 denies the meaningful interiority of other creatures and i think that you know that's part of what makes darwin so special is that that he pushed back against that um and there were others like him at that time too and there was sort of this brief flowering you know towards the latter half of the 19th century early of the 20th century when animal intelligence was embraced by a great many scientists um and then there was a backlash to that and you know i think