Hon MICHAEL WOOD: As we have canvassed in this House previously on this topic, the member and I have a very different view about these matters. The member seems to think that there is a straight out trade-off between fair and decent pay and conditions for workers on one hand and good economic outcomes on the other hand. On this side of the House, we actually believe in a better and more progressive vision of labour relations, one in which investment in workers, investment in skills and training, and valuing people can actually build value and productivity in the long run. That is why, for example, Australia, which has had a form of sector-based bargaining in place for most of the past 40 years, has a higher rate of labour productivity than New Zealand, with its largely individualised-based bargaining system.