 And it's also for civilian leaders to get the military understanding of the authorities and the complexities and the real world implications. So it's very difficult to do both. And it's not a knock on one or the other. But if you know more than you can take a 30-year civilian and make them an admiral and make them run something, you can't take a 30-year admiral and drop them into this. So it has much more to do with the people than I think the training that they end up doing.