GINNY ANDERSEN (Labour—Hutt South): Thank you very much to the member. Look, I think it's very difficult to quantify that in a financial sense, and I think that goes to the heart of the debate. The submissions we received from those women and the partners of those women who were unable to take leave were that they had long-term psychological trauma as a result of having to go back to work on a day and come back from work and clear out the nursery and fold away the clothes, and then go back to work the next day. I had stories of women who had had a miscarriage while travelling home on the train, and who had to continue to go to work that day and had to go back home on the train. The embarrassment, the trauma, and the pain that that caused was, I guess, unable to be quantified. 