Then we heard about pest and weed control. Well, we've heard evidence from environmental scientists and farmers about the Mackenzie Basin. Part of the Mackenzie Basin, after a tenure review process, was handed back to the Crown and given to the Department of Conservation (DOC) to manage. They excluded farm animals—ruminant animals—that chew the grass from the DOC land. They thought that would allow the tussock to recover, but it turns out there's some invasive weed species that have been introduced to New Zealand in the past couple of hundred years, and we can't go back in time. There is no TARDIS that allows us to put all of these weeds back into a phone box and ask Doctor Who to take them back to another galaxy, another dimension. They're here to stay, and the problem is if you try to take the land that has weeds and pests on it and return it back to a pre-human condition, you're going to fail. 