 And there are times where he and I would fight and he'd argue, and I think he might even have hung up on me once. And then there are times where he'd come on and he just, he was, I would just sit there and I would miss breaks because I just wanted to hear everything he had to say. He was such a human being, and that's the best way to describe him, because he was polarizing, some people loved him, some people hated him, and he was just this genuine person that I appreciated. Right.