 and to keep going on, but it never, never, he never changed his focus. If I remember, he lived down at Florida, didn't he? Yes, he did. He lived down in Florida and, um, I believe it was maybe 2014. I can't remember exactly the time, but I was attending a UFO conference in Sebring. Uh, Paula Harris was, um, with star works USA conference going on. So Jennifer Stein, another person very involved in the field.