 and even in most insurance contracts. And I say most because there are some insurance contracts like life insurance that don't really build up cash value. It's called term insurance. So there's no liquidity there because it doesn't build up any cash. But a cash value building life insurance contract, you might be able to borrow money out of that at a zero tax liability if you have the ability to borrow money from that cash value. So there are different ways to look at liquidity.