 ultimate intellect, the ultimate in kindness and humility and gentleness and sincerity and power, you know? So I grew up in a neighborhood where, well, to be blunt, there were Jews and Catholics, and so I was very familiar with the crucifix. And I always, when I looked at the crucifix, it kind of turned me off. And one of the reasons was, is there was this, what I thought was a weak person