 If you were a classical guy, they didn't want me to have a jazz combo at the same time. So I got a late start in learning how to play without reading music. In fact, my first gig ever, my first performance ever with Panorama was when somebody didn't show up. I went down and caught them at the neighborhood bar that was right by my house. And they sounded great playing all different kinds of music, but they didn't have a bass instrument.