CHRIS BISHOP (National): Thank you very much, Mr Chair. I want to ask specifically about Kāinga Ora's debt policies, because the briefing notes, at part 23, says that Kāinga Ora (KO) have a preference to issue debt privately rather than through the Crown. Of course, because of the new fiscal rules announced for this Budget, debt held on entities like KO and also the New Zealand Transport Agency is now included, when it wasn't previously, in the fiscal indicators and so, of course, quite rightly, I think the officials have said there may be merit in further investigating Crown debt as an option as opposed to KO borrowing privately. 