Hon SHANE JONES (Minister of Forestry): Obviously, the referral motion enjoys the support of the party I belong to, but this debate has become tainted by alarmism. This debate has wandered right off the track. It is a very narrow, well-understood device used by both sides of the House from time to time. But to suggest that we should acquiesce with this merchant of doom from the other side of the House at a time when all parliamentarians should be standing shoulder to shoulder and giving reassurance to New Zealanders rather than plucking inaccurate information out of Google, as he's just done in terms of America and Europe, without understanding the technicalities of that decision—not only has the member moved us away from a very common parliamentary practice, which we will be voting for, but he is now trying to scare, trying to panic, and trying to taint what is an important piece of legislation which has long since been talked about in this House: a public policy issue to which we are no strangers. So this notion that we're on the edge of a precipice—worsened and exaggerated by the other members of the House at the very time they should be giving a tone that is calm and reassuring, not dividing New Zealanders in levels of panic and scaremongering, moving along like Cassandras. So for those reasons, under no circumstances whatsoever will we agree with the sentiments of the last speaker, Mr Tim Macindoe, and I encourage us to move very quickly to the end of this rather elongated and fruitless debate.