But when we drill down on the detail of the murderer, that has now pleaded guilty, that took 51 innocent lives, how did that individual become a licensed firearm owner in New Zealand? There is a fit and proper test that the individuals need to go through. Well, we now learn that the referees of that particular individual came from a chatroom where they had never personally met the murderer, and those were the people that were interviewed. That is disgraceful. 