Let's look at those numbers. At 30 people a day, the service is losing $24,000 to $25,000 per day. Now, the Minister talks about that being an environmentally friendly option because it takes cars off the road. Well, we could actually put dozens of four-wheel drive diesel utes on the road, have each passenger drive one from Hamilton to Auckland and back, and still have fewer emissions than the Te Huia train, a diesel train, is emitting every single day it runs. So this party, the National Party, wants environmental impacts to be positive on the environment, and if trains make sense, that's fine. But Minister of Transport has got to come up with a much better value-for-money proposition if he is going to solve climate change through his policies.