 that Donald Trump has ever participated on the presidential scale against Hillary Clinton or against Joe Biden, has he ever been judged the winner? Now, we know for a fact that he did win some of those debates, but the point is that they do these flash polls, and he is not deemed the winner. And he won 67% to 33% in CNN's flash poll last night. And they were trying to spin it. Caitlin Collins was still trying to spin it.