yeah, I met him at a at a at a convention. He was very cool. Um, let's see for the read for the new for the new series. Um, yeah, I wouldn't say David Tennant. I love I love David Tennant. He was he was so much fun him body to lot. And I would have to say, I can't say honorable mention, but I also really enjoyed Peter Capaldi. I enjoyed him, because he I think embodied a lot of the rage that the doc figure like over 900 years old, something's got to be brewing. And I. And I think he brought that and I think David Tennant brought this. He brought the seriousness, he brought this wonderful sense of chaos. But he any he still, he still brought the compassion. He still also brought the rage to but it's like, yeah, David Tennant is you know, for this season or for this slowly.

Junaid Ahmed 39:52
No, you're right. And I never meant I never noticed the raid and you've seen the original series. Of course, you know that better. David Tennant did an excellent job. And then I saw David Tennant, you know on Jessica Jones. Mm hmm. I was like, wow, yeah. This man do any better.

Holli Shan 40:14
He You know what? He's also brilliant in Hamlet if you can watch him as Hamlet.

Junaid Ahmed 40:20
Oh, he's brilliant. Okay.

Holli Shan 40:23
Oh, the man can do no wrong.

Eddie, what ya see if you can if you can catch a gun Netflix or something and I forget which specific production it is, but just yeah, I'll find it. Yeah, catch him doing Hamlet.

Unknown Speaker 40:40
Nice. That's awesome. Unreal. Yeah.

Junaid Ahmed 40:43
I would never have pinned you for a Doctor Who fan.

Holli Shan 40:47
Oh, yeah. And I'm assuming I'm a Star Trek and Star Wars fan too. Oh,

Junaid Ahmed 40:50
have you seen the latest Star Trek? The discovery.

Holli Shan 40:55
Now we haven't caught discovery yet. Okay.

Junaid Ahmed 40:58
All right. I just finished a Tuesday. And I was like, wow, I because I never I didn't grow up in the United States. I never really got into the original Star Trek. And, and I've been wanting to get into it. I was like, I can't watch 50 years of

Holli Shan 41:17

Junaid Ahmed 41:20
that'd be that'd be three years of my life. watching Star Trek. Yeah, but they did a really good job and I got into Star Trek when they did the new reboot the movies. I was like all right. Okay, there's something to see here. Yeah, I just knew see the new two seasons took me a while to get into it cuz kids and time you know it's just forever

Holli Shan 41:43
now the world isn't bad either.

Junaid Ahmed 41:45
Oh my god. Orville is

Holli Shan 41:47
there writers are spot on holy cow I mean his for for his funny and his flip as they are they have a way of just getting in there so you know where to on the social topics guy. Yeah,

Junaid Ahmed 42:03
thank you. And and not just that but but also like it all came out to be okay, this is going to be a comedy they're gonna rip everything off. But no, it's very, very original. Yeah,

Holli Shan 42:15
it's a good show. And then like the way you know and the way they've categorized them Auckland's with their you know with their whole society and everything and we were just want you're catching up on the DVR last night on some of them going wow. Or we could look at it and say you know what, yeah, that's the episode where next gen had the to Rikers though Oh, yeah. So for so for all for all that I am you know, an environmentalist and definitely part of you know, animal animal welfare causes and I Am that I Am. Yes.

Junaid Ahmed 42:47
Nice. What's interesting is now that you mentioning, you know, that Orville and the Star Trek So, maybe So from my perspective, is brand new to me since I've never seen the original Star Trek. Are they taking stories from the original Star Trek and bring into Oracle

Holli Shan 43:09
not as such, so it's not like Oracle is tracking with and recreating stories that were of original Star Trek, or even Next Gen. But on the one episode that we saw, there was one where the Oracle went through like some kind of thing that screwed around timeline and so they will know bringing back a younger younger Kelly up forgetting forgetting the characters last name, Commander, so it brings back a younger her. And so now you have to have the same person on board which all which in next gen. There was a transporter malfunction or something that created

Unknown Speaker 43:49
to that creates to Rikers.

Junaid Ahmed 43:53
Okay, okay.

Holli Shan 43:54
He created to or pulled one from another from another time on, I forget exactly what it is. Okay. It's got a similarity here. So they don't fully bring on the whole timeline. They just have similarities or nods

to other issues that were I think that were touched on back in those years. And they're doing them in a real in a really neat way. Yeah,

Junaid Ahmed 44:11
no, so I guess, I guess if I if I do compare anything at all, it's like, Simpsons is the original Star Trek. family. I see Oracle.

Holli Shan 44:31
I'm sorry. I'm laughing because you know, Seth MacFarlane. Exactly.

Junaid Ahmed 44:40
Only only somebody who's seen, you know, the Star Trek and Simpsons and that parallel, and you know, can understand Wow, like, whoa. Nice. Well, that was that was awesome. That was that was a really cool attention on superheroes or movies, TV shows. Two more questions, sir. So who is your favorite superhero?

Holli Shan 45:08
Ah, you know, I think about that, and I love I love Xena Warrior Princess. Yes. I love her. And if I have to go to a comic book hero, I would say Green Arrow. Okay. Because you know, I love archery. Yeah, I just love this Archer who you know uses his righteous appointed power and I think I like that a lot with here with heroes as well. You know, when they when they can when they have this you know, this anger and this rage, but that is their that's their core of their power to still win the fight as it were. That's just what I like to see in my hero. So but yeah, but I love I love Xena. And I love the way Lucy Lawless played her. Nice.

So total, total, you know? Yeah. Yeah.

Junaid Ahmed 45:57
watching those shows growing up here. Last question. If you were a board game, what would it be?

Holli Shan 46:06
Oh my gosh.

It's not quite a board game. But I would say Cards Against Humanity.

Because you never know what weird. I mean, when I when I'm really casual, you know, some of it, you never know what weird thing is going to come out.

Or what it referencing is going to come out of my mouth.

So and also tends to be look tends to be a little bit different. Also, I haven't played a whole heck of a lot of board game. So that's closest

thing I can think I was Cards Against Humanity.

Junaid Ahmed 46:40
Okay. You know, I haven't played that game yet. I've heard a lot about it. And I want to play that game because of kids around when the kids are tired. Yeah.

Holli Shan 46:51
You don't want to play the game with kids? No, I mean, it was weird enough playing. It was weird. I'll tell you what, it was weird enough playing that game with my nephews who are, you know, with my nephews who are like, you know, who are young adults now? And playing in front of them with the whole family? And

my parents are there? Yeah.

Wow, that just happened. We just said this. And you just said that, you know, my nephew is growing up. Now. He's, you know, they have grown men and they can say things like that, but taught you how to say that.

But yeah, so yeah, you

do not want to play Cards Against Humanity with your kids at all, that you get together with your buddies, and you and you just have a time where you, you laugh, and you just have a bunch of time where you're just not right. Awesome.

Junaid Ahmed 47:42
Awesome. Well, Holly, this was really great. I love talking to you. We can go on for another 30 minutes or an hour? Yeah. Well, we'll have to do another episode. And we can talk about the trauma and you know, pick some more of these things that we that we like to talk about, um, where can my audience find you?

Holli Shan 48:07
Sure. So they can find me online. My website is www compassion. So that's, that's my website, and all my contact information is there. They can also, I also have a wonderful free Facebook group community called the peaceful pet playground. And that's, and that's where we like to and that's a drama free. Um, you know, Facebook, you know, Facebook community where we get to just talk about talk about our animals talk about things that work, what doesn't work, and, you know, we can help each other out with advice. And of course, lots of lots of photos. Nice.

Junaid Ahmed 48:43
Perfect. Well, thank you so much, Holly. Oh, be sure to include these links on the show notes for this episode, and let you know when it comes out. Awesome for your time.

Holli Shan 48:56
Thank you. It's a pleasure. Talk to you soon. All right, take care.

Junaid Ahmed 49:03

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