MAUREEN PUGH (National): Thank you, Mr Chair. I'm really pleased that the Minister and the Green Party have raised this issue around evidence, because it came up in the Social Services and Community Committee that actually the official advice was a little bit devoid of this information. In fact, they did not analyse the impacts of long-term benefit dependency. The reason they didn't do that was because the Minister had indicated from the outset that this was the policy direction that they were taking, and so that analysis had not been done. In fact, I believe it was part of the confidence and supply agreement with the Greens that this sanction be removed from the Act. But the reality is, and if the Minister would like some help with this, the evidence is unequivocal, and the evidence is that long-term benefit dependency does make it harder to enter the workforce and it is more likely to increase those cycles of hardship within those families, and it is not the compassionate action to take in the long term. So that information is there, and, of course, the social investment approach was entirely based on that evidence and the long-term benefits for both social and economic outcomes for this country. 