So when we heard the submissions from those people who came forward before the committee—we received 74 in total. And one of the ones that were of particular interest is that they saw the reoccurring theme that we often get from the National Party that we just want to use increased penalties as a deterrent. This comes time and time again, and it's deep in the National psychology, that if you increase a penalty that will somehow change the way people think and how they behave. And we know for a fact that that's flawed ideology—it's a deeply flawed ideology. So those who oppose the bill—and there were a fair few of them—generally regarded it as too punitive. They questioned whether the desired effect—which was agreed that we want to reduce the assaults on first responders—would be done by imposing a mandatory minimum sentence.