The final point that I'd make is there's been talk again about AV and AVL. It's all well and good that this bill touches on how it might be used, but as my colleague Paul Goldsmith, who was here earlier, pointed out, what's the point of talking about all this AV technology when it doesn't exist in most of our courts? For a variety of reasons, I sort of have a bit of understanding of what the courts are like up north—north of Tāmaki that is. People struggle to get to the courts. All this talk of access makes no or very little sense if you don't actually have the equipment in place. 